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Houston Owl 2 Offline
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Post: #161
RE: Rice @UNT game thread
My understanding was that Juma got a slight injury in practice on Wednesday or Thursday and wasn't at full strength...better safe than sorry in that situation.
11-24-2020 11:11 AM
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mrbig Offline
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Post: #162
RE: Rice @UNT game thread
Its weird that the Saints have spent the last couple years finding snaps for Taysom Hill while future HOF Drew Brees is the QB, but Bloomgren can't find snaps for future HOF Jovoni Johnson while Collins is the QB.

** To be clear, I am both making a serious point, and also a joke
(This post was last modified: 11-24-2020 11:58 AM by mrbig.)
11-24-2020 11:57 AM
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Rice Dad Offline
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Post: #163
RE: Rice @UNT game thread
(11-24-2020 11:57 AM)mrbig Wrote:  Its weird that the Saints have spent the last couple years finding snaps for Taysom Hill while future HOF Drew Brees is the QB, but Bloomgren can't find snaps for future HOF Jovoni Johnson while Collins is the QB.

** To be clear, I am both making a serious point, and also a joke

Neither Bloomgren nor Mack have a clue how to develop QBs, but blame them every week for the failures in the offense (which are design and play calling problems more than anything). As someone else pointed out, Bloom did not call the offense at Stanford (Shaw does) and they were only good with NFL HOF level talent. Bloom has never called this offense and has CUSA level talent (anyone think we don't have a QB as good as the kid NTexas had Saturday?).

Bloom needs to get rid of Mack and hire a FCS/D2/3 or HS OC/QB coach that has strong recruiting ties in Texas, and turn it over completely to run a spread offense that all the kids in Texas play and know how to play. I think I may do a longer post over the holiday weekend about the "lack of talent" Bloom has had at QB in his 3 years, as compared to what other schools in CUSA have that tend to beat us. For those of us who watch HS kids in Texas, Bloom's excuses really add up to lack of ability to develop.
11-24-2020 12:52 PM
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Justice2318 Offline
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Post: #164
RE: Rice @UNT game thread
(11-24-2020 11:11 AM)Houston Owl 2 Wrote:  My understanding was that Juma got a slight injury in practice on Wednesday or Thursday and wasn't at full strength...better safe than sorry in that situation.

Thanks any word on his status for this weekend?
11-24-2020 01:07 PM
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Post: #165
RE: Rice @UNT game thread
(11-21-2020 03:02 PM)OptimisticOwl Wrote:  
(11-21-2020 03:00 PM)Tomball Owl Wrote:  Well that decision to go for it on 4th down certainly blew up in Bloomgren’s face.


We sure gave a lot of grief to Bailiff for not gambling in those situations, but I sure would like to have the 3 points right now.

I didn't read this whole thread but wondered what the commentary was about this.

I can't speak for others but my issue with things like this is situational. Up 10-0, no clock issues with the defense playing well and on the 19 yard line going in, I think you take the points and keep the momentum. Down 10-0, MAYBE you go for it. 4th and 2 from the 40 and a light legged kicker, you go for it. Those were the ones that angered me about Bailiff. He had a big legged kicker AND a mediocre defense. The LAST thing he should have been doing was punting from near mid-field. This wasn't 'that', IMO.
11-24-2020 02:32 PM
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Owl 69/70/75 Online
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Post: #166
RE: Rice @UNT game thread
(11-24-2020 10:56 AM)Tomball Owl Wrote:  
(11-24-2020 10:34 AM)franklyconfused Wrote:  
(11-23-2020 08:50 PM)Tomball Owl Wrote:  
(11-23-2020 04:41 PM)Owl 69/70/75 Wrote:  
(11-23-2020 10:38 AM)Tomball Owl Wrote:  I think the Texans, definitely a mess coming out of BOB’s reign, answered that question on Sunday. At least the Texans realized they couldn’t run the ball and allowed their QB to do what he does.
Speaking of BOB's former employers, we've won more games than Penn State.
Pretty dramatic fall since going into their 1st game ranked #8. Haven’t paid any attention to what’s going on with them. Are they missing numerous key pieces?
They've had a key receiver opt out prior to the start of practice, and then a few running backs got injured in fall camp. I think they lost a key lineman to a season-ending surgery after the first game, too. On top of that, Franklin has said he's personally struggling with separation from his family (immuno-compromised child, so his wife is keeping the kids in Florida during the pandemic).
Thanks for the update! Sounds like multiple things have lined up against them.

They also lost about half their coaching staff. One of their assistants was hired to a HC job somewhere, and took about half the staff with him.
11-24-2020 07:12 PM
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Owl 69/70/75 Online
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Post: #167
RE: Rice @UNT game thread
(11-24-2020 12:52 PM)Rice Dad Wrote:  
(11-24-2020 11:57 AM)mrbig Wrote:  Its weird that the Saints have spent the last couple years finding snaps for Taysom Hill while future HOF Drew Brees is the QB, but Bloomgren can't find snaps for future HOF Jovoni Johnson while Collins is the QB.
** To be clear, I am both making a serious point, and also a joke
Neither Bloomgren nor Mack have a clue how to develop QBs, but blame them every week for the failures in the offense (which are design and play calling problems more than anything). As someone else pointed out, Bloom did not call the offense at Stanford (Shaw does) and they were only good with NFL HOF level talent. Bloom has never called this offense and has CUSA level talent (anyone think we don't have a QB as good as the kid NTexas had Saturday?).
Bloom needs to get rid of Mack and hire a FCS/D2/3 or HS OC/QB coach that has strong recruiting ties in Texas, and turn it over completely to run a spread offense that all the kids in Texas play and know how to play. I think I may do a longer post over the holiday weekend about the "lack of talent" Bloom has had at QB in his 3 years, as compared to what other schools in CUSA have that tend to beat us. For those of us who watch HS kids in Texas, Bloom's excuses really add up to lack of ability to develop.

I'm not sure how much is inability to develop a QB and how much is that we really don't have a system that fits well with the players we can recruit. I don't know how well you can develop someone to do something that he can't do. Mack has run a spread, so he should be able to coordinate it. I do agree that the lack of Texas recruiting connections is a significant problem.

I remember when Matt Rhule came to Baylor with no Texas ties. Among his first moves were to hire a coach who had just won three state championships and the president of the Texas HS Coaches Association. It obviously worked well. Bloomgren should have made similar hires, along with hiring a few Rice alums.

I said from the start that I had a feeling that the hardest thing about this "pound the rock" offense might be finding a QB to run it. So far, so bad.

I think any offense where we are committed to having a drop-back QB is going to be a problem. Texas HS kids don't run that kind of scheme. We've tried 3 graduate transfers in 3 years and so far have 6 wins in those 3 years. That's not getting it done. There's a reason why those guys weren't starting at a top program before. We're not getting Joe Burrow or Jalen Hurts caliber talent.

I've said several times that the QB we can get is the athlete that TexasU or aTm tells, "Come here and we can make you a defensive back," but he wants to play QB at this level. And that's not going to be a drop-back QB. So we need an offense where the QB runs some and can also throw.

What I guess I'm saying is that the QB we can recruit is Jovoni Johnson. So design and offense that he can run, give him the ball and let him develop, and stop screwing around with grad transfers who will be basically one and done.
11-24-2020 07:25 PM
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ruowls Offline
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Post: #168
RE: Rice @UNT game thread
(11-24-2020 07:25 PM)Owl 69/70/75 Wrote:  
(11-24-2020 12:52 PM)Rice Dad Wrote:  
(11-24-2020 11:57 AM)mrbig Wrote:  Its weird that the Saints have spent the last couple years finding snaps for Taysom Hill while future HOF Drew Brees is the QB, but Bloomgren can't find snaps for future HOF Jovoni Johnson while Collins is the QB.
** To be clear, I am both making a serious point, and also a joke
Neither Bloomgren nor Mack have a clue how to develop QBs, but blame them every week for the failures in the offense (which are design and play calling problems more than anything). As someone else pointed out, Bloom did not call the offense at Stanford (Shaw does) and they were only good with NFL HOF level talent. Bloom has never called this offense and has CUSA level talent (anyone think we don't have a QB as good as the kid NTexas had Saturday?).
Bloom needs to get rid of Mack and hire a FCS/D2/3 or HS OC/QB coach that has strong recruiting ties in Texas, and turn it over completely to run a spread offense that all the kids in Texas play and know how to play. I think I may do a longer post over the holiday weekend about the "lack of talent" Bloom has had at QB in his 3 years, as compared to what other schools in CUSA have that tend to beat us. For those of us who watch HS kids in Texas, Bloom's excuses really add up to lack of ability to develop.

I'm not sure how much is inability to develop a QB and how much is that we really don't have a system that fits well with the players we can recruit. I don't know how well you can develop someone to do something that he can't do. Mack has run a spread, so he should be able to coordinate it. I do agree that the lack of Texas recruiting connections is a significant problem.

I remember when Matt Rhule came to Baylor with no Texas ties. Among his first moves were to hire a coach who had just won three state championships and the president of the Texas HS Coaches Association. It obviously worked well. Bloomgren should have made similar hires, along with hiring a few Rice alums.

I said from the start that I had a feeling that the hardest thing about this "pound the rock" offense might be finding a QB to run it. So far, so bad.

I think any offense where we are committed to having a drop-back QB is going to be a problem. Texas HS kids don't run that kind of scheme. We've tried 3 graduate transfers in 3 years and so far have 6 wins in those 3 years. That's not getting it done. There's a reason why those guys weren't starting at a top program before. We're not getting Joe Burrow or Jalen Hurts caliber talent.

I've said several times that the QB we can get is the athlete that TexasU or aTm tells, "Come here and we can make you a defensive back," but he wants to play QB at this level. And that's not going to be a drop-back QB. So we need an offense where the QB runs some and can also throw.

What I guess I'm saying is that the QB we can recruit is Jovoni Johnson. So design and offense that he can run, give him the ball and let him develop, and stop screwing around with grad transfers who will be basically one and done.

You don’t need a superior athlete at QB either. You need a superior processor.
11-24-2020 09:04 PM
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ruowls Offline
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Post: #169
RE: Rice @UNT game thread
(11-24-2020 12:05 AM)Ourland Wrote:  
(11-23-2020 04:01 PM)ruowls Wrote:  
(11-23-2020 02:52 PM)Ourland Wrote:  TOP only matters when you score. It pressures the opposition to keep up with limited opportunity/time. It's one of the advantages of running the triple option.

What exactly does the triple option do if you don't score?
As you state, the stressor is scoring. Just do the math. If you decrease the denominator, it increases the importance of the numerator. In other words, it is easier to match scoring and get the one stop you need than it is to match NOT scoring with fewer opportunities.

The key is matching scoring which is independent of any offensive scheme or clock manipulation. Now if you HAVE a significant lead, then decreasing opportunities would be beneficial if your lead is larger than the opportunities needed to catch up.

When an offense dominates TOP, it's highly likely that it's scoring touchdowns as well. Most 15-play drives end with a touchdown. So, not only are you scoring, but you're also decreasing the opponent's opportunities.

That’s a pretty big assumption. Show me that stats that prove this. It seems this is your opinion which may not be supported by the stats.

The reason I harp on the triple option so much is because it's the only effective offense that Rice can reasonably execute, given the program's consistent lack of talent. We haven't had a great quarterback since Chase Clement left twelve years ago. Bloomgren still hasn't been able to land a great quarterback, and he's supposed to be an amazing recruiter. LOL!

Again, that is your opinion. I bet you can cobble an offense together that would be pretty good with players that Rice can recruit.
11-24-2020 09:13 PM
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Owl 69/70/75 Online
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Post: #170
RE: Rice @UNT game thread
(11-24-2020 09:04 PM)ruowls Wrote:  
(11-24-2020 07:25 PM)Owl 69/70/75 Wrote:  
(11-24-2020 12:52 PM)Rice Dad Wrote:  
(11-24-2020 11:57 AM)mrbig Wrote:  Its weird that the Saints have spent the last couple years finding snaps for Taysom Hill while future HOF Drew Brees is the QB, but Bloomgren can't find snaps for future HOF Jovoni Johnson while Collins is the QB.
** To be clear, I am both making a serious point, and also a joke
Neither Bloomgren nor Mack have a clue how to develop QBs, but blame them every week for the failures in the offense (which are design and play calling problems more than anything). As someone else pointed out, Bloom did not call the offense at Stanford (Shaw does) and they were only good with NFL HOF level talent. Bloom has never called this offense and has CUSA level talent (anyone think we don't have a QB as good as the kid NTexas had Saturday?).
Bloom needs to get rid of Mack and hire a FCS/D2/3 or HS OC/QB coach that has strong recruiting ties in Texas, and turn it over completely to run a spread offense that all the kids in Texas play and know how to play. I think I may do a longer post over the holiday weekend about the "lack of talent" Bloom has had at QB in his 3 years, as compared to what other schools in CUSA have that tend to beat us. For those of us who watch HS kids in Texas, Bloom's excuses really add up to lack of ability to develop.
I'm not sure how much is inability to develop a QB and how much is that we really don't have a system that fits well with the players we can recruit. I don't know how well you can develop someone to do something that he can't do. Mack has run a spread, so he should be able to coordinate it. I do agree that the lack of Texas recruiting connections is a significant problem.
I remember when Matt Rhule came to Baylor with no Texas ties. Among his first moves were to hire a coach who had just won three state championships and the president of the Texas HS Coaches Association. It obviously worked well. Bloomgren should have made similar hires, along with hiring a few Rice alums.
I said from the start that I had a feeling that the hardest thing about this "pound the rock" offense might be finding a QB to run it. So far, so bad.
I think any offense where we are committed to having a drop-back QB is going to be a problem. Texas HS kids don't run that kind of scheme. We've tried 3 graduate transfers in 3 years and so far have 6 wins in those 3 years. That's not getting it done. There's a reason why those guys weren't starting at a top program before. We're not getting Joe Burrow or Jalen Hurts caliber talent.
I've said several times that the QB we can get is the athlete that TexasU or aTm tells, "Come here and we can make you a defensive back," but he wants to play QB at this level. And that's not going to be a drop-back QB. So we need an offense where the QB runs some and can also throw.
What I guess I'm saying is that the QB we can recruit is Jovoni Johnson. So design and offense that he can run, give him the ball and let him develop, and stop screwing around with grad transfers who will be basically one and done.
You don’t need a superior athlete at QB either. You need a superior processor.

Which gets back to development. But my point is that what we can get is the athlete who can play QB, rather than the QB specialist. What a coach has to do is recognize this, and then figure out how to develop that particular kind of QB.
11-24-2020 10:31 PM
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Owl 69/70/75 Online
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Post: #171
RE: Rice @UNT game thread
(11-24-2020 09:13 PM)ruowls Wrote:  
(11-24-2020 12:05 AM)Ourland Wrote:  
(11-23-2020 04:01 PM)ruowls Wrote:  
(11-23-2020 02:52 PM)Ourland Wrote:  TOP only matters when you score. It pressures the opposition to keep up with limited opportunity/time. It's one of the advantages of running the triple option.
What exactly does the triple option do if you don't score?
As you state, the stressor is scoring. Just do the math. If you decrease the denominator, it increases the importance of the numerator. In other words, it is easier to match scoring and get the one stop you need than it is to match NOT scoring with fewer opportunities.
The key is matching scoring which is independent of any offensive scheme or clock manipulation. Now if you HAVE a significant lead, then decreasing opportunities would be beneficial if your lead is larger than the opportunities needed to catch up.
When an offense dominates TOP, it's highly likely that it's scoring touchdowns as well. Most 15-play drives end with a touchdown. So, not only are you scoring, but you're also decreasing the opponent's opportunities.
That’s a pretty big assumption. Show me that stats that prove this. It seems this is your opinion which may not be supported by the stats.
Quote:The reason I harp on the triple option so much is because it's the only effective offense that Rice can reasonably execute, given the program's consistent lack of talent. We haven't had a great quarterback since Chase Clement left twelve years ago. Bloomgren still hasn't been able to land a great quarterback, and he's supposed to be an amazing recruiter. LOL!
Again, that is your opinion. I bet you can cobble an offense together that would be pretty good with players that Rice can recruit.

I would bet that you could. Unfortunately, this staff can't seem to.

I would like to know how Mack is taking this. His offense was a spread that looked like something that would work for us. He can't be happy being forced unto this "pound the rock" scheme.
11-24-2020 10:36 PM
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ruowls Offline
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Post: #172
RE: Rice @UNT game thread
(11-24-2020 10:31 PM)Owl 69/70/75 Wrote:  
(11-24-2020 09:04 PM)ruowls Wrote:  
(11-24-2020 07:25 PM)Owl 69/70/75 Wrote:  
(11-24-2020 12:52 PM)Rice Dad Wrote:  
(11-24-2020 11:57 AM)mrbig Wrote:  Its weird that the Saints have spent the last couple years finding snaps for Taysom Hill while future HOF Drew Brees is the QB, but Bloomgren can't find snaps for future HOF Jovoni Johnson while Collins is the QB.
** To be clear, I am both making a serious point, and also a joke
Neither Bloomgren nor Mack have a clue how to develop QBs, but blame them every week for the failures in the offense (which are design and play calling problems more than anything). As someone else pointed out, Bloom did not call the offense at Stanford (Shaw does) and they were only good with NFL HOF level talent. Bloom has never called this offense and has CUSA level talent (anyone think we don't have a QB as good as the kid NTexas had Saturday?).
Bloom needs to get rid of Mack and hire a FCS/D2/3 or HS OC/QB coach that has strong recruiting ties in Texas, and turn it over completely to run a spread offense that all the kids in Texas play and know how to play. I think I may do a longer post over the holiday weekend about the "lack of talent" Bloom has had at QB in his 3 years, as compared to what other schools in CUSA have that tend to beat us. For those of us who watch HS kids in Texas, Bloom's excuses really add up to lack of ability to develop.
I'm not sure how much is inability to develop a QB and how much is that we really don't have a system that fits well with the players we can recruit. I don't know how well you can develop someone to do something that he can't do. Mack has run a spread, so he should be able to coordinate it. I do agree that the lack of Texas recruiting connections is a significant problem.
I remember when Matt Rhule came to Baylor with no Texas ties. Among his first moves were to hire a coach who had just won three state championships and the president of the Texas HS Coaches Association. It obviously worked well. Bloomgren should have made similar hires, along with hiring a few Rice alums.
I said from the start that I had a feeling that the hardest thing about this "pound the rock" offense might be finding a QB to run it. So far, so bad.
I think any offense where we are committed to having a drop-back QB is going to be a problem. Texas HS kids don't run that kind of scheme. We've tried 3 graduate transfers in 3 years and so far have 6 wins in those 3 years. That's not getting it done. There's a reason why those guys weren't starting at a top program before. We're not getting Joe Burrow or Jalen Hurts caliber talent.
I've said several times that the QB we can get is the athlete that TexasU or aTm tells, "Come here and we can make you a defensive back," but he wants to play QB at this level. And that's not going to be a drop-back QB. So we need an offense where the QB runs some and can also throw.
What I guess I'm saying is that the QB we can recruit is Jovoni Johnson. So design and offense that he can run, give him the ball and let him develop, and stop screwing around with grad transfers who will be basically one and done.
You don’t need a superior athlete at QB either. You need a superior processor.

Which gets back to development. But my point is that what we can get is the athlete who can play QB, rather than the QB specialist. What a coach has to do is recognize this, and then figure out how to develop that particular kind of QB.

I guess I have a hard time labeling a QB a specialist. What makes a QB unique is his ability exploit an identified weakness. All you need is a baseline of run and throw ability. It is a continuum with a combination of both in varying degrees in any QB. Multiple combinations of both can exploit an observed weakness and as such doesn’t require a single skill set combination.
11-24-2020 11:04 PM
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ruowls Offline
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Post: #173
RE: Rice @UNT game thread
(11-24-2020 10:31 PM)Owl 69/70/75 Wrote:  
(11-24-2020 09:04 PM)ruowls Wrote:  
(11-24-2020 07:25 PM)Owl 69/70/75 Wrote:  
(11-24-2020 12:52 PM)Rice Dad Wrote:  
(11-24-2020 11:57 AM)mrbig Wrote:  Its weird that the Saints have spent the last couple years finding snaps for Taysom Hill while future HOF Drew Brees is the QB, but Bloomgren can't find snaps for future HOF Jovoni Johnson while Collins is the QB.
** To be clear, I am both making a serious point, and also a joke
Neither Bloomgren nor Mack have a clue how to develop QBs, but blame them every week for the failures in the offense (which are design and play calling problems more than anything). As someone else pointed out, Bloom did not call the offense at Stanford (Shaw does) and they were only good with NFL HOF level talent. Bloom has never called this offense and has CUSA level talent (anyone think we don't have a QB as good as the kid NTexas had Saturday?).
Bloom needs to get rid of Mack and hire a FCS/D2/3 or HS OC/QB coach that has strong recruiting ties in Texas, and turn it over completely to run a spread offense that all the kids in Texas play and know how to play. I think I may do a longer post over the holiday weekend about the "lack of talent" Bloom has had at QB in his 3 years, as compared to what other schools in CUSA have that tend to beat us. For those of us who watch HS kids in Texas, Bloom's excuses really add up to lack of ability to develop.
I'm not sure how much is inability to develop a QB and how much is that we really don't have a system that fits well with the players we can recruit. I don't know how well you can develop someone to do something that he can't do. Mack has run a spread, so he should be able to coordinate it. I do agree that the lack of Texas recruiting connections is a significant problem.
I remember when Matt Rhule came to Baylor with no Texas ties. Among his first moves were to hire a coach who had just won three state championships and the president of the Texas HS Coaches Association. It obviously worked well. Bloomgren should have made similar hires, along with hiring a few Rice alums.
I said from the start that I had a feeling that the hardest thing about this "pound the rock" offense might be finding a QB to run it. So far, so bad.
I think any offense where we are committed to having a drop-back QB is going to be a problem. Texas HS kids don't run that kind of scheme. We've tried 3 graduate transfers in 3 years and so far have 6 wins in those 3 years. That's not getting it done. There's a reason why those guys weren't starting at a top program before. We're not getting Joe Burrow or Jalen Hurts caliber talent.
I've said several times that the QB we can get is the athlete that TexasU or aTm tells, "Come here and we can make you a defensive back," but he wants to play QB at this level. And that's not going to be a drop-back QB. So we need an offense where the QB runs some and can also throw.
What I guess I'm saying is that the QB we can recruit is Jovoni Johnson. So design and offense that he can run, give him the ball and let him develop, and stop screwing around with grad transfers who will be basically one and done.
You don’t need a superior athlete at QB either. You need a superior processor.

Which gets back to development. But my point is that what we can get is the athlete who can play QB, rather than the QB specialist. What a coach has to do is recognize this, and then figure out how to develop that particular kind of QB.

If you don’t know what is important to develop, you are bound to be less successful than expected. In other words, if you prioritize garbage, you will get garbage.
11-24-2020 11:07 PM
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Owl 69/70/75 Online
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Post: #174
RE: Rice @UNT game thread
(11-24-2020 11:04 PM)ruowls Wrote:  I guess I have a hard time labeling a QB a specialist. What makes a QB unique is his ability exploit an identified weakness. All you need is a baseline of run and throw ability. It is a continuum with a combination of both in varying degrees in any QB. Multiple combinations of both can exploit an observed weakness and as such doesn’t require a single skill set combination.

As long as the offense can adapt to where the QB is on that continuum, yes. This offense does not appear to have that ability.
11-24-2020 11:39 PM
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Post: #175
RE: Rice @UNT game thread
(11-24-2020 09:13 PM)ruowls Wrote:  
(11-24-2020 12:05 AM)Ourland Wrote:  
(11-23-2020 04:01 PM)ruowls Wrote:  
(11-23-2020 02:52 PM)Ourland Wrote:  TOP only matters when you score. It pressures the opposition to keep up with limited opportunity/time. It's one of the advantages of running the triple option.

What exactly does the triple option do if you don't score?
As you state, the stressor is scoring. Just do the math. If you decrease the denominator, it increases the importance of the numerator. In other words, it is easier to match scoring and get the one stop you need than it is to match NOT scoring with fewer opportunities.

The key is matching scoring which is independent of any offensive scheme or clock manipulation. Now if you HAVE a significant lead, then decreasing opportunities would be beneficial if your lead is larger than the opportunities needed to catch up.

When an offense dominates TOP, it's highly likely that it's scoring touchdowns as well. Most 15-play drives end with a touchdown. So, not only are you scoring, but you're also decreasing the opponent's opportunities.

That’s a pretty big assumption. Show me that stats that prove this. It seems this is your opinion which may not be supported by the stats.

The reason I harp on the triple option so much is because it's the only effective offense that Rice can reasonably execute, given the program's consistent lack of talent. We haven't had a great quarterback since Chase Clement left twelve years ago. Bloomgren still hasn't been able to land a great quarterback, and he's supposed to be an amazing recruiter. LOL!

Again, that is your opinion. I bet you can cobble an offense together that would be pretty good with players that Rice can recruit.

You show me the stats. Prove me wrong. Also, if Rice could cobble together consistently good offenses year in and year out with the limited talent on hand, wouldn't it have happened by now?
(This post was last modified: 11-25-2020 02:10 AM by Ourland.)
11-25-2020 02:01 AM
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Owl 69/70/75 Online
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Post: #176
RE: Rice @UNT game thread
(11-25-2020 02:01 AM)Ourland Wrote:  You show me the stats. Prove me wrong. Also, if Rice could cobble together consistently good offenses year in and year out with the limited talent on hand, wouldn't it have happened by now?

Since 2007, Rice has been trying to force players into a system, rather than adapting the system to reflect the skills of the players that it has.

Bailiff's idea was we have this system, and when we can recruit players who fit the system, then we will be okay. We kept forcing square pegs into round holes, and that worked a couple of time, but even then we were a team with some significant weaknesses--the defense (particularly the secondary) and special teams being two fairly consistent ones. He had two corners who played on Sundays (Callahan and Gaines) and his secondary was still awful, and he had two kickers that one did and one could have played on Sundays (Martens and Boz) but he never built strong special teams around them. The thing that I could never understand is that Bailiff's background was as a defensive coach, he had clearly a defensive philosophy, and he was at least peripherally involved in the development of TCU's effective scheme (although that mostly happened after he left), but his teams never really played good defense or special teams.

Bloomgren has improved special teams and the defense, but his offense is maybe the worst possible fit for the athletes that Rice can recruit, and he seems unwilling to change. If we could recruit Andrew Luck (who almost came here) then perhaps we could make this go, but would Andrew Luck be inclined to come to this dumpster fire?

IMO, to be successful at Rice, you have to be able to adapt to what you have. Some years you might just have the people to do exactly what you want to do. Some years you won't. And winning in those years when you don't have exactly what you want is going to be the key.

I always liked Fred's philosophy--play sound defense, win the kicking game, and have a good QB, and you can beat anyone. I also liked Ken's idea that you can win by doing something better than everybody else (the out-athlete approach) or by doing something different from everybody else (the flexbone). I think Rice has to be contrarian as much as possible, to make preparation harder for opponents and to fit what is often going to be a non-standard talent set. I don't necessarily mean that as an endorsement of the flexbone as much as an endorsement of something contrarian. It sure as heck is not an endorsement of "pound the rock" or whatever Bailiff's approach was.
(This post was last modified: 11-25-2020 09:47 AM by Owl 69/70/75.)
11-25-2020 08:29 AM
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WRCisforgotten79 Offline
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Post: #177
RE: Rice @UNT game thread
Andrew Luck.
11-25-2020 09:18 AM
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Owl 69/70/75 Online
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Post: #178
RE: Rice @UNT game thread
(11-25-2020 09:18 AM)WRCisforgotten79 Wrote:  Andrew Luck.

Thanks, corrected.
11-25-2020 09:47 AM
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ruowls Offline
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Post: #179
RE: Rice @UNT game thread
(11-25-2020 02:01 AM)Ourland Wrote:  
(11-24-2020 09:13 PM)ruowls Wrote:  
(11-24-2020 12:05 AM)Ourland Wrote:  
(11-23-2020 04:01 PM)ruowls Wrote:  
(11-23-2020 02:52 PM)Ourland Wrote:  TOP only matters when you score. It pressures the opposition to keep up with limited opportunity/time. It's one of the advantages of running the triple option.

What exactly does the triple option do if you don't score?
As you state, the stressor is scoring. Just do the math. If you decrease the denominator, it increases the importance of the numerator. In other words, it is easier to match scoring and get the one stop you need than it is to match NOT scoring with fewer opportunities.

The key is matching scoring which is independent of any offensive scheme or clock manipulation. Now if you HAVE a significant lead, then decreasing opportunities would be beneficial if your lead is larger than the opportunities needed to catch up.

When an offense dominates TOP, it's highly likely that it's scoring touchdowns as well. Most 15-play drives end with a touchdown. So, not only are you scoring, but you're also decreasing the opponent's opportunities.

That’s a pretty big assumption. Show me that stats that prove this. It seems this is your opinion which may not be supported by the stats.

The reason I harp on the triple option so much is because it's the only effective offense that Rice can reasonably execute, given the program's consistent lack of talent. We haven't had a great quarterback since Chase Clement left twelve years ago. Bloomgren still hasn't been able to land a great quarterback, and he's supposed to be an amazing recruiter. LOL!

Again, that is your opinion. I bet you can cobble an offense together that would be pretty good with players that Rice can recruit.

You show me the stats. Prove me wrong. Also, if Rice could cobble together consistently good offenses year in and year out with the limited talent on hand, wouldn't it have happened by now?

Here you go.

https://www.bcftoys.com/2020-fei/

Parse it how you want.
Of the three Acadamies, Air Force does the best and Army the least. Not surprisingly, the Academy that uses the pass the most is the highest ranked and the team that uses it the least is last.
11-25-2020 11:25 AM
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Post: #180
RE: Rice @UNT game thread
I thought we settled this 15 years ago, when we, The Parliament, declared the Hatfield offense outdated, predictable, and boring.
11-25-2020 11:45 AM
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