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All Things Realignment 2.0
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C1ncy4Life Offline
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Post: #181
RE: All Things Realignment 2.0
(12-30-2020 06:34 PM)doss2 Wrote:  
(12-30-2020 06:24 PM)C1ncy4Life Wrote:  
(12-30-2020 06:28 AM)doss2 Wrote:  
(12-29-2020 11:32 PM)C1ncy4Life Wrote:  
(12-29-2020 11:13 PM)Dont tase me bro Wrote:  The goal for UC should be to get into a P5 league. If that's the goal, leave Boise (and everyone else) where they are.

That’s the goal, but considering there is no guarantee we will get to a P5 conference they should also do everything they can to better position the conference they are in moving forward.

Our P5 targets are ACC and B12. Boise's targets would be P12 and B12.

We are trending up, Boise trending down. No need to give them a life line. Unless there is a good #12 ditching Tulsa or Tulane would be good. Ten teams, play 9 conference and 3 OOC.

I think it improved the conference and with no guarantee of a P5 invite I would prefer we play on the best conference possible. Personally, I would think we would be ahead of Boise in potential P5 invites when you consider academics, media market, recruiting grounds, etc... I guess an argument could be made they have a stronger brand, but this isn’t our first NY6 and as you say, we are trending up and they are trending down.

Maybe I’m naive but I guess I’m not overly concerned they get a spot and we don’t.

One disagreement is The B12 does not care about academics as proved by inviting WVU. The ACC also does not care as proved by inviting UL.

The SEC does not care. Only the B10 and P12 do to a degree.

I think it’s too far to say they don’t care. If 2 programs are deemed equal in every other area they are surely going to pick the institution with better academics. That said, I agree that most conferences will make exceptions and especially the B12 doesn’t strike me as being concerned with Academics.

I still believe we are well ahead of Boise State in terms of a potential invite, but again, I may be naive and blinded by bias????
 
(This post was last modified: 12-31-2020 10:44 AM by C1ncy4Life.)
12-31-2020 10:44 AM
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CliftonAve Offline
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Post: #182
RE: All Things Realignment 2.0
(12-31-2020 10:44 AM)C1ncy4Life Wrote:  
(12-30-2020 06:34 PM)doss2 Wrote:  
(12-30-2020 06:24 PM)C1ncy4Life Wrote:  
(12-30-2020 06:28 AM)doss2 Wrote:  
(12-29-2020 11:32 PM)C1ncy4Life Wrote:  That’s the goal, but considering there is no guarantee we will get to a P5 conference they should also do everything they can to better position the conference they are in moving forward.

Our P5 targets are ACC and B12. Boise's targets would be P12 and B12.

We are trending up, Boise trending down. No need to give them a life line. Unless there is a good #12 ditching Tulsa or Tulane would be good. Ten teams, play 9 conference and 3 OOC.

I think it improved the conference and with no guarantee of a P5 invite I would prefer we play on the best conference possible. Personally, I would think we would be ahead of Boise in potential P5 invites when you consider academics, media market, recruiting grounds, etc... I guess an argument could be made they have a stronger brand, but this isn’t our first NY6 and as you say, we are trending up and they are trending down.

Maybe I’m naive but I guess I’m not overly concerned they get a spot and we don’t.

One disagreement is The B12 does not care about academics as proved by inviting WVU. The ACC also does not care as proved by inviting UL.

The SEC does not care. Only the B10 and P12 do to a degree.

I think it’s too far to say they don’t care. If 2 programs are deemed equal in every other area they are surely going to pick the institution with better academics. That said, I agree that most conferences will make exceptions and especially the B12 doesn’t strike me as being concerned with Academics.

I still believe we are well ahead of Boise State in terms of a potential invite, but again, I may be naive and blinded by bias????

The only thing that worries me is that they are BYU as option #1, and a western partner might make more sense than a school in our backyard. Additionally, as I have posted before I don’t think the B12 likes a school with our profile very much. Yes Boise is an urban public school too, but the old Metro Schools: UC, Louisville, Memphis and I will throw on Houston too, are just held under further scrutiny through no faults of their own by people living in rural America.
 
12-31-2020 10:50 AM
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dubcat14 Offline
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Post: #183
RE: All Things Realignment 2.0
Prefacing by saying no major news.. but:

https://sports.yahoo.com/after-college-f...58001.html

Pete Thamel recaps the season and believes realignment is inevitable for schools to recoup some of the money that was lost during the 2020 season.

"Perhaps more relevant to the prospect of a significant shakeup is the ACC’s untenable television deal that new commissioner Jim Phillips inherits. The ACC is locked up through 2035-36, and the fixed income of that contract essentially puts the league in cement financial shoes as its peers are poised to distance themselves from the ACC financially."


For UC, I think the biggest question or cause for concern is how the ACC goes about looking at potential schools.. considering no one would leave the Big Ten or SEC for the ACC, there's not really a good fit outside of Cincinnati. Someone who brings a new market, quality facilities, decent history..

Thamel also brings up the topic of playoff expansion but mentions: "Any change in the CFP would require a new contract, with significant financial commitment from ESPN and more years from the CFP. That would take the playoff off the market for any potential competing bids for the next playoff cycle, which means it comes with some risk. This is high-level chess with billions at stake."
 
01-13-2021 10:54 AM
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BearcatMan Offline
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Post: #184
RE: All Things Realignment 2.0
(01-13-2021 10:54 AM)dubcat14 Wrote:  Prefacing by saying no major news.. but:

https://sports.yahoo.com/after-college-f...58001.html

Pete Thamel recaps the season and believes realignment is inevitable for schools to recoup some of the money that was lost during the 2020 season.

"Perhaps more relevant to the prospect of a significant shakeup is the ACC’s untenable television deal that new commissioner Jim Phillips inherits. The ACC is locked up through 2035-36, and the fixed income of that contract essentially puts the league in cement financial shoes as its peers are poised to distance themselves from the ACC financially."


For UC, I think the biggest question or cause for concern is how the ACC goes about looking at potential schools.. considering no one would leave the Big Ten or SEC for the ACC, there's not really a good fit outside of Cincinnati. Someone who brings a new market, quality facilities, decent history..

Thamel also brings up the topic of playoff expansion but mentions: "Any change in the CFP would require a new contract, with significant financial commitment from ESPN and more years from the CFP. That would take the playoff off the market for any potential competing bids for the next playoff cycle, which means it comes with some risk. This is high-level chess with billions at stake."

ACC would only be able to renegotiate a deal if a school like Notre Dame joins. If that happens, I'm assuming they'd have a BIG say in who #16 would be, and I'm not too entirely confident they'd want us.
 
01-13-2021 10:58 AM
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CliftonAve Offline
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Post: #185
RE: All Things Realignment 2.0
(01-13-2021 10:58 AM)BearcatMan Wrote:  
(01-13-2021 10:54 AM)dubcat14 Wrote:  Prefacing by saying no major news.. but:

https://sports.yahoo.com/after-college-f...58001.html

Pete Thamel recaps the season and believes realignment is inevitable for schools to recoup some of the money that was lost during the 2020 season.

"Perhaps more relevant to the prospect of a significant shakeup is the ACC’s untenable television deal that new commissioner Jim Phillips inherits. The ACC is locked up through 2035-36, and the fixed income of that contract essentially puts the league in cement financial shoes as its peers are poised to distance themselves from the ACC financially."


For UC, I think the biggest question or cause for concern is how the ACC goes about looking at potential schools.. considering no one would leave the Big Ten or SEC for the ACC, there's not really a good fit outside of Cincinnati. Someone who brings a new market, quality facilities, decent history..

Thamel also brings up the topic of playoff expansion but mentions: "Any change in the CFP would require a new contract, with significant financial commitment from ESPN and more years from the CFP. That would take the playoff off the market for any potential competing bids for the next playoff cycle, which means it comes with some risk. This is high-level chess with billions at stake."

ACC would only be able to renegotiate a deal if a school like Notre Dame joins. If that happens, I'm assuming they'd have a BIG say in who #16 would be, and I'm not too entirely confident they'd want us.

Yep. The ACC is like the girl you ask out to the prom but she tells you she wants to wait for the most popular guy in school to ask her first. The ACC will never make a move as they are waiting on Notre Dame to make a move. If they have to wait forever they will. As you state, Notre Dame might not want us at #16--- there are other schools they have history with and right now it seems like they enjoy using UC as a feeder school to bring in coaches and what not.

OTOH, I don't see the Big XII making a move either. We have nothing in common with those schools in the Heartland, and I don't think they particular care much about us TBH. Other than a one-off series with Iowa State in hoops that was scheduled when we were still in the Big East, when have we ever had anything with a BXII school in football or basketball in the past 7-8 years. We have football games scheduled six years ahead in the future and we still can't get a BXII game. You would think if they valued us at all WVU, Iowa State, K-State, somebody would have made an effort to put us on the schedule.

Unless there are multiple changes that set off a wave of realignment and shifting of tides, I think we are stuck in the AAC.
 
01-13-2021 11:09 AM
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rath v2.0 Offline
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Post: #186
RE: All Things Realignment 2.0
Not happening. Any realignment will be among the G5. 25’ will come and go.
 
01-13-2021 11:09 AM
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BearcatMan Offline
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Post: #187
RE: All Things Realignment 2.0
(01-13-2021 11:09 AM)rath v2.0 Wrote:  Not happening. Any realignment will be among the G5. 25’ will come and go.

Yep, that's where I'm at too...G5 will become even more regional OR there will be one conference trying to create the most competitive group to potentially remove the "Best of G5" NY6 slot and replace it with one for their specific conference. The ceiling isn't opening above us...got to do what we can where we're at now.
 
01-13-2021 11:13 AM
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OKIcat Offline
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Post: #188
RE: All Things Realignment 2.0
(01-13-2021 10:58 AM)BearcatMan Wrote:  
(01-13-2021 10:54 AM)dubcat14 Wrote:  Prefacing by saying no major news.. but:

https://sports.yahoo.com/after-college-f...58001.html

Pete Thamel recaps the season and believes realignment is inevitable for schools to recoup some of the money that was lost during the 2020 season.

"Perhaps more relevant to the prospect of a significant shakeup is the ACC’s untenable television deal that new commissioner Jim Phillips inherits. The ACC is locked up through 2035-36, and the fixed income of that contract essentially puts the league in cement financial shoes as its peers are poised to distance themselves from the ACC financially."


For UC, I think the biggest question or cause for concern is how the ACC goes about looking at potential schools.. considering no one would leave the Big Ten or SEC for the ACC, there's not really a good fit outside of Cincinnati. Someone who brings a new market, quality facilities, decent history..

Thamel also brings up the topic of playoff expansion but mentions: "Any change in the CFP would require a new contract, with significant financial commitment from ESPN and more years from the CFP. That would take the playoff off the market for any potential competing bids for the next playoff cycle, which means it comes with some risk. This is high-level chess with billions at stake."

ACC would only be able to renegotiate a deal if a school like Notre Dame joins. If that happens, I'm assuming they'd have a BIG say in who #16 would be, and I'm not too entirely confident they'd want us.

Bolded, quite possibly the case. And I would never count on Notre Dame giving up independence based upon past history with both the Big East and ACC.

I do wonder what exit clauses the ACC might have from that deal. 2035-36 is an eternity. For instance, if the ACC wanted to re-open negotiations because it intended to expand by two schools (neither being ND), does that allow them to entertain competing bids? That would seem to be a reasonable assumption that should have been included in the original deal. If so, what if CBS decides to go all in to make a play and looks to upgrade its CBS Sports Network to compete on more equal footing with FS1 and ESPN?

I have no expertise on these contracts so I'm just engaging in some wild speculation. But short of any P5 school or Notre Dame joining, Cincy is a pretty obvious expansion choice given the current ACC geographic footprint in the Ohio Valley. Any Florida or Carolina expansion candidate schools are less attractive perhaps as current ACC members wouldn't welcome more competition in their states for viewership and recruiting. But choosing a UC and Memphis or SMU, plants the ACC flag in major population states now dominated by the B10, SEC and B12 respectively.

I'm almost at the point of believing UC's best pathway will be a massive upheaval of the status quo ushered in by the Knight Commission or similar recommendations that create a new entity for the top football playing schools, rather than some incremental expansion of a P5 conference. Still wishing and hoping for whatever it takes to allow UC to compete on equal footing with many lesser programs that have been in the lucky geography (and revenue) club for decades.
 
01-13-2021 11:34 AM
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BearcatMan Offline
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Post: #189
RE: All Things Realignment 2.0
(01-13-2021 11:34 AM)OKIcat Wrote:  
(01-13-2021 10:58 AM)BearcatMan Wrote:  
(01-13-2021 10:54 AM)dubcat14 Wrote:  Prefacing by saying no major news.. but:

https://sports.yahoo.com/after-college-f...58001.html

Pete Thamel recaps the season and believes realignment is inevitable for schools to recoup some of the money that was lost during the 2020 season.

"Perhaps more relevant to the prospect of a significant shakeup is the ACC’s untenable television deal that new commissioner Jim Phillips inherits. The ACC is locked up through 2035-36, and the fixed income of that contract essentially puts the league in cement financial shoes as its peers are poised to distance themselves from the ACC financially."


For UC, I think the biggest question or cause for concern is how the ACC goes about looking at potential schools.. considering no one would leave the Big Ten or SEC for the ACC, there's not really a good fit outside of Cincinnati. Someone who brings a new market, quality facilities, decent history..

Thamel also brings up the topic of playoff expansion but mentions: "Any change in the CFP would require a new contract, with significant financial commitment from ESPN and more years from the CFP. That would take the playoff off the market for any potential competing bids for the next playoff cycle, which means it comes with some risk. This is high-level chess with billions at stake."

ACC would only be able to renegotiate a deal if a school like Notre Dame joins. If that happens, I'm assuming they'd have a BIG say in who #16 would be, and I'm not too entirely confident they'd want us.

Bolded, quite possibly the case. And I would never count on Notre Dame giving up independence based upon past history with both the Big East and ACC.

I do wonder what exit clauses the ACC might have from that deal. 2035-36 is an eternity. For instance, if the ACC wanted to re-open negotiations because it intended to expand by two schools (neither being ND), does that allow them to entertain competing bids? That would seem to be a reasonable assumption that should have been included in the original deal. If so, what if CBS decides to go all in to make a play and looks to upgrade its CBS Sports Network to compete on more equal footing with FS1 and ESPN?

I have no expertise on these contracts so I'm just engaging in some wild speculation. But short of any P5 school or Notre Dame joining, Cincy is a pretty obvious expansion choice given the current ACC geographic footprint in the Ohio Valley. Any Florida or Carolina expansion candidate schools are less attractive perhaps as current ACC members wouldn't welcome more competition in their states for viewership and recruiting. But choosing a UC and Memphis or SMU, plants the ACC flag in major population states now dominated by the B10, SEC and B12 respectively.

I'm almost at the point of believing UC's best pathway will be a massive upheaval of the status quo ushered in by the Knight Commission or similar recommendations that create a new entity for the top football playing schools, rather than some incremental expansion of a P5 conference. Still wishing and hoping for whatever it takes to allow UC to compete on equal footing with many lesser programs that have been in the lucky geography (and revenue) club for decades.

ACC is only going that far west to get Texas. No chance they would bring SMU on board.

If they go with any non-P5 schools, they'd probably do Cincinnati and Temple honestly...but that's not really their MO as far as type of school or prestige of school and is that going to bring any more money? The answer is undoubtedly no. They're staying at 14 unless ND comes in, and really, after that, unless there is a requirement to go to even numbers, they probably wouldn't add anyone.
 
01-13-2021 11:45 AM
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bcat1997 Offline
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Post: #190
RE: All Things Realignment 2.0
I saw something on Twitter yesterday and cannot find it now but it showed us the 8th ranked watched team this year...can that be right? Boise was #10. Rest on list were powerhouses. If that is the case why are we not getting picked up?
 
01-13-2021 01:21 PM
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CliftonAve Offline
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Post: #191
RE: All Things Realignment 2.0
(01-13-2021 01:21 PM)bcat1997 Wrote:  I saw something on Twitter yesterday and cannot find it now but it showed us the 8th ranked watched team this year...can that be right? Boise was #10. Rest on list were powerhouses. If that is the case why are we not getting picked up?

They don’t want to give money and status to anyone new. The P5 is looking at ways to adding more money for themselves.
 
01-13-2021 01:42 PM
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RE: All Things Realignment 2.0
UC won’t make the ACC or B12 schools an extra cent over what they already make.

That’s why.
 
01-13-2021 01:59 PM
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RE: All Things Realignment 2.0
(01-13-2021 01:59 PM)rath v2.0 Wrote:  UC won’t make the ACC or B12 schools an extra cent over what they already make.

That’s why.

Bingo. It’s time to let this go.
 
01-13-2021 02:07 PM
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BigDawg Offline
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Post: #194
RE: All Things Realignment 2.0
Yeah they get huge ratings for cheap. Though I do wonder if with the changing landscape that maybe they decide to throw us a rope to keep us going in fear of us not having the money. Just keep winning and keep us in position to go if it realignment happens again.
 
01-13-2021 04:31 PM
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Post: #195
RE: All Things Realignment 2.0
(01-13-2021 02:07 PM)Billy_Bearcat Wrote:  
(01-13-2021 01:59 PM)rath v2.0 Wrote:  UC won’t make the ACC or B12 schools an extra cent over what they already make.

That’s why.

Bingo. It’s time to let this go.

Seems like that's pretty much it.

OTOH, there may be a ratings case for the AAC to extract quite a bit more TV money for its current products.
 
01-13-2021 05:30 PM
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C1ncy4Life Offline
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Post: #196
RE: All Things Realignment 2.0
I agree and don’t expect a P5 invite coming anytime soon. I think it’s more likely that we get a shakeup if the College Football Division where X number of teams are competing.

This is why it makes sense for us to help build the AAC as much as possible. Then if an invite comes, we haven’t lost anything.
 
01-13-2021 06:12 PM
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Bear Catlett Offline
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Post: #197
RE: All Things Realignment 2.0
Here's our only foreseeable hopes.

1) ND joins ACC for good, they need one more to go to 16 and they pick us. Possible, but not likely.

2) The P5 decides that they want to shed a little weight and blows up the B12. As a consolation prize for the B12 nerds that nobody takes, they make a consolation conference with the best of the G5 and is not lumped in with other remaining midgets. I think this is also unlikely but more possible than #1.
 
01-14-2021 08:44 AM
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Post: #198
RE: All Things Realignment 2.0
(01-14-2021 08:44 AM)Bear Catlett Wrote:  Here's our only foreseeable hopes.

1) ND joins ACC for good, they need one more to go to 16 and they pick us. Possible, but not likely.

2) The P5 decides that they want to shed a little weight and blows up the B12. As a consolation prize for the B12 nerds that nobody takes, they make a consolation conference with the best of the G5 and is not lumped in with other remaining midgets. I think this is also unlikely but more possible than #1.

3) The big boys decide to break away from the governance of the NCAA and throws a bone to schools like UC, BYU, Memphis, Boise State, UCF, Houston(?).. also not likely but possible.
 
(This post was last modified: 01-14-2021 08:52 AM by dubcat14.)
01-14-2021 08:52 AM
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RE: All Things Realignment 2.0
I think it would take another TV company thinking UC is worth stealing from ESPN. ESPN is almost a monopoly anymore, so also unlikely.
 
01-14-2021 08:54 AM
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RE: All Things Realignment 2.0
(01-14-2021 08:44 AM)Bear Catlett Wrote:  Here's our only foreseeable hopes.

1) ND joins ACC for good, they need one more to go to 16 and they pick us. Possible, but not likely.

2) The P5 decides that they want to shed a little weight and blows up the B12. As a consolation prize for the B12 nerds that nobody takes, they make a consolation conference with the best of the G5 and is not lumped in with other remaining midgets. I think this is also unlikely but more possible than #1.

3. Also not likely, but...

New divisions are formed which in turn causes some conference realignment. UC gets lumped in the with the top tier and gets in a "new" conference with better geographic schools.
 
01-14-2021 08:55 AM
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