Hello There, Guest! (LoginRegister)

Post Reply 
Miracle on David Street: WAC has added its 10th member
Author Message
HawaiiMongoose Offline
All American
*

Posts: 2,762
Joined: Nov 2010
Reputation: 153
I Root For: Hawaii
Location: Honolulu
Post: #61
RE: Miracle on David Street: WAC has added its 10th member
(10-02-2020 03:19 PM)quo vadis Wrote:  
(10-02-2020 03:14 PM)HawaiiMongoose Wrote:  Just for easy reference, here's the geographic footprint covered by the current WAC membership:

And that "footprint", more like an octopus tentacles, bespeaks the weakness of the conference.

Actually if Chicago State were dropped and replaced with SUU the footprint would look pretty good. That would leave just Seattle as a geographic outlier.
(This post was last modified: 10-02-2020 04:16 PM by HawaiiMongoose.)
10-02-2020 04:03 PM
Find all posts by this user Quote this message in a reply
Todor Offline
2nd String
*

Posts: 350
Joined: Jan 2019
Reputation: 45
I Root For: Nmsu
Location:
Post: #62
RE: Miracle on David Street: WAC has added its 10th member
(10-02-2020 03:19 PM)quo vadis Wrote:  
(10-02-2020 03:14 PM)HawaiiMongoose Wrote:  Just for easy reference, here's the geographic footprint covered by the current WAC membership:

And that "footprint", more like an octopus tentacles, bespeaks the weakness of the conference.

Times, they are a changing. Look at the map of the BSC and tell me what geographic sense it makes for SUU and NAU.
(This post was last modified: 10-02-2020 04:05 PM by Todor.)
10-02-2020 04:04 PM
Find all posts by this user Quote this message in a reply
teamvsn Offline
2nd String
*

Posts: 423
Joined: Feb 2016
Reputation: 21
I Root For: NAIA
Location:
Post: #63
RE: Miracle on David Street: WAC has added its 10th member
(10-02-2020 12:18 PM)bill dazzle Wrote:  
(10-01-2020 06:17 PM)teamvsn Wrote:  
(10-01-2020 02:40 PM)bill dazzle Wrote:  FU in NAIA D-I currently.

Fisk might want to go to NCAA D2 but ... not sure that will happen. Trevecca did it but has more resources.

As of this year the NAIA is divisionless. All one big happy family :) There were only divisions in basketball but that's now gone.

Many would say Trevecca has not been a success in D2. They're spending a lot more money without anything to show for it. And they are a geographic outlier in their conference, with no better options.


I did not know that about NAIA.

As to Trevecca, it seems the move to NCAAD2 has been a success in terms of bolstering enrollment. There were 3,000-plus students at the college in fall 2016. By spring 2020 ...almost 4,000. Obviously, lots of increase can be attributed to things other than sports. But it's worth noting.

That 4000 figure includes a ton of grad students. I'm not sure what the breakdown is. Traditionally, undergrads are what matters for evaluating appropriate athletic associations/divisions. I don't know Trevecca's splits now or historically. Just as a reference NAIA Cumberlands (KY) has 18k students, most of which are grad students. The NAIA lists them at 1760 undergrads.
(This post was last modified: 10-02-2020 04:09 PM by teamvsn.)
10-02-2020 04:07 PM
Visit this user's website Find all posts by this user Quote this message in a reply
Nerdlinger Offline
Realignment Enthusiast
*

Posts: 2,961
Joined: May 2017
Reputation: 163
I Root For: Realignment!
Location: :uoᴉʇɐɔo⌉
Post: #64
RE: Miracle on David Street: WAC has added its 10th member
(10-02-2020 03:14 PM)HawaiiMongoose Wrote:  Just for easy reference, here's the geographic footprint covered by the current WAC membership:

[Image: 50409601257_3c6aede41f_z.jpg]

Even if the biggest outliers, Seattle and Chicago State, were to leave for... somewhere?... you've still got a league that stretches from California to Texas. Anyone moving from the Big Sky to the WAC is not going to be saving much if anything on travel, and they'd be screwing over their football team even if the WAC can scrape together enough bottom-feeding FCS schools to make 6.
(This post was last modified: 10-02-2020 04:11 PM by Nerdlinger.)
10-02-2020 04:11 PM
Find all posts by this user Quote this message in a reply
IWokeUpLikeThis Online
Heisman
*

Posts: 6,642
Joined: Jul 2014
Reputation: 407
I Root For: NIU, Chicago St
Location: South Side
Post: #65
RE: Miracle on David Street: WAC has added its 10th member
(10-02-2020 03:54 PM)Inkblot Wrote:  
(10-02-2020 03:50 PM)dbackjon Wrote:  
(10-02-2020 03:26 PM)Inkblot Wrote:  Looks like it's Southern Utah.

Source? Reasoning? Why would they join a league with a new team just down the road?

I'm not subscribed to Matt Brown's newsletter, but check the replies to this tweet: https://twitter.com/MattBrownEP/status/1...0330293248

Appreciate the guy giving us WAC/Big Sky realignment content, but there's no way this is true.
10-02-2020 04:14 PM
Find all posts by this user Quote this message in a reply
teamvsn Offline
2nd String
*

Posts: 423
Joined: Feb 2016
Reputation: 21
I Root For: NAIA
Location:
Post: #66
RE: Miracle on David Street: WAC has added its 10th member
(10-02-2020 04:07 PM)teamvsn Wrote:  
(10-02-2020 12:18 PM)bill dazzle Wrote:  
(10-01-2020 06:17 PM)teamvsn Wrote:  
(10-01-2020 02:40 PM)bill dazzle Wrote:  FU in NAIA D-I currently.

Fisk might want to go to NCAA D2 but ... not sure that will happen. Trevecca did it but has more resources.

As of this year the NAIA is divisionless. All one big happy family :) There were only divisions in basketball but that's now gone.

Many would say Trevecca has not been a success in D2. They're spending a lot more money without anything to show for it. And they are a geographic outlier in their conference, with no better options.


I did not know that about NAIA.

As to Trevecca, it seems the move to NCAAD2 has been a success in terms of bolstering enrollment. There were 3,000-plus students at the college in fall 2016. By spring 2020 ...almost 4,000. Obviously, lots of increase can be attributed to things other than sports. But it's worth noting.

That 4000 figure includes a ton of grad students. I'm not sure what the breakdown is. Traditionally, undergrads are what matters for evaluating appropriate athletic associations/divisions. I don't know Trevecca's splits now or historically. Just as a reference NAIA Cumberlands (KY) has 18k students, most of which are grad students. The NAIA lists them at 1760 undergrads.

Trevecca's undergraduate enrollment in 2014 was 1,115
2018 was 1,463
2019 was 1,541

They started playing an NCAA schedule in 2013. So there has been some growth but not what the gross enrollment numbers indicate.
10-02-2020 04:21 PM
Visit this user's website Find all posts by this user Quote this message in a reply
HawaiiMongoose Offline
All American
*

Posts: 2,762
Joined: Nov 2010
Reputation: 153
I Root For: Hawaii
Location: Honolulu
Post: #67
RE: Miracle on David Street: WAC has added its 10th member
(10-02-2020 04:11 PM)Nerdlinger Wrote:  
(10-02-2020 03:14 PM)HawaiiMongoose Wrote:  Just for easy reference, here's the geographic footprint covered by the current WAC membership:

[Image: 50409601257_3c6aede41f_z.jpg]

Even if the biggest outliers, Seattle and Chicago State, were to leave for... somewhere?... you've still got a league that stretches from California to Texas. Anyone moving from the Big Sky to the WAC is not going to be saving much if anything on travel, and they'd be screwing over their football team even if the WAC can scrape together enough bottom-feeding FCS schools to make 6.

For comparison here's the Big Sky footprint:

[Image: 50408904213_e4f4d5c6c6_w.jpg]

Of course this is all hypothetical since there's no reliable confirmation yet that SUU is the addition.
10-02-2020 04:31 PM
Find all posts by this user Quote this message in a reply
Todor Offline
2nd String
*

Posts: 350
Joined: Jan 2019
Reputation: 45
I Root For: Nmsu
Location:
Post: #68
RE: Miracle on David Street: WAC has added its 10th member
(10-02-2020 04:03 PM)HawaiiMongoose Wrote:  
(10-02-2020 03:19 PM)quo vadis Wrote:  
(10-02-2020 03:14 PM)HawaiiMongoose Wrote:  Just for easy reference, here's the geographic footprint covered by the current WAC membership:

And that "footprint", more like an octopus tentacles, bespeaks the weakness of the conference.

Actually if Chicago State were dropped and replaced with SUU the footprint would look pretty good. That would leave just Seattle as a geographic outlier.

And with their current conference options, the WAC need for members, and the ease of flying to Seattle from almost anywhere, its a completely tolerable situation. I'd rather try to fly to Seattle than Moscow or Bozeman. Once you're on a plane, the distance is much less important. And there aren't many non flying options anywhere in the West.
(This post was last modified: 10-02-2020 04:41 PM by Todor.)
10-02-2020 04:41 PM
Find all posts by this user Quote this message in a reply
bill dazzle Offline
1st String
*

Posts: 2,304
Joined: Aug 2016
Reputation: 166
I Root For: VUMemIUDePaulNC
Location: Tower Crane Town
Post: #69
RE: Miracle on David Street: WAC has added its 10th member
(10-02-2020 04:21 PM)teamvsn Wrote:  
(10-02-2020 04:07 PM)teamvsn Wrote:  
(10-02-2020 12:18 PM)bill dazzle Wrote:  
(10-01-2020 06:17 PM)teamvsn Wrote:  
(10-01-2020 02:40 PM)bill dazzle Wrote:  FU in NAIA D-I currently.

Fisk might want to go to NCAA D2 but ... not sure that will happen. Trevecca did it but has more resources.

As of this year the NAIA is divisionless. All one big happy family :) There were only divisions in basketball but that's now gone.

Many would say Trevecca has not been a success in D2. They're spending a lot more money without anything to show for it. And they are a geographic outlier in their conference, with no better options.


I did not know that about NAIA.

As to Trevecca, it seems the move to NCAAD2 has been a success in terms of bolstering enrollment. There were 3,000-plus students at the college in fall 2016. By spring 2020 ...almost 4,000. Obviously, lots of increase can be attributed to things other than sports. But it's worth noting.

That 4000 figure includes a ton of grad students. I'm not sure what the breakdown is. Traditionally, undergrads are what matters for evaluating appropriate athletic associations/divisions. I don't know Trevecca's splits now or historically. Just as a reference NAIA Cumberlands (KY) has 18k students, most of which are grad students. The NAIA lists them at 1760 undergrads.

Trevecca's undergraduate enrollment in 2014 was 1,115
2018 was 1,463
2019 was 1,541

They started playing an NCAA schedule in 2013. So there has been some growth but not what the gross enrollment numbers indicate.


Fewer than I realized. Good find.

I sometimes wonder if Trevecca wants eventually to be DI-AA. The campus is geographically large and the school eventually might want to have 5,000 students (4,000 now) from what I've heard. If the "move up" is truly the end game, then being D2 now is the price to be paid.

If TNU were DI-AA, Nashville/Davidson County would have five such athletic programs (to join Belmont, Tennessee State, Lipscomb and Vanderbilt). Would be unusual for a county of no more than 700,000 people.

Having said that, I doubt TNU moves up. Too many challenges.
10-02-2020 04:42 PM
Find all posts by this user Quote this message in a reply
teamvsn Offline
2nd String
*

Posts: 423
Joined: Feb 2016
Reputation: 21
I Root For: NAIA
Location:
Post: #70
RE: Miracle on David Street: WAC has added its 10th member
(10-02-2020 04:42 PM)bill dazzle Wrote:  
(10-02-2020 04:21 PM)teamvsn Wrote:  
(10-02-2020 04:07 PM)teamvsn Wrote:  
(10-02-2020 12:18 PM)bill dazzle Wrote:  
(10-01-2020 06:17 PM)teamvsn Wrote:  As of this year the NAIA is divisionless. All one big happy family :) There were only divisions in basketball but that's now gone.

Many would say Trevecca has not been a success in D2. They're spending a lot more money without anything to show for it. And they are a geographic outlier in their conference, with no better options.


I did not know that about NAIA.

As to Trevecca, it seems the move to NCAAD2 has been a success in terms of bolstering enrollment. There were 3,000-plus students at the college in fall 2016. By spring 2020 ...almost 4,000. Obviously, lots of increase can be attributed to things other than sports. But it's worth noting.

That 4000 figure includes a ton of grad students. I'm not sure what the breakdown is. Traditionally, undergrads are what matters for evaluating appropriate athletic associations/divisions. I don't know Trevecca's splits now or historically. Just as a reference NAIA Cumberlands (KY) has 18k students, most of which are grad students. The NAIA lists them at 1760 undergrads.

Trevecca's undergraduate enrollment in 2014 was 1,115
2018 was 1,463
2019 was 1,541

They started playing an NCAA schedule in 2013. So there has been some growth but not what the gross enrollment numbers indicate.


Fewer than I realized. Good find.

I sometimes wonder if Trevecca wants eventually to be DI-AA. The campus is geographically large and the school eventually might want to have 5,000 students (4,000 now) from what I've heard. If the "move up" is truly the end game, then being D2 now is the price to be paid.

If TNU were DI-AA, Nashville/Davidson County would have five such athletic programs (to join Belmont, Tennessee State, Lipscomb and Vanderbilt). Would be unusual for a county of no more than 700,000 people.

Having said that, I doubt TNU moves up. Too many challenges.

Good to know. Many of us NAIA people have speculated that they might move back to the NAIA because it's a better fit for a 1600 student college, but a D1 move would be a decent rationale for not doing so. But like you said, it would be a challenge. They might think "hey, we're 4-5k students strong" but they are mostly grad students. How does a private school pay for D1 athletic expenses? By rolling it into the cost of tuition. But if you do that to grad students you become uncompetitive with other grad school's tuition. Their endowment is only 22m. That's actually pretty good for an NAIA school but minuscule for a D1.
10-02-2020 05:08 PM
Visit this user's website Find all posts by this user Quote this message in a reply
DavidSt Offline
Hall of Famer
*

Posts: 15,030
Joined: Dec 2013
Reputation: 224
I Root For: ATU, P7
Location:
Post: #71
RE: Miracle on David Street: WAC has added its 10th member
(10-02-2020 04:14 PM)IWokeUpLikeThis Wrote:  
(10-02-2020 03:54 PM)Inkblot Wrote:  
(10-02-2020 03:50 PM)dbackjon Wrote:  
(10-02-2020 03:26 PM)Inkblot Wrote:  Looks like it's Southern Utah.

Source? Reasoning? Why would they join a league with a new team just down the road?

I'm not subscribed to Matt Brown's newsletter, but check the replies to this tweet: https://twitter.com/MattBrownEP/status/1...0330293248

Appreciate the guy giving us WAC/Big Sky realignment content, but there's no way this is true.



It is not true. It would be like Boston College moving from the ACC to the Ivy League. West Texas A&M showed their hands last month.
10-02-2020 06:45 PM
Find all posts by this user Quote this message in a reply
DavidSt Offline
Hall of Famer
*

Posts: 15,030
Joined: Dec 2013
Reputation: 224
I Root For: ATU, P7
Location:
Post: #72
RE: Miracle on David Street: WAC has added its 10th member
Southern Utah University Kills The Rumor That They Are Going To The WAC


They said they will never leave the Big Sky unless the offer is right. The WAC is not in the position to give an offer for them to leave.
10-02-2020 06:56 PM
Find all posts by this user Quote this message in a reply
Scoochpooch1 Offline
2nd String
*

Posts: 374
Joined: May 2017
Reputation: 23
I Root For: P4
Location:
Post: #73
RE: Miracle on David Street: WAC has added its 10th member
(10-02-2020 05:53 AM)DavidSt Wrote:  One of the guys on Reddit said that the school is a D1 school joining them. The problem is that there is no D1 school that wants to join the WAC because it is a downgrade. The hint is D1. It could also mean a former D1 school as well. West Texas A&M fits the former D1 school.

Which Reddit site?
10-02-2020 07:01 PM
Find all posts by this user Quote this message in a reply
IWokeUpLikeThis Online
Heisman
*

Posts: 6,642
Joined: Jul 2014
Reputation: 407
I Root For: NIU, Chicago St
Location: South Side
Post: #74
RE: Miracle on David Street: WAC has added its 10th member
(10-02-2020 07:01 PM)Scoochpooch1 Wrote:  
(10-02-2020 05:53 AM)DavidSt Wrote:  One of the guys on Reddit said that the school is a D1 school joining them. The problem is that there is no D1 school that wants to join the WAC because it is a downgrade. The hint is D1. It could also mean a former D1 school as well. West Texas A&M fits the former D1 school.

Which Reddit site?

https://www.reddit.com/r/CFB/comments/j2...ame=iossmf

Lots of DavidSt discussion.
10-02-2020 07:04 PM
Find all posts by this user Quote this message in a reply
HawaiiMongoose Offline
All American
*

Posts: 2,762
Joined: Nov 2010
Reputation: 153
I Root For: Hawaii
Location: Honolulu
Post: #75
RE: Miracle on David Street: WAC has added its 10th member
(10-02-2020 06:56 PM)DavidSt Wrote:  Southern Utah University Kills The Rumor That They Are Going To The WAC


They said they will never leave the Big Sky unless the offer is right. The WAC is not in the position to give an offer for them to leave.

I’m skeptical too, but for what it’s worth, SUU’s statement is exactly what you’d expect them to say if they were interested in jumping but the lawyers were still working out the details.
10-02-2020 07:09 PM
Find all posts by this user Quote this message in a reply
Nerdlinger Offline
Realignment Enthusiast
*

Posts: 2,961
Joined: May 2017
Reputation: 163
I Root For: Realignment!
Location: :uoᴉʇɐɔo⌉
Post: #76
RE: Miracle on David Street: WAC has added its 10th member
(10-02-2020 07:09 PM)HawaiiMongoose Wrote:  
(10-02-2020 06:56 PM)DavidSt Wrote:  Southern Utah University Kills The Rumor That They Are Going To The WAC


They said they will never leave the Big Sky unless the offer is right. The WAC is not in the position to give an offer for them to leave.

I’m skeptical too, but for what it’s worth, SUU’s statement is exactly what you’d expect them to say if they were interested in jumping but the lawyers were still working out the details.

Yes, it's really a lawyer/politician non-committal no-info answer.
10-02-2020 07:14 PM
Find all posts by this user Quote this message in a reply
quo vadis Offline
Legend
*

Posts: 35,914
Joined: Aug 2008
Reputation: 1065
I Root For: USF/Georgetown
Location: Baton Rouge, LA
Post: #77
RE: Miracle on David Street: WAC has added its 10th member
(10-02-2020 04:04 PM)Todor Wrote:  
(10-02-2020 03:19 PM)quo vadis Wrote:  
(10-02-2020 03:14 PM)HawaiiMongoose Wrote:  Just for easy reference, here's the geographic footprint covered by the current WAC membership:

And that "footprint", more like an octopus tentacles, bespeaks the weakness of the conference.

Times, they are a changing. Look at the map of the BSC and tell me what geographic sense it makes for SUU and NAU.

The What and Who and Who?

07-coffee3
10-02-2020 07:40 PM
Find all posts by this user Quote this message in a reply
Scoochpooch1 Offline
2nd String
*

Posts: 374
Joined: May 2017
Reputation: 23
I Root For: P4
Location:
Post: #78
RE: Miracle on David Street: WAC has added its 10th member
(10-02-2020 07:04 PM)IWokeUpLikeThis Wrote:  
(10-02-2020 07:01 PM)Scoochpooch1 Wrote:  
(10-02-2020 05:53 AM)DavidSt Wrote:  One of the guys on Reddit said that the school is a D1 school joining them. The problem is that there is no D1 school that wants to join the WAC because it is a downgrade. The hint is D1. It could also mean a former D1 school as well. West Texas A&M fits the former D1 school.

Which Reddit site?

https://www.reddit.com/r/CFB/comments/j2...ame=iossmf

Lots of DavidSt discussion.

Thank you
10-02-2020 08:08 PM
Find all posts by this user Quote this message in a reply
TDenverFan Online
All American
*

Posts: 2,547
Joined: Aug 2014
Reputation: 25
I Root For: William & Mary
Location: Northern VA
Post: #79
RE: Miracle on David Street: WAC has added its 10th member
(10-02-2020 06:56 PM)DavidSt Wrote:  Southern Utah University Kills The Rumor That They Are Going To The WAC


They said they will never leave the Big Sky unless the offer is right. The WAC is not in the position to give an offer for them to leave.

The title you posted and the actual title of the article, 'SUU: T-Birds have 'not received an official offer' to leave the Big Sky for the WAC,' convey a very different message.
10-02-2020 08:29 PM
Find all posts by this user Quote this message in a reply
IWokeUpLikeThis Online
Heisman
*

Posts: 6,642
Joined: Jul 2014
Reputation: 407
I Root For: NIU, Chicago St
Location: South Side
Post: #80
RE: Miracle on David Street: WAC has added its 10th member
(10-02-2020 07:09 PM)HawaiiMongoose Wrote:  
(10-02-2020 06:56 PM)DavidSt Wrote:  Southern Utah University Kills The Rumor That They Are Going To The WAC


They said they will never leave the Big Sky unless the offer is right. The WAC is not in the position to give an offer for them to leave.

I’m skeptical too, but for what it’s worth, SUU’s statement is exactly what you’d expect them to say if they were interested in jumping but the lawyers were still working out the details.

Yeah, you’d expect them to either pay it no attention or say “we’re not going anywhere”, not “we haven’t received an official offer” — that feels like code for a move is imminent.
10-02-2020 08:43 PM
Find all posts by this user Quote this message in a reply
Post Reply 




User(s) browsing this thread: 1 Guest(s)


Copyright © 2002-2020 Collegiate Sports Nation Bulletin Board System (CSNbbs), All Rights Reserved.
CSNbbs is an independent fan site and is in no way affiliated to the NCAA or any of the schools and conferences it represents.
This site monetizes links. FTC Disclosure.
We allow third-party companies to serve ads and/or collect certain anonymous information when you visit our web site. These companies may use non-personally identifiable information (e.g., click stream information, browser type, time and date, subject of advertisements clicked or scrolled over) during your visits to this and other Web sites in order to provide advertisements about goods and services likely to be of greater interest to you. These companies typically use a cookie or third party web beacon to collect this information. To learn more about this behavioral advertising practice or to opt-out of this type of advertising, you can visit http://www.networkadvertising.org.
Powered By MyBB, © 2002-2020 MyBB Group.