How are we supposed to pay for the extra scholarships? The cost would be somewhere over a million dollars. How would Title IX fit into this?

(07-20-2020 08:46 AM)Tribe32 Wrote:  How are we supposed to pay for the extra scholarships? The cost would be somewhere over a million dollars. How would Title IX fit into this?

I feel crappy for writing this, but I think we'd have to be very selective.

Kiely could have a redshirt year, COVID-19 related or not. I haven't looked at how many rising seniors have yet to burn their redshirt.

Crist, Ripley, and a few others could receive a COVID-19 redshirt, if the NCAA votes to allow it.

Then, there are guys who are rising 5th year seniors who have contributed very little on the field. I can't see paying their way for a 6th year.

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(07-20-2020 08:56 AM)Tribal Wrote:  

(07-20-2020 08:46 AM)Tribe32 Wrote:  How are we supposed to pay for the extra scholarships? The cost would be somewhere over a million dollars. How would Title IX fit into this?

I feel crappy for writing this, but I think we'd have to be very selective.

Kiely could have a redshirt year, COVID-19 related or not. I haven't looked at how many rising seniors have yet to burn their redshirt.

Crist, Ripley, and a few others could receive a COVID-19 redshirt, if the NCAA votes to allow it.

Then, there are guys who are rising 5th year seniors who have contributed very little on the field. I can't see paying their way for a 6th year.

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I've had the same thought on a broader level for our general student body.

W&M generally enrolls about 1,500 new freshmen a year.

If I were going to be an incoming freshman, I think I would try and take a gap year, and I'm sure I'm not alone in that.

If even like 1/3rd of freshmen take a gap year, we'd only be enrolling 1,000. What would the school's plan be?

They could try and take 500 more students off the waitlist, but it seems like we might hurt some of our academic rankings by having a higher admissions rate.

If they let all 500 defer, what do they do next year? Enroll 2,000 students, or stick to the normal 1,500?

Sticking to the normal size, maybe slightly higher, seems more realistic to me, as the school has a finite amount of dorms. If they stick to the normal 1,500, they'll have to get real selective with next year's HS seniors.

500 off the wait list seems like the better option. 2000 next year won't work in terms of dorms. The problem with 500 now is that those kids are probably already enrolled somewhere else. Over the next several years, allow more transfers to even out the lack of freshmen this year.

(07-20-2020 08:56 AM)Tribal Wrote:  

(07-20-2020 08:46 AM)Tribe32 Wrote:  How are we supposed to pay for the extra scholarships? The cost would be somewhere over a million dollars. How would Title IX fit into this?

I feel crappy for writing this, but I think we'd have to be very selective.

Kiely could have a redshirt year, COVID-19 related or not. I haven't looked at how many rising seniors have yet to burn their redshirt.

Crist, Ripley, and a few others could receive a COVID-19 redshirt, if the NCAA votes to allow it.

Then, there are guys who are rising 5th year seniors who have contributed very little on the field. I can't see paying their way for a 6th year.

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Well, a lot of this I would think takes care of itself? A problem we will have with the ones we WANT to stay even is... is there a 6th year of classes?

I would think many that haven’t seen the field would want to move on to the real world?


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If the college enrolls a larger than usual class in the future,
the massive number of student oriented apartments being constructed at
Midtown Williamsburg would absorb upper class students needing to be moved
off campus.

That gives them three or four additional dorm size buildings. I'm not sure of the total occupany at Midtown but I would think at least 400 students.

Either 3 or 4 large buildings going up. It looks like they could be finished by the end of 2020.

Frankly, if the virus reduces student enrollment long term, I think this development could end up a big financial bust. A big and ugly highly visible eyesore at Richmond Road and Monticello Avenue.

(07-20-2020 09:03 AM)TDenverFan Wrote:  

(07-20-2020 08:56 AM)Tribal Wrote:  

(07-20-2020 08:46 AM)Tribe32 Wrote:  How are we supposed to pay for the extra scholarships? The cost would be somewhere over a million dollars. How would Title IX fit into this?

I feel crappy for writing this, but I think we'd have to be very selective.

Kiely could have a redshirt year, COVID-19 related or not. I haven't looked at how many rising seniors have yet to burn their redshirt.

Crist, Ripley, and a few others could receive a COVID-19 redshirt, if the NCAA votes to allow it.

Then, there are guys who are rising 5th year seniors who have contributed very little on the field. I can't see paying their way for a 6th year.

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I've had the same thought on a broader level for our general student body.

W&M generally enrolls about 1,500 new freshmen a year.

If I were going to be an incoming freshman, I think I would try and take a gap year, and I'm sure I'm not alone in that.

If even like 1/3rd of freshmen take a gap year, we'd only be enrolling 1,000. What would the school's plan be?

They could try and take 500 more students off the waitlist, but it seems like we might hurt some of our academic rankings by having a higher admissions rate.

If they let all 500 defer, what do they do next year? Enroll 2,000 students, or stick to the normal 1,500?

Sticking to the normal size, maybe slightly higher, seems more realistic to me, as the school has a finite amount of dorms. If they stick to the normal 1,500, they'll have to get real selective with next year's HS seniors.

I still think that there is a way to enlarge enrollment (and be financially accretive) with some sort of hybrid model, utilizing a mix of on-line and in-person learning opportunities, without losing academic rankings along with lowering health risks. The new apartments can contribute to that by adding housing options.

If those actions could be coupled with some of the types of things Purdue has done to reduce costs and hold tuition steady for the past 9 years, I think it is possible to remake the college into a slightly bigger, but still small selective academically elite public ivy, with a more solid financial foundation, and be on the cutting edge of the coming revolution in college format and structure.

The snowballing student debt crisis is going to bring about drastic changes in the current higher education model. The pandemic is going to accelerate those needed changes. It is time to get out in front of this.

We don't need to be churning out 1000 kids a year with bachelor degrees in liberal arts and $100,000 in student debt.

(07-20-2020 08:56 AM)Tribal Wrote:  

(07-20-2020 08:46 AM)Tribe32 Wrote:  How are we supposed to pay for the extra scholarships? The cost would be somewhere over a million dollars. How would Title IX fit into this?

I feel crappy for writing this, but I think we'd have to be very selective.

Kiely could have a redshirt year, COVID-19 related or not. I haven't looked at how many rising seniors have yet to burn their redshirt.

Crist, Ripley, and a few others could receive a COVID-19 redshirt, if the NCAA votes to allow it.

Then, there are guys who are rising 5th year seniors who have contributed very little on the field. I can't see paying their way for a 6th year.

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And the reality is, this is just not a "senior" issue if the NCAA is fair. Every scholarship player on the 2020 team will now be going to class for the 2020-21 academic year on a fully funded scholarship without playing any football this year. And that is the way that it should be. And everyone of these kids should probably deserve the right to not have a year being on the field taken away from them.But this is where the budget gets completely blown out of the water if the NCAA gives every kid on our roster the opportunity to ultimately be on the field for 4 years. Arguably,this year's freshman class costs us no additional scholarship money IF one presumes that each of them would have redshirted this year and will then all be ready to see the field in 2021 as eligible players. But if the NCAA came along and said that you could redshirt those kids next year and then give them their 4 years of playing time, each of those kids will be receiving one additional year of paid education that the budget has to pay for IF the NCAA allows us to expand the number of scholarships accordingly in the year that they become 6th year players. And the same would go with every other player on the team that does not have a redshirt year still available that we could use up this year.

As I said, this is potentially way more than just giving a senior who has one more year of eligibility left the opportunity to play as a 5th or 6th year senior.

(07-20-2020 11:16 AM)WMTRIBE75 Wrote:  

(07-20-2020 08:56 AM)Tribal Wrote:  

(07-20-2020 08:46 AM)Tribe32 Wrote:  How are we supposed to pay for the extra scholarships? The cost would be somewhere over a million dollars. How would Title IX fit into this?

I feel crappy for writing this, but I think we'd have to be very selective.

Kiely could have a redshirt year, COVID-19 related or not. I haven't looked at how many rising seniors have yet to burn their redshirt.

Crist, Ripley, and a few others could receive a COVID-19 redshirt, if the NCAA votes to allow it.

Then, there are guys who are rising 5th year seniors who have contributed very little on the field. I can't see paying their way for a 6th year.

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And the reality is, this is just not a "senior" issue if the NCAA is fair. Every scholarship player on the 2020 team will now be going to class for the 2020-21 academic year on a fully funded scholarship without playing any football this year. And that is the way that it should be. And everyone of these kids should probably deserve the right to not have a year being on the field taken away from them.But this is where the budget gets completely blown out of the water if the NCAA gives every kid on our roster the opportunity to ultimately be on the field for 4 years. Arguably,this year's freshman class costs us no additional scholarship money IF one presumes that each of them would have redshirted this year and will then all be ready to see the field in 2021 as eligible players. But if the NCAA came along and said that you could redshirt those kids next year and then give them their 4 years of playing time, each of those kids will be receiving one additional year of paid education that the budget has to pay for IF the NCAA allows us to expand the number of scholarships accordingly in the year that they become 6th year players. And the same would go with every other player on the team that does not have a redshirt year still available that we could use up this year.

As I said, this is potentially way more than just giving a senior who has one more year of eligibility left the opportunity to play as a 5th or 6th year senior.

You're 100% right and I didn't think about the cascading impact.

Oof.

(07-20-2020 10:29 AM)DSL Wrote:  If the college enrolls a larger than usual class in the future,
the massive number of student oriented apartments being constructed at
Midtown Williamsburg would absorb upper class students needing to be moved
off campus.

That gives them three or four additional dorm size buildings. I'm not sure of the total occupany at Midtown but I would think at least 400 students.

Either 3 or 4 large buildings going up. It looks like they could be finished by the end of 2020.

Frankly, if the virus reduces student enrollment long term, I think this development could end up a big financial bust. A big and ugly highly visible eyesore at Richmond Road and Monticello Avenue.

Big and ugly eyesore? For the younger guys around here, this kind of development is seen as what is needed to make Wburg more desirable to those between graduation and retirement. If you want a packed Kaplan, youd better hope more of these get built.

http://midtownrowwilliamsburg.com/

That shopping center needs help. Backs to our School of Education. Perfect location...love this.

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@CAASports commissioner Joe D'Antonio details the decision to postpone @CAAFootball with hopes of getting in some sort of season in the spring. @spidervoice

https://t.co/4up0cUvgR1

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(07-20-2020 11:32 AM)wml33t Wrote:  

(07-20-2020 11:16 AM)WMTRIBE75 Wrote:  

(07-20-2020 08:56 AM)Tribal Wrote:  

(07-20-2020 08:46 AM)Tribe32 Wrote:  How are we supposed to pay for the extra scholarships? The cost would be somewhere over a million dollars. How would Title IX fit into this?

I feel crappy for writing this, but I think we'd have to be very selective.

Kiely could have a redshirt year, COVID-19 related or not. I haven't looked at how many rising seniors have yet to burn their redshirt.

Crist, Ripley, and a few others could receive a COVID-19 redshirt, if the NCAA votes to allow it.

Then, there are guys who are rising 5th year seniors who have contributed very little on the field. I can't see paying their way for a 6th year.

Sent from my SM-N970U using Tapatalk

And the reality is, this is just not a "senior" issue if the NCAA is fair. Every scholarship player on the 2020 team will now be going to class for the 2020-21 academic year on a fully funded scholarship without playing any football this year. And that is the way that it should be. And everyone of these kids should probably deserve the right to not have a year being on the field taken away from them.But this is where the budget gets completely blown out of the water if the NCAA gives every kid on our roster the opportunity to ultimately be on the field for 4 years. Arguably,this year's freshman class costs us no additional scholarship money IF one presumes that each of them would have redshirted this year and will then all be ready to see the field in 2021 as eligible players. But if the NCAA came along and said that you could redshirt those kids next year and then give them their 4 years of playing time, each of those kids will be receiving one additional year of paid education that the budget has to pay for IF the NCAA allows us to expand the number of scholarships accordingly in the year that they become 6th year players. And the same would go with every other player on the team that does not have a redshirt year still available that we could use up this year.

As I said, this is potentially way more than just giving a senior who has one more year of eligibility left the opportunity to play as a 5th or 6th year senior.

You're 100% right and I didn't think about the cascading impact.

Oof.

I think there is a rule at W&M that you have to graduate in 5 years, or get approval from pretty high up in the leadership chain to continue undergrad courses beyond that.

I doubt W&M would want to fill its graduate programs with a bunch of W&M athletes so they can play another year. I would guess many of the athletes will want to move on as well.

And of course, the NCAA could just say "tough luck" and give them nothing. I mean high school athletes aren't getting an extra year...

HS kids can go to postgrad schools before attending college. We have a few Fork Union & Peddie players on our current roster. I'm under the impression a postgrad school year doesn't count against eligibility, no?

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(07-20-2020 03:36 PM)Tribal Wrote:  HS kids can go to postgrad schools before attending college. We have a few Fork Union & Peddie players on our current roster. I'm under the impression a postgrad school year doesn't count against eligibility, no?

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Postgrad does not count against college eligibility. Going postgrad also frees you from any LOI as well. I don't see any of our commits going that route, but it is possible.

(07-20-2020 04:21 PM)mrjoolius Wrote:  

(07-20-2020 03:36 PM)Tribal Wrote:  HS kids can go to postgrad schools before attending college. We have a few Fork Union & Peddie players on our current roster. I'm under the impression a postgrad school year doesn't count against eligibility, no?

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Postgrad does not count against college eligibility. Going postgrad also frees you from any LOI as well. I don't see any of our commits going that route, but it is possible.

My post spoke to the comment that HS kids don't get an extra year. Just want to point out that they do have options before college...may not be another year of HS but they can play another year somewhere.

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(07-20-2020 04:38 PM)Tribal Wrote:  

(07-20-2020 04:21 PM)mrjoolius Wrote:  

(07-20-2020 03:36 PM)Tribal Wrote:  HS kids can go to postgrad schools before attending college. We have a few Fork Union & Peddie players on our current roster. I'm under the impression a postgrad school year doesn't count against eligibility, no?

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Postgrad does not count against college eligibility. Going postgrad also frees you from any LOI as well. I don't see any of our commits going that route, but it is possible.

My post spoke to the comment that HS kids don't get an extra year. Just want to point out that they do have options before college...may not be another year of HS but they can play another year somewhere.

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good point.

If we go that route, college kids also have other options post-graduation besides the NFL / NBA / etc. So they can also play another year elsewhere.

(07-20-2020 03:22 PM)soccerguy315 Wrote:  

(07-20-2020 11:32 AM)wml33t Wrote:  

(07-20-2020 11:16 AM)WMTRIBE75 Wrote:  

(07-20-2020 08:56 AM)Tribal Wrote:  

(07-20-2020 08:46 AM)Tribe32 Wrote:  How are we supposed to pay for the extra scholarships? The cost would be somewhere over a million dollars. How would Title IX fit into this?

I feel crappy for writing this, but I think we'd have to be very selective.

Kiely could have a redshirt year, COVID-19 related or not. I haven't looked at how many rising seniors have yet to burn their redshirt.

Crist, Ripley, and a few others could receive a COVID-19 redshirt, if the NCAA votes to allow it.

Then, there are guys who are rising 5th year seniors who have contributed very little on the field. I can't see paying their way for a 6th year.

Sent from my SM-N970U using Tapatalk

And the reality is, this is just not a "senior" issue if the NCAA is fair. Every scholarship player on the 2020 team will now be going to class for the 2020-21 academic year on a fully funded scholarship without playing any football this year. And that is the way that it should be. And everyone of these kids should probably deserve the right to not have a year being on the field taken away from them.But this is where the budget gets completely blown out of the water if the NCAA gives every kid on our roster the opportunity to ultimately be on the field for 4 years. Arguably,this year's freshman class costs us no additional scholarship money IF one presumes that each of them would have redshirted this year and will then all be ready to see the field in 2021 as eligible players. But if the NCAA came along and said that you could redshirt those kids next year and then give them their 4 years of playing time, each of those kids will be receiving one additional year of paid education that the budget has to pay for IF the NCAA allows us to expand the number of scholarships accordingly in the year that they become 6th year players. And the same would go with every other player on the team that does not have a redshirt year still available that we could use up this year.

As I said, this is potentially way more than just giving a senior who has one more year of eligibility left the opportunity to play as a 5th or 6th year senior.

You're 100% right and I didn't think about the cascading impact.

Oof.

I think there is a rule at W&M that you have to graduate in 5 years, or get approval from pretty high up in the leadership chain to continue undergrad courses beyond that.

I doubt W&M would want to fill its graduate programs with a bunch of W&M athletes so they can play another year. I would guess many of the athletes will want to move on as well.

And of course, the NCAA could just say "tough luck" and give them nothing. I mean high school athletes aren't getting an extra year...

From experience... the rule is actually 10 semesters. It may be 10 semesters in 6 years?


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12.8.1.5.1 Waiver Criteria. A waiver of the five-year period of eligibility is designed to provide a studentathlete
with the opportunity to participate in four seasons of intercollegiate competition within a five-year
period. This waiver may be granted, based upon objective evidence, for reasons that are beyond the control
of the student-athlete or the institution, which deprive the student-athlete of the opportunity to participate
for more than one season in his or her sport within the five-year period. The Committee on Student-Athlete
Reinstatement reserves the right to review requests that do not meet the more-than-one-year criteria detailed
2015-16 Division I – April
12

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I would think that the 5-year/10-semester waivers would be easier to come by if they were COVID related.