(02-15-2022 07:47 AM)owl at the moon Wrote:  

(02-14-2022 08:38 PM)WRCisforgotten79 Wrote:  (1) Even with Olivari, Rice was not among the top 50% of Division I (according to Pomeroy);

(2) Every team has injuries - that's the reason why good recruiting is essential (and Pera has been well below average in recruiting and keeping quality players - their best player is a transfer good for just one season);

(3) Don't even compare Houston's losses to those by Rice. And though UH's players were WAY better than ours, they're still at #7 in Pomeroy.

Fact check on #1.
We were, until we weren’t.
Spent most of this season in the top half of most ranking systems, including KenPom.

Top 50% on Pomeroy would mean no worse than #179. Do you have receipts demonstrating that Rice spent most of the season among the top 50 percent?

(02-14-2022 08:38 PM)WRCisforgotten79 Wrote:  

(02-14-2022 05:20 PM)Kayjay Wrote:  The injury to Q has thrown a wrench in the lineup to say the least. Right now there are 4 players on the shelf, Lieppert and Olivari, who are both out for the season, and Geron and Hutchins, (I don’t know the timetable for their return). Hutchins was earning more PT when he got hurt and Geron would have received some more developmental minutes with Q’s injury but his foot was in a brace at the UNT game Saturday. I don’t know many coaches that can lose 4 players like the Owls have and not struggle. Even UH has lost their last 2 games since they lost Sasser and a couple other players. I don’t blame Pera for the injuries. I think he is really working hard to find the right combination(s) to compete and finish the season positively.

(1) Even with Olivari, Rice was not among the top 50% of Division I (according to Pomeroy);

(2) Every team has injuries - that's the reason why good recruiting is essential (and Pera has been well below average in recruiting and keeping quality players - their best player is a transfer good for just one season);

(3) Don't even compare Houston's losses to those by Rice. And though UH's players were WAY better than ours, they're still at #7 in Pomeroy.

Agree that UH is WAY more talented and disciplined than the Owls. We also know that without the injuries to Sasser and other Cougars that SMU and Memphis don’t win those games. Even with Q in the line up Rice does not compete last week against UNT but they could (possibly) have beaten UTEP if he didn’t get hurt. Every team does deal with injuries. not every team has 4 players injured at the same time. It messes with game planning, game rotation, practice and much more. And you are right, Rice is not as deep as some other teams so the loss of the players is much more difficult for them. Not excuses, just fact.

I see a team that has continued to improve during Coach Pera’s tenure. Will it continue? No idea. I can tell you I have certainly enjoyed watching this team develop this season. I am also realistic. They have a long way to go until they can compete with NCAA tournament level teams.

(02-15-2022 12:07 AM)markbrindley Wrote:  

(02-14-2022 09:55 PM)Tomball Owl Wrote:  

(02-14-2022 09:42 PM)Snozberry Wrote:  

(02-14-2022 09:36 PM)markbrindley Wrote:  

(02-14-2022 09:22 PM)Snozberry Wrote:  He’s done a great job recruiting. From what I’ve heard, he was the main guy on the trail under Rhodes. Signed Evans, Letcher-Ellis, and the other (relatively) highly rated recruits from the Rhodes years. Most of those guys had power 5 offers. Koulechov from the portal as well.

As head coach, he recruited 3 guys who now start for USC, FSU and Vandy. Was it his fault they transferred? Rice boosters needed to get these guys NIL deals to keep them on campus. Didn’t happen, and they left. This is the new reality, the monied schools will keep recruiting the best mid-major underclassmen. Unless Rice boosters get on the NIL train and protect their best players, this will continue. Who knows, maybe Kazemi, Ennis and the other transfers from the Braun years would have stayed on campus if Rice made an effort to protect their program from getting poached by blue bloods.

NIL wasn't even an option when those guys were on campus. The NIL train is definitely something going forward, but had no impact on these guys leaving.

NIL may have not been official yet, but that doesn’t change the fact that these guys were poached from Rice. The boosters from those schools took care of them, no doubt.

Are you actually suggesting Rice should have cheated because other schools and their boosters may have?

No thanks.

i don't think boosters paying these kids was required, but some seem to think it's the only way a kid moves from one school to another. Snoz, there were plenty of other reasons for kids to leave - some for opportunity, some for grades, and others just to be somewhere else.

I’m just telling y’all how other schools protect their top players from poaching. Rice hasn’t done that, and it’s cost them three chances to field a tourney-level team over the past ten years.

(02-15-2022 12:12 PM)Snozberry Wrote:  

(02-15-2022 12:07 AM)markbrindley Wrote:  

(02-14-2022 09:55 PM)Tomball Owl Wrote:  

(02-14-2022 09:42 PM)Snozberry Wrote:  

(02-14-2022 09:36 PM)markbrindley Wrote:  NIL wasn't even an option when those guys were on campus. The NIL train is definitely something going forward, but had no impact on these guys leaving.

NIL may have not been official yet, but that doesn’t change the fact that these guys were poached from Rice. The boosters from those schools took care of them, no doubt.

Are you actually suggesting Rice should have cheated because other schools and their boosters may have?

No thanks.

i don't think boosters paying these kids was required, but some seem to think it's the only way a kid moves from one school to another. Snoz, there were plenty of other reasons for kids to leave - some for opportunity, some for grades, and others just to be somewhere else.

I’m just telling y’all how other schools protect their top players from poaching. Rice hasn’t done that, and it’s cost them three chances to field a tourney-level team over the past ten years.

You didn't answer the question. Did you think Rice should have cheated pre-NIL to "protect their top players"?

(02-15-2022 12:40 PM)Tomball Owl Wrote:  

(02-15-2022 12:12 PM)Snozberry Wrote:  

(02-15-2022 12:07 AM)markbrindley Wrote:  

(02-14-2022 09:55 PM)Tomball Owl Wrote:  

(02-14-2022 09:42 PM)Snozberry Wrote:  NIL may have not been official yet, but that doesn’t change the fact that these guys were poached from Rice. The boosters from those schools took care of them, no doubt.

Are you actually suggesting Rice should have cheated because other schools and their boosters may have?

No thanks.

i don't think boosters paying these kids was required, but some seem to think it's the only way a kid moves from one school to another. Snoz, there were plenty of other reasons for kids to leave - some for opportunity, some for grades, and others just to be somewhere else.

I’m just telling y’all how other schools protect their top players from poaching. Rice hasn’t done that, and it’s cost them three chances to field a tourney-level team over the past ten years.

You didn't answer the question. Did you think Rice should have cheated pre-NIL to "protect their top players"?

Count me in as someone who does!

Hasn't hurt any other schools who have recently cheated (Duke, SMU, Auburn, etc).

Nine out of ten schools are cheating. The other is in last place Jerry Tarkanian

(02-15-2022 09:12 AM)WRCisforgotten79 Wrote:  

(02-15-2022 07:47 AM)owl at the moon Wrote:  

(02-14-2022 08:38 PM)WRCisforgotten79 Wrote:  (1) Even with Olivari, Rice was not among the top 50% of Division I (according to Pomeroy);

(2) Every team has injuries - that's the reason why good recruiting is essential (and Pera has been well below average in recruiting and keeping quality players - their best player is a transfer good for just one season);

(3) Don't even compare Houston's losses to those by Rice. And though UH's players were WAY better than ours, they're still at #7 in Pomeroy.

Fact check on #1.
We were, until we weren’t.
Spent most of this season in the top half of most ranking systems, including KenPom.

Top 50% on Pomeroy would mean no worse than #179. Do you have receipts demonstrating that Rice spent most of the season among the top 50 percent?

Most of my KenPom receipts are on the KenPom thread.

I did not snapshot it every game (ironic since that was the point of the thread!) but it looks to me like Rice spent all of 2021 (November and December) at 179 or higher. Was likely the 1/1 UNT loss that dropped us below 180, and the UAB win on 1/8 back up to quartile 2. The home Charlotte loss (1/22) dropped us back below the Mendoza line, where we’ve remained the past month.
So if I’m right on those exact transition dates then that’s
Nov/Dec 11/0
Jan 4/3
Feb 0/3
So after 15 games we’ve been above the line, and only below it after 6.

But now we’re mired down in the 200s and so it was a nice ride while it lasted but I will be impressed if we get to see more of the best version of the Nov/Dec/Jan team down the stretch.

Here’s my screen capture from the day after the Texas State Loss (we were 157 headed in and they were 156). After the loss we dropped to 166 and from there the only thing that would have likely dropped us below 179 was the drubbing at UNT January 1. Happy New Year! I just hope we can avoid UNT in Frisco.

(02-15-2022 12:40 PM)Tomball Owl Wrote:  

(02-15-2022 12:12 PM)Snozberry Wrote:  

(02-15-2022 12:07 AM)markbrindley Wrote:  

(02-14-2022 09:55 PM)Tomball Owl Wrote:  

(02-14-2022 09:42 PM)Snozberry Wrote:  NIL may have not been official yet, but that doesn’t change the fact that these guys were poached from Rice. The boosters from those schools took care of them, no doubt.

Are you actually suggesting Rice should have cheated because other schools and their boosters may have?

No thanks.

i don't think boosters paying these kids was required, but some seem to think it's the only way a kid moves from one school to another. Snoz, there were plenty of other reasons for kids to leave - some for opportunity, some for grades, and others just to be somewhere else.

I’m just telling y’all how other schools protect their top players from poaching. Rice hasn’t done that, and it’s cost them three chances to field a tourney-level team over the past ten years.

You didn't answer the question. Did you think Rice should have cheated pre-NIL to "protect their top players"?

Yes. Unfortunately, others were happy to let Rice become a recruiting ground.

(02-16-2022 10:32 AM)Snozberry Wrote:  

(02-15-2022 12:40 PM)Tomball Owl Wrote:  

(02-15-2022 12:12 PM)Snozberry Wrote:  

(02-15-2022 12:07 AM)markbrindley Wrote:  

(02-14-2022 09:55 PM)Tomball Owl Wrote:  Are you actually suggesting Rice should have cheated because other schools and their boosters may have?

No thanks.

i don't think boosters paying these kids was required, but some seem to think it's the only way a kid moves from one school to another. Snoz, there were plenty of other reasons for kids to leave - some for opportunity, some for grades, and others just to be somewhere else.

I’m just telling y’all how other schools protect their top players from poaching. Rice hasn’t done that, and it’s cost them three chances to field a tourney-level team over the past ten years.

You didn't answer the question. Did you think Rice should have cheated pre-NIL to "protect their top players"?

Yes. Unfortunately, others were happy to let Rice become a recruiting ground.

And the Rice Honor Code is more like a suggested guideline. Got it.