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(01-28-2021 12:44 AM)Bearhawkeye Wrote:  

(01-27-2021 10:36 PM)Billy_Bearcat Wrote:  The knock on Hudson is arm length. He measured only 33 inches and the cut off for most tackles in the NFL is 34. Jonah Williams is 33.5 and he was dinged for having a short reach for a guy playing on the outside. A lot of teams may value him at guard.

He could end up at guard but don't forget that Jonah was a top 10 pick for the Bengals as an OT and he wasn't considered a reach (at the time anyway - we'll see how it all works out.) FWIW, there are several senior bowl practice clips out there and I've seen him at RT quite a bit, but I haven't seen him at Guard although that doesn't mean he didn't get some looks there too.

I can certainly believe that some scouts/analysts can get very hung up on arm length, but I'm not sold on it being a big issue compared to other characteristics. FWIW, a PFF writer did an analysis on this very issue in 2013. His conclusion: "Any way I break it down, there doesn’t seem to be any correlation between arm length and performance. "

Of course, such studies have their limits and things may have evolved some since 2013. You can see his method, charts and caveats, etc. at the link:

Does Arm Length Affect OT Play?

I would say it's kinda like having a "slow" corner that plays perfect technique. If you're a corner with a lot of speed, you don't have to have perfect technique as your speed will help you recover. If you have shorter arms as on OT, the other areas of your game (feet, position, etc.) have to be more accurate, than on OT with longer arms.

On profootballnetwork.com, which has a really cool mock draft simulator, they originally had him around 215, which put him at the end of the 7th round. They now have him at 142 which is round 5, Wiggins is at 119 which is round 4 and Hicks is at 206 which is round 7.

(01-28-2021 01:48 PM)scvanguard1 Wrote:  

(01-28-2021 12:44 AM)Bearhawkeye Wrote:  

(01-27-2021 10:36 PM)Billy_Bearcat Wrote:  The knock on Hudson is arm length. He measured only 33 inches and the cut off for most tackles in the NFL is 34. Jonah Williams is 33.5 and he was dinged for having a short reach for a guy playing on the outside. A lot of teams may value him at guard.

He could end up at guard but don't forget that Jonah was a top 10 pick for the Bengals as an OT and he wasn't considered a reach (at the time anyway - we'll see how it all works out.) FWIW, there are several senior bowl practice clips out there and I've seen him at RT quite a bit, but I haven't seen him at Guard although that doesn't mean he didn't get some looks there too.

I can certainly believe that some scouts/analysts can get very hung up on arm length, but I'm not sold on it being a big issue compared to other characteristics. FWIW, a PFF writer did an analysis on this very issue in 2013. His conclusion: "Any way I break it down, there doesn’t seem to be any correlation between arm length and performance. "

Of course, such studies have their limits and things may have evolved some since 2013. You can see his method, charts and caveats, etc. at the link:

Does Arm Length Affect OT Play?

I would say it's kinda like having a "slow" corner that plays perfect technique. If you're a corner with a lot of speed, you don't have to have perfect technique as your speed will help you recover. If you have shorter arms as on OT, the other areas of your game (feet, position, etc.) have to be more accurate, than on OT with longer arms.

On profootballnetwork.com, which has a really cool mock draft simulator, they originally had him around 215, which put him at the end of the 7th round. They now have him at 142 which is round 5, Wiggins is at 119 which is round 4 and Hicks is at 206 which is round 7.

I see arm length as just one of many characteristics you look for in finding the perfect OT and though it's all relative, I wouldn't say it is one of the most important ones. To your analogy, there's plenty of CBs with a lot of speed who can't cover worth a lick. I think maybe we're pretty much saying the same thing.

As far as Hudson going 215th, I don't know if I should call it the "over" or the "under" but I'd be willing to bet he goes well before that unless something bizarre happens before the draft.

I’ve seen guys rate him in the 70s on the draft boards

(01-28-2021 07:02 PM)Billy_Bearcat Wrote:  I’ve seen guys rate him in the 70s on the draft boards

I posted above that The Athletic's draft guy had him 77th and said he could go in the top 40 if he impresses in the Senior Bowl (which he has so far also per many observers.)

I will stick with my same assessment from right after the season ended. James Hudson will not make it out of the 3rd round, and even THAT might be too conservative.

So watched the game today while taking down all the Christmas stuff. I don't think either stood out but they also did not make any mistakes that I saw. What did anyone else see?

Looks like Daniel Jeremiah's top 50: 2021 NFL Draft prospect rankings 1.0 posted on the 26th.

46) James Hudson, OT
School: Cincinnati | Year: Junior (RS)

Hudson is an athletic left tackle. He has very quick feet in his set and uses a powerful inside-hand punch to steer and control defenders in pass protection. He does need to play with more consistent knee bend. He can get too upright at times. He's at his best in the run game. He excels on the back side, using his outstanding quickness to reach and cut off defenders. He's also very good working up to the second level. Zone-run teams are going to love him because of his quickness and athleticism. He's also a very good finisher. Hudson hasn't generated a lot of buzz in personnel circles to this point, but I'm a believer in his skill set. He will be a quality starting tackle.

Everyone buys BearcatMan a beer if Hudson goes in the second

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Hudson had a great week and good game yesterday playing OT:

https://www.dallascowboys.com/news/senio...line-depth

"The talent and depth of the O-Line class is impressive.

If the talent at the Senior Bowl is any indication, the 2021 class is loaded with talent along the frontline. Teams in need of offensive linemen should be able to find blue-chip players throughout based on the talent and depth at offensive tackle and offensive guard/center. At the Senior Bowl, the impressive performances of Cincinnati's James Hudson, East Carolina's D'Ante Smith, Oklahoma's Creed Humphrey, and Wisconsin-Watewater's Quinn Meinerz only confirm the outstanding collection of talent of available in the 2021 draft.

Smith and Hudson have dazzled evaluators with their athleticism, balance, and body control. Each edge blocker has been able to stonewall pass rushers in one-on-one drills and their success has continued in competitive team sessions. Smith, in particular, has displayed the patience, versatility, and punch that scouts covet in "swing" players (offensive guard/offensive tackle)."

I calmly predict Double Nickel in the second round. Hudson has a good pass blocking one armed punch. Not bad for the first Bearcat to play in the Senior Bowl. I didn't see him play in the Reese's Senior Bowl and during the game it took five minutes to find out he was playing for the National Team. Still don't know his number in the game. Nats had a black helmet RT in the 1st quarter, but it wasn't him. I shoulda looked for an OT with short arms! It fun to watch hims on running left replays during the season. On one play he twisted his body into a "dollar sign" while screening off the RLB. We will see him next year.

He was number 55. Played with his normal shirt hanging out under his jersey. Was a white shirt under the dark jersey. Played the 2nd quarter mostly and maybe some of the 4th.

From ESPN+

While many aspects of the pre-NFL draft process can get overrated in their importance, the Senior Bowl is not one of them. It's one of the few settings in which evaluators can see future NFL players going against future NFL players without the advent of a superior scheme or surrounding cast. More than 120 prospects went against each other at practice on Tuesday, Wednesday and Thursday, culminating in the game on Saturday afternoon.

There's a long history of under-the-radar standouts such as Tampa Bay guard Ali Marpet, Washington receiver Terry McLaurin and Carolina safety Jeremy Chinn proving early in their NFL career that what they did in Mobile, Alabama, wasn't a fluke.

Here are 10 prospects from the 2021 class who raised and lowered their draft stock at the Senior Bowl:

Biggest risers from the week

Demetric Felton, RB, UCLA
Richie Grant, S, UCF
Quinn Meinerz, C/G, Wisconsin-Whitewater
Tre Brown, CB, Oklahoma
James Hudson, OT, Cincinnati
Hudson was a former highly recruited defensive lineman for Michigan before flipping to the offensive side of the ball and transferring to Cincinnati. That defensive-line type of athleticism is still present, and he has made massive strides in his technique in a short period.

At the Senior Bowl, Hudson showed how easily he could mirror speed rushers and finished with an 88% win percentage in the one-on-ones for the week -- the best of any offensive lineman in Mobile. With Hudson's physical ability developing so quickly, he looks like a top-50 pick who could sneak into the first round.

How sweet would a first round pick be for Hudson and the Bearcats? Unlikely but possible I suppose.

Somewhat related, will the beleaguered Bengals do anything to fix the O line and could Hudson land at PBS?

Hudson is shooting up the draft boards. Sounds like he has a legit chance to sneak into the first round. But I'm thinking he is a 2nd rounder most likely and I think he could be a steal.

#5 pick in second round (37 overall).

(02-01-2021 09:03 AM)bearcatdp Wrote:  #5 pick in second round (37 overall).

Right they take Chase with the first pick and they take Hudson with the second.

I will lose my damn mind if the Bengals don't go OL with the first pick.

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I am rooting hard for Hudson. I just wish he would have had this great performance in the Peach Bowl instead of the Senior Bowl.

(02-01-2021 04:48 PM)Cataclysmo Wrote:  I will lose my damn mind if the Bengals don't go OL with the first pick.

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This draft is so deep in OL, I hope they trade the pick. If Devonta Smith and Penei Sewell are available, they could get a kings ransom for the pick.