slhNavy91
Heisman
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RE: Army left out of bowl season?
(12-21-2020 06:51 PM)brovol Wrote: (12-21-2020 05:44 PM)slhNavy91 Wrote: (12-21-2020 04:58 PM)brovol Wrote: (12-21-2020 03:43 PM)slhNavy91 Wrote: (12-21-2020 03:06 PM)brovol Wrote: Monken's comments then were a reflection of his, West Point's, and the Army fan base belief that being in ANY conference would conflict with what Army football has liked to do; play different schools throughout the country every year. Army tried playing in a conference once, and obviously failed there in a big way. Timing probably wasn't the best then, but the experience isn't something anyone associated with Army football cares to go back to.
If Army was going to join a conference, there are several reasons the AAC would be a poor choice. First and foremost, the AAC, in my mind at least, is too strong, from top to bottom, for Army to compete at a consistently high enough level. Right now Army can schedule some top level football schools, but also enough "not-so-tough" games to balance the season, and always have a good shot at avoiding too many terrible record years. In the AAC that simply isn't possible, and Army simply cant recruit the type of players most AAC schools can draw. Further, the geographical footprint of the AAC is quite broad, and would take a toll on the Cadets (even football players at West Point have a ton on their plate in addition to practices). But in truth, the AAC is probably just a bit out of reach for Army athletically (and that isnt even addressing the other sports, where Army would likely struggle even more). The AAC is probably a bit too good.
As for the Monken being fake with his passion, toughness or emotion; that contention is pure uninformed, and likely biassed, BS. The guy is as genuine as anyone in college sports. He is the real deal. I sense those comments, instead, to have been made with a tone of bitterness from a rival fan who perhaps got used to beating Army prior to Monken's arrival at West Point, and who is currently stinging from the latest "setback" two weekends ago. I recommend sleep and a couple aspirin to give your pride a chance to recover brother. These things take time. Be at peace. But until then; Go ARMY! Beat Navy!!
Great. The bronie is back.
Was your cadet '20, or '21? Either way, congratulations - belated or anticipatory.
You say that the AAC footprint is too broad, but Monken's quote about the AAC was "We're NATIONAL!" so you need to check the talking points and toe the party line better. Basically it amounted to Army saying they want to play UTSA for Texas recruiting and could never join the AAC (which would give them annual, or two years out of four, Texas games). Rational thinkers see through it...Army West Point fans eat it up.
The Monken issue is multifaceted - he was on the Navy staff under Paul Johnson after all. (Don't ever forget that Army West Point had to go to the Navy coaching tree to re-take even modest success. Like I said, that 14 year streak left scars.) Niumat and Monken were good friends, going back to Hawaii days when Monken was a defensive grad assistant and Niumat was qb then grad assistant. Monken's WWE shtick ... that wasn't around in UH or Navy days - don't even recall it at Georgia Tech when he was one of the minority of assistants who went with PJ instead of staying with Niumat. I can find you the youtube of Army week press Zoom where Niumat is asked about the friendship and the response is basically "we were, not so much now."
And you didn't really address the point I made about being all "anyone, anytime, in the parking lot" but not ponying up to get BYU RE-scheduled in one of two weeks you had an opportunity. Maybe Coastal are actually the "national champions of toughness."
Army fans got all quivery when "Supe Daddy" LTG Caslen rode the chopper onto Michie, or when Monken was all motivated motivated motivated sir!!! in boots and utes on GameDay. They don't like to talk about Monken going into the stands to chastise the Cadets who were cheering for Georgia Southern because morale is so low at having second rate food, and being TV props in the stands while the Brave Old Army Team was staying in the Thayer Hotel.
They definitely don't like to talk about the culture problems evidenced by this:
https://www.thedailybeast.com/west-point...tion-found
or this:
https://www.thedailybeast.com/cadet-run-...ck-of-rape
Congrats on 9th CiC Trophy (compared to 16 here and 20 for the Zoomies). We'll get it back next year.
My son was a 2020 grad, and thank you for the congratulations. He is an armor 2nd Lt, training at Ft Benning, Ranger school to follow.
The AAC footprint would require Army to play the same teams each year, as opposed to playing a few different schools around the country every year, as well as some regional schools which aren't as strong as most AAC teams. There is a very relevant distinction. Army recognizes what it is, what it isn't, and understands the challenges it would have in the AAC. This is in part due to experiencing many humbling football seasons. Humility has never been something Annapolis or it's fan base "gets", even during times when it should come easily, so the perspective you share comes as no surprise.
I don't see what point you move to make regarding Monken's history with Navy, or it's coaching tree. Has little to do with whether the AAC would be a good fit for the Black Knights. Army did learn from the successes of Navy, and made decisions based on what it learned. now Army seems to have Navy's number. No??
Sup Daddy rode the Harley into the stadium (I was there) because it was presented to him and West Point by the family of a Cadet who died saving the life of a stranger who was drowning the summer before. The family loved (and still loves) West Point, and appreciated how General Caslen handled the situation. It was an inspirational moment, and was also really cool, somewhat because Gen Caslen is a bonafide badass, and everyone at West Point knows it. Not having a comparable leadership situation at Navy, I can give you a pass on the inability to empathize.
As for the GSU game, you speak out of school. "The Cadets" were not rooting for GSU in that game; a "few" Cadets were upset that the football team was staying at the Thayer Hotel on base, rather than in the barracks, and presumably had more privileges than the rest of the Corps, who have been very contained this year, and decided, stupidly, to make their point by cheering for the opponent on a couple plays. Most of the Corps was upset by the actions of those few, but of course folks with limited insight will cite that as if it reflects upon the whole. It doesn't.
Listen, we both apparently are passionate about our preferred academy. I root for Navy most games, and even especially against AF. Don't let your recent losses to Army make you sound more bitter and upset than you should probably be. Every 25 years or so you should get a player like Malcolm Perry, and so in 19 years or you should get another win against Army. You just lost 4 out of the last 5 to the Black Knights. This will get easier for you in time.
You absolutely prove my point of Army West Point fans eating up the shtick of Monken and Caslen (I've met your SupeDaddy; I disagree with your fanboy position). Service culture and organizational culture are what they are. I've been in joint positions for about half of my thirty year active duty Navy career, so I can speak to the foibles of all the services. Big Green, and West Point specifically, are ripe for Cult of Personality hero worship stituations. Navy service culture and USNA have their own different issues too.
You skipped over the BYU non-re-schedule proving the phoniness of the anytime-anywhere tough guy routine.
Multiple family friends in the USMA Class of '21. I'll stand by the story - morale was low in the Corps writ large in part due (obviously not solely) to the special, privileged treatment that King Football gave that one team. More than a few. And the point isn't how many Cadets cheered for Georgia Southern...the point is the football head coach and the three-star general left the sidelines for the stands to chew them out. It's a bad look. Then LTG Williams looked like an undignified fool for the remainder of the game going over the top rah-rah cheerleader. Sad.
Nothing on the football-win-at-all-costs attitude due to the streak leading to a corrupt culture as the Daily Beast articles highlight?
A little recent history check for you - The Army West Point Black Knight Mule Cadets of the Hudson have won 4 of the last 19. If you think Malcolm Perry is once in every 25 years, you weren't paying attention to Keenan Reynolds, all time FBS TD Record Holder with 88 TDs 2012-2015, four wins in four starts over Army, and fifth place Heisman vote getter in 2015. That was a little more recent than 25 years, but I also know stuff from way back in 2015 pre-dates an Army football fan for four or five years. I expect the next nineteen years will look about like the last nineteen overall.
Good luck to 2LT Brovol, in Ranger School and after.
Do you find most Navy football fans to be toolbags? Or are the others different?
In all honesty, I remembered I found you to be soft as ten-ply four years ago, and I edited out a couple things to be careful about your feewings.
I'll repeat my congratulations on Army's CiC this year.
I'll repeat that I'm glad the 9 win Army team gets the Liberty bowl.
I'll repeat my sincere best wishes for your son as he embarks on his Army career.
And to you I find myself once again saying good luck and goodbye.
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