I notice that "goodknightfl" has posted a response to one of my posts, yet again.

I put him on my ignore list because he was so disrespectful, indeed vicious at times.

Hopefully, he has seen the light and realizes that there is no point in being "Mr. Negativity" any longer, because life is too short and too precious to waste.

(01-06-2021 01:43 AM)TroyTBoy Wrote:  

(01-05-2021 05:56 PM)Wedge Wrote:  That's the wrong premise, because moving from the MWC to the AAC is a small step, whereas moving from the AAC to the Big 12 is a giant leap. (h/t Neil Armstrong)

If Boise State or UCF was offered the Big 12 for football only, then that is the kind of upgrade in money and status that would cause them to strongly consider dropping all of their other sports off at an orphanage, so to speak. If an athletic department makes a move like that, they are burning their bridges with every donor and potential donor who cares about any of the school's sports other than football.

There are no small steps.

Everyone realizes that the landscape can/will change dramatically in the next 5 years, and justifying your spot in the next iteration of BCS/NY6/??? is a LOT easier when you are in the top 6 conferences versus 7-8-9-10-11??

There was ALWAYS going to be some consolidation in the non-autonomy leagues to increase strength in numbers/brands. Anyone who thinks the strongest non-autonomy brands wouldn't find each other just has a narrow view of what's going on. We saw this in the BCS era when TCU kept changing leagues.

TCU was in a much more fluid situation; being in the central time zone they could easily move east or west. Hence, it was their choice to send their teams to the Mountain and Pacific time zones.

Boise State (all-sports) moving east puts a strain on the majority of the athletic programs existing in the AAC East, because those programs will have to send their teams out there and that is why Boise State is not yet a full member of the AAC. The totality of their athletic department is not worth the traveling and logistical strain to at least five schools, but their football program could help.

(01-06-2021 04:07 AM)jedclampett Wrote:  1. Schools such as Belmont and New Mexico State have proven that recruiting doesn't "dry up" for perennial NCAA tournament schools from the conferences that have typically sent only one team to the tournament.

Moreover, Boise State has long surprised observers with its recruiting potential. Few would suggest that Boise State FB's recruiting would "dry up" if they were to play in the MAC.

Football and basketball are much different sports, and we all know that. The two can't be compared so in this instance, we must look at basketball. Boise State's success has been one regular season title and two NCAA berths this past decade, arguably in the absolute nadir of the Mountain West conference. Leon Rice has been a consistent coach, and I argue the success can be attributed to him, as much of the success in college basketball is based on the coach and their consistency. For every VCU and Dayton that has consistently hired great coaches, I can find a UNLV, UAB, and UMass that hasn't, and those programs have suffered.

(01-06-2021 04:07 AM)jedclampett Wrote:  Playing in a less prestigious conference can have varying effects (such as making it easier to get a NCAA bid), and doesn't automatically cause recruiting to dry up. The top recruits within a conference tend to gravitate to the top programs in the conference, which can sustain their recruiting by making repeat trips to the NCAA and NIT tournaments.

Boise State basketball is not hauling in amazing crops of recruits at this point and I doubt joining the Big West or WAC will really hurt them there. I don't believe joining either of those leagues will affect their NCAA chances either, considering they went 23-7 a few years ago and missed the Dance. I also don't think it's guaranteed they would dominate the Big Sky, nor do I believe the athletic department has any desire to re-join that conference.

Bottomline: Boise State needs to think long and hard about the future of their Olympic sports programs because I doubt the Mountain West in its current formation will be inviting the Broncos back into the fold if the AAC experiment doesn't work out.

https://footballscoop.com/news/troy-aikm...d-it-down/

According to Troy Aikman, Kellen Moore was offered, accepted and then turned down the Boise State job. "“What I’ve been told was that he had been offered the job and he accepted the job,” Aikman said. “Then as they were working out some details there was a bit of a disagreement. It was then that Kellen backed out of the deal because he questioned the overall commitment of the university in supporting the football program and his opportunity to have success.

Doesn't sound like Boise State is on the cusp of joining the AAC in the near-future. Perhaps a year from now, maybe never, but nothing imminent.

(01-06-2021 01:10 PM)GoldenWarrior11 Wrote:  https://footballscoop.com/news/troy-aikm...d-it-down/

According to Troy Aikman, Kellen Moore was offered, accepted and then turned down the Boise State job. "“What I’ve been told was that he had been offered the job and he accepted the job,” Aikman said. “Then as they were working out some details there was a bit of a disagreement. It was then that Kellen backed out of the deal because he questioned the overall commitment of the university in supporting the football program and his opportunity to have success.

Doesn't sound like Boise State is on the cusp of joining the AAC in the near-future. Perhaps a year from now, maybe never, but nothing imminent.

Im not sure how your get to that take. It sounds to me more like it means in the negotiations Boise probably would not give him the salary or assistant pool fund he felt was necessary to create the staff he desired.

(01-06-2021 01:44 PM)Attackcoog Wrote:  

(01-06-2021 01:10 PM)GoldenWarrior11 Wrote:  https://footballscoop.com/news/troy-aikm...d-it-down/

According to Troy Aikman, Kellen Moore was offered, accepted and then turned down the Boise State job. "“What I’ve been told was that he had been offered the job and he accepted the job,” Aikman said. “Then as they were working out some details there was a bit of a disagreement. It was then that Kellen backed out of the deal because he questioned the overall commitment of the university in supporting the football program and his opportunity to have success.

Doesn't sound like Boise State is on the cusp of joining the AAC in the near-future. Perhaps a year from now, maybe never, but nothing imminent.

Im not sure how your get to that take. It sounds to me more like it means in the negotiations Boise probably would not give him the salary or assistant pool fund he felt was necessary to create the staff he desired.

Sounds like money for assistant coaches, at least the way Aikman is spinning it. Maybe Moore wanted a P5-sized budget for assistants and had some guys in mind. If that's what he wants, it's not the kind of thing that can be fixed in either the MWC or AAC; it would take a much larger revenue stream.

Add Boise, AF, and Colorado St all sports.

West:
Boise St
AF
Colorado St
Tulsa
SMU
Houston
Navy / Wichita St.

East:
Temple
Tulane
UCF
USF
Cinn
ECU
Memphis

BYU thinks they are too good for the AAC.
Keep the annual Tulane - Navy game in the cross overs for FB.

Im pretty sure we are just looking for one team right now. Down the line---who knows?

(01-06-2021 01:10 PM)GoldenWarrior11 Wrote:  https://footballscoop.com/news/troy-aikm...d-it-down/

Doesn't sound like Boise State is on the cusp of joining the AAC in the near-future.

Having a prospective Head Coach turn down the job doesn't have anything to do with whether or not Boise State is going to join the AAC.

Their failure to find a basketball/olympics conference does have something to do with it, but for all we know, Boise State hasn't abandoned their interest in joining the AAC.

(01-06-2021 02:07 PM)panite Wrote:  Add Boise, AF, and Colorado St all sports.

West:
Boise St
AF
Colorado St
Tulsa
SMU
Houston
Navy / Wichita St.

East:
Temple
Tulane
UCF
USF
Cinn
ECU
Memphis

BYU thinks they are too good for the AAC.
Keep the annual Tulane - Navy game in the cross overs for FB.

(01-06-2021 05:17 AM)jedclampett Wrote:  

(01-06-2021 04:08 AM)AllTideUp Wrote:  

(01-06-2021 01:43 AM)TroyTBoy Wrote:  

(01-05-2021 05:56 PM)Wedge Wrote:  That's the wrong premise, because moving from the MWC to the AAC is a small step, whereas moving from the AAC to the Big 12 is a giant leap. (h/t Neil Armstrong)

If Boise State or UCF was offered the Big 12 for football only, then that is the kind of upgrade in money and status that would cause them to strongly consider dropping all of their other sports off at an orphanage, so to speak. If an athletic department makes a move like that, they are burning their bridges with every donor and potential donor who cares about any of the school's sports other than football.

There are no small steps.

Everyone realizes that the landscape can/will change dramatically in the next 5 years, and justifying your spot in the next iteration of BCS/NY6/??? is a LOT easier when you are in the top 6 conferences versus 7-8-9-10-11??

There was ALWAYS going to be some consolidation in the non-autonomy leagues to increase strength in numbers/brands. Anyone who thinks the strongest non-autonomy brands wouldn't find each other just has a narrow view of what's going on. We saw this in the BCS era when TCU kept changing leagues.

The difference in this situation is that AAC membership really won't help that much. That should be considered simply because the Big 12 could collapse within 4 years. That's within the timeline of Boise losing their special status in the Mountain West.

Given that potentiality, there's really no reason to do anything drastic this year or anytime soon until the Big 12 question is answered.

I would agree with you if the WCC was an option for Boise State sports, but if it's not then there's really no reason to create a lot of upheaval. The WAC or other leagues aren't going to help Boise State with their Olympic sports. That is especially true given that if the Big 12 disintegrates then Boise could be on the move again before the next recruiting class even graduates.

If I'm Boise then I consider independence or maybe football membership in the AAC if I can get my olympic sports into the WCC. If not then it's best to wait because nothing is lost.

The idea that Boise should play it safe and wait for a better situation because the Big 12 might "disintegrate" in 4 years certainly wasn't found persuasive by Boise State's administration.

Although it might be conceivable that "the landscape (could) change dramatically in the next 5 years," there are few indications that this is likely to happen.

In fact, seems equally possible that the P5 conferences will do as the SEC has done by simply renewing their broadcasting agreements and leaving it at that. The major networks have little motivation to shell out the vast new sums that would be required to expand the number of P5 schools, and the conferences have little incentive to increase the number of "mouths to feed" (i.e., conference schools to share their revenues with).

The Big 12's decision not to expand, a few years ago, may well be indicative of an enduring preference, which is unlikely to be reversed, and there haven't been any compelling indications that the Big 12 is on the verge of disintegrating. If there had been, the SEC might well have been involved, but as we have seen, they're moving on with no changes.

Finally, if the Big 12 should decide to add members, Boise St. wouldn't necessarily near the top of their list of expansion candidates, due to their less than stellar academic credentials and the fact that Boise hasn't yet established itself as more than quality football school.

Regardless, Boise State has weighed all of these considerations, and has decided to (preferably) switch to the AAC (FB) and another (BB/olympics) conference or - failing that - to remain in the MWC.

I wasn't talking about the Big 12 expanding, that's a very low likelihood. I'm talking about the possibility that Texas and Oklahoma could leave. If that happens then the Big 12 will likely reorganize and we'll have to see what the fallout is.

Currently, there are no indications that it will or won't happen, but there's no reason there would be. The Big 12 GOR prevents any open talk of movement.

So my point is that a significant reshuffling could come, but it won't be for another 4 years. If it doesn't happen then Boise State would be logical in pursuing the AAC, but their deal with the Mountain West won't expire before the Big 12 GOR.

Of course, you could argue that if the Big 12 breaks down then there will be a scramble among those interested in backfilling. At that point, AAC membership could give Boise State a leg up if there ends up being some sort of amalgamation of the two. I think that would be a fair point in favor of Boise pursuing the AAC now.

Nonetheless, we don't know for certain what Boise State is doing or not doing. We know what they have considered and perhaps they feel the Big 12 is stable. With certainty, we don't actually know if they want to move at all.

(01-06-2021 02:07 PM)panite Wrote:  Add Boise, AF, and Colorado St all sports.

West:
Boise St
AF
Colorado St
Tulsa
SMU
Houston
Navy / Wichita St.

East:
Temple
Tulane
UCF
USF
Cinn
ECU
Memphis

BYU thinks they are too good for the AAC.
Keep the annual Tulane - Navy game in the cross overs for FB.

Maybe San Diego St instead of Colorado St?

This would kill the MW as a competitor for best G5. AAC has been doing ok for a while though so they could probably just stay put if not forced to add another.

Why does the AAC want or need to kill the MWC? Shouldn’t they be a bit more worried about the Sun Belt at this point? Those schools are right in their backyard.

The MWC was once a very proud league in both major sports. It’s kind of sad what’s happened to it. Without looking it up, I can’t say the last time New Mexico and UNLV went dancing. Those two should be in the running every single season, and they were back when the conference was much stronger and included BYU and Utah.

(01-07-2021 10:27 AM)esayem Wrote:  Why does the AAC want or need to kill the MWC? Shouldn’t they be a bit more worried about the Sun Belt at this point? Those schools are right in their backyard.

You could say this about any conference feasting that occurs, like the Big East to ACC, or CUSA to BE/AAC. But, I think the meat of it is that those “next best” or similar/equal programs to the AAC are most concentrated in the MWC. Or, for hoops, A10.

I don’t fully disagree, though. However, do you see someone who poses a threat that doesn’t bring with it political issues? Like, App State should they continue to excel...how does ECU feel about that? Louisiana to Tulane?

(01-07-2021 10:27 AM)esayem Wrote:  Why does the AAC want or need to kill the MWC? Shouldn’t they be a bit more worried about the Sun Belt at this point? Those schools are right in their backyard.

The MWC was once a very proud league in both major sports. It’s kind of sad what’s happened to it. Without looking it up, I can’t say the last time New Mexico and UNLV went dancing. Those two should be in the running every single season, and they were back when the conference was much stronger and included BYU and Utah.

P6

Isnt that the ultimate goal?

The Sun Belt has had a couple nice seasons. Lets see how long they can keep it up.

(01-06-2021 03:35 PM)jedclampett Wrote:  

(01-06-2021 01:10 PM)GoldenWarrior11 Wrote:  https://footballscoop.com/news/troy-aikm...d-it-down/

Doesn't sound like Boise State is on the cusp of joining the AAC in the near-future.

Having a prospective Head Coach turn down the job doesn't have anything to do with whether or not Boise State is going to join the AAC.

Their failure to find a basketball/olympics conference does have something to do with it, but for all we know, Boise State hasn't abandoned their interest in joining the AAC.

No, but - regardless of whomever is the new head coach - a school is not making a drastic change, such as conference affiliation, for all of its sports with a brand new athletic director and a brand new head coach in the immediate-term. Sure it can and likely will be continued to be discussed, but there are much more important things for the school, and others, to be handling right now.

(01-07-2021 10:27 AM)esayem Wrote:  Why does the AAC want or need to kill the MWC? Shouldn’t they be a bit more worried about the Sun Belt at this point? Those schools are right in their backyard.

The MWC was once a very proud league in both major sports. It’s kind of sad what’s happened to it. Without looking it up, I can’t say the last time New Mexico and UNLV went dancing. Those two should be in the running every single season, and they were back when the conference was much stronger and included BYU and Utah.

Agree. The MW has nothing to do with it. You add Boise because, all else being equal, you’d prefer to be a 12 team league (no odd man out awkward scheduling) and Boise is one of only 3 or 4 teams (in the universe of G5/Indy schools) that actually adds to value and perception of the conference. Simple as that.

AAC goal of P6 status is closer to being achieved with a Boise, BYU, and either SDSU or Army/Gonzaga combo. Boise alone doesn’t move the needle all that much. Boise/BYU +1 does. Fold Army/Navy into the conference package. All BYU and Boise games into the package in addition to Army/Navy would likely trigger a media rights renegotiation. I think it doubles the value which still would be less than half the P5, but light years ahead of the G4

If the AAC, long-term, was able to acquire Army, Air Force (likely w/ CSU), Boise State and BYU, that 16-team league, I think has enough, collectively, to be assimilated-in as a power conference. No, it would not have a Texas, an Ohio State, an Alabama, etc. - a true power program - but it would have all of the service academies, a national brand in BYU, and top-25 programs in Houston, Cincinnati, Boise State, UCF and Memphis to undoubtedly push it over the hump. I don't envision SDSU coming along, unless they have another California travel partner to pair with. If Boise State can get BYU and AF (w/ CSU) to come along, at least there is a four-team quad to help for travel purposes for Olympics.

East
Army/VCU
Cincinnati
ECU
Temple

South
Memphis
Tulane
UCF
USF

West
Houston
Navy/Wichita State
SMU
Tulsa

Mountain
Air Force
Boise State
BYU
Colorado State

If the AAC wanted to get one more non-football programs to help balance the Army addition (like Navy), then you the league could also add VCU (Air Force is a full member in the MWC, so I'm assuming under this proposal that they would come along in-full as well). To note, Navy is in the West Division in order to remain paired with Houston and SMU, as they desire to play in Texas for recruiting purposes.

(01-07-2021 10:37 AM)The Cutter of Bish Wrote:  

(01-07-2021 10:27 AM)esayem Wrote:  Why does the AAC want or need to kill the MWC? Shouldn’t they be a bit more worried about the Sun Belt at this point? Those schools are right in their backyard.

You could say this about any conference feasting that occurs, like the Big East to ACC, or CUSA to BE/AAC. But, I think the meat of it is that those “next best” or similar/equal programs to the AAC are most concentrated in the MWC. Or, for hoops, A10.

Didn't the SWC start it by killing the Southwest Conference, or could you say the Big Ten and Big East almost killed the Atlantic 10?

I don't believe the ACC's original intent was to kill the Big East, they wanted Miami (not in the Big East's footprint anyway) and they wanted a championship game. They would have stayed at ten if the NCAA would have allowed it.

(01-07-2021 10:37 AM)The Cutter of Bish Wrote:  I don’t fully disagree, though. However, do you see someone who poses a threat that doesn’t bring with it political issues? Like, App State should they continue to excel...how does ECU feel about that? Louisiana to Tulane?

All good points.