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Keith Jenkins' Comments on Mason Madsen
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Crewdogz Offline
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Post: #61
RE: Keith Jenkins' Comments on Mason Madsen
(03-23-2021 09:32 PM)robertfoshizzle Wrote:  New Bearcat Bounce podcast w/DerMarr and James White: https://247sports.com/college/cincinnati...162979793/

Only a little over 10 minutes in, but good stuff so far.

Blocked by firewall... What were your take aways?
 
03-24-2021 10:27 AM
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coachpipe Offline
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Post: #62
RE: Keith Jenkins' Comments on Mason Madsen
(03-24-2021 10:22 AM)Cataclysmo Wrote:  
(03-24-2021 09:36 AM)coachpipe Wrote:  
(03-23-2021 04:38 PM)Cataclysmo Wrote:  
(03-23-2021 04:00 PM)Bcatbog Wrote:  My bet is Mason winds up in a MAC level school - and is unhappy. IMO this says more about his character than Brannen’s. Color me surprised and disappointing.

Mason is well aware of what kind of school he'll end up at and yet he passed up a clear role with a high major program to pursue it anyways. What does that tell you about the head coach.

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tells me mason is a ******. You want to burn down the program on your way out because someone wasnt nice? Kick rocks. Dont let the door hit you on the way out.

When did he do that? The guys leaving have nothing against the program.

well, this thread is about mason going to the AD behind brannens back right? put 2 and 2 together.
 
03-24-2021 10:27 AM
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rath v2.0 Offline
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Post: #63
RE: Keith Jenkins' Comments on Mason Madsen
Should we cite this thread or a podcast? Need to dust off my blue book for the proper format for that.
 
03-24-2021 10:33 AM
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Post: #64
RE: Keith Jenkins' Comments on Mason Madsen
i'm kind of amazed the judgements people have made one way or the other when there just isn't much out there. My biggest issues with Justin Williams' report (which I have mixed feelings about) was not that they were all anonymous sources (which often make sense in situations like these where players / others are trying to protect their future interests), but that the anonymous sources offered very little clarity into the situation. In the end the most important thing to come out of the Justin Williams piece was the lack of specific conduct discussed by the sources from Brannen that would be detrimental to the team and cause the huge rift. This wasn't a Greg Marshall situation.

That isn't to say Brannen doesn't share in the blame, but for me the article offered no clarity into what extent was Brannen, the players at issue, the weird situation with COVID / lack of team building / lack of normal campus life / lack of offseason opportunities to get buy in, and lack of upper class leadership. Getting mores specific, a lot of the stuff in the piece was very unhelpful"

Quote:“There was no communication,” one source said. “Everybody down the line was unhappy at one point or another (this season).”
That's a quote from "one source". Player/parent/friend/coach? We don't know. But someone believed that. The problem is that it's a perception quote. There are no examples that follow, no specifics...it tells us almost nothing other than someone perceived a communication issue.

Quote:“It was just hard. To the point where, at some points during the season, I kind of didn’t love the game of basketball,” one player said. “It wasn’t fun to me anymore. I lost the love of the game. And I feel like that’s all because of Coach Brannen. That’s just being honest. It’s not the teammates, not the fans. It was never about that. It was about one guy.”
Again we get the perception of one source, this time definitively a player. But we don't really learn anything from it. He says he "feels" that's all because of Coach Brannen. Why? Explain what the specific issues were. What actions did Brannen take then didn't take that caused it.

Quote:One source explained a player’s decision to leave the program by stating, “How he felt he was treated, how he was treated, mentally, he didn’t want to go through that again.”

Another "source" but no idea what connection the source had to the player. The quote implies the player thought he was treated somehow in a way he didn't want to be treated but doesn't offer much more than that. Was he mistreated? Treated harshly? Not given playing time he wanted? We don't know what the issues were for the player. And we don't get any specifics on what Brannen might have done that made the player feel like he did.

Quote:Those sources characterized manipulation and exclusion, and players feeling lied to or misled about playing time and their role on the team. Perhaps most significant were claims of repeated instances of Brannen disparaging players behind their backs to other teammates, at times doubting whether certain players had the necessary ability or makeup to survive in the program. It was interpreted as pitting players against each other, by multiple accounts. Sources have said it continued even after transfer decisions were announced.

This is the closest we get to the issues, but it's mainly a characterization by the writer of the impression he got from sources. And once again we see no specific examples. It's just hard to parse through what happened with a bunch of vague quotes and little specifics.

All this is before we get to other sources who disagree with the assessment of these sources.

In short, we really don't know what was going on or what happened. We know the freshman were not happy with their time at UC. I tend to think that it was a combination of COVID year (no fans, no real campus life, strict rules to play), no offseason to really set expectations, limited upper class leadership in the program, players having unreasonable expectations, easy transfer rules and Brannen / staff not handling the weird season that was going to particularly effect the young guys who didn't know what a normal season would be like. Which factors were most important...I've seen nothing that really tells us much.

Ultimately the buck will stop with Brannen. This can't be the norm. But it's hard to really say how it all happened or whose "fault" it was.
 
03-24-2021 10:40 AM
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Cataclysmo Online
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Post: #65
RE: Keith Jenkins' Comments on Mason Madsen
(03-24-2021 10:27 AM)coachpipe Wrote:  well, this thread is about mason going to the AD behind brannens back right? put 2 and 2 together.

Even if that were true, going to the AD constitutes burning a program down?
 
03-24-2021 10:50 AM
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Post: #66
RE: Keith Jenkins' Comments on Mason Madsen
(03-24-2021 10:50 AM)Cataclysmo Wrote:  
(03-24-2021 10:27 AM)coachpipe Wrote:  well, this thread is about mason going to the AD behind brannens back right? put 2 and 2 together.

Even if that were true, going to the AD constitutes burning a program down?

i mean, i dont believe hes going to the AD for some ice cream.
 
03-24-2021 10:59 AM
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Post: #67
RE: Keith Jenkins' Comments on Mason Madsen
(03-23-2021 04:01 PM)Dont tase me bro Wrote:  
(03-23-2021 03:25 PM)Helicopter Wrote:  I was listening to Meachs' podcast and Keith Jenkins of the Enquirer seemed to indicate the player that went to the AD and blasted Brannen anonymously in Williams' Athletic article was Mason Madsen.

I was kind of shocked a borderline 2-star recruit, who earned 15 mpg as a freshman on a high D-1 major team, tried to "burn it down" on his way out.

My initial reaction is to side with the players, particularly when they are doing what is in their best interests, but I don't see the sense in slandering the coach on the way out. Comes across as extraordinarily ungrateful.

Not too surprising if he thought that his twin brother was treated unfairly.

I don't know why these guys left or what happened, but I will say that I thought Brannen's substitution patterns were sometimes bizarre during the season. These things get amplified when the team is not winning.

Can anyone expand on this? What exactly happened between Gabe and CJB? Gabe left fairly early in the season, and its hard to imagine he was treated that poorly that he would leave, and Mason would stick it out.
 
03-24-2021 11:00 AM
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Post: #68
RE: Keith Jenkins' Comments on Mason Madsen
(03-24-2021 10:59 AM)coachpipe Wrote:  
(03-24-2021 10:50 AM)Cataclysmo Wrote:  
(03-24-2021 10:27 AM)coachpipe Wrote:  well, this thread is about mason going to the AD behind brannens back right? put 2 and 2 together.

Even if that were true, going to the AD constitutes burning a program down?

i mean, i dont believe hes going to the AD for some ice cream.

You don't think there are any legitimate reasons for a player to take his concerns to the AD? Seriously?
 
03-24-2021 11:00 AM
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Post: #69
RE: Keith Jenkins' Comments on Mason Madsen
It’s the internet fan pendulum swinging back the other way.

Worst part about this is we now have fans slamming a kid who by all accounts came here and worked hard and did what was asked of him to help the team... his coach won’t make any comments at all and the player can’t defend himself on social media if he wants to play anywhere with a pulse next year. All without any facts...and this will now potentially follow him to his new school and a whole new set of internet magistrates. Not a good look at all. Adults in the coaching office need to address.
 
(This post was last modified: 03-24-2021 11:04 AM by rath v2.0.)
03-24-2021 11:04 AM
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coachpipe Offline
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Post: #70
RE: Keith Jenkins' Comments on Mason Madsen
(03-24-2021 11:00 AM)Cataclysmo Wrote:  
(03-24-2021 10:59 AM)coachpipe Wrote:  
(03-24-2021 10:50 AM)Cataclysmo Wrote:  
(03-24-2021 10:27 AM)coachpipe Wrote:  well, this thread is about mason going to the AD behind brannens back right? put 2 and 2 together.

Even if that were true, going to the AD constitutes burning a program down?

i mean, i dont believe hes going to the AD for some ice cream.

You don't think there are any legitimate reasons for a player to take his concerns to the AD? Seriously?

Well we are 2 weeks in and havent heard a single one, so no I dont. Everything we have heard isnt a "get the boss involved" problem. Yet he made it one.
 
03-24-2021 11:05 AM
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Post: #71
RE: Keith Jenkins' Comments on Mason Madsen
Thanks for the summary, Mark.

Taken altogether you have to admit seems like pretty weak reasons for guys to transfer. But given the Covid situation and transfer rules the facts the guys were mostly freshman or unhappy (Harvey), led to the perfect storm.

Not necessarily Brannen’s fault. But 100% his responsibility to pick up the pieces and do a helluva lot better.
 
03-24-2021 11:17 AM
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Post: #72
RE: Keith Jenkins' Comments on Mason Madsen
(03-24-2021 11:05 AM)coachpipe Wrote:  
(03-24-2021 11:00 AM)Cataclysmo Wrote:  
(03-24-2021 10:59 AM)coachpipe Wrote:  
(03-24-2021 10:50 AM)Cataclysmo Wrote:  
(03-24-2021 10:27 AM)coachpipe Wrote:  well, this thread is about mason going to the AD behind brannens back right? put 2 and 2 together.

Even if that were true, going to the AD constitutes burning a program down?

i mean, i dont believe hes going to the AD for some ice cream.

You don't think there are any legitimate reasons for a player to take his concerns to the AD? Seriously?

Well we are 2 weeks in and havent heard a single one, so no I dont. Everything we have heard isnt a "get the boss involved" problem. Yet he made it one.

You are talking in absolutes. Once again, what reputable source that has 1st hand knowledge is saying this stuff? What has the coach said...rhetorical question since he is apparently in the witness protection program right now.
 
03-24-2021 11:21 AM
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Post: #73
RE: Keith Jenkins' Comments on Mason Madsen
(03-24-2021 11:17 AM)Bearcatbdub Wrote:  Thanks for the summary, Mark.

Taken altogether you have to admit seems like pretty weak reasons for guys to transfer. But given the Covid situation and transfer rules the facts the guys were mostly freshman or unhappy (Harvey), led to the perfect storm.

Not necessarily Brannen’s fault. But 100% his responsibility to pick up the pieces and do a helluva lot better.

I don't know. Every kid is different and this is a crazy year. Kids should do what they think is best but there's really very little good information about what their issues were and what Brannen did/ didn't do.
 
03-24-2021 11:21 AM
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Post: #74
RE: Keith Jenkins' Comments on Mason Madsen
Somebody needs to write a letter to the AD and ask what’s up, lol.
 
03-24-2021 11:26 AM
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Post: #75
RE: Keith Jenkins' Comments on Mason Madsen
Doss, get on that!
 
03-24-2021 11:26 AM
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Post: #76
RE: Keith Jenkins' Comments on Mason Madsen
So aside from games and practice, were players forced to stay in their rooms or could they do other things on their own. I get it if say a player was from out of town, didn't have transportation of his own and wasn't allowed to leave the dorm except for practices. Probably couldn't go home for the holidays. One would probably question their decision to attend this school, if a school near their hometown also offered a full ride and they would enjoy many of the benefits of going to school close to home.
 
03-24-2021 11:29 AM
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namrag Offline
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Post: #77
RE: Keith Jenkins' Comments on Mason Madsen
What’s with all this “kid” stuff?

We are talking about ADULTS.

Trying to excuse players behaviors by calling them “kids” doesn't cut it.

Yes they are young adults, but they are still adults.

It seems like some on here want to excuse these young adults from any share of the blame by portraying them as kids


I feel there is shared blame among the players and Coach Brannen.

But I 100% support what TNel said “I’ll be damned if I’m gonna let guys on the way out try to burn down what we built”.

Yes it is very telling that all the UC alum players who speak out are critical of the players.

It is universally agreed by them that Brannen is no where near as severe as huggs or Cronin.

Could Brannen have been more cuddly to the little “kiddos”?

I’m sure he could.

The laughable part that I see is the same posters that were tearing Brannen a new one because the team wasn’t “Bearcat tough” enough, are now critical of him for not being more kumbaya touchy feely with them.

It seems some just want to be critical of the coach, and look for reasons to justify that.
 
03-24-2021 11:35 AM
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Post: #78
RE: Keith Jenkins' Comments on Mason Madsen
They were in HS this time last year. They are kids.

They don’t deserve this crap.
 
03-24-2021 11:37 AM
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coachpipe Offline
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Post: #79
RE: Keith Jenkins' Comments on Mason Madsen
(03-24-2021 11:21 AM)rath v2.0 Wrote:  
(03-24-2021 11:05 AM)coachpipe Wrote:  
(03-24-2021 11:00 AM)Cataclysmo Wrote:  
(03-24-2021 10:59 AM)coachpipe Wrote:  
(03-24-2021 10:50 AM)Cataclysmo Wrote:  Even if that were true, going to the AD constitutes burning a program down?

i mean, i dont believe hes going to the AD for some ice cream.

You don't think there are any legitimate reasons for a player to take his concerns to the AD? Seriously?

Well we are 2 weeks in and havent heard a single one, so no I dont. Everything we have heard isnt a "get the boss involved" problem. Yet he made it one.

You are talking in absolutes. Once again, what reputable source that has 1st hand knowledge is saying this stuff? What has the coach said...rhetorical question since he is apparently in the witness protection program right now.

We know the AD has spoken to players(chad has posted such on BCJ), we know players have "anonymously" made comments that Mark posted a few posts back saying JB was a problem. but....We havent heard of any legitimate problems. We have heard what some players "anonymously" claim to be problems and we have DDJ saying Coach changed those things to accommodate the players.

Until something actually comes out that says coach is the bad guy, im not believing any of it. Brannen is still the coach of UC and he should be getting our support. Not guys who arent bearcats
 
(This post was last modified: 03-24-2021 11:46 AM by coachpipe.)
03-24-2021 11:38 AM
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rath v2.0 Offline
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Post: #80
RE: Keith Jenkins' Comments on Mason Madsen
So we are blaming the players for unsubstantiated BS rather than the guy in charge who could actually address if he wasn’t in hiding.

He may need a sign on his desk that says “The Buck Stops There.”
 
03-24-2021 11:47 AM
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