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UC QB situation (Ridder v Bryant)
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BearcatJerry Offline
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Post: #41
RE: UC QB situation (Ridder v Bryant)
(09-28-2020 03:17 PM)Dannyboy Wrote:  Running the option against Army? I reacted thusly:

[Image: QMo9bBY.gif]

I mean...it was unexpected...in a "Nobody expects someone to break INTO prison!" type of way.

And, had it worked, we all would have been saying "Brilliant!" and "Big D*** Fick!"
 
09-28-2020 03:58 PM
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CliftonAve Offline
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Post: #42
RE: UC QB situation (Ridder v Bryant)
I saw two things on that option play after watching it a couple times:

1) That was a heck of play by Army to split two defenders and bat down the pitch.
2) Des probably should have kept it and taken what would have been a 2-3 yard gain.

I am not so mad at the play call. It just didn’t work.
 
09-28-2020 04:07 PM
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rath v2.0 Offline
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Post: #43
RE: UC QB situation (Ridder v Bryant)
I thought it was silly...we ran a play in a game that we ran by the scout team to learn to defend against. Looked like something we were not comfortable running and the result backed that up.
 
09-28-2020 04:13 PM
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Edgebrookjeff Offline
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Post: #44
RE: UC QB situation (Ridder v Bryant)
(09-28-2020 03:01 PM)BearcatJerry Wrote:  
(09-28-2020 02:36 PM)Z-Fly Wrote:  
(09-28-2020 02:32 PM)Edgebrookjeff Wrote:  I am undecided on the QBs this year. However, I also think that our receivers aren't doing Dez any favors out there. In the past, we've had receivers that could make the difficult or contested catch. I haven't seen that in the last couple years. If we had a Shaq Washington type receiver out there, I don't know that we'd be having this discussion.

Are you talking about the time Dez handed it off to the other team, or when the guys were wide open and had to go back for the ball?

To be fair, it was a "Pitch."

To be fair, the Tight End / Wide Receiver completely whiffed the block on that side that allowed the DB to make that play.
 
09-28-2020 06:46 PM
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Bear Catlett Offline
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Post: #45
RE: UC QB situation (Ridder v Bryant)
You can look at 21 positions on the team and say "if you don't make the plays I'm pulling your a** for somebody who will".

For whatever reason, you just don't do that with your QB. QB controversies kill team chemistry. Coaches know that and avoid them like the plague... or if you prefer, covid19. No locker room ever divides over who is playing right guard.

So it appears that Des is their guy and they're sticking to it. Unless he comes out and is totally Andy Dalton reincarnated, he's going to be in there.

Now the out that they could invoke is if Des gets dinged up a little. Blame it on the trainers. Whatever. Then they could slide Bryant in there without much questioning going on.

And from here on, this shall be referred to as the "Des-Bryant" matter.
 
09-28-2020 07:11 PM
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Cataclysmo Online
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Post: #46
UC QB situation (Ridder v Bryant)
Wouldn't be the first time the Des Bryant situation hurt team chemistry there Bearcatlett.

Be sure to tip your waitresses.

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09-28-2020 07:17 PM
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bearcat54 Offline
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Post: #47
RE: UC QB situation (Ridder v Bryant)
looks like a lot of bearcat fans are frantic every week in every sport. Expecting to win every game and if a point down, they panic and want changes. CHANGE sure didn't work for the USA when Obidens were in power.
 
09-28-2020 07:21 PM
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Bruce Monnin Offline
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Post: #48
RE: UC QB situation (Ridder v Bryant)
(09-28-2020 07:21 PM)bearcat54 Wrote:  looks like a lot of bearcat fans are frantic every week in every sport. Expecting to win every game and if a point down, they panic and want changes. CHANGE sure didn't work for the USA when Obidens were in power.

That change worked great for me.
 
09-28-2020 07:27 PM
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UCGrad1992 Offline
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Post: #49
RE: UC QB situation (Ridder v Bryant)
Everyone has made valid points. One thing we all can agree on is we want our Bearcats to be the best on the field that they possibly can be. We've all criticized/made observations of other weaknesses on Bearcat teams over the years - and QB should always be a part of that critique especially since it is the most critical position on the field. That said, for any of us sitting in front of our keyboards it doesn't cost us a thing to criticize or demand changes on the team. It does cost the staff if changes don't work out. Fick is now 28-13 [.683] and 2-0 in bowls against P5 competition. Not too shabby. He knows what he's doing. We may not always agree sure but I doubt there's a program out there where the fans always agree with the coaching staff on matters. I don't want to speculate on the "why's" but I believe Fick has his reasons for Ridder and for Bryant and he ain't going to change/deviate from them. That's why he's the CEO and gets paid the big bucks. Let's see how things play out against USuckF and go from there.
 
(This post was last modified: 09-28-2020 09:17 PM by UCGrad1992.)
09-28-2020 07:34 PM
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Racinejake Offline
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Post: #50
RE: UC QB situation (Ridder v Bryant)
(09-28-2020 06:46 PM)Edgebrookjeff Wrote:  
(09-28-2020 03:01 PM)BearcatJerry Wrote:  
(09-28-2020 02:36 PM)Z-Fly Wrote:  
(09-28-2020 02:32 PM)Edgebrookjeff Wrote:  I am undecided on the QBs this year. However, I also think that our receivers aren't doing Dez any favors out there. In the past, we've had receivers that could make the difficult or contested catch. I haven't seen that in the last couple years. If we had a Shaq Washington type receiver out there, I don't know that we'd be having this discussion.

Are you talking about the time Dez handed it off to the other team, or when the guys were wide open and had to go back for the ball?

To be fair, it was a "Pitch."

To be fair, the Tight End / Wide Receiver completely whiffed the block on that side that allowed the DB to make that play.

Agreed. I was upset at Des at first but after seeing two guys whiff on the DB I realized Des was obviously not reading that guy on the play and would not have expected him to factor into the pitch. I'm fine with the play, those guys just have to execute. Actually if just one of the two guys execute that doesn't happen.
 
09-28-2020 08:05 PM
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Bearcatbdub Offline
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Post: #51
RE: UC QB situation (Ridder v Bryant)
I think Dez is still in there because of his “intangible” leadership
Qualities. I think that’s why he got the nod over Moore in the first place. And it’s
Probably why he keeps his spot when Bryant appears to be the better passing option. I think Dez is the leader of the offense and Fickell really buys into that stuff.

Just an observation that could be complete crap, but there you have it.
 
09-28-2020 09:16 PM
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colohank Offline
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Post: #52
RE: UC QB situation (Ridder v Bryant)
Is it possible the Fickell and his assistants know something that all of the doubting Thomases on this board don't?
 
09-28-2020 09:19 PM
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CoachFickFan Offline
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Post: #53
RE: UC QB situation (Ridder v Bryant)
The Bearcats should play the best QB.
It seems that the QB with the best QB rating is Des Ridder, who has (at 154.5) the best UC QB Rating since Zach Collaros (195.5, 2009) was a backup to Tony Pike, and Brendon Kay (163.1) was a backup to Munchie Legaux (2012). It is clear that the very best recent teams had two really good QBs.

AAC Passing QB Rating Leaders 2020
Dillon Gabriel, UCF, 173.5, #13 National Rank
Brady White, Memphis, 166.8, #16 National Rank
Shane Buechele, SMU, 164.5, #18 National Rank
Desmond Ridder, Cincinnati, 154.5, #22 National Rank
Holton Ahlers, ECU 137.8, #38 National Rank
Zach Smith, Tulsa, 118.7, #57 National Rank
Jordan McClain, USF, 111.3
Keon Howard, Tulane, 83.0
Dalen Morris, 65.0, Navy
Both Houston and Temple haven’t
played a game yet. Houston’s AD had a game scheduled at Baylor 3 hours after Baylor/LA Tech game was postponed. But 22 hours before the game was scheduled to be played, Baylor cancelled because of COVID. Houston’s equipment truck made it to the stadium in Waco, but not the Cougars.
These two AAC QBs/Teams haven’t played in 2020 yet:
Clayton Tune, Houston, 141.7 QBR, 2019
Anthony Russo, Temple, 126.9 QBR, 2019

Bearcat Passing QB Rating Leaders 2004-2020 with some Passing Yards Stats
2020, Desmond Ridder, Cincinnati, 154.5,
2019, Desmond Ridder, 123.7, 2164 passing yards
2019, Ben Bryant, 119.4, 388 passing yards
2018, Desmond Ridder, 146.4
2017, Hayden Moore, 118.4
2016. Hayden Moore, 123.4, 1744 passing yards
2016, Gunner Kiel 117.6, 804 passing yards
2015, Gunner Kiel, 151.9, 2777 passing yards
2015, Hayden Moore, 132.9, 1885 passing yards
2014, Gunner Kiel, 149.4, 3254 passing yards
2014, Munchie Legaux, 136.4, 574 passing yards
2013, Brendon Kay, 148.4, 3302 passing yards
2013, Munchie Legaux, 122.9, 382 passing yards
2012, Munchie Legaux, 125.7, 120/230, 1716 passing yards, 13 tds, 9 int
2012, Brendon Kay, 163.1, 87/138, 1298 passing yards, 10 tds, 2 ints
2011, Zach Collaros, 131.6
2010, Zach Collaros, 137.5
2009, Tony Pike, 149.8, 2520 passing yards
2009, Zach Collaros, 195.5, 1434 passing yards
2008, Tony Pike, 136.4, 2407 passing yards, 19tds, 11 ints
2008, Dustin Grutza, 166.7, 617 passing yards, 5 tds, 1 ints
2007, Ben Mauk, 150.6, 3121 passing yards
2007, Dustin Grutza, 161.9, 432 passing yards
2006, Dustin Grutza, 123.5, 1632 passing yards
2006, Nick Davila, 151.6, 1057 passing yards
2005, Dustin Grutza, 111.1, 1799 passing yards
2005, Nick Davila, 142.4, 344 passing yards
2004, Gino Guidugli, 146.5

Guidugli is the current QB coach, and his QB coach was Dan Enos, who is now the Bearcats Assistant Head Coach and RB coach but has been OC for Miami FL, Alabama, and Arkansas.
 
(This post was last modified: 09-28-2020 10:07 PM by CoachFickFan.)
09-28-2020 09:23 PM
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RuckleSt Offline
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Post: #54
RE: UC QB situation (Ridder v Bryant)
(09-28-2020 09:23 PM)CoachFickFan Wrote:  The Bearcats should play the best QB.
It seems that the QB with the best QB rating is Des Ridder, who has (at 154.5) the best UC QB Rating since Zach Collaros (195.5, 2009) was a backup to Tony Pike, and Brendon Kay (163.1) was a backup to Munchie Legaux (2012). It is clear that the very best recent teams had two really good QBs.

AAC Passing QB Rating Leaders 2020
Dillon Gabriel, UCF, 173.5, #13 National Rank
Brady White, Memphis, 166.8, #16 National Rank
Shane Buechelle, SMU, 164.5, #18 National Rank
Desmond Ritter, Cincinnati, 154.5, #22 National Rank
Holton Ahlers, ECU 137.8, #38, National Rank
Zach Smith, Tulsa, 118.7, #57, National Rank
Jordan McClain, USF, 111.3
Keon Howard, Tulane, 83.0
Dalen Morris, 65.0, Navy
Both Houston and Temple haven’t
played a game yet. Houston’s AD had a game scheduled at Baylor 3 hours after Baylor/LA Tech game was postponed. But 22 hours before the game was scheduled to be played, Baylor cancelled because of COVID. Houston’s equipment truck made it to the stadium in Waco, but not the Cougars.
These two AAC QBs/Teams haven’t played in 2020 yet:
Clayton Tune, Houston, 141.7 QBR, 2019
Anthony Russo, Temple, 126.9 QBR,2019

Bearcat Passing QB Rating Leaders 2004-2020 with some Passing Yards Stats
2020, Desmond Ridder, Cincinnati, 154.5,
2019, Desmond Ridder, 123.7, 2164 passing yards
2019, Ben Bryant, 119.4, 388 passing yards
2018, Desmond Ridder, 146.4
2017, Hayden Moore, 118.4
2016. Hayden Moore, 123.4, 1744 passing yards
2016, Gunner Kiel 117.6, 804 passing yards
2015, Gunner Kiel, 151.9, 2777 passing yards
2015, Hayden Moore, 123.4, 1885 passing yards
2014, Gunner Kiel, 149.4, 3254 passing yards
2014, Munchie Legaux, 136.4, 574 passing yards
2013, Brendon Kay, 148.4, 3302 passing yards
2013, Munchie Legaux, 122.9, 382 passing yards
2012, Munchie Legaux, 125.7, 120/230, 1716 passing yards, 13 tds, 9 int
2012, Brendon Kay, 163.1, 87/138, 1298 passing yards, 10 tds, 2 ints
2011, Zach Collaros, 131.6
2010, Zach Collaros, 137.5
2009, Tony Pike, 149.8, 2520 passing yards
2009, Zach Collaros, 195.5, 1434 passing yards
2008, Tony Pike, 136.4, 2407 passing yards, 19tds, 11 ints
2008, Dustin Grutza, 166.7, 617 passing yards, 5 tds, 1 ints
2007, Ben Mauk, 150.6, 3121 passing yards
2007, Dustin Grutza, 161.9, 432 passing yards
2006, Dustin Grutza, 123.5, 1632 passing yards
2006, Nick Davila, 151.6, 1057 passing yards
2005, Dustin Grutza, 111.1, 1799 passing yards
2005, Nick Davila, 142.4, 344 passing yards
2004, Gino Guidugli, 146.5

Guidugli is the current QB coach, and his QB coach was Dan Enos, who is now the Bearcats Assistant Head Coach and RB coach but has been OC for Miami FL, Alabama, and Arkansas.

I would argue that passer rating is a flawed metric in that it doesn't account for the type of passes completed. A QB could in theory "game" the system by completing a lot of simple screen and checkdown passes. It's similar to looking at an MLB outfielders total amount of errors, and concluding because they have made very few errors they are a good outfielder. In reality they could be a below average outfielder because they don't have the range of a great outfielder. Thereby limiting the amount of errors by not having as many opportunities to make mistakes. IMO, this is what is happening with Ridders rating. Denbrock doesn't call a lot of pass plays across the middle because he is afraid Ridder will throw more interceptions. Opposing defenses adjust to this and leave the middle more open while focusing more on the edges.
 
09-28-2020 09:49 PM
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Sweetness Offline
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Post: #55
RE: UC QB situation (Ridder v Bryant)
(09-28-2020 09:49 PM)RuckleSt Wrote:  
(09-28-2020 09:23 PM)CoachFickFan Wrote:  The Bearcats should play the best QB.
It seems that the QB with the best QB rating is Des Ridder, who has (at 154.5) the best UC QB Rating since Zach Collaros (195.5, 2009) was a backup to Tony Pike, and Brendon Kay (163.1) was a backup to Munchie Legaux (2012). It is clear that the very best recent teams had two really good QBs.

AAC Passing QB Rating Leaders 2020
Dillon Gabriel, UCF, 173.5, #13 National Rank
Brady White, Memphis, 166.8, #16 National Rank
Shane Buechelle, SMU, 164.5, #18 National Rank
Desmond Ritter, Cincinnati, 154.5, #22 National Rank
Holton Ahlers, ECU 137.8, #38, National Rank
Zach Smith, Tulsa, 118.7, #57, National Rank
Jordan McClain, USF, 111.3
Keon Howard, Tulane, 83.0
Dalen Morris, 65.0, Navy
Both Houston and Temple haven’t
played a game yet. Houston’s AD had a game scheduled at Baylor 3 hours after Baylor/LA Tech game was postponed. But 22 hours before the game was scheduled to be played, Baylor cancelled because of COVID. Houston’s equipment truck made it to the stadium in Waco, but not the Cougars.
These two AAC QBs/Teams haven’t played in 2020 yet:
Clayton Tune, Houston, 141.7 QBR, 2019
Anthony Russo, Temple, 126.9 QBR,2019

Bearcat Passing QB Rating Leaders 2004-2020 with some Passing Yards Stats
2020, Desmond Ridder, Cincinnati, 154.5,
2019, Desmond Ridder, 123.7, 2164 passing yards
2019, Ben Bryant, 119.4, 388 passing yards
2018, Desmond Ridder, 146.4
2017, Hayden Moore, 118.4
2016. Hayden Moore, 123.4, 1744 passing yards
2016, Gunner Kiel 117.6, 804 passing yards
2015, Gunner Kiel, 151.9, 2777 passing yards
2015, Hayden Moore, 123.4, 1885 passing yards
2014, Gunner Kiel, 149.4, 3254 passing yards
2014, Munchie Legaux, 136.4, 574 passing yards
2013, Brendon Kay, 148.4, 3302 passing yards
2013, Munchie Legaux, 122.9, 382 passing yards
2012, Munchie Legaux, 125.7, 120/230, 1716 passing yards, 13 tds, 9 int
2012, Brendon Kay, 163.1, 87/138, 1298 passing yards, 10 tds, 2 ints
2011, Zach Collaros, 131.6
2010, Zach Collaros, 137.5
2009, Tony Pike, 149.8, 2520 passing yards
2009, Zach Collaros, 195.5, 1434 passing yards
2008, Tony Pike, 136.4, 2407 passing yards, 19tds, 11 ints
2008, Dustin Grutza, 166.7, 617 passing yards, 5 tds, 1 ints
2007, Ben Mauk, 150.6, 3121 passing yards
2007, Dustin Grutza, 161.9, 432 passing yards
2006, Dustin Grutza, 123.5, 1632 passing yards
2006, Nick Davila, 151.6, 1057 passing yards
2005, Dustin Grutza, 111.1, 1799 passing yards
2005, Nick Davila, 142.4, 344 passing yards
2004, Gino Guidugli, 146.5

Guidugli is the current QB coach, and his QB coach was Dan Enos, who is now the Bearcats Assistant Head Coach and RB coach but has been OC for Miami FL, Alabama, and Arkansas.

I would argue that passer rating is a flawed metric in that it doesn't account for the type of passes completed. A QB could in theory "game" the system by completing a lot of simple screen and checkdown passes. It's similar to looking at an MLB outfielders total amount of errors, and concluding because they have made very few errors they are a good outfielder. In reality they could be a below average outfielder because they don't have the range of a great outfielder. Thereby limiting the amount of errors by not having as many opportunities to make mistakes. IMO, this is what is happening with Ridders rating. Denbrock doesn't call a lot of pass plays across the middle because he is afraid Ridder will throw more interceptions. Opposing defenses adjust to this and leave the middle more open while focusing more on the edges.

It also doesn't account for the competition that you're playing against.
 
09-28-2020 10:04 PM
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eroc Offline
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Post: #56
RE: UC QB situation (Ridder v Bryant)
PPL seem more than willing to trust Coach Fickell in the matter of Ridder v. Bryant.

My question is how would people feel if/when this becomes Ridder v Prater? Will all those ppl who seem satisfied with the leadership/intangibles rationalization (projected or otherwise) find that explanation as acceptable in keeping Prater on the bench?
 
09-28-2020 10:06 PM
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Cataclysmo Online
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Post: #57
RE: UC QB situation (Ridder v Bryant)
(09-28-2020 07:21 PM)bearcat54 Wrote:  looks like a lot of bearcat fans are frantic every week in every sport. Expecting to win every game and if a point down, they panic and want changes. CHANGE sure didn't work for the USA when Obidens were in power.
Holy christ, this is an all time attempt to invoke politics for no reason lol

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(This post was last modified: 09-28-2020 10:17 PM by Cataclysmo.)
09-28-2020 10:17 PM
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UCGrad1992 Offline
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Post: #58
RE: UC QB situation (Ridder v Bryant)
(09-28-2020 10:06 PM)eroc Wrote:  PPL seem more than willing to trust Coach Fickell in the matter of Ridder v. Bryant.

My question is how would people feel if/when this becomes Ridder v Prater? Will all those ppl who seem satisfied with the leadership/intangibles rationalization (projected or otherwise) find that explanation as acceptable in keeping Prater on the bench?

What are you saying, Fickell can't be trusted LOL? How about we cross the Prater bridge next season when it's actually relevant?
 
09-28-2020 10:36 PM
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CliftonAve Offline
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Post: #59
RE: UC QB situation (Ridder v Bryant)
Prater needs a year to put on 25 pounds of muscle, learn the playbook and adjust to this level. He’s not playing against Mariemont and Madeira anymore. Ridder came into the program at a buck seventy as well, and benefitted from that redshirt year to add good weight and strength. That’s why he was physically ready to take on UCLA in week 1 in 2018.
 
09-29-2020 05:49 AM
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RealDeal Offline
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Post: #60
RE: UC QB situation (Ridder v Bryant)
(09-28-2020 10:04 PM)Sweetness Wrote:  
(09-28-2020 09:49 PM)RuckleSt Wrote:  I would argue that passer rating is a flawed metric in that it doesn't account for the type of passes completed. A QB could in theory "game" the system by completing a lot of simple screen and checkdown passes. It's similar to looking at an MLB outfielders total amount of errors, and concluding because they have made very few errors they are a good outfielder. In reality they could be a below average outfielder because they don't have the range of a great outfielder. Thereby limiting the amount of errors by not having as many opportunities to make mistakes. IMO, this is what is happening with Ridders rating. Denbrock doesn't call a lot of pass plays across the middle because he is afraid Ridder will throw more interceptions. Opposing defenses adjust to this and leave the middle more open while focusing more on the edges.

It also doesn't account for the competition that you're playing against.

Not to mention going back 10 years and comparing passer rating doesn't account for how much more passing friendly football has become; it's basically irrelevant to go back much further than 5 years. No one stat will ever be perfect but I look at QBR and for a team that's been at the top of the conference our starting QB was 8/12 in our conference last year and so far this year in a really small sample size is 5/8. This includes rushing contributions. If we're trying to win the conference we're likely going to need our QB to be in the top quarter of the conference.
 
09-29-2020 06:08 AM
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