(03-18-2021 08:46 AM)Tiger87 Wrote:  I think there is no doubt that some people will refuse to donate due to the stickers. In today's world of polarization, it's bound to be true. And it was laughable that any "mysterious deep pockets" would double any donations that were lost because of this. To go with that logo was a poor choice that added to the polarization instead of bringing unity. This can sometimes happen when you turn over decision-making to idealistic & unwise 20 year olds. And from listening to the Coaches and Admin, it's a decision they wish they could take back. There were unlimited other choices that could not be politicized.

At the same time, the majority of donation shortfall is most certainly COVID related. Has nothing to do with the stickers. All universities are feeling it, so it seems to be a level playing field. But it could impact debt and operations greater at the schools who live day-to-day, and can't simply delay the next big $100M over-the-top project to "catch up".

I look at the stickers as ill-advised, but coming from a good place. It is definitely NOT a reason or excuse for me to stop providing support for my alma mater, and for programs that I care about and that increase my quality of life.

(03-17-2021 03:07 PM)Tigerx3 Wrote:  

(03-17-2021 01:10 PM)aardWolf Wrote:  

(03-17-2021 07:32 AM)AlonsoWDC Wrote:  

(03-16-2021 05:50 PM)bluecrew Wrote:  I honestly think the University's using the athletic program for political reasons (whether you were for or against) is going to hurt for several seasons to come. It really has to do with habits as much as anything- if you lose a customer/donor, it takes a bit to get them back.

There is nothing political about the fact that black lives matter.

Sorry this is such a difficult concept to grasp, but the majority of Tigers athletics will be black men.

The stickers weren't about the statement itself, but the political movement. Pretending the stickers isn't political is equivalent to sticking your head in the sand. Using the capitalized initials implies support for the organization, not just the statement in general.

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Black_Lives_Matter

Quote:Black Lives Matter (BLM) is a decentralized political and social movement protesting against incidents of police brutality and all racially motivated violence against black people.

Most people can quote you two lines from the BLM movement. There is a national organization but to most people it is simply a way to brand a problem in our society that needs to be addressed. Decentralized means it is not one thought, one action, one offense, one organization. It is a philosophical gathering place for those who see racial injustice. Too many time we focus on everything we can find that is wrong or questionable rather than the good that is being attempted.

Although I can't give you a percentage I would venture that much of the negativity associated to the BLM letters is attributed to violence perpetrated by people who have no alliance with the reason there are marches and protest. There are extremes in every movement. There are extremes in the republican and democrat parties. Get past the extremes who by definition are disruptors and look for common ground.

The important issue isn't extremists. As an example, the KKK hasn't had any impact in decades, is a fringe movement at best and is denounced by 99% of Conservatives. The Capitol riots were denounced unconditionally by Fox News and all Conservative media.

That is the difference. All of the rioting, violence and protests were encouraged by the left. None of the vile rhetoric by the extremist side of BLM was denounced. The extremist element in BLM isn't a fringe element. It is espoused by a huge part of the population.

Will the stickers be on the helmet this year? I bet not.

(03-18-2021 09:30 AM)Stammers Wrote:  

(03-17-2021 03:07 PM)Tigerx3 Wrote:  

(03-17-2021 01:10 PM)aardWolf Wrote:  

(03-17-2021 07:32 AM)AlonsoWDC Wrote:  

(03-16-2021 05:50 PM)bluecrew Wrote:  I honestly think the University's using the athletic program for political reasons (whether you were for or against) is going to hurt for several seasons to come. It really has to do with habits as much as anything- if you lose a customer/donor, it takes a bit to get them back.

There is nothing political about the fact that black lives matter.

Sorry this is such a difficult concept to grasp, but the majority of Tigers athletics will be black men.

The stickers weren't about the statement itself, but the political movement. Pretending the stickers isn't political is equivalent to sticking your head in the sand. Using the capitalized initials implies support for the organization, not just the statement in general.

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Black_Lives_Matter

Quote:Black Lives Matter (BLM) is a decentralized political and social movement protesting against incidents of police brutality and all racially motivated violence against black people.

Most people can quote you two lines from the BLM movement. There is a national organization but to most people it is simply a way to brand a problem in our society that needs to be addressed. Decentralized means it is not one thought, one action, one offense, one organization. It is a philosophical gathering place for those who see racial injustice. Too many time we focus on everything we can find that is wrong or questionable rather than the good that is being attempted.

Although I can't give you a percentage I would venture that much of the negativity associated to the BLM letters is attributed to violence perpetrated by people who have no alliance with the reason there are marches and protest. There are extremes in every movement. There are extremes in the republican and democrat parties. Get past the extremes who by definition are disruptors and look for common ground.

The important issue isn't extremists. As an example, the KKK hasn't had any impact in decades, is a fringe movement at best and is denounced by 99% of Conservatives. The Capitol riots were denounced unconditionally by Fox News and all Conservative media.

That is the difference. All of the rioting, violence and protests were encouraged by the left. None of the vile rhetoric by the extremist side of BLM was denounced. The extremist element in BLM isn't a fringe element. It is espoused by a huge part of the population.

I didn't want this thread to turn political. A few comments and I'm done.

Stammers, in my experience and my observation that is not true in either case. When you generalize you miss the whole truth.

There are some on Fox that spoke the words once but follow that up with more conspiracy theories (a staple of some on Fox and fringe right wing that I don't call conservatives)
Instead of letting the Capitol riots stand on it's on we had some Fox hosts host repeating yea but why don't they punish the rioters from last summer, they didn't punish them (they did, thousands were arrested and prosecuted). Tucker Carlson is in his own fantasy world.
The fringe right wing does not represent conservatives in the republican party. Tru KKK are not relevant anymore but there are plenty of fringe elements embraced by the Right Wing extremism of the republican party. The Proud Boys and all of that ilk do not represent the conservatives in the republican party. The Steve Bannons and that ilk do not represent the conservatives of the republican party. There were many at the Capitol that did not riot and did not storm the capitol and did not cause harm or disruption to anyone but that was reported widely by the left wing of the democrat party because it did not fit their agenda.

There is a Fringe Left and some of those represent the extreme views of the BLM movement. They do not represent the mainstream of the democrat party. Like the Fringe right wing the fringe left wing are load and visible. There were some that promoted violence and some that would not condemn violence and destruction. Most of the mainstream left are not like that. They wanted criminals prosecuted. They also followed the destruction and helped rebuild but that did not get reported widely on Fox news because it did not fit the agenda.

The extremes of both parties are more about agendas and destroying the other side than trying to build what is best for all of us. Take out the extreme pols on both side of the isle and watch us fly. Get both parties to hold their own people accountable and watch us fly.

Keep demonizing the other party and spend 90% of the time trying to destroy the other party and we fall. Bring civil discourse back and we have a chance.

I have friends at every level of extremes to moderates on both sides of the isle. There are some on both sides I have distanced myself from because all they promoted was hate. I've defriended a bunch of people that can't seem to mute the hate speech. Often a differing opinion is just different not bad.

This country was carved out of wilderness by people from all walks of life. Native and immigrants. There was lots of good and lots of bad that went into building this country. My first ancestor to this country was a forced indentured servant from Scotland. He served 7 years for a paltry sum from the age of 13 and then sold himself for another 5 for land in Siler City, North Carolina. His son hired out to a Dr. to drive a covered wagon west and settled in a place in west TN. For 150 years my family farmed. My Great grandfather married a women who lived with the Cherokee Tribe but DNA Ancestry tracing says I have Asian bloodlines through her. Nobody fully knows that story. My dad dealt in livestock. He was a social and fiscal Democrat and my mothers bloodlines were Irish. Her family was conservative Republican.

I was the first college graduate in my family. I am a fiscal conservative and social moderate that believes in accountability. I have almost always voted Republican in national elections and I split tickets in state and local. I do not believe that politics and religion mix well although I try to seek out moral conservatives regardless of party. I think there is a growing number of people like me who can not accept the extremes of either party.

I could never swallow what Trump or H. Clinton sold and in the past two elections I voted with the same write-in candidate. I gave Trump his chance but found morally lacking in almost every way and his purposeful divisiveness harmed this country well beyond anything positive he brought to the table. I did not support Biden but I will give him the same opportunity to earn my support I gave Trump. By midterms we will know who he really is.

So yes I am different. I was molded differently than anyone I know but uniqueness is a core strength of our nation.

(03-18-2021 11:18 AM)Tigerx3 Wrote:  

(03-18-2021 09:30 AM)Stammers Wrote:  

(03-17-2021 03:07 PM)Tigerx3 Wrote:  

(03-17-2021 01:10 PM)aardWolf Wrote:  

(03-17-2021 07:32 AM)AlonsoWDC Wrote:  There is nothing political about the fact that black lives matter.

Sorry this is such a difficult concept to grasp, but the majority of Tigers athletics will be black men.

The stickers weren't about the statement itself, but the political movement. Pretending the stickers isn't political is equivalent to sticking your head in the sand. Using the capitalized initials implies support for the organization, not just the statement in general.

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Black_Lives_Matter

Quote:Black Lives Matter (BLM) is a decentralized political and social movement protesting against incidents of police brutality and all racially motivated violence against black people.

Most people can quote you two lines from the BLM movement. There is a national organization but to most people it is simply a way to brand a problem in our society that needs to be addressed. Decentralized means it is not one thought, one action, one offense, one organization. It is a philosophical gathering place for those who see racial injustice. Too many time we focus on everything we can find that is wrong or questionable rather than the good that is being attempted.

Although I can't give you a percentage I would venture that much of the negativity associated to the BLM letters is attributed to violence perpetrated by people who have no alliance with the reason there are marches and protest. There are extremes in every movement. There are extremes in the republican and democrat parties. Get past the extremes who by definition are disruptors and look for common ground.

The important issue isn't extremists. As an example, the KKK hasn't had any impact in decades, is a fringe movement at best and is denounced by 99% of Conservatives. The Capitol riots were denounced unconditionally by Fox News and all Conservative media.

That is the difference. All of the rioting, violence and protests were encouraged by the left. None of the vile rhetoric by the extremist side of BLM was denounced. The extremist element in BLM isn't a fringe element. It is espoused by a huge part of the population.

I didn't want this thread to turn political. A few comments and I'm done.

Stammers, in my experience and my observation that is not true in either case. When you generalize you miss the whole truth.

There are some on Fox that spoke the words once but follow that up with more conspiracy theories (a staple of some on Fox and fringe right wing that I don't call conservatives)
Instead of letting the Capitol riots stand on it's on we had some Fox hosts host repeating yea but why don't they punish the rioters from last summer, they didn't punish them (they did, thousands were arrested and prosecuted). Tucker Carlson is in his own fantasy world.
The fringe right wing does not represent conservatives in the republican party. Tru KKK are not relevant anymore but there are plenty of fringe elements embraced by the Right Wing extremism of the republican party. The Proud Boys and all of that ilk do not represent the conservatives in the republican party. The Steve Bannons and that ilk do not represent the conservatives of the republican party. There were many at the Capitol that did not riot and did not storm the capitol and did not cause harm or disruption to anyone but that was reported widely by the left wing of the democrat party because it did not fit their agenda.

There is a Fringe Left and some of those represent the extreme views of the BLM movement. They do not represent the mainstream of the democrat party. Like the Fringe right wing the fringe left wing are load and visible. There were some that promoted violence and some that would not condemn violence and destruction. Most of the mainstream left are not like that. They wanted criminals prosecuted. They also followed the destruction and helped rebuild but that did not get reported widely on Fox news because it did not fit the agenda.

The extremes of both parties are more about agendas and destroying the other side than trying to build what is best for all of us. Take out the extreme pols on both side of the isle and watch us fly. Get both parties to hold their own people accountable and watch us fly.

Keep demonizing the other party and spend 90% of the time trying to destroy the other party and we fall. Bring civil discourse back and we have a chance.

I have friends at every level of extremes to moderates on both sides of the isle. There are some on both sides I have distanced myself from because all they promoted was hate. I've defriended a bunch of people that can't seem to mute the hate speech. Often a differing opinion is just different not bad.

This country was carved out of wilderness by people from all walks of life. Native and immigrants. There was lots of good and lots of bad that went into building this country. My first ancestor to this country was a forced indentured servant from Scotland. He served 7 years for a paltry sum from the age of 13 and then sold himself for another 5 for land in Siler City, North Carolina. His son hired out to a Dr. to drive a covered wagon west and settled in a place in west TN. For 150 years my family farmed. My Great grandfather married a women who lived with the Cherokee Tribe but DNA Ancestry tracing says I have Asian bloodlines through her. Nobody fully knows that story. My dad dealt in livestock. He was a social and fiscal Democrat and my mothers bloodlines were Irish. Her family was conservative Republican.

I was the first college graduate in my family. I am a fiscal conservative and social moderate that believes in accountability. I have almost always voted Republican in national elections and I split tickets in state and local. I do not believe that politics and religion mix well although I try to seek out moral conservatives regardless of party. I think there is a growing number of people like me who can not accept the extremes of either party.

I could never swallow what Trump or H. Clinton sold and in the past two elections I voted with the same write-in candidate. I gave Trump his chance but found morally lacking in almost every way and his purposeful divisiveness harmed this country well beyond anything positive he brought to the table. I did not support Biden but I will give him the same opportunity to earn my support I gave Trump. By midterms we will know who he really is.

So yes I am different. I was molded differently than anyone I know but uniqueness is a core strength of our nation.

All that is your opinion about things that won't change regardless of what side you are on. People on the other side can give equally compelling arguments that go directly against what you are saying.

What do we know that isn't an opinion?

Conservative politicians and Conservative news outlets denounced the Capitol riots with the same vigor that they denounced the violence, destruction of property, lootings and protests in NYC, DC, Seattle, Portland, Chicago, Baltimore and Minneapolis.

Democrat and Liberal politicians, and Democrat and Liberal news outlets only denounced the Capitol riots. They didn't say a word in opposition to try and quell all the other stuff and often encouraged it.

As I always say, come up with links from June 2020 onward with quotes or proof that Biden, Harris, Pelosi, Ocrazio, Schumer, Schitt, Watters, The Squad, any Democratic presidential candidate, ANY Democrat politician said ANYTHING against the stuff that was going on, and I'll be happy to tell you that you are right.

I'm very proud of Coach Silverfield and all those who OKd it. You can stand me him up at the gates of hell but I he won't back down.

(03-18-2021 11:35 AM)Stammers Wrote:  

(03-18-2021 11:18 AM)Tigerx3 Wrote:  

(03-18-2021 09:30 AM)Stammers Wrote:  

(03-17-2021 03:07 PM)Tigerx3 Wrote:  

(03-17-2021 01:10 PM)aardWolf Wrote:  The stickers weren't about the statement itself, but the political movement. Pretending the stickers isn't political is equivalent to sticking your head in the sand. Using the capitalized initials implies support for the organization, not just the statement in general.

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Black_Lives_Matter

Most people can quote you two lines from the BLM movement. There is a national organization but to most people it is simply a way to brand a problem in our society that needs to be addressed. Decentralized means it is not one thought, one action, one offense, one organization. It is a philosophical gathering place for those who see racial injustice. Too many time we focus on everything we can find that is wrong or questionable rather than the good that is being attempted.

Although I can't give you a percentage I would venture that much of the negativity associated to the BLM letters is attributed to violence perpetrated by people who have no alliance with the reason there are marches and protest. There are extremes in every movement. There are extremes in the republican and democrat parties. Get past the extremes who by definition are disruptors and look for common ground.

The important issue isn't extremists. As an example, the KKK hasn't had any impact in decades, is a fringe movement at best and is denounced by 99% of Conservatives. The Capitol riots were denounced unconditionally by Fox News and all Conservative media.

That is the difference. All of the rioting, violence and protests were encouraged by the left. None of the vile rhetoric by the extremist side of BLM was denounced. The extremist element in BLM isn't a fringe element. It is espoused by a huge part of the population.

I didn't want this thread to turn political. A few comments and I'm done.

Stammers, in my experience and my observation that is not true in either case. When you generalize you miss the whole truth.

There are some on Fox that spoke the words once but follow that up with more conspiracy theories (a staple of some on Fox and fringe right wing that I don't call conservatives)
Instead of letting the Capitol riots stand on it's on we had some Fox hosts host repeating yea but why don't they punish the rioters from last summer, they didn't punish them (they did, thousands were arrested and prosecuted). Tucker Carlson is in his own fantasy world.
The fringe right wing does not represent conservatives in the republican party. Tru KKK are not relevant anymore but there are plenty of fringe elements embraced by the Right Wing extremism of the republican party. The Proud Boys and all of that ilk do not represent the conservatives in the republican party. The Steve Bannons and that ilk do not represent the conservatives of the republican party. There were many at the Capitol that did not riot and did not storm the capitol and did not cause harm or disruption to anyone but that was reported widely by the left wing of the democrat party because it did not fit their agenda.

There is a Fringe Left and some of those represent the extreme views of the BLM movement. They do not represent the mainstream of the democrat party. Like the Fringe right wing the fringe left wing are load and visible. There were some that promoted violence and some that would not condemn violence and destruction. Most of the mainstream left are not like that. They wanted criminals prosecuted. They also followed the destruction and helped rebuild but that did not get reported widely on Fox news because it did not fit the agenda.

The extremes of both parties are more about agendas and destroying the other side than trying to build what is best for all of us. Take out the extreme pols on both side of the isle and watch us fly. Get both parties to hold their own people accountable and watch us fly.

Keep demonizing the other party and spend 90% of the time trying to destroy the other party and we fall. Bring civil discourse back and we have a chance.

I have friends at every level of extremes to moderates on both sides of the isle. There are some on both sides I have distanced myself from because all they promoted was hate. I've defriended a bunch of people that can't seem to mute the hate speech. Often a differing opinion is just different not bad.

This country was carved out of wilderness by people from all walks of life. Native and immigrants. There was lots of good and lots of bad that went into building this country. My first ancestor to this country was a forced indentured servant from Scotland. He served 7 years for a paltry sum from the age of 13 and then sold himself for another 5 for land in Siler City, North Carolina. His son hired out to a Dr. to drive a covered wagon west and settled in a place in west TN. For 150 years my family farmed. My Great grandfather married a women who lived with the Cherokee Tribe but DNA Ancestry tracing says I have Asian bloodlines through her. Nobody fully knows that story. My dad dealt in livestock. He was a social and fiscal Democrat and my mothers bloodlines were Irish. Her family was conservative Republican.

I was the first college graduate in my family. I am a fiscal conservative and social moderate that believes in accountability. I have almost always voted Republican in national elections and I split tickets in state and local. I do not believe that politics and religion mix well although I try to seek out moral conservatives regardless of party. I think there is a growing number of people like me who can not accept the extremes of either party.

I could never swallow what Trump or H. Clinton sold and in the past two elections I voted with the same write-in candidate. I gave Trump his chance but found morally lacking in almost every way and his purposeful divisiveness harmed this country well beyond anything positive he brought to the table. I did not support Biden but I will give him the same opportunity to earn my support I gave Trump. By midterms we will know who he really is.

So yes I am different. I was molded differently than anyone I know but uniqueness is a core strength of our nation.

All that is your opinion about things that won't change regardless of what side you are on. People on the other side can give equally compelling arguments that go directly against what you are saying.

What do we know that isn't an opinion?

Conservative politicians and Conservative news outlets denounced the Capitol riots with the same vigor that they denounced the violence, destruction of property, lootings and protests in NYC, DC, Seattle, Portland, Chicago, Baltimore and Minneapolis.

Democrat and Liberal politicians, and Democrat and Liberal news outlets only denounced the Capitol riots. They didn't say a word in opposition to try and quell all the other stuff and often encouraged it.

As I always say, come up with links from June 2020 onward with quotes or proof that Biden, Harris, Pelosi, Ocrazio, Schumer, Schitt, Watters, The Squad, any Democratic presidential candidate, ANY Democrat politician said ANYTHING against the stuff that was going on, and I'll be happy to tell you that you are right.

If there is one thing I have learned in life, it's to not speak in absolutes with stuff like this.

https://www.fayobserver.com/story/opinio...170932001/

(03-18-2021 12:30 PM)snowtiger Wrote:  I'm very proud of Coach Silverfield and all those who OKd it. You can stand me up at the gates of hell but I won't back down.

I have no issue with the reasons why the kids wanted to do it, the same way that I believe many aren't racist and are being honest when they defend the Confederate Flag.

The problem is that you can't compartmentalize your feelings and try to ram them down everyone else's throat. You're not a racist and the flag isn't racist to you? That's a perfectly fine opinion, but don't try to tell people that they are being silly if they don't agree.

BLM personally means that in a vacuum, you want to end police brutality against blacks? That's a perfectly fine opinion, but don't tell people that they are being silly for not having the same opinion when they watch white people burn down black neighborhoods, tens of thousands running out of Best Buy with armfuls of TV's and computers, or organizers that say that they want to destroy the nuclear family or
on megaphones saying that whites are sub human.

Everyone has the right to feel how they feel and what they think. Everybody has the right to tell people what they think of their feelings and opinions, but nobody can impose their feelings and opinions on others.

I wish I could give the same amount, but I have to be content with donating my season tickets last year back to the program, even though I could not attend a single gave on doctor's orders due to Covid risk at my age. I have been out of work a solid year now, so I am living on a pittance.

But I look forward to purchasing season tickets this year and being back in the stands for every single game, and bringing my granddaughters, and being involved in HH events.

(03-18-2021 12:48 PM)Alanda Wrote:  

(03-18-2021 11:35 AM)Stammers Wrote:  

(03-18-2021 11:18 AM)Tigerx3 Wrote:  

(03-18-2021 09:30 AM)Stammers Wrote:  

(03-17-2021 03:07 PM)Tigerx3 Wrote:  Most people can quote you two lines from the BLM movement. There is a national organization but to most people it is simply a way to brand a problem in our society that needs to be addressed. Decentralized means it is not one thought, one action, one offense, one organization. It is a philosophical gathering place for those who see racial injustice. Too many time we focus on everything we can find that is wrong or questionable rather than the good that is being attempted.

Although I can't give you a percentage I would venture that much of the negativity associated to the BLM letters is attributed to violence perpetrated by people who have no alliance with the reason there are marches and protest. There are extremes in every movement. There are extremes in the republican and democrat parties. Get past the extremes who by definition are disruptors and look for common ground.

The important issue isn't extremists. As an example, the KKK hasn't had any impact in decades, is a fringe movement at best and is denounced by 99% of Conservatives. The Capitol riots were denounced unconditionally by Fox News and all Conservative media.

That is the difference. All of the rioting, violence and protests were encouraged by the left. None of the vile rhetoric by the extremist side of BLM was denounced. The extremist element in BLM isn't a fringe element. It is espoused by a huge part of the population.

I didn't want this thread to turn political. A few comments and I'm done.

Stammers, in my experience and my observation that is not true in either case. When you generalize you miss the whole truth.

There are some on Fox that spoke the words once but follow that up with more conspiracy theories (a staple of some on Fox and fringe right wing that I don't call conservatives)
Instead of letting the Capitol riots stand on it's on we had some Fox hosts host repeating yea but why don't they punish the rioters from last summer, they didn't punish them (they did, thousands were arrested and prosecuted). Tucker Carlson is in his own fantasy world.
The fringe right wing does not represent conservatives in the republican party. Tru KKK are not relevant anymore but there are plenty of fringe elements embraced by the Right Wing extremism of the republican party. The Proud Boys and all of that ilk do not represent the conservatives in the republican party. The Steve Bannons and that ilk do not represent the conservatives of the republican party. There were many at the Capitol that did not riot and did not storm the capitol and did not cause harm or disruption to anyone but that was reported widely by the left wing of the democrat party because it did not fit their agenda.

There is a Fringe Left and some of those represent the extreme views of the BLM movement. They do not represent the mainstream of the democrat party. Like the Fringe right wing the fringe left wing are load and visible. There were some that promoted violence and some that would not condemn violence and destruction. Most of the mainstream left are not like that. They wanted criminals prosecuted. They also followed the destruction and helped rebuild but that did not get reported widely on Fox news because it did not fit the agenda.

The extremes of both parties are more about agendas and destroying the other side than trying to build what is best for all of us. Take out the extreme pols on both side of the isle and watch us fly. Get both parties to hold their own people accountable and watch us fly.

Keep demonizing the other party and spend 90% of the time trying to destroy the other party and we fall. Bring civil discourse back and we have a chance.

I have friends at every level of extremes to moderates on both sides of the isle. There are some on both sides I have distanced myself from because all they promoted was hate. I've defriended a bunch of people that can't seem to mute the hate speech. Often a differing opinion is just different not bad.

This country was carved out of wilderness by people from all walks of life. Native and immigrants. There was lots of good and lots of bad that went into building this country. My first ancestor to this country was a forced indentured servant from Scotland. He served 7 years for a paltry sum from the age of 13 and then sold himself for another 5 for land in Siler City, North Carolina. His son hired out to a Dr. to drive a covered wagon west and settled in a place in west TN. For 150 years my family farmed. My Great grandfather married a women who lived with the Cherokee Tribe but DNA Ancestry tracing says I have Asian bloodlines through her. Nobody fully knows that story. My dad dealt in livestock. He was a social and fiscal Democrat and my mothers bloodlines were Irish. Her family was conservative Republican.

I was the first college graduate in my family. I am a fiscal conservative and social moderate that believes in accountability. I have almost always voted Republican in national elections and I split tickets in state and local. I do not believe that politics and religion mix well although I try to seek out moral conservatives regardless of party. I think there is a growing number of people like me who can not accept the extremes of either party.

I could never swallow what Trump or H. Clinton sold and in the past two elections I voted with the same write-in candidate. I gave Trump his chance but found morally lacking in almost every way and his purposeful divisiveness harmed this country well beyond anything positive he brought to the table. I did not support Biden but I will give him the same opportunity to earn my support I gave Trump. By midterms we will know who he really is.

So yes I am different. I was molded differently than anyone I know but uniqueness is a core strength of our nation.

All that is your opinion about things that won't change regardless of what side you are on. People on the other side can give equally compelling arguments that go directly against what you are saying.

What do we know that isn't an opinion?

Conservative politicians and Conservative news outlets denounced the Capitol riots with the same vigor that they denounced the violence, destruction of property, lootings and protests in NYC, DC, Seattle, Portland, Chicago, Baltimore and Minneapolis.

Democrat and Liberal politicians, and Democrat and Liberal news outlets only denounced the Capitol riots. They didn't say a word in opposition to try and quell all the other stuff and often encouraged it.

As I always say, come up with links from June 2020 onward with quotes or proof that Biden, Harris, Pelosi, Ocrazio, Schumer, Schitt, Watters, The Squad, any Democratic presidential candidate, ANY Democrat politician said ANYTHING against the stuff that was going on, and I'll be happy to tell you that you are right.

If there is one thing I have learned in life, it's to not speak in absolutes with stuff like this.

https://www.fayobserver.com/story/opinio...170932001/

I'm glad you brought this up. 8 times?

Biden - May 31st, written, nothing after that
Clyburn - June 3rd, then nothing until August 18th (not cited in your article)
Obama - June 1st, nothing after that
Polis - August 23rd and only when it happened in Colorado. Nothing before or after
Rice - September 1st; nothing before or after
Walsh - June 1st
Newsom - June 1st

Where were Pelosi, Sanders, Pocohontas, Ocrazio, Nadler, Schitt, Schumer?, etc?

I would be embarrassed to use this as an example to support a position. In your opinion, this is an example of all Democrats presenting a united, unconditional condemnation of all violence, looting and destruction of property?

(03-18-2021 01:26 PM)Stammers Wrote:  

(03-18-2021 12:48 PM)Alanda Wrote:  

(03-18-2021 11:35 AM)Stammers Wrote:  

(03-18-2021 11:18 AM)Tigerx3 Wrote:  

(03-18-2021 09:30 AM)Stammers Wrote:  The important issue isn't extremists. As an example, the KKK hasn't had any impact in decades, is a fringe movement at best and is denounced by 99% of Conservatives. The Capitol riots were denounced unconditionally by Fox News and all Conservative media.

That is the difference. All of the rioting, violence and protests were encouraged by the left. None of the vile rhetoric by the extremist side of BLM was denounced. The extremist element in BLM isn't a fringe element. It is espoused by a huge part of the population.

I didn't want this thread to turn political. A few comments and I'm done.

Stammers, in my experience and my observation that is not true in either case. When you generalize you miss the whole truth.

There are some on Fox that spoke the words once but follow that up with more conspiracy theories (a staple of some on Fox and fringe right wing that I don't call conservatives)
Instead of letting the Capitol riots stand on it's on we had some Fox hosts host repeating yea but why don't they punish the rioters from last summer, they didn't punish them (they did, thousands were arrested and prosecuted). Tucker Carlson is in his own fantasy world.
The fringe right wing does not represent conservatives in the republican party. Tru KKK are not relevant anymore but there are plenty of fringe elements embraced by the Right Wing extremism of the republican party. The Proud Boys and all of that ilk do not represent the conservatives in the republican party. The Steve Bannons and that ilk do not represent the conservatives of the republican party. There were many at the Capitol that did not riot and did not storm the capitol and did not cause harm or disruption to anyone but that was reported widely by the left wing of the democrat party because it did not fit their agenda.

There is a Fringe Left and some of those represent the extreme views of the BLM movement. They do not represent the mainstream of the democrat party. Like the Fringe right wing the fringe left wing are load and visible. There were some that promoted violence and some that would not condemn violence and destruction. Most of the mainstream left are not like that. They wanted criminals prosecuted. They also followed the destruction and helped rebuild but that did not get reported widely on Fox news because it did not fit the agenda.

The extremes of both parties are more about agendas and destroying the other side than trying to build what is best for all of us. Take out the extreme pols on both side of the isle and watch us fly. Get both parties to hold their own people accountable and watch us fly.

Keep demonizing the other party and spend 90% of the time trying to destroy the other party and we fall. Bring civil discourse back and we have a chance.

I have friends at every level of extremes to moderates on both sides of the isle. There are some on both sides I have distanced myself from because all they promoted was hate. I've defriended a bunch of people that can't seem to mute the hate speech. Often a differing opinion is just different not bad.

This country was carved out of wilderness by people from all walks of life. Native and immigrants. There was lots of good and lots of bad that went into building this country. My first ancestor to this country was a forced indentured servant from Scotland. He served 7 years for a paltry sum from the age of 13 and then sold himself for another 5 for land in Siler City, North Carolina. His son hired out to a Dr. to drive a covered wagon west and settled in a place in west TN. For 150 years my family farmed. My Great grandfather married a women who lived with the Cherokee Tribe but DNA Ancestry tracing says I have Asian bloodlines through her. Nobody fully knows that story. My dad dealt in livestock. He was a social and fiscal Democrat and my mothers bloodlines were Irish. Her family was conservative Republican.

I was the first college graduate in my family. I am a fiscal conservative and social moderate that believes in accountability. I have almost always voted Republican in national elections and I split tickets in state and local. I do not believe that politics and religion mix well although I try to seek out moral conservatives regardless of party. I think there is a growing number of people like me who can not accept the extremes of either party.

I could never swallow what Trump or H. Clinton sold and in the past two elections I voted with the same write-in candidate. I gave Trump his chance but found morally lacking in almost every way and his purposeful divisiveness harmed this country well beyond anything positive he brought to the table. I did not support Biden but I will give him the same opportunity to earn my support I gave Trump. By midterms we will know who he really is.

So yes I am different. I was molded differently than anyone I know but uniqueness is a core strength of our nation.

All that is your opinion about things that won't change regardless of what side you are on. People on the other side can give equally compelling arguments that go directly against what you are saying.

What do we know that isn't an opinion?

Conservative politicians and Conservative news outlets denounced the Capitol riots with the same vigor that they denounced the violence, destruction of property, lootings and protests in NYC, DC, Seattle, Portland, Chicago, Baltimore and Minneapolis.

Democrat and Liberal politicians, and Democrat and Liberal news outlets only denounced the Capitol riots. They didn't say a word in opposition to try and quell all the other stuff and often encouraged it.

As I always say, come up with links from June 2020 onward with quotes or proof that Biden, Harris, Pelosi, Ocrazio, Schumer, Schitt, Watters, The Squad, any Democratic presidential candidate, ANY Democrat politician said ANYTHING against the stuff that was going on, and I'll be happy to tell you that you are right.

If there is one thing I have learned in life, it's to not speak in absolutes with stuff like this.

https://www.fayobserver.com/story/opinio...170932001/

I'm glad you brought this up. 8 times?

Biden - May 31st, written, nothing after that
Clyburn - June 3rd, then nothing until August 18th (not cited in your article)
Obama - June 1st, nothing after that
Polis - August 23rd and only when it happened in Colorado. Nothing before or after
Rice - September 1st; nothing before or after
Walsh - June 1st
Newsom - June 1st

Where were Pelosi, Sanders, Pocohontas, Ocrazio, Nadler, Schitt, Schumer?, etc?

I would be embarrassed to use this as an example to support a position. In your opinion, this is an example of all Democrats presenting a united, unconditional condemnation of all violence, looting and destruction of property?

Oh I don't have a position since I don't care much for either party. I was just showing those eight are more than the zero you mentioned.

Since we are discussing United States and the hatefilled polarization in American political parties...I would like to add this.

"yeah... no," said with a grin.

It's my favorite Canadian answer. And it works for everything! I have friends up in O Canada --Vancouver. And they never take a hard stand on anything without immediately considering the opposite.

Gotta love them for that... along with many other things. Great couple!

(03-18-2021 01:43 PM)snowtiger Wrote:  Since we are discussing United States and the polarization of extremists in American political parties...I would like to add this.

"yeah... no," said with a grin.

It's my favorite Canadian answer. And it works for everything! I have friends up in O Canada --Vancouver. And they never take a hard stand on anything without immediately considering the opposite.

Gotta love them for that... along with many other things. Great couple!

That's the view I grew into going into the 2000 election.

(03-18-2021 01:35 PM)Alanda Wrote:  

(03-18-2021 01:26 PM)Stammers Wrote:  

(03-18-2021 12:48 PM)Alanda Wrote:  

(03-18-2021 11:35 AM)Stammers Wrote:  

(03-18-2021 11:18 AM)Tigerx3 Wrote:  I didn't want this thread to turn political. A few comments and I'm done.

Stammers, in my experience and my observation that is not true in either case. When you generalize you miss the whole truth.

There are some on Fox that spoke the words once but follow that up with more conspiracy theories (a staple of some on Fox and fringe right wing that I don't call conservatives)
Instead of letting the Capitol riots stand on it's on we had some Fox hosts host repeating yea but why don't they punish the rioters from last summer, they didn't punish them (they did, thousands were arrested and prosecuted). Tucker Carlson is in his own fantasy world.
The fringe right wing does not represent conservatives in the republican party. Tru KKK are not relevant anymore but there are plenty of fringe elements embraced by the Right Wing extremism of the republican party. The Proud Boys and all of that ilk do not represent the conservatives in the republican party. The Steve Bannons and that ilk do not represent the conservatives of the republican party. There were many at the Capitol that did not riot and did not storm the capitol and did not cause harm or disruption to anyone but that was reported widely by the left wing of the democrat party because it did not fit their agenda.

There is a Fringe Left and some of those represent the extreme views of the BLM movement. They do not represent the mainstream of the democrat party. Like the Fringe right wing the fringe left wing are load and visible. There were some that promoted violence and some that would not condemn violence and destruction. Most of the mainstream left are not like that. They wanted criminals prosecuted. They also followed the destruction and helped rebuild but that did not get reported widely on Fox news because it did not fit the agenda.

The extremes of both parties are more about agendas and destroying the other side than trying to build what is best for all of us. Take out the extreme pols on both side of the isle and watch us fly. Get both parties to hold their own people accountable and watch us fly.

Keep demonizing the other party and spend 90% of the time trying to destroy the other party and we fall. Bring civil discourse back and we have a chance.

I have friends at every level of extremes to moderates on both sides of the isle. There are some on both sides I have distanced myself from because all they promoted was hate. I've defriended a bunch of people that can't seem to mute the hate speech. Often a differing opinion is just different not bad.

This country was carved out of wilderness by people from all walks of life. Native and immigrants. There was lots of good and lots of bad that went into building this country. My first ancestor to this country was a forced indentured servant from Scotland. He served 7 years for a paltry sum from the age of 13 and then sold himself for another 5 for land in Siler City, North Carolina. His son hired out to a Dr. to drive a covered wagon west and settled in a place in west TN. For 150 years my family farmed. My Great grandfather married a women who lived with the Cherokee Tribe but DNA Ancestry tracing says I have Asian bloodlines through her. Nobody fully knows that story. My dad dealt in livestock. He was a social and fiscal Democrat and my mothers bloodlines were Irish. Her family was conservative Republican.

I was the first college graduate in my family. I am a fiscal conservative and social moderate that believes in accountability. I have almost always voted Republican in national elections and I split tickets in state and local. I do not believe that politics and religion mix well although I try to seek out moral conservatives regardless of party. I think there is a growing number of people like me who can not accept the extremes of either party.

I could never swallow what Trump or H. Clinton sold and in the past two elections I voted with the same write-in candidate. I gave Trump his chance but found morally lacking in almost every way and his purposeful divisiveness harmed this country well beyond anything positive he brought to the table. I did not support Biden but I will give him the same opportunity to earn my support I gave Trump. By midterms we will know who he really is.

So yes I am different. I was molded differently than anyone I know but uniqueness is a core strength of our nation.

All that is your opinion about things that won't change regardless of what side you are on. People on the other side can give equally compelling arguments that go directly against what you are saying.

What do we know that isn't an opinion?

Conservative politicians and Conservative news outlets denounced the Capitol riots with the same vigor that they denounced the violence, destruction of property, lootings and protests in NYC, DC, Seattle, Portland, Chicago, Baltimore and Minneapolis.

Democrat and Liberal politicians, and Democrat and Liberal news outlets only denounced the Capitol riots. They didn't say a word in opposition to try and quell all the other stuff and often encouraged it.

As I always say, come up with links from June 2020 onward with quotes or proof that Biden, Harris, Pelosi, Ocrazio, Schumer, Schitt, Watters, The Squad, any Democratic presidential candidate, ANY Democrat politician said ANYTHING against the stuff that was going on, and I'll be happy to tell you that you are right.

If there is one thing I have learned in life, it's to not speak in absolutes with stuff like this.

https://www.fayobserver.com/story/opinio...170932001/

I'm glad you brought this up. 8 times?

Biden - May 31st, written, nothing after that
Clyburn - June 3rd, then nothing until August 18th (not cited in your article)
Obama - June 1st, nothing after that
Polis - August 23rd and only when it happened in Colorado. Nothing before or after
Rice - September 1st; nothing before or after
Walsh - June 1st
Newsom - June 1st

Where were Pelosi, Sanders, Pocohontas, Ocrazio, Nadler, Schitt, Schumer?, etc?

I would be embarrassed to use this as an example to support a position. In your opinion, this is an example of all Democrats presenting a united, unconditional condemnation of all violence, looting and destruction of property?

Oh I don't have a position since I don't care much for either party. I was just showing those eight are more than the zero you mentioned.

My statement was 100% accurate. None of the names I mentioned, said anything from June onward.

(03-18-2021 02:17 PM)Stammers Wrote:  

(03-18-2021 01:35 PM)Alanda Wrote:  

(03-18-2021 01:26 PM)Stammers Wrote:  

(03-18-2021 12:48 PM)Alanda Wrote:  

(03-18-2021 11:35 AM)Stammers Wrote:  All that is your opinion about things that won't change regardless of what side you are on. People on the other side can give equally compelling arguments that go directly against what you are saying.

What do we know that isn't an opinion?

Conservative politicians and Conservative news outlets denounced the Capitol riots with the same vigor that they denounced the violence, destruction of property, lootings and protests in NYC, DC, Seattle, Portland, Chicago, Baltimore and Minneapolis.

Democrat and Liberal politicians, and Democrat and Liberal news outlets only denounced the Capitol riots. They didn't say a word in opposition to try and quell all the other stuff and often encouraged it.

As I always say, come up with links from June 2020 onward with quotes or proof that Biden, Harris, Pelosi, Ocrazio, Schumer, Schitt, Watters, The Squad, any Democratic presidential candidate, ANY Democrat politician said ANYTHING against the stuff that was going on, and I'll be happy to tell you that you are right.

If there is one thing I have learned in life, it's to not speak in absolutes with stuff like this.

https://www.fayobserver.com/story/opinio...170932001/

I'm glad you brought this up. 8 times?

Biden - May 31st, written, nothing after that
Clyburn - June 3rd, then nothing until August 18th (not cited in your article)
Obama - June 1st, nothing after that
Polis - August 23rd and only when it happened in Colorado. Nothing before or after
Rice - September 1st; nothing before or after
Walsh - June 1st
Newsom - June 1st

Where were Pelosi, Sanders, Pocohontas, Ocrazio, Nadler, Schitt, Schumer?, etc?

I would be embarrassed to use this as an example to support a position. In your opinion, this is an example of all Democrats presenting a united, unconditional condemnation of all violence, looting and destruction of property?

Oh I don't have a position since I don't care much for either party. I was just showing those eight are more than the zero you mentioned.

My statement was 100% accurate. None of the names I mentioned, said anything from June onward.

Yeah but you're dancing around what you said to get to 100% accuracy. You're leaving out the rest.

Quote:Democrat and Liberal politicians, and Democrat and Liberal news outlets only denounced the Capitol riots. They didn't say a word in opposition to try and quell all the other stuff and often encouraged it.

(03-18-2021 09:30 AM)Stammers Wrote:  The important issue isn't extremists. As an example, the KKK hasn't had any impact in decades, is a fringe movement at best and is denounced by 99% of Conservatives. The Capitol riots were denounced unconditionally by Fox News and all Conservative media.

That is the difference. All of the rioting, violence and protests were encouraged by the left. None of the vile rhetoric by the extremist side of BLM was denounced. The extremist element in BLM isn't a fringe element. It is espoused by a huge part of the population.

Well I gave examples and there are others to show that the use of "only", "all", and "none" can't be used in this situation. That's really my only issue, mainly because I don't like generalizing things like this. And you're far from the only person to do that. But that's what makes it not 100% accurate. Now if you were only saying they didn't provide a united front in condemning the bad acts then I would agree with you and wouldn't have responded.

Also looking back on you saying "often encouraged it" seems kind of out there as well. Did they often encourage the protests or did they often encourage the rioting? Those two things are very different.

Also you say the extremists aren't important, then list some from the far left as the ones you want quotes from. I wouldn't expect much, if anything, from some of them either after hearing things certain ones have said in the past. But at first you mentioned Democrats and Liberal media in general so I was looking at that as well.

And I personally have no problem saying the ones on the extreme side of BLM are fringe. My question is what is your view on what the extreme element is saying to know that a "huge part of the population" is saying it as well?

And having said all of this maybe I also don't fully understand why you say the extremists aren't the important issue.

(03-18-2021 11:18 AM)Tigerx3 Wrote:  

(03-18-2021 09:30 AM)Stammers Wrote:  

(03-17-2021 03:07 PM)Tigerx3 Wrote:  

(03-17-2021 01:10 PM)aardWolf Wrote:  

(03-17-2021 07:32 AM)AlonsoWDC Wrote:  There is nothing political about the fact that black lives matter.

Sorry this is such a difficult concept to grasp, but the majority of Tigers athletics will be black men.

The stickers weren't about the statement itself, but the political movement. Pretending the stickers isn't political is equivalent to sticking your head in the sand. Using the capitalized initials implies support for the organization, not just the statement in general.

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Black_Lives_Matter

Quote:Black Lives Matter (BLM) is a decentralized political and social movement protesting against incidents of police brutality and all racially motivated violence against black people.

Most people can quote you two lines from the BLM movement. There is a national organization but to most people it is simply a way to brand a problem in our society that needs to be addressed. Decentralized means it is not one thought, one action, one offense, one organization. It is a philosophical gathering place for those who see racial injustice. Too many time we focus on everything we can find that is wrong or questionable rather than the good that is being attempted.

Although I can't give you a percentage I would venture that much of the negativity associated to the BLM letters is attributed to violence perpetrated by people who have no alliance with the reason there are marches and protest. There are extremes in every movement. There are extremes in the republican and democrat parties. Get past the extremes who by definition are disruptors and look for common ground.

The important issue isn't extremists. As an example, the KKK hasn't had any impact in decades, is a fringe movement at best and is denounced by 99% of Conservatives. The Capitol riots were denounced unconditionally by Fox News and all Conservative media.

That is the difference. All of the rioting, violence and protests were encouraged by the left. None of the vile rhetoric by the extremist side of BLM was denounced. The extremist element in BLM isn't a fringe element. It is espoused by a huge part of the population.

I didn't want this thread to turn political. A few comments and I'm done.

Stammers, in my experience and my observation that is not true in either case. When you generalize you miss the whole truth.

There are some on Fox that spoke the words once but follow that up with more conspiracy theories (a staple of some on Fox and fringe right wing that I don't call conservatives)
Instead of letting the Capitol riots stand on it's on we had some Fox hosts host repeating yea but why don't they punish the rioters from last summer, they didn't punish them (they did, thousands were arrested and prosecuted). Tucker Carlson is in his own fantasy world.
The fringe right wing does not represent conservatives in the republican party. Tru KKK are not relevant anymore but there are plenty of fringe elements embraced by the Right Wing extremism of the republican party. The Proud Boys and all of that ilk do not represent the conservatives in the republican party. The Steve Bannons and that ilk do not represent the conservatives of the republican party. There were many at the Capitol that did not riot and did not storm the capitol and did not cause harm or disruption to anyone but that was reported widely by the left wing of the democrat party because it did not fit their agenda.

There is a Fringe Left and some of those represent the extreme views of the BLM movement. They do not represent the mainstream of the democrat party. Like the Fringe right wing the fringe left wing are load and visible. There were some that promoted violence and some that would not condemn violence and destruction. Most of the mainstream left are not like that. They wanted criminals prosecuted. They also followed the destruction and helped rebuild but that did not get reported widely on Fox news because it did not fit the agenda.

The extremes of both parties are more about agendas and destroying the other side than trying to build what is best for all of us. Take out the extreme pols on both side of the isle and watch us fly. Get both parties to hold their own people accountable and watch us fly.

Keep demonizing the other party and spend 90% of the time trying to destroy the other party and we fall. Bring civil discourse back and we have a chance.

I have friends at every level of extremes to moderates on both sides of the isle. There are some on both sides I have distanced myself from because all they promoted was hate. I've defriended a bunch of people that can't seem to mute the hate speech. Often a differing opinion is just different not bad.

This country was carved out of wilderness by people from all walks of life. Native and immigrants. There was lots of good and lots of bad that went into building this country. My first ancestor to this country was a forced indentured servant from Scotland. He served 7 years for a paltry sum from the age of 13 and then sold himself for another 5 for land in Siler City, North Carolina. His son hired out to a Dr. to drive a covered wagon west and settled in a place in west TN. For 150 years my family farmed. My Great grandfather married a women who lived with the Cherokee Tribe but DNA Ancestry tracing says I have Asian bloodlines through her. Nobody fully knows that story. My dad dealt in livestock. He was a social and fiscal Democrat and my mothers bloodlines were Irish. Her family was conservative Republican.

I was the first college graduate in my family. I am a fiscal conservative and social moderate that believes in accountability. I have almost always voted Republican in national elections and I split tickets in state and local. I do not believe that politics and religion mix well although I try to seek out moral conservatives regardless of party. I think there is a growing number of people like me who can not accept the extremes of either party.

I could never swallow what Trump or H. Clinton sold and in the past two elections I voted with the same write-in candidate. I gave Trump his chance but found morally lacking in almost every way and his purposeful divisiveness harmed this country well beyond anything positive he brought to the table. I did not support Biden but I will give him the same opportunity to earn my support I gave Trump. By midterms we will know who he really is.

So yes I am different. I was molded differently than anyone I know but uniqueness is a core strength of our nation.

(Thousands) were arrested and prosecuted ? I call BS-----For the most part the cops were told to stand down----and the few that were arrested --they were just released--or our new VP raised bail to get them out.

(03-18-2021 10:03 AM)uskjtc02 Wrote:  Will the stickers be on the helmet this year? I bet not.

Which sticker---there are at least 2 different ones

(03-18-2021 09:25 AM)Stammers Wrote:  

(03-18-2021 08:46 AM)Tiger87 Wrote:  I think there is no doubt that some people will refuse to donate due to the stickers. In today's world of polarization, it's bound to be true. And it was laughable that any "mysterious deep pockets" would double any donations that were lost because of this. To go with that logo was a poor choice that added to the polarization instead of bringing unity. This can sometimes happen when you turn over decision-making to idealistic & unwise 20 year olds. And from listening to the Coaches and Admin, it's a decision they wish they could take back. There were unlimited other choices that could not be politicized.

At the same time, the majority of donation shortfall is most certainly COVID related. Has nothing to do with the stickers. All universities are feeling it, so it seems to be a level playing field. But it could impact debt and operations greater at the schools who live day-to-day, and can't simply delay the next big $100M over-the-top project to "catch up".

I look at the stickers as ill-advised, but coming from a good place. It is definitely NOT a reason or excuse for me to stop providing support for my alma mater, and for programs that I care about and that increase my quality of life.

BLM

although i deferred my season tkts til this year, last year i told them to keep the donation so I will be donating again this year.

(03-18-2021 07:21 PM)jsw3ent Wrote:  

(03-18-2021 11:18 AM)Tigerx3 Wrote:  

(03-18-2021 09:30 AM)Stammers Wrote:  

(03-17-2021 03:07 PM)Tigerx3 Wrote:  

(03-17-2021 01:10 PM)aardWolf Wrote:  The stickers weren't about the statement itself, but the political movement. Pretending the stickers isn't political is equivalent to sticking your head in the sand. Using the capitalized initials implies support for the organization, not just the statement in general.

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Black_Lives_Matter

Most people can quote you two lines from the BLM movement. There is a national organization but to most people it is simply a way to brand a problem in our society that needs to be addressed. Decentralized means it is not one thought, one action, one offense, one organization. It is a philosophical gathering place for those who see racial injustice. Too many time we focus on everything we can find that is wrong or questionable rather than the good that is being attempted.

Although I can't give you a percentage I would venture that much of the negativity associated to the BLM letters is attributed to violence perpetrated by people who have no alliance with the reason there are marches and protest. There are extremes in every movement. There are extremes in the republican and democrat parties. Get past the extremes who by definition are disruptors and look for common ground.

The important issue isn't extremists. As an example, the KKK hasn't had any impact in decades, is a fringe movement at best and is denounced by 99% of Conservatives. The Capitol riots were denounced unconditionally by Fox News and all Conservative media.

That is the difference. All of the rioting, violence and protests were encouraged by the left. None of the vile rhetoric by the extremist side of BLM was denounced. The extremist element in BLM isn't a fringe element. It is espoused by a huge part of the population.

I didn't want this thread to turn political. A few comments and I'm done.

Stammers, in my experience and my observation that is not true in either case. When you generalize you miss the whole truth.

There are some on Fox that spoke the words once but follow that up with more conspiracy theories (a staple of some on Fox and fringe right wing that I don't call conservatives)
Instead of letting the Capitol riots stand on it's on we had some Fox hosts host repeating yea but why don't they punish the rioters from last summer, they didn't punish them (they did, thousands were arrested and prosecuted). Tucker Carlson is in his own fantasy world.
The fringe right wing does not represent conservatives in the republican party. Tru KKK are not relevant anymore but there are plenty of fringe elements embraced by the Right Wing extremism of the republican party. The Proud Boys and all of that ilk do not represent the conservatives in the republican party. The Steve Bannons and that ilk do not represent the conservatives of the republican party. There were many at the Capitol that did not riot and did not storm the capitol and did not cause harm or disruption to anyone but that was reported widely by the left wing of the democrat party because it did not fit their agenda.

There is a Fringe Left and some of those represent the extreme views of the BLM movement. They do not represent the mainstream of the democrat party. Like the Fringe right wing the fringe left wing are load and visible. There were some that promoted violence and some that would not condemn violence and destruction. Most of the mainstream left are not like that. They wanted criminals prosecuted. They also followed the destruction and helped rebuild but that did not get reported widely on Fox news because it did not fit the agenda.

The extremes of both parties are more about agendas and destroying the other side than trying to build what is best for all of us. Take out the extreme pols on both side of the isle and watch us fly. Get both parties to hold their own people accountable and watch us fly.

Keep demonizing the other party and spend 90% of the time trying to destroy the other party and we fall. Bring civil discourse back and we have a chance.

I have friends at every level of extremes to moderates on both sides of the isle. There are some on both sides I have distanced myself from because all they promoted was hate. I've defriended a bunch of people that can't seem to mute the hate speech. Often a differing opinion is just different not bad.

This country was carved out of wilderness by people from all walks of life. Native and immigrants. There was lots of good and lots of bad that went into building this country. My first ancestor to this country was a forced indentured servant from Scotland. He served 7 years for a paltry sum from the age of 13 and then sold himself for another 5 for land in Siler City, North Carolina. His son hired out to a Dr. to drive a covered wagon west and settled in a place in west TN. For 150 years my family farmed. My Great grandfather married a women who lived with the Cherokee Tribe but DNA Ancestry tracing says I have Asian bloodlines through her. Nobody fully knows that story. My dad dealt in livestock. He was a social and fiscal Democrat and my mothers bloodlines were Irish. Her family was conservative Republican.

I was the first college graduate in my family. I am a fiscal conservative and social moderate that believes in accountability. I have almost always voted Republican in national elections and I split tickets in state and local. I do not believe that politics and religion mix well although I try to seek out moral conservatives regardless of party. I think there is a growing number of people like me who can not accept the extremes of either party.

I could never swallow what Trump or H. Clinton sold and in the past two elections I voted with the same write-in candidate. I gave Trump his chance but found morally lacking in almost every way and his purposeful divisiveness harmed this country well beyond anything positive he brought to the table. I did not support Biden but I will give him the same opportunity to earn my support I gave Trump. By midterms we will know who he really is.

So yes I am different. I was molded differently than anyone I know but uniqueness is a core strength of our nation.

(Thousands) were arrested and prosecuted ? I call BS-----For the most part the cops were told to stand down----and the few that were arrested --they were just released--or our new VP raised bail to get them out.

This is just one reference from June. There are many others if you take the time to do research and not listen to just singular view outlets. I don’t claim a party. I listen to both sides.

“According to the tally, Los Angeles has recorded 2,700 arrests since the protests, followed by New York City with some 1,500 arrests. Police in Dallas and Houston, Texas, and Philadelphia, Pennsylvania, have also arrested several hundred people.”

Sometimes when you call BS BS comes calling.