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End of the NCAA?
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BinghamptonNed Offline
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Post: #41
RE: End of the NCAA?
(05-27-2020 06:46 PM)memphisike Wrote:  Word on the street the ncaa is killinghas killed their goose that lays the golden egg

Fixed it for you,

the NCAA has outlived their usefulness to the P5, the NCAA knew they were on thin ice and ignorantly kept acting ignorantly, the P5 will go after all football and basketball revenues --- ALL of IT and the NCAA will be left with all of the expenses and none of the revenues, they are in big trouble and it could not happen to a more deserving group
05-30-2020 08:12 AM
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Tiger87 Offline
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Post: #42
RE: End of the NCAA?
(05-29-2020 08:53 PM)hk25 Wrote:  The regular season is 9 conference games with other 9 teams in division 2 out of conference games against teams in other power conference (home &homes) & “buy” with a local fcs school who would gladly take the big paychecks.

I don't think the NCAA would allow any member institutions to play non-member schools, so the FCS game would be gone.
05-30-2020 07:23 PM
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hk25 Offline
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Post: #43
RE: End of the NCAA?
(05-30-2020 07:23 PM)Tiger87 Wrote:  
(05-29-2020 08:53 PM)hk25 Wrote:  The regular season is 9 conference games with other 9 teams in division 2 out of conference games against teams in other power conference (home &homes) & “buy” with a local fcs school who would gladly take the big paychecks.

I don't think the NCAA would allow any member institutions to play non-member schools, so the FCS game would be gone.

Fair point, but with the right economic incentive, I could see a scenario where that kind of game could still occur even if just in a “friendly/exhibition “ type of arrangement.
05-30-2020 09:15 PM
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Hernando Hills Tiger Away
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Post: #44
RE: End of the NCAA?
The key is that we are in a better position football wise then we have ever been. Let's hope that plays a role in the issuing of the invitation.
05-30-2020 09:21 PM
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jsw3ent Offline
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Post: #45
RE: End of the NCAA?
(05-30-2020 09:15 PM)hk25 Wrote:  
(05-30-2020 07:23 PM)Tiger87 Wrote:  
(05-29-2020 08:53 PM)hk25 Wrote:  The regular season is 9 conference games with other 9 teams in division 2 out of conference games against teams in other power conference (home &homes) & “buy” with a local fcs school who would gladly take the big paychecks.

I don't think the NCAA would allow any member institutions to play non-member schools, so the FCS game would be gone.

Fair point, but with the right economic incentive, I could see a scenario where that kind of game could still occur even if just in a “friendly/exhibition “ type of arrangement.

Like Balboa and Hogan ?
05-30-2020 11:53 PM
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Browning Hall Away
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Post: #46
RE: End of the NCAA?
(05-30-2020 11:53 PM)jsw3ent Wrote:  
(05-30-2020 09:15 PM)hk25 Wrote:  
(05-30-2020 07:23 PM)Tiger87 Wrote:  
(05-29-2020 08:53 PM)hk25 Wrote:  The regular season is 9 conference games with other 9 teams in division 2 out of conference games against teams in other power conference (home &homes) & “buy” with a local fcs school who would gladly take the big paychecks.

I don't think the NCAA would allow any member institutions to play non-member schools, so the FCS game would be gone.

Fair point, but with the right economic incentive, I could see a scenario where that kind of game could still occur even if just in a “friendly/exhibition “ type of arrangement.

Like Balboa and Hogan ?

Lawler and Kaufman was better
05-31-2020 12:22 AM
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jsw3ent Offline
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Post: #47
RE: End of the NCAA?
(05-31-2020 12:22 AM)Browning Hall Wrote:  
(05-30-2020 11:53 PM)jsw3ent Wrote:  
(05-30-2020 09:15 PM)hk25 Wrote:  
(05-30-2020 07:23 PM)Tiger87 Wrote:  
(05-29-2020 08:53 PM)hk25 Wrote:  The regular season is 9 conference games with other 9 teams in division 2 out of conference games against teams in other power conference (home &homes) & “buy” with a local fcs school who would gladly take the big paychecks.

I don't think the NCAA would allow any member institutions to play non-member schools, so the FCS game would be gone.

Fair point, but with the right economic incentive, I could see a scenario where that kind of game could still occur even if just in a “friendly/exhibition “ type of arrangement.

Like Balboa and Hogan ?

Lawler and Kaufman was better

LOL--yes it certainly was.
05-31-2020 01:36 AM
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Atlanta Offline
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Post: #48
RE: End of the NCAA?
(05-30-2020 07:23 PM)Tiger87 Wrote:  
(05-29-2020 08:53 PM)hk25 Wrote:  The regular season is 9 conference games with other 9 teams in division 2 out of conference games against teams in other power conference (home &homes) & “buy” with a local fcs school who would gladly take the big paychecks.

I don't think the NCAA would allow any member institutions to play non-member schools, so the FCS game would be gone.

NCAA doesn't prohibit members from playing NAIA schools now. Don't think that would happen. But I do think the NCAA would not count the non-NCAA games.
06-01-2020 06:39 AM
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TripleA Offline
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Post: #49
RE: End of the NCAA?
(05-28-2020 02:52 PM)fsquid Wrote:  The power 5 already make all the rules and keep the football money. Unsure how this benefits them.

Simple. Their intent is to:

1. Take all the basketball money.

2. Self rule without having the NCAA interfere or take any money.

JRsec is probably close to reality. Back when we were chasing the Big 12, the P5 conferences were already discussing a breakaway. Rudd and Bowen were saying privately that it would include maybe 80 to 100 schools.

Personally, I think it would be most or all of the P5, the top half or so of the AAC, BYU and a few others for football, and those plus the Big East and a few others for basketball.

So, maybe 70-75 for football, and another 20 or so for basketball.
06-01-2020 09:22 AM
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bbqtiger Offline
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Post: #50
RE: End of the NCAA?
(06-01-2020 09:22 AM)TripleA Wrote:  Personally, I think it would be most or all of the P5, the top half or so of the AAC, BYU and a few others for football, and those plus the Big East and a few others for basketball.

So, maybe 70-75 for football, and another 20 or so for basketball.

Trip, I think you have it nailed. JMHO
06-01-2020 01:19 PM
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dcg141 Offline
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Post: #51
RE: End of the NCAA?
(05-29-2020 08:53 PM)hk25 Wrote:  
(05-28-2020 08:19 PM)dcg141 Wrote:  The only leverage those outside could bring would be to refuse to play the Power 5 in any sport. They would have a very difficult time scheduling sports outside of football. Also for weak football P5 programs football is going to be misery.

Sorry, I disagree with the thought of teams outside of the new power alliance hurting them by not playing them,in fact I think they don’t really want to play any teams in the next level down.

I could see 4 conferences with 20 teams each, each conference has 2 divisions with 10 teams . The winners of each division plays In the conference championship game & that is the pay in game for 4 team National playoffs. That way everything is “settled on field”, if you don’t win your division, then conference, you don’t play for National championship.

The regular season is 9 conference games with other 9 teams in division 2 out of conference games against teams in other power conference (home &homes) & “buy” with a local fcs school who would gladly take the big paychecks.

Only issue I see with that is all schools would loose 1 home game every other year due to the unbalanced 9 game conference schedule .

If it goes to 80 teams I like our chances of being included, I don’t like current conference affiliation politics if it’s only mid 60’s.

I was thinking more outside the area of football. BB, baseball and other sports. If the P5 are forced to fill all of their sports with other P5's is going to get difficult.
06-01-2020 02:44 PM
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Stammers Online
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Post: #52
RE: End of the NCAA?
How would this look at 78 schools?

AAC - 12
Memphis
Cincinnati
Louisville
UCF
USF
Temple
Army
Navy
BYU
Boise
San Diego State
Air Force

ACC - 14
Clemson
Florida State
NC State
North Carolina
Duke
Wake Forest
Boston College
Syracuse
Virginia
Virginia Tech
Miami
Pitt
Georgia Tech
Notre Dame

Big Ten - 14
Big 12 - 10
PAC12 - 14
$EC - 14
(This post was last modified: 06-01-2020 03:01 PM by Stammers.)
06-01-2020 02:54 PM
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bbqtiger Offline
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Post: #53
RE: End of the NCAA?
Stammers, I think there will be a major shift in conference alignment in the future. How far out, I won't even hazard a guess. The American is likely to involved very deeply. But I cannot see how it could include UCF, USF, and San Diego St. That would literally be coast to coast in one conference.

As far as a likely group of 78 schools/teams, it is hard to argue against your choices. But the alignment will not be as you have it, IMHO.
06-01-2020 03:18 PM
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Stammers Online
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Post: #54
RE: End of the NCAA?
(06-01-2020 03:18 PM)bbqtiger Wrote:  Stammers, I think there will be a major shift in conference alignment in the future. How far out, I won't even hazard a guess. The American is likely to involved very deeply. But I cannot see how it could include UCF, USF, and San Diego St. That would literally be coast to coast in one conference.

As far as a likely group of 78 schools/teams, it is hard to argue against your choices. But the alignment will not be as you have it, IMHO.

No doubt that it won't look like that, but there are going to have to be compromises. The advantage that the service academies will have is that other conferences will allow them to park their other sports there.

I would think that the Big Ten, $EC and PAC12 would be reluctant to compromise. San Diego State and Boise should go into the PAC12, but then the AAC would not be strong enough, would be down to 10 members and only 8 for basketball. We should be in the $EC, but there is no way that they would allow it.
06-01-2020 04:13 PM
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Tiger87 Offline
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Post: #55
RE: End of the NCAA?
The problem is that we look at it as fans. We think success should provide bigger opportunities.
The ones making the decision will not look at who has been most competitive. They will look at money and politics.
06-01-2020 04:24 PM
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Tiger87 Offline
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Post: #56
RE: End of the NCAA?
(06-01-2020 06:39 AM)Atlanta Wrote:  
(05-30-2020 07:23 PM)Tiger87 Wrote:  
(05-29-2020 08:53 PM)hk25 Wrote:  The regular season is 9 conference games with other 9 teams in division 2 out of conference games against teams in other power conference (home &homes) & “buy” with a local fcs school who would gladly take the big paychecks.

I don't think the NCAA would allow any member institutions to play non-member schools, so the FCS game would be gone.

NCAA doesn't prohibit members from playing NAIA schools now. Don't think that would happen. But I do think the NCAA would not count the non-NCAA games.

Can NCAA play NAIA in football? Maybe so, but I'm drawing a blank on that happening.

In basketball, the NCAA allows 2 "non-NCAA" games that do not count. These are sometimes exhibitions against schools who are not members of the NCAA.

But I'm not sure that applies to football, which is what we were talking about. In football you're allowed one FCS game, but I think it has to be an NCAA school...?
(This post was last modified: 06-01-2020 04:30 PM by Tiger87.)
06-01-2020 04:29 PM
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hk25 Offline
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Post: #57
RE: End of the NCAA?
(06-01-2020 02:44 PM)dcg141 Wrote:  
(05-29-2020 08:53 PM)hk25 Wrote:  
(05-28-2020 08:19 PM)dcg141 Wrote:  The only leverage those outside could bring would be to refuse to play the Power 5 in any sport. They would have a very difficult time scheduling sports outside of football. Also for weak football P5 programs football is going to be misery.

Sorry, I disagree with the thought of teams outside of the new power alliance hurting them by not playing them,in fact I think they don’t really want to play any teams in the next level down.

I could see 4 conferences with 20 teams each, each conference has 2 divisions with 10 teams . The winners of each division plays In the conference championship game & that is the pay in game for 4 team National playoffs. That way everything is “settled on field”, if you don’t win your division, then conference, you don’t play for National championship.

The regular season is 9 conference games with other 9 teams in division 2 out of conference games against teams in other power conference (home &homes) & “buy” with a local fcs school who would gladly take the big paychecks.

Only issue I see with that is all schools would loose 1 home game every other year due to the unbalanced 9 game conference schedule .

If it goes to 80 teams I like our chances of being included, I don’t like current conference affiliation politics if it’s only mid 60’s.

I was thinking more outside the area of football. BB, baseball and other sports. If the P5 are forced to fill all of their sports with other P5's is going to get difficult.

Gotcha I see your point outside of football.

Schools like us in basketball would likely loose several home games if they only played the schools that broke away since all would expect home & homes & not want to be anyone’s buy game.

But from a fan’s standpoint, I might ok swapping out 10 Home buy games for 10 home & homes with other higher end programs.

I am sure the athletic budget disagrees with me, unless the TV & other revenue more than make up for the lost home game revenue.
06-01-2020 08:55 PM
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Stammers Online
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Post: #58
RE: End of the NCAA?
(06-01-2020 04:24 PM)Tiger87 Wrote:  The problem is that we look at it as fans. We think success should provide bigger opportunities.
The ones making the decision will not look at who has been most competitive. They will look at money and politics.

Exactly true. I can't see any scenario where P5 conferences and the AAC give up the CCG. They are huge money makers.
06-01-2020 10:16 PM
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Browning Hall Away
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Post: #59
RE: End of the NCAA?
(06-01-2020 10:16 PM)Stammers Wrote:  
(06-01-2020 04:24 PM)Tiger87 Wrote:  The problem is that we look at it as fans. We think success should provide bigger opportunities.
The ones making the decision will not look at who has been most competitive. They will look at money and politics.

Exactly true. I can't see any scenario where P5 conferences and the AAC give up the CCG. They are huge money makers.

They might if the below was actually on the table.

(05-28-2020 05:20 PM)Alanda Wrote:  
(05-28-2020 02:52 PM)fsquid Wrote:  The power 5 already make all the rules and keep the football money. Unsure how this benefits them.

According to JRsec estimate pay per team up to $120m.
06-01-2020 10:49 PM
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Stammers Online
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Post: #60
RE: End of the NCAA?
(06-01-2020 10:49 PM)Browning Hall Wrote:  
(06-01-2020 10:16 PM)Stammers Wrote:  
(06-01-2020 04:24 PM)Tiger87 Wrote:  The problem is that we look at it as fans. We think success should provide bigger opportunities.
The ones making the decision will not look at who has been most competitive. They will look at money and politics.

Exactly true. I can't see any scenario where P5 conferences and the AAC give up the CCG. They are huge money makers.

They might if the below was actually on the table.

(05-28-2020 05:20 PM)Alanda Wrote:  
(05-28-2020 02:52 PM)fsquid Wrote:  The power 5 already make all the rules and keep the football money. Unsure how this benefits them.

According to JRsec estimate pay per team up to $120m.

You would have to think that the CCG and bowls are a huge chunk of that.
06-02-2020 11:27 AM
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