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East Carolina on the Clock: Will Cut One or More Sports
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AllTideUp Offline
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Post: #61
RE: East Carolina on the Clock: Will Cut One or More Sports
(05-21-2020 12:10 PM)CitrusUCF Wrote:  
(05-21-2020 11:54 AM)ken d Wrote:  
(05-21-2020 11:30 AM)Attackcoog Wrote:  
(05-21-2020 11:16 AM)PirateTreasureNC Wrote:  https://247sports.com/college/east-carol...147370402/

The axe has fallen.

I still can't believe that Swimming and Diving got an axe because of their continuous good performance but I think I could see something looming for them in the future with their own facility that might have been fly in the ointment.

Welp..four sports got the axe. I guess they had limited choices because the hit had to be equally distributed between mens and womens sports to keep the balance for Title 9.

Their Title IX balance was already out of whack, given that their enrollment is 57% female. This move eliminates more women's scholarship's (22) than men's (14.4). I believe it also gets them to the FBS minimum of 16 sports sponsored.

So Title IX is kind of misunderstood. It doesn't just protect women's sports; it's designed to protect the gender minority at a college. In the case of ECU, that's clearly men. Title IX requires you meet one of these three tests:

Quote:Provide participation opportunities for women and men that are substantially proportionate to their respective rates of enrollment of full-time undergraduate students;
Demonstrate a history and continuing practice of program expansion for the underrepresented sex;
Fully and effectively accommodate the interests and abilities of the underrepresented sex; and,

ECU is using the bold part for meeting Title IX, I would imagine.

Now what ECU may have trouble with in trying to offset football is:

Quote:Female and male student-athletes must receive athletics scholarship dollars proportional to their participation;

That's where the head count scholarship reductions may hurt them.

I've thought for some time now that football and basketball expenditures(or at least football) should be exempted from Title IX regulations. The economics of those sports are so fundamentally different. That's before you root their value in the real world factor that without revenue from those 2 sports, the others could never survive.
05-21-2020 12:56 PM
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Statefan Offline
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Post: #62
RE: East Carolina on the Clock: Will Cut One or More Sports
(05-20-2020 07:56 PM)PirateTreasureNC Wrote:  
(05-20-2020 06:42 PM)Statefan Wrote:  ECU just got a major thorn pulled out of it's ass a few hours ago.

How so?

Fetzer off the BOG
05-21-2020 12:57 PM
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Carolina_Low_Country Offline
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Post: #63
RE: East Carolina on the Clock: Will Cut One or More Sports
(05-20-2020 09:00 AM)ken d Wrote:  
(05-20-2020 08:03 AM)Carolina_Low_Country Wrote:  
(05-20-2020 02:35 AM)BruceMcF Wrote:  
(05-20-2020 02:16 AM)Carolina_Low_Country Wrote:  
(05-19-2020 02:04 PM)GTFletch Wrote:  hmmmm so UCONN is not the only one who is struggling with the Great AAC and the GREAT AAC Media deal.... The only diff between UCONN and ECU is that UCONN could jump to the Big East and go Indy in FB while ECU is straight up F****ed.... It is going to get real interesting once we learn how much these production facilities really cost and the actually cost of these ESPN+ productions along with the reneog deal with ESPN.....

Not true I budget is $15M more than it used to be we just had a AD who spent money like Congress and I don’t even mean using money on facilities etc. He hired too many people for the athletic dept and too many of his friends from NIU and gave them all a large salary and spent a ton on travel and entertainment. On top of that he killed our football program by firing a good coach and replaced with a terrible coach. We have just got to get back to being lean and mean like we were during Terry Holland’s regime.

It does help during a budget crisis if there is actually fat to cut, so you don't have to start the process by cutting into spending that contributes to program success.
We used to have a surplus until Compher showed up.

In the grand scheme of things, a $4 million dollar athletic budget deficit isn't all that big by G5 standards. And it doesn't have to closed entirely by cutting sports. The fact that ECU's 20 sports (which includes cheerleading as one of the women's sports) is one of the most in what arguably is the strongest G5 conference tells a lot about why the G5 don't have the autonomous status that P5 conferences do.
I'm not sure where you get your info as cheerleading is not a NCAA sport and does not count. We have 16 sports
Mens: Indoor Track & Field, Outdoor Track & Field, Cross Country, Basketball, Football, Baseball, Golf
Womens: LAX, Volleyball, Golf, Softball, Indoor Track & Field, Outdoor Track & Field, Crosscountry
05-21-2020 02:23 PM
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ken d Online
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Post: #64
RE: East Carolina on the Clock: Will Cut One or More Sports
(05-21-2020 02:23 PM)Carolina_Low_Country Wrote:  
(05-20-2020 09:00 AM)ken d Wrote:  
(05-20-2020 08:03 AM)Carolina_Low_Country Wrote:  
(05-20-2020 02:35 AM)BruceMcF Wrote:  
(05-20-2020 02:16 AM)Carolina_Low_Country Wrote:  Not true I budget is $15M more than it used to be we just had a AD who spent money like Congress and I don’t even mean using money on facilities etc. He hired too many people for the athletic dept and too many of his friends from NIU and gave them all a large salary and spent a ton on travel and entertainment. On top of that he killed our football program by firing a good coach and replaced with a terrible coach. We have just got to get back to being lean and mean like we were during Terry Holland’s regime.

It does help during a budget crisis if there is actually fat to cut, so you don't have to start the process by cutting into spending that contributes to program success.
We used to have a surplus until Compher showed up.

In the grand scheme of things, a $4 million dollar athletic budget deficit isn't all that big by G5 standards. And it doesn't have to closed entirely by cutting sports. The fact that ECU's 20 sports (which includes cheerleading as one of the women's sports) is one of the most in what arguably is the strongest G5 conference tells a lot about why the G5 don't have the autonomous status that P5 conferences do.
I'm not sure where you get your info as cheerleading is not a NCAA sport and does not count. We have 16 sports
Mens: Indoor Track & Field, Outdoor Track & Field, Cross Country, Basketball, Football, Baseball, Golf
Womens: LAX, Volleyball, Golf, Softball, Indoor Track & Field, Outdoor Track & Field, Crosscountry

When I saw the initial report that ECU had 20 teams, I went to their website and counted them. They listed 19, and also mentioned their "spirit" team. The listed sports at that time did not include women's swimming and diving, so I incorrectly inferred that the 20th must be the cheerleading team. With their anouncement today, saying that they were dropping women's S&D, clearly that was one of the 20. They now have 7 men's teams and 9 women's (add basketball and soccer to your list) after the cuts.
(This post was last modified: 05-21-2020 04:07 PM by ken d.)
05-21-2020 03:08 PM
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HatterFan Offline
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Post: #65
RE: East Carolina on the Clock: Will Cut One or More Sports
I wonder what will happen to the remainder of AAC swimming. There are now only 2 men's programs (SMU and Cincinnati) and 4 women's programs (SMU, Cincinnati, Houston and Tulane). Perhaps they will disperse to other more regional conferences as affiliate members.

Tennis, in many Division I leagues, is facing a numbers problem, but the American will be fine. They drop from 12 to 10 in women's tennis and from 10 to 8 in men's tennis. The auto bid minimum number is 6.
05-21-2020 03:47 PM
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GoldenWarrior11 Online
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Post: #66
RE: East Carolina on the Clock: Will Cut One or More Sports
(05-21-2020 03:47 PM)HatterFan Wrote:  I wonder what will happen to the remainder of AAC swimming. There are now only 2 men's programs (SMU and Cincinnati) and 4 women's programs (SMU, Cincinnati, Houston and Tulane). Perhaps they will disperse to other more regional conferences as affiliate members.

Tennis, in many Division I leagues, is facing a numbers problem, but the American will be fine. They drop from 12 to 10 in women's tennis and from 10 to 8 in men's tennis. The auto bid minimum number is 6.

Cincinnati would probably join as an affiliate with the Big East, if the AAC no longer sponsors it.
05-21-2020 06:31 PM
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ken d Online
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Post: #67
RE: East Carolina on the Clock: Will Cut One or More Sports
As more and more schools seem to be dropping sports, and not all the same ones, I wonder if this will provide some impetus to move away from all sports conferences below the P5 level. And if that were to happen, I wonder if we could see more schools belonging to different conferences for football and basketball. Clearly, not everybody within a conference is playing at the same level in all sports. And why should they need to?
05-21-2020 08:54 PM
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johnbragg Online
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Post: #68
RE: East Carolina on the Clock: Will Cut One or More Sports
(05-21-2020 08:54 PM)ken d Wrote:  As more and more schools seem to be dropping sports, and not all the same ones, I wonder if this will provide some impetus to move away from all sports conferences below the P5 level. And if that were to happen, I wonder if we could see more schools belonging to different conferences for football and basketball. Clearly, not everybody within a conference is playing at the same level in all sports. And why should they need to?

I think that will be strongly resisted by your conference outliers. If your school is not travel-friendly, (UTEP, NMSU, Idaho, St Bonaventure, UTRGV), you want other schools to be conference-obligated to come play you.
05-21-2020 09:02 PM
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BruceMcF Offline
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Post: #69
RE: East Carolina on the Clock: Will Cut One or More Sports
(05-21-2020 08:54 PM)ken d Wrote:  As more and more schools seem to be dropping sports, and not all the same ones, I wonder if this will provide some impetus to move away from all sports conferences below the P5 level. And if that were to happen, I wonder if we could see more schools belonging to different conferences for football and basketball. Clearly, not everybody within a conference is playing at the same level in all sports. And why should they need to?

Once a sport drops below half the schools in the division sponsoring it, there's the option of single sport conferences for that sport, as is common in Hockey.

Single sport FCS conferences are an option, but single sport FBS conferences would require a rules change. An unsurprising response to the proposal would be if you want that, drop your football down to FCS and you can have it.
(This post was last modified: 05-21-2020 09:24 PM by BruceMcF.)
05-21-2020 09:19 PM
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XLance Offline
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Post: #70
RE: East Carolina on the Clock: Will Cut One or More Sports
IN the paper this morning: East Carolina cuts 4 sports, Men's and Women's tennis as well as men's and women's swimming and diving.
The article blames the firing of Ruffin McNeill for putting ECU in a financial bind.
05-22-2020 07:13 AM
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GTFletch Offline
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Post: #71
RE: East Carolina on the Clock: Will Cut One or More Sports
East Carolina University cuts four sports due to coronavirus

According to a release from ECU, the action is being taken as part of the school's budget restructuring efforts and is part of an in-depth analysis of ECU's athletics financial position during the ongoing COVID-19 pandemic.

Link
https://www.wfmynews2.com/article/sports...d0ac9f2e88
05-22-2020 07:16 AM
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GTFletch Offline
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Post: #72
RE: East Carolina on the Clock: Will Cut One or More Sports
I think with UConn leaving, ECU recent issues, and with ESPN wanting to renegotiate the TV deal after UCONN left shows why the AAC is not Power league. While the P-6 strategy was nice just nothing more than a gimmick. Maybe a few (Houston, SMU, UCF, USF, Memphis, Cincy) get another look at by the BIG12 during renegotiationof the TV contract that expires 2025...
05-22-2020 07:25 AM
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Chappy Offline
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Post: #73
RE: East Carolina on the Clock: Will Cut One or More Sports
(05-22-2020 07:13 AM)XLance Wrote:  IN the paper this morning: East Carolina cuts 4 sports, Men's and Women's tennis as well as men's and women's swimming and diving.
The article blames the firing of Ruffin McNeill for putting ECU in a financial bind.

It certainly remains a controversial move, but I'd say that and other poor decisions by Jeff Compher and Cecil Stanton's decision to extend Jeff Compher put us in this pickle.
05-22-2020 07:57 AM
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quo vadis Online
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Post: #74
RE: East Carolina on the Clock: Will Cut One or More Sports
(05-22-2020 07:25 AM)GTFletch Wrote:  I think with UConn leaving, ECU recent issues, and with ESPN wanting to renegotiate the TV deal after UCONN left shows ...

Yes, remember when some AAC fans were saying ESPN would just let the AAC keep the whole contract amount after UConn left and divide it one fewer ways so the rest of the AAC would in effect get a raise?

Wishful thinking is prevalent around here.

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05-22-2020 08:43 AM
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ken d Online
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Post: #75
RE: East Carolina on the Clock: Will Cut One or More Sports
(05-21-2020 09:19 PM)BruceMcF Wrote:  
(05-21-2020 08:54 PM)ken d Wrote:  As more and more schools seem to be dropping sports, and not all the same ones, I wonder if this will provide some impetus to move away from all sports conferences below the P5 level. And if that were to happen, I wonder if we could see more schools belonging to different conferences for football and basketball. Clearly, not everybody within a conference is playing at the same level in all sports. And why should they need to?

Once a sport drops below half the schools in the division sponsoring it, there's the option of single sport conferences for that sport, as is common in Hockey.

Single sport FCS conferences are an option, but single sport FBS conferences would require a rules change. An unsurprising response to the proposal would be if you want that, drop your football down to FCS and you can have it.

Does that mean that if 66 FBS schools offer a sport, but one particular conference doesn't have enough of its members offering it, the ones who do must play as independents? I'm not familiar with that rule.
05-22-2020 09:03 AM
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Post: #76
RE: East Carolina on the Clock: Will Cut One or More Sports
(05-22-2020 08:43 AM)quo vadis Wrote:  
(05-22-2020 07:25 AM)GTFletch Wrote:  I think with UConn leaving, ECU recent issues, and with ESPN wanting to renegotiate the TV deal after UCONN left shows ...

Yes, remember when some AAC fans were saying ESPN would just let the AAC keep the whole contract amount after UConn left and divide it one fewer ways so the rest of the AAC would in effect get a raise?

Wishful thinking is prevalent around here.

07-coffee3

I read that ESPN was actually going to be paying the AAC more money. UConn was hurting its average annual value, not to mention hurting football and men's basketball.

Still eagerly waiting for the VCU addition as a non-football addition, since they are a better basketball program than UConn anyways.

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05-22-2020 10:02 AM
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Post: #77
RE: East Carolina on the Clock: Will Cut One or More Sports
(05-22-2020 10:02 AM)GoldenWarrior11 Wrote:  Still eagerly waiting for the VCU addition as a non-football addition, since they are a better basketball program than UConn anyways.

This is not true. Connecticut may be down but UConn is a modern blue-blood. The school has so much success over the last 20 years or so. It is unfortunate that the Huskies basketball program took a nosedive. It happens.
05-22-2020 10:07 AM
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Post: #78
RE: East Carolina on the Clock: Will Cut One or More Sports
(05-22-2020 09:03 AM)ken d Wrote:  
(05-21-2020 09:19 PM)BruceMcF Wrote:  
(05-21-2020 08:54 PM)ken d Wrote:  As more and more schools seem to be dropping sports, and not all the same ones, I wonder if this will provide some impetus to move away from all sports conferences below the P5 level. And if that were to happen, I wonder if we could see more schools belonging to different conferences for football and basketball. Clearly, not everybody within a conference is playing at the same level in all sports. And why should they need to?

Once a sport drops below half the schools in the division sponsoring it, there's the option of single sport conferences for that sport, as is common in Hockey.

Single sport FCS conferences are an option, but single sport FBS conferences would require a rules change. An unsurprising response to the proposal would be if you want that, drop your football down to FCS and you can have it.

Does that mean that if 66 FBS schools offer a sport, but one particular conference doesn't have enough of its members offering it, the ones who do must play as independents? I'm not familiar with that rule.

Single-sport conferences are always an option, except for FBS football and 99% basketball. (FBS Conference has a list of requirements attached to it, and basketball is very central to how NCAA organizes conferences).

The drawback to single-sport conferences is that your conference has to sponsor a certain number and combination of sports. So if the SBC and CUSA members (favorite topic of the board) create a couple of regional women's soccer conferences, SBC and CUSA are short a women's team sport. (I did not check this against actual lists, it's a hypothetical).

Waht I think he means is that if less than half of a division plays a sport, you can play cross-division like in hockey.
05-22-2020 10:12 AM
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Post: #79
RE: East Carolina on the Clock: Will Cut One or More Sports
(05-22-2020 10:07 AM)chess Wrote:  
(05-22-2020 10:02 AM)GoldenWarrior11 Wrote:  Still eagerly waiting for the VCU addition as a non-football addition, since they are a better basketball program than UConn anyways.

This is not true. Connecticut may be down but UConn is a modern blue-blood. The school has so much success over the last 20 years or so. It is unfortunate that the Huskies basketball program took a nosedive. It happens.

SSSSSSSSSArcasm.
05-22-2020 10:13 AM
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RE: East Carolina on the Clock: Will Cut One or More Sports
(05-22-2020 10:13 AM)johnbragg Wrote:  
(05-22-2020 10:07 AM)chess Wrote:  
(05-22-2020 10:02 AM)GoldenWarrior11 Wrote:  Still eagerly waiting for the VCU addition as a non-football addition, since they are a better basketball program than UConn anyways.

This is not true. Connecticut may be down but UConn is a modern blue-blood. The school has so much success over the last 20 years or so. It is unfortunate that the Huskies basketball program took a nosedive. It happens.

SSSSSSSSSArcasm.

04-cheers
05-22-2020 10:14 AM
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