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Rumor: Incarnate Word gets site visit from WAC
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solohawks Offline
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Post: #41
RE: Rumor: Incarnate Word gets site visit from WAC
If UIW does leave, would that make it more attractive for the current SWAC West to move in mass to the Southland? No trips to MS/AL/FL and only 1 non HBCU football school in their divison
04-08-2021 01:40 PM
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Bobcat2013 Offline
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Post: #42
RE: Rumor: Incarnate Word gets site visit from WAC
(04-08-2021 01:29 PM)Yosef Himself Wrote:  Is IW "the" Texas Catholic university?

They might call themselves that but as a Catholic Texan I don't consider any school to be THE Texas Catholic uni and even if they were I don't think that title really would mean much. They May be the largest Catholic school in the state (I don't know if they are) but they're still small with only like 7k students on campus. I honestly never heard of them before they moved to the Southland and that's only because TXST is a former member. I'd bet 99% of my very devout Catholic family has never heard of them.
04-08-2021 01:47 PM
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johnintx Offline
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Post: #43
RE: Rumor: Incarnate Word gets site visit from WAC
(04-08-2021 01:29 PM)Yosef Himself Wrote:  Is IW "the" Texas Catholic university?

Not exactly, as I'm not sure if one takes that title. UIW, Our Lady of the Lake and St. Mary's are in San Antonio, St. Thomas is in Houston, St. Edward's is in Austin, and the University of Dallas is in Irving. I may be leaving one out. None are on the Texas prestige level of Baylor/TCU/SMU/Rice. Incarnate Word has received a lot of funding from the Benson family (New Orleans Saints, car dealerships), and their profile has increased dramatically.
(This post was last modified: 04-08-2021 01:52 PM by johnintx.)
04-08-2021 01:51 PM
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BePcr07 Offline
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Post: #44
RE: Rumor: Incarnate Word gets site visit from WAC
(04-08-2021 01:51 PM)johnintx Wrote:  
(04-08-2021 01:29 PM)Yosef Himself Wrote:  Is IW "the" Texas Catholic university?

Not exactly, as I'm not sure if one takes that title. UIW, Our Lady of the Lake and St. Mary's are in San Antonio, St. Thomas is in Houston, St. Edward's is in Austin, and the University of Dallas is in Irving. I may be leaving one out. None are on the Texas prestige level of Baylor/TCU/SMU/Rice. Incarnate Word has received a lot of funding from the Benson family (New Orleans Saints, car dealerships), and their profile has increased dramatically.

I've been on each of those campuses for different reasons (I'm not Catholic) and if I had to pick one to attend as an undergrad, it would probably be University of Dallas. The "Saints" (Edward's, Mary's, Thomas) all leave something to be desired but I did like St. Edward's. OLLU is growing. UIW isn't bad, it's just not that great.

I'm on board with the idea that the school requested the visit - probably to get a list of what needs to be improved more than anything. It would be weird to invite the Texas-4 and exclude UIW only to add them a little bit later.
04-08-2021 01:58 PM
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DFW HOYA Offline
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Post: #45
RE: Rumor: Incarnate Word gets site visit from WAC
UIW could play the WAC games at Alamo Stadium.



(This post was last modified: 04-08-2021 02:22 PM by DFW HOYA.)
04-08-2021 02:21 PM
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IWokeUpLikeThis Offline
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Post: #46
RE: Rumor: Incarnate Word gets site visit from WAC
(04-08-2021 02:21 PM)DFW HOYA Wrote:  UIW could play the WAC games at Alamo Stadium.




Yes, I love those historic New Deal stadiums built in the FDR era. That place has history and character. Hosted the Tech/A&M game throughout the 40s.
04-08-2021 02:53 PM
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billybobby777 Offline
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Post: #47
RE: Rumor: Incarnate Word gets site visit from WAC
(04-08-2021 10:19 AM)quo vadis Wrote:  
(04-07-2021 11:19 PM)IWokeUpLikeThis Wrote:  This guy knew some stuff when the Texas-4 was happening:

Still have zero idea as to why Texas schools would want to join the WAC.

Don't they know this isn't their daddy's WAC? Does the WAC name still carry some magic in lower-rung circles even though it is hollowed out?

I don't get it.

07-coffee3

The only guess I have as well.
They hear the name “WAC” and think of the founders:
Arizona
Arizona St
Utah
BYU
New Mexico
Wyoming
Then later on local big time schools; TCU, SMU, Rice, Tulsa, UTEP etc
Most of those schools have been gone for decades...
The WAC has prestige because of their former members I suppose
04-08-2021 03:06 PM
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SoCalBobcat78 Offline
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Post: #48
RE: Rumor: Incarnate Word gets site visit from WAC
(04-08-2021 06:59 AM)MWC Tex Wrote:  
(04-08-2021 02:40 AM)Stugray2 Wrote:  Well FWIW they have a bigger budget than everyone else in the SLC, including the Texas 4. Can't speak for facilities. I do see they play at the Gayle and Tom Benson stadium. So maybe the Benson family is influencing.

Their stadium capacity and basketball gym capacity are pretty low (HBU is even lower). Their basketball attendance was only 370.

They definitely have the finances, but attendance is weak and they play in undersized facilities, even for the SLC. I file this under "hum".

Perhaps IUW was asking the WAC for a visit. Sure San Antonio would be a good destination for the WAC. But, their facilities are still lacking even after the D1 move.
It would be better to wait for Texas A&M - San Antonio to develop their sports program and invite them. If they are looking at San Antonio.
WT is the best option, in my opinion, but with 2 schools still in D1 transition stage it may be feasible.

This makes a lot of sense. UIW gives the WAC an 8th football school and an all Texas seven team eastern division. The western division would consist of seven western schools (NMSU, SUU, Dixie State, UVU, GCU, CBU, and Seattle). For once, NMSU is not an outlier. They are right in the middle of the conference. The conference would be in some very good markets. They would have five private schools, all of whom are ambitious and willing to spend money. This would end the D2 pipeline.

The spending part will be key for the WAC. For the WAC schools, with UMKC gone and Chicago State leaving, there should be no more schools that are unable to spend money. The same for the SLC schools that are leaving the Louisiana schools behind. UIW is already a member of the WAC in men's soccer. Their men's & women's swimming & diving teams are members of the CCSA, so they can just roll those teams into the WAC. It should be an easy transition. As for FBS football, I think that is still a bit of a pipe dream. But they have time to figure that out.
04-08-2021 03:19 PM
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GeminiCoog Offline
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Post: #49
RE: Rumor: Incarnate Word gets site visit from WAC
Figured it would happen. They’re not a bad school; just need to upgrade some facilities if and when they get invited to join the WAC.
04-08-2021 06:16 PM
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Post: #50
RE: Rumor: Incarnate Word gets site visit from WAC
(04-08-2021 02:53 PM)IWokeUpLikeThis Wrote:  
(04-08-2021 02:21 PM)DFW HOYA Wrote:  UIW could play the WAC games at Alamo Stadium.




Yes, I love those historic New Deal stadiums built in the FDR era. That place has history and character. Hosted the Tech/A&M game throughout the 40s.

Very close to UIW campus as well.
04-08-2021 06:26 PM
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DoubleRSU Offline
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Post: #51
RE: Rumor: Incarnate Word gets site visit from WAC
In 2019, their best attended game was under 4,000. Doesn’t matter where you play if that’s the crowd you’re getting.
04-08-2021 06:28 PM
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DavidSt Offline
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Post: #52
RE: Rumor: Incarnate Word gets site visit from WAC
(04-08-2021 06:16 PM)GeminiCoog Wrote:  Figured it would happen. They’re not a bad school; just need to upgrade some facilities if and when they get invited to join the WAC.


Yes, when they are ready to join the WAC in 2050. Their facilities are crap and they are more D2 level.
04-08-2021 07:40 PM
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IWokeUpLikeThis Offline
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Post: #53
RE: Rumor: Incarnate Word gets site visit from WAC
(04-08-2021 07:40 PM)DavidSt Wrote:  
(04-08-2021 06:16 PM)GeminiCoog Wrote:  Figured it would happen. They’re not a bad school; just need to upgrade some facilities if and when they get invited to join the WAC.


Yes, when they are ready to join the WAC in 2050. Their facilities are crap and they are more D2 level.

So it’s not Incarnate Word. Who is the WAC‘s 14th school?
04-08-2021 07:45 PM
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GeminiCoog Offline
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Post: #54
RE: Rumor: Incarnate Word gets site visit from WAC
(04-08-2021 07:45 PM)IWokeUpLikeThis Wrote:  
(04-08-2021 07:40 PM)DavidSt Wrote:  
(04-08-2021 06:16 PM)GeminiCoog Wrote:  Figured it would happen. They’re not a bad school; just need to upgrade some facilities if and when they get invited to join the WAC.


Yes, when they are ready to join the WAC in 2050. Their facilities are crap and they are more D2 level.

So it’s not Incarnate Word. Who is the WAC‘s 14th school?

Yes, it’s definitely gonna be Incarnate Word. I’m calling it right now. Don’t listen to David. He’s been wrong on these things so many times it’s unreal. Besides, they can use Alamo Stadium until theirs is finished being upgraded. But hey, if I’m wrong, I’ll be the one to admit it.
(This post was last modified: 04-08-2021 08:34 PM by GeminiCoog.)
04-08-2021 07:56 PM
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DoubleRSU Offline
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Post: #55
RE: Rumor: Incarnate Word gets site visit from WAC
(04-08-2021 07:45 PM)IWokeUpLikeThis Wrote:  
(04-08-2021 07:40 PM)DavidSt Wrote:  
(04-08-2021 06:16 PM)GeminiCoog Wrote:  Figured it would happen. They’re not a bad school; just need to upgrade some facilities if and when they get invited to join the WAC.


Yes, when they are ready to join the WAC in 2050. Their facilities are crap and they are more D2 level.

So it’s not Incarnate Word. Who is the WAC‘s 14th school?

He’s the wrong person to ask. He claimed WTAMU was the WAC’s 10th school last year and never predicted 4 SLC schools and Southern Utah would join. He knows nothing.
04-08-2021 08:02 PM
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GeminiCoog Offline
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Post: #56
RE: Rumor: Incarnate Word gets site visit from WAC
(04-08-2021 07:40 PM)DavidSt Wrote:  
(04-08-2021 06:16 PM)GeminiCoog Wrote:  Figured it would happen. They’re not a bad school; just need to upgrade some facilities if and when they get invited to join the WAC.


Yes, when they are ready to join the WAC in 2050. Their facilities are crap and they are more D2 level.

Wouldn’t the WAC need someone who’s ready to start competition right now and not have to go into a transition period due to moving up from a lower classification? West Texas A&M would still need a transition period unless the WAC sponsored them for an immediate move up, and even then, they’d still require at least a year or two to completely move up.

Incarnate Word is already FCS. All they would have to do is switch leagues and upgrade some of their facilities for when the WAC goes back to FBS football. Besides, if they need to, they could use Alamo Stadium until their football stadium is ready for FBS-level competition.

But hey, I’m just some guy in Texas who has had many friends and family members go to the Texas Four schools, especially the two in the Piney Woods and the one in Beaumont. If they’re saying Incarnate Word is the next school, I believe them. I’d certainly believe them more than I would you.
04-08-2021 08:21 PM
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DavidSt Offline
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Post: #57
RE: Rumor: Incarnate Word gets site visit from WAC
(04-08-2021 08:21 PM)GeminiCoog Wrote:  
(04-08-2021 07:40 PM)DavidSt Wrote:  
(04-08-2021 06:16 PM)GeminiCoog Wrote:  Figured it would happen. They’re not a bad school; just need to upgrade some facilities if and when they get invited to join the WAC.


Yes, when they are ready to join the WAC in 2050. Their facilities are crap and they are more D2 level.

Wouldn’t the WAC need someone who’s ready to start competition right now and not have to go into a transition period due to moving up from a lower classification? West Texas A&M would still need a transition period unless the WAC sponsored them for an immediate move up, and even then, they’d still require at least a year or two to completely move up.

Incarnate Word is already FCS. All they would have to do is switch leagues and upgrade some of their facilities for when the WAC goes back to FBS football. Besides, if they need to, they could use Alamo Stadium until their football stadium is ready for FBS-level competition.

But hey, I’m just some guy in Texas who has had many friends and family members go to the Texas Four schools, especially the two in the Piney Woods and the one in Beaumont. If they’re saying Incarnate Word is the next school, I believe them. I’d certainly believe them more than I would you.


West Texas A&M already have a D1 type facilities than Incarnate Word. They are the school that the Texas schools want because they are in a much better position than any other Southland schools. They bring better football and men's basketball product to the table for the WAC than Incarnate Word. Lets not forget that West Texas A&M did hold conference titles in D1 for football and men's basketball before. There is history there with them at D1 level a lot longer than Incarnate Word were.
04-08-2021 09:21 PM
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Post: #58
RE: Rumor: Incarnate Word gets site visit from WAC
(04-08-2021 12:15 PM)teamvsn Wrote:  
(04-08-2021 09:54 AM)Bobcat2013 Wrote:  
(04-08-2021 09:44 AM)teamvsn Wrote:  
(04-08-2021 09:26 AM)Bobcat2013 Wrote:  
(04-08-2021 09:13 AM)teamvsn Wrote:  TAMU San Antonio will be a no brainier in 10 years. Their NAIA ramp up is going slowly. They don't even have a web site yet. They do not seem to be in any hurry at all.

So if they're so unambitious then what makes them a no brainer?

They'll get there eventually. And often the people who launch athletic programs aren't there 5 years later.

Look at TAMU Texarkana's trajectory, and they're in a much smaller market.

Looking down the road IWU would make an interesting cross town rival for TAMU SA.

I've not even heard of TAMU Texarkana honestly. Where is their trajectory headed?
2000 - UG enrollment 775
2014 - Launches athletic program and joins the NAIA with M & W Tennis and W Soccer, UG Enrollment 1363
2015 - adds Baseball, goes 2-2 in NAIA opening round (2-2), UG Enrollment 1,422
2016 - Joins Red River Conference, adds M Soccer, UG Enrollment 1,583
2017 - adds Softball, UG Enrollment 1,647
2018 - Completes Patterson Student Center (Gymnasium), UG Enrollment 1,664
2019 - adds M & W Basketball
2020 - M Basketball qualifies for NAIA Opening Round (L), EG Enrollment 1,723

This is a typical trajectory for an NAIA start up. Truly a "start up". They had no facilities, administration or coaches. For any start up, first you have to hire a core administration, decide which sports to sponsor and when, decide where to play, possibly build new facilities, hire coaches to coach those sports, recruit players, recruit sponsors, build support in the community, etc. You can't just pop that all into place in one year. So even if you're super ambitious, you are probably going to roll out one or two sports at a time. Where are your early sports going to play until you have enough to meet NCAA requirements? The NAIA.

Texarkana fits the profile of a typical NAIA school, so they might make the NAIA their permanent home. I could see them going D2 if they found a good conference fit at some point. I think they will probably add W and possibly M Volleyball soon. Football is a possibility as well, although facilities would be a big question. Lots of other minor sports could follow such as golf, track, cross country, etc.

TAMU SA is a different story. I am happy they are in the NAIA but I have no doubt that they will outgrow it pretty quickly. I think their enrollment goals are in the 10s of thousands. They already have 6800. A city of 1.5 million can easily support multiple D1 schools. Think of all the TAMU main campus alumni that are in SA that would like to see a TAMU "little brother" playing in their town. It may never be a heavyweight D1, but there's room for success there.

What is the point of A&M-SA? There is already UTSA which is not especially selective. There is San Antonio College (JC). And Texas State is just 50 miles up the road. And that doesn't count the private colleges-Trinity, St. Mary's and Incarnate Word and Texas Lutheran in Seguin.
04-08-2021 09:35 PM
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RE: Rumor: Incarnate Word gets site visit from WAC
(04-08-2021 06:26 PM)72Tiger Wrote:  
(04-08-2021 02:53 PM)IWokeUpLikeThis Wrote:  
(04-08-2021 02:21 PM)DFW HOYA Wrote:  UIW could play the WAC games at Alamo Stadium.




Yes, I love those historic New Deal stadiums built in the FDR era. That place has history and character. Hosted the Tech/A&M game throughout the 40s.

Very close to UIW campus as well.

Alamo Stadium is basically walking distance, only a little over a mile away along Hildebrand, and with nearly 20k, is as much as they would need.
Its a high school stadium, but they could work things out.
(This post was last modified: 04-08-2021 09:43 PM by bullet.)
04-08-2021 09:42 PM
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GeminiCoog Offline
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RE: Rumor: Incarnate Word gets site visit from WAC
(04-08-2021 09:21 PM)DavidSt Wrote:  
(04-08-2021 08:21 PM)GeminiCoog Wrote:  
(04-08-2021 07:40 PM)DavidSt Wrote:  
(04-08-2021 06:16 PM)GeminiCoog Wrote:  Figured it would happen. They’re not a bad school; just need to upgrade some facilities if and when they get invited to join the WAC.


Yes, when they are ready to join the WAC in 2050. Their facilities are crap and they are more D2 level.

Wouldn’t the WAC need someone who’s ready to start competition right now and not have to go into a transition period due to moving up from a lower classification? West Texas A&M would still need a transition period unless the WAC sponsored them for an immediate move up, and even then, they’d still require at least a year or two to completely move up.

Incarnate Word is already FCS. All they would have to do is switch leagues and upgrade some of their facilities for when the WAC goes back to FBS football. Besides, if they need to, they could use Alamo Stadium until their football stadium is ready for FBS-level competition.

But hey, I’m just some guy in Texas who has had many friends and family members go to the Texas Four schools, especially the two in the Piney Woods and the one in Beaumont. If they’re saying Incarnate Word is the next school, I believe them. I’d certainly believe them more than I would you.


West Texas A&M already have a D1 type facilities than Incarnate Word. They are the school that the Texas schools want because they are in a much better position than any other Southland schools. They bring better football and men's basketball product to the table for the WAC than Incarnate Word. Lets not forget that West Texas A&M did hold conference titles in D1 for football and men's basketball before. There is history there with them at D1 level a lot longer than Incarnate Word were.

Yes, that is true. And yet, Incarnate Word is currently D1 while West Texas A&M is currently D2.

So who has an easier time moving to the WAC? Not the D2 school.

Sorry, dude, but if the WAC wants to have a six-team conference in football right now, the answer is Incarnate Word. If they don’t mind waiting until another D2 can move up and be a full member in a few years, the answer is absolutely West Texas A&M.
04-08-2021 10:47 PM
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