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BcatMatt13 Offline
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Post: #21
RE: It’s time
(02-21-2021 03:24 PM)bearcatmark Wrote:  
(02-21-2021 03:16 PM)Bear Catlett Wrote:  The difference between Cronin and Brannen was how they started.

Cronin started with one guy.

Brannen had it all on a plate for him. All he had to do was not screw it up.

He's screwed it up. This is down 51-3 at halftime against USF.

Yes, it's time.

There are plenty of differences but Brannen entered year 2 with two guys recruited by Cronin and one of those was dou. Brannen had to deal with the big reset in year 2 instead of year 1. It's a different situation with its own challenges.

I agree but it’s concerning that the two teams are comparable. Mick had to rebuild in the best conference of all time, a good portion of the fanbase refused to support the program because of the Huggins fiasco, and he had terrible and outdated arena and facilities to recruit to. Yet he still was able to land some high profile recruits despite the bad result on the court.

Brannen deserves time to get his guys in, but I’m concerned because so far I haven’t seen much to be impressed about.
 
02-21-2021 03:29 PM
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Post: #22
RE: It’s time
(02-21-2021 03:21 PM)BcatMatt13 Wrote:  
(02-21-2021 02:54 PM)BrooklynRocket Wrote:  Worst coaching job I've seen by a UC coach in 20 years - Andy Kennedy included.

I don’t think Andy Kennedy did a bad job that one year he was here.

He actually might make the tournament this year at UAB. And Huggins and Cronin both have team in the top 25. What a kick in the nuts.

Andy Kennedy did an outstanding job during his year as acting HC and followed with a good job at Ole Miss, which is where SEC basketball coaching careers go to die
 
02-21-2021 03:29 PM
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robertfoshizzle Offline
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Post: #23
RE: It’s time
I know we're all fans and we're prone to being emotional. But firing Brannen this season is not a sensible decision given the circumstances. If we suck next year, he's fair game.
 
02-21-2021 03:34 PM
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Post: #24
RE: It’s time
(02-21-2021 03:22 PM)skylinecat Wrote:  
(02-21-2021 03:16 PM)Bear Catlett Wrote:  The difference between Cronin and Brannen was how they started.

Cronin started with one guy.

Brannen had it all on a plate for him. All he had to do was not screw it up.

He's screwed it up. This is down 51-3 at halftime against USF.

Yes, it's time.

I agree. Brannen inherited the conference player of the year and a very very good Tre Scott. He couldn't keep Brooks and went back to the well for Vogt, who would've been fine as a bit piece but not as a full time starter. He needed a monster class last season. Eason looks good for a young kid and DeJulius is IMO an average AAC starter. Everyone else was a bust and he lost his big recruit from the season before.

Who reasonably believed that John Brannen was going to leave NKU, come to UC, and bring a monster recruiting class a year later?
 
02-21-2021 03:38 PM
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Post: #25
RE: It’s time
(02-21-2021 03:24 PM)bearcatmark Wrote:  
(02-21-2021 03:16 PM)Bear Catlett Wrote:  The difference between Cronin and Brannen was how they started.

Cronin started with one guy.

Brannen had it all on a plate for him. All he had to do was not screw it up.

He's screwed it up. This is down 51-3 at halftime against USF.

Yes, it's time.

There are plenty of differences but Brannen entered year 2 with two guys recruited by Cronin and one of those was dou. Brannen had to deal with the big reset in year 2 instead of year 1. It's a different situation with its own challenges.

You act like this is a personnel problem... though I don't know what is stopping him from going out and getting the Jarron Cumberlands and Gary Clarks of the world.

This is a coaching problem.

This team has no fire. This team has no mojo. This team has no defense.

That's on the coach.
 
02-21-2021 03:41 PM
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Post: #26
RE: It’s time
(02-21-2021 03:41 PM)Bear Catlett Wrote:  
(02-21-2021 03:24 PM)bearcatmark Wrote:  
(02-21-2021 03:16 PM)Bear Catlett Wrote:  The difference between Cronin and Brannen was how they started.

Cronin started with one guy.

Brannen had it all on a plate for him. All he had to do was not screw it up.

He's screwed it up. This is down 51-3 at halftime against USF.

Yes, it's time.

There are plenty of differences but Brannen entered year 2 with two guys recruited by Cronin and one of those was dou. Brannen had to deal with the big reset in year 2 instead of year 1. It's a different situation with its own challenges.

You act like this is a personnel problem... though I don't know what is stopping him from going out and getting the Jarron Cumberlands and Gary Clarks of the world.

This is a coaching problem.

This team has no fire. This team has no mojo. This team has no defense.

That's on the coach.

Gary Clark and jarron Cumberland weren't recruited into a situation where they had to be the guy in year 1. Mick left an outstanding senior class and barebones elsewhere. Go look at mick's 2009 team. (3rd season) he had gates, dixon and bishop. All would be key guys on 2 tournament teams in 2 years and 2 would be on a sweet 16 in three. Uc was bad that season. Unless you get the elite of the elite it takes time unless you have a good core in the upper class. Hell mick's upper class of williams/Vaughn was better than ours this year and they still really struggled.
 
(This post was last modified: 02-21-2021 03:50 PM by bearcatmark.)
02-21-2021 03:49 PM
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RE: It’s time
Vogt has been in Brannen's system for 3 or 4 years. Today he scored two points and was completely out of his element on the floor. After a decent season a year ago, he has regressed. Williams was 1-10 today and continuously dribbled the ball into traffic for either a missed layup or a turnover. The 78% free throw shooter has morphed into a 50% free throw shooter. Adams-Woods has been a starter for two full seasons. Today he was scoreless, has 0 rebounds and 0 assists. Saunders tries hard, but there is no evidence that he is a high-level player. Same with Madsen. Today, as is common, our interior defense and rebounding was below sub-par. We foul too much and turn it over too much. Recruiting is not where it needs to be. In short, UC basketball, after 9 consecutive NCAA tourney appearances, is going nowhere. There is no evidence to suggest that Brannen has the ability to turn it around and put this program back to where it needs to be. Houston is a good team, but for UC to lose to Houston by 40 points should NEVER, EVER happen. There is a reason the all-time series is 34-6 in favor of Cincy.
 
02-21-2021 03:58 PM
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Post: #28
RE: It’s time
(02-21-2021 03:34 PM)robertfoshizzle Wrote:  I know we're all fans and we're prone to being emotional. But firing Brannen this season is not a sensible decision given the circumstances. If we suck next year, he's fair game.

Of course we'll suck next yrar, we'll have pretty much the same roster.
 
02-21-2021 04:01 PM
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Post: #29
RE: It’s time
(02-21-2021 03:58 PM)vabearcat Wrote:  Vogt has been in Brannen's system for 3 or 4 years. Today he scored two points and was completely out of his element on the floor. After a decent season a year ago, he has regressed. Williams was 1-10 today and continuously dribbled the ball into traffic for either a missed layup or a turnover. The 78% free throw shooter has morphed into a 50% free throw shooter. Adams-Woods has been a starter for two full seasons. Today he was scoreless, has 0 rebounds and 0 assists. Saunders tries hard, but there is no evidence that he is a high-level player. Same with Madsen. Today, as is common, our interior defense and rebounding was below sub-par. We foul too much and turn it over too much. Recruiting is not where it needs to be. In short, UC basketball, after 9 consecutive NCAA tourney appearances, is going nowhere. There is no evidence to suggest that Brannen has the ability to turn it around and put this program back to where it needs to be. Houston is a good team, but for UC to lose to Houston by 40 points should NEVER, EVER happen. There is a reason the all-time series is 34-6 in favor of Cincy.

All this. College basketball is all about the HC and his ability to place his stamp on the program by sheer force of will. Remember when Huggs rolled into town? The fanbase knew he was the guy within a few games even though the tournament was still two years away. Brannen talks a good game, but doesn't produce.
 
02-21-2021 04:09 PM
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DownOnRohs Offline
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Post: #30
RE: It’s time
(02-21-2021 04:09 PM)Former Lurker Wrote:  
(02-21-2021 03:58 PM)vabearcat Wrote:  Vogt has been in Brannen's system for 3 or 4 years. Today he scored two points and was completely out of his element on the floor. After a decent season a year ago, he has regressed. Williams was 1-10 today and continuously dribbled the ball into traffic for either a missed layup or a turnover. The 78% free throw shooter has morphed into a 50% free throw shooter. Adams-Woods has been a starter for two full seasons. Today he was scoreless, has 0 rebounds and 0 assists. Saunders tries hard, but there is no evidence that he is a high-level player. Same with Madsen. Today, as is common, our interior defense and rebounding was below sub-par. We foul too much and turn it over too much. Recruiting is not where it needs to be. In short, UC basketball, after 9 consecutive NCAA tourney appearances, is going nowhere. There is no evidence to suggest that Brannen has the ability to turn it around and put this program back to where it needs to be. Houston is a good team, but for UC to lose to Houston by 40 points should NEVER, EVER happen. There is a reason the all-time series is 34-6 in favor of Cincy.

All this. College basketball is all about the HC and his ability to place his stamp on the program by sheer force of will. Remember when Huggs rolled into town? The fanbase knew he was the guy within a few games even though the tournament was still two years away. Brannen talks a good game, but doesn't produce.

Ok yes. BUT ALSO, he won the league last year. And we knew this year was gonna suck. At least those of us who were being honest with ourselves did.
 
02-21-2021 04:23 PM
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DownOnRohs Offline
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RE: It’s time
It’s interesting how the consensus is split 50/50
 
02-21-2021 04:24 PM
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BcatMatt13 Offline
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RE: It’s time
(02-21-2021 04:23 PM)DownOnRohs Wrote:  
(02-21-2021 04:09 PM)Former Lurker Wrote:  
(02-21-2021 03:58 PM)vabearcat Wrote:  Vogt has been in Brannen's system for 3 or 4 years. Today he scored two points and was completely out of his element on the floor. After a decent season a year ago, he has regressed. Williams was 1-10 today and continuously dribbled the ball into traffic for either a missed layup or a turnover. The 78% free throw shooter has morphed into a 50% free throw shooter. Adams-Woods has been a starter for two full seasons. Today he was scoreless, has 0 rebounds and 0 assists. Saunders tries hard, but there is no evidence that he is a high-level player. Same with Madsen. Today, as is common, our interior defense and rebounding was below sub-par. We foul too much and turn it over too much. Recruiting is not where it needs to be. In short, UC basketball, after 9 consecutive NCAA tourney appearances, is going nowhere. There is no evidence to suggest that Brannen has the ability to turn it around and put this program back to where it needs to be. Houston is a good team, but for UC to lose to Houston by 40 points should NEVER, EVER happen. There is a reason the all-time series is 34-6 in favor of Cincy.

All this. College basketball is all about the HC and his ability to place his stamp on the program by sheer force of will. Remember when Huggs rolled into town? The fanbase knew he was the guy within a few games even though the tournament was still two years away. Brannen talks a good game, but doesn't produce.

Ok yes. BUT ALSO, he won the league last year. And we knew this year was gonna suck. At least those of us who were being honest with ourselves did.

Split the title three ways* with an unbalanced schedule that heavily favored UC over Houston.
 
02-21-2021 04:27 PM
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DownOnRohs Offline
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RE: It’s time
(02-21-2021 04:27 PM)BcatMatt13 Wrote:  
(02-21-2021 04:23 PM)DownOnRohs Wrote:  
(02-21-2021 04:09 PM)Former Lurker Wrote:  
(02-21-2021 03:58 PM)vabearcat Wrote:  Vogt has been in Brannen's system for 3 or 4 years. Today he scored two points and was completely out of his element on the floor. After a decent season a year ago, he has regressed. Williams was 1-10 today and continuously dribbled the ball into traffic for either a missed layup or a turnover. The 78% free throw shooter has morphed into a 50% free throw shooter. Adams-Woods has been a starter for two full seasons. Today he was scoreless, has 0 rebounds and 0 assists. Saunders tries hard, but there is no evidence that he is a high-level player. Same with Madsen. Today, as is common, our interior defense and rebounding was below sub-par. We foul too much and turn it over too much. Recruiting is not where it needs to be. In short, UC basketball, after 9 consecutive NCAA tourney appearances, is going nowhere. There is no evidence to suggest that Brannen has the ability to turn it around and put this program back to where it needs to be. Houston is a good team, but for UC to lose to Houston by 40 points should NEVER, EVER happen. There is a reason the all-time series is 34-6 in favor of Cincy.

All this. College basketball is all about the HC and his ability to place his stamp on the program by sheer force of will. Remember when Huggs rolled into town? The fanbase knew he was the guy within a few games even though the tournament was still two years away. Brannen talks a good game, but doesn't produce.

Ok yes. BUT ALSO, he won the league last year. And we knew this year was gonna suck. At least those of us who were being honest with ourselves did.

Split the title three ways* with an unbalanced schedule that heavily favored UC over Houston.

I’m of the opinion that you should throw out last year when evaluating CJB
 
02-21-2021 04:40 PM
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Banter Online
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Post: #34
RE: It’s time
A lot of really bad takes and hyperbole in here. It's like some of you never looked at the roster and realized just how decimated it was after the past two years.

Many of you are still riding high on the glory of 30 years ago and haven't realized we have been a mediocre program for two decades. Recruits don't care that we have a lot of wins. Kids we are recruiting now were not alive in 1999 when we had our last good team.

Xavier past us about 15 years ago even while playing in a smaller conference. They were more exciting, they won games when it counted and they continue to ride that momentum and we can't catch up.

Cronin won us a lot of games, but very few that mattered. We have to rebuild the program and build an identity. Many of you are missing the fact we have not been "cool" in 20 years. We have generations of graduates(like myself) who view UC as a football school.

This rebuild won't happen overnight and this is basically year one. I am still holding some faith in CJB. He has yet to have a normal year to try and get his program going, and that is a shame. In his limited time he had recruited fairly well. There have been a lot of snap judgements made about the ability of some of these players, but people fail to grasp that many of these guys would not be seeing much time if we had a full roster. Gary Clark likely would not have been Gary Clark had he not had a very experienced roster around him. Saunders is likely a redshirt guy, but many people are already writing him off.

In all likelihood (as it stands now) his inability to shift the way he recruits this season likely gets him fired after next year baring some sort of big win on the transfer market.
 
02-21-2021 04:48 PM
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rosewater Offline
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Post: #35
RE: It’s time
I cannot decide if Brannen is more like Yates(constant roster turnover and no continuity) or Cronin(lack or inexperienced talent to win games). Time will tell.
 
02-21-2021 04:50 PM
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RE: It’s time
(02-21-2021 04:48 PM)Banter Wrote:  A lot of really bad takes and hyperbole in here. It's like some of you never looked at the roster and realized just how decimated it was after the past two years.

Many of you are still riding high on the glory of 30 years ago and haven't realized we have been a mediocre program for two decades. Recruits don't care that we have a lot of wins. Kids we are recruiting now were not alive in 1999 when we had our last good team.

Xavier past us about 15 years ago even while playing in a smaller conference. They were more exciting, they won games when it counted and they continue to ride that momentum and we can't catch up.

Cronin won us a lot of games, but very few that mattered. We have to rebuild the program and build an identity. Many of you are missing the fact we have not been "cool" in 20 years. We have generations of graduates(like myself) who view UC as a football school.

This rebuild won't happen overnight and this is basically year one. I am still holding some faith in CJB. He has yet to have a normal year to try and get his program going, and that is a shame. In his limited time he had recruited fairly well. There have been a lot of snap judgements made about the ability of some of these players, but people fail to grasp that many of these guys would not be seeing much time if we had a full roster. Gary Clark likely would not have been Gary Clark had he not had a very experienced roster around him. Saunders is likely a redshirt guy, but many people are already writing him off.

In all likelihood (as it stands now) his inability to shift the way he recruits this season likely gets him fired after next year baring some sort of big win on the transfer market.

As an older fan, I concur with some of the points you are making. Nobody outside our fan base cares that we went to 9 NCAATs in a row from 2011-2019. If you don’t make it to the SS or knock off a Blue Blood OOC it simply does not matter. That’s the thing about CBB vs. CFB- in FB every game matters. Most of America does not start paying attention to CBB until March.
 
02-21-2021 04:58 PM
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RE: It’s time
(02-21-2021 04:58 PM)CliftonAve Wrote:  
(02-21-2021 04:48 PM)Banter Wrote:  A lot of really bad takes and hyperbole in here. It's like some of you never looked at the roster and realized just how decimated it was after the past two years.

Many of you are still riding high on the glory of 30 years ago and haven't realized we have been a mediocre program for two decades. Recruits don't care that we have a lot of wins. Kids we are recruiting now were not alive in 1999 when we had our last good team.

Xavier past us about 15 years ago even while playing in a smaller conference. They were more exciting, they won games when it counted and they continue to ride that momentum and we can't catch up.

Cronin won us a lot of games, but very few that mattered. We have to rebuild the program and build an identity. Many of you are missing the fact we have not been "cool" in 20 years. We have generations of graduates(like myself) who view UC as a football school.

This rebuild won't happen overnight and this is basically year one. I am still holding some faith in CJB. He has yet to have a normal year to try and get his program going, and that is a shame. In his limited time he had recruited fairly well. There have been a lot of snap judgements made about the ability of some of these players, but people fail to grasp that many of these guys would not be seeing much time if we had a full roster. Gary Clark likely would not have been Gary Clark had he not had a very experienced roster around him. Saunders is likely a redshirt guy, but many people are already writing him off.

In all likelihood (as it stands now) his inability to shift the way he recruits this season likely gets him fired after next year baring some sort of big win on the transfer market.

As an older fan, I concur with some of the points you are making. Nobody outside our fan base cares that we went to 9 NCAATs in a row from 2011-2019. If you don’t make it to the SS or knock off a Blue Blood OOC it simply does not matter. That’s the thing about CBB vs. CFB- in FB every game matters. Most of America does not start paying attention to CBB until March.

Instead we’ll have a team that can’t finish .500 because god forbid they lose in the second round again
 
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02-21-2021 05:03 PM
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colohank Offline
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RE: It’s time
If Brannen didn't help UC's recruiting today, he probably helped Houston's. Is that the kind of recruiter we need?
 
02-21-2021 05:11 PM
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RE: It’s time
(02-21-2021 04:58 PM)CliftonAve Wrote:  
(02-21-2021 04:48 PM)Banter Wrote:  A lot of really bad takes and hyperbole in here. It's like some of you never looked at the roster and realized just how decimated it was after the past two years.

Many of you are still riding high on the glory of 30 years ago and haven't realized we have been a mediocre program for two decades. Recruits don't care that we have a lot of wins. Kids we are recruiting now were not alive in 1999 when we had our last good team.

Xavier past us about 15 years ago even while playing in a smaller conference. They were more exciting, they won games when it counted and they continue to ride that momentum and we can't catch up.

Cronin won us a lot of games, but very few that mattered. We have to rebuild the program and build an identity. Many of you are missing the fact we have not been "cool" in 20 years. We have generations of graduates(like myself) who view UC as a football school.

This rebuild won't happen overnight and this is basically year one. I am still holding some faith in CJB. He has yet to have a normal year to try and get his program going, and that is a shame. In his limited time he had recruited fairly well. There have been a lot of snap judgements made about the ability of some of these players, but people fail to grasp that many of these guys would not be seeing much time if we had a full roster. Gary Clark likely would not have been Gary Clark had he not had a very experienced roster around him. Saunders is likely a redshirt guy, but many people are already writing him off.

In all likelihood (as it stands now) his inability to shift the way he recruits this season likely gets him fired after next year baring some sort of big win on the transfer market.

As an older fan, I concur with some of the points you are making. Nobody outside our fan base cares that we went to 9 NCAATs in a row from 2011-2019. If you don’t make it to the SS or knock off a Blue Blood OOC it simply does not matter. That’s the thing about CBB vs. CFB- in FB every game matters. Most of America does not start paying attention to CBB until March.

People watch the first and second rounds of the tournament to see who makes it to the second weekend. Teams that lose are mentally compartmentalized as also-rans, if not outright failures.
 
02-21-2021 05:34 PM
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Post: #40
RE: It’s time
(02-21-2021 05:11 PM)colohank Wrote:  If Brannen didn't help UC's recruiting today, he probably helped Houston's. Is that the kind of recruiter we need?

Houston's recruiting has zero bearing on us, or results against us. They're in a fertile, fertile area for recruiting and have a very good recruiting coach. That's why he's gotten to where he's at over 7 years or whatever his tenure is. Brannen has to recruit to what he wants to do. I still think they will have a winning season by a small margin. They're not deep, and they're not real talented right now. You have to be patient. We got blown out quite a few times in Cronin's earlier years as well. I recall a 45 or so pt drubbing at Uconn.
 
02-21-2021 05:36 PM
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