Totally nuetral party here. Seems to me UC is trashing Brannen to get out of paying the buyout. Does Brannen deserve to be fired? Probably. But being a d*ck who is mean and runs hard practices does not equate to breaking a contract. If UC had made it to the second week of the NCAAs this year, this would not be a conversation. UC hired this guy two years ago; none of these issues came up? Where was UCs due diligence in hiring him?

(05-05-2021 10:32 AM)pesik Wrote:  

(05-05-2021 10:22 AM)justinhub2003 Wrote:  You’re a idiot. I played basketball my whole life. It’s one thing to condition, it’s another to endanger UNPAID athletes.


Just stop commenting on UC basketball dude. Your a know it all who will take any stand that’s against UC basketball. Just like you questioned the John Brannen hire. Now you are defending him.

1) i dontcare that you fired him.... why do you keep coming back to the point like im defending his coaching ability... the whole convo is about HOW you fired him.. i questioned brannen basketball ability. i never said to make him into a monster

2) so in your high school practices.. you never had to do sprints where players went to the ground or almost collapsed .. this was a common thing literally everywhere ive been especially preseason stuff

No one has ever denied me water and I’ve never needed Oxygen or IV’s


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(05-05-2021 10:25 AM)JFlight21 Wrote:  Those last two paragraphs you typed are remarkable and even more so that you actually believe it! We had a player (Prince Toyambi) in the fall of 2019 (Brannen's first year) whose life was saved by the training staff and the heart monitors. And then this past August, the head trainer's high school grandson died after a soccer conditioning drill (go read the story about Matt Mangine, it's heartbreaking). But you decide it's Brannen's instinct for comedy that drove these remarks! Get a clue.

https://www.msn.com/en-us/lifestyle/pare...r-BB15GibO

again off the cuff comment.. who said anything about comedy... an example a player keeps trying to avoid sprints and using the heart monitor as his excuse and that he is in shape and doesnt need to run. a frustrated brannen says the to the staff in private "F*** the heart monitor. I know what in shape is" out of frustration....

who cares... i dont know the context... spied on conversations from months of practices you are bound to say something out of frustration especially when you are losing or players arent in shape and running out fo time... using that quote as some sort of gotcha is a witchhunt ...

(05-05-2021 10:39 AM)justinhub2003 Wrote:  

(05-05-2021 10:32 AM)pesik Wrote:  

(05-05-2021 10:22 AM)justinhub2003 Wrote:  You’re a idiot. I played basketball my whole life. It’s one thing to condition, it’s another to endanger UNPAID athletes.


Just stop commenting on UC basketball dude. Your a know it all who will take any stand that’s against UC basketball. Just like you questioned the John Brannen hire. Now you are defending him.

1) i dontcare that you fired him.... why do you keep coming back to the point like im defending his coaching ability... the whole convo is about HOW you fired him.. i questioned brannen basketball ability. i never said to make him into a monster

2) so in your high school practices.. you never had to do sprints where players went to the ground or almost collapsed .. this was a common thing literally everywhere ive been especially preseason stuff

No one has ever denied me water and I’ve never needed Oxygen or IV’s


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you had oxygen and ivs in your high school????? what, where did you go??

my school we had a water fountain, we didnt have water boys who gave them water after every sprint...after all the sprints were done, we all went to the fountain

(05-05-2021 10:36 AM)vick mike Wrote:  Totally nuetral party here. Seems to me UC is trashing Brannen to get out of paying the buyout. Does Brannen deserve to be fired? Probably. But being a d*ck who is mean and runs hard practices does not equate to breaking a contract. If UC had made it to the second week of the NCAAs this year, this would not be a conversation. UC hired this guy two years ago; none of these issues came up? Where was UCs due diligence in hiring him?

There was no due diligence. That has already been covered.

(05-05-2021 10:36 AM)vick mike Wrote:  Totally nuetral party here. Seems to me UC is trashing Brannen to get out of paying the buyout. Does Brannen deserve to be fired? Probably. But being a d*ck who is mean and runs hard practices does not equate to breaking a contract. If UC had made it to the second week of the NCAAs this year, this would not be a conversation. UC hired this guy two years ago; none of these issues came up? Where was UCs due diligence in hiring him?

I also don't appreciate this line of thinking - if UC had made the second week of the NCAAs. Well that wasn't an option because his players hated him and he drove off about half the roster.

(05-05-2021 10:40 AM)pesik Wrote:  again off the cuff comment.. who said anything about comedy... an example a player keeps trying to avoid sprints and using the heart monitor as his excuse and that he is in shape and doesnt need to run. a frustrated brannen says the to the staff in private "F*** the heart monitor. I know what in shape is" out of frustration....

who cares... i dont know the context... spied on conversations from months of practices you are bound to say something out of frustration especially when you are losing or players arent in shape and running out fo time... using that quote as some sort of gotcha is a witchhunt ...

Can't make it 2 paragraphs without contradicting yourself. Absolute **** tier opinions.

(05-05-2021 10:48 AM)Billy Bob Bearcat Wrote:  

(05-05-2021 10:40 AM)pesik Wrote:  again off the cuff comment.. who said anything about comedy... an example a player keeps trying to avoid sprints and using the heart monitor as his excuse and that he is in shape and doesnt need to run. a frustrated brannen says the to the staff in private "F*** the heart monitor. I know what in shape is" out of frustration....

who cares... i dont know the context... spied on conversations from months of practices you are bound to say something out of frustration especially when you are losing or players arent in shape and running out fo time... using that quote as some sort of gotcha is a witchhunt ...

Can't make it 2 paragraphs without contradicting yourself. Absolute **** tier opinions.

you missed the point.. that there are tons of possibilities for the context of that statement.. but UC fans are hanging their hats on that statement.. acting like there is no possible way he could have said that without malicious intent .. they see 1 out of context quote and now thats all they need.

im saying its meaningless without getting full context from both sides

(05-05-2021 10:36 AM)vick mike Wrote:  Totally nuetral party here. Seems to me UC is trashing Brannen to get out of paying the buyout. Does Brannen deserve to be fired? Probably. But being a d*ck who is mean and runs hard practices does not equate to breaking a contract. If UC had made it to the second week of the NCAAs this year, this would not be a conversation. UC hired this guy two years ago; none of these issues came up? Where was UCs due diligence in hiring him?

The last AD put no real due diligence into hiring him. He was moving on to "bigger and better" things because of the success of the Fickell hiring.

As far as this being a UC smear campaign. The Document that came out yesterday was a freedom of information act request by the local paper. This is our first "insider" information, and it definitely isn't officially from the university or athletic department.

(05-05-2021 10:36 AM)vick mike Wrote:  Totally nuetral party here. Seems to me UC is trashing Brannen to get out of paying the buyout. Does Brannen deserve to be fired? Probably. But being a d*ck who is mean and runs hard practices does not equate to breaking a contract. If UC had made it to the second week of the NCAAs this year, this would not be a conversation. UC hired this guy two years ago; none of these issues came up? Where was UCs due diligence in hiring him?

UC documented issues prior to the season. They sent him a letter of reprimand before the season even began coming off a conference championship. If this is just an effort to trash Brannen they showed an incredible amount of foresight in case things fell apart.

Or the more likely scenario. There were real issues, brought to the administration by UC's medical staff and the players. They reprimanded him, but many of the concerns raised remained ongoing and contributed to a toxic environment for our student athletes. Is that going to be a enough to win on "for cause", I guess we'll see, having read the relevant parts of the contract I think UC has a good case (not a slam dunk case) and it makes sense for UC to go about it this way.

(05-05-2021 10:51 AM)pesik Wrote:  

(05-05-2021 10:48 AM)Billy Bob Bearcat Wrote:  

(05-05-2021 10:40 AM)pesik Wrote:  again off the cuff comment.. who said anything about comedy... an example a player keeps trying to avoid sprints and using the heart monitor as his excuse and that he is in shape and doesnt need to run. a frustrated brannen says the to the staff in private "F*** the heart monitor. I know what in shape is" out of frustration....

who cares... i dont know the context... spied on conversations from months of practices you are bound to say something out of frustration especially when you are losing or players arent in shape and running out fo time... using that quote as some sort of gotcha is a witchhunt ...

Can't make it 2 paragraphs without contradicting yourself. Absolute **** tier opinions.

you missed the point.. that there are tons of possibilities for the context of that statement.. but UC fans are hanging their hats on that statement.. acting like there is no possible way he could have said that without malicious intent .. the see 1 out of context quote and now thats all they need

Dwight you ignorant sl*t.

(05-05-2021 10:51 AM)pesik Wrote:  

(05-05-2021 10:48 AM)Billy Bob Bearcat Wrote:  

(05-05-2021 10:40 AM)pesik Wrote:  again off the cuff comment.. who said anything about comedy... an example a player keeps trying to avoid sprints and using the heart monitor as his excuse and that he is in shape and doesnt need to run. a frustrated brannen says the to the staff in private "F*** the heart monitor. I know what in shape is" out of frustration....

who cares... i dont know the context... spied on conversations from months of practices you are bound to say something out of frustration especially when you are losing or players arent in shape and running out fo time... using that quote as some sort of gotcha is a witchhunt ...

Can't make it 2 paragraphs without contradicting yourself. Absolute **** tier opinions.

you missed the point.. that there are tons of possibilities for the context of that statement.. but UC fans are hanging their hats on that statement.. acting like there is no possible way he could have said that without malicious intent .. the see 1 out of context quote and now thats all they need

How about this for context:

In each of the past two seasons, a graduate transfer couldn't even make it to February.
4 different players opted out this past season.
2 strength coaches left after one year with Brannen and one just returned under a new coach.
An entire freshman class entered the transfer portal and 3 returned once we had a new coach in place.

Those are the facts - I won't even delve into all the other rumors we've heard.

As each new piece of information comes out you continue to analyze it in complete isolation to all of the other factors at play. Sure, there probably isn't a big single incident smoking gun but once you look at the entire picture it is so painfully obvious regarding Brannen's conduct. But I guess that is too difficult for you to understand. Sheesh I'm done with this argument. I hope Brannen doesn't get a penny.

(05-05-2021 11:05 AM)JFlight21 Wrote:  How about this for context:

In each of the past two seasons, a graduate transfer couldn't even make it to February.
4 different players opted out this past season.
2 strength coaches left after one year with Brannen and one just returned under a new coach.
An entire freshman class entered the transfer portal and 3 returned once we had a new coach in place.

Those are the facts - I won't even delve into all the other rumors we've heard.

As each new piece of information comes out you continue to analyze it in complete isolation to all of the other factors at play. Sure, there probably isn't a big single incident smoking gun but once you look at the entire picture it is so painfully obvious regarding Brannen's conduct. But I guess that is too difficult for you to understand. Sheesh I'm done with this argument. I hope Brannen doesn't get a penny.

everyone is losing players... memphis has lost a similar amount of players and lost a similar amount of staff... they had a freshman transfer in and transfer right back out in 2 months....
no i dont think penny is monster and should be fired...

if UC fans were saying he couldnt connect with people and should have been fired with his buyout...no one would care, most would agree... the issue is the cause stuff.. not being able to connect is not reason to be portrayed like monster for doing things common in most practices

heres the thing, if UC said tomorrow they settled on 3mill buyout...the majority of UC fans would b happy and move on...no one would be "how could we pay that monster"... all the UC fans here are just rushing to defend whatever UC is doing

also BearcatMark "we have a great case because we arent leaking anything to the public"

*uc proceeds to leak a bunch of stuff the public* and pretty much confirms all the previous stuff was also leaked by them (as its the same information worded the same way too)

lol

It would be interesting reading the different practice techniques of coaches and the influence of medical advice.

Things have changed (for the better IMO) since my youth.

(05-05-2021 11:16 AM)pesik Wrote:  also BearcatMark "we have a great case because we arent leaking anything to the public"

*uc proceeds to leak a bunch of stuff the public* and pretty much confirms all the previous stuff was also leaked by them (as its the same information worded the same way too)

lol

UC has not leaked a single thing to the public. This document came from a FOIA request by the media. Yesterday's letter came from a FOIA by the media. UC is a public institution, they don't really have a choice when those are filed.

And as far as those Justin Williams Athletic articles. Brendel has said unequivocally that the athletic department was not involved and was actively trying to avoid attention on the issue. The only person trying to make things public at any point in time are Tom Mars and the media...

(05-05-2021 11:19 AM)Tiger1983 Wrote:  It would be interesting reading the different practice techniques of coaches and the influence of medical advice.

Things have changed (for the better IMO) since my youth.

It's honestly insane seeing people not understand how stuff has changed.

We used to tell people with head injuries to suck it up and play through things too. Turns out that wasn't exactly a good idea.

Why talk about science when you have 'basketball experience'.

(05-03-2021 09:14 PM)pesik Wrote:  

(05-03-2021 09:06 PM)UCGrad1992 Wrote:  You can spin it however you want to to fit your narrative.

every coach had brutal conditioning.. it is not a spin.. i posted a picture from UH like 4 pages back of multiple UH players collapsed from running getting medical care from our November "conditioning" practices

So we had a player just 2-3 years ago literally had his life saved by Bob Mangine and our SA health department because of their understanding and use of heart monitors. For a head coach to literally say "f*ck the heart monitors" is pretty alarming.

(05-05-2021 11:32 AM)stxrunner Wrote:  

(05-05-2021 11:16 AM)pesik Wrote:  also BearcatMark "we have a great case because we arent leaking anything to the public"

*uc proceeds to leak a bunch of stuff the public* and pretty much confirms all the previous stuff was also leaked by them (as its the same information worded the same way too)

lol

UC has not leaked a single thing to the public. This document came from a FOIA request by the media. Yesterday's letter came from a FOIA by the media. UC is a public institution, they don't really have a choice when those are filed.

And as far as those Justin Williams Athletic articles. Brendel has said unequivocally that the athletic department was not involved and was actively trying to avoid attention on the issue. The only person trying to make things public at any point in time are Tom Mars and the media...

there is nothing that states it was FOIA'd.... nothing..
also was referencing the athletic article from a few months ago that stated the exact same thing ...there definitely wasnt a foia then

(05-04-2021 02:01 PM)justinhub2003 Wrote:  

(05-04-2021 01:20 PM)pesik Wrote:  

(05-04-2021 01:06 PM)justinhub2003 Wrote:  

(05-04-2021 12:54 PM)pesik Wrote:  

(05-04-2021 12:41 PM)DownOnRohs Wrote:  When half the roster opts for the transfer portal doesn't that call into question the coach's character?


And why do you keep trying to draw parallels? Basketball is not football. 2 seasons is not 3. And definitely not when 1 of those 2 was a Covid season.

1/3 of all d1 basketball players are in the portal...uc isnt even top 20 in players who entered the portal, not even top in the conference... the portal alone does not bring into question his character.... also i have no issue with you firing him, talking how its done..

again everyone already thinks you are firing him for performance.. it is not views as performance vs players best interest....the national perspective outside of UC circles (including coaching circles), is "performance and using cause to get out of the contract" vs "performance and paying his buyout"
your permiss assumes people believe this was done to the betterment of the athletes, when no one not tied to UC believes that

Dude Brendel just noted that AAU coaches thought UC made the right move to can JB. They specifically said they wouldn’t send their players to play for UC with John Brannen as the coach.

And UC already won.

Uc is going to gain season ticket holders instead of lose them. Cunningham won the media and the fans back with an excellent thorough coaching search that landed Wes Miller. The fan base is more United now than its ever been.

That’s all good news for UC

This was literally a tiny blip of bad PR for UC that is now turning out to be a huge PR win.

Make no mistake... UC is in better shape today than it was if John Brannen was the coach. He’s an awful human, who had weird rules and couldn’t connect with players.

Wes Miller is the exact opposite.


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you keep going back to the point, that i am somehow against the firing...from the start i said i get firing him.. its just how its being done

also any coach you were going to hire was going to be praised.. erik martin, dennis gates...
the success of a coach has little to do with the emotions when hired..

the moment UC struggles, you know there are going to be articles about this is what uc gets, kenyon martin tweeting i told you so, especially when brannens team starts to counter and relese their info (which also may or may not be overstated)
you could have achieved this whole thing without the whole cause thing

No.

Wes Miller was universally praised. Erik Martin was not going to be, he wasn’t even a top assistant for Huggins. Dennis Gates hasn’t proven it long enough for universal praise.

There is a large subset of the UNC fan base who wanted Wes Miller. And he was by all accounts the runner up. That’s a big get for UC. Like Roy Williams is now. Season ticket holder. And even a good chance that UC gets a jordan deal back

Add in that we just got back the best strength coach in the country because of Miller & Cunningham.

I have no idea why you downplayed this. There wasn’t universal fan praise for John Brannen when he was hired. I was a skeptic from day 1 with brannen. I never liked the dude. But Wes has big dick energy like Luke Fickell.

When he breast feeds Kelvin Sampson I’ll accept your apology


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