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ODU's perfect conference for you guys
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Post: #221
RE: ODU's perfect conference for you guys
(03-03-2021 03:36 AM)JSchmack Wrote:  Ok, want to mention a few things after the last page:

1. I joined to post because ODU is an intriguing/attractive program for the A-10. So let's make sure you understand that from the jump.

2. Steve1981 said we went to 15 teams.... we went to 16 teams because WE KNEW we were losing teams (Xavier, Temple, possibly more) and the teams we added were Butler, who made 2 Final Fours in the Horizon in 2010 and 2011 and VCU who made the Final Four in 2011...

and when we lost Temple, Xavier, Butler and Charlotte, we added George Mason (2006 Final Four) and Davidson (2008 Elite Eight).

My point is that I feel that ODU is a consistent program, a good program, and one who could be competitive in the A-10 and a good addition for us; But have you made a Sweet 16 ever? La Salle made one in 2013, and people want to kick them the F out! They won a national championship and lost the NCG 60 years ago. So turning the discussion from "Why would we expand" to "okay, who do we add with ODU" is going to take a step forward by the Monarchs. Again, I came here because I recognize the value of the ODU program! No disrespect intended. I understand that the BCS Carter runs things and screws over programs like my Bonnies and that's why C-USA gets one bid when they have 4+ quality programs. I'm just saying you're going to have to turn heads.

3. Thanks for saying the Bonnies are a sexy program, but as for the drop off... we're the most consistent program in the A-10. We don't have the bids that others do, like Saint Louis or Saint Joe's, who bounce between 24-7 and 13-18, while the Bonnies are just 18+ wins 8 years in a row. ME PERSONALLY, I recognized that the 18+ 8 years in a row is better for the league, and that's why I took note of ODU, but I'm also the rare guy among CBB fans. I'm the guy who laughed when everyone said the A-10 was a one-bid league after losing Temple, Xavier, Butler and Charlotte. I said we'd stay at 2 to 4 bids every year, the Big East wouldn't get 7-8 bids and the ACC wouldn't get 11. And everyone said I was wrong but they didn't know how CONFERENCES WORK in the math of SOS/RPI/NET/bids. You don't need sexy Final Four team that sucked half the last 20 years. ODU's consistency is what is the most attractive thing about you, slightly ahead of the market.

4. Screw Charlotte, if your admin is smart, they'd pitch the A-10 on the consistency and markets of ODU and Belmont.

5. C-USA is killing ODU, and Marshall, and WKU, and MTSU and UAB and La Tech. Since there's no path to a CFP cartel conference, or even the American for FBS, you are much better off doing a 7/7 split and forming your own league with Charlotte, Liberty, Buffalo and (tell them all or nothing, settle for football only) UMass. The "Risk" of being an unofficial FBS conference without 8 core members is NOTHING compared to the benefits for MBB and FB of ditching FAU, FIU, Rice, So Miss, UTSA, North Texas. and UTEP. There's just too many not good enough programs. You can only go with 14 when the 14th member brings this year is capable of winning the league 8 years from now. In the A-10 that is not true, in C-USA it is not true.

^ I like this guy
03-03-2021 06:37 AM
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Post: #222
RE: ODU's perfect conference for you guys
(03-02-2021 11:02 PM)monarx Wrote:  I think ODUs recruiting would definitely take a step up in the A10 (especially if it came with a new coach). And I think the comparison to VCU is closer for ODU than GMU. ODU has historically owned GMU, and has a much more committed fan base, history and commitment to the sport than the Patriots. Before VCUs F4 run, our two programs were virtually identical. What has changed since the CAA days of the recent past? VCU went on a F4 run, and switched conferences. Im of the mindset if ODU were to get in the A10 it wouldnt be long before we were in the top 4 fairly consistently and going close to .500 against the Rams again. Lastly, VCU, UR, GMU and GW are all natural rivals for ODU. Especially the first three. With the intrigue of a conference race attached to those games, I think its safe to say we'd be back to having multiple sell outs every year.

I've been as critical as anyone with Jeff Jones... but... I'm not 100% sure he is the problem. The travel puts us at a grave disadvantage. We have the worst travel situation in the league. Maybe not financially because UTEP is more of an outlier, but for the athletes, at least they are flying. Nothing worse than spending 24 hours on the road in 4 days. I think recruiting would immediately improve with or without JJ.
(This post was last modified: 03-03-2021 08:58 AM by EverRespect.)
03-03-2021 08:52 AM
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Post: #223
RE: ODU's perfect conference for you guys
You know watching how things are turning out, I would be in favor of just splitting conference and adding liberty to get 8 or wkentucky marshall liberty odu middle Tennessee app st Charlotte coastal ga state ga southern uab and try and get east carolina or jmu. I like it simple,regional. I know it's not aac or a10,but I think it is a great fit for all sports. Its not a10 in basketball but not bad and football would be absolutely awesome. I know it would be hard for a new conference, but maybe ncaa would like the regional conference. I think if had to go a conference, I would be 1.aac 2.a10 3.cusa. I know you guys hate this,but I'm still hearing sun belt
03-08-2021 10:01 AM
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Post: #224
RE: ODU's perfect conference for you guys
(03-03-2021 03:36 AM)JSchmack Wrote:  2. Steve1981 said we went to 15 teams.... we went to 16 teams because WE KNEW we were losing teams (Xavier, Temple, possibly more) and the teams we added were Butler, who made 2 Final Fours in the Horizon in 2010 and 2011 and VCU who made the Final Four in 2011...

and when we lost Temple, Xavier, Butler and Charlotte, we added George Mason (2006 Final Four) and Davidson (2008 Elite Eight).

FWIW the A-10 never intended to go to 16 teams. They invited VCU and Butler to join for 2013, taking Charlotte's and Temple's places. Then the CAA, in its traditional vindictive fashion, told VCU it would not be eligible for conference titles and autobids in its final season, at which point VCU and the A-10 changed their move-in date to 2012. I think the same thing happened with Butler and the Horizon. Then of course as Temple and Charlotte left, the long-prophesied Big East breakaway took place and the A-10 went from 14 to 16 to 12 with Dayton and Saint Louis widely believed to be on their way out as well. I couldn't tell you if the Mason and Davidson adds were to replace Xavier and Butler, or if it was a preemptive move in case Dayton and Saint Louis dropped them to a more-tenuous 10.


Quote:My point is that I feel that ODU is a consistent program, a good program, and one who could be competitive in the A-10 and a good addition for us; But have you made a Sweet 16 ever? La Salle made one in 2013, and people want to kick them the F out! They won a national championship and lost the NCG 60 years ago. So turning the discussion from "Why would we expand" to "okay, who do we add with ODU" is going to take a step forward by the Monarchs. Again, I came here because I recognize the value of the ODU program! No disrespect intended. I understand that the BCS Carter runs things and screws over programs like my Bonnies and that's why C-USA gets one bid when they have 4+ quality programs. I'm just saying you're going to have to turn heads.

ODU's basketball excellence, outside of two NIT Final Fours and a D2 title in the 70s, is more about being consistently good than big seasons (which you acknowledge later). La Salle had their S16, and good for them, but it was an outlier. They hadn't been to the NCAAs in 21 seasons prior, and since then, they've had one winning record (at 17-16) in the past eight seasons. Their recruiting has been underwhelming, their facilities are nothing special and there were reports a few years ago that they were considering moving to a conference where they could be more competitive.

I'm not saying remove La Salle; I've repeatedly complained that message-board posters are way more trigger-happy than school presidents that move with all due caution and won't turf a full member in good standing because they don't like how the football or basketball has done lately. But if La Salle and ODU were up for the last spot in the A-10, I think far more people take ODU.

Quote:3. Thanks for saying the Bonnies are a sexy program, but as for the drop off... we're the most consistent program in the A-10. We don't have the bids that others do, like Saint Louis or Saint Joe's, who bounce between 24-7 and 13-18, while the Bonnies are just 18+ wins 8 years in a row.

OK, granted; I think I was thinking about the early 200s when it seemed like your NCAA teams came out of nowhere. Saint Louis is very up-and-down, which is fun to watch play out on the realignment board; when the Billikens are doing well, then SLU was a lock to be the 11th Big East member, and when they weren't, then not only was Dayton the lock 11th, SLU wasn't consistently good enough to warrant consideration and in fact should perhaps consider swallowing their pride and joining the MVC. Until they got good again and *boom* Big East lock.

Quote:You can only go with 14 when the 14th member brings this year is capable of winning the league 8 years from now. In the A-10 that is not true, in C-USA it is not true.
That's definitely true in the A-10 because that 14th program is usually Fordham, a mid-pack Patriot program in A-10's clothing. But the difference between first and 14th in CUSA isn't insurmountable. This year's 14th place team is FIU, which has a good coach and could make some moves in the years to come (they could also not make those moves, but this is about capability, not guaranteed outcomes). Last year's 14th was Middle Tennessee, which two years prior won their second straight NCAA first-round game. In 2019 the 14th was UTEP, and they definitely have the resources to win the conference at some point in the next eight years.

The biggest difference between the A-10 and CUSA is that the resources/commitment gap is larger in the A-10. For as much as we complain about FIU/FAU/UTSA not investing enough in basketball, the gap is nowhere near as large as the top programs in the A-10 versus Fordham and La Salle (and until recently you could include Duquesne, I think). And in football, I think everyone's trying, they're just not producing as a whole.
03-08-2021 11:01 AM
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Post: #225
RE: ODU's perfect conference for you guys
(03-08-2021 10:01 AM)jaybird44 Wrote:  You know watching how things are turning out, I would be in favor of just splitting conference and adding liberty to get 8 or wkentucky marshall liberty odu middle Tennessee app st Charlotte coastal ga state ga southern uab and try and get east carolina or jmu. I like it simple,regional. I know it's not aac or a10,but I think it is a great fit for all sports. Its not a10 in basketball but not bad and football would be absolutely awesome. I know it would be hard for a new conference, but maybe ncaa would like the regional conference. I think if had to go a conference, I would be 1.aac 2.a10 3.cusa. I know you guys hate this,but I'm still hearing sun belt

That makes little to no sense when you consider logistics, entrance and exit fees, and contracts. It makes this all about UTEP. Even with the relatively short 9 hr GaSt drive, travel in the current SBC would actually further in total (excluding UTEP), than in CUSA, even with the Florida schools.
(This post was last modified: 03-08-2021 12:22 PM by ODUalum78.)
03-08-2021 12:12 PM
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Post: #226
RE: ODU's perfect conference for you guys
(03-08-2021 12:12 PM)ODUalum78 Wrote:  
(03-08-2021 10:01 AM)jaybird44 Wrote:  You know watching how things are turning out, I would be in favor of just splitting conference and adding liberty to get 8 or wkentucky marshall liberty odu middle Tennessee app st Charlotte coastal ga state ga southern uab and try and get east carolina or jmu. I like it simple,regional. I know it's not aac or a10,but I think it is a great fit for all sports. Its not a10 in basketball but not bad and football would be absolutely awesome. I know it would be hard for a new conference, but maybe ncaa would like the regional conference. I think if had to go a conference, I would be 1.aac 2.a10 3.cusa. I know you guys hate this,but I'm still hearing sun belt

That makes little to no sense when you consider logistics, entrance and exit fees, and contracts. It makes this all about UTEP. Even with the relatively short 9 hr GaSt drive, travel in the current SBC would actually further in total (excluding UTEP), than in CUSA, even with the Florida schools.

None of the options stated here make any sense, except for the AAC which I admit has little to no chance and has the same travel problems of the other options. Those touting the A10 talk about the regionalism that makes it superior but in the same breath say they would take the AAC in an instant if it were available. My only problem with the A10 option is football. I don’t think independent will work. And regarding travel with the other options, including status quo, does it really matter if there is a 1 or 2 hour difference in travel when you are already traveling 10 or 11 hours? There is no perfect conference. The only way to fix regionalism is to erase everything and start from scratch. We all know that is not happening. That said, AAC or bust.
03-08-2021 12:55 PM
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Post: #227
RE: ODU's perfect conference for you guys
(03-08-2021 12:55 PM)Chillie Willie Wrote:  
(03-08-2021 12:12 PM)ODUalum78 Wrote:  
(03-08-2021 10:01 AM)jaybird44 Wrote:  You know watching how things are turning out, I would be in favor of just splitting conference and adding liberty to get 8 or wkentucky marshall liberty odu middle Tennessee app st Charlotte coastal ga state ga southern uab and try and get east carolina or jmu. I like it simple,regional. I know it's not aac or a10,but I think it is a great fit for all sports. Its not a10 in basketball but not bad and football would be absolutely awesome. I know it would be hard for a new conference, but maybe ncaa would like the regional conference. I think if had to go a conference, I would be 1.aac 2.a10 3.cusa. I know you guys hate this,but I'm still hearing sun belt

That makes little to no sense when you consider logistics, entrance and exit fees, and contracts. It makes this all about UTEP. Even with the relatively short 9 hr GaSt drive, travel in the current SBC would actually further in total (excluding UTEP), than in CUSA, even with the Florida schools.

None of the options stated here make any sense, except for the AAC which I admit has little to no chance and has the same travel problems of the other options. Those touting the A10 talk about the regionalism that makes it superior but in the same breath say they would take the AAC in an instant if it were available. My only problem with the A10 option is football. I don’t think independent will work. And regarding travel with the other options, including status quo, does it really matter if there is a 1 or 2 hour difference in travel when you are already traveling 10 or 11 hours? There is no perfect conference. The only way to fix regionalism is to erase everything and start from scratch. We all know that is not happening. That said, AAC or bust.

- Since there was also discussion about the A10 on other boards, there may have been some smoke there, and may still be. However I agree that football as an independent would be a disaster.

- ODU moving to the SBC offers little or no advantages, serves no economic purpose, but would likely incur substantial costs.

- A realignment/crossover of CUSA and the SBC seems to me to be nothing more than a pipe dream. As I have said before, many if not most SBC programs, and even some CUSA programs, have no impetus to make that happen.

- Although The AAC would be a step up in football and basketball, travel issues would still be there, and by the time we got the call to the AAC, likely it would be very watered down, similar to CUSA after we joined. Out of the frying pan and into the fire so to speak. In any event, that is not happening anytime in the foreseeable future.

I think that realistically, the schools in CUSA would best served by a 'locked' divisional model. No program would have to travel outside of their division except for the basketball tournament and the football championship game.
Not perfect, but a lot better for most, and certainly doable without a whole lot of logistical "fuss".
(This post was last modified: 03-08-2021 01:29 PM by ODUalum78.)
03-08-2021 01:27 PM
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Post: #228
RE: ODU's perfect conference for you guys
(03-08-2021 01:27 PM)ODUalum78 Wrote:  
(03-08-2021 12:55 PM)Chillie Willie Wrote:  
(03-08-2021 12:12 PM)ODUalum78 Wrote:  
(03-08-2021 10:01 AM)jaybird44 Wrote:  You know watching how things are turning out, I would be in favor of just splitting conference and adding liberty to get 8 or wkentucky marshall liberty odu middle Tennessee app st Charlotte coastal ga state ga southern uab and try and get east carolina or jmu. I like it simple,regional. I know it's not aac or a10,but I think it is a great fit for all sports. Its not a10 in basketball but not bad and football would be absolutely awesome. I know it would be hard for a new conference, but maybe ncaa would like the regional conference. I think if had to go a conference, I would be 1.aac 2.a10 3.cusa. I know you guys hate this,but I'm still hearing sun belt

That makes little to no sense when you consider logistics, entrance and exit fees, and contracts. It makes this all about UTEP. Even with the relatively short 9 hr GaSt drive, travel in the current SBC would actually further in total (excluding UTEP), than in CUSA, even with the Florida schools.

None of the options stated here make any sense, except for the AAC which I admit has little to no chance and has the same travel problems of the other options. Those touting the A10 talk about the regionalism that makes it superior but in the same breath say they would take the AAC in an instant if it were available. My only problem with the A10 option is football. I don’t think independent will work. And regarding travel with the other options, including status quo, does it really matter if there is a 1 or 2 hour difference in travel when you are already traveling 10 or 11 hours? There is no perfect conference. The only way to fix regionalism is to erase everything and start from scratch. We all know that is not happening. That said, AAC or bust.

- Since there was also discussion about the A10 on other boards, there may have been some smoke there, and may still be. However I agree that football as an independent would be a disaster.

- ODU moving to the SBC offers little or no advantages, serves no economic purpose, but would likely incur substantial costs.

- A realignment/crossover of CUSA and the SBC seems to me to be nothing more than a pipe dream. As I have said before, many if not most SBC programs, and even some CUSA programs, have no impetus to make that happen.

- Although The AAC would be a step up in football and basketball, travel issues would still be there, and by the time we got the call to the AAC, likely it would be very watered down, similar to CUSA after we joined. Out of the frying pan and into the fire so to speak. In any event, that is not happening anytime in the foreseeable future.

I think that realistically, the schools in CUSA would best served by a 'locked' divisional model. No program would have to travel outside of their division except for the basketball tournament and the football championship game.
Not perfect, but a lot better for most, and certainly doable without a whole lot of logistical "fuss".

Your preferred option is purgatory for basketball. It is worse than the current setup aside from travel, which in my opinion, is not even close the biggest problem with CUSA.
03-08-2021 01:33 PM
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Post: #229
RE: ODU's perfect conference for you guys
I just cant see any logical reason to go to the Sun Belt UNLESS, there are wholesale changes in both conferences. If going to the SB meant going SB with Charlotte, Marshall, WKU, MTSU and the FUs (and/or JMU or LU), and TX ST, Ark St and Troy and So Alabama went to CUSA, it might make a little sense..

That would have us with Marshall, WKU, MT, App St. Charlotte, Coastal, GSU, GaSt, FIU, FAU

Even then, the only logical reason is geography. Out of 11 or 12 teams, new SB would only have 2 very good football teams, and 5 pretty good hoops programs. It'd be better without the FUs, but CUSA probably wouldnt expand that much. If we could have them stay in CUSA while the new SB kept UAB and Ark St, it would be much better, but I suspect they'd rather stay where they are.
(This post was last modified: 03-08-2021 03:25 PM by monarx.)
03-08-2021 03:22 PM
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Post: #230
RE: ODU's perfect conference for you guys
(03-01-2021 10:12 AM)Monarchblue Wrote:  ODU's basketball excellence, outside of two NIT Final Fours and a D2 title in the 70s, is more about being consistently good than big seasons (which you acknowledge later). La Salle had their S16, and good for them, but it was an outlier.

I'm not saying remove La Salle;
But if La Salle and ODU were up for the last spot in the A-10, I think far more people take ODU.

Saint Louis is very up-and-down, which is fun to watch play out on the realignment board; when the Billikens are doing well, then SLU was a lock to be the 11th Big East member, and when they weren't, then not only was Dayton the lock 11th, SLU wasn't consistently good enough to warrant consideration and in fact should perhaps consider swallowing their pride and joining the MVC. Until they got good again and *boom* Big East lock.

That's definitely true in the A-10 because that 14th program is usually Fordham, a mid-pack Patriot program in A-10's clothing. But the difference between first and 14th in CUSA isn't insurmountable. This year's 14th place team is FIU, which has a good coach and could make some moves in the years to come (they could also not make those moves, but this is about capability, not guaranteed outcomes). Last year's 14th was Middle Tennessee, which two years prior won their second straight NCAA first-round game. In 2019 the 14th was UTEP, and they definitely have the resources to win the conference at some point in the next eight years.

The biggest difference between the A-10 and CUSA is that the resources/commitment gap is larger in the A-10. For as much as we complain about FIU/FAU/UTSA not investing enough in basketball, the gap is nowhere near as large as the top programs in the A-10 versus Fordham and La Salle (and until recently you could include Duquesne, I think). And in football, I think everyone's trying, they're just not producing as a whole.

I agree with virtually all of this.
- I referenced La Salle's Sweet 16 run as an indicator of people want to throw out a team that has a Sweet 16 run; The powers that be care about MBB NCAA Success, which is why the last people we've added have had deep runs to Final Fours and Elite 8s. People undervalue consistency.

- We'd definitely take ODU over LAS/FORD.
- No one is kicking schools out. All you can do is Grow in size and then split in half and form a new league if you want to leave someone behind!

- The A-10 gap between top and bottom IS pretty vast, but the depth of everyone else has overcome that. Having a bad team or two in your league is actually GOOD, because conference play is zero sum.

- The A-10's biggest problem isn't actually LAS/FORD, it's that Saint Louis, Saint Joseph's, Rhode Island, UMass and George Washington go from "24-8 NCAA teams" to 12-19 teams yo-yo style. Every team should schedule to be no worse than 9-3 in non-conference. You don't need marquee wins if you're 10th in the standings.

- With the amount of programs in Division I, under .500 is a bad year for the level the A-10 and half C-USA is trying to compete at. Let's look at C-USA:

La Tech 0 bad seasons in 12 years, 5 in 23 years
WKU has 1 bad season in 21 years.
ODU has 2 "bad" seasons in 18 years.
MTSU has 3 in 11 years (the last three after winning 19+ 8 years in a row
Marshall 3 in 13 years
UAB 3 in 19 years

Charlotte 11 in the last 35 years, but 10 since they left C-USA 1.0.
UTEP: 7 in 20 years, only 3 in the last 18 years (El Paso is really far away).

North Texas: 8 in 20 years
UTSA: 10 in 20 years
Southern Miss: 12 in 20 years
FAU: 13 in 20 years
FIU: 19 in 21 years
Rice: 12 in 16 years

In any given season, you've got 6 quality teams having good seasons; and 8 teams struggling. And that's killing you.

The average SOS of CONFERENCE games is your OOC Win Pct + the 139-139 you'll always do against each other (regular season/conf tourney). So you go 67-83 OOC in 2020, each game is worth .4813 on your SOS, 19 times each, dragging down all your RPIs.

So you have NCAA calibre teams, with NIT resumes, and NIT teams with CBI resumes because of nothing more than "how the math works."

Those 7 teams I said should leave, plus Liberty and Buffalo; your SOS from conference games is worth far more, and people don't view you as a one-bid league, they view you like a deeper MVC.


- It WOULD be a massive risk to take if the teams good in basketball were bad in football, and the teams bad in basketball were good in football (like Kansas and Kentucky football; Penn State and Nebraska basketball). But for the most part, the teams I suggest you take with you to split C-USA in half are 7 of the best 9 teams in BOTH basketball AND FOOTBALL.

The only reason the 14 of you are together is timing of who was in the league and was C-USA better than where you were or where you elevating to FBS. There's no real reason for the 5 eastern members to tie their lot to FIU/FAU, the four Texas schools or Southern Miss. It was just that Rice, So Miss, UTEP, were in the group that invited you.
(This post was last modified: 03-08-2021 06:35 PM by JSchmack.)
03-08-2021 06:28 PM
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ODUalum78 Online
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Post: #231
RE: ODU's perfect conference for you guys
(03-08-2021 01:33 PM)Monarchblue Wrote:  
(03-08-2021 01:27 PM)ODUalum78 Wrote:  
(03-08-2021 12:55 PM)Chillie Willie Wrote:  
(03-08-2021 12:12 PM)ODUalum78 Wrote:  
(03-08-2021 10:01 AM)jaybird44 Wrote:  You know watching how things are turning out, I would be in favor of just splitting conference and adding liberty to get 8 or wkentucky marshall liberty odu middle Tennessee app st Charlotte coastal ga state ga southern uab and try and get east carolina or jmu. I like it simple,regional. I know it's not aac or a10,but I think it is a great fit for all sports. Its not a10 in basketball but not bad and football would be absolutely awesome. I know it would be hard for a new conference, but maybe ncaa would like the regional conference. I think if had to go a conference, I would be 1.aac 2.a10 3.cusa. I know you guys hate this,but I'm still hearing sun belt

That makes little to no sense when you consider logistics, entrance and exit fees, and contracts. It makes this all about UTEP. Even with the relatively short 9 hr GaSt drive, travel in the current SBC would actually further in total (excluding UTEP), than in CUSA, even with the Florida schools.

None of the options stated here make any sense, except for the AAC which I admit has little to no chance and has the same travel problems of the other options. Those touting the A10 talk about the regionalism that makes it superior but in the same breath say they would take the AAC in an instant if it were available. My only problem with the A10 option is football. I don’t think independent will work. And regarding travel with the other options, including status quo, does it really matter if there is a 1 or 2 hour difference in travel when you are already traveling 10 or 11 hours? There is no perfect conference. The only way to fix regionalism is to erase everything and start from scratch. We all know that is not happening. That said, AAC or bust.

- Since there was also discussion about the A10 on other boards, there may have been some smoke there, and may still be. However I agree that football as an independent would be a disaster.

- ODU moving to the SBC offers little or no advantages, serves no economic purpose, but would likely incur substantial costs.

- A realignment/crossover of CUSA and the SBC seems to me to be nothing more than a pipe dream. As I have said before, many if not most SBC programs, and even some CUSA programs, have no impetus to make that happen.

- Although The AAC would be a step up in football and basketball, travel issues would still be there, and by the time we got the call to the AAC, likely it would be very watered down, similar to CUSA after we joined. Out of the frying pan and into the fire so to speak. In any event, that is not happening anytime in the foreseeable future.

I think that realistically, the schools in CUSA would best served by a 'locked' divisional model. No program would have to travel outside of their division except for the basketball tournament and the football championship game.
Not perfect, but a lot better for most, and certainly doable without a whole lot of logistical "fuss".

Your preferred option is purgatory for basketball. It is worse than the current setup aside from travel, which in my opinion, is not even close the biggest problem with CUSA.

Not my "preferred" option. I would PREFER to move to the AAC as it exists now.
However I believe the E/W scheduling separation of CUSA to be the most realistic scenario going forward.
04-cheers
(This post was last modified: 03-09-2021 02:18 AM by ODUalum78.)
03-08-2021 06:52 PM
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MUsince96 Online
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Post: #232
RE: ODU's perfect conference for you guys
Mike Aresco was recently talking 14 football teams in the AAC. He said-

“Our goal is to get back to 12 [teams],” Aresco said. “… And if down the road, there’s an opportunity to go to 14, why wouldn’t we at least think about it?
“We are going to be a factor. We are going to be a P6 conference. I’m totally convinced we’re going to make it.”

If they take Boise State and one or two other MWC schools for a western flank; I don't see where the MWC goes to replace them besides the C-USA Texas schools (maybe NDSU).

If that happens C-USA gets closer to ODU and Marshall. While it's not the league either of us want it may help improve things.

https://www.dallasnews.com/sports/smu-mu...ll-season/
03-09-2021 07:46 AM
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mturn017 Offline
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Post: #233
RE: ODU's perfect conference for you guys
(03-09-2021 07:46 AM)MUsince96 Wrote:  Mike Aresco was recently talking 14 football teams in the AAC. He said-

“Our goal is to get back to 12 [teams],” Aresco said. “… And if down the road, there’s an opportunity to go to 14, why wouldn’t we at least think about it?
“We are going to be a factor. We are going to be a P6 conference. I’m totally convinced we’re going to make it.”

If they take Boise State and one or two other MWC schools for a western flank; I don't see where the MWC goes to replace them besides the C-USA Texas schools (maybe NDSU).

If that happens C-USA gets closer to ODU and Marshall. While it's not the league either of us want it may help improve things.

https://www.dallasnews.com/sports/smu-mu...ll-season/

Yeah, AAC seems to be looking west and MWC would likely look to TX to replace. I doubt CUSA would replace if we lost two, I'm not sure the schools could reach a consensus on additions or if any SB other than maybe TX ST would be interested. WKU or MT would likely not be happy about being pushed west though. Staying at 12 with two less TX schools wouldn't help much but at least we could get the tourney moved.
03-09-2021 08:32 AM
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monarx Offline
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Post: #234
RE: ODU's perfect conference for you guys
I like UTEP and Rice, but UTEP especially hurts geographically. But they are two of the more recognizable names in the conference. Especially Rice. Id have mixed feelings about losing them because they add value to CUSA, but it would make sense for them to go MWC if given a chance. If AAC does get P6 status, they may have to expand the playoffs, or else they'll kick the rest of us out. One or the other I would think. It might not be the worst thing for CUSA either.
03-09-2021 09:31 AM
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odu09 Offline
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Post: #235
RE: ODU's perfect conference for you guys
I think UTEP, Rice, and UNT all add value to the conference. While I don't like that our conference is centered in Texas, I would not be too happy about losing any of them and not finding a suitable replacement.
03-09-2021 09:46 AM
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Maryland Monarch Offline
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Post: #236
RE: ODU's perfect conference for you guys
(03-09-2021 09:46 AM)odu09 Wrote:  I think UTEP, Rice, and UNT all add value to the conference. While I don't like that our conference is centered in Texas, I would not be too happy about losing any of them and not finding a suitable replacement.

In my humble opinion, less is more. Nothing against any of the Texas/Western schools, but if CUSA East split and added 1 or 2 more local schools, I think we would be much better off. 7+ 2 > 14 in G5 mathematics, if the right 8-9 schools are aligned.

With that said, I'm in the camp that wants the A10 and FB independence with every fiber of my being. Nothing would make me happier than for ODU to rejoin our Virginia rivals. Some of my best ODU memories are from the old CAA days.
03-09-2021 03:55 PM
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monarx Offline
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Post: #237
RE: ODU's perfect conference for you guys
(03-09-2021 03:55 PM)Maryland Monarch Wrote:  
(03-09-2021 09:46 AM)odu09 Wrote:  I think UTEP, Rice, and UNT all add value to the conference. While I don't like that our conference is centered in Texas, I would not be too happy about losing any of them and not finding a suitable replacement.

In my humble opinion, less is more. Nothing against any of the Texas/Western schools, but if CUSA East split and added 1 or 2 more local schools, I think we would be much better off. 7+ 2 > 14 in G5 mathematics, if the right 8-9 schools are aligned.

With that said, I'm in the camp that wants the A10 and FB independence with every fiber of my being. Nothing would make me happier than for ODU to rejoin our Virginia rivals. Some of my best ODU memories are from the old CAA days.

I agree. I pretty much don't care who we play in football as long as we are playing football. The A10 or AAC is where we need to be. If we did split, Id cut the FUs too leaving ODU, MU, WKU, Char, MTSU If we could add two good basketball schools (that have football) Id feel better about that split away plan. LU can be good in hoops. JMU did just build a new arena, so theres hope, and they were good 25 years ago. Maybe UMass could be convinced to come along since its more geographically reasonable. Darn shame we cant get them, Temple and ECU to join the fun.
03-09-2021 04:19 PM
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40smokingcannon Offline
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Post: #238
RE: ODU's perfect conference for you guys
You guys remind me a lot of UConn fans. Long time basketball fans learning where football fits into your schools athletic culture. UConn had been in the Big East and felt left behind after realignment had happened because of their success and prestige in the BE, not to mention close basketball rivalries they lost. The American to them was a step down (and was). They made the decision to embrace their basketball culture and went back to the BE. Contrary to belief I don't think their football will suffer as an independent long term.

ODU fans (I think) still embrace the basketball heritage and legacy and cherish their old rivals. Perhaps ODU could follow the lead of UConn and put basketball and the olympics in the A10 (if there is an opening) and go independent in football. I don't think it would hurt your football too much. You could schedule Va Tech, Liberty, ECU, Virginia, App At, Charlotte UConn, UMass, Norfolk At, William and Mary, Nc State, Duke, Wake, JMU, Elon, UNC, etc. Get a pay game every year too. Get BYU, South Carolina, Navy Temple, Maryland, etc.

To me, this seems better for ODU and it's fanbase than staying in CUSA or going to the Sun Belt or another conference made up of these teams.

Hampton Roads is an important recruiting area so I don't think you'd have trouble getting home games. Your potential football schedule could look like:

UConn
Liberty
JMU
Va Tech
Charlotte
App State
ECU
Marshall
BYU
West Virginia
Duke
UMass

There's enough money in that schedule to offset travel.

Couple that with basketball playing George Mason, Davidson, GW, VCU, etc. I bet your fans would come back in huge numbers.

It's difficult feeling like your teams are in purgatory. I felt that way with ECU in CUSA 2.0 (no offense) and love being in the AAC even though football and basketball hasn't been kind to us. It was a great move for us and I think ODU would benefit from making a bold move.

Good luck ODU.
03-12-2021 04:27 PM
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Monarchblue Offline
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Post: #239
RE: ODU's perfect conference for you guys
(03-12-2021 04:27 PM)40smokingcannon Wrote:  You guys remind me a lot of UConn fans. Long time basketball fans learning where football fits into your schools athletic culture. UConn had been in the Big East and felt left behind after realignment had happened because of their success and prestige in the BE, not to mention close basketball rivalries they lost. The American to them was a step down (and was). They made the decision to embrace their basketball culture and went back to the BE. Contrary to belief I don't think their football will suffer as an independent long term.

ODU fans (I think) still embrace the basketball heritage and legacy and cherish their old rivals. Perhaps ODU could follow the lead of UConn and put basketball and the olympics in the A10 (if there is an opening) and go independent in football. I don't think it would hurt your football too much. You could schedule Va Tech, Liberty, ECU, Virginia, App At, Charlotte UConn, UMass, Norfolk At, William and Mary, Nc State, Duke, Wake, JMU, Elon, UNC, etc. Get a pay game every year too. Get BYU, South Carolina, Navy Temple, Maryland, etc.

To me, this seems better for ODU and it's fanbase than staying in CUSA or going to the Sun Belt or another conference made up of these teams.

Hampton Roads is an important recruiting area so I don't think you'd have trouble getting home games. Your potential football schedule could look like:

UConn
Liberty
JMU
Va Tech
Charlotte
App State
ECU
Marshall
BYU
West Virginia
Duke
UMass

There's enough money in that schedule to offset travel.

Couple that with basketball playing George Mason, Davidson, GW, VCU, etc. I bet your fans would come back in huge numbers.

It's difficult feeling like your teams are in purgatory. I felt that way with ECU in CUSA 2.0 (no offense) and love being in the AAC even though football and basketball hasn't been kind to us. It was a great move for us and I think ODU would benefit from making a bold move.

Good luck ODU.

Well stated.
03-12-2021 04:39 PM
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EverRespect Offline
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Post: #240
RE: ODU's perfect conference for you guys
(03-12-2021 04:27 PM)40smokingcannon Wrote:  You guys remind me a lot of UConn fans. Long time basketball fans learning where football fits into your schools athletic culture. UConn had been in the Big East and felt left behind after realignment had happened because of their success and prestige in the BE, not to mention close basketball rivalries they lost. The American to them was a step down (and was). They made the decision to embrace their basketball culture and went back to the BE. Contrary to belief I don't think their football will suffer as an independent long term.

ODU fans (I think) still embrace the basketball heritage and legacy and cherish their old rivals. Perhaps ODU could follow the lead of UConn and put basketball and the olympics in the A10 (if there is an opening) and go independent in football. I don't think it would hurt your football too much. You could schedule Va Tech, Liberty, ECU, Virginia, App At, Charlotte UConn, UMass, Norfolk At, William and Mary, Nc State, Duke, Wake, JMU, Elon, UNC, etc. Get a pay game every year too. Get BYU, South Carolina, Navy Temple, Maryland, etc.

To me, this seems better for ODU and it's fanbase than staying in CUSA or going to the Sun Belt or another conference made up of these teams.

Hampton Roads is an important recruiting area so I don't think you'd have trouble getting home games. Your potential football schedule could look like:

UConn
Liberty
JMU
Va Tech
Charlotte
App State
ECU
Marshall
BYU
West Virginia
Duke
UMass

There's enough money in that schedule to offset travel.

Couple that with basketball playing George Mason, Davidson, GW, VCU, etc. I bet your fans would come back in huge numbers.

It's difficult feeling like your teams are in purgatory. I felt that way with ECU in CUSA 2.0 (no offense) and love being in the AAC even though football and basketball hasn't been kind to us. It was a great move for us and I think ODU would benefit from making a bold move.

Good luck ODU.

If pulling together a schedule like that is realistic, I 100% agree. I'd take that over a CUSA schedule any day and most of those games would stop the bleeding on the fleeing fans.
03-12-2021 04:41 PM
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