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(02-23-2024 01:13 PM)757ODU Wrote:  Our size is definitely an issue, but rebounding is, and always will be a "want to" thing.

They both play a role in rebounding, but it's difficult to overcome a size difference just with "want to". Wade plays with plenty of effort and still had zero rebounds despite playing 1/4 of the game.

(02-23-2024 02:09 PM)Prideofalion Wrote:  

(02-23-2024 02:04 PM)Stat Geek Wrote:  

(02-23-2024 01:38 PM)The Flagship Wrote:  

(02-23-2024 01:13 PM)757ODU Wrote:  Our size is definitely an issue, but rebounding is, and always will be a "want to" thing.

Joe Bunn

Brandon Stith, Richard Ross. Best rebounder in the nation is 6-7 205.

Both great college players. Both players were forwards and played around the basket their entire life. They came in as good rebounders. Not wings and guards playing out of position. We act surprised that Williams and Baker aren’t rebounding better. Give me a break. They’ve played on the perimeter their entire life

This can be true AND it shouldn't be that hard to have a Division 1 player, regardless of position, find his man on a free throw and box out.

(02-23-2024 02:07 PM)Prideofalion Wrote:  Does anyone else think the team lacks “rebounding talent” because the entire roster is comprised of shooting guards? If you have played guard your entire life it’s hard to change that mentality. Someone mentioned Joe Bunn. Great player. But even at 6’4 he played under the basket his entire life. He was a true forward. Positions matter. Not just height and weight. Joe Bunn is a perfect example of a forward that we have none of. Everyone is out of position other than whoever’s playing 2 guard.

Odahi and Pounds are the size of the players they are playing against and grew up playing center but neither are rebounding very well.

(02-23-2024 02:09 PM)Prideofalion Wrote:  

(02-23-2024 02:04 PM)Stat Geek Wrote:  

(02-23-2024 01:38 PM)The Flagship Wrote:  

(02-23-2024 01:13 PM)757ODU Wrote:  Our size is definitely an issue, but rebounding is, and always will be a "want to" thing.

Joe Bunn

Brandon Stith, Richard Ross. Best rebounder in the nation is 6-7 205.

Both great college players. Both players were forwards and played around the basket their entire life. They came in as good rebounders. Not wings and guards playing out of position. We act surprised that Williams and Baker aren’t rebounding better. Give me a break. They’ve played on the perimeter their entire life

Ty Williams is a good rebounder for his position. Him and Allette were average-to-above average rebounding for their spot.

I think more than anything, this team just lacks focus when it comes to the details of what it takes to win a basketball game at this level. Williams is a decent rebounder for his position, which is why it's especially maddening when he doesn't box out on a missed FT.

(02-23-2024 02:07 PM)Prideofalion Wrote:  Does anyone else think the team lacks “rebounding talent” because the entire roster is comprised of shooting guards? If you have played guard your entire life it’s hard to change that mentality. Someone mentioned Joe Bunn. Great player. But even at 6’4 he played under the basket his entire life. He was a true forward. Positions matter. Not just height and weight. Joe Bunn is a perfect example of a forward that we have none of. Everyone is out of position other than whoever’s playing 2 guard.

Anyone that thinks that size has nothing to do with rebounding just wants to argue. Yes, effort and technique factor into it as well, but those things are a given that apply to any position for any sport.

For anyone comparing, Bunn was bigger than Jason Wade. Interestingly enough, Bunn played the 4 (power forward) at NC A&T before transferring to ODU. I've seen several articles today that all list Joe Bunn as 6'-6" during his time at ODU - which I believe was just one season.

https://greensboro.com/bunn-decides-to-j...579e6.html

(02-23-2024 10:15 AM)Stat Geek Wrote:  The amount of players is a poor excuse. We played the same amount of players as they did and there best players played similar minutes to our best players.

The offensive rebounds thing is an excuse. They have 2 guys that weight over 205 pounds and 2 guys that are taller than 6-7. You have to have the mentality that you are going to go in and box out/rebound and this team doesn't have it. I like Blakney as a player and his defense is good, but he's never been a rebounder and I was just hoping that our staff would help him with that. We don't play physical enough when driving to the hoop, instead we shy away from contact.

Lots of issues with this team. Defections and a bad mixture of players. Looking forward to next year :)

Interesting that you don't mention the biggest problem. Our 6'4" center. This team was much more competitive last night when he wasn't on the floor, and yet Odiahi got one rotation, even though ODU played really well when he was on the court.

The substitutions were awful last night. The team WAS tired, as someone above mentioned earlier, but not because of numbers. It was because the coaches ran the group that took the lead way too long. Pounds was visibly less effective for a few minutes before he came out, as was Caesar. Then, when they finally rest Pounds, in comes Wade and the layup line and non stop offensive rebounds commence.

I get it. Everyone loves Wade. Great guy, and a great story, but he has no place on the court as the 5. I get it, he does the little things that coaches and basketball nerds love, but the problem is that while he does a great job of setting screens, and making the right pass, he does zero of the big things that you need from your 5. He doesn't score, he doesn't rebound, he can't defend his position. None of this is his fault. HE IS 6'4". I am not saying he shouldn't play, I am just saying he shouldn't play the 5 unless Pounds and Odiahi aren't available.

(02-23-2024 02:37 PM)ODU BBALL Wrote:  

(02-23-2024 02:07 PM)Prideofalion Wrote:  Does anyone else think the team lacks “rebounding talent” because the entire roster is comprised of shooting guards? If you have played guard your entire life it’s hard to change that mentality. Someone mentioned Joe Bunn. Great player. But even at 6’4 he played under the basket his entire life. He was a true forward. Positions matter. Not just height and weight. Joe Bunn is a perfect example of a forward that we have none of. Everyone is out of position other than whoever’s playing 2 guard.

Anyone that thinks that size has nothing to do with rebounding just wants to argue. Yes, effort and technique factor into it as well, but those things are a given that apply to any position for any sport.

For anyone comparing, Bunn was bigger than Jason Wade. Interestingly enough, Bunn played the 4 (power forward) at NC A&T before transferring to ODU. I've seen several articles today that all list Joe Bunn as 6'-6" during his time at ODU - which I believe was just one season.

https://greensboro.com/bunn-decides-to-j...579e6.html

I am 100% not disagreeing with you. Size absolutely plays a role in it, but one of the best all around rebounding teams in the country is Boise State who does not play a guy over 6'8. Again, size definitely matters, but want to, and technique are the biggest factors.

(02-23-2024 03:13 PM)757ODU Wrote:  

(02-23-2024 02:37 PM)ODU BBALL Wrote:  

(02-23-2024 02:07 PM)Prideofalion Wrote:  Does anyone else think the team lacks “rebounding talent” because the entire roster is comprised of shooting guards? If you have played guard your entire life it’s hard to change that mentality. Someone mentioned Joe Bunn. Great player. But even at 6’4 he played under the basket his entire life. He was a true forward. Positions matter. Not just height and weight. Joe Bunn is a perfect example of a forward that we have none of. Everyone is out of position other than whoever’s playing 2 guard.

Anyone that thinks that size has nothing to do with rebounding just wants to argue. Yes, effort and technique factor into it as well, but those things are a given that apply to any position for any sport.

For anyone comparing, Bunn was bigger than Jason Wade. Interestingly enough, Bunn played the 4 (power forward) at NC A&T before transferring to ODU. I've seen several articles today that all list Joe Bunn as 6'-6" during his time at ODU - which I believe was just one season.

https://greensboro.com/bunn-decides-to-j...579e6.html

I am 100% not disagreeing with you. Size absolutely plays a role in it, but one of the best all around rebounding teams in the country is Boise State who does not play a guy over 6'8. Again, size definitely matters, but want to, and technique are the biggest factors.

Are we still talking hoops here?

Im not a big proponent of plus/minus, but Wade has the second best figure on the team. If the teams plays better with him off the floor how is that possible? In terms of defense, no one is even remotely close in defensive metrics. (he is 1.09 while the second best is .50).He has the 2nd best on/off offensive efficiency on the team. I know it is not adjusted for minutes but the team is only - 28 points with him on the court. While i would prefer that Wade not be our center, there is overwhelming evidence that considering the players we do have, the team is performing best with him on the court.

Wade only played 11 minutes last night. Odahi played 8. Pounds played 22.

Odahi played the first 4.5 minutes (tied 5-5 after he went out)
Pounds played 6 mins (13-12 APP when he leaves)
Wade played ~ 7 mins (29-25 APP when he leaves)
Pounds played ~3 mins (36-29 APP when he leaves)
Odahi played 3 mins (39-35 APP when he leaves)
Pounds plays next 12 mins (70-58 APP when he leaves)
Wade plays next 3 mins (78-65 APP when he leaves)
Pounds plays last 2 mins (92-67)

How in the world does anything you say about Wade apply? They were roughly -4 in the 11 minutes he played, how is he the reason they lost or how he was the biggest problem?

(02-23-2024 03:13 PM)757ODU Wrote:  

(02-23-2024 02:37 PM)ODU BBALL Wrote:  

(02-23-2024 02:07 PM)Prideofalion Wrote:  Does anyone else think the team lacks “rebounding talent” because the entire roster is comprised of shooting guards? If you have played guard your entire life it’s hard to change that mentality. Someone mentioned Joe Bunn. Great player. But even at 6’4 he played under the basket his entire life. He was a true forward. Positions matter. Not just height and weight. Joe Bunn is a perfect example of a forward that we have none of. Everyone is out of position other than whoever’s playing 2 guard.

Anyone that thinks that size has nothing to do with rebounding just wants to argue. Yes, effort and technique factor into it as well, but those things are a given that apply to any position for any sport.

For anyone comparing, Bunn was bigger than Jason Wade. Interestingly enough, Bunn played the 4 (power forward) at NC A&T before transferring to ODU. I've seen several articles today that all list Joe Bunn as 6'-6" during his time at ODU - which I believe was just one season.

https://greensboro.com/bunn-decides-to-j...579e6.html

I am 100% not disagreeing with you. Size absolutely plays a role in it, but one of the best all around rebounding teams in the country is Boise State who does not play a guy over 6'8. Again, size definitely matters, but want to, and technique are the biggest factors.

You are correct. And rebounding is typically not an issue for Jones team. In fact, its usually the biggest strength of the team. But, this year, it is not it. Mekhi Long was roughly 6-7 190 and he rebounds better than anyone on our team.

(02-23-2024 03:35 PM)Roy Munson Wrote:  

(02-23-2024 03:13 PM)757ODU Wrote:  

(02-23-2024 02:37 PM)ODU BBALL Wrote:  

(02-23-2024 02:07 PM)Prideofalion Wrote:  Does anyone else think the team lacks “rebounding talent” because the entire roster is comprised of shooting guards? If you have played guard your entire life it’s hard to change that mentality. Someone mentioned Joe Bunn. Great player. But even at 6’4 he played under the basket his entire life. He was a true forward. Positions matter. Not just height and weight. Joe Bunn is a perfect example of a forward that we have none of. Everyone is out of position other than whoever’s playing 2 guard.

Anyone that thinks that size has nothing to do with rebounding just wants to argue. Yes, effort and technique factor into it as well, but those things are a given that apply to any position for any sport.

For anyone comparing, Bunn was bigger than Jason Wade. Interestingly enough, Bunn played the 4 (power forward) at NC A&T before transferring to ODU. I've seen several articles today that all list Joe Bunn as 6'-6" during his time at ODU - which I believe was just one season.

https://greensboro.com/bunn-decides-to-j...579e6.html

I am 100% not disagreeing with you. Size absolutely plays a role in it, but one of the best all around rebounding teams in the country is Boise State who does not play a guy over 6'8. Again, size definitely matters, but want to, and technique are the biggest factors.

Are we still talking hoops here?

(02-23-2024 03:43 PM)Stat Geek Wrote:  

(02-23-2024 03:13 PM)757ODU Wrote:  

(02-23-2024 02:37 PM)ODU BBALL Wrote:  

(02-23-2024 02:07 PM)Prideofalion Wrote:  Does anyone else think the team lacks “rebounding talent” because the entire roster is comprised of shooting guards? If you have played guard your entire life it’s hard to change that mentality. Someone mentioned Joe Bunn. Great player. But even at 6’4 he played under the basket his entire life. He was a true forward. Positions matter. Not just height and weight. Joe Bunn is a perfect example of a forward that we have none of. Everyone is out of position other than whoever’s playing 2 guard.

Anyone that thinks that size has nothing to do with rebounding just wants to argue. Yes, effort and technique factor into it as well, but those things are a given that apply to any position for any sport.

For anyone comparing, Bunn was bigger than Jason Wade. Interestingly enough, Bunn played the 4 (power forward) at NC A&T before transferring to ODU. I've seen several articles today that all list Joe Bunn as 6'-6" during his time at ODU - which I believe was just one season.

https://greensboro.com/bunn-decides-to-j...579e6.html

I am 100% not disagreeing with you. Size absolutely plays a role in it, but one of the best all around rebounding teams in the country is Boise State who does not play a guy over 6'8. Again, size definitely matters, but want to, and technique are the biggest factors.

You are correct. And rebounding is typically not an issue for Jones team. In fact, its usually the biggest strength of the team. But, this year, it is not it. Mekhi Long was roughly 6-7 190 and he rebounds better than anyone on our team.

This is true. But this year he recruited guys who were more talented on the offensive side, and I guess he figured he'd teach them defense. That didnt work out, and the JJ mojo zapped their shooting ability as usual. So now we have guys who not only cant shoot, but cant play good D either. Usually we have guys who cant shoot but play good D. Hopefully this nightmare all ends soon.

(02-23-2024 03:48 PM)monarx Wrote:  

(02-23-2024 03:43 PM)Stat Geek Wrote:  

(02-23-2024 03:13 PM)757ODU Wrote:  

(02-23-2024 02:37 PM)ODU BBALL Wrote:  

(02-23-2024 02:07 PM)Prideofalion Wrote:  Does anyone else think the team lacks “rebounding talent” because the entire roster is comprised of shooting guards? If you have played guard your entire life it’s hard to change that mentality. Someone mentioned Joe Bunn. Great player. But even at 6’4 he played under the basket his entire life. He was a true forward. Positions matter. Not just height and weight. Joe Bunn is a perfect example of a forward that we have none of. Everyone is out of position other than whoever’s playing 2 guard.

Anyone that thinks that size has nothing to do with rebounding just wants to argue. Yes, effort and technique factor into it as well, but those things are a given that apply to any position for any sport.

For anyone comparing, Bunn was bigger than Jason Wade. Interestingly enough, Bunn played the 4 (power forward) at NC A&T before transferring to ODU. I've seen several articles today that all list Joe Bunn as 6'-6" during his time at ODU - which I believe was just one season.

https://greensboro.com/bunn-decides-to-j...579e6.html

I am 100% not disagreeing with you. Size absolutely plays a role in it, but one of the best all around rebounding teams in the country is Boise State who does not play a guy over 6'8. Again, size definitely matters, but want to, and technique are the biggest factors.

You are correct. And rebounding is typically not an issue for Jones team. In fact, its usually the biggest strength of the team. But, this year, it is not it. Mekhi Long was roughly 6-7 190 and he rebounds better than anyone on our team.

This is true. But this year he recruited guys who were more talented on the offensive side, and I guess he figured he'd teach them defense. That didnt work out, and the JJ mojo zapped their shooting ability as usual. So now we have guys who not only cant shoot, but cant play good D either. Usually we have guys who cant shoot but play good D. Hopefully this nightmare all ends soon.

I don't know that they recruited offensive players. They just expected to have Williams playing 20 minutes a game (best rebounder) and filling in/developing Pounds, Odahi, Hood. Blakney is a defensive player. I guess you could say Allette and Ceaser are offensive players but Ceaser wasn't expected to play much.

I pointed out the dropoff in rebounding from Long to Blakney being a concern and it certainly shows. But, losing Williams also hurts the rebounding as well. Odahi doesn't rebound well despite his size.

That doesn't excuse the poor defense these guys play.

(02-23-2024 03:35 PM)Roy Munson Wrote:  

(02-23-2024 03:13 PM)757ODU Wrote:  

(02-23-2024 02:37 PM)ODU BBALL Wrote:  

(02-23-2024 02:07 PM)Prideofalion Wrote:  Does anyone else think the team lacks “rebounding talent” because the entire roster is comprised of shooting guards? If you have played guard your entire life it’s hard to change that mentality. Someone mentioned Joe Bunn. Great player. But even at 6’4 he played under the basket his entire life. He was a true forward. Positions matter. Not just height and weight. Joe Bunn is a perfect example of a forward that we have none of. Everyone is out of position other than whoever’s playing 2 guard.

Anyone that thinks that size has nothing to do with rebounding just wants to argue. Yes, effort and technique factor into it as well, but those things are a given that apply to any position for any sport.

For anyone comparing, Bunn was bigger than Jason Wade. Interestingly enough, Bunn played the 4 (power forward) at NC A&T before transferring to ODU. I've seen several articles today that all list Joe Bunn as 6'-6" during his time at ODU - which I believe was just one season.

https://greensboro.com/bunn-decides-to-j...579e6.html

I am 100% not disagreeing with you. Size absolutely plays a role in it, but one of the best all around rebounding teams in the country is Boise State who does not play a guy over 6'8. Again, size definitely matters, but want to, and technique are the biggest factors.

Are we still talking hoops here?

Winner of funniest post of the week!

I compiled size data (height & weight) of the current Top 20 rebounders in the country regardless of what league they play in or how many minutes they play versus others on that Top 20 list.

The AVERAGE size (height & weight) for those occupying the current list of Top 20 Rebounders is:

Height- 6'-10"
Weight - 235 Lbs.

The prototype player listed above basically describes #45 (Mark West) of ODU.

The weaker leagues tend to have smaller players in it at the 4 and 5 positions, and sometimes you will get someone in the small forward size range that racks up a lot of rebounds and can make the list. A team's style of play can also factor into rebounds. A team that plays at a really fast pace every game will get more rebounding opportunities. One that shoots a lot of 3-point shots will get a lot of long rebound opportunities. For example, a 6'-6", 210 Lb. guard that plays at VMI ranks 13th on the list.

https://www.espn.com/mens-college-basket...s/dir/desc

Rebounding? What about scoring, our 3 bigs scored 4 pts total. AppSt's 3 bigs scored 29 pts. It's been this way all season.

(02-24-2024 10:37 AM)DaBigBlue Wrote:  Rebounding? What about scoring, our 3 bigs scored 4 pts total. AppSt's 3 bigs scored 29 pts. It's been this way all season.

I totally agree with the scoring factoring in - and post defense / rim protection as well. My post was limited to rebounding because that is where the discussion was.