Even though Louisville is not very good I’ve been watching a lot of ACC games and Love no divisions. I think the ACC is so much more exciting not only with the all in one but the matchups that would never happen. I think the ACC can cash in with this setup and make more money than before if marketed the right way.

(10-10-2020 10:03 PM)7thHeaven Wrote:  Even though Louisville is not very good I’ve been watching a lot of ACC games and Love no divisions. I think the ACC is so much more exciting not only with the all in one but the matchups that would never happen. I think the ACC can cash in with this setup and make more money than before if marketed the right way.

+1

The existing NCAA rules apply to all conferences. Two divisions of at least 6 to have a championship game. An exception was made for the Big 12 to hold a championship game with only 10 teams after their round robin scheduling. It is interesting to note that that is when FOX turned down their opportunity to continue to broadcast the Big 12 championship game. Look at the Big 12 as an NCAA experiment.......which failed as an interest grabber.
Unless ESPN promotes no divisions or at least the willingness to pay for no divisions......it just will never happen.

Someone posted that under the divisionless format that the 5 northern schools played each other, the NC and VA schools play each other and the 4 southern schools play each other.
So....
BC, Cuse, Pitt, ND and Louisville
UVA, VT, UNC, Duke, NCSU, and Wake
Clemson, GT, FSU and Miami

I like that format. I interact with more NC and VA conference members fans than I do any other. So, as I've gotten older, I value playing those teams more.

If divisionless can keep those matchups, I'm all for it.

The AAC has gotten a waiver from NCAA rules to allow it to hold a CCG with a single division but without playing a full round robin. I know that the waiver runs out at some point, but it is a step closer to the NCAA approving such an exception permanently.

The scheduling model for a 14 team single division would be 3 permanent/annual rivalry games, and play the other members of the league every other year. For a 15 team single division, it would be 2 permanent/annual rivalry games, and play the other members of the league every other year.

If we could get ND to join, 15 members would mean 5 set games and 3 rotating. With 15 members you would get a home and away with every team once every 6 years. Total 8 games per year.

(10-11-2020 11:18 AM)XLance Wrote:  The existing NCAA rules apply to all conferences. Two divisions of at least 6 to have a championship game. An exception was made for the Big 12 to hold a championship game with only 10 teams after their round robin scheduling. It is interesting to note that that is when FOX turned down their opportunity to continue to broadcast the Big 12 championship game. Look at the Big 12 as an NCAA experiment.......which failed as an interest grabber.
Unless ESPN promotes no divisions or at least the willingness to pay for no divisions......it just will never happen.

An odd number of schools allows for two divisions in which one has less than the other, but only one less per NCAA rule

For the ACC it's a 8-7 split.

It's not correct to say the rules require 2 divisions to have a championship game. The ACC plans to do it this year without using divisions, and the rules have not been changed. The issue, according to the rules, comes if you want to play 12 games AND a 13th for the FCG. You can always do what the ACC is doing this year - 11 games plus a 12th as the FCG; you can even do a version of what the Big Ten is doing: reserve the final weekend of the season for all conference matches, but don't schedule them in advance, and let one of them be the FCG (yes, that could present ticketing problems for home teams, but we'll see how the Big Ten handles it - admittedly on a small scale - this year). BTW, that wouldn't interfere with Rivalry Week, because the week in question is actually Championship Week.

Thanks Gobbler Joe, appreciate the turkey work in your time off not winning the division this year.

In all seriousness, can VaTech just move to the Atlantic now that they’ll never sniff another Coastal title?



I digress, division-less is certainly the way to go. But is the 13-game thing accurate? Because the rule was in place before 12 game regular seasons.

(10-11-2020 10:10 PM)esayem Wrote:  ...division-less is certainly the way to go. But is the 13-game thing accurate? Because the rule was in place before 12 game regular seasons.

The NCAA rule limits the number of games per season to 12, then allows an exemption for a conference championship (13th) game. My point is you don't need to follow that rule if the FCG is, in fact, the 12th game.

Here are the pertinent rules:

17.11.5.1 Maximum Limitations -- Institutional. [FBS/FCS] In bowl subdivision football, a member institution shall limit its total regular-season playing schedule with outside competition during the permissible football playing season in any one year to 12 contests (games or scrimmages), except as provided for member institutions located in Alaska and Hawaii, under Bylaw 17.30.2, and except as provided for all members under Bylaw 17.11.5.2.

(17.30.2 is the "Hawaii Rule" which is of no use here, but the other exemption...)

17.11.5.2 Annual Exemptions. [FBS/FCS]
17.11.5.2.1 Bowl Subdivision. [FBS] In bowl subdivision football, the maximum number of football contests shall exclude the following: (Revised: 1/10/90, 11/1/07 effective 8/1/08, 10/28/10, 10/27/11 effective 4/1/12, Adopted: 8/2/12 effective 8/1/14, 1/15/16 effective 8/1/16)
(a) Spring Game. One contest at the conclusion of the spring practice period [see Bylaw 17.11.4-(a)], provided the contest is against a team composed of bona fide alumni or students or both;
(b) Conference Championship Game. One conference championship game:
(1) Between division champions of a conference that is divided into two divisions (as equally balanced in number as possible) and conducts round-robin, regular-season competition in each division; or
(2) Between the top two teams in the conference standings following full round-robin regular-season competition among all members of the conference.
. . .

I just don’t think the SEC and the BIG will let the ACC go divisionless and have 13th game. Not playing the 13th game may hurt the ACC in terms of being selected for a playoff berth.

(10-11-2020 11:28 AM)ChrisLords Wrote:  Someone posted that under the divisionless format that the 5 northern schools played each other, the NC and VA schools play each other and the 4 southern schools play each other.
So....
BC, Cuse, Pitt, ND and Louisville
UVA, VT, UNC, Duke, NCSU, and Wake
Clemson, GT, FSU and Miami

I like that format. I interact with more NC and VA conference members fans than I do any other. So, as I've gotten older, I value playing those teams more.

If divisionless can keep those matchups, I'm all for it.

We can try this setup:

Mid Atlantic division
4 NC schools
2 VA school
Louisville

North & South division:
BC, Pitt, Cuse
Clemson, GT, FSU, Miami

Duke-GT and VT-Miami crossover if they want.

Probably not gonna happen

We can determine the following:

• There aren't enough objections amongst the membership towards the current divisions to have them changed.

• Notre Dame will be going back to being Independent next season, so 15-team setups are pointless.

• If a division-less structure is finally approved, permanent rivals will probably look very similar to the basketball partners, at least for a starting point. Im assuming there would be an eight game schedule with three permanent rivals and a rotation through the other ten members. The previously scheduled ND games don't need to change.

- UNC would probably have Duke, NC State, and Virginia as permanent rivals. They can schedule Wake OOC the two off years to resume a yearly game with the Deacs.