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Would you do an AAC like this for AQ?
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ken d Offline
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Post: #41
RE: Would you do an AAC like this for AQ?
How about if we scale this back to 12 teams for football and 8 for basketball?

West (FB only): Army, Navy, Air Force, Boise, BYU and San Diego St.
East (All sports): Cincy, Temple, Memphis, UCF, USF and Houston (+ VCU and Wichita for OS)

Potentially, Boise and SDSU could join BYU in the WCC to find a home for their Olympic sports (the WCC is already a 2 bid league with Gonzaga and St Mary's). Hopefully, Air Force could find a home in the Big Sky where they would be more competitive than they are now in the MWC. Army and Navy already have homes for their other sports.

With the service academies all in one division with 8 conference games a year, they have the flexibility to put together national schedules that suit their mission and status. And Navy gets to go to San Diego every other year to raise the flag for the Pacific Fleet (in the odd years they could visit Hawaii, getting a 13th game in the bargain).
09-08-2020 08:59 AM
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IWokeUpLikeThis Offline
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Post: #42
RE: Would you do an AAC like this for AQ?
(09-08-2020 07:33 AM)Michael in Raleigh Wrote:  My head might explode if App State wouldn't be included in a 24 team AAC. Clearly, ties with Georgia with the fifth most wins in all of FBS since 2015, Appalachian has been at the very least the best program among the MAC, C-USA, and the SB.

It's all moot, anyway. This is not happening.

NIU won 57 from 2010-14 with an Orange Bowl. App St won 54 since 2015.

Unless you develop a Boise-like brand winning multiple BCS bowls, it won't matter. Neither fits the institutional profile.
09-08-2020 09:03 AM
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BePcr07 Offline
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Post: #43
RE: Would you do an AAC like this for AQ?
(09-08-2020 08:59 AM)ken d Wrote:  How about if we scale this back to 12 teams for football and 8 for basketball?

West (FB only): Army, Navy, Air Force, Boise, BYU and San Diego St.
East (All sports): Cincy, Temple, Memphis, UCF, USF and Houston (+ VCU and Wichita for OS)

Potentially, Boise and SDSU could join BYU in the WCC to find a home for their Olympic sports (the WCC is already a 2 bid league with Gonzaga and St Mary's). Hopefully, Air Force could find a home in the Big Sky where they would be more competitive than they are now in the MWC. Army and Navy already have homes for their other sports.

With the service academies all in one division with 8 conference games a year, they have the flexibility to put together national schedules that suit their mission and status. And Navy gets to go to San Diego every other year to raise the flag for the Pacific Fleet (in the odd years they could visit Hawaii, getting a 13th game in the bargain).

What happens to East Carolina, SMU, Tulane, and Tulsa? Might as well go to 16 for football and with 12 for basketball.

West: Air Force*, Army*, Boise St*, BYU*, Navy*, San Diego St*, SMU, Tulsa
East: Central Florida, Cincinnati, East Carolina, Houston, Memphis, South Florida, Temple, Tulane
Non-football: VCU, Wichita St
09-08-2020 10:06 AM
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ken d Offline
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Post: #44
RE: Would you do an AAC like this for AQ?
(09-08-2020 10:06 AM)BePcr07 Wrote:  
(09-08-2020 08:59 AM)ken d Wrote:  How about if we scale this back to 12 teams for football and 8 for basketball?

West (FB only): Army, Navy, Air Force, Boise, BYU and San Diego St.
East (All sports): Cincy, Temple, Memphis, UCF, USF and Houston (+ VCU and Wichita for OS)

Potentially, Boise and SDSU could join BYU in the WCC to find a home for their Olympic sports (the WCC is already a 2 bid league with Gonzaga and St Mary's). Hopefully, Air Force could find a home in the Big Sky where they would be more competitive than they are now in the MWC. Army and Navy already have homes for their other sports.

With the service academies all in one division with 8 conference games a year, they have the flexibility to put together national schedules that suit their mission and status. And Navy gets to go to San Diego every other year to raise the flag for the Pacific Fleet (in the odd years they could visit Hawaii, getting a 13th game in the bargain).

What happens to East Carolina, SMU, Tulane, and Tulsa? Might as well go to 16 for football and with 12 for basketball.

West: Air Force*, Army*, Boise St*, BYU*, Navy*, San Diego St*, SMU, Tulsa
East: Central Florida, Cincinnati, East Carolina, Houston, Memphis, South Florida, Temple, Tulane
Non-football: VCU, Wichita St

It's all about the money - too many mouths to feed. The 12 schools would likely produce as much media revenue as the 16 would, giving them all a bigger share.

As for where the four who are left behind would go, most likely they would divide what would become an 18 team CUSA into two separate 9 team leagues. The MWC would also have 9 members left. None of these conferences (or the MAC or SBC) would come close to matching the new Best of the Rest conference in strength, average attendance or media attractiveness. They would for all practical purposes become like a separate subdivision of the FBS.
09-08-2020 10:36 AM
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ken d Offline
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Post: #45
RE: Would you do an AAC like this for AQ?
(09-08-2020 10:36 AM)ken d Wrote:  
(09-08-2020 10:06 AM)BePcr07 Wrote:  
(09-08-2020 08:59 AM)ken d Wrote:  How about if we scale this back to 12 teams for football and 8 for basketball?

West (FB only): Army, Navy, Air Force, Boise, BYU and San Diego St.
East (All sports): Cincy, Temple, Memphis, UCF, USF and Houston (+ VCU and Wichita for OS)

Potentially, Boise and SDSU could join BYU in the WCC to find a home for their Olympic sports (the WCC is already a 2 bid league with Gonzaga and St Mary's). Hopefully, Air Force could find a home in the Big Sky where they would be more competitive than they are now in the MWC. Army and Navy already have homes for their other sports.

With the service academies all in one division with 8 conference games a year, they have the flexibility to put together national schedules that suit their mission and status. And Navy gets to go to San Diego every other year to raise the flag for the Pacific Fleet (in the odd years they could visit Hawaii, getting a 13th game in the bargain).

What happens to East Carolina, SMU, Tulane, and Tulsa? Might as well go to 16 for football and with 12 for basketball.

West: Air Force*, Army*, Boise St*, BYU*, Navy*, San Diego St*, SMU, Tulsa
East: Central Florida, Cincinnati, East Carolina, Houston, Memphis, South Florida, Temple, Tulane
Non-football: VCU, Wichita St

It's all about the money - too many mouths to feed. The 12 schools would likely produce as much media revenue as the 16 would, giving them all a bigger share.

As for where the four who are left behind would go, most likely they would divide what would become an 18 team CUSA into two separate 9 team leagues. The MWC would also have 9 members left. None of these conferences (or the MAC or SBC) would come close to matching the new Best of the Rest conference in strength, average attendance or media attractiveness. They would for all practical purposes become like a separate subdivision of the FBS.

USA West: Louisiana Tech, Tulsa, SMU, Southern Miss, Tulane, North Texas, Rice, UTSA and UTEP

USA East: Marshall, Western Kentucky, East Carolina, Middle Tennessee, Fla Atlantic, UAB, Fla International, Old Dominion and Charlotte
09-08-2020 10:43 AM
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BraveKnight Offline
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Post: #46
RE: Would you do an AAC like this for AQ?
(09-08-2020 08:59 AM)ken d Wrote:  How about if we scale this back to 12 teams for football and 8 for basketball?

West (FB only): Army, Navy, Air Force, Boise, BYU and San Diego St.
East (All sports): Cincy, Temple, Memphis, UCF, USF and Houston (+ VCU and Wichita for OS)

Potentially, Boise and SDSU could join BYU in the WCC to find a home for their Olympic sports (the WCC is already a 2 bid league with Gonzaga and St Mary's). Hopefully, Air Force could find a home in the Big Sky where they would be more competitive than they are now in the MWC. Army and Navy already have homes for their other sports.

With the service academies all in one division with 8 conference games a year, they have the flexibility to put together national schedules that suit their mission and status. And Navy gets to go to San Diego every other year to raise the flag for the Pacific Fleet (in the odd years they could visit Hawaii, getting a 13th game in the bargain).
Keep SMU and Tulane and go to 14. Otherwise I really like this idea.
09-08-2020 03:16 PM
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Nerdlinger Offline
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Post: #47
RE: Would you do an AAC like this for AQ?
(09-08-2020 03:16 PM)BraveKnight Wrote:  
(09-08-2020 08:59 AM)ken d Wrote:  How about if we scale this back to 12 teams for football and 8 for basketball?

West (FB only): Army, Navy, Air Force, Boise, BYU and San Diego St.
East (All sports): Cincy, Temple, Memphis, UCF, USF and Houston (+ VCU and Wichita for OS)

Potentially, Boise and SDSU could join BYU in the WCC to find a home for their Olympic sports (the WCC is already a 2 bid league with Gonzaga and St Mary's). Hopefully, Air Force could find a home in the Big Sky where they would be more competitive than they are now in the MWC. Army and Navy already have homes for their other sports.

With the service academies all in one division with 8 conference games a year, they have the flexibility to put together national schedules that suit their mission and status. And Navy gets to go to San Diego every other year to raise the flag for the Pacific Fleet (in the odd years they could visit Hawaii, getting a 13th game in the bargain).
Keep SMU and Tulane and go to 14. Otherwise I really like this idea.

Yes, you'd need two more full FB-playing members to meet the current NCAA minimum for FBS conferences (if that still matters in this scenario). SMU and Tulane are better keeps than ECU and Tulsa. I might trade Tulane for App State, but I know that's not what a university president would do.
09-08-2020 05:40 PM
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Erictelevision Offline
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Post: #48
RE: Would you do an AAC like this for AQ?
Add Memphis and USM to the East and find CUSA or SBC teams to upgrade.
09-08-2020 06:37 PM
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ken d Offline
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Post: #49
RE: Would you do an AAC like this for AQ?
(09-08-2020 05:40 PM)Nerdlinger Wrote:  
(09-08-2020 03:16 PM)BraveKnight Wrote:  
(09-08-2020 08:59 AM)ken d Wrote:  How about if we scale this back to 12 teams for football and 8 for basketball?

West (FB only): Army, Navy, Air Force, Boise, BYU and San Diego St.
East (All sports): Cincy, Temple, Memphis, UCF, USF and Houston (+ VCU and Wichita for OS)

Potentially, Boise and SDSU could join BYU in the WCC to find a home for their Olympic sports (the WCC is already a 2 bid league with Gonzaga and St Mary's). Hopefully, Air Force could find a home in the Big Sky where they would be more competitive than they are now in the MWC. Army and Navy already have homes for their other sports.

With the service academies all in one division with 8 conference games a year, they have the flexibility to put together national schedules that suit their mission and status. And Navy gets to go to San Diego every other year to raise the flag for the Pacific Fleet (in the odd years they could visit Hawaii, getting a 13th game in the bargain).
Keep SMU and Tulane and go to 14. Otherwise I really like this idea.

Yes, you'd need two more full FB-playing members to meet the current NCAA minimum for FBS conferences (if that still matters in this scenario). SMU and Tulane are better keeps than ECU and Tulsa. I might trade Tulane for App State, but I know that's not what a university president would do.

I believe it would also have the benefit of making this actually possible. That is, it provides enough members to vote to dissolve the AAC so the defectors don't have to pay exit fees. FWIW, this 14 team conference would have had a higher Sagarin rating than the ACC in 2019.
09-08-2020 06:44 PM
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Michael in Raleigh Offline
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Post: #50
RE: Would you do an AAC like this for AQ?
(09-08-2020 09:03 AM)IWokeUpLikeThis Wrote:  
(09-08-2020 07:33 AM)Michael in Raleigh Wrote:  My head might explode if App State wouldn't be included in a 24 team AAC. Clearly, ties with Georgia with the fifth most wins in all of FBS since 2015, Appalachian has been at the very least the best program among the MAC, C-USA, and the SB.

It's all moot, anyway. This is not happening.

NIU won 57 from 2010-14 with an Orange Bowl. App St won 54 since 2015.

Unless you develop a Boise-like brand winning multiple BCS bowls, it won't matter.
Neither fits the institutional profile.

App is definitely not there yet, and I know no one who says they are, but the early returns are promising. Since the 1978 1-A/1-AA divide, only Marshall had more success in its first six seasons moving to FBS from the lower subdivision. (Boise's rate of winning accelerated after those first six years, when they beat Oklahoma and so on.)

The goal is most definitely to be the east coast version of Boise State.

Since 2015, App State has gone 54-12.

- Three of the 12 losses were in overtime to Tennessee in '16, UMass in '17 (by far the worst loss in past five years), and Penn State in '18.

- Another loss was by one point on a missed field goal to Wake Forest in '17.

- Troy in '16, ULM in '17, and Ga. Southern in '19 were all by a touchdown or less.

- Only five losses in the last five years were by more than a touchdown: '15 national runner up Clemson, Ark. State in '15, Miami (FL) in '16, '17 national runner up Georgia, and Georgia Southern in '18.

Obviously, App State still has a lot to prove to get into Boise State's ratified air, especially with yet another new head coach, but to not even be considered for a 24 team AAC? Yeesh.

EDIT: App State also missed out on a chance for a 55th win in the past five years, and a 12th win for the 2018 season, when the Southern Miss game was canceled due to a hurricane. App State offered to play their "home" game in Hattiesburg and Chattanooga, but USM declined, citing the contract which stated the game had to be played in Boone.
(This post was last modified: 09-08-2020 06:55 PM by Michael in Raleigh.)
09-08-2020 06:51 PM
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Nerdlinger Offline
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Post: #51
RE: Would you do an AAC like this for AQ?
(09-08-2020 06:44 PM)ken d Wrote:  
(09-08-2020 05:40 PM)Nerdlinger Wrote:  
(09-08-2020 03:16 PM)BraveKnight Wrote:  
(09-08-2020 08:59 AM)ken d Wrote:  How about if we scale this back to 12 teams for football and 8 for basketball?

West (FB only): Army, Navy, Air Force, Boise, BYU and San Diego St.
East (All sports): Cincy, Temple, Memphis, UCF, USF and Houston (+ VCU and Wichita for OS)

Potentially, Boise and SDSU could join BYU in the WCC to find a home for their Olympic sports (the WCC is already a 2 bid league with Gonzaga and St Mary's). Hopefully, Air Force could find a home in the Big Sky where they would be more competitive than they are now in the MWC. Army and Navy already have homes for their other sports.

With the service academies all in one division with 8 conference games a year, they have the flexibility to put together national schedules that suit their mission and status. And Navy gets to go to San Diego every other year to raise the flag for the Pacific Fleet (in the odd years they could visit Hawaii, getting a 13th game in the bargain).
Keep SMU and Tulane and go to 14. Otherwise I really like this idea.

Yes, you'd need two more full FB-playing members to meet the current NCAA minimum for FBS conferences (if that still matters in this scenario). SMU and Tulane are better keeps than ECU and Tulsa. I might trade Tulane for App State, but I know that's not what a university president would do.

I believe it would also have the benefit of making this actually possible. That is, it provides enough members to vote to dissolve the AAC so the defectors don't have to pay exit fees. FWIW, this 14 team conference would have had a higher Sagarin rating than the ACC in 2019.

That's a plus.

So a MWC without AFA, Boise, and SDSU would be down to the minimum 8 full FB-playing members, plus FB-only Hawaii. I wonder if UTEP or NMSU get a look at that point.
09-08-2020 07:06 PM
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goofus Offline
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Post: #52
RE: Would you do an AAC like this for AQ?
How about this?

AAC East-6
UCF, USF, Cincy, Memphis, Hou, SMU

AAC West-6
BYU, Boise, SDSU, Col. St, UNLV, New Mex
09-08-2020 08:12 PM
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bullet Offline
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Post: #53
RE: Would you do an AAC like this for AQ?
(09-08-2020 09:03 AM)IWokeUpLikeThis Wrote:  
(09-08-2020 07:33 AM)Michael in Raleigh Wrote:  My head might explode if App State wouldn't be included in a 24 team AAC. Clearly, ties with Georgia with the fifth most wins in all of FBS since 2015, Appalachian has been at the very least the best program among the MAC, C-USA, and the SB.

It's all moot, anyway. This is not happening.

NIU won 57 from 2010-14 with an Orange Bowl. App St won 54 since 2015.

Unless you develop a Boise-like brand winning multiple BCS bowls, it won't matter. Neither fits the institutional profile.

App St. has zero chance of the AAC in the next 10-15 years. Never say never, but its unlikely at any point. They don't fit the profile and they only have been FBS for a handful of years.
09-08-2020 08:39 PM
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bill dazzle Offline
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Post: #54
RE: Would you do an AAC like this for AQ?
(09-08-2020 08:39 PM)bullet Wrote:  
(09-08-2020 09:03 AM)IWokeUpLikeThis Wrote:  
(09-08-2020 07:33 AM)Michael in Raleigh Wrote:  My head might explode if App State wouldn't be included in a 24 team AAC. Clearly, ties with Georgia with the fifth most wins in all of FBS since 2015, Appalachian has been at the very least the best program among the MAC, C-USA, and the SB.

It's all moot, anyway. This is not happening.

NIU won 57 from 2010-14 with an Orange Bowl. App St won 54 since 2015.

Unless you develop a Boise-like brand winning multiple BCS bowls, it won't matter. Neither fits the institutional profile.

App St. has zero chance of the AAC in the next 10-15 years. Never say never, but its unlikely at any point. They don't fit the profile and they only have been FBS for a handful of years.


Though you are likely correct, Bullet, I would be pleased as a fan of two AAC programs (and I've noted this before) with the addition of AppState for football only and VCU with all sports but football.
09-08-2020 08:44 PM
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Fighting Muskie Offline
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Post: #55
RE: Would you do an AAC like this for AQ?
3 or 5 of the best programs in the Mountain/Pacific time zones. That’s your P6 conference.

(Alternatively 4 Western schools plus Army)
09-08-2020 08:52 PM
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Michael in Raleigh Offline
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Post: #56
RE: Would you do an AAC like this for AQ?
(09-08-2020 08:39 PM)bullet Wrote:  
(09-08-2020 09:03 AM)IWokeUpLikeThis Wrote:  
(09-08-2020 07:33 AM)Michael in Raleigh Wrote:  My head might explode if App State wouldn't be included in a 24 team AAC. Clearly, ties with Georgia with the fifth most wins in all of FBS since 2015, Appalachian has been at the very least the best program among the MAC, C-USA, and the SB.

It's all moot, anyway. This is not happening.

NIU won 57 from 2010-14 with an Orange Bowl. App St won 54 since 2015.

Unless you develop a Boise-like brand winning multiple BCS bowls, it won't matter. Neither fits the institutional profile.

App St. has zero chance of the AAC in the next 10-15 years. Never say never, but its unlikely at any point. They don't fit the profile and they only have been FBS for a handful of years.

The goal is to be the Boise State of the east.

App State is not there as of right now. They have to not slip up against a Georgia Southern or let a Penn State get away in overtime, and then get to the NY6 a few times and win. But they're the closest thing this side of the Mississippi River has to a Boise State-like football program. (I don't include AAC schools as being similar to Boise. Boise and App State are former FCS/1-AA schools who stepped up big in FBS. UCF was 1-AA, but they are the largest school in the country, and in the state of Florida. Memphis, Houston, Cincinnati, Navy, ECU, SMU, etc., have been playing at the FBS level for many many decades.)

As for not matching the academic profile, App State could at worst be like Boise State there, too. Boise State doesn't exactly fit the profile of the Mountain West. New Mexico, Wyoming, Hawaii, and Nevada are flagships. Colorado State and Utah State are their states' land grant institutions. The Air Force Academy is all around elite. How does Boise fit in with them? Great (for the G5) football.

App State, like Boise State, would have to have a football program too outstanding to ignore in order to get into the AAC, just as Boise did with the MWC or attempted Big East football only. I fully recognize that. Even though App has averaged just shy of 11 wins the last five years, winning will have to not only maintain, but accelerate. Remember: Boise wasn't offered membership in the MWC until several years after their famous win over Oklahoma. And by the way, I think I'm doing a disservice to App State comparing any academic concerns AAC presidents may have to Boise State.

I agree with Bill Dazzle: the most realistic goal would be football only for the AAC. And as I have said before, I do not expect App to get in ahead of others, including the addition of nobody, unless App State wins at the clip Boise was from the mid 2000's to early 2010's.
09-08-2020 09:21 PM
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UTEPDallas Offline
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Post: #57
RE: Would you do an AAC like this for AQ?
(09-08-2020 09:21 PM)Michael in Raleigh Wrote:  
(09-08-2020 08:39 PM)bullet Wrote:  
(09-08-2020 09:03 AM)IWokeUpLikeThis Wrote:  
(09-08-2020 07:33 AM)Michael in Raleigh Wrote:  My head might explode if App State wouldn't be included in a 24 team AAC. Clearly, ties with Georgia with the fifth most wins in all of FBS since 2015, Appalachian has been at the very least the best program among the MAC, C-USA, and the SB.

It's all moot, anyway. This is not happening.

NIU won 57 from 2010-14 with an Orange Bowl. App St won 54 since 2015.

Unless you develop a Boise-like brand winning multiple BCS bowls, it won't matter. Neither fits the institutional profile.

App St. has zero chance of the AAC in the next 10-15 years. Never say never, but its unlikely at any point. They don't fit the profile and they only have been FBS for a handful of years.

The goal is to be the Boise State of the east.

App State is not there as of right now. They have to not slip up against a Georgia Southern or let a Penn State get away in overtime, and then get to the NY6 a few times and win. But they're the closest thing this side of the Mississippi River has to a Boise State-like football program. (I don't include AAC schools as being similar to Boise. Boise and App State are former FCS/1-AA schools who stepped up big in FBS. UCF was 1-AA, but they are the largest school in the country, and in the state of Florida. Memphis, Houston, Cincinnati, Navy, ECU, SMU, etc., have been playing at the FBS level for many many decades.)

As for not matching the academic profile, App State could at worst be like Boise State there, too. Boise State doesn't exactly fit the profile of the Mountain West. New Mexico, Wyoming, Hawaii, and Nevada are flagships. Colorado State and Utah State are their states' land grant institutions. The Air Force Academy is all around elite. How does Boise fit in with them? Great (for the G5) football.

App State, like Boise State, would have to have a football program too outstanding to ignore in order to get into the AAC, just as Boise did with the MWC or attempted Big East football only. I fully recognize that. Even though App has averaged just shy of 11 wins the last five years, winning will have to not only maintain, but accelerate. Remember: Boise wasn't offered membership in the MWC until several years after their famous win over Oklahoma. And by the way, I think I'm doing a disservice to App State comparing any academic concerns AAC presidents may have to Boise State.

I agree with Bill Dazzle: the most realistic goal would be football only for the AAC. And as I have said before, I do not expect App to get in ahead of others, including the addition of nobody, unless App State wins at the clip Boise was from the mid 2000's to early 2010's.

Trust me when I type this. The MWC didn't want Boise State. They had no choice because it was eminent Utah was getting a Pac-10 invite and Boise helped with the BCS numbers. The reason why the Big East invited Boise State is because the Broncos helped with BCS numbers. The Big East needed all the help they could find once West Virginia, Pitt and Syracuse announced they were leaving for the Big XII and ACC respectively. Another school the MWC didn't want is Fresno State. Back in June 2010, only Boise State got invited, leaving the WAC with 8 members and the possibility of asking Montana and Montana State if they were interested. It later settled for Texas State and UTSA. Fresno State got invited because of the failed "Project", BYU leaving, TCU looking at other options like the Big East...... otherwise, the MWC wouldn't have bothered with the Bulldogs or any other WAC school they had to invite thereafter.

In order for App State to get the same breaks Boise got, something really bad has to happen to the ACC (unlikely) to the point where they need to raid the AAC and invite other programs like App State and Buffalo that can help them in trying to retain some respect or relevance. Academics don't really matter that much when a conference is in panic mode and thinks it could be further raided after losing one school. Just look at Louisville and the ACC. Boise State to the MWC and Big East is another example.
(This post was last modified: 09-08-2020 09:47 PM by UTEPDallas.)
09-08-2020 09:38 PM
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MidknightWhiskey Offline
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Post: #58
RE: Would you do an AAC like this for AQ?
(09-08-2020 08:12 PM)goofus Wrote:  How about this?

AAC East-6
UCF, USF, Cincy, Memphis, Hou, SMU

AAC West-6
BYU, Boise, SDSU, Col. St, UNLV, New Mex

CSU, UNLV & New Mexico have less to offer than the teams they'd be replacing. I'm wondering how long we can continue to beat this dead horse topic. BYU, Boise & SDSU are the only ones that will get enough votes. But I think everyone is going to stay pat until were closer to the CFP contract and next wave of realignment. If the top 2-4 teams get invited to an autonomous conference then it'll be CUSA & Sunbelt teams that will backfill.
09-08-2020 10:53 PM
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bill dazzle Offline
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Post: #59
RE: Would you do an AAC like this for AQ?
(09-08-2020 09:21 PM)Michael in Raleigh Wrote:  
(09-08-2020 08:39 PM)bullet Wrote:  
(09-08-2020 09:03 AM)IWokeUpLikeThis Wrote:  
(09-08-2020 07:33 AM)Michael in Raleigh Wrote:  My head might explode if App State wouldn't be included in a 24 team AAC. Clearly, ties with Georgia with the fifth most wins in all of FBS since 2015, Appalachian has been at the very least the best program among the MAC, C-USA, and the SB.

It's all moot, anyway. This is not happening.

NIU won 57 from 2010-14 with an Orange Bowl. App St won 54 since 2015.

Unless you develop a Boise-like brand winning multiple BCS bowls, it won't matter. Neither fits the institutional profile.

App St. has zero chance of the AAC in the next 10-15 years. Never say never, but its unlikely at any point. They don't fit the profile and they only have been FBS for a handful of years.

The goal is to be the Boise State of the east.

App State is not there as of right now. They have to not slip up against a Georgia Southern or let a Penn State get away in overtime, and then get to the NY6 a few times and win. But they're the closest thing this side of the Mississippi River has to a Boise State-like football program. (I don't include AAC schools as being similar to Boise. Boise and App State are former FCS/1-AA schools who stepped up big in FBS. UCF was 1-AA, but they are the largest school in the country, and in the state of Florida. Memphis, Houston, Cincinnati, Navy, ECU, SMU, etc., have been playing at the FBS level for many many decades.)

As for not matching the academic profile, App State could at worst be like Boise State there, too. Boise State doesn't exactly fit the profile of the Mountain West. New Mexico, Wyoming, Hawaii, and Nevada are flagships. Colorado State and Utah State are their states' land grant institutions. The Air Force Academy is all around elite. How does Boise fit in with them? Great (for the G5) football.

App State, like Boise State, would have to have a football program too outstanding to ignore in order to get into the AAC, just as Boise did with the MWC or attempted Big East football only. I fully recognize that. Even though App has averaged just shy of 11 wins the last five years, winning will have to not only maintain, but accelerate. Remember: Boise wasn't offered membership in the MWC until several years after their famous win over Oklahoma. And by the way, I think I'm doing a disservice to App State comparing any academic concerns AAC presidents may have to Boise State.

I agree with Bill Dazzle: the most realistic goal would be football only for the AAC. And as I have said before, I do not expect App to get in ahead of others, including the addition of nobody, unless App State wins at the clip Boise was from the mid 2000's to early 2010's.


In many respects, I already consider Appalachian State the "Boise State of the East," MinR.

There are various parallels involving the two football programs, both of which I highly respect and consider "major programs" — not on the same level as, say, Clemson or even Virginia Tech, of course, but clearly within the next tier down and able to beat just about any team in the nation in given year.

AppState would immediately be competitive in the American and is very deserving of an invite to the AAC for football only.
09-09-2020 08:28 AM
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BePcr07 Offline
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Post: #60
RE: Would you do an AAC like this for AQ?
(09-09-2020 08:28 AM)bill dazzle Wrote:  
(09-08-2020 09:21 PM)Michael in Raleigh Wrote:  
(09-08-2020 08:39 PM)bullet Wrote:  
(09-08-2020 09:03 AM)IWokeUpLikeThis Wrote:  
(09-08-2020 07:33 AM)Michael in Raleigh Wrote:  My head might explode if App State wouldn't be included in a 24 team AAC. Clearly, ties with Georgia with the fifth most wins in all of FBS since 2015, Appalachian has been at the very least the best program among the MAC, C-USA, and the SB.

It's all moot, anyway. This is not happening.

NIU won 57 from 2010-14 with an Orange Bowl. App St won 54 since 2015.

Unless you develop a Boise-like brand winning multiple BCS bowls, it won't matter. Neither fits the institutional profile.

App St. has zero chance of the AAC in the next 10-15 years. Never say never, but its unlikely at any point. They don't fit the profile and they only have been FBS for a handful of years.

The goal is to be the Boise State of the east.

App State is not there as of right now. They have to not slip up against a Georgia Southern or let a Penn State get away in overtime, and then get to the NY6 a few times and win. But they're the closest thing this side of the Mississippi River has to a Boise State-like football program. (I don't include AAC schools as being similar to Boise. Boise and App State are former FCS/1-AA schools who stepped up big in FBS. UCF was 1-AA, but they are the largest school in the country, and in the state of Florida. Memphis, Houston, Cincinnati, Navy, ECU, SMU, etc., have been playing at the FBS level for many many decades.)

As for not matching the academic profile, App State could at worst be like Boise State there, too. Boise State doesn't exactly fit the profile of the Mountain West. New Mexico, Wyoming, Hawaii, and Nevada are flagships. Colorado State and Utah State are their states' land grant institutions. The Air Force Academy is all around elite. How does Boise fit in with them? Great (for the G5) football.

App State, like Boise State, would have to have a football program too outstanding to ignore in order to get into the AAC, just as Boise did with the MWC or attempted Big East football only. I fully recognize that. Even though App has averaged just shy of 11 wins the last five years, winning will have to not only maintain, but accelerate. Remember: Boise wasn't offered membership in the MWC until several years after their famous win over Oklahoma. And by the way, I think I'm doing a disservice to App State comparing any academic concerns AAC presidents may have to Boise State.

I agree with Bill Dazzle: the most realistic goal would be football only for the AAC. And as I have said before, I do not expect App to get in ahead of others, including the addition of nobody, unless App State wins at the clip Boise was from the mid 2000's to early 2010's.


In many respects, I already consider Appalachian State the "Boise State of the East," MinR.

There are various parallels involving the two football programs, both of which I highly respect and consider "major programs" — not on the same level as, say, Clemson or even Virginia Tech, of course, but clearly within the next tier down and able to beat just about any team in the nation in given year.

AppState would immediately be competitive in the American and is very deserving of an invite to the AAC for football only.

Appalachian St has the benefit of geography over Boise St which is huge. Put Boise St in, say, Louisiana and they’re in the XII a decade ago. There is no real power conference option for Boise St at this time and the American is a geographically bad idea for both the conference and school.
09-09-2020 08:44 AM
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