(05-21-2020 06:37 PM)shere khan Wrote: More proof stupid people are frickin sheep and when called out try to claim a morally superior high ground. It's not that I wont wear a mask or any number of things for protection but local virtue signaling despots can frick right on off.
As to your fear part. Quit your misguided psychobabble crap. It won't fly here. You really aren't clever enough to pull it off. JR could, you....nah. JR wouldn't though. Lol.
Honestly, I like your posts but we ain't gonna agree on this one. That's fine. Just dont play your stupid games. I'm impervious.
I'm the one playing games but you're 'impervious'? lol Okay chief.
Please be specific about what it is you think we aren't going to agree on.
The only area I see us in disagreement is that you don't support my right to make a choice different from yours.... and while we do disagree on some of the 'science', that really doesn't concern me. The fact is that the overwhelming majority of the scientific and medical community clearly agrees with my position... as does the majority of the population.... so even if it is 'wrong' (which you haven't remotely proven, but I'm playing along) it's STILL going to be the same end result. You've got a whole lot more people to convince than 'me'. Since I want the same choices that you do, It will be easy to convince me with clear facts.
All one needs to do is watch commercials to see that 'acceptance' of these things is pretty universal. I haven't seen one single significant commercial with someone touting their 'lack of concern'... have you?
I disagree with your choices, but I have repeatedly supported your right to your choice. I've taken serious issue with your insistence on broadcasting it and belittling people who make different choices... because I believe they are both unnecessary and that it emboldens the left (who has had a FIELD day with this) for 'the next time'. This is their utopia. They now have tens of millions of people out of work and on support... who will need all sorts of laws about 'evictions' and 'unemployment benefit timelines' etc etc etc. Those people are in HOG HEAVEN in terms of being able to 'buy' millions of votes in just a few months.
On the contrary, I believe you've consistently belittled my choices... which wouldn't be so bad if you weren't also BLATANTLY misrepresent them to do so.... so as far as I'm concerned, you're no different from the left on things like Climate Change. You're convinced that you're right and everyone else is just stupid.... even if you have to lie about what they believe to make that claim.
What bothers me is that NEITHER of you support my right to my choices... you both want to decide for me.... so I don't want to support either of you, and there are a lot more of them than there are of you... so if I don't put up with the guy who insists on insulting me, 'they' win. That's what happened this time, and you've not remotely changed the calculus of that going forward.
Seriously, I don't get your point in the insults. You want me to 'not' do what I think is best for me and my family that doesn't in any way impact you? Fight the government all you want... I'm with you... all I ask if that you not try and convince me of things that you can't prove or I believe are wrong along the way... especially in that they don't matter to my support.
(05-21-2020 06:43 PM)Kaplony Wrote: LOL Trust me, if I were being a dick you'd have already banned me because I would have truly blasted you over your "I'm not scared but I'm complying with everything the government tells me because I'm a good little sheep" stance while attacking others for legitimate concerns over governmental overreach and massive erosion of rights.
You like to play the philosophical objector but your compliance shows it's just a ruse. Like I have said many times, you'd be at the top of the ramp encouraging the rest of the sheep to follow you into the cattle car saying "Come on guys! The covid camp is to keep us safe!" You are nothing more than the average German citizen who dutifully went along with the suspension of rights after the Reichstag Fire Decree because "It's to keep us safe." You'll be at the head of the line to get your covid "vaccination" and the papers to prove you got it because they told you to. You are ashamed of yourself because you tried to play this reasonable person for oh so long but at the first sign of crisis your facade cracked and exposed the compliant little gutless follower you are. Can't walk that back now, it's been there for everyone to see.
Just remember, as tens of thousands of your fellow Americans lose their livelihoods, small business owners lose their hopes and dreams, and our economy falls deeper and deeper into the morass which will result in far more health problems than this virus was ever going to cause that you were complicit. You and others like you meekly complied while others protested. Own the fruits of your lack of labor...you earned it.
And remember, you were the one who made it personal way back when. Don't get mad when it boomerangs on you and you get back what you dish out.
All you're telling me here is that there is a 'range' of your ability to be a dick. The list of lies here is long...
Let's start with this:
I've not once threatened you or made any comment about moderation along the way. If you have that 'fear', that's on you... not me. I am in no way 'without sin' in this bull**** so I wouldn't think it appropriate to moderate you for something you said in response to me. I've said this to other posters as well, so this is not unique to you. The WORST I would do is just what you could also do, and that is report you to another mod... whom you may know personally better than I do.... and see what they think and decide to do. I've done that once I think on the Rice board and once with a 'leftie' in a political argument. Be as big a dick as you want towards me... and if there are consequences, they will come from a mod other than me.
Now let's look at a few facts... these aren't all of them... feel free to find others to correct me if I'm wrong... but I randomly pulled some posts... and they support my recollection.
3/10 when asked if you would voluntarily get infected for $4,500... I essentially said 'yes' (for more money though as it wouldn't be worth my time away from work) and compared it to getting your kids exposed to chicken pox. I obviously wasn't that concerned about it... but I still already thought there was a 'proper' personal response, based on circumstances...
In a post I made 3/19 in response to Momus calling Right-Wingers 'a special kind of stupid' for having an 18 month plan for this...
I suggested:
Quote:We also have plans for alien invasions and a nuclear war with India.
I do however 100% agree that it will come in waves and could last 18 months or even longer.... but that doesn't mean that the impact in 18 months will remotely be what it is now. By 18 months we should have better tools and be better 'citizens'. I expect open buffet type self-serve restaurants to essentially go away... or at least lose a ton of business/lots of consolidation. May still be tons of options, but will be behind glass and you will be served as opposed to serving yourself and even remotely 'open'. I expect the use of delivery services to greatly increase. I expect health measures/disinfecting on planes, in theatres etc and especially at nursing homes etc to increase greatly. I expect to see many more people wearing masks at things like concerts.
I still believe this, some of it has actually been prescient... and didn't suggest that it would be through mandate.
Now... 3/26... in a thread about a mayor blasting people for ignoring warnings... I spoke at some length about my plans regarding taking my son (who was coming in from living in Manhattan) to my parents home with me (my mother recovering from Cancer surgery) and the fact that I intended to voluntarily isolate us from her for 2 weeks.... because my son was coming from a high infection area and my mother was part of the known high risk population... My actions amounted to masks and gloves and social distancing... and doing things for them so they could stay home.
I said my actions were extreme, but it wasn't a big deal for me for 2 weeks. I called them fairly simple actions and said I'm not taking a 0.02% chance of harming my mother.
To which EverRespect (whom interestingly has "Free Kaplony' in his signature) responded...
'What the F?'
Now where things start to change....
I'd direct you to the 'I'm turning Japanese' thread... from early April...
Where I state my support for us being 'cleaner' as a nation, but repeatedly say I'm not remotely talking about laws.
WKY now comes in on 4/3 with 'Why don't you just ask your government to tell you how to wipe your ass' and that "He's never seen a person so hellbent on having their government define their lives'.
To which I made very clear... I didn't say one thing about my suggestions involving the government, but them merely being a fairly natural cultural progression... I likened it to moving from outdoor to indoor plumbing.
Shere makes comments about 'getting people pacifiers' and 'CDC recommendations to walk around with a thump up their ass'.
After calling one of my comments 'beyond stupid', Stink talks about 'smart folk turn into 'huh'' and though he says he's not referring to me, I still have no idea whom else he could have been referring to... as I was the only one even remotely talking about 'changes' and since he's now leashed the same comments on me... he either has me confused with someone else, or he WAS referring to me....
So while certainly there had been differences of opinion, I believe it was 'here' where the tone changed... and I wasn't the one making personal insults. The worst I said is that 'I was gobsmacked that so many seemed to be so adamantly against a society that discouraged having boogers in their pizza.'
Yet still, my response was polite as follows:
Quote:Again, I assume you're speaking of me.
Kindly do me the courtesy of demonstrating where I EVER suggested additional government regulation or anything other than exactly what you have...
All I've done is put some ideas to the 'best methods'.
self-cleaning/cleaner toilets
fewer 'self-serve' foods
more regular wearing of masks if you're sick and sneezing
Never suggested mandates, never mentioned government, never suggested penalties for not doing so. Only penalty I suggested already exists, for urinating in public when a restroom exists... which I hope you agree isn't a 'best method'
No 'fear' whatsoever by me. I simply see us spending billions of dollars on flu vaccines that aren't that effective against flu, and aren't effective at all against 'new' flu's.... killing 30-50,000 people per year, every year.... and causing untold numbers of lost work hours/productivity by those who catch it. Practicing good flu hygiene seems like it would cost far less and be just as if not vastly more effective.
I don't mind if you disagree with me, I'd just appreciate it if you'd actually disagree with what I said.
Note that the 'you're scared' comment as well as 'misrepresentations' of my position are already coming out as I am politely suggesting what I believe would be a better and less costly solution than 'shut downs'.
I DID get into it with Shere in a thread about 'letting the virus spread' where he claimed some sort of authority about what 'children of war' would think about what we were doing... ignoring what my parents, who ARE children of war were thinking about it.... and absolutely it got condescending... and I believe you came into the conversation at this point... but I'd note that this is a month ago.... and I'm already talking about:
Quote:I suggest you actually represent my beliefs, and not the lies you've read Shere trying to assign to me. Unfortunately this is across a few threads so you may not be aware of them.
I also said:
Quote:I don't disagree at all that for vast swaths of the nation.... like 80+% or maybe even more (depending on whether you mean area or population) it is time to get back to work... many of them never needed to be shut down at all...
and more to the point...
Quote:Either way, that has nothing to do with his claims that these actions have been unconstitutional or that people who wear a mask to protect other people are 'cowards'.... Those are the claims he made that I've shot down... that have elicited this straw man you're describing where I'm 'so afraid that I stay in my basement' or 'so compliant that I bend a knee'. You don't want to wear a mask, don't. It's not there to protect you anyway. It doesn't even really do much to protect anyone else... but it certainly shows respect for those at risk. Medical professionals would tell you it was a good idea to wear a mask ANY time you had an infectious disease.... but what do THEY know... let's listen to an internet troll instead. At the very least, not sneezing or even accidentally spitting on others, especially when you're sick is called common courtesy.
Of course the REAL issue is this....
If we all practiced these good habits anyway, we would need to be shut. Being obvious merely for effect... but if we could take actions to make it much more difficult for the virus to travel from one person to another, you could open up the whole country tomorrow.... and would have never needed to close any of it in the first place. I suggested this and this is what sent Shere on his tear.... that because I support sick people washing their hands and not touching or sneezing on my food, whether or not there is a pandemic... that I'm somehow a 'slave to the state'.
Now... MAYBE you want to dig into those other threads and find specifically where this 'fear' bull**** got started, but I'm quite confident that your belief that I started it is wrong. Stink and Shere (and others) were making those same comments at least by April 2nd, and they clearly have continued since then. At some point, YOU joined in.
It's certainly possible that I first spoke of YOUR fear, but I pretty clearly recall being surprised at you 'coming at me' with the same lies that these two were using as to this point, we'd always had cordial conversations. If my 'aim' was off, I'll apologize... but at this point, I'm pretty confident that any comment I made towards YOU about this issue would have to have been in response to something you said to me. If I'm wrong, please find it and I'll apologize for dragging you into this crap.