FLASHBACK: ‘60 Minutes’ Claimed No Evidence For Russia Collusion, Biden Scandal

(04-06-2021 12:15 PM)JRsec Wrote:  Nice deflection, but it misses the point. Trump won in 2016 because he reached voters that were left out of the Bush party, a party of pro corporate agendas. It is why the Bush family and Ryan and Romney (who is liberal as hell) all sought to thwart Trump. Trumps polarizing nature revealed the real rifts and stances of way too many corporate wonks who had been lining their pockets, and in the case of the Bush family they were corporate America and still are, they aren't wonks.

Trump received more votes in 2020 than he did in 2016. The only difference was the illegal votes, and you are damned right it needs to be dealt with. But not looking backwards dooms us in the future.

We need to recognize why Trump got so many votes, and it wasn't because of corporate ass kissing! It's because he represented the lower middle class, the middle middle class and some of the upper middle class (unless they were aging hippie draft dodging Boomers who will always vote left). He had some corporate support but mostly from smaller corporations interested in what is happening in the American work place and not overseas. He didn't have the NAFTA crowd or Big Tech most of which own the media.

Here's why you need to look backwards. The Republican party has to hold the middle class, make improvements for the poor as Trump did, and help corporations to the point that they are not damaging the United State's security (as Big Tech has), undermined Americas infrastructure (as the globalists have seeking slave labor abroad), and conspired to gain a hegemony over an industry (as Big Pharma has).

Otherwise Hambone we are headed for a corporately bought Congress, and a PAC funded President, and oodles of Federally appointed judges who will be in the hip pocket of Corporate Conglomerates and what we will have is a democratic facade for a Fascist State.

There is no difference at all, other than label, between a corporately backed Democrat and a corporately backed Republican. If the money comes out of the same pocket they do the same bidding. This is the essence of "The Swamp" and those who want to forget Trump and move on are only serving the corporatist fascist agenda.

And that is the damned reality and why we don't need to forget why Trump won, who he represented, and why the Republican Party needs to clean the house of any remnant of the Bush administration. Every damned picture with H.W. or W and the Obamas and the Clintons should be seen by the public constantly as they the chumminess goes much deeper than the photos.

I voted for Trump, I wish his aids had smashed his cell phone so he couldn't tweet. I didn't like the Yankee Bronx bravado, but every New York politician has had it. It only becomes an issue when the left doesn't like the policies. From Koch to Cuomo they all are brash. Hillary was abrasive.

The corporate crowd doesn't give a damn about brashness. They control the spin and only use brashness as an issue when the policies are not favorable to them. Trump should have been smarter during the election but it is who he is. But, he has taught us some very good lessons and we had better heed them moving forward, so this shovel kitty litter and move on crap doesn't cut it with me. It's a recipe for leaving turds in place that should be scooped and tossed, and it's still a friggin swamp!

What deflection, and how did I miss your point? I simply disagree with the tactics you wish to employ.

Biden also set records for votes, and while I agree that many of them were illegally cast, they were willing to break the law to elect Biden... which they didn't do (at least not to the degree) for Hillary. I don't believe it was because they love Biden, and neither do you... so it was obviously because they HATED Trump. Their entire election was all about defeating him... and any 'policy' issues were just about posturing to pick who would be in what seat on their ticket. I'm convinced that every single person who voted left (legally or not) would have also done so had it been Harris/Biden... or even Buttegieg/Warren.

You seem to want to take pride in that and encourage it... which is fine... and IMO why Trump lost. We can disagree... They were motivated and found a way to cheat. I've already suggested Trump COULD be at the top of the ticket (if you are right and we lose more by not having him) and I suggested someone like DeSantis to 'smooth his edges' but not 'lose his message'... in a way I don't think Pence can do.

If you disagree, that's fine... but I have neither missed your point nor deflected from it.

(04-06-2021 02:38 PM)Hambone10 Wrote:  

(04-06-2021 12:15 PM)JRsec Wrote:  Nice deflection, but it misses the point. Trump won in 2016 because he reached voters that were left out of the Bush party, a party of pro corporate agendas. It is why the Bush family and Ryan and Romney (who is liberal as hell) all sought to thwart Trump. Trumps polarizing nature revealed the real rifts and stances of way too many corporate wonks who had been lining their pockets, and in the case of the Bush family they were corporate America and still are, they aren't wonks.

Trump received more votes in 2020 than he did in 2016. The only difference was the illegal votes, and you are damned right it needs to be dealt with. But not looking backwards dooms us in the future.

We need to recognize why Trump got so many votes, and it wasn't because of corporate ass kissing! It's because he represented the lower middle class, the middle middle class and some of the upper middle class (unless they were aging hippie draft dodging Boomers who will always vote left). He had some corporate support but mostly from smaller corporations interested in what is happening in the American work place and not overseas. He didn't have the NAFTA crowd or Big Tech most of which own the media.

Here's why you need to look backwards. The Republican party has to hold the middle class, make improvements for the poor as Trump did, and help corporations to the point that they are not damaging the United State's security (as Big Tech has), undermined Americas infrastructure (as the globalists have seeking slave labor abroad), and conspired to gain a hegemony over an industry (as Big Pharma has).

Otherwise Hambone we are headed for a corporately bought Congress, and a PAC funded President, and oodles of Federally appointed judges who will be in the hip pocket of Corporate Conglomerates and what we will have is a democratic facade for a Fascist State.

There is no difference at all, other than label, between a corporately backed Democrat and a corporately backed Republican. If the money comes out of the same pocket they do the same bidding. This is the essence of "The Swamp" and those who want to forget Trump and move on are only serving the corporatist fascist agenda.

And that is the damned reality and why we don't need to forget why Trump won, who he represented, and why the Republican Party needs to clean the house of any remnant of the Bush administration. Every damned picture with H.W. or W and the Obamas and the Clintons should be seen by the public constantly as they the chumminess goes much deeper than the photos.

I voted for Trump, I wish his aids had smashed his cell phone so he couldn't tweet. I didn't like the Yankee Bronx bravado, but every New York politician has had it. It only becomes an issue when the left doesn't like the policies. From Koch to Cuomo they all are brash. Hillary was abrasive.

The corporate crowd doesn't give a damn about brashness. They control the spin and only use brashness as an issue when the policies are not favorable to them. Trump should have been smarter during the election but it is who he is. But, he has taught us some very good lessons and we had better heed them moving forward, so this shovel kitty litter and move on crap doesn't cut it with me. It's a recipe for leaving turds in place that should be scooped and tossed, and it's still a friggin swamp!

What deflection, and how did I miss your point? I simply disagree with the tactics you wish to employ.

Biden also set records for votes, and while I agree that many of them were illegally cast, they were willing to break the law to elect Biden... which they didn't do (at least not to the degree) for Hillary. I don't believe it was because they love Biden, and neither do you... so it was obviously because they HATED Trump. Their entire election was all about defeating him... and any 'policy' issues were just about posturing to pick who would be in what seat on their ticket. I'm convinced that every single person who voted left (legally or not) would have also done so had it been Harris/Biden... or even Buttegieg/Warren.

You seem to want to take pride in that and encourage it... which is fine... and IMO why Trump lost. We can disagree... They were motivated and found a way to cheat. I've already suggested Trump COULD be at the top of the ticket (if you are right and we lose more by not having him) and I suggested someone like DeSantis to 'smooth his edges' but not 'lose his message'... in a way I don't think Pence can do.

If you disagree, that's fine... but I have neither missed your point nor deflected from it.

Boy are you a piece of work. You defend yourself and still miss the whole point. You said to forget the past. The past has the focus and issues and lessons the Republicans need in order to win. The lesson is that blue collar workers (lower middle class), private business and professionals (middle middle class) and CEO's of national not global corporations (upper middle class) want a government that is responsive to their needs and not necessarily to those of global conglomerates. That is who Trump landed in record numbers and when minority votes started to erode his way it scared the hell out of the Left. That's why they cheated! And it was massive conglomerate money that paid for it, that donated money to states to use Dominion machines (swing states at that which indicates premeditation) it wasn't the poor who were motivated, but rather the ignorant who were misinformed by the MSM beating the same lies over and over again. And until that International Corporate money is out of our election process the nation will never again belong to the people, and we will have become a fascist state pretending to be a Republic.

We don't need to abandon the crusade against this (and those were the lessons of the Trump administration). They hated Trump because he was giving the citizens back a successful, and practical, America instead of soaking its middle class for their damned foreign endeavors.

I'm reminded of the a Bible verse which proclaims "The luke warm shall be spewed forth from the mouth of God" depending upon your translation it may be worded differently but the point is either are are for what is right or you are corrupt. Those in the middle are worthless to God and do the Devils bidding by inaction.

The Republican party will never win again with Bush policies. There wasn't a nickels difference between Bush, W., Clinton, and Obama when it came to foreign trade and military use.

Biden at one time might have fallen into that camp, but that was when he had a mind. Sanders and Harris and Buttigeig are all Marxists with Harris being a bit more of an opportunist than an ideologue. But these people are neither Clinton, Obama, H.W., or W.. These people are far worse and their kowtowing to Big Tech, Big Pharma and International Corporate Conglomerates, and the fact they cheated to win are all indications that we indeed are no longer a Republic, because a Republic would have demanded legitimacy in voting. But instead our courts demurred because they too are tainted by the Corporate money and those who while taking it appointed them.

Your namby pamby acceptance of the cheating tells me all I need know about your position. And from the way you make that a lower priority in your post by dismissing it and accepting the sheise we have now have without further question, speaks volumes. The time to deal with corruption is when it happens. We swept it under the rug!

Quote:On Tuesday, CBS doubled down after the network’s “60 Minutes” program was widely criticized for a hit piece targeting Florida GOP governor Ron DeSantis.

CBS stated:

When Florida state data revealed people of color were vaccinated at a much lower rate than their wealthier neighbors, 60 Minutes reported the facts surrounding the vaccine’s rollout, which is controlled by the governor. We requested and conducted interviews with dozens of sources and authorities involved. We requested an interview with Gov. Ron DeSantis, he declined; We spoke to State Emergency Management Director Jared Moskowitz twice, but he declined to be interviewed on camera for our story until well after our deadline. The idea we ignored their perspective is untrue. Counter to his statement yesterday, we also spoke on the record with Palm Beach County Mayor David Kerner. For over 50 years, the facts reported by 60 Minutes have often stirred debate and prompted strong reactions. Our story Sunday night speaks for itself.

A spokesman for CBS told Mediaite, “As we always do for clarity, 60 Minutes used the portion of the governor’s over two-minute response that directly addressed the question from the correspondent.”

On Sunday’s edition of “60 Minutes,” the program elided key sections from DeSantis’ reply to CBS’ Sharyn Alfonsi, who accused DeSantis of briefly permitting a limited number of Publix grocery stores in Palm Beach County to deliver Covid-19 vaccines before other drugstore chains after Publix contributed $100,000 to his campaign.

DeSantis noted that Publix was the first company to volunteer to deliver COVID-19 vaccines, but “60 Minutes” cut that out of the response they showed.

Mayor Dave Kerner of Palm Beach County, a Democrat, blasted “60 Minutes” for its edited version of DeSantis’ response, as The Daily Wire reported. He stated,“I watched the ’60 Minutes’ segment on Palm Beach County last night and feel compelled to issue this statement. The reporting was not just based on bad information — it was intentionally false. I know this because I offered to provide my insight into Palm Beach County’s vaccination efforts and 60 Minutes declined. They know that the Governor came to Palm Beach County and met with me and the county administrator and we asked to expand the state’s partnership with Publix to Palm Beach County. We also discussed our own local plans to expand mass vaccination centers throughout the county, which the governor has been incredibly supportive. We asked and he delivered. They had that information, and they left it out because it kneecaps their narrative.”

“We have confronted this pandemic for over a year. Our residents, like all Americans, are tired. And the media is making it worse. They are hellbent on dividing us for cheap views and clicks. ’60 Minutes’ should be ashamed,” Kerner continued. “I thank the Governor for supporting the residents of Palm Beach County. Because of his efforts, working in coordination with Palm Beach County officials, over 275,000 seniors in our county – which is over 75% of the total senior population –have been vaccinated. I am proud of how our county and state leadership have executed on this important mission, and the results speak for themselves.”

The Daily Wire noted that former Florida state Representative Jared Moskowitz, a Democrat, and the director of Florida’s Division of Emergency Management who has overseen the state’s response to the pandemic, as the Sun Sentinel reported, echoed, “@60Minutes I said this before and I’ll say it again. @Publix was recommended by [FL Division of Emergency Management] and [Florida Dept. Health] as the other pharmacies were not ready to start. Period! Full Stop! No one from the Governor[‘]s office suggested Publix. It’s just absolute malarkey.”

Numerous figures in the media condemned “60 Minutes” for its deceptive editing.

Publix issued a statement blasting Alfonsi’s claim that it donated to DeSantis’ campaign to score a contract to distribute vaccines.

“The irresponsible suggestion that there was a connection between campaign contributions made to Governor DeSantis and our willingness to join other pharmacies in support of the state’s vaccine distribution efforts is absolutely false and offensive,” Publix said. “We are proud of our pharmacy associates for administering more than 1.5 million doses of vaccine to date and for joining other retailers in Alabama, Florida, Georgia, South Carolina, Tennessee and Virginia to do our part to help our communities emerge from the pandemic.”

Link

Quote:Florida Gov. Ron DeSantis ® blasted “corporate media” and promised to hold news outlets accountable after CBS parroted unsupported allegations of a pay-to-play scheme against the governor.

CBS’s “60 Minutes” ran a segment on Florida’s COVID vaccination program while pushing allegations that the governor awarded the supermarket chain Publix a contract to disseminate the vaccine in exchange for campaign funds. The allegations have been denied by DeSantis, Publix, and the Democratic mayor of Palm Beach County who worked with the governor’s office on the vaccine distribution plan for the Palm Beach community.

“They cut out everything that showed that their narrative was a piece of horse manure and it shows you how dishonest, these are smear merchants – that’s why nobody trusts corporate media. They are a disaster in what they are doing,” DeSantis told a group of reporters on Tuesday. “They knew what they were doing was a lie. I knew what they were doing was a lie. Everybody here knows what they were doing is a lie. They know that we know they’re lying and yet they continue to lie.”

“We offered them the information and they declined to interview the key people because they didn’t want to let go of the narrative. Well, guess what? There are going to be consequences for that,” DeSantis said.

The CBS clip showed reporter Sharyn Alfonsi questioning DeSantis on an alleged pay-to-play scheme, but CBS cut out the substance of DeSantis’s response, making the governor seem uncommunicative and combative. The segment has received bipartisan backlash from Florida officials.

“They spliced it because they can’t handle the truth, and they know if they would have put out everything, they wouldn’t have had a story,” DeSantis continued. “They went for the smear, they’ve been caught red-handed.

“The message is for people out there, unless you’re a partisan leftist, do not trust corporate media. You can’t trust them. They’re not trustworthy. They will lie, they will smear and then they just move on to the next target and think that they’re going to be able to get away with it,” the governor continued. “You come down to our state and you try to smear people, we’re going to bite back and we’re going to hold you accountable. So this is not over by any stretch of the imagination.”

CBS issued a statement defending its edit of the clip, saying that they cut out DeSantis’s response for “clarity.”

“As we always do for clarity, 60 Minutes used the portion of the governor’s over two-minute response that directly addressed the question from the correspondent,” a CBS spokesman told Mediaite on Tuesday.

Palm Beach County Mayor David Kerner slammed CBS in a statement Monday accusing the network of lying to create a fake scandal about the DeSantis administration and Florida’s vaccination efforts.

“I watched the ’60 Minutes’ segment on Palm Beach County last night and feel compelled to issue this statement. The reporting was not just based on bad information – it was intentionally false,” Kerner wrote. “I know this because I offered to provide my insight into Palm Beach County’s vaccination efforts and ’60 Minutes’ declined.”

Link

(04-06-2021 03:14 PM)JRsec Wrote:  

(04-06-2021 02:38 PM)Hambone10 Wrote:  

(04-06-2021 12:15 PM)JRsec Wrote:  Nice deflection, but it misses the point. Trump won in 2016 because he reached voters that were left out of the Bush party, a party of pro corporate agendas. It is why the Bush family and Ryan and Romney (who is liberal as hell) all sought to thwart Trump. Trumps polarizing nature revealed the real rifts and stances of way too many corporate wonks who had been lining their pockets, and in the case of the Bush family they were corporate America and still are, they aren't wonks.

Trump received more votes in 2020 than he did in 2016. The only difference was the illegal votes, and you are damned right it needs to be dealt with. But not looking backwards dooms us in the future.

We need to recognize why Trump got so many votes, and it wasn't because of corporate ass kissing! It's because he represented the lower middle class, the middle middle class and some of the upper middle class (unless they were aging hippie draft dodging Boomers who will always vote left). He had some corporate support but mostly from smaller corporations interested in what is happening in the American work place and not overseas. He didn't have the NAFTA crowd or Big Tech most of which own the media.

Here's why you need to look backwards. The Republican party has to hold the middle class, make improvements for the poor as Trump did, and help corporations to the point that they are not damaging the United State's security (as Big Tech has), undermined Americas infrastructure (as the globalists have seeking slave labor abroad), and conspired to gain a hegemony over an industry (as Big Pharma has).

Otherwise Hambone we are headed for a corporately bought Congress, and a PAC funded President, and oodles of Federally appointed judges who will be in the hip pocket of Corporate Conglomerates and what we will have is a democratic facade for a Fascist State.

There is no difference at all, other than label, between a corporately backed Democrat and a corporately backed Republican. If the money comes out of the same pocket they do the same bidding. This is the essence of "The Swamp" and those who want to forget Trump and move on are only serving the corporatist fascist agenda.

And that is the damned reality and why we don't need to forget why Trump won, who he represented, and why the Republican Party needs to clean the house of any remnant of the Bush administration. Every damned picture with H.W. or W and the Obamas and the Clintons should be seen by the public constantly as they the chumminess goes much deeper than the photos.

I voted for Trump, I wish his aids had smashed his cell phone so he couldn't tweet. I didn't like the Yankee Bronx bravado, but every New York politician has had it. It only becomes an issue when the left doesn't like the policies. From Koch to Cuomo they all are brash. Hillary was abrasive.

The corporate crowd doesn't give a damn about brashness. They control the spin and only use brashness as an issue when the policies are not favorable to them. Trump should have been smarter during the election but it is who he is. But, he has taught us some very good lessons and we had better heed them moving forward, so this shovel kitty litter and move on crap doesn't cut it with me. It's a recipe for leaving turds in place that should be scooped and tossed, and it's still a friggin swamp!

What deflection, and how did I miss your point? I simply disagree with the tactics you wish to employ.

Biden also set records for votes, and while I agree that many of them were illegally cast, they were willing to break the law to elect Biden... which they didn't do (at least not to the degree) for Hillary. I don't believe it was because they love Biden, and neither do you... so it was obviously because they HATED Trump. Their entire election was all about defeating him... and any 'policy' issues were just about posturing to pick who would be in what seat on their ticket. I'm convinced that every single person who voted left (legally or not) would have also done so had it been Harris/Biden... or even Buttegieg/Warren.

You seem to want to take pride in that and encourage it... which is fine... and IMO why Trump lost. We can disagree... They were motivated and found a way to cheat. I've already suggested Trump COULD be at the top of the ticket (if you are right and we lose more by not having him) and I suggested someone like DeSantis to 'smooth his edges' but not 'lose his message'... in a way I don't think Pence can do.

If you disagree, that's fine... but I have neither missed your point nor deflected from it.

Boy are you a piece of work. You defend yourself and still miss the whole point. You said to forget the past. The past has the focus and issues and lessons the Republicans need in order to win. The lesson is that blue collar workers (lower middle class), private business and professionals (middle middle class) and CEO's of national not global corporations (upper middle class) want a government that is responsive to their needs and not necessarily to those of global conglomerates. That is who Trump landed in record numbers and when minority votes started to erode his way it scared the hell out of the Left. That's why they cheated! And it was massive conglomerate money that paid for it, that donated money to states to use Dominion machines (swing states at that which indicates premeditation) it wasn't the poor who were motivated, but rather the ignorant who were misinformed by the MSM beating the same lies over and over again. And until that International Corporate money is out of our election process the nation will never again belong to the people, and we will have become a fascist state pretending to be a Republic.

We don't need to abandon the crusade against this (and those were the lessons of the Trump administration). They hated Trump because he was giving the citizens back a successful, and practical, America instead of soaking its middle class for their damned foreign endeavors.

I'm reminded of the a Bible verse which proclaims "The luke warm shall be spewed forth from the mouth of God" depending upon your translation it may be worded differently but the point is either are are for what is right or you are corrupt. Those in the middle are worthless to God and do the Devils bidding by inaction.

The Republican party will never win again with Bush policies. There wasn't a nickels difference between Bush, W., Clinton, and Obama when it came to foreign trade and military use.

Biden at one time might have fallen into that camp, but that was when he had a mind. Sanders and Harris and Buttigeig are all Marxists with Harris being a bit more of an opportunist than an ideologue. But these people are neither Clinton, Obama, H.W., or W.. These people are far worse and their kowtowing to Big Tech, Big Pharma and International Corporate Conglomerates, and the fact they cheated to win are all indications that we indeed are no longer a Republic, because a Republic would have demanded legitimacy in voting. But instead our courts demurred because they too are tainted by the Corporate money and those who while taking it appointed them.

Your namby pamby acceptance of the cheating tells me all I need know about your position. And from the way make that a lower priority in your post dismissing it and accepting the sheise we have now speaks volumes. The time to deal with corruption is when it happens. We swept it under the rug!

I simply don't understand why the bold needs to be restated to ad nauseam....it's too simple for the avg. idiot not to understand...

what I see is how the numbers of stupid/worthless/lazy have overwhelmed common sense....

to your wit (again, to ad nauseam), is the failure of how we lack a fundamental education system that creates incentive via self reliance + self worth....

be it DJT, DeSantis, the midterms, the pubs as a whole need to learn how to cut throats.....unfortunately, there's still too many pos rinos with 100% shitehole dems....and they're all bought at this point....

my crew new it was coming back in the 80s.....I had it happening ~'30....I only missed it by a decade....


imagine what it looks like when the market drops 30%+ in the not too distant future....cheese lines won't be available...

that day is coming muh fellow VZ folk.....

Quote:TALLAHASSEE, FL—In response to being caught deceptively editing a statement by Florida Governor Ron DeSantis, who later called them "lairs" for pushing a "fake narrative," CBS hit back today with another bombshell.

Several photos, described by CBS as "totally real and authentic," appear to show DeSantis clubbing baby seals with his best friend Adolf Hitler.

"We are shocked and saddened by this terrible reveal of Desantis's past," said correspondent Sharyn Alfonsi. "It would appear from these completely undoctored photographs, that Ron DeSantis is both a fan of clubbing baby seals and a Nazi. Please know that I am just as saddened by this news as I'm sure the rest of the country is."

In a statement, Governor DeSantis replied: "This is not true! I love baby seals! And I've never met Hitler!"

60 Minutes later reported the Governor's statement as: "This is... true! I love [clubbing] baby seals! And I've... met Hitler!"

The governor later thanked CBS for helping to launch his presidential campaign.

Link

(04-06-2021 03:41 PM)stinkfist Wrote:  

(04-06-2021 03:14 PM)JRsec Wrote:  

(04-06-2021 02:38 PM)Hambone10 Wrote:  

(04-06-2021 12:15 PM)JRsec Wrote:  Nice deflection, but it misses the point. Trump won in 2016 because he reached voters that were left out of the Bush party, a party of pro corporate agendas. It is why the Bush family and Ryan and Romney (who is liberal as hell) all sought to thwart Trump. Trumps polarizing nature revealed the real rifts and stances of way too many corporate wonks who had been lining their pockets, and in the case of the Bush family they were corporate America and still are, they aren't wonks.

Trump received more votes in 2020 than he did in 2016. The only difference was the illegal votes, and you are damned right it needs to be dealt with. But not looking backwards dooms us in the future.

We need to recognize why Trump got so many votes, and it wasn't because of corporate ass kissing! It's because he represented the lower middle class, the middle middle class and some of the upper middle class (unless they were aging hippie draft dodging Boomers who will always vote left). He had some corporate support but mostly from smaller corporations interested in what is happening in the American work place and not overseas. He didn't have the NAFTA crowd or Big Tech most of which own the media.

Here's why you need to look backwards. The Republican party has to hold the middle class, make improvements for the poor as Trump did, and help corporations to the point that they are not damaging the United State's security (as Big Tech has), undermined Americas infrastructure (as the globalists have seeking slave labor abroad), and conspired to gain a hegemony over an industry (as Big Pharma has).

Otherwise Hambone we are headed for a corporately bought Congress, and a PAC funded President, and oodles of Federally appointed judges who will be in the hip pocket of Corporate Conglomerates and what we will have is a democratic facade for a Fascist State.

There is no difference at all, other than label, between a corporately backed Democrat and a corporately backed Republican. If the money comes out of the same pocket they do the same bidding. This is the essence of "The Swamp" and those who want to forget Trump and move on are only serving the corporatist fascist agenda.

And that is the damned reality and why we don't need to forget why Trump won, who he represented, and why the Republican Party needs to clean the house of any remnant of the Bush administration. Every damned picture with H.W. or W and the Obamas and the Clintons should be seen by the public constantly as they the chumminess goes much deeper than the photos.

I voted for Trump, I wish his aids had smashed his cell phone so he couldn't tweet. I didn't like the Yankee Bronx bravado, but every New York politician has had it. It only becomes an issue when the left doesn't like the policies. From Koch to Cuomo they all are brash. Hillary was abrasive.

The corporate crowd doesn't give a damn about brashness. They control the spin and only use brashness as an issue when the policies are not favorable to them. Trump should have been smarter during the election but it is who he is. But, he has taught us some very good lessons and we had better heed them moving forward, so this shovel kitty litter and move on crap doesn't cut it with me. It's a recipe for leaving turds in place that should be scooped and tossed, and it's still a friggin swamp!

What deflection, and how did I miss your point? I simply disagree with the tactics you wish to employ.

Biden also set records for votes, and while I agree that many of them were illegally cast, they were willing to break the law to elect Biden... which they didn't do (at least not to the degree) for Hillary. I don't believe it was because they love Biden, and neither do you... so it was obviously because they HATED Trump. Their entire election was all about defeating him... and any 'policy' issues were just about posturing to pick who would be in what seat on their ticket. I'm convinced that every single person who voted left (legally or not) would have also done so had it been Harris/Biden... or even Buttegieg/Warren.

You seem to want to take pride in that and encourage it... which is fine... and IMO why Trump lost. We can disagree... They were motivated and found a way to cheat. I've already suggested Trump COULD be at the top of the ticket (if you are right and we lose more by not having him) and I suggested someone like DeSantis to 'smooth his edges' but not 'lose his message'... in a way I don't think Pence can do.

If you disagree, that's fine... but I have neither missed your point nor deflected from it.

Boy are you a piece of work. You defend yourself and still miss the whole point. You said to forget the past. The past has the focus and issues and lessons the Republicans need in order to win. The lesson is that blue collar workers (lower middle class), private business and professionals (middle middle class) and CEO's of national not global corporations (upper middle class) want a government that is responsive to their needs and not necessarily to those of global conglomerates. That is who Trump landed in record numbers and when minority votes started to erode his way it scared the hell out of the Left. That's why they cheated! And it was massive conglomerate money that paid for it, that donated money to states to use Dominion machines (swing states at that which indicates premeditation) it wasn't the poor who were motivated, but rather the ignorant who were misinformed by the MSM beating the same lies over and over again. And until that International Corporate money is out of our election process the nation will never again belong to the people, and we will have become a fascist state pretending to be a Republic.

We don't need to abandon the crusade against this (and those were the lessons of the Trump administration). They hated Trump because he was giving the citizens back a successful, and practical, America instead of soaking its middle class for their damned foreign endeavors.

I'm reminded of the a Bible verse which proclaims "The luke warm shall be spewed forth from the mouth of God" depending upon your translation it may be worded differently but the point is either are are for what is right or you are corrupt. Those in the middle are worthless to God and do the Devils bidding by inaction.

The Republican party will never win again with Bush policies. There wasn't a nickels difference between Bush, W., Clinton, and Obama when it came to foreign trade and military use.

Biden at one time might have fallen into that camp, but that was when he had a mind. Sanders and Harris and Buttigeig are all Marxists with Harris being a bit more of an opportunist than an ideologue. But these people are neither Clinton, Obama, H.W., or W.. These people are far worse and their kowtowing to Big Tech, Big Pharma and International Corporate Conglomerates, and the fact they cheated to win are all indications that we indeed are no longer a Republic, because a Republic would have demanded legitimacy in voting. But instead our courts demurred because they too are tainted by the Corporate money and those who while taking it appointed them.

Your namby pamby acceptance of the cheating tells me all I need know about your position. And from the way make that a lower priority in your post dismissing it and accepting the sheise we have now speaks volumes. The time to deal with corruption is when it happens. We swept it under the rug!

I simply don't understand why the bold needs to be restated to ad nauseam....it's too simple for the avg. idiot not to understand...

what I see is how the numbers of stupid/worthless/lazy have overwhelmed common sense....

to your wit (again, to ad nauseam), is the failure of how we lack a fundamental education system that creates incentive via self reliance + self worth....

be it DJT, DeSantis, the midterms, the pubs as a whole need to learn how to cut throats.....unfortunately, there's still too many pos rinos with 100% shitehole dems....and they're all bought at this point....

my crew new it was coming back in the 80s.....I had it happening ~'30....I only missed it by a decade....


imagine what it looks like when the market drops 30%+ in the not too distant future....cheese lines won't be available...

that day is coming muh fellow VZ folk.....

You what will be hell? A nation load of government teat suckers when Miss Liberty's breasts run as cold as the bronze they are made of and dry as a bone! Hell they've never hunted (scared of guns, scared of the woods, ignorant of nature) and don't know where meat comes from. They can't milk a cow and make cheese and butter (still got a churn) and they don't know how to garden (got mine down in the last 2 days). All they know how to do is squawk and crap, a nation of seagulls is what public education has carefully crafted.

The best thing that could happen to America would be for the global grid to go down and people to learn how to actually fend for themselves, smoke meats, eat fresh, and boil water, if they can find it. My greatgrandfather never paid a utility bill in his life other than the phone. His radio had an antenna and it worked for the analog TV that took its place. His windmill powered his well his refrigerator, and the stove and 2 reading lights one over the kitchen table and one hanging from the ceiling in the living room, where the radio was located. He had cows, mules, fruit and pecan orchards, a large fully stocked pond and about 180 acres of farmland. They raised children to work. They lacked for nothing, had an extensive library they all read, and my greatgrandmother made medicines from the local plants.

Americans aren't just dumb and stupid today, they are lazy, ignorant, and useless. And yes Public Education is to blame, absolutely it is.

Have you ever taken an idiot hunting? If he doesn't accidentally shoot you or himself and he is lucky enough to bag a deer or hog just watch him ruin the meat when he fakes his way through a field dressing.

Stink they outnumber us now 20 to 1 or more and corporations are laying claim to public land for taking over management and private land through sale and we are fast approaching the days when the crap hits the fan and we all get to play Sherwood Forest and poach the King's stag. The right to own is evaporating and the cubicle dweebs don't even realize it. Reverse mortgages to take your parent's home (if they are dumb) and the big push to rent so you don't have to spend on repairs, are just making it easy to become property-less slaves in a world of shrinking resources.

What people are going to find out soon enough is that the lack of primers is the control point for firearms. I'd recommend raising exotic frogs and learning how to pucker, because if you don't have a compound bow and know how to use it, or a great crossbow, it's the blowgun for you!

(04-06-2021 03:14 PM)JRsec Wrote:  Boy are you a piece of work. You defend yourself and still miss the whole point. You said to forget the past.

No I did not. If I had, you could quote me saying 'forget the past'. You didn't.

Quote:The past has the focus and issues and lessons the Republicans need in order to win.

I agree... and said as much.

Quote:The lesson is that blue collar workers (lower middle class), private business and professionals (middle middle class) and CEO's of national not global corporations (upper middle class) want a government that is responsive to their needs and not necessarily to those of global conglomerates. That is who Trump landed in record numbers and when minority votes started to erode his way it scared the hell out of the Left. That's why they cheated! And it was massive conglomerate money that paid for it, that donated money to states to use Dominion machines (swing states at that which indicates premeditation) it wasn't the poor who were motivated, but rather the ignorant who were misinformed by the MSM beating the same lies over and over again. And until that International Corporate money is out of our election process the nation will never again belong to the people, and we will have become a fascist state pretending to be a Republic.

Do you honestly think you're going to either sway any leftist voters or convince them to stay home or not cheat with any of the above? SInce their motivation to cheat last time was to 'STOP TRUMP', it seems obvious that while such a chant is inevitable, it might be wise not to fan those flames. You're all offense, no defense. That's okay, I just disagree with it. The additional problem I have with your approach is that they still have more morons and cheaters they can pull out.... newer ways to cheat.... and the above only encourages them to do more of it, not less. SInce we didn't win the last election, we don't control the places where you want to 'change the rules'. How do you suggest we do that without having the votes (not in the public, in the legislatures.. the people who make the rules)?? Revolution?? Okay. I don't think you have the numbers or weaponry, but maybe I'm wrong.

Quote:We don't need to abandon the crusade against this (and those were the lessons of the Trump administration). They hated Trump because he was giving the citizens back a successful, and practical, America instead of soaking its middle class for their damned foreign endeavors.

I'm reminded of the a Bible verse which proclaims "The luke warm shall be spewed forth from the mouth of God" depending upon your translation it may be worded differently but the point is either are are for what is right or you are corrupt. Those in the middle are worthless to God and do the Devils bidding by inaction.

The Republican party will never win again with Bush policies. There wasn't a nickels difference between Bush, W., Clinton, and Obama when it came to foreign trade and military use.

Biden at one time might have fallen into that camp, but that was when he had a mind. Sanders and Harris and Buttigeig are all Marxists with Harris being a bit more of an opportunist than an ideologue. But these people are neither Clinton, Obama, H.W., or W.. These people are far worse and their kowtowing to Big Tech, Big Pharma and International Corporate Conglomerates, and the fact they cheated to win are all indications that we indeed are no longer a Republic, because a Republic would have demanded legitimacy in voting. But instead our courts demurred because they too are tainted by the Corporate money and those who while taking it appointed them.

Your namby pamby acceptance of the cheating tells me all I need know about your position. And from the way you make that a lower priority in your post by dismissing it and accepting the sheise we have now have without further question, speaks volumes. The time to deal with corruption is when it happens. We swept it under the rug!

Meh... I don't think you understand me at all, much less know 'all you need to know' about my position. All you CARE to know, perhaps... but not all you NEED to know (if you want to understand it).

The cheating happened and they now control the places where the rules are made. How you intend to fix something when you don't control the process and the cheaters do, I am waiting for you to articulate. It would be rude of me to assume that because you haven't articulated how to change the rules for the next election BEFORE the next election that I know all I need to know about your plan or that you don't have one... but I sure can't see it.

If your solution is to utilize the courts, that's fine. I support that. The dems have already said how they will address that... pack the courts...

You aren't differentiating between 'how you win an election' and 'how you govern after you've won'. Trump can't do much of anything if he doesn't get elected.


Think of it this way...

You're arguing to get a larger percentage of the available open/Republican voters... but Democrats have already shown a willingness to deliver 110% of the available voters. How do you propose to win with 100% of ANYTHING if the opposition is willing to cheat??

(04-06-2021 05:22 PM)Hambone10 Wrote:  

(04-06-2021 03:14 PM)JRsec Wrote:  Boy are you a piece of work. You defend yourself and still miss the whole point. You said to forget the past.

No I did not. If I had, you could quote me saying 'forget the past'. You didn't.

Quote:The past has the focus and issues and lessons the Republicans need in order to win.

I agree... and said as much.

Quote:The lesson is that blue collar workers (lower middle class), private business and professionals (middle middle class) and CEO's of national not global corporations (upper middle class) want a government that is responsive to their needs and not necessarily to those of global conglomerates. That is who Trump landed in record numbers and when minority votes started to erode his way it scared the hell out of the Left. That's why they cheated! And it was massive conglomerate money that paid for it, that donated money to states to use Dominion machines (swing states at that which indicates premeditation) it wasn't the poor who were motivated, but rather the ignorant who were misinformed by the MSM beating the same lies over and over again. And until that International Corporate money is out of our election process the nation will never again belong to the people, and we will have become a fascist state pretending to be a Republic.

Do you honestly think you're going to either sway any leftist voters or convince them to stay home or not cheat with any of the above? SInce their motivation to cheat last time was to 'STOP TRUMP', it seems obvious that while such a chant is inevitable, it might be wise not to fan those flames. You're all offense, no defense. That's okay, I just disagree with it. The additional problem I have with your approach is that they still have more morons and cheaters they can pull out.... newer ways to cheat.... and the above only encourages them to do more of it, not less. SInce we didn't win the last election, we don't control the places where you want to 'change the rules'. How do you suggest we do that without having the votes (not in the public, in the legislatures.. the people who make the rules)?? Revolution?? Okay. I don't think you have the numbers or weaponry, but maybe I'm wrong.

Quote:We don't need to abandon the crusade against this (and those were the lessons of the Trump administration). They hated Trump because he was giving the citizens back a successful, and practical, America instead of soaking its middle class for their damned foreign endeavors.

I'm reminded of the a Bible verse which proclaims "The luke warm shall be spewed forth from the mouth of God" depending upon your translation it may be worded differently but the point is either are are for what is right or you are corrupt. Those in the middle are worthless to God and do the Devils bidding by inaction.

The Republican party will never win again with Bush policies. There wasn't a nickels difference between Bush, W., Clinton, and Obama when it came to foreign trade and military use.

Biden at one time might have fallen into that camp, but that was when he had a mind. Sanders and Harris and Buttigeig are all Marxists with Harris being a bit more of an opportunist than an ideologue. But these people are neither Clinton, Obama, H.W., or W.. These people are far worse and their kowtowing to Big Tech, Big Pharma and International Corporate Conglomerates, and the fact they cheated to win are all indications that we indeed are no longer a Republic, because a Republic would have demanded legitimacy in voting. But instead our courts demurred because they too are tainted by the Corporate money and those who while taking it appointed them.

Your namby pamby acceptance of the cheating tells me all I need know about your position. And from the way you make that a lower priority in your post by dismissing it and accepting the sheise we have now have without further question, speaks volumes. The time to deal with corruption is when it happens. We swept it under the rug!

Meh... I don't think you understand me at all, much less know 'all you need to know' about my position. All you CARE to know, perhaps... but not all you NEED to know (if you want to understand it).

The cheating happened and they now control the places where the rules are made. How you intend to fix something when you don't control the process and the cheaters do, I am waiting for you to articulate. It would be rude of me to assume that because you haven't articulated how to change the rules for the next election BEFORE the next election that I know all I need to know about your plan or that you don't have one... but I sure can't see it.

If your solution is to utilize the courts, that's fine. I support that. The dems have already said how they will address that... pack the courts...

You aren't differentiating between 'how you win an election' and 'how you govern after you've won'. Trump can't do much of anything if he doesn't get elected.


Think of it this way...

You're arguing to get a larger percentage of the available open/Republican voters... but Democrats have already shown a willingness to deliver 110% of the available voters. How do you propose to win with 100% of ANYTHING if the opposition is willing to cheat??

You are either unwilling on unable to get on the same page. Trump carried enough support to win save for 400,000 well placed fraudulent ballots. There is no base to be abandoned and he was gaining with Hispanics and among working class African Americans.

If we were going to fix the cheating we'd put some asses in jail where they belong but the pro Corporate House and Senate and the pro Corporate Judges all turned a blind eye along with their appointed leaders of the FBI, HSA, and CIA whose purview would be limited to port cities. There is no appetite to fix it in Washington because they are virtually all on the take. It is why they don't represent you or me.

Trumps actions worked. His mouth was broken and disengaged from his business sense. It is who is is and typical of NY politicians. Chutzpah! To abandon Trump's approach is to reembrace the RINO's. No Thanks!

If the United States is to survive as a "FREE" nation the recipe is simple:
1. Educate all children to strive for excellence. Anything less is a disservice to the children and the nation.
2. Redirect the less intelligent into productive job apprenticeships as they do in Germany and Japan.
3. End all corporate giving to elections and set limits for what individuals may give.
4. Have an immigration policy designed to fill needs, not appease the needy.
5. Make Networks stand alone companies not allowed to be part of any other organization. An independent news serves us all. Corporate news serves the corporations.
6. All US based companies will submit to whatever restrictions the Department of State sets on trade with countries with enmity for the U.S. or with outright adversaries. Our National Security has to come first before profits for us to survive.
7. When you register to vote you get a picture I.D./background check/and Passport all at once. Prospective voters need to be employed or retired and should not be on any form of public assistance other than Social Security (which they paid for). And they cannot be convicted felons.

Do that and we'll get a nation that is well informed, protects its citizens from foreign predators (like foreign phone scams), and which elects people to Congress who are only beholden to their constituents.

So other than combining Voter ID with Passport pretty much what the founding fathers had in mind.

I suggest the passport because we are soon going to need it to fly anyway so why not prove citizenship, meet the background check, get your voter ID and Passport all at once. We might like to freely drive to Canada and Mexico again like we did when I was a young family man. You shouldn't need a damn passport to see Niagara Falls from both sides. Besides Canadians are more like Americans than ever before. When I was living there they were just milk-toast Americans. Now most of America is milk-toast.

But none of this happens if Trump's plan for America is abandoned. We wind up with third world educations, a lazy assed cry baby work force, incompetence in government offices (which is already rampant with the quota system) and about as free as the common European which is overtaxed and owns less and less real property. That's the Clinton/Bush plan. So no thanks.

I have nothing against De Santis but the whole movement has to be focused on objectives and can't afford to be sidetracked by the foibles of personality. And to win in 2022 and 2024 whoever the nominee is will need Trumps support.

(04-06-2021 05:54 PM)JRsec Wrote:  

(04-06-2021 05:22 PM)Hambone10 Wrote:  

(04-06-2021 03:14 PM)JRsec Wrote:  Boy are you a piece of work. You defend yourself and still miss the whole point. You said to forget the past.

No I did not. If I had, you could quote me saying 'forget the past'. You didn't.

Quote:The past has the focus and issues and lessons the Republicans need in order to win.

I agree... and said as much.

Quote:The lesson is that blue collar workers (lower middle class), private business and professionals (middle middle class) and CEO's of national not global corporations (upper middle class) want a government that is responsive to their needs and not necessarily to those of global conglomerates. That is who Trump landed in record numbers and when minority votes started to erode his way it scared the hell out of the Left. That's why they cheated! And it was massive conglomerate money that paid for it, that donated money to states to use Dominion machines (swing states at that which indicates premeditation) it wasn't the poor who were motivated, but rather the ignorant who were misinformed by the MSM beating the same lies over and over again. And until that International Corporate money is out of our election process the nation will never again belong to the people, and we will have become a fascist state pretending to be a Republic.

Do you honestly think you're going to either sway any leftist voters or convince them to stay home or not cheat with any of the above? SInce their motivation to cheat last time was to 'STOP TRUMP', it seems obvious that while such a chant is inevitable, it might be wise not to fan those flames. You're all offense, no defense. That's okay, I just disagree with it. The additional problem I have with your approach is that they still have more morons and cheaters they can pull out.... newer ways to cheat.... and the above only encourages them to do more of it, not less. SInce we didn't win the last election, we don't control the places where you want to 'change the rules'. How do you suggest we do that without having the votes (not in the public, in the legislatures.. the people who make the rules)?? Revolution?? Okay. I don't think you have the numbers or weaponry, but maybe I'm wrong.

Quote:We don't need to abandon the crusade against this (and those were the lessons of the Trump administration). They hated Trump because he was giving the citizens back a successful, and practical, America instead of soaking its middle class for their damned foreign endeavors.

I'm reminded of the a Bible verse which proclaims "The luke warm shall be spewed forth from the mouth of God" depending upon your translation it may be worded differently but the point is either are are for what is right or you are corrupt. Those in the middle are worthless to God and do the Devils bidding by inaction.

The Republican party will never win again with Bush policies. There wasn't a nickels difference between Bush, W., Clinton, and Obama when it came to foreign trade and military use.

Biden at one time might have fallen into that camp, but that was when he had a mind. Sanders and Harris and Buttigeig are all Marxists with Harris being a bit more of an opportunist than an ideologue. But these people are neither Clinton, Obama, H.W., or W.. These people are far worse and their kowtowing to Big Tech, Big Pharma and International Corporate Conglomerates, and the fact they cheated to win are all indications that we indeed are no longer a Republic, because a Republic would have demanded legitimacy in voting. But instead our courts demurred because they too are tainted by the Corporate money and those who while taking it appointed them.

Your namby pamby acceptance of the cheating tells me all I need know about your position. And from the way you make that a lower priority in your post by dismissing it and accepting the sheise we have now have without further question, speaks volumes. The time to deal with corruption is when it happens. We swept it under the rug!

Meh... I don't think you understand me at all, much less know 'all you need to know' about my position. All you CARE to know, perhaps... but not all you NEED to know (if you want to understand it).

The cheating happened and they now control the places where the rules are made. How you intend to fix something when you don't control the process and the cheaters do, I am waiting for you to articulate. It would be rude of me to assume that because you haven't articulated how to change the rules for the next election BEFORE the next election that I know all I need to know about your plan or that you don't have one... but I sure can't see it.

If your solution is to utilize the courts, that's fine. I support that. The dems have already said how they will address that... pack the courts...

You aren't differentiating between 'how you win an election' and 'how you govern after you've won'. Trump can't do much of anything if he doesn't get elected.


Think of it this way...

You're arguing to get a larger percentage of the available open/Republican voters... but Democrats have already shown a willingness to deliver 110% of the available voters. How do you propose to win with 100% of ANYTHING if the opposition is willing to cheat??

You are either unwilling on unable to get on the same page. Trump carried enough support to win save for 400,000 well placed fraudulent ballots. There is no base to be abandoned and he was gaining with Hispanics and among working class African Americans.

If we were going to fix the cheating we'd put some asses in jail where they belong but the pro Corporate House and Senate and the pro Corporate Judges all turned a blind eye along with their appointed leaders of the FBI, HSA, and CIA whose purview would be limited to port cities. There is no appetite to fix it in Washington because they are virtually all on the take. It is why they don't represent you or me.

Trumps actions worked. His mouth was broken and disengaged from his business sense. It is who is is and typical of NY politicians. Chutzpah! To abandon Trump's approach is to reembrace the RINO's. No Thanks!

If the United States is to survive as a "FREE" nation the recipe is simple:
1. Educate all children to strive for excellence. Anything less is a disservice to the children and the nation.
2. Redirect the less intelligent into productive job apprenticeships as they do in Germany and Japan.
3. End all corporate giving to elections and set limits for what individuals may give.
4. Have an immigration policy designed to fill needs, not appease the needy.
5. Make Networks stand alone companies not allowed to be part of any other organization. An independent news serves us all. Corporate news serves the corporations.
6. All US based companies will submit to whatever restrictions the Department of State sets on trade with countries with enmity for the U.S. or with outright adversaries. Our National Security has to come first before profits for us to survive.
7. When you register to vote you get a picture I.D./background check/and Passport all at once. Prospective voters need to be employed or retired and should not be on any form of public assistance other than Social Security (which they paid for). And they cannot be convicted felons.

Do that and we'll get a nation that is well informed, protects its citizens from foreign predators (like foreign phone scams), and which elects people to Congress who are only beholden to their constituents.

So other than combining Voter ID with Passport pretty much what the founding fathers had in mind.

I suggest the passport because we are soon going to need it to fly anyway so why not prove citizenship, meet the background check, get your voter ID and Passport all at once. We might like to freely drive to Canada and Mexico again like we did when I was a young family man. You shouldn't need a damn passport to see Niagara Falls from both sides. Besides Canadians are more like Americans than ever before. When I was living there they were just milk-toast Americans. Now most of America is milk-toast.

But none of this happens if Trump's plan for America is abandoned. We wind up with third world educations, a lazy assed cry baby work force, incompetence in government offices (which is already rampant with the quota system) and about as free as the common European which is overtaxed and owns less and less real property. That's the Clinton/Bush plan. So no thanks.

I have nothing against De Santis but the whole movement has to be focused on objectives and can't afford to be sidetracked by the foibles of personality. And to win in 2022 and 2024 whoever the nominee is will need Trumps support.

pay att'n to 1-7 boys and gals....

the first on the list is the trickiest due to 'muh feels'..........but w/o question, our entire education system has to be redesigned to fit the needs of all w/o trying to squeeze the needs of all into one....hence, line item #2

JR, there's only one issue with it all.....some lambs would be sacrificed along the path......and that won't sit well with auntie jamima, nor her flock....

I really wish DJT would've addressed education directives in term one......I'm almost certain it would've happened in term 2 with legislative support.....

however, what happened???? never trumpers completely fk'd the first two years with total control.....

if we had legislative term limits???? maybe it's plausible.....

it's a shame some on a bbs see the path w/o much recourse....

(04-06-2021 05:54 PM)JRsec Wrote:  You are either unwilling on unable to get on the same page.

Maybe we should start by defining what pages we're on. My page is to win the next election essentially by doing exactly what Trump did in 2016 (legally) and what Biden did in 2020 (Illegally) in order to put rules in place to eliminate/reduce the ability to vote illegally. What they did was take a strategic approach to the election... which you seem to agree happened when you say this....

Quote:Trump carried enough support to win save for 400,000 well placed fraudulent ballots. There is no base to be abandoned and he was gaining with Hispanics and among working class African Americans.

I don't know what the second sentence has to do with anything I said... but the first comment is absolutely true. I'd only add that Trump WON in 2016 by winning a couple hundred thousand well places VALID ballots.

Quote:If we were going to fix the cheating we'd put some asses in jail where they belong but the pro Corporate House and Senate and the pro Corporate Judges all turned a blind eye along with their appointed leaders of the FBI, HSA, and CIA whose purview would be limited to port cities. There is no appetite to fix it in Washington because they are virtually all on the take. It is why they don't represent you or me.

I agree... but unless you're planning on revolution of some sort, the only way to fix a corrupt government is to vote them out... and they have shown they are willing to cheat to win...

So don't show your hand/gameplan.

Quote:Trumps actions worked. His mouth was broken and disengaged from his business sense. It is who is is and typical of NY politicians. Chutzpah! To abandon Trump's approach is to reembrace the RINO's. No Thanks!

So you can't have the actions and business sense without a broken and disengaged mouth?? I guess this is where we disagree. I think you can.... and even if you can't, I think you can still put someone 'stronger than Pence' in place to do a better job of 'interpreting' Trump... not to Trump supporters, but to anyone open to being swayed... or more importantly... to 'cut off' the attacks from the left. As opposed to letting 'whomever the liberal media selects' to represent Trump, insist that the VP do it, or nobody else.

Quote:If the United States is to survive as a "FREE" nation the recipe is simple:

I've edited this out because I don't disagree with any of it, and haven't remotely implied that I did. If Trump can accomplish the stated objective of emboldening the right without making himself an EASY target from the left because of his broken and disengaged mouth (your words) then I support that. If instead it takes Desantis or anyone else who can accomplish your goals, then I support that. Are you able to run?

Quote:I have nothing against De Santis but the whole movement has to be focused on objectives and can't afford to be sidetracked by the foibles of personality. And to win in 2022 and 2024 whoever the nominee is will need Trumps support.

While this is possible and perhaps even likely, MY goal is to accomplish YOUR goals... with or without Trump. If we had a candidate who embodied all that you support, why would Trump supporters be against him? 270 EVs by ANY (legal) means.

Are you saying you'd rather lose with Trump than win without him? What good is that?

All I'm saying is focus on winning with someone willing to do the right things... not on electing Trump. I haven't said to elect someone who won't do all the things you listed or to 'soften' the goals. That was never even part of the conversation. I just said to package it smarter.

Let me say it differently... and just picking a random Trump campaign promise...
If Trump saying 'some illegal immigrants are criminals' when speaking of illegal immigration creates a 'losing for him' or 'highly motivating, enough to cheat for them' situation, then since we lack the power to stop them from cheating, he needs to find a way to say it differently or don't say it at all. You don't have to say it before the election, to DO it AFTER the election. If he is so intent on 'being Trump' (and by that I mean your, ''broken and disengaged mouth', not his business sense) that he costs us the election, then why would you support that?

Democrats cheated. We know they did. I don't think you can PROVE it (in a court of law) though, enough to change it. Not public opinion, but through the current, manipulated legal and legislative systems. I think you agree with this. We need to win the next one... and if that means Trump has to be put out (I'm not saying he does.. I"m saying 'if') then that's what needs to happen. Your LIST is what matters to me.... not electing Trump.

Bottom line, Cheers

Guys, think about what “they” have done in the last year:

Very possibly (maybe likely) released a virus.......most certainly made no attempt to keep it in China.

Convinced almost all the Western world to lock themselves down and nearly wreck each countries economy for a virus that is fatal to less than 1% of the population.

Used said virus as a cudgel to try and unseat a President that wouldn’t play by their rules, then when they saw that wouldn’t defeat him, cheated rampantly enough to install a person that’s at best in mental decline.

They’ve cranked up the printing presses to devalue the dollar a bunch.

They are opening the border floodgates to allow as many illegals in country to scatter as possible.

......developed a vaccine that certainly appears more gene therapy than vaccine, to what ends no one knows....but they are still pushing people that have had the virus and are immune to still get the vaccine???

And now pushing “Vaccine Passports” to force vaccination if people want to participate in society and implementing “social credit scores”

Have a Bill in Congress to federalize elections (a clear violation of the Constitution) that would institutionalize the ability to election cheat.

This is where we are and at least half the American populace is in the dark and ignorant of what is happening. The takeover is in-process.

If the state governments don’t get off their asses and clean up the election laws from cheating (no chance the fed does it) we are very close to a fascist state and voting won’t matter.

.......we are nearing the hill to die on.

(04-06-2021 08:38 PM)Crebman Wrote:  Guys, think about what “they” have done in the last year:

Very possibly (maybe likely) released a virus.......most certainly made no attempt to keep it in China.

Convinced almost all the Western world to lock themselves down and nearly wreck each countries economy for a virus that is fatal to less than 1% of the population.

Used said virus as a cudgel to try and unseat a President that wouldn’t play by their rules, then when they saw that wouldn’t defeat him, cheated rampantly enough to install a person that’s at best in mental decline.

They’ve cranked up the printing presses to devalue the dollar a bunch.

They are opening the border floodgates to allow as many illegals in country to scatter as possible.

......developed a vaccine that certainly appears more gene therapy than vaccine, to what ends no one knows....but they are still pushing people that have had the virus and are immune to still get the vaccine???

And now pushing “Vaccine Passports” to force vaccination if people want to participate in society and implementing “social credit scores”

Have a Bill in Congress to federalize elections (a clear violation of the Constitution) that would institutionalize the ability to election cheat.

This is where we are and at least half the American populace is in the dark and ignorant of what is happening. The takeover is in-process.

If the state governments don’t get off their asses and clean up the election laws from cheating (no chance the fed does it) we are very close to a fascist state and voting won’t matter.

.......we are nearing the hill to die on.

that's spot-on......in varying methodology, some of us have pointed out all the above over the past year.....

it's been more than disgusting watching it play out with the numbnuts cheating away at the fabric of this nation.....

fwiw, it's easily +50% w/o a clue.....

MY HILL IS WORTH DYING FOR IF SO

(04-06-2021 09:08 AM)Owl 69/70/75 Wrote:  One problem with Trump/DeSantis. With Trump now a resident of Florida, that would mean that Florida electors could not vote for both of them. And if you think republicans can win without Florida, I don't.

I don't think Trump is the best candidate for 2024. Assuming the democrats will run Kamala the ****, republicans will have a huge potential advantage in that it's going to be hard for the MSM to polish up that turd enough to make her look more likable than whomever republicans run. They need to run somebody without Trump's negatives.

But what they really need to do is focus on issues. Republicans haven't run an issues-based campaign since 1994. How did that turn out?

I’d disagree with that, I think the ‘16 campaign was very much about the issues. Sadly the same ones we are largely facing again today.

‘20 more about personality, hurt feels, anarchy from the trust fund kids and a temper tantrum. I’ve never seen as many new converts to “McCain is a great hero” people in my life.

Cheney and Dubbya were both Texans at the time, Cheney just switched PO Boxes once he found himself to.be the best suited to be VP (which I did and do support).

Trump just moves to another of his golf courses in NoVa, Md., Colorado wherever. TrumpForce one can get him around easily enough.

Perhaps even go with a DeSantos/Trump ticket? It’s basically what we have today, only with the training wheels off, and far less tapioca and fewer chin wipes.

60 Minutes has been doing this crap for decades. No one should be surprised. The idea of Anderson Cooper being one of their "journalists" should tell you everything you need to know

(04-07-2021 04:38 AM)JMUDunk Wrote:  

(04-06-2021 09:08 AM)Owl 69/70/75 Wrote:  One problem with Trump/DeSantis. With Trump now a resident of Florida, that would mean that Florida electors could not vote for both of them. And if you think republicans can win without Florida, I don't.

I don't think Trump is the best candidate for 2024. Assuming the democrats will run Kamala the ****, republicans will have a huge potential advantage in that it's going to be hard for the MSM to polish up that turd enough to make her look more likable than whomever republicans run. They need to run somebody without Trump's negatives.

But what they really need to do is focus on issues. Republicans haven't run an issues-based campaign since 1994. How did that turn out?

I’d disagree with that, I think the ‘16 campaign was very much about the issues. Sadly the same ones we are largely facing again today.

‘20 more about personality, hurt feels, anarchy from the trust fund kids and a temper tantrum. I’ve never seen as many new converts to “McCain is a great hero” people in my life.

Cheney and Dubbya were both Texans at the time, Cheney just switched PO Boxes once he found himself to.be the best suited to be VP (which I did and do support).

Trump just moves to another of his golf courses in NoVa, Md., Colorado wherever. TrumpForce one can get him around easily enough.

Perhaps even go with a DeSantis/Trump ticket? It’s basically what we have today, only with the training wheels off, and far less tapioca and fewer chin wipes.

^^^ .... owl#s simply didn't like the solution/platform...

WALL, MAGA, TARRIFS, TWEETS, ETC

(04-07-2021 05:44 AM)TheOriginalBigApp Wrote:  60 Minutes has been doing this crap for decades. No one should be surprised. The idea of Anderson Cooper being one of their "journalists" should tell you everything you need to know

w/o question.....those fkbags have been manipulating 'stories' from day one....

it's truly saddening how easily the sheeple are 'spun'....

(04-07-2021 04:38 AM)JMUDunk Wrote:  

(04-06-2021 09:08 AM)Owl 69/70/75 Wrote:  One problem with Trump/DeSantis. With Trump now a resident of Florida, that would mean that Florida electors could not vote for both of them. And if you think republicans can win without Florida, I don't.
I don't think Trump is the best candidate for 2024. Assuming the democrats will run Kamala the ****, republicans will have a huge potential advantage in that it's going to be hard for the MSM to polish up that turd enough to make her look more likable than whomever republicans run. They need to run somebody without Trump's negatives.
But what they really need to do is focus on issues. Republicans haven't run an issues-based campaign since 1994. How did that turn out?

I’d disagree with that, I think the ‘16 campaign was very much about the issues. Sadly the same ones we are largely facing again today.
‘20 more about personality, hurt feels, anarchy from the trust fund kids and a temper tantrum. I’ve never seen as many new converts to “McCain is a great hero” people in my life.
Cheney and Dubbya were both Texans at the time, Cheney just switched PO Boxes once he found himself to.be the best suited to be VP (which I did and do support).
Trump just moves to another of his golf courses in NoVa, Md., Colorado wherever. TrumpForce one can get him around easily enough.
Perhaps even go with a DeSantos/Trump ticket? It’s basically what we have today, only with the training wheels off, and far less tapioca and fewer chin wipes.

One proposal I heard is that Trump run for a safe congressional seat in Florida, and if republicans retake the house, they make him speaker. That one sounds very juicy to me.

(04-07-2021 09:47 AM)Owl 69/70/75 Wrote:  

(04-07-2021 04:38 AM)JMUDunk Wrote:  

(04-06-2021 09:08 AM)Owl 69/70/75 Wrote:  One problem with Trump/DeSantis. With Trump now a resident of Florida, that would mean that Florida electors could not vote for both of them. And if you think republicans can win without Florida, I don't.
I don't think Trump is the best candidate for 2024. Assuming the democrats will run Kamala the ****, republicans will have a huge potential advantage in that it's going to be hard for the MSM to polish up that turd enough to make her look more likable than whomever republicans run. They need to run somebody without Trump's negatives.
But what they really need to do is focus on issues. Republicans haven't run an issues-based campaign since 1994. How did that turn out?

I’d disagree with that, I think the ‘16 campaign was very much about the issues. Sadly the same ones we are largely facing again today.
‘20 more about personality, hurt feels, anarchy from the trust fund kids and a temper tantrum. I’ve never seen as many new converts to “McCain is a great hero” people in my life.
Cheney and Dubbya were both Texans at the time, Cheney just switched PO Boxes once he found himself to.be the best suited to be VP (which I did and do support).
Trump just moves to another of his golf courses in NoVa, Md., Colorado wherever. TrumpForce one can get him around easily enough.
Perhaps even go with a DeSantos/Trump ticket? It’s basically what we have today, only with the training wheels off, and far less tapioca and fewer chin wipes.

One proposal I heard is that Trump run for a safe congressional seat in Florida, and if republicans retake the house, they make him speaker. That one sounds very juicy to me.

Pelosi handing Trump the gavel would be TV GOLD!!!

(04-07-2021 05:44 AM)TheOriginalBigApp Wrote:  60 Minutes has been doing this crap for decades. No one should be surprised. The idea of Anderson Cooper being one of their "journalists" should tell you everything you need to know

Anderson Cooper is my 7th cousin. So was GHWB, on a different line.

Cooper's ancestor Hugh Judson Kilpatrick was a general in the Union cavalry, known as "Kill cavalry" for his reckless tactics. He was sent by Grant to burn Eatonton, Georgia, on the march to the sea. His cousin and my ancestor, Madison Kilpatrick, lived in Eatonton, which today claims to be the only city not burned on the march to the sea. There is a family legend, which may or may not be true, that Madison's family (he was away fighting) somehow talked Hugh out of burning Eatonton.