C1ncy4Life
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RE: 2020 AP Top 25 Thread
(10-05-2020 09:02 PM)rath v2.0 Wrote: If I’m criticizing Fick it’s that he has either changed his mind on wide open and dynamic or he just hasn’t recruited that position well enough - high school or grad transfer- to get a FBS level signal caller that can stretch the field and contribute so far in 4 years. Prater may be good in 2-3 years. Until then, barring the wheels completely falling off, I think Ridder is the guy for seasons to come.
Billy called “tressel ball” the day we hired him and I’ll be darned if we don’t look like a 3 star version of that more and more each season. Between Dantonio and Tressel being his mentors, guess it should not be that surprising.
I don’t really agree that Fick is trying to play “Tressel” ball. Even Tressel opened up the offense towards the end of his tenure and had high octane offenses. Fick realizes this, but also realized we have to run an offense that gives us the best chance to win.
In 2018 he was limited because we started a Freshman QB so it didn’t make sense to drop back 40 times to pass.
In 2019 the offensive line had issues so once again we were limited. Still there were times throughout last season when we tried and were let down by poor QB play.
In 2020 it seems the pieces are in place. I think we have tried to run a high scoring offense. Imagine what we would think of the offense if we had executed properly. If Ridder completed just a couple of his throws to wide open receivers each week what would we think of the offense?. We would have scored at least a couple additional TD’s each week and I think we would all be excited about the offense. The problem is more to do with execution this season.
I’d also say he has recruited great, even at the QB position. The first cycle or two he was limited due to lack of time to build relationships and it’s not like the pantry was full when he arrived. He was probably forced to take Ridder as there wasn’t any better options that he could land in that short time frame. I also refuse to judge all our QB’s off Ridder due to the reasons above.
I place the blame on not giving Bryant more of a chance.
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10-06-2020 08:28 AM |
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JPBearcat3
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RE: 2020 AP Top 25 Thread
(10-06-2020 08:28 AM)C1ncy4Life Wrote: (10-05-2020 09:02 PM)rath v2.0 Wrote: If I’m criticizing Fick it’s that he has either changed his mind on wide open and dynamic or he just hasn’t recruited that position well enough - high school or grad transfer- to get a FBS level signal caller that can stretch the field and contribute so far in 4 years. Prater may be good in 2-3 years. Until then, barring the wheels completely falling off, I think Ridder is the guy for seasons to come.
Billy called “tressel ball” the day we hired him and I’ll be darned if we don’t look like a 3 star version of that more and more each season. Between Dantonio and Tressel being his mentors, guess it should not be that surprising.
I don’t really agree that Fick is trying to play “Tressel” ball. Even Tressel opened up the offense towards the end of his tenure and had high octane offenses. Fick realizes this, but also realized we have to run an offense that gives us the best chance to win.
In 2018 he was limited because we started a Freshman QB so it didn’t make sense to drop back 40 times to pass.
In 2019 the offensive line had issues so once again we were limited. Still there were times throughout last season when we tried and were let down by poor QB play.
In 2020 it seems the pieces are in place. I think we have tried to run a high scoring offense. Imagine what we would think of the offense if we had executed properly. If Ridder completed just a couple of his throws to wide open receivers each week what would we think of the offense?. We would have scored at least a couple additional TD’s each week and I think we would all be excited about the offense. The problem is more to do with execution this season.
I’d also say he has recruited great, even at the QB position. The first cycle or two he was limited due to lack of time to build relationships and it’s not like the pantry was full when he arrived. He was probably forced to take Ridder as there wasn’t any better options that he could land in that short time frame. I also refuse to judge all our QB’s off Ridder due to the reasons above.
I place the blame on not giving Bryant more of a chance.
Agree with this. We've had wide open receivers running all over the field so far this year. That didn't happen last year.
The X's and O's aren't the problem. It's one particular Jimmy/Joe.
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10-06-2020 08:34 AM |
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CliftonAve
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RE: 2020 AP Top 25 Thread
^^ they basically booted out the entire WR room and replaced then duty more explosive guts. Fick was quoted several times this past off season about having guys that can make things happen ala Memphis. This is why I will push back on those who argue the staff has their heads in the sand and will never change
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10-06-2020 09:36 AM |
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OKIcat
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RE: 2020 AP Top 25 Thread
(10-06-2020 08:28 AM)C1ncy4Life Wrote: (10-05-2020 09:02 PM)rath v2.0 Wrote: If I’m criticizing Fick it’s that he has either changed his mind on wide open and dynamic or he just hasn’t recruited that position well enough - high school or grad transfer- to get a FBS level signal caller that can stretch the field and contribute so far in 4 years. Prater may be good in 2-3 years. Until then, barring the wheels completely falling off, I think Ridder is the guy for seasons to come.
Billy called “tressel ball” the day we hired him and I’ll be darned if we don’t look like a 3 star version of that more and more each season. Between Dantonio and Tressel being his mentors, guess it should not be that surprising.
I don’t really agree that Fick is trying to play “Tressel” ball. Even Tressel opened up the offense towards the end of his tenure and had high octane offenses. Fick realizes this, but also realized we have to run an offense that gives us the best chance to win.
In 2018 he was limited because we started a Freshman QB so it didn’t make sense to drop back 40 times to pass.
In 2019 the offensive line had issues so once again we were limited. Still there were times throughout last season when we tried and were let down by poor QB play.
In 2020 it seems the pieces are in place. I think we have tried to run a high scoring offense. Imagine what we would think of the offense if we had executed properly. If Ridder completed just a couple of his throws to wide open receivers each week what would we think of the offense?. We would have scored at least a couple additional TD’s each week and I think we would all be excited about the offense. The problem is more to do with execution this season.
I’d also say he has recruited great, even at the QB position. The first cycle or two he was limited due to lack of time to build relationships and it’s not like the pantry was full when he arrived. He was probably forced to take Ridder as there wasn’t any better options that he could land in that short time frame. I also refuse to judge all our QB’s off Ridder due to the reasons above.
I place the blame on not giving Bryant more of a chance.
Bolded, well said. I had a similar thought this morning. Two more touchdowns each of the past two weeks would have yielded the following results: UC 42, USF 14 and UC 38, Army 10. With those scores, I think we'd have some much shorter, or non-existent threads on Banter.
Failure to execute on offense has raised reasonable doubts about this team's ceiling, maybe kept it out of the top ten so far. Even undefeated and ranked right now, I think many are reluctant to invest too much emotionally in the loftier dreams of August.
Unfortunately, all of Cincinnati's sports teams have conditioned us to such diminished expectations over recent decades. Here's hoping our football Bearcats can still break through the glass ceiling hovering atop Hamilton County.
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10-06-2020 09:37 AM |
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natibeast21
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RE: 2020 AP Top 25 Thread
Couldn't agree more^^
We have the personnel to be an explosive team in this conference and battle with legit P5 teams.
Execute the plays!!!
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10-06-2020 09:46 AM |
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UCBearcatlawjd2
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RE: 2020 AP Top 25 Thread
I am not sure there is a better option at the moment than Ridder. Bryant was unavailable last week which creates an issue going forward where he might not be ready to go at Tulsa.
This is a basically a throw away year. UC will be fortunate if we can get through this season without a game being postponed or cancelled. Hope for the safety for the team and that they win every game but I am going to treat this season a crazy oddity no matter how it plays out.
Who knows what things look like in December and if we get to see bowl games. I enjoy the wins but I am not thinking about playoffs or NY6.
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10-06-2020 09:46 AM |
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rath v2.0
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RE: 2020 AP Top 25 Thread
My point was that this isn’t year one or two where you are stuck with who the last staff left you on the roster 4 years in and we still haven’t brought in a guy to competently run a high level passing game.
In rebuilding and strengthening this roster we’ve also successfully jumped into the transfer market for about every position group except this one for some reason. My fear is that it’s the type of limited offense we run that closes down potential opportunities on that front.
So either this really is the offense we want to run or we just didn’t staff that position group with guys who can do what we would have otherwise wanted to run.
Huge fan of CLF. Just not a fan of how the staff has handled the QB position group and by extension the limited offense we are again forced to run. It’s a limiting factor on taking the next step as a program. And yes, I think we have a couple more years of this.
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10-06-2020 10:00 AM |
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robertfoshizzle
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RE: 2020 AP Top 25 Thread
(10-06-2020 10:00 AM)rath v2.0 Wrote: My point was that this isn’t year one or two where you are stuck with who the last staff left you on the roster 4 years in and we still haven’t brought in a guy to competently run a high level passing game.
In rebuilding and strengthening this roster we’ve also successfully jumped into the transfer market for about every position group except this one for some reason. My fear is that it’s the type of limited offense we run that closes down potential opportunities on that front.
So either this really is the offense we want to run or we just didn’t staff that position group with guys who can do what we would have otherwise wanted to run.
Huge fan of CLF. Just not a fan of how the staff has handled the QB position group and by extension the limited offense we are again forced to run. It’s a limiting factor on taking the next step as a program. And yes, I think we have a couple more years of this.
To be fair, we had Torrance Gibson and also went after Joe Burrow from what I've heard.
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10-06-2020 10:09 AM |
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rath v2.0
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RE: 2020 AP Top 25 Thread
I said successful
Gibson was never going to play a down of QB anywhere at this level and Joe Burrow wasn’t coming here to manage a game and throw 7 yard outs.
(This post was last modified: 10-06-2020 10:15 AM by rath v2.0.)
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10-06-2020 10:14 AM |
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robertfoshizzle
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RE: 2020 AP Top 25 Thread
(10-06-2020 10:14 AM)rath v2.0 Wrote: I said successful
Gibson was never going to play a down of QB anywhere at this level and Joe Burrow wasn’t coming here to manage a game and throw 7 yard outs.
True. Honestly, after Ridder's freshman year, I think the staff thought we were set at QB going forward with Ridder, Bryant, and then Prater coming on board. And they likely chalked last year's regression up to injuries, so I understand why they haven't hit the QB transfer market very hard. That said, I'm of the position that Bryant needs to get some meaningful game reps ASAP and the staff needs to take a long, hard look at making the switch.
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10-06-2020 10:18 AM |
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robertfoshizzle
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RE: 2020 AP Top 25 Thread
Also, if Ridder has regressed and Bryant hasn't proven to be good enough to unseat him -- are we concerned about Gino's ability to develop quarterbacks? Just throwing out some food for thought.
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10-06-2020 10:20 AM |
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rath v2.0
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RE: 2020 AP Top 25 Thread
(10-06-2020 09:36 AM)CliftonAve Wrote: ^^ they basically booted out the entire WR room and replaced then duty more explosive guts. Fick was quoted several times this past off season about having guys that can make things happen ala Memphis. This is why I will push back on those who argue the staff has their heads in the sand and will never change
Our WRs are much improved. They are open. A lot.
But too often if it’s not a little sideline route they are running downfield routes just to get exercise.
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10-06-2020 10:22 AM |
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Banter
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RE: 2020 AP Top 25 Thread
(10-06-2020 10:00 AM)rath v2.0 Wrote: My point was that this isn’t year one or two where you are stuck with who the last staff left you on the roster 4 years in and we still haven’t brought in a guy to competently run a high level passing game.
In rebuilding and strengthening this roster we’ve also successfully jumped into the transfer market for about every position group except this one for some reason. My fear is that it’s the type of limited offense we run that closes down potential opportunities on that front.
So either this really is the offense we want to run or we just didn’t staff that position group with guys who can do what we would have otherwise wanted to run.
Huge fan of CLF. Just not a fan of how the staff has handled the QB position group and by extension the limited offense we are again forced to run. It’s a limiting factor on taking the next step as a program. And yes, I think we have a couple more years of this.
I don't think any coach in America would jump into the transfer market for a QB in Fickells position prior to the start of this season.
Ridder had a very good RS Freshman season. I think all of us expected him to be our QB for 3 more years at that point. As a RS Frosh he had 2500 yards 20 TD to 5 INT and a 62% completion percentage. No need to find a transfer.
There were issues last year, but Des was clearly hurt, the O-line was not very good, and the receivers were sub-par. The O-line is improved, and the WR room looked overhauled. One would expect a healthy Ridder to improve as a third-year starter and take control of the offense. This has not happened.
No way you were going after a transfer last season. If the QB room continues to struggle the entire year then MAYBE you try and find a guy with 1 year of eligibility for next season, but you have to think one of the guys here can fill that role until Prater likely takes over in 2022.
(This post was last modified: 10-06-2020 10:23 AM by Banter.)
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10-06-2020 10:22 AM |
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rath v2.0
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RE: 2020 AP Top 25 Thread
(10-06-2020 10:20 AM)robertfoshizzle Wrote: Also, if Ridder has regressed and Bryant hasn't proven to be good enough to unseat him -- are we concerned about Gino's ability to develop quarterbacks? Just throwing out some food for thought.
It’s a fair question.
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10-06-2020 10:22 AM |
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rath v2.0
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RE: 2020 AP Top 25 Thread
(10-06-2020 10:22 AM)Banter Wrote: (10-06-2020 10:00 AM)rath v2.0 Wrote: My point was that this isn’t year one or two where you are stuck with who the last staff left you on the roster 4 years in and we still haven’t brought in a guy to competently run a high level passing game.
In rebuilding and strengthening this roster we’ve also successfully jumped into the transfer market for about every position group except this one for some reason. My fear is that it’s the type of limited offense we run that closes down potential opportunities on that front.
So either this really is the offense we want to run or we just didn’t staff that position group with guys who can do what we would have otherwise wanted to run.
Huge fan of CLF. Just not a fan of how the staff has handled the QB position group and by extension the limited offense we are again forced to run. It’s a limiting factor on taking the next step as a program. And yes, I think we have a couple more years of this.
I don't think any coach in America would jump into the transfer market for a QB in Fickells position prior to the start of this season.
Ridder had a very good RS Freshman season. I think all of us expected him to be our QB for 3 more years at that point. As a RS Frosh he had 2500 yards 20 TD to 5 INT and a 62% completion percentage. No need to find a transfer.
There were issues last year, but Des was clearly hurt, the O-line was not very good, and the receivers were sub-par. The O-line is improved, and the WR room looked overhauled. One would expect a healthy Ridder to improve as a third-year starter and take control of the offense. This has not happened.
No way you were going after a transfer last season. If the QB room continues to struggle the entire year then MAYBE you try and find a guy with 1 year of eligibility for next season, but you have to think one of the guys here can fill that role until Prater likely takes over in 2022.
Prater in 22’ would be 6 years with this staff. Anyone really think Prater is going to unseat Ridder in his last year of eligibility? Not seeing any indication this staff would bench a 6th year guy with 4 years of running the offense already under his belt.
Heck there may be a better chance Prater transfers before then if he sees he’s is behind Ridder for 3 years.
(This post was last modified: 10-06-2020 10:31 AM by rath v2.0.)
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10-06-2020 10:30 AM |
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Cataclysmo
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2020 AP Top 25 Thread
Brady Lichtenberg is one of the top ranked QBs in Ohio and coming in next year, too. The Gibson and Burrow misses got the staff off on the wrong foot at QB but they have clearly stacked the position with young talent. It's fair to say they have struggled there but have also done everything possible to improve over the last few cycles.
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10-06-2020 10:37 AM |
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Banter
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RE: 2020 AP Top 25 Thread
(10-06-2020 10:30 AM)rath v2.0 Wrote: (10-06-2020 10:22 AM)Banter Wrote: (10-06-2020 10:00 AM)rath v2.0 Wrote: My point was that this isn’t year one or two where you are stuck with who the last staff left you on the roster 4 years in and we still haven’t brought in a guy to competently run a high level passing game.
In rebuilding and strengthening this roster we’ve also successfully jumped into the transfer market for about every position group except this one for some reason. My fear is that it’s the type of limited offense we run that closes down potential opportunities on that front.
So either this really is the offense we want to run or we just didn’t staff that position group with guys who can do what we would have otherwise wanted to run.
Huge fan of CLF. Just not a fan of how the staff has handled the QB position group and by extension the limited offense we are again forced to run. It’s a limiting factor on taking the next step as a program. And yes, I think we have a couple more years of this.
I don't think any coach in America would jump into the transfer market for a QB in Fickells position prior to the start of this season.
Ridder had a very good RS Freshman season. I think all of us expected him to be our QB for 3 more years at that point. As a RS Frosh he had 2500 yards 20 TD to 5 INT and a 62% completion percentage. No need to find a transfer.
There were issues last year, but Des was clearly hurt, the O-line was not very good, and the receivers were sub-par. The O-line is improved, and the WR room looked overhauled. One would expect a healthy Ridder to improve as a third-year starter and take control of the offense. This has not happened.
No way you were going after a transfer last season. If the QB room continues to struggle the entire year then MAYBE you try and find a guy with 1 year of eligibility for next season, but you have to think one of the guys here can fill that role until Prater likely takes over in 2022.
Prater in 22’ would be 6 years with this staff. Anyone really think Prater is going to unseat Ridder in his last year of eligibility? Not seeing any indication this staff would bench a 6th year guy with 4 years of running the offense already under his belt.
Heck there may be a better chance Prater transfers before then if he sees he’s is behind Ridder for 3 years.
If Prater has the talent everyone says he has then I believe he will be starting in 2022 and Des will be a grad transfer somewhere. I never saw Prater in high school... I am just buying into all the hype that bearcat fans are selling. If Ridder is the best this staff can do by 2022 then Geno needs to canned as QB coach.
(This post was last modified: 10-06-2020 10:41 AM by Banter.)
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10-06-2020 10:40 AM |
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RuckleSt
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RE: 2020 AP Top 25 Thread
(10-06-2020 10:40 AM)Banter Wrote: (10-06-2020 10:30 AM)rath v2.0 Wrote: (10-06-2020 10:22 AM)Banter Wrote: (10-06-2020 10:00 AM)rath v2.0 Wrote: My point was that this isn’t year one or two where you are stuck with who the last staff left you on the roster 4 years in and we still haven’t brought in a guy to competently run a high level passing game.
In rebuilding and strengthening this roster we’ve also successfully jumped into the transfer market for about every position group except this one for some reason. My fear is that it’s the type of limited offense we run that closes down potential opportunities on that front.
So either this really is the offense we want to run or we just didn’t staff that position group with guys who can do what we would have otherwise wanted to run.
Huge fan of CLF. Just not a fan of how the staff has handled the QB position group and by extension the limited offense we are again forced to run. It’s a limiting factor on taking the next step as a program. And yes, I think we have a couple more years of this.
I don't think any coach in America would jump into the transfer market for a QB in Fickells position prior to the start of this season.
Ridder had a very good RS Freshman season. I think all of us expected him to be our QB for 3 more years at that point. As a RS Frosh he had 2500 yards 20 TD to 5 INT and a 62% completion percentage. No need to find a transfer.
There were issues last year, but Des was clearly hurt, the O-line was not very good, and the receivers were sub-par. The O-line is improved, and the WR room looked overhauled. One would expect a healthy Ridder to improve as a third-year starter and take control of the offense. This has not happened.
No way you were going after a transfer last season. If the QB room continues to struggle the entire year then MAYBE you try and find a guy with 1 year of eligibility for next season, but you have to think one of the guys here can fill that role until Prater likely takes over in 2022.
Prater in 22’ would be 6 years with this staff. Anyone really think Prater is going to unseat Ridder in his last year of eligibility? Not seeing any indication this staff would bench a 6th year guy with 4 years of running the offense already under his belt.
Heck there may be a better chance Prater transfers before then if he sees he’s is behind Ridder for 3 years.
If Prater has the talent everyone says he has then I believe he will be starting in 2022 and Des will be a grad transfer somewhere. I never saw Prater in high school... I am just buying into all the hype that bearcat fans are selling. If Ridder is the best this staff can do by 2022 then Geno needs to canned as QB coach.
Ridder is a Junior, he should be out of eligibility by 22.
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10-06-2020 10:59 AM |
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Banter
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RE: 2020 AP Top 25 Thread
(10-06-2020 10:59 AM)RuckleSt Wrote: (10-06-2020 10:40 AM)Banter Wrote: (10-06-2020 10:30 AM)rath v2.0 Wrote: (10-06-2020 10:22 AM)Banter Wrote: (10-06-2020 10:00 AM)rath v2.0 Wrote: My point was that this isn’t year one or two where you are stuck with who the last staff left you on the roster 4 years in and we still haven’t brought in a guy to competently run a high level passing game.
In rebuilding and strengthening this roster we’ve also successfully jumped into the transfer market for about every position group except this one for some reason. My fear is that it’s the type of limited offense we run that closes down potential opportunities on that front.
So either this really is the offense we want to run or we just didn’t staff that position group with guys who can do what we would have otherwise wanted to run.
Huge fan of CLF. Just not a fan of how the staff has handled the QB position group and by extension the limited offense we are again forced to run. It’s a limiting factor on taking the next step as a program. And yes, I think we have a couple more years of this.
I don't think any coach in America would jump into the transfer market for a QB in Fickells position prior to the start of this season.
Ridder had a very good RS Freshman season. I think all of us expected him to be our QB for 3 more years at that point. As a RS Frosh he had 2500 yards 20 TD to 5 INT and a 62% completion percentage. No need to find a transfer.
There were issues last year, but Des was clearly hurt, the O-line was not very good, and the receivers were sub-par. The O-line is improved, and the WR room looked overhauled. One would expect a healthy Ridder to improve as a third-year starter and take control of the offense. This has not happened.
No way you were going after a transfer last season. If the QB room continues to struggle the entire year then MAYBE you try and find a guy with 1 year of eligibility for next season, but you have to think one of the guys here can fill that role until Prater likely takes over in 2022.
Prater in 22’ would be 6 years with this staff. Anyone really think Prater is going to unseat Ridder in his last year of eligibility? Not seeing any indication this staff would bench a 6th year guy with 4 years of running the offense already under his belt.
Heck there may be a better chance Prater transfers before then if he sees he’s is behind Ridder for 3 years.
If Prater has the talent everyone says he has then I believe he will be starting in 2022 and Des will be a grad transfer somewhere. I never saw Prater in high school... I am just buying into all the hype that bearcat fans are selling. If Ridder is the best this staff can do by 2022 then Geno needs to canned as QB coach.
Ridder is a Junior, he should be out of eligibility by 22.
My understanding is that all players receive an extra year due to the pandemic.
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10-06-2020 11:32 AM |
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RuckleSt
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RE: 2020 AP Top 25 Thread
(10-06-2020 11:32 AM)Banter Wrote: (10-06-2020 10:59 AM)RuckleSt Wrote: (10-06-2020 10:40 AM)Banter Wrote: (10-06-2020 10:30 AM)rath v2.0 Wrote: (10-06-2020 10:22 AM)Banter Wrote: I don't think any coach in America would jump into the transfer market for a QB in Fickells position prior to the start of this season.
Ridder had a very good RS Freshman season. I think all of us expected him to be our QB for 3 more years at that point. As a RS Frosh he had 2500 yards 20 TD to 5 INT and a 62% completion percentage. No need to find a transfer.
There were issues last year, but Des was clearly hurt, the O-line was not very good, and the receivers were sub-par. The O-line is improved, and the WR room looked overhauled. One would expect a healthy Ridder to improve as a third-year starter and take control of the offense. This has not happened.
No way you were going after a transfer last season. If the QB room continues to struggle the entire year then MAYBE you try and find a guy with 1 year of eligibility for next season, but you have to think one of the guys here can fill that role until Prater likely takes over in 2022.
Prater in 22’ would be 6 years with this staff. Anyone really think Prater is going to unseat Ridder in his last year of eligibility? Not seeing any indication this staff would bench a 6th year guy with 4 years of running the offense already under his belt.
Heck there may be a better chance Prater transfers before then if he sees he’s is behind Ridder for 3 years.
If Prater has the talent everyone says he has then I believe he will be starting in 2022 and Des will be a grad transfer somewhere. I never saw Prater in high school... I am just buying into all the hype that bearcat fans are selling. If Ridder is the best this staff can do by 2022 then Geno needs to canned as QB coach.
Ridder is a Junior, he should be out of eligibility by 22.
My understanding is that all players receive an extra year due to the pandemic.
That's wild, I thought it was only for players that "opted out" this season.
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10-06-2020 12:06 PM |
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