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B1G to kickoff football October 17 - Milwaukee Journal
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quo vadis Offline
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B1G to kickoff football October 17 - Milwaukee Journal
Journal sources say the B1G will reverse course and kick off football on October 17.

https://wolverineswire.usatoday.com/2020...on-update/
09-13-2020 01:00 PM
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RE: B1G to kickoff football October 17 - Milwaukee Journal
So does the CFP get pushed back to accommodate them?
09-13-2020 01:49 PM
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XLance Online
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RE: B1G to kickoff football October 17 - Milwaukee Journal
Football.......to save the conference.

save the conference
09-13-2020 01:52 PM
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MWC Tex Offline
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RE: B1G to kickoff football October 17 - Milwaukee Journal
I’ll wait to believe it will actually happen. I’m sorry but there is political implications involved in that decision. No word on the PAC ?
09-13-2020 02:00 PM
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RE: B1G to kickoff football October 17 - Milwaukee Journal
(09-13-2020 02:00 PM)MWC Tex Wrote:  I’ll wait to believe it will actually happen. I’m sorry but there is political implications involved in that decision. No word on the PAC ?

The PAC 12 had legitimate reasons to postpone their season. Now add the crazy fires that is affecting the entire air quality of the Pacific Coast and a couple of boarding states I doubt seriously they reverse course like the Big Ten will apparently do.
09-13-2020 02:27 PM
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RE: B1G to kickoff football October 17 - Milwaukee Journal
(09-13-2020 02:00 PM)MWC Tex Wrote:  I’ll wait to believe it will actually happen. I’m sorry but there is political implications involved in that decision. No word on the PAC ?

Still nothing according to an Ohio St. blog, updated just before 5 pm eastern.
09-13-2020 03:59 PM
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DavidSt Offline
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RE: B1G to kickoff football October 17 - Milwaukee Journal
ESPN said there is not enough schools will reverse the course, and the majority will still vote no. They need 6 to vote yes, and there are no 6 schools that will change their minds.
09-13-2020 04:39 PM
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RE: B1G to kickoff football October 17 - Milwaukee Journal
It’s terrible that the leaders of the Big Ten can’t get their act together. They shouldn’t keep putting their athletes, coaches and fans through this. Make a decision, stand by it and move on.
09-13-2020 04:49 PM
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RE: B1G to kickoff football October 17 - Milwaukee Journal
They need a minimum of 9 schools to vote yes to play Oct 17th. Stay tuned...
09-13-2020 05:12 PM
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MWC Tex Offline
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RE: B1G to kickoff football October 17 - Milwaukee Journal
(09-13-2020 04:09 PM)quo vadis Wrote:  
(09-13-2020 02:00 PM)MWC Tex Wrote:  I’ll wait to believe it will actually happen. I’m sorry but there is political implications involved in that decision. No word on the PAC ?

The PAC is handcuffed by the liberal crazies who run California.

And Colorado, Oregon and Washington.
09-13-2020 05:33 PM
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RE: B1G to kickoff football October 17 - Milwaukee Journal

09-13-2020 05:46 PM
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RE: B1G to kickoff football October 17 - Milwaukee Journal
(09-13-2020 05:46 PM)stever20 Wrote:  

Not a good sign.
09-13-2020 05:52 PM
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JRsec Offline
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RE: B1G to kickoff football October 17 - Milwaukee Journal
Let's dispel some inaccurate information.
1. They probably don't need 9 votes. Why? The legal issue is they have no right to compel a state school operating as a non profit in a sovereign state to shut down football season. A GOR compels schools to play to honor a contractual obligation. A GOR cannot compel non performance, and more specifically a conference probably can't either. And that makes in a backhanded way the whole notion of a GOR for state schools questionable.

In the past there was no reason to challenge one. If a F.S.U. wanted to leave the ACC for the SEC or Big 10 in 2010 they might make 7 million more and the lawsuit, likely to make it to the Supreme Court, might cost 15 million. So there was no desire to challenge it because it cost too much.

Now you are talking about shutting Ohio State out of nearly 200 million by ordering them not to play. You had better believe that the Attorney General of Ohio would spend the 15 million to challenge that as would the AG of Nebraska for their 130 million. GOR's were mostly used for professional entertainers prior to the raids and their use in college football. They've never really been applied to state non profits where tax payers pick up the shortfalls in taxes.

So the Big 10 doesn't want to touch that issue with a 10 foot pole and will likely vote to cancel the season.........., but......., permit those schools who desire to play to do so, which is precisely the position they should have declared from the beginning instead of trying to force independent states into compliance because that was what Michigan and Minnesota wanted to do.

2. It's going to be damn difficult for Nebraska, Iowa and Ohio State to work out a schedule now. So even if the Big 10 permits them to play independently, they likely have already suffered significant losses due to the colossal screw up by the Commissioner and a few of the presidents.

3. If it goes to trial for damages the efficacy of GOR's and Conference mandates are going to come under direct assault anyway and by golly that may be the best thing that could happen for college sports because then all new associations would be by choice and not by history.
09-13-2020 06:19 PM
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RE: B1G to kickoff football October 17 - Milwaukee Journal
(09-13-2020 06:19 PM)JRsec Wrote:  Let's dispel some inaccurate information.
1. They probably don't need 9 votes. Why? The legal issue is they have no right to compel a state school operating as a non profit in a sovereign state to shut down football season. A GOR compels schools to play to honor a contractual obligation. A GOR cannot compel non performance, and more specifically a conference probably can't either. And that makes in a backhanded way the whole notion of a GOR for state schools questionable.

In the past there was no reason to challenge one. If a F.S.U. wanted to leave the ACC for the SEC or Big 10 in 2010 they might make 7 million more and the lawsuit, likely to make it to the Supreme Court, might cost 15 million. So there was no desire to challenge it because it cost too much.

Now you are talking about shutting Ohio State out of nearly 200 million by ordering them not to play. You had better believe that the Attorney General of Ohio would spend the 15 million to challenge that as would the AG of Nebraska for their 130 million. GOR's were mostly used for professional entertainers prior to the raids and their use in college football. They've never really been applied to state non profits where tax payers pick up the shortfalls in taxes.

So the Big 10 doesn't want to touch that issue with a 10 foot pole and will likely vote to cancel the season.........., but......., permit those schools who desire to play to do so, which is precisely the position they should have declared from the beginning instead of trying to force independent states into compliance because that was what Michigan and Minnesota wanted to do.

2. It's going to be damn difficult for Nebraska, Iowa and Ohio State to work out a schedule now. So even if the Big 10 permits them to play independently, they likely have already suffered significant losses due to the colossal screw up by the Commissioner and a few of the presidents.

3. If it goes to trial for damages the efficacy of GOR's and Conference mandates are going to come under direct assault anyway and by golly that may be the best thing that could happen for college sports because then all new associations would be by choice and not by history.

There are enough teams with holes in their schedules to fill them all up with at least 8 games.... at least my opinion. Look how fast the Houston Baylor deal was made.
09-13-2020 07:47 PM
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usffan Offline
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RE: B1G to kickoff football October 17 - Milwaukee Journal
(09-13-2020 05:52 PM)MWC Tex Wrote:  
(09-13-2020 05:46 PM)stever20 Wrote:  

Not a good sign.

Yep. Old saying - don't ask a question in a meeting you don't already know the answer to...

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09-13-2020 08:52 PM
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RE: B1G to kickoff football October 17 - Milwaukee Journal
(09-13-2020 06:19 PM)JRsec Wrote:  Let's dispel some inaccurate information.
1. They probably don't need 9 votes. Why? The legal issue is they have no right to compel a state school operating as a non profit in a sovereign state to shut down football season.

They aren't bound by the rules of the conference that shares revenue with them?
09-13-2020 08:54 PM
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RE: B1G to kickoff football October 17 - Milwaukee Journal
(09-13-2020 06:19 PM)JRsec Wrote:  Let's dispel some inaccurate information.
1. They probably don't need 9 votes. Why? The legal issue is they have no right to compel a state school operating as a non profit in a sovereign state to shut down football season. A GOR compels schools to play to honor a contractual obligation. A GOR cannot compel non performance, and more specifically a conference probably can't either. And that makes in a backhanded way the whole notion of a GOR for state schools questionable.

In the past there was no reason to challenge one. If a F.S.U. wanted to leave the ACC for the SEC or Big 10 in 2010 they might make 7 million more and the lawsuit, likely to make it to the Supreme Court, might cost 15 million. So there was no desire to challenge it because it cost too much.

Now you are talking about shutting Ohio State out of nearly 200 million by ordering them not to play. You had better believe that the Attorney General of Ohio would spend the 15 million to challenge that as would the AG of Nebraska for their 130 million. GOR's were mostly used for professional entertainers prior to the raids and their use in college football. They've never really been applied to state non profits where tax payers pick up the shortfalls in taxes.

So the Big 10 doesn't want to touch that issue with a 10 foot pole and will likely vote to cancel the season.........., but......., permit those schools who desire to play to do so, which is precisely the position they should have declared from the beginning instead of trying to force independent states into compliance because that was what Michigan and Minnesota wanted to do.

2. It's going to be damn difficult for Nebraska, Iowa and Ohio State to work out a schedule now. So even if the Big 10 permits them to play independently, they likely have already suffered significant losses due to the colossal screw up by the Commissioner and a few of the presidents.

3. If it goes to trial for damages the efficacy of GOR's and Conference mandates are going to come under direct assault anyway and by golly that may be the best thing that could happen for college sports because then all new associations would be by choice and not by history.

I'm not a lawyer, but each of the members in any conference is a member voluntarily, and at liberty to leave any time they wish per the rules of the conference that they willingly joined. Therefore, if any school such as Nebraska wishes to leave the conference, they are not "compelled" (your word) to remain a member of the conference, and could probably sue to avoid exit fees due to the reasons you've stated. But I do think the conference is within its rights to say "members of this conference are not allowed to compete this fall." Don't like the rules, don't stay in the conference.

(note, I think the B1G has acted foolishly, but I don't think your legal argument holds water)

[Image: giphy-9-6.gif?w=372]

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09-13-2020 09:00 PM
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RE: B1G to kickoff football October 17 - Milwaukee Journal
(09-13-2020 08:54 PM)EigenEagle Wrote:  
(09-13-2020 06:19 PM)JRsec Wrote:  Let's dispel some inaccurate information.
1. They probably don't need 9 votes. Why? The legal issue is they have no right to compel a state school operating as a non profit in a sovereign state to shut down football season.

They aren't bound by the rules of the conference that shares revenue with them?

Ohio State doesn't believe any rules apply to them. Just look at their wife beating ex-coach and all the lawsuits they've endured recently.
09-13-2020 09:00 PM
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RE: B1G to kickoff football October 17 - Milwaukee Journal
(09-13-2020 08:54 PM)EigenEagle Wrote:  
(09-13-2020 06:19 PM)JRsec Wrote:  Let's dispel some inaccurate information.
1. They probably don't need 9 votes. Why? The legal issue is they have no right to compel a state school operating as a non profit in a sovereign state to shut down football season.

They aren't bound by the rules of the conference that shares revenue with them?

In the history of college football no team has ever been compelled not to play. In WWII there were massive numbers of schools who opted not to play, but nobody forced them. So they are bound by the rules of the conference they joined inasmuch as those rules don't conflict with the state laws, or the right of that state's non profit to operate. The Big 10 enforced rules that weren't theirs to make.
09-13-2020 09:02 PM
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RE: B1G to kickoff football October 17 - Milwaukee Journal
(09-13-2020 09:00 PM)usffan Wrote:  
(09-13-2020 06:19 PM)JRsec Wrote:  Let's dispel some inaccurate information.
1. They probably don't need 9 votes. Why? The legal issue is they have no right to compel a state school operating as a non profit in a sovereign state to shut down football season. A GOR compels schools to play to honor a contractual obligation. A GOR cannot compel non performance, and more specifically a conference probably can't either. And that makes in a backhanded way the whole notion of a GOR for state schools questionable.

In the past there was no reason to challenge one. If a F.S.U. wanted to leave the ACC for the SEC or Big 10 in 2010 they might make 7 million more and the lawsuit, likely to make it to the Supreme Court, might cost 15 million. So there was no desire to challenge it because it cost too much.

Now you are talking about shutting Ohio State out of nearly 200 million by ordering them not to play. You had better believe that the Attorney General of Ohio would spend the 15 million to challenge that as would the AG of Nebraska for their 130 million. GOR's were mostly used for professional entertainers prior to the raids and their use in college football. They've never really been applied to state non profits where tax payers pick up the shortfalls in taxes.

So the Big 10 doesn't want to touch that issue with a 10 foot pole and will likely vote to cancel the season.........., but......., permit those schools who desire to play to do so, which is precisely the position they should have declared from the beginning instead of trying to force independent states into compliance because that was what Michigan and Minnesota wanted to do.

2. It's going to be damn difficult for Nebraska, Iowa and Ohio State to work out a schedule now. So even if the Big 10 permits them to play independently, they likely have already suffered significant losses due to the colossal screw up by the Commissioner and a few of the presidents.

3. If it goes to trial for damages the efficacy of GOR's and Conference mandates are going to come under direct assault anyway and by golly that may be the best thing that could happen for college sports because then all new associations would be by choice and not by history.

I'm not a lawyer, but each of the members in any conference is a member voluntarily, and at liberty to leave any time they wish per the rules of the conference that they willingly joined. Therefore, if any school such as Nebraska wishes to leave the conference, they are not "compelled" (your word) to remain a member of the conference, and could probably sue to avoid exit fees due to the reasons you've stated. But I do think the conference is within its rights to say "members of this conference are not allowed to compete this fall." Don't like the rules, don't stay in the conference.

(note, I think the B1G has acted foolishly, but I don't think your legal argument holds water)

[Image: giphy-9-6.gif?w=372]

USFFan

Show me the rule in the Big 10 bylaws that permits the conference to tell a school they shall not play? I won't hold my breath. The Conference can't circumvent state law, or the right of a school to fund its programs. So get some depends, they'll hold your water for you. BTW: The Attorney General of Nebraska knew this and the A.G. of Ohio was willing to join the suit. Take up your legal issues with them.

I see they all voted to play so that renders this moot. But, to your suggestion, they are not just free to leave. They are free to leave their full share of the BTN value they've bought into, and they are free to pay massive GOR damages for future seasons remaining on the contract, or they are free to lose what would be for Nebraska roughly 130 million in football revenue for the year, or for OSU closer to 200 million. That's not being free to leave. That's why the A.G.'s were willing to get involved because basically it's the taxpayer of the states that fund the losses and no football conference has the legal right to levy massive taxes on a state and therein has always resided the weakness of a GOR for non profit school from a sovereign state and the word sovereign is highly operative.

Also, having all Big 10 schools play keeps the GOR intact. I think the current one expires in 2023 or 4. It will be interesting to see what is done then. They backtracked on their initial decision because they didn't have the legal grounds to enforce it. What they have done tonight is yield to the Attorneys General. I think it was the only move they could make.
(This post was last modified: 09-13-2020 09:23 PM by JRsec.)
09-13-2020 09:05 PM
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