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2 1/2 hours to Nooch's first NFL start. May there be many more. Cowboys-Eagles in-gam
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Dukes84 Offline
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Post: #41
RE: 2 1/2 hours to Nooch's first NFL start. May there be many more. Cowboys-Eagles in-gam
(11-02-2020 09:30 AM)Wear Purple Wrote:  A few thoughts in no particular odor...

1. I actually thought they did a disservice to Ben coming out with the gimmicky offensive stuff. I would've thought they'd get some early easy throws (like quick outs) to build some confidence for Ben instead of flanking him out, running wildcat stuff, etc. It looked like Dallas was playing out of desperation offensively right from the first series. I think their approach should've been give it to Zeke, low risk passes for Ben, roll Ben out where he can use his legs, and definitely definitely definitely some screen passes to Elliott. Difficult for Ben to build any rhythm whatsoever when he's being flanked out as a decoy WR.

2. As I stated in the Pro Dukes thread, Ben was/is trying out for 32 clubs. Hopefully, even if he doesn't stick with Dallas (and I think he very well may) that there is enough respect around the league about McCarthy regarding he has seen enough in Ben scouting college film to draft him to start with and then in practices and so forth to start him. I really hope Ben gets more chances as I think he'll get better moving forward just from experience, though D's O-Line remains an issue. They need to give him a chance and not be a circus sideshow like they were for much of the 1st half last night with gimmicky desperation football.

3. I was impressed with the research NBC had done and presented during the broadcast regarding Ben's ties to McCarthy's brother being his hoops coach way back when and how HC McCarthy ran into Ben at Frisco (national title game). Chris Collinsworth's voice is like fingernails down a chalkboard to me, but otherwise he is a knowledgeable analyst and usually does a good job - I think he did last night breaking down Ben.

True. I didn't realize that McCarthy's brother had passed away. He looked young in that picture with Ben from 10 or 12 years ago. Referred to him as late brother, I thought.
11-02-2020 09:36 AM
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Purple Offline
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Post: #42
RE: 2 1/2 hours to Nooch's first NFL start. May there be many more. Cowboys-Eagles in-gam
Ben didn't look great last night, but was still better than Leon Redbone, I mean Wentz. Nooch's best run was called back for holding. I thought there should have been more designed runs for Nooch and RPO. The wind was also a huge factor in the passing game for both QBs, plus the timing on passes was clearly off due to Nooch's limited practice time with the first team. You don't develop great timing and chemistry in a week.

I think Nooch will see more time under center this season as I just don't think Dalton is as good as Nooch. More experienced, yes, but I think he is going to continue to stink up the field.
11-02-2020 09:41 AM
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fishingduke12 Offline
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Post: #43
RE: 2 1/2 hours to Nooch's first NFL start. May there be many more. Cowboys-Eagles in-gam
At this point Dallas is at a crossroads. They are still very much in play for the division but the question is do they want to win the division with a record most likely at 6-10? If they make the playoffs as the NFC east champ (and likely the worst playoff record) they are automatically assigned the 21st pick at best in next years draft (assuming they lose in the wildcard round). They are potentially looking at a top 10 or better pick if they dont make the playoffs. If i was Jerry I'd roll with dinucci and let him take his bumps and bruises along the way as ugly as it may be
11-02-2020 09:59 AM
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Dukester Online
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Post: #44
RE: 2 1/2 hours to Nooch's first NFL start. May there be many more. Cowboys-Eagles in-gam
(11-02-2020 09:59 AM)fishingduke12 Wrote:  At this point Dallas is at a crossroads. They are still very much in play for the division but the question is do they want to win the division with a record most likely at 6-10? If they make the playoffs as the NFC east champ (and likely the worst playoff record) they are automatically assigned the 21st pick at best in next years draft (assuming they lose in the wildcard round). They are potentially looking at a top 10 or better pick if they dont make the playoffs. If i was Jerry I'd roll with dinucci and let him take his bumps and bruises along the way as ugly as it may be

Eagles, Cowboys, and sadly Washington have not thrown in the towel for this season. No way I would throw the towel in if I was with the talent Dallas has. It's not like they are going to get that great of a pick either way. Hard to imagine one way or another Dallas does not win 5 games. 6 or 7 wins likely get them in the playoffs. Why tank? It won't make that much difference in draft if they make the playoff with 7 wins versus tanking with Ben and winning 4 or 5.
11-02-2020 10:07 AM
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jmufan2008 Offline
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Post: #45
RE: 2 1/2 hours to Nooch's first NFL start. May there be many more. Cowboys-Eagles in-gam
Plus they showed the remaining schedules for the Cowboys and Eagles against teams with winning records...2 for Dallas vs. like 5-6 for the Eagles. Dallas has an incredibly easy road:
Steelers and Ravens are losses
49ers (4-4) at home
Vikings (2-5) and Bengals (2-5)
and then they have one game vs each of the NFC East left

If they can get just a little better they still have a shot at the division. I agree it'd be better to let it ride with Ben and just cut him loose to do RPOs and mix it up once Dalton is out of concussion protocol. I doubt they'll keep Ben as the starter, but it would be nice.
11-02-2020 10:13 AM
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Dukester Online
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Post: #46
RE: 2 1/2 hours to Nooch's first NFL start. May there be many more. Cowboys-Eagles in-gam
The new goal - Andy plays and get's them to the playoffs, and gets injured the last regular season game of the season.

Ben becomes the first JMU QB to start an NFL playoff game.

04-cheers
(This post was last modified: 11-02-2020 10:15 AM by Dukester.)
11-02-2020 10:15 AM
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fishingduke12 Offline
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Post: #47
RE: 2 1/2 hours to Nooch's first NFL start. May there be many more. Cowboys-Eagles in-gam
(11-02-2020 10:07 AM)Dukester Wrote:  
(11-02-2020 09:59 AM)fishingduke12 Wrote:  At this point Dallas is at a crossroads. They are still very much in play for the division but the question is do they want to win the division with a record most likely at 6-10? If they make the playoffs as the NFC east champ (and likely the worst playoff record) they are automatically assigned the 21st pick at best in next years draft (assuming they lose in the wildcard round). They are potentially looking at a top 10 or better pick if they dont make the playoffs. If i was Jerry I'd roll with dinucci and let him take his bumps and bruises along the way as ugly as it may be

Eagles, Cowboys, and sadly Washington have not thrown in the towel for this season. No way I would throw the towel in if I was with the talent Dallas has. It's not like they are going to get that great of a pick either way. Hard to imagine one way or another Dallas does not win 5 games. 6 or 7 wins likely get them in the playoffs. Why tank? It won't make that much difference in draft if they make the playoff with 7 wins versus tanking with Ben and winning 4 or 5.

I think the difference between a top ten pick, potentially even top 5, and the ability to get a top flight lineman for their terrible Oline vs getting a bottom third pick is well worth it. This team is not going to do anything the playoffs, Dalton may get you 1-2 more wins that Dinucci would. Its no so much tanking as setting you up for the future where you have a backup that has half a season of game experience under his belt. Dalton is only on a 1 year contract and not likely to get offered an extension with Dallas. Yes Dallas has a ton of talent on the outside but with Zack martin as their only capable lineman, that talent is essentially worthless just look at the last three weeks.
11-02-2020 10:22 AM
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Duke Dawg Offline
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Post: #48
RE: 2 1/2 hours to Nooch's first NFL start. May there be many more. Cowboys-Eagles in-gam
i mean, let's be real. Nooch's performance wasn't great.

but he was a rook thrown to the wolves on a bad team. That was sort of to be expected in your first game (Tua didn't have a great debut either).

but Wentz .....he's been around awhile now. I'd be much more concerned as an Eagles fan to how bad he looked than if I was a Boys fan worried about their QB situation.
11-02-2020 11:05 AM
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olddawg Offline
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Post: #49
RE: 2 1/2 hours to Nooch's first NFL start. May there be many more. Cowboys-Eagles in-gam
I pretty much echo what everyone else has said. It wasn't a game that moved the needle. That said, his current situation had a stronger likelihood of producing a bad game rather than a good game-that didn't happen, so that is a positive.

The only other thing I see (other than speeding up his internal clock in sensing the pressure) is ball security. I realize his line is not helping him, but he has coughed up the ball several times on hard/ blindside hits. Not sure if there are techniques for improving on this. There are QBs that amaze me with their ability to absorb huge, blindside hits yet still hold onto the ball. For now, I just chalk it up to his learning curve involving the speed of the game. But ball security will be something I'll be tracking going forward.
11-02-2020 11:14 AM
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Purplehazed Offline
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Post: #50
RE: 2 1/2 hours to Nooch's first NFL start. May there be many more. Cowboys-Eagles in-gam
How many people, ever, have done what nooch did last night? If he can squeeze 4 yrs as a backup qb in the nfl he did right by himself big time.

Save your money nooch
11-02-2020 11:35 AM
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Dukester Online
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Post: #51
RE: 2 1/2 hours to Nooch's first NFL start. May there be many more. Cowboys-Eagles in-gam
(11-02-2020 11:35 AM)Purplehazed Wrote:  How many people, ever, have done what nooch did last night? If he can squeeze 4 yrs as a backup qb in the nfl he did right by himself big time.

Save your money nooch

Nobody from JMU, but if some of our past QBs has had the opportunity I think they could of done as well, or better.
11-02-2020 11:48 AM
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TribePride91 Offline
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Post: #52
RE: 2 1/2 hours to Nooch's first NFL start. May there be many more. Cowboys-Eagles in-gam
Nooch was terrible, but it was not unexpected. He will get better if he gets a chance to play. Not much to see this upcoming weekend as he will likely get destroyed by the Steelers defense. Dalton would be better served to sit the next 2 weeks through the Cowboys bye.

Dallas isn't going to win more than 3 more games regardless of who the QB is. Their O-line and their defense are that bad. It would be a good opportunity for Ben though as few backups ever get to play at all, much less a 7th rounder playing potentially 8 more games. I do think he got a little better as the game wore on, but he struggled with accuracy and the speed of the NFL game. The lack of practice and preseason almost certainly hurt any gains he might have made. It is not like he was expected to get any reps at all. I give him credit for hanging in there. Had he not fumbled twice, they were in position to steal a win. As for the draft, Cowboys need all kinds of help on the O-Line and on defense(especially in the secondary). But, I would rank all four of the NFC East teams in the bottom 5 of the league with the Jets.

Great for Nooch. Sean Lissemore(W&M) made a nice living as a 7th round Defensive End for Dallas and San Diego. Nooch just needs to stick for 3-4 years to do the same. Wentz not torching the Dallas D is a big warning sign for him. But, he has been hit a lot this season.
11-02-2020 12:00 PM
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Wear Purple Offline
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Post: #53
RE: 2 1/2 hours to Nooch's first NFL start. May there be many more. Cowboys-Eagles in-gam
(11-02-2020 10:07 AM)Dukester Wrote:  No way I would throw the towel in if I was with the talent Dallas has.

While I agree with your premise, I always giggle just a bit whenever I hear or read about how much "talent" Dallas has. They haven't been to a conference championship game in 25 years. That's TWENTY FIIIIIIIIIIIVE!

Every year in Week 1's episode of Fox NFL Today show or whatever it's called, Howie Long does his annual drooling session where he has his nose stuck 8 feet up Jerry Jones' buttocks talking about how "talented" Dallas is and so forth. And every year it seems they underachieve - at least versus all this so-called "talent" they have.

As long as Dallas' defense is what it is in 2020, they aren't winning the NFC East...no matter how sorry the rest of the division is. And, it's sorry. Ben isn't going to change that. Sorry, I'm just not seeing all this "talent" and if it exists, then really question why they are so horrible, especially on defense. They are historically bad defensively as some graphics during the game last night pointed out. Not meaning to dump on you, btw. Just, I've heard about all this so-called talent they have for over 2 decades and getting closer to 3. It's old and tired for an organization that routinely underachieves.

For full disclosure, being a long-time WFT/Redskins fan, we are no better. It's been 29 years since we've seen a NFC championship game appearance. The difference is though for most of this terrible near-30-year drought nobody is drooling over our talent every year like the Punks. Maybe one day they will, but as long as Danny Boy is the owner I highly doubt it.
11-02-2020 02:39 PM
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Dukester Online
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Post: #54
RE: 2 1/2 hours to Nooch's first NFL start. May there be many more. Cowboys-Eagles in-gam
(11-02-2020 02:39 PM)Wear Purple Wrote:  
(11-02-2020 10:07 AM)Dukester Wrote:  No way I would throw the towel in if I was with the talent Dallas has.

While I agree with your premise, I always giggle just a bit whenever I hear or read about how much "talent" Dallas has. They haven't been to a conference championship game in 25 years. That's TWENTY FIIIIIIIIIIIVE!

Every year in Week 1's episode of Fox NFL Today show or whatever it's called, Howie Long does his annual drooling session where he has his nose stuck 8 feet up Jerry Jones' buttocks talking about how "talented" Dallas is and so forth. And every year it seems they underachieve - at least versus all this so-called "talent" they have.

As long as Dallas' defense is what it is in 2020, they aren't winning the NFC East...no matter how sorry the rest of the division is. And, it's sorry. Ben isn't going to change that. Sorry, I'm just not seeing all this "talent" and if it exists, then really question why they are so horrible, especially on defense. They are historically bad defensively as some graphics during the game last night pointed out. Not meaning to dump on you, btw. Just, I've heard about all this so-called talent they have for over 2 decades and getting closer to 3. It's old and tired for an organization that routinely underachieves.

For full disclosure, being a long-time WFT/Redskins fan, we are no better. It's been 29 years since we've seen a NFC championship game appearance. The difference is though for most of this terrible near-30-year drought nobody is drooling over our talent every year like the Punks. Maybe one day they will, but as long as Danny Boy is the owner I highly doubt it.

I hate Dallas (and love to see them "struggle" 03-lmfao) - but man the receivers and running backs are as good as anyone in the NFL.

I still can't understand how they are so bad with what I figured would be a upgrade at head coach. I know they've had a lot of injuries, but their performance is a head scratcher to me.
11-02-2020 02:48 PM
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TribePride91 Offline
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Post: #55
RE: 2 1/2 hours to Nooch's first NFL start. May there be many more. Cowboys-Eagles in-gam
It actually is easy to understand why Dallas is so awful.

1) Their O line is terrible. Instead of Smith, Martin, Frederick, Collins and Looney, they had 5 different players in there for the last 2 weeks. Frederick retired, Smith has constant injuries, and Collins is out for the year. Looney got hurt in the first week and Martin is hurt as well. No line, no time for Dak or holes for Zeke.

2) Until last night, they were down by double digits in every game in the first half, usually by more than 2 scores. Some of that was awful defense and some were early turnovers. Sadly, last night even with 4 forced turnovers, they couldn't score.

3) Finally, the defense is super awful. They cannot stop the run, and they have literally nothing in the secondary other than Diggs(and he is a rookie). Some of that might be trying to implement a new system without actual practice and it being implemented by a non-Zoom savvy 70+ year old, Mike Nolan.

BTW, Philly, WFT and the Giants also have terrible O-Lines too. Only the Eagles have a good secondary.

Dallas isn't going to win. They got Zeke the last time they were this bad. This time they need the top O linemen, or 3 cornerbacks. The Eagles will likely do just enough to win the division. Agree with the earlier post that mentioned dysfunctional ownership of the Cowboys and WFT.
(This post was last modified: 11-02-2020 05:21 PM by TribePride91.)
11-02-2020 05:19 PM
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JMUsince89 Offline
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Post: #56
RE: 2 1/2 hours to Nooch's first NFL start. May there be many more. Cowboys-Eagles in-gam
Most rookie QB's get playtime only when the team is up 30+ points, and then only late in the 4th. Ben hasn't got that luxury. Getting thrown to the wolf's this soon is rough. That guy deserves acolaides not crap. The OC play calling was terrible, I'm sure it was designed to take the heat of Ben. If he starts next game it may be different. The NFL is not CAA. Just my .02.
11-02-2020 07:35 PM
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Duke Dawg Offline
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Post: #57
RE: 2 1/2 hours to Nooch's first NFL start. May there be many more. Cowboys-Eagles in-gam
(11-02-2020 07:35 PM)JMUsince89 Wrote:  Most rookie QB's get playtime only when the team is up 30+ points, and then only late in the 4th. Ben hasn't got that luxury. Getting thrown to the wolf's this soon is rough. That guy deserves acolaides not crap. The OC play calling was terrible, I'm sure it was designed to take the heat of Ben. If he starts next game it may be different. The NFL is not CAA. Just my .02.

He did play the week before in garbage time of the Arizona game to somewhat get his feet wet. He just didn’t get a chance to throw a pass.
11-02-2020 08:24 PM
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Hart Foundation Offline
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Post: #58
RE: 2 1/2 hours to Nooch's first NFL start. May there be many more. Cowboys-Eagles in-gam
It hit me today that coach Houston is a Cowboys fan. I wonder what he was yelling at the TV last night. Probably similar things when he benched the Nooch in the first quarter against New Hampshire.

The Nooch looked overwhelmed at times and after 5 1/2 quarters of football he has 4 fumbles while taking 7 sacks. I don’t see him playing anymore unless Dalton can’t clear concussion protocol or gets injured again this year. The team was trying to hide him last night which you can’t do for long at QB in the NFL. He gave it the good ol college try and just isn’t NFL caliber although it would have been fun to see him run more and move the chains vs struggling as a passer.
11-02-2020 08:58 PM
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Polish Hammer Offline
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Post: #59
RE: 2 1/2 hours to Nooch's first NFL start. May there be many more. Cowboys-Eagles in-gam
(11-02-2020 09:41 AM)Purple Wrote:  I thought there should have been more designed runs for Nooch and RPO. The wind was also a huge factor in the passing game for both QBs, plus the timing on passes was clearly off due to Nooch's limited practice time with the first team. You don't develop great timing and chemistry in a week.
When you’re on QB3 and the only backup just came off somebody else’s practice squad you don’t want him out running unless he absolutely has to or sees a huge opening, so you’re not going to call designed runs and risk injury.

His throws that were off were really off, I wouldn’t attribute that to wind or lack of practice time, more like mechanics which I why I maintain he overdid the sidearm flinging too much.
11-02-2020 10:34 PM
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NJDuke97 Offline
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RE: 2 1/2 hours to Nooch's first NFL start. May there be many more. Cowboys-Eagles in-gam
(11-02-2020 08:58 PM)Hart Foundation Wrote:  It hit me today that coach Houston is a Cowboys fan. I wonder what he was yelling at the TV last night. Probably similar things when he benched the Nooch in the first quarter against New Hampshire.

The Nooch looked overwhelmed at times and after 5 1/2 quarters of football he has 4 fumbles while taking 7 sacks. I don’t see him playing anymore unless Dalton can’t clear concussion protocol or gets injured again this year. The team was trying to hide him last night which you can’t do for long at QB in the NFL. He gave it the good ol college try and just isn’t NFL caliber although it would have been fun to see him run more and move the chains vs struggling as a passer.

Maybe Houston was yelling at Nooch like he did in the playoff loss vs Colgate - oh yeah he probably wasn’t yelling then because his head was elsewhere.

I’d like to see your scouting credentials to assess that a rookie 7th rounder isn’t NFL caliber. He may not be a starting caliber Qb today or ever but that doesn’t mean that he can’t grow and learn and stick in the NFL. He was drafted for a reason and other teams would have had interest in him as well. He has ability and there is potential upside there. I get that you aren’t a fan of his but he can do some things.
11-02-2020 10:39 PM
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