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Which Rival Is The Most Important?
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Tomball Owl Offline
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Post: #61
RE: Which Rival Is The Most Important?
(01-01-2021 09:43 AM)OptimisticOwl Wrote:  
(01-01-2021 03:14 AM)75src Wrote:  The games against Texas, LSU, and A&M were important in the 1950s and 1960s.

(12-31-2020 11:03 AM)OptimisticOwl Wrote:  
(12-31-2020 10:17 AM)Owl 69/70/75 Wrote:  Nobody considers Rice a significant rival. Let that marinate for a few minutes?

How bad is that? And we did it to ourselves.

Who considered us a significant rival in the 50's and 60's? I don't think we were high on anybody's list of must win games back then, either. I never heard anybody point to the Rice weekend like the Aggies and Teasips pointed to Thanksgiving.

Were they important to the Teasips, Aggies, and Tigers, anymore than any other game? Nobody made plans to attend the XXX-Rice game because it was the BIG game.

I am sure the Buckeyes will pack the stadium for Purdue or Northwestern, but there is no doubt that the BIG game is Michigan.

We have never been anybody's BIG game on an year-in, year-out basis. No use lamenting the loss of a status we never had.

Plenty of LSU fans showed up every other year in the mid-70s to see the Tigers play the Owls on a Sept Saturday night. Many arrived on Thursday in their RVs to start “preparing” for Saturday night.

55,000 at HRS in 1974.
(This post was last modified: 01-01-2021 01:29 PM by Tomball Owl.)
01-01-2021 01:19 PM
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OptimisticOwl Offline
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Post: #62
RE: Which Rival Is The Most Important?
(01-01-2021 01:19 PM)Tomball Owl Wrote:  
(01-01-2021 09:43 AM)OptimisticOwl Wrote:  
(01-01-2021 03:14 AM)75src Wrote:  The games against Texas, LSU, and A&M were important in the 1950s and 1960s.

(12-31-2020 11:03 AM)OptimisticOwl Wrote:  
(12-31-2020 10:17 AM)Owl 69/70/75 Wrote:  Nobody considers Rice a significant rival. Let that marinate for a few minutes?

How bad is that? And we did it to ourselves.

Who considered us a significant rival in the 50's and 60's? I don't think we were high on anybody's list of must win games back then, either. I never heard anybody point to the Rice weekend like the Aggies and Teasips pointed to Thanksgiving.

Were they important to the Teasips, Aggies, and Tigers, anymore than any other game? Nobody made plans to attend the XXX-Rice game because it was the BIG game.

I am sure the Buckeyes will pack the stadium for Purdue or Northwestern, but there is no doubt that the BIG game is Michigan.

We have never been anybody's BIG game on an year-in, year-out basis. No use lamenting the loss of a status we never had.

Plenty of LSU fans showed up every other year in the mid-70s to see the Tigers play the Owls on a Sept Saturday night. Many arrived on Thursday in their RVs to start “preparing” for Saturday night.

55,000 at HRS in 1974.

Yeah, and I remember going to some of the 1960's games. In fact, my first game as a freshmen, we freshmen marched to the stadium chanting "5, 4, 3, 2, beat the hell out of LSU".

But did the LSU fans come because LSU was playing RICE, or just because LSU was playing? Was anybody saying, if I can go to only one LSU game this year, I had better make it the RICE game because they are our rivals?

I once went to Ames, Iowa to see Rice play - that did not make Iowa State a rivalry game for Rice.

When it is a rivalry game, it is because the opponent has special significance. I don't think any LSU fans thought Rice had special significance.
01-01-2021 02:11 PM
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ruowls Offline
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Post: #63
RE: Which Rival Is The Most Important?
(01-01-2021 02:11 PM)OptimisticOwl Wrote:  
(01-01-2021 01:19 PM)Tomball Owl Wrote:  
(01-01-2021 09:43 AM)OptimisticOwl Wrote:  
(01-01-2021 03:14 AM)75src Wrote:  The games against Texas, LSU, and A&M were important in the 1950s and 1960s.

(12-31-2020 11:03 AM)OptimisticOwl Wrote:  Who considered us a significant rival in the 50's and 60's? I don't think we were high on anybody's list of must win games back then, either. I never heard anybody point to the Rice weekend like the Aggies and Teasips pointed to Thanksgiving.

Were they important to the Teasips, Aggies, and Tigers, anymore than any other game? Nobody made plans to attend the XXX-Rice game because it was the BIG game.

I am sure the Buckeyes will pack the stadium for Purdue or Northwestern, but there is no doubt that the BIG game is Michigan.

We have never been anybody's BIG game on an year-in, year-out basis. No use lamenting the loss of a status we never had.

Plenty of LSU fans showed up every other year in the mid-70s to see the Tigers play the Owls on a Sept Saturday night. Many arrived on Thursday in their RVs to start “preparing” for Saturday night.

55,000 at HRS in 1974.

Yeah, and I remember going to some of the 1960's games. In fact, my first game as a freshmen, we freshmen marched to the stadium chanting "5, 4, 3, 2, beat the hell out of LSU".

But did the LSU fans come because LSU was playing RICE, or just because LSU was playing? Was anybody saying, if I can go to only one LSU game this year, I had better make it the RICE game because they are our rivals?

I once went to Ames, Iowa to see Rice play - that did not make Iowa State a rivalry game for Rice.

When it is a rivalry game, it is because the opponent has special significance. I don't think any LSU fans thought Rice had special significance.

Well....

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Notre_Dame...ll_rivalry

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Notre_Dame...ll_rivalry

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Notre_Dame...ll_rivalry

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Navy%E2%80...ll_rivalry

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Holy_War_(...otre_Dame)

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Notre_Dame..._rivalries

So I am confused. Is it: USC, Navy, Stanford, Purdue, Michigan, Michigan Sate, Northwestern, Army, Pittsburgh, or Boston College.
01-01-2021 02:25 PM
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Tomball Owl Offline
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Post: #64
RE: Which Rival Is The Most Important?
Because of the size difference between Rice and almost anybody else the Owls play, especially the ESUs, Rice will never have rivals like UT/OU, UT/TAMU, Bama/Auburn, OSU/Michigan, etc. It doesn’t mean these weren’t games to which both sides looked forward. I’m thinking Rice vs UT/TAMU/LSU when I was in school. Those schools loved kicking nerd butts, and Rice loved the possibility of pulling off an upset.
01-01-2021 02:33 PM
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OptimisticOwl Offline
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Post: #65
RE: Which Rival Is The Most Important?
(01-01-2021 02:33 PM)Tomball Owl Wrote:  Because of the size difference between Rice and almost anybody else the Owls play, especially the ESUs, Rice will never have rivals like UT/OU, UT/TAMU, Bama/Auburn, OSU/Michigan, etc. It doesn’t mean these weren’t games to which both sides looked forward. I’m thinking Rice vs UT/TAMU/LSU when I was in school. Those schools loved kicking nerd butts, and Rice loved the possibility of pulling off an upset.

Not sure when you were in school, but just wanting to win (kick nerd butts) does not make it a rivalry game IMO. Everybody always wants to win.
01-01-2021 02:54 PM
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Tomball Owl Offline
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Post: #66
RE: Which Rival Is The Most Important?
(01-01-2021 02:54 PM)OptimisticOwl Wrote:  
(01-01-2021 02:33 PM)Tomball Owl Wrote:  Because of the size difference between Rice and almost anybody else the Owls play, especially the ESUs, Rice will never have rivals like UT/OU, UT/TAMU, Bama/Auburn, OSU/Michigan, etc. It doesn’t mean these weren’t games to which both sides looked forward. I’m thinking Rice vs UT/TAMU/LSU when I was in school. Those schools loved kicking nerd butts, and Rice loved the possibility of pulling off an upset.

Not sure when you were in school, but just wanting to win (kick nerd butts) does not make it a rivalry game IMO. Everybody always wants to win.

73-77. Kicking nerd butts /= to just winning IMO.

And I’m not arguing these were rivalry games. I already said the size difference of almost any school and Rice makes rivalries unlikely. I am saying they were big games for both schools. Semantics I guess.
01-01-2021 03:09 PM
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Owl 69/70/75 Online
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Post: #67
RE: Which Rival Is The Most Important?
When we were beating them repeatedly when we weren't supposed to do so, I think they considered them big games. When we stopped beating them and started getting blown out every time, I think they no longer considered us rivals. Would UT/OU remain a big rivalry game if one of them started winning all the time? I think not.

Trying to back into where were were then from where we are now simply ignores how much the fortunes of both schools, particularly Rice, have changed.
01-01-2021 04:25 PM
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Ourland Offline
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Post: #68
RE: Which Rival Is The Most Important?
(01-01-2021 09:43 AM)OptimisticOwl Wrote:  
(01-01-2021 03:14 AM)75src Wrote:  The games against Texas, LSU, and A&M were important in the 1950s and 1960s.

(12-31-2020 11:03 AM)OptimisticOwl Wrote:  
(12-31-2020 10:17 AM)Owl 69/70/75 Wrote:  Nobody considers Rice a significant rival. Let that marinate for a few minutes?

How bad is that? And we did it to ourselves.

Who considered us a significant rival in the 50's and 60's? I don't think we were high on anybody's list of must win games back then, either. I never heard anybody point to the Rice weekend like the Aggies and Teasips pointed to Thanksgiving.

Were they important to the Teasips, Aggies, and Tigers, anymore than any other game? Nobody made plans to attend the XXX-Rice game because it was the BIG game.

I am sure the Buckeyes will pack the stadium for Purdue or Northwestern, but there is no doubt that the BIG game is Michigan.

We have never been anybody's BIG game on an year-in, year-out basis. No use lamenting the loss of a status we never had.

This is why I think Tulane and SMU have so much potential to be meaningful rivals of Rice. We're nextdoor neighbors, and we're like-minded. However, I do not, under any circumstances, see us getting into the AAC.
01-01-2021 10:14 PM
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Owl 69/70/75 Online
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Post: #69
RE: Which Rival Is The Most Important?
If we played TexasU every year for 30 years, and won half of them, we'd be a rival. That's where we were after beating them in Austin my freshman year. What a lot of people don't realize is that when Jess retired, Rice had more wins over TexasU than did any other school. More than OU, more than aTm, more than anybody else.

5 years later, after getting blown out in 4 straight, we were no longer a rival.
(This post was last modified: 01-02-2021 10:21 AM by Owl 69/70/75.)
01-02-2021 10:19 AM
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OptimisticOwl Offline
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Post: #70
RE: Which Rival Is The Most Important?
Sometimes coaches get fired despite overall good records they have not done well against the rival. It certainly adds weight toward a push for a new coach.

I don’t think anybody was ever fired for a poor record against Rice, despite overall good results.

One measure of whether or not we are a rival is the number of opposing fans who say something like “I don’t care if we go 1-11 as long as the win is against Rice”. I don’t think those words have ever been uttered by anybody, anywhere.
01-02-2021 10:48 AM
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Hambone10 Offline
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Post: #71
RE: Which Rival Is The Most Important?
A big part of making something a rivalry is having students and alumni get into the games.

In the old SWC, students were highly engaged. I don't mean there were thousands of them, I just mean that clever chants, references to local politics or politicians and ESU vs 'Vine Covered U' references were aplenty. None of those references make much sense anymore... so the jokes aren't as funny... they aren't as interesting... most of us don't have many family members or co-workers who attended CUSA schools outside of Texas, etc etc etc.

What makes games a rivalry is that the people involved care about the outcome. Even if it is 'against the spread' as opposed to 'heads up', it is the familiarity and commonality that makes a rivalry.
01-05-2021 10:41 AM
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Post: #72
RE: Which Rival Is The Most Important?
(01-05-2021 10:41 AM)Hambone10 Wrote:  A big part of making something a rivalry is having students and alumni get into the games.

In the old SWC, students were highly engaged. I don't mean there were thousands of them, I just mean that clever chants, references to local politics or politicians and ESU vs 'Vine Covered U' references were aplenty. None of those references make much sense anymore... so the jokes aren't as funny... they aren't as interesting... most of us don't have many family members or co-workers who attended CUSA schools outside of Texas, etc etc etc.

What makes games a rivalry is that the people involved care about the outcome. Even if it is 'against the spread' as opposed to 'heads up', it is the familiarity and commonality that makes a rivalry.
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01-06-2021 10:37 PM
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owl at the moon Offline
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Post: #73
Which Rival Is The Most Important?
(01-02-2021 10:48 AM)OptimisticOwl Wrote:  Sometimes coaches get fired despite overall good records they have not done well against the rival. It certainly adds weight toward a push for a new coach.

I don’t think anybody was ever fired for a poor record against Rice, despite overall good results.

One measure of whether or not we are a rival is the number of opposing fans who say something like “I don’t care if we go 1-11 as long as the win is against Rice”. I don’t think those words have ever been uttered by anybody, anywhere.


But it has been said “we should never lose to Rice in anything”.

UH is still a good rivalry because we have something they crave... the prestige. Even though they have gotten ahead of us in more sports than I’d care to admit.
01-11-2021 01:12 PM
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