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Coaching changes 2020-21- it's not done yet!!!!
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JRsec Offline
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Post: #181
RE: Coaching changes 2020-21- it's not done yet!!!!
(01-18-2021 09:31 PM)Kaplony Wrote:  
(01-18-2021 09:08 PM)bullet Wrote:  
(01-18-2021 07:00 PM)stever20 Wrote:  
(01-18-2021 06:59 PM)quo vadis Wrote:  
(01-18-2021 01:29 PM)ken d Wrote:  To the extent that it could be called a premier job, it's only because they are in the SEC, not because their performance warrants it.

The Tennessee job remains a premier job not just because it's in the SEC, but because of their long pedigree of success and the 100,000 fans who fill the stadium.

It's a premier job, despite the lousy performance of the past years.

being a top 21-25 job isn't a premiere job.

There aren't 20 better jobs. Missouri? Arizona? Iowa? North Carolina? List them.
There are about 10 clearly better. Tennessee is in the middle of that second 10.

Tennessee is one of 18 schools to win an AP MNC since 1984. They are one of only 21 to win one since 1960 (Georgia, Pitt and BYU 84 or prior). Oregon outside of that group is the only school that might be considered top 20. And do you really think Oregon is a better job than Tennessee? Is Pitt? Is BYU? That puts them #18 at the worst.

Sure there are. If it's so great then explain why the last three head coaches were Derek Dooley, Butch Jones, and Jeremy Pruitt.

I agree that there may be 20 better jobs out there, but it is only because of the total cluster cuck that has been the relationships between the UT President, the UT Boosters, the UT AD, and one old coach who stabbed Johnny Majors in the back.
01-18-2021 09:39 PM
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Post: #182
RE: Coaching changes 2020-21- it's not done yet!!!!
(01-18-2021 04:15 PM)vandiver49 Wrote:  UTN is not a top 25 job anymore IMO. Yes you have the money, but what you don't have are:

Time: New coaches are expected to have the Vols competing with the like of UF and UGA in 3 years. If not, year 4 is the hot seat and year 5 is lame duck.
Talent: The Vols used to feast on talent from GA and FL as there isn't much top talent within the state. The rise of Clemson and a resurgent Georgia have cut UTN historical talent sources.

And, in terms of talent, Tennessee hasn't bothered to tap any new states for talent either. If you take a look at one of Georgia's most prized recruits, you would see that he isn't from Georgia or Florida; he's from Nevada. Georgia has also recruited the Carolinas pretty hard as well. Tennessee used to recruit the Carolinas, but they gave up on them when Clemson became a big power; in contrast, that hasn't deterred Georgia at all. In addition, for some odd reason, Tennessee chose to stop recruiting the state of California, even though the Vols were quite successful in recruiting the state in the past.
01-22-2021 05:02 AM
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vandiver49 Online
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Post: #183
RE: Coaching changes 2020-21- it's not done yet!!!!
(01-22-2021 05:02 AM)DawgNBama Wrote:  
(01-18-2021 04:15 PM)vandiver49 Wrote:  UTN is not a top 25 job anymore IMO. Yes you have the money, but what you don't have are:

Time: New coaches are expected to have the Vols competing with the like of UF and UGA in 3 years. If not, year 4 is the hot seat and year 5 is lame duck.
Talent: The Vols used to feast on talent from GA and FL as there isn't much top talent within the state. The rise of Clemson and a resurgent Georgia have cut UTN historical talent sources.

And, in terms of talent, Tennessee hasn't bothered to tap any new states for talent either. If you take a look at one of Georgia's most prized recruits, you would see that he isn't from Georgia or Florida; he's from Nevada. Georgia has also recruited the Carolinas pretty hard as well. Tennessee used to recruit the Carolinas, but they gave up on them when Clemson became a big power; in contrast, that hasn't deterred Georgia at all. In addition, for some odd reason, Tennessee chose to stop recruiting the state of California, even though the Vols were quite successful in recruiting the state in the past.

The Vols had to refocus attention closer to home once the tradition pipelines started to whither. A solid plan if UTN were able to crave out a solid niche in GA, FL, SC and NC. The problem is the bad football precluded it.
01-22-2021 05:32 AM
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Post: #184
RE: Coaching changes 2020-21- it's not done yet!!!!
(01-22-2021 05:32 AM)vandiver49 Wrote:  
(01-22-2021 05:02 AM)DawgNBama Wrote:  
(01-18-2021 04:15 PM)vandiver49 Wrote:  UTN is not a top 25 job anymore IMO. Yes you have the money, but what you don't have are:

Time: New coaches are expected to have the Vols competing with the like of UF and UGA in 3 years. If not, year 4 is the hot seat and year 5 is lame duck.
Talent: The Vols used to feast on talent from GA and FL as there isn't much top talent within the state. The rise of Clemson and a resurgent Georgia have cut UTN historical talent sources.

And, in terms of talent, Tennessee hasn't bothered to tap any new states for talent either. If you take a look at one of Georgia's most prized recruits, you would see that he isn't from Georgia or Florida; he's from Nevada. Georgia has also recruited the Carolinas pretty hard as well. Tennessee used to recruit the Carolinas, but they gave up on them when Clemson became a big power; in contrast, that hasn't deterred Georgia at all. In addition, for some odd reason, Tennessee chose to stop recruiting the state of California, even though the Vols were quite successful in recruiting the state in the past.

The Vols had to refocus attention closer to home once the tradition pipelines started to whither. A solid plan if UTN were able to crave out a solid niche in GA, FL, SC and NC. The problem is the bad football precluded it.

The best reason to take TN job would be to cash big paychecks for a while. Even if you get fired, it wouldn't hurt you because everyone sees how Tennessee has been.
01-22-2021 05:38 AM
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Post: #185
RE: Coaching changes 2020-21- it's not done yet!!!!
"https://www.knoxnews.com/story/sports/college/university-of-tennessee/football/2021/01/22/danny-white-tennessee-vols-ad-football-search-investigation-ut/6665788002/"
01-23-2021 09:43 AM
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Post: #186
RE: Coaching changes 2020-21- it's not done yet!!!!
(01-18-2021 09:31 PM)Kaplony Wrote:  
(01-18-2021 09:08 PM)bullet Wrote:  
(01-18-2021 07:00 PM)stever20 Wrote:  
(01-18-2021 06:59 PM)quo vadis Wrote:  
(01-18-2021 01:29 PM)ken d Wrote:  To the extent that it could be called a premier job, it's only because they are in the SEC, not because their performance warrants it.

The Tennessee job remains a premier job not just because it's in the SEC, but because of their long pedigree of success and the 100,000 fans who fill the stadium.

It's a premier job, despite the lousy performance of the past years.

being a top 21-25 job isn't a premiere job.

There aren't 20 better jobs. Missouri? Arizona? Iowa? North Carolina? List them.
There are about 10 clearly better. Tennessee is in the middle of that second 10.

Tennessee is one of 18 schools to win an AP MNC since 1984. They are one of only 21 to win one since 1960 (Georgia, Pitt and BYU 84 or prior). Oregon outside of that group is the only school that might be considered top 20. And do you really think Oregon is a better job than Tennessee? Is Pitt? Is BYU? That puts them #18 at the worst.

Sure there are. If it's so great then explain why the last three head coaches were Derek Dooley, Butch Jones, and Jeremy Pruitt.

Texas hired Charley Strong. They hired David McWilliams in the 80s. Notre Dame hired that HS coach in the 80s. Sometimes ADs make bad choices.

Again, put up or shut up. List the 20 better jobs.
(This post was last modified: 01-23-2021 10:50 AM by bullet.)
01-23-2021 10:50 AM
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Post: #187
RE: Coaching changes 2020-21- it's not done yet!!!!
Alabama, Georgia, Florida, LSU, Auburn, Florida St, Clemson, Ohio St, Michigan, Penn St, USC, Oregon, Notre Dame, Oklahoma, Texas right off the bat. That's 15.
01-23-2021 11:09 AM
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Kaplony Offline
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Post: #188
RE: Coaching changes 2020-21- it's not done yet!!!!
(01-23-2021 11:09 AM)stever20 Wrote:  Alabama, Georgia, Florida, LSU, Auburn, Florida St, Clemson, Ohio St, Michigan, Penn St, USC, Oregon, Notre Dame, Oklahoma, Texas right off the bat. That's 15.

A&M, Wisconsin, Washington, FSU, Miami, UNC.

That's 21.
01-23-2021 11:14 AM
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stever20 Offline
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Post: #189
RE: Coaching changes 2020-21- it's not done yet!!!!
(01-23-2021 11:14 AM)Kaplony Wrote:  
(01-23-2021 11:09 AM)stever20 Wrote:  Alabama, Georgia, Florida, LSU, Auburn, Florida St, Clemson, Ohio St, Michigan, Penn St, USC, Oregon, Notre Dame, Oklahoma, Texas right off the bat. That's 15.

A&M, Wisconsin, Washington, FSU, Miami, UNC.

That's 21.

I listed FSU already. So 20.
01-23-2021 11:17 AM
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ken d Online
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Post: #190
RE: Coaching changes 2020-21- it's not done yet!!!!
(01-23-2021 11:14 AM)Kaplony Wrote:  
(01-23-2021 11:09 AM)stever20 Wrote:  Alabama, Georgia, Florida, LSU, Auburn, Florida St, Clemson, Ohio St, Michigan, Penn St, USC, Oregon, Notre Dame, Oklahoma, Texas right off the bat. That's 15.

A&M, Wisconsin, Washington, FSU, Miami, UNC.

That's 21.

UNC's a little iffy for me. They're "up" at the moment, but if you look at their record over time they seem to be either very good or very bad. At the end of the day that averages out to mediocre. But as jobs go, I'd say they are on a par with Tennessee, with both programs unable to defend their home turf in recruiting or make significant inroads into anyone else's turf.
(This post was last modified: 01-23-2021 12:05 PM by ken d.)
01-23-2021 12:05 PM
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Kaplony Offline
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Post: #191
RE: Coaching changes 2020-21- it's not done yet!!!!
(01-23-2021 12:05 PM)ken d Wrote:  
(01-23-2021 11:14 AM)Kaplony Wrote:  
(01-23-2021 11:09 AM)stever20 Wrote:  Alabama, Georgia, Florida, LSU, Auburn, Florida St, Clemson, Ohio St, Michigan, Penn St, USC, Oregon, Notre Dame, Oklahoma, Texas right off the bat. That's 15.

A&M, Wisconsin, Washington, FSU, Miami, UNC.

That's 21.

UNC's a little iffy for me. They're "up" at the moment, but if you look at their record over time they seem to be either very good or very bad. At the end of the day that averages out to mediocre. But as jobs go, I'd say they are on a par with Tennessee, with both programs unable to defend their home turf in recruiting or make significant inroads into anyone else's turf.

Not me. A high paying job in an easily winnable P5 division at the flagship of a state with great recruiting and little to no real pressure because you are
always going to be #2 and you are going to get the time needed to turn things around. UNC gave Torbush four years, Bunting six, and Fedora seven. Who ever is hired at UT is going to be on the hotseat in two years minimum because they aren't going to be able to right that ship before then.

Everyone has to deal with incursions in recruiting, it's the nature of the beast.
(This post was last modified: 01-23-2021 12:21 PM by Kaplony.)
01-23-2021 12:19 PM
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Post: #192
RE: Coaching changes 2020-21- it's not done yet!!!!
(01-23-2021 12:19 PM)Kaplony Wrote:  
(01-23-2021 12:05 PM)ken d Wrote:  
(01-23-2021 11:14 AM)Kaplony Wrote:  
(01-23-2021 11:09 AM)stever20 Wrote:  Alabama, Georgia, Florida, LSU, Auburn, Florida St, Clemson, Ohio St, Michigan, Penn St, USC, Oregon, Notre Dame, Oklahoma, Texas right off the bat. That's 15.

A&M, Wisconsin, Washington, FSU, Miami, UNC.

That's 21.

UNC's a little iffy for me. They're "up" at the moment, but if you look at their record over time they seem to be either very good or very bad. At the end of the day that averages out to mediocre. But as jobs go, I'd say they are on a par with Tennessee, with both programs unable to defend their home turf in recruiting or make significant inroads into anyone else's turf.

Not me. A high paying job in an easily winnable P5 division at the flagship of a state with great recruiting and little to no real pressure because you are always going to be #2 and you are going to get the time needed to turn things around. UNC gave Torbush four years, Bunting six, and Fedora seven. Who ever is hired at UT is going to be on the hotseat in two years minimum because they aren't going to be able to right that ship before then.

Everyone has to deal with incursions in recruiting, it's the nature of the beast.

Yup. The bolded part is also why Chip Kelly chose UCLA.
01-23-2021 12:48 PM
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Post: #193
RE: Coaching changes 2020-21- it's not done yet!!!!
(01-23-2021 11:14 AM)Kaplony Wrote:  
(01-23-2021 11:09 AM)stever20 Wrote:  Alabama, Georgia, Florida, LSU, Auburn, Florida St, Clemson, Ohio St, Michigan, Penn St, USC, Oregon, Notre Dame, Oklahoma, Texas right off the bat. That's 15.

A&M, Wisconsin, Washington, FSU, Miami, UNC.

That's 21.

A&M has an argument. But this was the first time in over 60 years they finished in the top 5. It was the first time they finished as high as 2nd in their division in about 20 years.

Miami doesn't have the fan support. UNC-are you serious?
Auburn is #2 in their state. Tennessee owns the state. Oregon-again, are you serious-no local talent, small stadium? Wisconsin has never done anything nationally and doesn't have the local talent either. I wouldn't take Washington over them.

You've got 10:
USC, Texas, Oklahoma, Alabama, Georgia, Florida, Penn St., Ohio ST., Michigan, Notre Dame.

Then Tennessee is in the mix with the next 9 (in no particular order):
Tennessee, Auburn, LSU, Washington, Oregon, Clemson (good job, but Dabo doesn't make it a permanent premier job), Miami FL, FSU, Nebraska.

Then there are a half dozen others who are close: Texas A&M, Wisconsin, Arkansas, UCLA, Colorado, Iowa.

You want the resources and tradition to succeed. Tennessee has it. When they aren't abysmal they have 106,000 screaming fans.
01-23-2021 01:32 PM
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Post: #194
RE: Coaching changes 2020-21- it's not done yet!!!!
Washington?UNC? for sure are not better than TN

Wisconsin, Penn St, Miami and Oregon are all questionable.

TN, FSU and Auburn are about the same.
01-23-2021 01:58 PM
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Post: #195
RE: Coaching changes 2020-21- it's not done yet!!!!
(01-23-2021 01:58 PM)Gemofthehills Wrote:  Washington?UNC? for sure are not better than TN

Wisconsin, Penn St, Miami and Oregon are all questionable.

TN, FSU and Auburn are about the same.

What makes Tennessee better? The ramshackle stadium where they stack them in like sardines? The meddling boosters? The unrealistic fan base? The lack of a local recruiting base?
01-23-2021 06:33 PM
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