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Mandel's Mailbag: P5 expansion draft
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10thMountain Offline
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Post: #61
RE: Mandel's Mailbag: P5 expansion draft
(Yesterday 11:58 AM)ken d Wrote:  
(Yesterday 11:41 AM)THUNDERStruck73 Wrote:  
(Yesterday 10:59 AM)10thMountain Wrote:  Also throw in the fact that the SEC doesn’t do public city schools...

The University of Kentucky, the University of Tennessee, the University of South Carolina, and LSU say, “Hold my beer.”

Is that an inside joke? I don't get it.

I think he’s trying to somehow say that being located in places like Lexington and Knoxville makes those institutions urban commuter schools

03-lmfao
Yesterday 12:50 PM
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THUNDERStruck73 Offline
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Post: #62
RE: Mandel's Mailbag: P5 expansion draft
(Yesterday 11:58 AM)ken d Wrote:  
(Yesterday 11:41 AM)THUNDERStruck73 Wrote:  
(Yesterday 10:59 AM)10thMountain Wrote:  Also throw in the fact that the SEC doesn’t do public city schools...

The University of Kentucky, the University of Tennessee, the University of South Carolina, and LSU say, “Hold my beer.”

Is that an inside joke? I don't get it.

UK, UT, USC, and LSU are SEC public and in Cities.

However now that I re-read it, I suppose he meant that the SEC doesn’t do public schools named for the city in which they are located. Lol.
Yesterday 12:55 PM
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schmolik Online
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Post: #63
RE: Mandel's Mailbag: P5 expansion draft
(Yesterday 12:55 PM)THUNDERStruck73 Wrote:  
(Yesterday 11:58 AM)ken d Wrote:  
(Yesterday 11:41 AM)THUNDERStruck73 Wrote:  
(Yesterday 10:59 AM)10thMountain Wrote:  Also throw in the fact that the SEC doesn’t do public city schools...

The University of Kentucky, the University of Tennessee, the University of South Carolina, and LSU say, “Hold my beer.”

Is that an inside joke? I don't get it.

UK, UT, USC, and LSU are SEC public and in Cities.

However now that I re-read it, I suppose he meant that the SEC doesn’t do public schools named for the city in which they are located. Lol.

Oh you mean like Auburn?
Yesterday 01:28 PM
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schmolik Online
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Post: #64
RE: Mandel's Mailbag: P5 expansion draft
(Yesterday 12:55 PM)THUNDERStruck73 Wrote:  
(Yesterday 11:58 AM)ken d Wrote:  
(Yesterday 11:41 AM)THUNDERStruck73 Wrote:  
(Yesterday 10:59 AM)10thMountain Wrote:  Also throw in the fact that the SEC doesn’t do public city schools...

The University of Kentucky, the University of Tennessee, the University of South Carolina, and LSU say, “Hold my beer.”

Is that an inside joke? I don't get it.

UK, UT, USC, and LSU are SEC public and in Cities.

However now that I re-read it, I suppose he meant that the SEC doesn’t do public schools named for the city in which they are located. Lol.

Every SEC public school is in a city. Even Oxford and Starkville are cities. They're not as populous as Lexington or Knoxville but they're still cities.
Yesterday 01:32 PM
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THUNDERStruck73 Offline
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Post: #65
RE: Mandel's Mailbag: P5 expansion draft
(Yesterday 01:32 PM)schmolik Wrote:  
(Yesterday 12:55 PM)THUNDERStruck73 Wrote:  
(Yesterday 11:58 AM)ken d Wrote:  
(Yesterday 11:41 AM)THUNDERStruck73 Wrote:  
(Yesterday 10:59 AM)10thMountain Wrote:  Also throw in the fact that the SEC doesn’t do public city schools...

The University of Kentucky, the University of Tennessee, the University of South Carolina, and LSU say, “Hold my beer.”

Is that an inside joke? I don't get it.

UK, UT, USC, and LSU are SEC public and in Cities.

However now that I re-read it, I suppose he meant that the SEC doesn’t do public schools named for the city in which they are located. Lol.

Every SEC public school is in a city. Even Oxford and Starkville are cities. They're not as populous as Lexington or Knoxville but they're still cities.

Right, but I think he meant schools like Houston, Cincinnati, Memphis, Charlotte which are named after the city they are in. Your example of Auburn discounts his theory.
Yesterday 01:43 PM
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bullet Offline
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Post: #66
RE: Mandel's Mailbag: P5 expansion draft
(Yesterday 01:43 PM)THUNDERStruck73 Wrote:  
(Yesterday 01:32 PM)schmolik Wrote:  
(Yesterday 12:55 PM)THUNDERStruck73 Wrote:  
(Yesterday 11:58 AM)ken d Wrote:  
(Yesterday 11:41 AM)THUNDERStruck73 Wrote:  The University of Kentucky, the University of Tennessee, the University of South Carolina, and LSU say, “Hold my beer.”

Is that an inside joke? I don't get it.

UK, UT, USC, and LSU are SEC public and in Cities.

However now that I re-read it, I suppose he meant that the SEC doesn’t do public schools named for the city in which they are located. Lol.

Every SEC public school is in a city. Even Oxford and Starkville are cities. They're not as populous as Lexington or Knoxville but they're still cities.

Right, but I think he meant schools like Houston, Cincinnati, Memphis, Charlotte which are named after the city they are in. Your example of Auburn discounts his theory.

No. You just don't get the concept of regional commuter schools. The SEC schools draw from throughout their states and none of them are anything like a commuter school. Houston, Memphis, Charlotte and Cincinnati all draw from their region of the state and have big commuter components. All were at one time overwhelming commuter schools.
Yesterday 01:47 PM
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THUNDERStruck73 Offline
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Post: #67
RE: Mandel's Mailbag: P5 expansion draft
(Yesterday 01:47 PM)bullet Wrote:  
(Yesterday 01:43 PM)THUNDERStruck73 Wrote:  
(Yesterday 01:32 PM)schmolik Wrote:  
(Yesterday 12:55 PM)THUNDERStruck73 Wrote:  
(Yesterday 11:58 AM)ken d Wrote:  Is that an inside joke? I don't get it.

UK, UT, USC, and LSU are SEC public and in Cities.

However now that I re-read it, I suppose he meant that the SEC doesn’t do public schools named for the city in which they are located. Lol.

Every SEC public school is in a city. Even Oxford and Starkville are cities. They're not as populous as Lexington or Knoxville but they're still cities.

Right, but I think he meant schools like Houston, Cincinnati, Memphis, Charlotte which are named after the city they are in. Your example of Auburn discounts his theory.

No. You just don't get the concept of regional commuter schools. The SEC schools draw from throughout their states and none of them are anything like a commuter school. Houston, Memphis, Charlotte and Cincinnati all draw from their region of the state and have big commuter components. All were at one time overwhelming commuter schools.

Dear God, I know perfectly what they are. Mountain 10 said the SEC doesn’t do public city schools. I then said UK, UT, LSU, and USC are in populous cities, but then I corrected myself when I realized that he meant they do not take schools named after the cities that they are in (the exception being Auburn).
Yesterday 04:22 PM
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bill dazzle Offline
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Post: #68
RE: Mandel's Mailbag: P5 expansion draft
(Yesterday 01:47 PM)bullet Wrote:  
(Yesterday 01:43 PM)THUNDERStruck73 Wrote:  
(Yesterday 01:32 PM)schmolik Wrote:  
(Yesterday 12:55 PM)THUNDERStruck73 Wrote:  
(Yesterday 11:58 AM)ken d Wrote:  Is that an inside joke? I don't get it.

UK, UT, USC, and LSU are SEC public and in Cities.

However now that I re-read it, I suppose he meant that the SEC doesn’t do public schools named for the city in which they are located. Lol.

Every SEC public school is in a city. Even Oxford and Starkville are cities. They're not as populous as Lexington or Knoxville but they're still cities.

Right, but I think he meant schools like Houston, Cincinnati, Memphis, Charlotte which are named after the city they are in. Your example of Auburn discounts his theory.

No. You just don't get the concept of regional commuter schools. The SEC schools draw from throughout their states and none of them are anything like a commuter school. Houston, Memphis, Charlotte and Cincinnati all draw from their region of the state and have big commuter components. All were at one time overwhelming commuter schools.

This is 100 percent correct.
Yesterday 04:32 PM
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Statefan Offline
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Post: #69
RE: Mandel's Mailbag: P5 expansion draft
(08-01-2020 09:42 PM)BraveKnight Wrote:  
(08-01-2020 04:38 PM)THUNDERStruck73 Wrote:  
(07-31-2020 05:38 PM)BraveKnight Wrote:  
(07-31-2020 11:50 AM)YNot Wrote:  The somewhat more realistic expansion draft idea would be the formation of a new best-of-the-rest conference from the non-P5 candidates. It's a draft in the sense that you're pulling teams away from their existing situations, but it would have only a single drafter.

It would likely involve the best of the AAC, MWC and the independents.

Even though more realistic, it didn't ultimately come to fruition in the 2011-2012 realignment and it didn't happen in the last year when the AAC, MWC, and BYU were all negotiating new media deals...so, it will likely never happen. The 2025 realignment could present another opportunity. Or, a P5 break away could allow a limited set of callups to come along.

It would be interesting to see how the list might differ today from those schools that were part of and invited to the Big East and then the AAC, in the 2011-2013 realignment timeframe. I believe this is the order:

UConn, Cincinnati, USF
Temple, Houston, SMU, Memphis, UCF
BYU, Navy, Air Force, Boise State, San Diego State
ECU, Tulane, Tulsa
[also rumored that Fresno State and UNLV were approached]


My take is that Army would now be on the list somewhere and UConn's value would fall - although they would still be on the short list for consideration.

Any other MWC, CUSA, MAC, Sun Belt or independent schools that would get an invite ahead of anyone on the above list?
Tulsa and ECU would likely be left out.

Tulsa’s academics and endowment would surely keep them in, no?
Not sure if that was a joke, but I’m gonna assume it wasn’t lol. Tulsa has no fanbase, small market, no growth potential, tiny enrollment, poor on the field results, etc. They wouldn’t be included.

The real problem with Tulane is that they have de-emphasized football twice already. Even if you like them, and like NO the ABILITY to make that decision says something about the nature of the institution. LSU, PSU, Ohio State, Clemson, or VT are as likely to end their Graduate School as to drop football. (Hyperbole)

Duke plays football because the ACC refused to allow them to drop football and play all other sports - but Duke has not put its heart into football since 1961.
Yesterday 04:51 PM
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Statefan Offline
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Post: #70
RE: Mandel's Mailbag: P5 expansion draft
(Yesterday 01:32 PM)schmolik Wrote:  
(Yesterday 12:55 PM)THUNDERStruck73 Wrote:  
(Yesterday 11:58 AM)ken d Wrote:  
(Yesterday 11:41 AM)THUNDERStruck73 Wrote:  
(Yesterday 10:59 AM)10thMountain Wrote:  Also throw in the fact that the SEC doesn’t do public city schools...

The University of Kentucky, the University of Tennessee, the University of South Carolina, and LSU say, “Hold my beer.”

Is that an inside joke? I don't get it.

UK, UT, USC, and LSU are SEC public and in Cities.

However now that I re-read it, I suppose he meant that the SEC doesn’t do public schools named for the city in which they are located. Lol.

Every SEC public school is in a city. Even Oxford and Starkville are cities. They're not as populous as Lexington or Knoxville but they're still cities.

Some schools are in towns.

Chapel Hill is not a "City" as most understand the broad definition of City. Blacksburg is not a City, nor is Clemson, nor is Charlottesville.

Raleigh, Durham, Syracuse, Pittsburgh, Tallahassee, etc. are cities. Now unless Starkville and Oxford have grown, they are still "towns".

I used to teach urban studies at VT. The way most people understand a city to be, I find that you are not a city unless you have:

1. An active red light/prostitution business
2. An underdeveloped urban slum
3. Periodic shootings from drug folks seeking to maintain territory and clients
4. An incredibly undesirable place to live near a combinations of dumps, heavy industry, sewage treatment, rendering, chemicals, etc.

That sounds jaded. But those types of industries are predicated in part on population density and the economic gravity of the area to draw in activity from a surrounding hinterland. That does not mean you can't score dope in Clemson, or find an escort to come to Charlottesville or Blacksburg - just that those things do not exist at a level that can be supported by the locals.
(This post was last modified: Yesterday 05:00 PM by Statefan.)
Yesterday 04:54 PM
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Statefan Offline
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Post: #71
RE: Mandel's Mailbag: P5 expansion draft
Just for fun and giggles here are my listings of the most "urban" cities to the least urban "towns" see if you agree or disagree

SEC

1. Nashville
2. Columbia SC
3. Columbia Mizzou
4. Fayetteville
5. Gainsville
6. Baton Rouge
7. Knoxville
8. College Station
9. Lexington
10. Athens
11. Tuscolousa (have not been there in a decade)
12. Oxford
13. Starkville
14. Auburn

Compared to the ACC, the Schools are in the "boonies"

1. Miami
2. Boston
3. Atlanta
4. Pittsburgh
5. Raleigh
6. Louisville
7. Tallahassee
8. Syracuse
9. Durham
10. Winston-Salem
11. Charlottesville
12. Chapel Hill
13. Clemson
14. Blacksburg

Technically Chapel Hill/Durham/Raleigh are in the same Metro - they are, but they are distinct places. Technically Chestnut Hill is a suburb of Boston but you have to park your car in Boston and ride the train to the Alumni Stadium if you are visiting.

The Big 10 goes a follows:

1. Chicago (Evansville)
2. DC (College Park)
3. Minneapolis
4. Columbus
5. Lansing
6. Madison
7. Brunswick
8. Champagne
9. Iowa City
10. Bloomington
11. West Lafayette
12. Ann Arbor
12. Lincoln
13. Happy Valley

Columbus Ohio is about as big as you get before your college football goes to hell in a handbasket. Of course what this list really shows is the interaction between college and pro football that would require about 30 more pages to tease out and put into a thesis.

College football spending is part of a basket of goods that exists in and outside the urban area but competes with other urban spending on discretionary items.
(This post was last modified: Yesterday 05:38 PM by Statefan.)
Yesterday 05:26 PM
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Cattidude Online
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Post: #72
RE: Mandel's Mailbag: P5 expansion draft
(07-30-2020 12:38 PM)Statefan Wrote:  
(07-30-2020 08:37 AM)CliftonAve Wrote:  
(07-29-2020 04:31 PM)dbackjon Wrote:  
(07-29-2020 04:01 PM)CliftonAve Wrote:  
(07-29-2020 03:54 PM)dbackjon Wrote:  To offense to the Bearcats, but why would the Big Ten choose Cincy with all of them available? A Texas or Florida School would be more valuable.

Well first of all they wouldn’t, but the premise of Mandel’s article is he is throwing out throw out a lot of factors that get considered and based it on geography and on the field performance.

I would buy that more if the next pick wasn't UCF to the Big 12. Cincy doesn't add that much to a conference that is already in Ohio and Indiana, and UC doesn't have much reach into Kentucky

I realize Cincinnati isn’t well respected on this board, but we check more boxes across the board than nearly everyone outside the P5. We haven’t had the back to back undefeated seasons of UCF, but our FB has been very good for a while now. We are good at hoops. We have brand strength. We have solid academics and are heavy in research. We reside in a large market in a big state and Ohio is a football crazed market. Our TV ratings are solid.

Most of the other candidates have at least one box unchecked, whether it be academics, location, duplication of markets/not expanding footprint, attendance issues, mediocre to bad hoops, political/religious issues, etc.

I respect Cincy. Your academic profile is right there with VT, NC State, Miami, etc., one of the half-dozen of so waiting to take Kansas' and Mizzou's spot in the AAU.

Your problem is that you allowed Louisville to get 7-8 years ahead of you in football and then the merry go round stopped.

Your geography is a problem as well - your market is overlapped by SEC, B10, and ACC schools UK, Louisville, OSU, Indiana, etc. If Cincy were located in Dayton or Cleveland you would be in the ACC.

I'm sorry, but in my 7 years in Cincy I maybe ran into single digit amounts of Louisville and Indiana fans. Fanbase size in Cincinnati would go UC>OSU>then ND and UK>Louisville/Indiana. ND might edge out UK. Hard to really judge. I'm just saying that Indiana and Louisville have a very small presence in Cincinnati
Today 07:48 AM
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Cattidude Online
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Post: #73
RE: Mandel's Mailbag: P5 expansion draft
(Yesterday 01:47 PM)bullet Wrote:  
(Yesterday 01:43 PM)THUNDERStruck73 Wrote:  
(Yesterday 01:32 PM)schmolik Wrote:  
(Yesterday 12:55 PM)THUNDERStruck73 Wrote:  
(Yesterday 11:58 AM)ken d Wrote:  Is that an inside joke? I don't get it.

UK, UT, USC, and LSU are SEC public and in Cities.

However now that I re-read it, I suppose he meant that the SEC doesn’t do public schools named for the city in which they are located. Lol.

Every SEC public school is in a city. Even Oxford and Starkville are cities. They're not as populous as Lexington or Knoxville but they're still cities.

Right, but I think he meant schools like Houston, Cincinnati, Memphis, Charlotte which are named after the city they are in. Your example of Auburn discounts his theory.

No. You just don't get the concept of regional commuter schools. The SEC schools draw from throughout their states and none of them are anything like a commuter school. Houston, Memphis, Charlotte and Cincinnati all draw from their region of the state and have big commuter components. All were at one time overwhelming commuter schools.

Cincinnati isn't a commuter school. They do have a lots of students from the surrounding area, true, but they draw students from all over the state. I think I met more Clevelanders than I did Cincinnati natives in my time at UC.
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