The unofficial online home for fans of the Old Dominion University Monarchs. Part of Collegiate Sports Nation (CSN).

I graduated High School in 1984 from a Eastern Henrico school. Was a very strong student, with acceptance from WM, UVA, Tech, Miami (FL), and Trinity (Tx). Was not from a well-to-do family, so the offer from Miami was insufficient to make it feasible to go there (and become an oceanographer as I thought at the time). Was late into my Spring Senior semester, and ODU just kept making better and better offers. Finally, they offered me a Dominion Scholarship (full tuition), and I had to keep something like a 3.2 to keep it all four years - never an issue.

My parents, thrilled at the prospect, bought me a sweet little used MGB convertible when I accepted to ODU, and combined with other schollys and my own work, they never paid a dime.

I have had a solid and successful career in Applied Chemistry. My best friends remain those made at ODU, and we get together often every year since my 1988 graduation. Those times, living on (or near) campus in the 80s were awesome. Best times of my life.

I think sometimes how things could have turned out had I chosen a different path. Maybe I could have reached higher, maybe not. What I do know is this; the best people I have ever known have been a part of ODU with me. I will lower some into the ground in the coming years, and when the bell tolls for me, they will do the same for me. Marriages, jobs, etc. all pass. But the connections you make in college matter greatly, and I was fortunate to make very good ones.

I share these things because my affiliation with ODU has been very positive. My friends from ODU are all doing well. We have hopefully all made better opportunities for our generation of kids. I certainly have no complaints, and agree that success is there for the taking, but a student needs to embrace and take it during their college years.

Might be related to ODU's new ranking and Carnagie Rankings, but I was in NJ/NYC for Easter and I saw billboards for ODU along the highway. Never seen them before and I frequent the area a lot.

(04-19-2022 11:53 AM)GhentFan Wrote:  Might be related to ODU's new ranking and Carnagie Rankings, but I was in NJ/NYC for Easter and I saw billboards for ODU along the highway. Never seen them before and I frequent the area a lot.

I see them sometimes, but the ones I see are always for. “Online”. Makes us look like Phoenix. I wish they’d mix em up and do some real campus ones too

(04-19-2022 12:11 PM)monarx Wrote:  

(04-19-2022 11:53 AM)GhentFan Wrote:  Might be related to ODU's new ranking and Carnagie Rankings, but I was in NJ/NYC for Easter and I saw billboards for ODU along the highway. Never seen them before and I frequent the area a lot.

I see them sometimes, but the ones I see are always for. “Online”. Makes us look like Phoenix. I wish they’d mix em up and do some real campus ones too

Pretty sure they are ODUonline. I know there was one on 95 north of Philadelphia a few months ago.

https://www.usnews.com/best-colleges/old-dominion-3728

Not sure what happened, but we got crushed in the USNWR rankings this year. ODU drops from an almost not embarrassing #258 down to a #299. Was hoping to see us rise up to better than #250, so thats disappointing. Guess the R1 stuff didnt have the hoped for effect (though its a pretty new designation, maybe it affects 2023). For comparison:

GMU: 131 (rose12)
UAB: 137 (rose16)
JMU: 151 (new)
VCU: 166 (dropped 6)
Hampton: 219
UNCC: 219 (rose 8)
ECU: 234 (dropped 17)
FAU: 263 (NR)
ODU: 299 (dropped 41) (tied with Marshall, MTSU, Campbell and Regent)

From the best I can tell at a quick glance this would help us tremendously:

• Our acceptance rate needs to be slightly more selective (we are 96%, would be good to get to 92-93%)

• Our 4yr grad rate needs to improve A LOT. We are 25%, VCU is at 48%, JMU 65%. Even our 6 yr grad rate is only 52%.

• Our graduate's median starting salaries need to get in the $50ks

• Alumni giving was only at 3%. Get that to at least 5%


Surprisingly, we were only ranked #140 for social mobility and nowhere on the "best values" lists. I think this "cheap and diverse" approach to our brand is not working in our favor and neither is having most of the marketing efforts going toward the online program. It makes us look like a peer of UMGC or ECPI rather than VCU, ECU, UAB, UNCC etc. Affordability is great. But the perception is "you get what you pay for". People want quality first and are willing to take on a little extra debt if they feel the ROI is there. I would charge comparable tuition rates to our peers and put the extra resources into career services, scholarships, tutors and marketing for our residential undergrad programs. I was excited to see the rise last year, but very disappointed to see such a significant drop this time around.

It is also possible that our emphasis on graduate level programs has hurt our undergrad ratings.

We became a Tier 1 National research Institution last year.

(09-12-2022 09:44 AM)ODUalum78 Wrote:  It is also possible that our emphasis on graduate level programs has hurt our undergrad ratings.

We became a Tier 1 National research Institution last year.

We've been a National Research Institution by the USNWR definition for decades and have been ranked multiple times over the years. Usually right on the edge of T1 and T2. Thankfully we're still in T1. This is the first year JMU has been a NRI as they were previously considered "regional". As more schools enter the rankings for the first time above us, maybe that pushes us down some too?

Regardless, how do you think grad programs would hurt undergrad? The grad programs are more highly ranked, and are what got us into R1 status. I would think the rising tide would lift the undergrad boat so to speak.

I usually don't give a rats ass to US News rankings but that 25% graduation rate is just horrible to say the least. What in the world is happening over there. I am glad we are an R1 tier institution but the more graduates we can have in the world generating top dollar the better it is for the school to keep the donor streams nice and get the research going with the dollars generated. We can't have an abysmal 25% graduation rate no matter how you see it and pride ourselves as an educational institution trying to improve on the academic side.

(09-12-2022 09:58 AM)12thmonarch Wrote:  I usually don't give a rats ass to US News rankings but that 25% graduation rate is just horrible to say the least. What in the world is happening over there. I am glad we are an R1 tier institution but the more graduates we can have in the world generating top dollar the better it is for the school to keep the donor streams nice and get the research going with the dollars generated. We can't have an abysmal 25% graduation rate no matter how you see it and pride ourselves as an educational institution trying to improve on the academic side.

Too many folks stepping on the seal, obviously

(09-12-2022 09:29 AM)monarx Wrote:  https://www.usnews.com/best-colleges/old-dominion-3728

Not sure what happened, but we got crushed in the USNWR rankings this year. ODU drops from an almost not embarrassing #258 down to a #299. Was hoping to see us rise up to better than #250, so thats disappointing. Guess the R1 stuff didnt have the hoped for effect (though its a pretty new designation, maybe it affects 2023). For comparison:

GMU: 131 (rose12)
UAB: 137 (rose16)
JMU: 151 (new)
VCU: 166 (dropped 6)
Hampton: 219
UNCC: 219 (rose 8)
ECU: 234 (dropped 17)
FAU: 263 (NR)
ODU: 299 (dropped 41) (tied with Marshall, MTSU, Campbell and Regent)

From the best I can tell at a quick glance this would help us tremendously:

• Our acceptance rate needs to be slightly more selective (we are 96%, would be good to get to 92-93%)

• Our 4yr grad rate needs to improve A LOT. We are 25%, VCU is at 48%, JMU 65%. Even our 6 yr grad rate is only 52%.

• Our graduate's median starting salaries need to get in the $50ks

• Alumni giving was only at 3%. Get that to at least 5%


Surprisingly, we were only ranked #140 for social mobility and nowhere on the "best values" lists. I think this "cheap and diverse" approach to our brand is not working in our favor and neither is having most of the marketing efforts going toward the online program. It makes us look like a peer of UMGC or ECPI rather than VCU, ECU, UAB, UNCC etc. Affordability is great. But the perception is "you get what you pay for". People want quality first and are willing to take on a little extra debt if they feel the ROI is there. I would charge comparable tuition rates to our peers and put the extra resources into career services, scholarships, tutors and marketing for our residential undergrad programs. I was excited to see the rise last year, but very disappointed to see such a significant drop this time around.

Couldn't agree more. Cheap and Diverse is what a community college can strive for. We need to focus on academic excellence, a fantastic student experience, creating a culture that carries from students to alumni and improved campus safety, beautification, etc. 3% alumni giving - terrible - that's a poor student experience and no school culture loud and clear. Alumni are not sending their kids to their Alma Mater in the numbers they JMU/ECU/UVA/VT/Christopher Newport do not focus on Cheap and Diverse.

(09-12-2022 10:05 AM)ODUDrunkard13 Wrote:  

(09-12-2022 09:58 AM)12thmonarch Wrote:  I usually don't give a rats ass to US News rankings but that 25% graduation rate is just horrible to say the least. What in the world is happening over there. I am glad we are an R1 tier institution but the more graduates we can have in the world generating top dollar the better it is for the school to keep the donor streams nice and get the research going with the dollars generated. We can't have an abysmal 25% graduation rate no matter how you see it and pride ourselves as an educational institution trying to improve on the academic side.

Too many folks stepping on the seal, obviously

LOL the seal strike. In all seriousness though i hope someone from the admin is looking into those stats and the causes to fix them ASAP or at least address them for future.

(09-12-2022 10:27 AM)12thmonarch Wrote:  

(09-12-2022 10:05 AM)ODUDrunkard13 Wrote:  

(09-12-2022 09:58 AM)12thmonarch Wrote:  I usually don't give a rats ass to US News rankings but that 25% graduation rate is just horrible to say the least. What in the world is happening over there. I am glad we are an R1 tier institution but the more graduates we can have in the world generating top dollar the better it is for the school to keep the donor streams nice and get the research going with the dollars generated. We can't have an abysmal 25% graduation rate no matter how you see it and pride ourselves as an educational institution trying to improve on the academic side.

Too many folks stepping on the seal, obviously

LOL the seal strike. In all seriousness though i hope someone from the admin is looking into those stats and the causes to fix them ASAP or at least address them for future.

All kidding aside, I'd be interested in seeing the breakdown that shows how many working adults we have as students. I know I worked myself through school at ODU and it added a year to my time. And it's a big part of why I appreciate what ODU is so much. The school offered me the flexibility with online and night classes so I could make it work and leave the school with a great degree to start a great career. I know I met a lot of folks in my time at ODU that were doing the same thing.

(09-12-2022 11:06 AM)ODUDrunkard13 Wrote:  

(09-12-2022 10:27 AM)12thmonarch Wrote:  

(09-12-2022 10:05 AM)ODUDrunkard13 Wrote:  

(09-12-2022 09:58 AM)12thmonarch Wrote:  I usually don't give a rats ass to US News rankings but that 25% graduation rate is just horrible to say the least. What in the world is happening over there. I am glad we are an R1 tier institution but the more graduates we can have in the world generating top dollar the better it is for the school to keep the donor streams nice and get the research going with the dollars generated. We can't have an abysmal 25% graduation rate no matter how you see it and pride ourselves as an educational institution trying to improve on the academic side.

Too many folks stepping on the seal, obviously

LOL the seal strike. In all seriousness though i hope someone from the admin is looking into those stats and the causes to fix them ASAP or at least address them for future.

All kidding aside, I'd be interested in seeing the breakdown that shows how many working adults we have as students. I know I worked myself through school at ODU and it added a year to my time. And it's a big part of why I appreciate what ODU is so much. The school offered me the flexibility with online and night classes so I could make it work and leave the school with a great degree to start a great career. I know I met a lot of folks in my time at ODU that were doing the same thing.

Interesting and a valid take on real life situation for most of the working adults. Based on how this 4 year graduation rates are calculated a significant amount of working adults can induce a rolling higher time periods into the graduation cycle and can skew the numbers bad. Hopefully that is the case and we are still doing fine with graduating students.

(09-12-2022 11:58 AM)12thmonarch Wrote:  

(09-12-2022 11:06 AM)ODUDrunkard13 Wrote:  

(09-12-2022 10:27 AM)12thmonarch Wrote:  

(09-12-2022 10:05 AM)ODUDrunkard13 Wrote:  

(09-12-2022 09:58 AM)12thmonarch Wrote:  I usually don't give a rats ass to US News rankings but that 25% graduation rate is just horrible to say the least. What in the world is happening over there. I am glad we are an R1 tier institution but the more graduates we can have in the world generating top dollar the better it is for the school to keep the donor streams nice and get the research going with the dollars generated. We can't have an abysmal 25% graduation rate no matter how you see it and pride ourselves as an educational institution trying to improve on the academic side.

Too many folks stepping on the seal, obviously

LOL the seal strike. In all seriousness though i hope someone from the admin is looking into those stats and the causes to fix them ASAP or at least address them for future.

All kidding aside, I'd be interested in seeing the breakdown that shows how many working adults we have as students. I know I worked myself through school at ODU and it added a year to my time. And it's a big part of why I appreciate what ODU is so much. The school offered me the flexibility with online and night classes so I could make it work and leave the school with a great degree to start a great career. I know I met a lot of folks in my time at ODU that were doing the same thing.

Interesting and a valid take on real life situation for most of the working adults. Based on how this 4 year graduation rates are calculated a significant amount of working adults can induce a rolling higher time periods into the graduation cycle and can skew the numbers bad. Hopefully that is the case and we are still doing fine with graduating students.

It definitely makes an impact as does our military enrollment. But most urban schools have the "working student" component. We need to continue to serve that demographic well, but perhaps add focus to getting the the residential undergrads who have a strong likelihood to graduate in 4 years, get good jobs and pay their loans. Do that to improve the academic rep and rankings, and THEN our low tuition and diversity become selling points. But make no mistake, academic reputation, student experience and location are the main selling points. Compete in those areas, and let the tuition and diversity push us over the top. But lead with those first three.

Graduation rate has always been low and will remain low as long as we are an open door University. Another contributing factor has to do with miilitary enrolling then getting transfered out of the area before graduating.

(09-12-2022 10:22 AM)MonarchsWon Wrote:  

(09-12-2022 09:29 AM)monarx Wrote:  https://www.usnews.com/best-colleges/old-dominion-3728

Not sure what happened, but we got crushed in the USNWR rankings this year. ODU drops from an almost not embarrassing #258 down to a #299. Was hoping to see us rise up to better than #250, so thats disappointing. Guess the R1 stuff didnt have the hoped for effect (though its a pretty new designation, maybe it affects 2023). For comparison:

GMU: 131 (rose12)
UAB: 137 (rose16)
JMU: 151 (new)
VCU: 166 (dropped 6)
Hampton: 219
UNCC: 219 (rose 8)
ECU: 234 (dropped 17)
FAU: 263 (NR)
ODU: 299 (dropped 41) (tied with Marshall, MTSU, Campbell and Regent)

From the best I can tell at a quick glance this would help us tremendously:

• Our acceptance rate needs to be slightly more selective (we are 96%, would be good to get to 92-93%)

• Our 4yr grad rate needs to improve A LOT. We are 25%, VCU is at 48%, JMU 65%. Even our 6 yr grad rate is only 52%.

• Our graduate's median starting salaries need to get in the $50ks

• Alumni giving was only at 3%. Get that to at least 5%


Surprisingly, we were only ranked #140 for social mobility and nowhere on the "best values" lists. I think this "cheap and diverse" approach to our brand is not working in our favor and neither is having most of the marketing efforts going toward the online program. It makes us look like a peer of UMGC or ECPI rather than VCU, ECU, UAB, UNCC etc. Affordability is great. But the perception is "you get what you pay for". People want quality first and are willing to take on a little extra debt if they feel the ROI is there. I would charge comparable tuition rates to our peers and put the extra resources into career services, scholarships, tutors and marketing for our residential undergrad programs. I was excited to see the rise last year, but very disappointed to see such a significant drop this time around.

Couldn't agree more. Cheap and Diverse is what a community college can strive for. We need to focus on academic excellence, a fantastic student experience, creating a culture that carries from students to alumni and improved campus safety, beautification, etc. 3% alumni giving - terrible - that's a poor student experience and no school culture loud and clear. Alumni are not sending their kids to their Alma Mater in the numbers they JMU/ECU/UVA/VT/Christopher Newport do not focus on Cheap and Diverse.

I believe our approach has been somewhat dictated by the state both directly and indirectly. They wanted us to fill this niche between Community College and other state universities. Unfortunately, the years of bias towards ODU, based on incorrect assumptions and perception left us an easy target. Our admins willingness over the years to run with this has been just as unfortunate. It has not and is not working for us and it will be very detrimental in the long run.

We need a new, more traditional approach based on the quality of student, etc. Our rise in football and sports stature can help this tremendously. Sure we can focus on upward mobility - it's admirable and needed, but as someone else said that's the main role of the community college system.

With low graduation rates, and high Pell Grant attendees, the school is fleecing many students. It's a money grab. The school is complicit in this scam. It's time to require many students to attend community college to determine their commitment to a degree, and their worthiness of taxpayer funded financial support.

If you think about it, if you are one class short of a degree, you aren't much more employable than if you hadn't attended at all. And therefore, the grant money wasted, and the debt accumulated, becomes a poor investment, and tragedy.

(09-12-2022 12:07 PM)monarx Wrote:  

(09-12-2022 11:58 AM)12thmonarch Wrote:  

(09-12-2022 11:06 AM)ODUDrunkard13 Wrote:  

(09-12-2022 10:27 AM)12thmonarch Wrote:  

(09-12-2022 10:05 AM)ODUDrunkard13 Wrote:  Too many folks stepping on the seal, obviously

LOL the seal strike. In all seriousness though i hope someone from the admin is looking into those stats and the causes to fix them ASAP or at least address them for future.

All kidding aside, I'd be interested in seeing the breakdown that shows how many working adults we have as students. I know I worked myself through school at ODU and it added a year to my time. And it's a big part of why I appreciate what ODU is so much. The school offered me the flexibility with online and night classes so I could make it work and leave the school with a great degree to start a great career. I know I met a lot of folks in my time at ODU that were doing the same thing.

Interesting and a valid take on real life situation for most of the working adults. Based on how this 4 year graduation rates are calculated a significant amount of working adults can induce a rolling higher time periods into the graduation cycle and can skew the numbers bad. Hopefully that is the case and we are still doing fine with graduating students.

It definitely makes an impact as does our military enrollment. But most urban schools have the "working student" component. We need to continue to serve that demographic well, but perhaps add focus to getting the the residential undergrads who have a strong likelihood to graduate in 4 years, get good jobs and pay their loans. Do that to improve the academic rep and rankings, and THEN our low tuition and diversity become selling points. But make no mistake, academic reputation, student experience and location are the main selling points. Compete in those areas, and let the tuition and diversity push us over the top. But lead with those first three.

Agree. Nothing wrong with serving working individuals as they try to better themselves and work towards better opportunities. As a school we should always prioritize admissions to the students who are going to finish the degree and have the capability to bring the academic prowess to the school over the diversity factor. Don't get me wrong i want us to be diverse but that shouldn't come at the expense of academics or worse reputation to the school.

(09-12-2022 09:29 AM)monarx Wrote:  https://www.usnews.com/best-colleges/old-dominion-3728

Not sure what happened, but we got crushed in the USNWR rankings this year. ODU drops from an almost not embarrassing #258 down to a #299. Was hoping to see us rise up to better than #250, so thats disappointing. Guess the R1 stuff didnt have the hoped for effect (though its a pretty new designation, maybe it affects 2023). For comparison:

GMU: 131 (rose12)
UAB: 137 (rose16)
JMU: 151 (new)
VCU: 166 (dropped 6)
Hampton: 219
UNCC: 219 (rose 8)
ECU: 234 (dropped 17)
FAU: 263 (NR)
ODU: 299 (dropped 41) (tied with Marshall, MTSU, Campbell and Regent)

From the best I can tell at a quick glance this would help us tremendously:

• Our acceptance rate needs to be slightly more selective (we are 96%, would be good to get to 92-93%)

• Our 4yr grad rate needs to improve A LOT. We are 25%, VCU is at 48%, JMU 65%. Even our 6 yr grad rate is only 52%.

• Our graduate's median starting salaries need to get in the $50ks

• Alumni giving was only at 3%. Get that to at least 5%


Surprisingly, we were only ranked #140 for social mobility and nowhere on the "best values" lists. I think this "cheap and diverse" approach to our brand is not working in our favor and neither is having most of the marketing efforts going toward the online program. It makes us look like a peer of UMGC or ECPI rather than VCU, ECU, UAB, UNCC etc. Affordability is great. But the perception is "you get what you pay for". People want quality first and are willing to take on a little extra debt if they feel the ROI is there. I would charge comparable tuition rates to our peers and put the extra resources into career services, scholarships, tutors and marketing for our residential undergrad programs. I was excited to see the rise last year, but very disappointed to see such a significant drop this time around.

ODU has quietly let things slip so that we are known for letting anybody in with a pulse. This has diminished the reputation, based on the Broderick train who ran the standards into the ground during his time. Diversity/Inclusion (whatever that actually means) awards were plenty, but any recognition of substance were not understood or pursued. Instead, it was the mantra that those things don't matter to us --- and we are reaping the rewards for those decisions in the present and near term future.

The 'new' administration seems to be pursuing a strategy of the claim to R1 Research Status (which is really a fluke for ODU when you peel back the onion and see how ODU actually got that designation). The new strategy forming seems to be -- without any real investment in research except the illusion that ODU by name and some money can 'poach' some big $$$ researchers from other prestigious universities. This strategy is flawed as evidenced by every time ODU has pursued similar strategies it has always failed, for reasons of my opinion: (1) Why would someone of significant research stature come to ODU -- Name? Money? Running from a collapsing situation? Wanting to retire near the beach? -- any of which are a recipe for failure at ODU after they milk the situation -- as the rest of the infrastructure is starved from reallocated resources, (2) the strategy of 'we take anyone' is a short term gain at the expense of the long term success of the institution (when the number of applicants available from the high school graduation decline cliff in 2024 hits -- if you are at the bottom in admissions standards you have no place to go to increase enrollments -- the 'top' ODU students will suddenly find that they are acceptable to the UVA, Tech admissions and will be the first ones gone), and (3) diverting funds from other parts of the university (e.g. number of full time faculty, reliance on adjunct faculty to cover reallocation of $$$, pushing online programs without proper investments to make them distinguished) will only compound the downward spiral - leaving students in a lurch who don't benefit from the research status of the university -- as it will not make its way to the classroom -- I believe most students want good value for their education and to have excellent job/career prospects following graduation -- neither of which are served by any research designation, and in fact arguably diminished by the reallocation of resources away from the 'educational' mission of the university.

I was hoping to see some fundamental 'corrections' from the new administration, but there seems to be a shortsighted perspective to pad some resumes for the short term and probably leave others to clean up the mess while all the time claiming "success". ODU has been, is, and remains rudderless. I am disappointed, but trying to sugarcoat this is intellectually dishonest. Sorry for the rant, but I love ODU and feel bad for the lack of leadership being bestowed on the university over the last decade and appearing to continue, albeit in a slightly different direction.

(09-12-2022 12:17 PM)The Flagship Wrote:  With low graduation rates, and high Pell Grant attendees, the school is fleecing many students. It's a money grab. The school is complicit in this scam. It's time to require many students to attend community college to determine their commitment to a degree, and their worthiness of taxpayer funded financial support.

If you think about it, if you are one class short of a degree, you aren't much more employable than if you hadn't attended at all. And therefore, the grant money wasted, and the debt accumulated, becomes a poor investment, and tragedy.

Ive heard one interesting idea floated that would solve this issue quickly. It wont happen, but what if the feds got out of the loan game and student loans were issued by the schools themselves? Then the college would be on the hook for people who dont pay or who get jobs that dont pay enough to pay their bills. Or take the fin aid money and give it to the schools to distribute through loans and scholarships as they wish, earmarking it all to financial qualifications. Part of the rankings issue is ODU has a disproportionate amount of students on Pell grants, and loan repayment is also a factor in the rankings (I guess ability to pay is looked at as a measurement of degree quality). But lots of these loans either never result in a degree being completed or are used for non-lucrative majors.

And fwiw, I still have hope in Dr. Hemphill. He seems to care about the academic reputation and also the upcoming merger could be a game changer. Dr. Runte seemed to care about academics and student experience though, and they ran her off. And the folks I know within the school seem to think that was the right move, though Im not sure why.