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UCF Fans - Are you happy with Josh Heupel?
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Lurkercat Online
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Post: #21
RE: UCF Fans - Are you happy with Josh Heupel?
(11-22-2020 11:49 AM)CitrusUCF Wrote:  
(11-22-2020 09:42 AM)mlb Wrote:  In my opinion they had their most important players on the field last night and still lost... The refs.

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I will accept no argument that the refs favored UCF last night. The inadvertent whistle clearly screwed UC, but they scored anyway.

The refs blew an obvious fumble recovery by UCF. It is clear as day on video that UCF recovered and had possession of the ball with the player down. If that is ruled correctly and UCF scores again there, the game is more or less over.

Additionally, UC was not called for holding all night. The announcers even highlighted a play where the center was downfield and held clearly. You could put together a highlight tape of all the holding that occurred and was not called.

Further, the play where UC should have been called for targeting on Gabriel and instead UCF was flagged for the OL defending his QB despite the Cincy player jawing and getting in Gabriel's face. Absolutely ridiculous.

The AAC has awful refs. Consistently awful. There were blown calls on both teams, but Cincinnati was the overall big beneficiary of blown calls.

Ucf could be called for holding all night too so that's a wash

Big hits are not targeting. Gabriel thinks he's going to get lightly shoved out of bounds because he's a qb then gets mad when he gets hit. Unless you can show me a clip that shows helmet to helmet, it looked like he led with the shoulder

Since we're complaining about the refs, that whistle that brought back the Whyle touchdown was one of the worst things I've ever seen. Absolutely pathetic reffing. Also ucf apparently gets to push the pile for 10 minutes whereas uc gets the play blown dead as soon as a ucf defender touches them. Ucf got a td and 2 pt conversion that should've been stopped because of forward progress, but they let the pile get pushed forever
11-22-2020 12:08 PM
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DeeHee33 Offline
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Post: #22
RE: UCF Fans - Are you happy with Josh Heupel?
(11-22-2020 11:56 AM)CitrusUCF Wrote:  
(11-22-2020 07:21 AM)Z-Fly Wrote:  First off, I come in peace.

He seems like a good not great coach. He kind of reminds me of Butch Jones. He’ll keep you in the top third of the league, but that’s about it. I hated that about Butch.

Maybe, I’m way off, and you guys feel like he can take you to the promised land again. Anyways, I’m curious of your thoughts.

That's probably about right, though Heupel still has time to improve a coach. Butch was what he was given his experience level at that point. Heupel is still in Year 3 of being a head coach.

Heupel is 2-7 in one score games. It suggests to me that he has not learned how to lead the team with the game on the line. The team lacks a killer instinct. When we got the ball back up 14-3, I knew we would not score. We very consistently never score in that situation and fail to bury the opponent when we should. Heupel got conservative, and we punted. He always does it. I believe he should stop being the playcaller and focus on being the head coach.

I also think Randy Shannon needs to go. There are various arguments and data that support that he has done a good job. I don't even necessarily disagree at some level, but his defense is not the correct scheme for the offense we run. We cannot afford to have just 4 possessions in a half and leaving our defense on the field for long periods of time like the 8:30 drive. We need an aggressive, blitzing defense that keeps the QB under pressure and can get off the field much quicker.

Randy Shannon needs to stay. Randy is one of the reasons we have some of the more talented players coming from south Florida. UCF offense and how it scores so quickly puts the defense in some tough situations.
(This post was last modified: 11-22-2020 12:12 PM by DeeHee33.)
11-22-2020 12:10 PM
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Post: #23
RE: UCF Fans - Are you happy with Josh Heupel?
Any claim that the refs cost UCF anything last night is next level ******* stupid.
11-22-2020 12:20 PM
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CitrusUCF Offline
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Post: #24
RE: UCF Fans - Are you happy with Josh Heupel?
(11-22-2020 12:10 PM)DeeHee33 Wrote:  
(11-22-2020 11:56 AM)CitrusUCF Wrote:  
(11-22-2020 07:21 AM)Z-Fly Wrote:  First off, I come in peace.

He seems like a good not great coach. He kind of reminds me of Butch Jones. He’ll keep you in the top third of the league, but that’s about it. I hated that about Butch.

Maybe, I’m way off, and you guys feel like he can take you to the promised land again. Anyways, I’m curious of your thoughts.

That's probably about right, though Heupel still has time to improve a coach. Butch was what he was given his experience level at that point. Heupel is still in Year 3 of being a head coach.

Heupel is 2-7 in one score games. It suggests to me that he has not learned how to lead the team with the game on the line. The team lacks a killer instinct. When we got the ball back up 14-3, I knew we would not score. We very consistently never score in that situation and fail to bury the opponent when we should. Heupel got conservative, and we punted. He always does it. I believe he should stop being the playcaller and focus on being the head coach.

I also think Randy Shannon needs to go. There are various arguments and data that support that he has done a good job. I don't even necessarily disagree at some level, but his defense is not the correct scheme for the offense we run. We cannot afford to have just 4 possessions in a half and leaving our defense on the field for long periods of time like the 8:30 drive. We need an aggressive, blitzing defense that keeps the QB under pressure and can get off the field much quicker.

Randy Shannon needs to stay. Randy is one of the reasons we have some of the more talented players coming from south Florida. UCF offense and how it scores so quickly puts the defense in some tough situations.

We have one recruit from Florida right now. Randy isn't doing **** on the recruiting front and we are getting murdered in recruiting by Cincy. Randy's reputation as an elite recruiter is vastly overstated.
11-22-2020 12:27 PM
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Post: #25
RE: UCF Fans - Are you happy with Josh Heupel?
(11-22-2020 12:20 PM)MickMack Wrote:  Any claim that the refs cost UCF anything last night is next level ******* stupid.

Any claim that the refs didn't cost UCF anything last night is next level ******* stupid.
11-22-2020 12:27 PM
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Post: #26
RE: UCF Fans - Are you happy with Josh Heupel?
(11-22-2020 07:21 AM)Z-Fly Wrote:  First off, I come in peace.

He seems like a good not great coach. He kind of reminds me of Butch Jones. He’ll keep you in the top third of the league, but that’s about it. I hated that about Butch.

Maybe, I’m way off, and you guys feel like he can take you to the promised land again. Anyways, I’m curious of your thoughts.

It's a hell of a tall order to go undefeated every year, and UCF isn't Alabama or Clemson. No one is.

They lost to Tulsa and Memphis, and you, Cincy. All of which are very, very good. I don't think it's as much them being in decline as it is the conference is really improving year after year. They need to take their losses like men and get ready for next season. Expecting to be undefeated every season is delusional.
11-22-2020 02:02 PM
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CitrusUCF Offline
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Post: #27
RE: UCF Fans - Are you happy with Josh Heupel?
(11-22-2020 02:02 PM)PuddlePirate Wrote:  
(11-22-2020 07:21 AM)Z-Fly Wrote:  First off, I come in peace.

He seems like a good not great coach. He kind of reminds me of Butch Jones. He’ll keep you in the top third of the league, but that’s about it. I hated that about Butch.

Maybe, I’m way off, and you guys feel like he can take you to the promised land again. Anyways, I’m curious of your thoughts.

It's a hell of a tall order to go undefeated every year, and UCF isn't Alabama or Clemson. No one is.

They lost to Tulsa and Memphis, and you, Cincy. All of which are very, very good. I don't think it's as much them being in decline as it is the conference is really improving year after year. They need to take their losses like men and get ready for next season. Expecting to be undefeated every season is delusional.

I don't think much of the fanbase expects to go undefeated every year. I think there's a lot of frustration with two straight years of decline, going 0-6 in one score games, and blowing double digit leads in most of those losses.
11-22-2020 02:50 PM
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Post: #28
RE: UCF Fans - Are you happy with Josh Heupel?
(11-22-2020 12:08 PM)Lurkercat Wrote:  
(11-22-2020 11:49 AM)CitrusUCF Wrote:  
(11-22-2020 09:42 AM)mlb Wrote:  In my opinion they had their most important players on the field last night and still lost... The refs.

Sent from my SM-N970U using Tapatalk

I will accept no argument that the refs favored UCF last night. The inadvertent whistle clearly screwed UC, but they scored anyway.

The refs blew an obvious fumble recovery by UCF. It is clear as day on video that UCF recovered and had possession of the ball with the player down. If that is ruled correctly and UCF scores again there, the game is more or less over.

Additionally, UC was not called for holding all night. The announcers even highlighted a play where the center was downfield and held clearly. You could put together a highlight tape of all the holding that occurred and was not called.

Further, the play where UC should have been called for targeting on Gabriel and instead UCF was flagged for the OL defending his QB despite the Cincy player jawing and getting in Gabriel's face. Absolutely ridiculous.

The AAC has awful refs. Consistently awful. There were blown calls on both teams, but Cincinnati was the overall big beneficiary of blown calls.

Ucf could be called for holding all night too so that's a wash

Big hits are not targeting. Gabriel thinks he's going to get lightly shoved out of bounds because he's a qb then gets mad when he gets hit. Unless you can show me a clip that shows helmet to helmet, it looked like he led with the shoulder

Since we're complaining about the refs, that whistle that brought back the Whyle touchdown was one of the worst things I've ever seen. Absolutely pathetic reffing. Also ucf apparently gets to push the pile for 10 minutes whereas uc gets the play blown dead as soon as a ucf defender touches them. Ucf got a td and 2 pt conversion that should've been stopped because of forward progress, but they let the pile get pushed forever
I’m not blaming the loss on the refs but that was textbook targeting, led with the crown of the helmet to Gabriel’s head/neck area. The fact they didn’t even review it makes it even worse.
(This post was last modified: 11-22-2020 02:51 PM by BraveKnight.)
11-22-2020 02:50 PM
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Post: #29
RE: UCF Fans - Are you happy with Josh Heupel?
(11-22-2020 02:50 PM)BraveKnight Wrote:  
(11-22-2020 12:08 PM)Lurkercat Wrote:  
(11-22-2020 11:49 AM)CitrusUCF Wrote:  
(11-22-2020 09:42 AM)mlb Wrote:  In my opinion they had their most important players on the field last night and still lost... The refs.

Sent from my SM-N970U using Tapatalk

I will accept no argument that the refs favored UCF last night. The inadvertent whistle clearly screwed UC, but they scored anyway.

The refs blew an obvious fumble recovery by UCF. It is clear as day on video that UCF recovered and had possession of the ball with the player down. If that is ruled correctly and UCF scores again there, the game is more or less over.

Additionally, UC was not called for holding all night. The announcers even highlighted a play where the center was downfield and held clearly. You could put together a highlight tape of all the holding that occurred and was not called.

Further, the play where UC should have been called for targeting on Gabriel and instead UCF was flagged for the OL defending his QB despite the Cincy player jawing and getting in Gabriel's face. Absolutely ridiculous.

The AAC has awful refs. Consistently awful. There were blown calls on both teams, but Cincinnati was the overall big beneficiary of blown calls.

Ucf could be called for holding all night too so that's a wash

Big hits are not targeting. Gabriel thinks he's going to get lightly shoved out of bounds because he's a qb then gets mad when he gets hit. Unless you can show me a clip that shows helmet to helmet, it looked like he led with the shoulder

Since we're complaining about the refs, that whistle that brought back the Whyle touchdown was one of the worst things I've ever seen. Absolutely pathetic reffing. Also ucf apparently gets to push the pile for 10 minutes whereas uc gets the play blown dead as soon as a ucf defender touches them. Ucf got a td and 2 pt conversion that should've been stopped because of forward progress, but they let the pile get pushed forever
I’m not blaming the loss on the refs but that was textbook targeting, led with the crown of the helmet to Gabriel’s head/neck area. The fact they didn’t even review it makes it even worse.

Do you know if there's a clip or anything of that hit? I'd love to see it again. I don't remember it being head to head and I don't even think the announcers said anything about it
11-22-2020 03:07 PM
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BraveKnight Online
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Post: #30
RE: UCF Fans - Are you happy with Josh Heupel?
(11-22-2020 03:07 PM)Lurkercat Wrote:  
(11-22-2020 02:50 PM)BraveKnight Wrote:  
(11-22-2020 12:08 PM)Lurkercat Wrote:  
(11-22-2020 11:49 AM)CitrusUCF Wrote:  
(11-22-2020 09:42 AM)mlb Wrote:  In my opinion they had their most important players on the field last night and still lost... The refs.

Sent from my SM-N970U using Tapatalk

I will accept no argument that the refs favored UCF last night. The inadvertent whistle clearly screwed UC, but they scored anyway.

The refs blew an obvious fumble recovery by UCF. It is clear as day on video that UCF recovered and had possession of the ball with the player down. If that is ruled correctly and UCF scores again there, the game is more or less over.

Additionally, UC was not called for holding all night. The announcers even highlighted a play where the center was downfield and held clearly. You could put together a highlight tape of all the holding that occurred and was not called.

Further, the play where UC should have been called for targeting on Gabriel and instead UCF was flagged for the OL defending his QB despite the Cincy player jawing and getting in Gabriel's face. Absolutely ridiculous.

The AAC has awful refs. Consistently awful. There were blown calls on both teams, but Cincinnati was the overall big beneficiary of blown calls.

Ucf could be called for holding all night too so that's a wash

Big hits are not targeting. Gabriel thinks he's going to get lightly shoved out of bounds because he's a qb then gets mad when he gets hit. Unless you can show me a clip that shows helmet to helmet, it looked like he led with the shoulder

Since we're complaining about the refs, that whistle that brought back the Whyle touchdown was one of the worst things I've ever seen. Absolutely pathetic reffing. Also ucf apparently gets to push the pile for 10 minutes whereas uc gets the play blown dead as soon as a ucf defender touches them. Ucf got a td and 2 pt conversion that should've been stopped because of forward progress, but they let the pile get pushed forever
I’m not blaming the loss on the refs but that was textbook targeting, led with the crown of the helmet to Gabriel’s head/neck area. The fact they didn’t even review it makes it even worse.

Do you know if there's a clip or anything of that hit? I'd love to see it again. I don't remember it being head to head and I don't even think the announcers said anything about it
I can’t find one but I was very close to it and it was clear as day that it was helmet to helmet. Even if they missed it on the field, they still should’ve reviewed it at least.
11-22-2020 03:18 PM
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PuddlePirate Offline
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Post: #31
RE: UCF Fans - Are you happy with Josh Heupel?
(11-22-2020 02:50 PM)CitrusUCF Wrote:  
(11-22-2020 02:02 PM)PuddlePirate Wrote:  
(11-22-2020 07:21 AM)Z-Fly Wrote:  First off, I come in peace.

He seems like a good not great coach. He kind of reminds me of Butch Jones. He’ll keep you in the top third of the league, but that’s about it. I hated that about Butch.

Maybe, I’m way off, and you guys feel like he can take you to the promised land again. Anyways, I’m curious of your thoughts.

It's a hell of a tall order to go undefeated every year, and UCF isn't Alabama or Clemson. No one is.

They lost to Tulsa and Memphis, and you, Cincy. All of which are very, very good. I don't think it's as much them being in decline as it is the conference is really improving year after year. They need to take their losses like men and get ready for next season. Expecting to be undefeated every season is delusional.

I don't think much of the fanbase expects to go undefeated every year. I think there's a lot of frustration with two straight years of decline, going 0-6 in one score games, and blowing double digit leads in most of those losses.

I get what you're saying. I went back to re-read your first post about Heupel to make sure I understood it. I'm not discounting your point. What I'm saying is that the top 3rd of this league is excellent and they play to win too. That needs to be acknowledged. It's not all UCF is in decline.
11-22-2020 03:53 PM
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CitrusUCF Offline
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Post: #32
RE: UCF Fans - Are you happy with Josh Heupel?
(11-22-2020 03:53 PM)PuddlePirate Wrote:  
(11-22-2020 02:50 PM)CitrusUCF Wrote:  
(11-22-2020 02:02 PM)PuddlePirate Wrote:  
(11-22-2020 07:21 AM)Z-Fly Wrote:  First off, I come in peace.

He seems like a good not great coach. He kind of reminds me of Butch Jones. He’ll keep you in the top third of the league, but that’s about it. I hated that about Butch.

Maybe, I’m way off, and you guys feel like he can take you to the promised land again. Anyways, I’m curious of your thoughts.

It's a hell of a tall order to go undefeated every year, and UCF isn't Alabama or Clemson. No one is.

They lost to Tulsa and Memphis, and you, Cincy. All of which are very, very good. I don't think it's as much them being in decline as it is the conference is really improving year after year. They need to take their losses like men and get ready for next season. Expecting to be undefeated every season is delusional.

I don't think much of the fanbase expects to go undefeated every year. I think there's a lot of frustration with two straight years of decline, going 0-6 in one score games, and blowing double digit leads in most of those losses.

I get what you're saying. I went back to re-read your first post about Heupel to make sure I understood it. I'm not discounting your point. What I'm saying is that the top 3rd of this league is excellent and they play to win too. That needs to be acknowledged. It's not all UCF is in decline.

Honestly, I think it's the Pitt and Tulsa losses last year that have resulted in people being pissed about this year. We were the clear more talented team in both of those games. Had we not blown those two games and only lost to Cincy, I don't think people would be griping nearly as much about this year given that one loss is to a much improved Tulsa team and the other is on a missed FG to Memphis. That sort of thing happens, but the ball doesn't randomly bounce against you 6 times out of 6, so even though we had some good luck in 2017-18, there's some sort of explanation needed for 0-6 in one score games besides "the other team was good too." I'd argue that except maybe for the Cincy game this year, we were the more talented team in every game, so going 0-5 as the superior team in close games just doesn't cut it and it raises a lot of questions about Heupel's ability to coach under pressure. I don't think anyone doubts his ability to dominate inferior teams, but he has a problem getting it done when things get tough.
(This post was last modified: 11-22-2020 04:14 PM by CitrusUCF.)
11-22-2020 04:02 PM
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C1ncy4Life Offline
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Post: #33
RE: UCF Fans - Are you happy with Josh Heupel?
Gabriel hit...He led with his shoulder, IMO. He didn’t launch with his head down and with the crown of his helmet. QB is a runner at that point and if we are going to call a penalty every time helmets make contact with a runner then I’m not sure we can play football anymore. Doesn’t seem like what the rule was created for IMO.

Also, complaining that the OL and Gabriel started shoving players after the whistle isn’t an argument. Would it be ok for UC players to start shoving UCF players after blown calls?

Last, this was also on the drive that was helped by one of the phantom PI calls to help move the ball downfield and gave them a new set of Downs.

Edit: In terms of Heupel, I do think Freeman has outcoached/out schemes UCF the last 2 years, but even if you agree with that it doesn’t make Heupel a bad coach. I think he is still a good coach but it’s still to be determined if he is a great coach. The AAC has only gotten better since 2018 and part of that may well be due to the attention UCF brought the conference.

Still early in his tenure and they have plenty of talent for the coming years.
(This post was last modified: 11-22-2020 04:50 PM by C1ncy4Life.)
11-22-2020 04:46 PM
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PuddlePirate Offline
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Post: #34
RE: UCF Fans - Are you happy with Josh Heupel?
(11-22-2020 04:02 PM)CitrusUCF Wrote:  
(11-22-2020 03:53 PM)PuddlePirate Wrote:  
(11-22-2020 02:50 PM)CitrusUCF Wrote:  
(11-22-2020 02:02 PM)PuddlePirate Wrote:  
(11-22-2020 07:21 AM)Z-Fly Wrote:  First off, I come in peace.

He seems like a good not great coach. He kind of reminds me of Butch Jones. He’ll keep you in the top third of the league, but that’s about it. I hated that about Butch.

Maybe, I’m way off, and you guys feel like he can take you to the promised land again. Anyways, I’m curious of your thoughts.

It's a hell of a tall order to go undefeated every year, and UCF isn't Alabama or Clemson. No one is.

They lost to Tulsa and Memphis, and you, Cincy. All of which are very, very good. I don't think it's as much them being in decline as it is the conference is really improving year after year. They need to take their losses like men and get ready for next season. Expecting to be undefeated every season is delusional.

I don't think much of the fanbase expects to go undefeated every year. I think there's a lot of frustration with two straight years of decline, going 0-6 in one score games, and blowing double digit leads in most of those losses.

I get what you're saying. I went back to re-read your first post about Heupel to make sure I understood it. I'm not discounting your point. What I'm saying is that the top 3rd of this league is excellent and they play to win too. That needs to be acknowledged. It's not all UCF is in decline.

Honestly, I think it's the Pitt and Tulsa losses last year that have resulted in people being pissed about this year. We were the clear more talented team in both of those games. Had we not blown those two games and only lost to Cincy, I don't think people would be griping nearly as much about this year given that one loss is to a much improved Tulsa team and the other is on a missed FG to Memphis. That sort of thing happens, but the ball doesn't randomly bounce against you 6 times out of 6, so even though we had some good luck in 2017-18, there's some sort of explanation needed for 0-6 in one score games besides "the other team was good too." I'd argue that except maybe for the Cincy game this year, we were the more talented team in every game, so going 0-5 as the superior team in close games just doesn't cut it and it raises a lot of questions about Heupel's ability to coach under pressure. I don't think anyone doubts his ability to dominate inferior teams, but he has a problem getting it done when things get tough.

Fair enough. 04-cheers
11-22-2020 04:48 PM
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Post: #35
RE: UCF Fans - Are you happy with Josh Heupel?
Heupel is exactly what he has always been. A glorified coordinator masquerading as a head coach. We tried to kill two birds with one stone, and get a HC + play caller to afford Randy Shannon. The problem is we went cheap on the most important position to a college football team. A head coach is supposed to be a leader of men. Even the greatest playcallers who are head coaches, like Andy Reid, have playcallers because when things hit the fan their team needs them. Heupel is too busy staring into his play sheet which has maybe 6 plays total on it. Our players were fighting at the end of the Tulsa game, that shows a complete lack of leadership. The reason we didn’t have that problem in his first year was because of Milton. Since then we are 1-7 in one possession games. Like with anything in life, you get what you pay for. We didn’t get a real coach and now we’re playing like it. The problem is we don’t have an out. Danny White foolishly extended a coach who didn’t earn it, and now has a 10+ million buyout. 2-3 years of mediocrity minimum
11-22-2020 04:54 PM
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HoopsJunky Offline
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Post: #36
RE: UCF Fans - Are you happy with Josh Heupel?
(11-22-2020 12:27 PM)CitrusUCF Wrote:  
(11-22-2020 12:20 PM)MickMack Wrote:  Any claim that the refs cost UCF anything last night is next level ******* stupid.

Any claim that the refs didn't cost UCF anything last night is next level ******* stupid.

Scary that somebody could watch the game and think UCF was on the wrong side of the calls
(This post was last modified: 11-22-2020 09:03 PM by HoopsJunky.)
11-22-2020 08:58 PM
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HoopsJunky Offline
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RE: UCF Fans - Are you happy with Josh Heupel?
How has UCF’s last few recruiting classes been?

Do they lose much to graduation?
11-22-2020 09:00 PM
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Post: #38
RE: UCF Fans - Are you happy with Josh Heupel?
(11-22-2020 09:00 PM)HoopsJunky Wrote:  How has UCF’s last few recruiting classes been?

Do they lose much to graduation?

Recruiting has been awful. The team is relatively young though
11-22-2020 10:56 PM
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Posts: 6,494
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I Root For: UCF
Location: NW Ark.
Post: #39
RE: UCF Fans - Are you happy with Josh Heupel?
(11-22-2020 08:58 PM)HoopsJunky Wrote:  
(11-22-2020 12:27 PM)CitrusUCF Wrote:  
(11-22-2020 12:20 PM)MickMack Wrote:  Any claim that the refs cost UCF anything last night is next level ******* stupid.

Any claim that the refs didn't cost UCF anything last night is next level ******* stupid.

Scary that somebody could watch the game and think UCF was on the wrong side of the calls

Back at you in reverse.
11-22-2020 11:21 PM
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rath v2.0 Offline
Wartime Consigliere
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Posts: 37,757
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I Root For: ΜΟΛΩΝ ΛΑΒΕ
Location: Tip Of The Mitt

Donators
Post: #40
RE: UCF Fans - Are you happy with Josh Heupel?
Someone needs a hug.
11-23-2020 07:35 AM
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