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Tomball Owl Offline
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Post: #141
RE: Rice @UNT game thread
And somehow ESPN is showing Rice with a 86.9% chance of winning vs. UTEP next weekend.
11-21-2020 09:10 PM
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Texasowl Offline
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Post: #142
RE: Rice @UNT game thread
Hard to win with three turnovers. The offensive line did not play well. There may be some changes the next game Anyway, this year in college football is really waste of time no matter what conference is playing. Hard to evaluate how good or bad a team really is.
11-21-2020 10:00 PM
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mrbig Online
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Post: #143
RE: Rice @UNT game thread
I only watched the 2nd half, but to my eyes Collins looks pretty good on mid-range passesbut really hasn’t looked good on deep balls. I understand throwing enough deep balls to keep defenses a little stretched, but that has looked over utilized at times given the success he has found with passes going 5-15 yards downfield.

I do think the high number of sacks makes the running stats looks worse than reality and the passing game stats better than reality. Something that needs to be remembered when looking at yards/carry or passing yards.
11-21-2020 11:18 PM
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Hank16 Offline
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Post: #144
RE: Rice @UNT game thread
(11-21-2020 05:14 PM)owlcarlos Wrote:  
(11-21-2020 05:08 PM)Barney Wrote:  Well, that was certainly an uninspired performance.
Seems as if the team took those 2 lost weeks and just decided to write off this season, more or less.
We were in total control -- then a failed 4th and 1, followed by Trammell's mistake....and we just folded.

In that 4th and 1, Rice should have used the wildcat with Jovoni Johnson!

Actually good with that, Collins turns his shoulder in when he is about to make contact.
11-21-2020 11:18 PM
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gsloth Offline
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Post: #145
RE: Rice @UNT game thread
(11-21-2020 06:12 PM)DFW Owl Wrote:  
(11-21-2020 05:21 PM)Tomball Owl Wrote:  
(11-21-2020 05:02 PM)owlcarlos Wrote:  UNT- poor rush defense!

Not today! They convinced the Owls to run 36 times for all of 49 yards.

Oh wait, maybe it’s not the UNT rush defense?

All the sacks didn't help the rushing total.

I went through the PBP. Colins was sacked 7 time for -52 yards. So Rice's rushing was 29 times for 101 yards - still below 4 yards per carry. Just not good.
11-21-2020 11:32 PM
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Tomball Owl Offline
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Post: #146
RE: Rice @UNT game thread
(11-21-2020 05:26 PM)texowl2 Wrote:  Question is which is a bigger mess-Rice or the Texans.

I think the Texans, definitely a mess coming out of BOB’s reign, answered that question on Sunday. At least the Texans realized they couldn’t run the ball and allowed their QB to do what he does.
11-23-2020 10:38 AM
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Buho00 Offline
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Post: #147
RE: Rice @UNT game thread
(11-21-2020 11:32 PM)gsloth Wrote:  
(11-21-2020 06:12 PM)DFW Owl Wrote:  
(11-21-2020 05:21 PM)Tomball Owl Wrote:  
(11-21-2020 05:02 PM)owlcarlos Wrote:  UNT- poor rush defense!

Not today! They convinced the Owls to run 36 times for all of 49 yards.

Oh wait, maybe it’s not the UNT rush defense?

All the sacks didn't help the rushing total.

I went through the PBP. Colins was sacked 7 time for -52 yards. So Rice's rushing was 29 times for 101 yards - still below 4 yards per carry. Just not good.

Our run offense is the most predictable and easiest to adjust to in a game that I've ever seen. Not sure how Stanford had success with this offense, obviously it helped having all world guys like Luck, McCafree, and Love with a solid defense. Stanford is winless this season though. It's over - just not a good college system in my opinion.

Not sure I've seen a better prepared Rice team - we haven't allowed a score on opening drives in 12 straight games! We also look pretty good on offense in first quarters. But never seen such a lack of in-game adjustments. Other teams adjust, we don't or can't because of our scheme. And this is against really BAD defenses like MTS and UNT. It happens time and time again.

Collins is a good a thrower as I've seen at QB in the past 20 years at Rice. But in college, without a spread offense, it doesn't mean as much as a QB who can scramble and make something happen on broken plays. Would we have fared better with with Jovani Johnson at QB? Hard to say but I bet we'd be better in the second halves. If you saw him last year, he moves the offense vs bad defenses by making plays on third downs with his legs and that keeps defenses somewhat off balance, something we lack when the run game is stopped, with Collins at QB, where passing game becomes predictable and the pass rush increases. I'd go 2-QBs the rest of the way with Collins getting most snaps, to at least be more versatile. Again, this has been versus really, really bad defenses. This offense doesn't work. It takes several games for Bloomgren to realize it each season. He needs to switch the scheme for good, like yesterday.

The Southern Miss game was a fluke. Had their QB not gotten hurt, adjustments were looming like we've seen in most other games, S Miss was going to come back and win, we only scored 1 TD in second half and it helped that their offense was so bad with their freshman bacckup QB in that we had the ball a ton. The comeback vs MTSU was also somewhat of a fluke, their defense was so bad we were able to catch up by just throwing it deep to Tramell. It's not sustainable.

Our defense is good for Rice standards, that has not been the problem.

For one quarter we looked like it would be a total Rice blowout vs UNT. The rest of the game was an embarrassment and further proof that Bloomgren is not yet a good HC at this level. He wasn't facing Saban. At best, we're the C-USA poor man's version of Rex Ryan Jets. Nobody wants that.
11-23-2020 12:25 PM
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ruowls Offline
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Post: #148
RE: Rice @UNT game thread
Here is my take.
The goal of the offense is to score points. As Tomball Owl posted about TOP, the are no bonus points for holding on to the ball. So, TOP is irrelevant. I will concede that it does reduce scoring opportunities. But this only helps if your defense is efficient in stopping the other team from scoring in some of their limited opportunities in a greater proportion than you (basically the same situation as a shootout).
The other key component of an offense is to control the game. This is essentially what the "pound the rock" is trying to do (under the false premise of shortening the game and controlling TOP). But what is really important is an offense that can control the tempo and momentum of the game when it has to. What this really does is increases the efficiency of your defense.
As to the passing game, it is easier to set up the run with the pass than set up the pass with the run. Even a crappy passing game can amass 300 yards while only rushing for 50. But if you can't control the game you still lose by 10.

With a few tweaks to the passing game and a change in the overall approach to offense, Rice could be better than it has shown and be much more consistent.
11-23-2020 01:29 PM
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Ourland Offline
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Post: #149
RE: Rice @UNT game thread
TOP only matters when you score. It pressures the opposition to keep up with limited opportunity/time. It's one of the advantages of running the triple option.
(This post was last modified: 11-23-2020 02:53 PM by Ourland.)
11-23-2020 02:52 PM
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ruowls Offline
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Post: #150
RE: Rice @UNT game thread
(11-23-2020 02:52 PM)Ourland Wrote:  TOP only matters when you score. It pressures the opposition to keep up with limited opportunity/time. It's one of the advantages of running the triple option.

What exactly does the triple option do if you don't score?
As you state, the stressor is scoring. Just do the math. If you decrease the denominator, it increases the importance of the numerator. In other words, it is easier to match scoring and get the one stop you need than it is to match NOT scoring with fewer opportunities.

The key is matching scoring which is independent of any offensive scheme or clock manipulation. Now if you HAVE a significant lead, then decreasing opportunities would be beneficial if your lead is larger than the opportunities needed to catch up.
11-23-2020 04:01 PM
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Owl 69/70/75 Online
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Post: #151
RE: Rice @UNT game thread
(11-23-2020 10:38 AM)Tomball Owl Wrote:  
(11-21-2020 05:26 PM)texowl2 Wrote:  Question is which is a bigger mess-Rice or the Texans.
I think the Texans, definitely a mess coming out of BOB’s reign, answered that question on Sunday. At least the Texans realized they couldn’t run the ball and allowed their QB to do what he does.

Speaking of BOB's former employers, we've won more games than Penn State.
11-23-2020 04:41 PM
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Tomball Owl Offline
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Post: #152
RE: Rice @UNT game thread
(11-23-2020 04:41 PM)Owl 69/70/75 Wrote:  
(11-23-2020 10:38 AM)Tomball Owl Wrote:  
(11-21-2020 05:26 PM)texowl2 Wrote:  Question is which is a bigger mess-Rice or the Texans.
I think the Texans, definitely a mess coming out of BOB’s reign, answered that question on Sunday. At least the Texans realized they couldn’t run the ball and allowed their QB to do what he does.

Speaking of BOB's former employers, we've won more games than Penn State.

Pretty dramatic fall since going into their 1st game ranked #8. Haven’t paid any attention to what’s going on with them. Are they missing numerous key pieces?
11-23-2020 08:50 PM
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Ourland Offline
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Post: #153
RE: Rice @UNT game thread
(11-23-2020 04:01 PM)ruowls Wrote:  
(11-23-2020 02:52 PM)Ourland Wrote:  TOP only matters when you score. It pressures the opposition to keep up with limited opportunity/time. It's one of the advantages of running the triple option.

What exactly does the triple option do if you don't score?
As you state, the stressor is scoring. Just do the math. If you decrease the denominator, it increases the importance of the numerator. In other words, it is easier to match scoring and get the one stop you need than it is to match NOT scoring with fewer opportunities.

The key is matching scoring which is independent of any offensive scheme or clock manipulation. Now if you HAVE a significant lead, then decreasing opportunities would be beneficial if your lead is larger than the opportunities needed to catch up.

When an offense dominates TOP, it's highly likely that it's scoring touchdowns as well. Most 15-play drives end with a touchdown. So, not only are you scoring, but you're also decreasing the opponent's opportunities.

The reason I harp on the triple option so much is because it's the only effective offense that Rice can reasonably execute, given the program's consistent lack of talent. We haven't had a great quarterback since Chase Clement left twelve years ago. Bloomgren still hasn't been able to land a great quarterback, and he's supposed to be an amazing recruiter. LOL!
(This post was last modified: 11-24-2020 12:21 AM by Ourland.)
11-24-2020 12:05 AM
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Post: #154
RE: Rice @UNT game thread
(11-24-2020 12:05 AM)Ourland Wrote:  Bloomgren still hasn't been able to land OR DEVELOP a great quarterback,
11-24-2020 01:18 AM
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Ourland Offline
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Post: #155
RE: Rice @UNT game thread
(11-24-2020 01:18 AM)OptimisticOwl Wrote:  
(11-24-2020 12:05 AM)Ourland Wrote:  Bloomgren still hasn't been able to land OR DEVELOP a great quarterback,

+1. At this point, I have very little faith in Mike Bloomgren. He doesn't strike me as a guy who has the patience or ability to coach up a young QB. We should pray that Collins returns next season. If not, we're starting all over again with another grad transfer who may or may not have talent. If I were Jovani Johnson, I'd transfer out. His talents are wasted at Rice.
11-24-2020 02:11 AM
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Ricefootballnet Offline
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Post: #156
RE: Rice @UNT game thread
(11-24-2020 02:11 AM)Ourland Wrote:  
(11-24-2020 01:18 AM)OptimisticOwl Wrote:  
(11-24-2020 12:05 AM)Ourland Wrote:  Bloomgren still hasn't been able to land OR DEVELOP a great quarterback,

+1. At this point, I have very little faith in Mike Bloomgren. He doesn't strike me as a guy who has the patience or ability to coach up a young QB. We should pray that Collins returns next season. If not, we're starting all over again with another grad transfer who may or may not have talent. If I were Jovani Johnson, I'd transfer out. His talents are wasted at Rice.

It's unbelievable to me that Jovoni is left on the bench for 60 minutes, every game. A guy with that kind of talent needs to be on the field somewhere, at least some of the time. Wildcat-type QB. Put him in the slot and get him some balls in space where he can go one on one-- my favorite notion. If he's got the hands, WR for a few plays. Special teams. Insert him in there as a wild card that can make our offense a tad less predictable. He's a smart kid; he can retain his QB knowledge and continue to caucus with the QBs while getting a chance to show what he's got.

I suppose the theory is that he needs to keep healthy and fresh because these days more often than not your number one QB goes down with injury at some point in the season.

But it's frustrating not seeing him out there for at least a few plays.

When I saw him on the practice field as a true freshman, I thought, this is the guy who can be our quarterback for four years. Taylor McHargue with better wheels (sorry, TH).

But I don't know nothin'. Haven't played a down of football since I was a senior in high school, 1967. We ran the winged-T and a 6-2-2-1 defense in those prehistoric days.
11-24-2020 09:51 AM
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Justice2318 Offline
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Post: #157
RE: Rice @UNT game thread
Does anyone know why Juma didn't play?
11-24-2020 10:32 AM
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Post: #158
RE: Rice @UNT game thread
(11-23-2020 08:50 PM)Tomball Owl Wrote:  
(11-23-2020 04:41 PM)Owl 69/70/75 Wrote:  
(11-23-2020 10:38 AM)Tomball Owl Wrote:  
(11-21-2020 05:26 PM)texowl2 Wrote:  Question is which is a bigger mess-Rice or the Texans.
I think the Texans, definitely a mess coming out of BOB’s reign, answered that question on Sunday. At least the Texans realized they couldn’t run the ball and allowed their QB to do what he does.

Speaking of BOB's former employers, we've won more games than Penn State.

Pretty dramatic fall since going into their 1st game ranked #8. Haven’t paid any attention to what’s going on with them. Are they missing numerous key pieces?

They've had a key receiver opt out prior to the start of practice, and then a few running backs got injured in fall camp. I think they lost a key lineman to a season-ending surgery after the first game, too. On top of that, Franklin has said he's personally struggling with separation from his family (immuno-compromised child, so his wife is keeping the kids in Florida during the pandemic).
11-24-2020 10:34 AM
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Tomball Owl Offline
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Post: #159
RE: Rice @UNT game thread
(11-24-2020 10:34 AM)franklyconfused Wrote:  
(11-23-2020 08:50 PM)Tomball Owl Wrote:  
(11-23-2020 04:41 PM)Owl 69/70/75 Wrote:  
(11-23-2020 10:38 AM)Tomball Owl Wrote:  
(11-21-2020 05:26 PM)texowl2 Wrote:  Question is which is a bigger mess-Rice or the Texans.
I think the Texans, definitely a mess coming out of BOB’s reign, answered that question on Sunday. At least the Texans realized they couldn’t run the ball and allowed their QB to do what he does.

Speaking of BOB's former employers, we've won more games than Penn State.

Pretty dramatic fall since going into their 1st game ranked #8. Haven’t paid any attention to what’s going on with them. Are they missing numerous key pieces?

They've had a key receiver opt out prior to the start of practice, and then a few running backs got injured in fall camp. I think they lost a key lineman to a season-ending surgery after the first game, too. On top of that, Franklin has said he's personally struggling with separation from his family (immuno-compromised child, so his wife is keeping the kids in Florida during the pandemic).

Thanks for the update! Sounds like multiple things have lined up against them.
11-24-2020 10:56 AM
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Ourland Offline
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Post: #160
RE: Rice @UNT game thread
(11-24-2020 09:51 AM)Ricefootballnet Wrote:  
(11-24-2020 02:11 AM)Ourland Wrote:  
(11-24-2020 01:18 AM)OptimisticOwl Wrote:  
(11-24-2020 12:05 AM)Ourland Wrote:  Bloomgren still hasn't been able to land OR DEVELOP a great quarterback,

+1. At this point, I have very little faith in Mike Bloomgren. He doesn't strike me as a guy who has the patience or ability to coach up a young QB. We should pray that Collins returns next season. If not, we're starting all over again with another grad transfer who may or may not have talent. If I were Jovani Johnson, I'd transfer out. His talents are wasted at Rice.

It's unbelievable to me that Jovoni is left on the bench for 60 minutes, every game. A guy with that kind of talent needs to be on the field somewhere, at least some of the time. Wildcat-type QB. Put him in the slot and get him some balls in space where he can go one on one-- my favorite notion. If he's got the hands, WR for a few plays. Special teams. Insert him in there as a wild card that can make our offense a tad less predictable. He's a smart kid; he can retain his QB knowledge and continue to caucus with the QBs while getting a chance to show what he's got.

I suppose the theory is that he needs to keep healthy and fresh because these days more often than not your number one QB goes down with injury at some point in the season.

But it's frustrating not seeing him out there for at least a few plays.

When I saw him on the practice field as a true freshman, I thought, this is the guy who can be our quarterback for four years. Taylor McHargue with better wheels (sorry, TH).

But I don't know nothin'. Haven't played a down of football since I was a senior in high school, 1967. We ran the winged-T and a 6-2-2-1 defense in those prehistoric days.

Agree. Johnson is so talented. He belongs on the field.
11-24-2020 11:06 AM
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