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345 Small Private Colleges And Universities Could Close Down In The Next 6 Years
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DavidSt Offline
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345 Small Private Colleges And Universities Could Close Down In The Next 6 Years
With No On Campus Classes In The Fall

If schools on campus classes in the fall moves to online due to COVId-19, many students may skip a year because of it. Notre Dame in California, Concordia-Portland, Urbana and now Holy Family, we may see more schools starting to close for good in the next 6 years.
05-06-2020 01:06 PM
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Captain Bearcat Offline
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RE: 345 Small Private Colleges And Universities Could Close Down In The Next 6 Years
There's 4 big new pressures on universities right now due to coronavirus:

1) real estate revenue - most universities have major investments in dormitories. If classes are all online for the fall, they can't charge rent.

2) hospital revenue - some universities are attached to major hospitals. Hospitals are hemorrhaging cash right now.

3) state government revenue - most states will be forced to decrease support for higher education because coronavirus has reduced tax revenues

4) price pressure at universities with higher sticker prices - students won't pay $50k/year for online classes when a state school will offer the same classes for $15k/year.
05-06-2020 01:24 PM
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The Cutter of Bish Offline
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RE: 345 Small Private Colleges And Universities Could Close Down In The Next 6 Years
More than 5% of schools have less than 90 days worth of money to operate? Yeah, I’m thinking some serious conversations need to happen across higher education.
05-06-2020 02:00 PM
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AZcats Offline
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RE: 345 Small Private Colleges And Universities Could Close Down In The Next 6 Years
(05-06-2020 01:06 PM)DavidSt Wrote:  With No On Campus Classes In The Fall

If schools on campus classes in the fall moves to online due to COVId-19, many students may skip a year because of it. Notre Dame in California, Concordia-Portland, Urbana and now Holy Family, we may see more schools starting to close for good in the next 6 years.

Stop posting if you can't post correct information. Concordia-Portland announced their closing more than a month BEFORE the shut down making it unrelated to the virus. Notre Dame de Namur cancelled the lacrosse season in January indicating the school was already having difficulties. NDNU has NOT CLOSED yet. The virus may have played a part of Urbana closing but they almost closed in 2014 and have been on life support since.
05-06-2020 03:24 PM
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Frank the Tank Offline
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RE: 345 Small Private Colleges And Universities Could Close Down In The Next 6 Years
(05-06-2020 02:00 PM)The Cutter of Bish Wrote:  More than 5% of schools have less than 90 days worth of money to operate? Yeah, I’m thinking some serious conversations need to happen across higher education.

Unfortunately, this pandemic has exposed that there are lots of businesses across lots of industries that are in similar (and many times worse) situations.
05-06-2020 03:44 PM
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The Cutter of Bish Offline
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RE: 345 Small Private Colleges And Universities Could Close Down In The Next 6 Years
(05-06-2020 03:44 PM)Frank the Tank Wrote:  
(05-06-2020 02:00 PM)The Cutter of Bish Wrote:  More than 5% of schools have less than 90 days worth of money to operate? Yeah, I’m thinking some serious conversations need to happen across higher education.

Unfortunately, this pandemic has exposed that there are lots of businesses across lots of industries that are in similar (and many times worse) situations.

I expect that for businesses. I expect that for churches. But, I think employees and members tend to know about that.

When I see a stat like that, I think about sudden closures and the number of students who never know what’s going on until the decision is made. It’s for the students at those schools I feel for, because I suspect institutions selfishly withhold that from students to keep the money coming in until it’s too late.
05-06-2020 06:51 PM
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RE: 345 Small Private Colleges And Universities Could Close Down In The Next 6 Years
(05-06-2020 03:44 PM)Frank the Tank Wrote:  
(05-06-2020 02:00 PM)The Cutter of Bish Wrote:  More than 5% of schools have less than 90 days worth of money to operate? Yeah, I’m thinking some serious conversations need to happen across higher education.

Unfortunately, this pandemic has exposed that there are lots of businesses across lots of industries that are in similar (and many times worse) situations.

Some statistics shows about 80% of Americans live paycheck to paycheck. I suspect it’s a bit higher. I would think then that a similar number of businesses operate month to month or quarter to quarter and a bad month or quarter would ruin them.
05-06-2020 07:42 PM
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Love and Honor Offline
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RE: 345 Small Private Colleges And Universities Could Close Down In The Next 6 Years
(05-06-2020 01:24 PM)Captain Bearcat Wrote:  There's 4 big new pressures on universities right now due to coronavirus:

1) real estate revenue - most universities have major investments in dormitories. If classes are all online for the fall, they can't charge rent.

2) hospital revenue - some universities are attached to major hospitals. Hospitals are hemorrhaging cash right now.

3) state government revenue - most states will be forced to decrease support for higher education because coronavirus has reduced tax revenues

4) price pressure at universities with higher sticker prices - students won't pay $50k/year for online classes when a state school will offer the same classes for $15k/year.

Some random points:

1. Since my freshman year at Miami we've built 7 brand new dorms, completely renovated 9 existing ones, and replaced 3 dining halls with new ones. Online classes mean we have a bunch of debt built up for assets that aren't making any money, I doubt we're alone.
2. My dad works for WashU Med in St. Louis, they're projecting a $150 million loss this year under current trends with most of that is driven by the school. It's a very large system compared to most med schools out there, but it is telling.
3. Yep, though I think relative public funding for universities has been stagnant or declining for awhile now. Miami got something like 25% of its revenues from Ohio in the seventies, it's now under 10. I'm sure that's especially the case for schools in states with big financial issues like Illinois. Not like private schools will be immune either, people struggling to make ends meet or drowning in debt don't donate to their alma mater.
4. Absolutely. Higher ed has been a borderline Ponzi scheme for a generation or so, it's overdue for a correction in terms of price against return. Unfortunately this is what's triggering it.

A former Miami president used to teach a class called 'History of Miami University', one semester was posted to Youtube and I've been listening to it lately as a podcast of sorts. He stated that there was something like 540 colleges at the start of the Civil War but a decade after it ended there were less than 90 left; I doubt we see 80% go belly up like that, but this will be a bloodbath relative to what we've gotten used to.
05-06-2020 08:14 PM
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DavidSt Offline
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RE: 345 Small Private Colleges And Universities Could Close Down In The Next 6 Years
05-15-2020 07:24 PM
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esayem Offline
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RE: 345 Small Private Colleges And Universities Could Close Down In The Next 6 Years
Do we NEED as many colleges as we have?
05-15-2020 07:46 PM
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RE: 345 Small Private Colleges And Universities Could Close Down In The Next 6 Years
(05-15-2020 07:24 PM)DavidSt Wrote:  Wells College Could Close Down For Good

Darn it. They have an awesome name: the Express, that I wish one of the major league expansion franchises adopted.
05-15-2020 08:54 PM
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DavidSt Offline
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RE: 345 Small Private Colleges And Universities Could Close Down In The Next 6 Years
(05-15-2020 07:46 PM)esayem Wrote:  Do we NEED as many colleges as we have?


I think we have so much overlapping of schools in the same town would be better off working together as a hybrid like Delaware and Galluadet could be.

Detroit Mercy and Wayne State can merge to make a hybrid. Wayne State-Mercy would get Detroit Mercy a better deal as Wayne State is an R1 institute with football. Endowment is better as well.

Wilberforce and Central State, Ohio

IUPUI and Indianapolis which IUPUI could drop IUPU to become University of Indianapolis.

Alfred and Alfred State is another one

Daytona State and Bethune-Cookman Daytona State is a CC in Florida which could become a four year school.

Jacksonville and North Florida could merge and football be brought back.
05-15-2020 09:06 PM
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Wedge Offline
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RE: 345 Small Private Colleges And Universities Could Close Down In The Next 6 Years
(05-06-2020 03:24 PM)AZcats Wrote:  
(05-06-2020 01:06 PM)DavidSt Wrote:  With No On Campus Classes In The Fall

If schools on campus classes in the fall moves to online due to COVId-19, many students may skip a year because of it. Notre Dame in California, Concordia-Portland, Urbana and now Holy Family, we may see more schools starting to close for good in the next 6 years.

Stop posting if you can't post correct information. Concordia-Portland announced their closing more than a month BEFORE the shut down making it unrelated to the virus. Notre Dame de Namur cancelled the lacrosse season in January indicating the school was already having difficulties. NDNU has NOT CLOSED yet. The virus may have played a part of Urbana closing but they almost closed in 2014 and have been on life support since.


Right, they have had declining enrollment and financial difficulties for a long time. They appear to be planning to close down NDNU after the spring 2021 semester unless they miraculously get enough money to keep going. Because of the location, their campus would be insanely valuable as real estate, might be worth $100 million or more.
05-15-2020 09:06 PM
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RE: 345 Small Private Colleges And Universities Could Close Down In The Next 6 Years
(05-15-2020 09:06 PM)DavidSt Wrote:  IUPUI and Indianapolis which IUPUI could drop IUPU to become University of Indianapolis.

University of Indianapolis already exists.
05-16-2020 05:22 AM
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RE: 345 Small Private Colleges And Universities Could Close Down In The Next 6 Years
(05-06-2020 07:42 PM)BePcr07 Wrote:  
(05-06-2020 03:44 PM)Frank the Tank Wrote:  
(05-06-2020 02:00 PM)The Cutter of Bish Wrote:  More than 5% of schools have less than 90 days worth of money to operate? Yeah, I’m thinking some serious conversations need to happen across higher education.

Unfortunately, this pandemic has exposed that there are lots of businesses across lots of industries that are in similar (and many times worse) situations.

Some statistics shows about 80% of Americans live paycheck to paycheck. I suspect it’s a bit higher. ...

Note that the 20% is not limited to those with savings to let them subsist for a month or more ... it also includes those with less than a month's worth of saving who have the borrowing power to subsist for a month or more on borrowed money.

So, yes, as for as the percentage of Americans who do not have sufficient savings to go for a month or more without any income ... it's got to be substantially over 80%.

It's a lot lower here in China. For instance, while 80%+ of the funds for purchasing a car in the US are borrowed, on average, 80%+ of the funds for purchasing a car here in China are from savings.

We used to have an income-driven growth system in the US, back in the 50's and 60's, but now it's more of a debt-driven growth system.
(This post was last modified: 05-16-2020 05:40 AM by BruceMcF.)
05-16-2020 05:38 AM
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RE: 345 Small Private Colleges And Universities Could Close Down In The Next 6 Years
(05-15-2020 07:24 PM)DavidSt Wrote:  Wells College Could Close Down For Good

I grew up about a half hour from here. They went co-ed about 15 years back in an attempt to stay relevant. Between the school being closed and the stay at home orders impacting the businesses that provide funding for the foundation (several inns, 3 or 4 restauants, etc) since most of these have closed or are trying to survive in a takeout menu to a much smaller, less well heeled population base, I'm not shocked.
05-16-2020 08:10 AM
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RE: 345 Small Private Colleges And Universities Could Close Down In The Next 6 Years
(05-15-2020 09:06 PM)DavidSt Wrote:  
(05-15-2020 07:46 PM)esayem Wrote:  Do we NEED as many colleges as we have?


I think we have so much overlapping of schools in the same town would be better off working together as a hybrid like Delaware and Galluadet could be.

Detroit Mercy and Wayne State can merge to make a hybrid. Wayne State-Mercy would get Detroit Mercy a better deal as Wayne State is an R1 institute with football. Endowment is better as well.

Wilberforce and Central State, Ohio

IUPUI and Indianapolis which IUPUI could drop IUPU to become University of Indianapolis.

Alfred and Alfred State is another one

Daytona State and Bethune-Cookman Daytona State is a CC in Florida which could become a four year school.

Jacksonville and North Florida could merge and football be brought back.

Gallaudet is in DC, almost 2 hours from UD.

A lot of these mergers don't really make that much sense to me. What good does Jacksonville and North Florida merging do? They're different schools that attract different students. Just because they're in the same city doesn't mean it makes sense for them to merge.
05-16-2020 01:58 PM
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RE: 345 Small Private Colleges And Universities Could Close Down In The Next 6 Years
(05-16-2020 01:58 PM)TDenverFan Wrote:  
(05-15-2020 09:06 PM)DavidSt Wrote:  
(05-15-2020 07:46 PM)esayem Wrote:  Do we NEED as many colleges as we have?


I think we have so much overlapping of schools in the same town would be better off working together as a hybrid like Delaware and Galluadet could be.

Detroit Mercy and Wayne State can merge to make a hybrid. Wayne State-Mercy would get Detroit Mercy a better deal as Wayne State is an R1 institute with football. Endowment is better as well.

Wilberforce and Central State, Ohio

IUPUI and Indianapolis which IUPUI could drop IUPU to become University of Indianapolis.

Alfred and Alfred State is another one

Daytona State and Bethune-Cookman Daytona State is a CC in Florida which could become a four year school.

Jacksonville and North Florida could merge and football be brought back.

Gallaudet is in DC, almost 2 hours from UD.

A lot of these mergers don't really make that much sense to me. What good does Jacksonville and North Florida merging do? They're different schools that attract different students. Just because they're in the same city doesn't mean it makes sense for them to merge.

A private HBCU with a public community college makes no sense. Might as well throw Embry-Riddle in with them.
05-16-2020 02:04 PM
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RE: 345 Small Private Colleges And Universities Could Close Down In The Next 6 Years
Merge colleges & universities.

Trim/cut the 'worthless' programs, classes, & majors. This saves operating cost. Transform the other classes/programs/majors to be more focused on preparing students for a career - not memorizing things from a textbook to be forgotten after an exam but more on-the-job training. This would increase the public perception of the university as a whole.

Athletics: trim coaching salaries. I think this would go a long-ways.

Universities have been in an arms-race for the bigger & better buildings with lots of construction projects. While some might be necessary to attract students, instead of 5 buildings just build one. New dorm construction should be tossed to the wayside - most students opt to live in off-campus housing anyways.
05-16-2020 03:50 PM
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RE: 345 Small Private Colleges And Universities Could Close Down In The Next 6 Years
(05-16-2020 03:50 PM)Bronco14 Wrote:  Merge colleges & universities.

Trim/cut the 'worthless' programs, classes, & majors. This saves operating cost. Transform the other classes/programs/majors to be more focused on preparing students for a career - not memorizing things from a textbook to be forgotten after an exam but more on-the-job training. This would increase the public perception of the university as a whole.

Athletics: trim coaching salaries. I think this would go a long-ways.

Universities have been in an arms-race for the bigger & better buildings with lots of construction projects. While some might be necessary to attract students, instead of 5 buildings just build one. New dorm construction should be tossed to the wayside - most students opt to live in off-campus housing anyways.

Pretty much each of these recommendations can be summarized as "make it more like a public state college". Except for the one about lowering coach's salaries, because at small private colleges the salaries are already low. Coaches at schools like these who want to make a career of it go to grad school and take on additional "jobs" on campus like teaching, or an additional athletic department or administration role.

I suppose there could be some outliers, but evaluating programs as to whether they are "worthless" is an annual, ongoing task. If a school isn't already doing this, they are already either closed or so wealthy that they aren't on the list this thread is talking about. And their criteria for whether they are "worthless" is whether they are attracting students. The proverbial "intermediate basket weaving" major may sound worthless to you and me, but if it's attracting enough tuition paying students to justify it's existence, it's not worthless to the school or the students. And like I said, if it's not then the program is already on the way out or the school is too rich to care.

And, many small private colleges thrive on "residential" campuses. I went to one. It would have been a radically inferior experience to not be living with my fellow classmates on campus.

In short, small private colleges do these things to differentiate themselves from public or large private colleges. It's a different niche. That's what a lot of students want. Differentiation is how markets work. One size does not fit all.

Are there too many of them? Probably. But becoming more like public institutions won't save them.
05-16-2020 04:10 PM
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