(04-08-2020 08:58 AM)bullet Wrote:  Basketball doesn't count? Is that because you are in Georgia? UTEP (who also has a load of track championships)?

And of course Rice also has a baseball title.

I was referring to baseball. Didn't know Rice had one too, though I knew they were very good for a very long time. Track isn't a major. Who won one in basketball? Is this a ye olde title like UNLV?

(04-08-2020 08:18 AM)georgia_tech_swagger Wrote:  

(04-07-2020 01:44 PM)Herd6993 Wrote:  1. Marshall
2. ODU
3. UNCC
4. Appy
5. Coastal
6. GA Southern
7. WKU
8. MTSU

It's pretty easy to find your final two to bolt on. Choose your own adventure:
FAU and FIU (travel partner bonus savings)
UAB and Troy (travel partner bonus savings)
UAB and FAU (if access to both AL and FL is more important than the travel partner)
JMU and UAB (both of these could travel partner with existing membership ... App State and Georgia State respectively)

The biggest problem for these conferences is that they keep on adding FCS schools. That should be the last thing they do. 12 of these 24 southern schools are moveups in the last 15 years. Liberty also moved up in that time frame. 8 of the other 12 moved up between 1989 and 2002.

(04-07-2020 06:46 PM)Side Show Joe Wrote:  

(04-07-2020 05:07 PM)quo vadis Wrote:  

(04-06-2020 05:45 PM)Side Show Joe Wrote:  It is better that North Texas plays a Butch Davis coached FIU or Willie Tagart coached FAU, than play a Texas State team that has not won more than 3 games in any of the past 5 seasons. It's that simple.

Taggart and Davis won't be at FAU/FIU forever (and really, who cares if they are?), and Texas State is growing by leaps and bounds. They are a budding colossus.

If I were North Texas, I'd want to get on their good side.

I'll go ahead and bold the most important part of this post. I guess you didn't read the whole thing.

I'd much rather North Texas travel to Florida every year and play teams that go bowling. We want to conference with the best competition we can. Geography is secondary to quality.

By the way North Texas is a larger university. We are the 5th largest university in Texas with an enrollment of 39,454. Texas State is close, but currently not larger. They have an enrollment of 38,848. Plus, North Texas is a Carnegie Tier 1 research university. Texas State is not.

I would say the bolded part is least important. Sure, a few programs win (Ohio State) or lose (Vandy) all the time, but for most schools wins and losses will come and go, are no basis to make conference decisions on. That's certainly true of FAU and FIU.

(04-08-2020 09:13 AM)quo vadis Wrote:  

(04-07-2020 06:46 PM)Side Show Joe Wrote:  

(04-07-2020 05:07 PM)quo vadis Wrote:  

(04-06-2020 05:45 PM)Side Show Joe Wrote:  It is better that North Texas plays a Butch Davis coached FIU or Willie Tagart coached FAU, than play a Texas State team that has not won more than 3 games in any of the past 5 seasons. It's that simple.

Taggart and Davis won't be at FAU/FIU forever (and really, who cares if they are?), and Texas State is growing by leaps and bounds. They are a budding colossus.

If I were North Texas, I'd want to get on their good side.

I'll go ahead and bold the most important part of this post. I guess you didn't read the whole thing.

I'd much rather North Texas travel to Florida every year and play teams that go bowling. We want to conference with the best competition we can. Geography is secondary to quality.

By the way North Texas is a larger university. We are the 5th largest university in Texas with an enrollment of 39,454. Texas State is close, but currently not larger. They have an enrollment of 38,848. Plus, North Texas is a Carnegie Tier 1 research university. Texas State is not.

I would say the bolded part is least important. Sure, a few programs win (Ohio State) or lose (Vandy) all the time, but for most schools wins and losses will come and go, are no basis to make conference decisions on. That's certainly true of FAU and FIU.

We are going to have to agree to disagree. In my opinion, Texas State does nothing for North Texas. UTSA is located 50 miles from Texas State, and UTSA is in San Antonio. I know UTSA hasn't done much, but I don't think Texas State has their potential either, so there is no need to overlap in that region. But, if UTSA was a small private school, I'd probably feel differently.

Like I stated, North Texas needs to focus on conferencing with the best programs we can, not looking for cheap local bus games no one will care about. We are building facilities, improving recruiting, improving our OOC scheduling, and growing our budget. Those things are not being done just so we can move to a regional conference no one will care about.

North Texas can only do what we can do. I'm sure we would jump at an AAC invitation, but that is beyond our control. So, we will make the best of being in C-USA and build our athletic programs. No whining, and not excuses.

(04-08-2020 10:01 AM)Side Show Joe Wrote:  

(04-08-2020 09:13 AM)quo vadis Wrote:  

(04-07-2020 06:46 PM)Side Show Joe Wrote:  

(04-07-2020 05:07 PM)quo vadis Wrote:  

(04-06-2020 05:45 PM)Side Show Joe Wrote:  It is better that North Texas plays a Butch Davis coached FIU or Willie Tagart coached FAU, than play a Texas State team that has not won more than 3 games in any of the past 5 seasons. It's that simple.

Taggart and Davis won't be at FAU/FIU forever (and really, who cares if they are?), and Texas State is growing by leaps and bounds. They are a budding colossus.

If I were North Texas, I'd want to get on their good side.

I'll go ahead and bold the most important part of this post. I guess you didn't read the whole thing.

I'd much rather North Texas travel to Florida every year and play teams that go bowling. We want to conference with the best competition we can. Geography is secondary to quality.

By the way North Texas is a larger university. We are the 5th largest university in Texas with an enrollment of 39,454. Texas State is close, but currently not larger. They have an enrollment of 38,848. Plus, North Texas is a Carnegie Tier 1 research university. Texas State is not.

I would say the bolded part is least important. Sure, a few programs win (Ohio State) or lose (Vandy) all the time, but for most schools wins and losses will come and go, are no basis to make conference decisions on. That's certainly true of FAU and FIU.

We are going to have to agree to disagree. In my opinion, Texas State does nothing for North Texas. UTSA is located 50 miles from Texas State, and UTSA is in San Antonio. I know UTSA hasn't done much, but I don't think Texas State has their potential either, so there is no need to overlap in that region. But, if UTSA was a small private school, I'd probably feel differently.

Like I stated, North Texas needs to focus on conferencing with the best programs we can, not looking for cheap local bus games no one will care about. We are building facilities, improving recruiting, improving our OOC scheduling, and growing our budget. Those things are not being done just so we can move to a regional conference no one will care about.

North Texas can only do what we can do. I'm sure we would jump at an AAC invitation, but that is beyond our control. So, we will make the best of being in C-USA and build our athletic programs. No whining, and not excuses.

THANK YOU, what you said basically applies the exact same way for Louisiana.

(04-08-2020 10:22 AM)Cajuns1252 Wrote:  

(04-08-2020 10:01 AM)Side Show Joe Wrote:  

(04-08-2020 09:13 AM)quo vadis Wrote:  

(04-07-2020 06:46 PM)Side Show Joe Wrote:  

(04-07-2020 05:07 PM)quo vadis Wrote:  Taggart and Davis won't be at FAU/FIU forever (and really, who cares if they are?), and Texas State is growing by leaps and bounds. They are a budding colossus.

If I were North Texas, I'd want to get on their good side.

I'll go ahead and bold the most important part of this post. I guess you didn't read the whole thing.

I'd much rather North Texas travel to Florida every year and play teams that go bowling. We want to conference with the best competition we can. Geography is secondary to quality.

By the way North Texas is a larger university. We are the 5th largest university in Texas with an enrollment of 39,454. Texas State is close, but currently not larger. They have an enrollment of 38,848. Plus, North Texas is a Carnegie Tier 1 research university. Texas State is not.

I would say the bolded part is least important. Sure, a few programs win (Ohio State) or lose (Vandy) all the time, but for most schools wins and losses will come and go, are no basis to make conference decisions on. That's certainly true of FAU and FIU.

We are going to have to agree to disagree. In my opinion, Texas State does nothing for North Texas. UTSA is located 50 miles from Texas State, and UTSA is in San Antonio. I know UTSA hasn't done much, but I don't think Texas State has their potential either, so there is no need to overlap in that region. But, if UTSA was a small private school, I'd probably feel differently.

Like I stated, North Texas needs to focus on conferencing with the best programs we can, not looking for cheap local bus games no one will care about. We are building facilities, improving recruiting, improving our OOC scheduling, and growing our budget. Those things are not being done just so we can move to a regional conference no one will care about.

North Texas can only do what we can do. I'm sure we would jump at an AAC invitation, but that is beyond our control. So, we will make the best of being in C-USA and build our athletic programs. No whining, and not excuses.

THANK YOU, what you said basically applies the exact same way for Louisiana.

So you don't think in state teams generate more interest from casual fans and thus encourage ticket sales?

(04-08-2020 10:01 AM)Side Show Joe Wrote:  

(04-08-2020 09:13 AM)quo vadis Wrote:  

(04-07-2020 06:46 PM)Side Show Joe Wrote:  

(04-07-2020 05:07 PM)quo vadis Wrote:  

(04-06-2020 05:45 PM)Side Show Joe Wrote:  It is better that North Texas plays a Butch Davis coached FIU or Willie Tagart coached FAU, than play a Texas State team that has not won more than 3 games in any of the past 5 seasons. It's that simple.

Taggart and Davis won't be at FAU/FIU forever (and really, who cares if they are?), and Texas State is growing by leaps and bounds. They are a budding colossus.

If I were North Texas, I'd want to get on their good side.

I'll go ahead and bold the most important part of this post. I guess you didn't read the whole thing.

I'd much rather North Texas travel to Florida every year and play teams that go bowling. We want to conference with the best competition we can. Geography is secondary to quality.

By the way North Texas is a larger university. We are the 5th largest university in Texas with an enrollment of 39,454. Texas State is close, but currently not larger. They have an enrollment of 38,848. Plus, North Texas is a Carnegie Tier 1 research university. Texas State is not.

I would say the bolded part is least important. Sure, a few programs win (Ohio State) or lose (Vandy) all the time, but for most schools wins and losses will come and go, are no basis to make conference decisions on. That's certainly true of FAU and FIU.

We are going to have to agree to disagree. In my opinion, Texas State does nothing for North Texas. UTSA is located 50 miles from Texas State, and UTSA is in San Antonio. I know UTSA hasn't done much, but I don't think Texas State has their potential either, so there is no need to overlap in that region. But, if UTSA was a small private school, I'd probably feel differently.

Like I stated, North Texas needs to focus on conferencing with the best programs we can, not looking for cheap local bus games no one will care about. We are building facilities, improving recruiting, improving our OOC scheduling, and growing our budget. Those things are not being done just so we can move to a regional conference no one will care about.

North Texas can only do what we can do. I'm sure we would jump at an AAC invitation, but that is beyond our control. So, we will make the best of being in C-USA and build our athletic programs. No whining, and not excuses.

I appreciate your POV, no problem with disagreeing to agree (LOL).

FWIW though, I just looked at FAU's football record the past 5 years. Sure, they have two 11-3 seasons. But they also have two 3-9 seasons, with a 5-7 in there too. Not exactly a juggernaut on the field. FIU also has 3 losing seasons in the last 5, and their best record during that time is 9-4. These are not world-beaters. FAU is barely above .500 for those years, FIU is below .500.

I agree with the idea of partnering with the best schools you can, I just don't think that necessarily means traveling far afield (the Ivy Leagus is a regional conference), and as I don't see any real quality difference between the SB and CUSA schools, so in that case, geography does IMO matter.

I also think you underestimate Texas State. Potential? They are growing by leaps and bounds. Unlike UTSA and UNT, they aren't in a big metro footprint, but that is actually working to their advantage. Their location is kind of epicenter among Austin, San Antonio, and even Houston, allowing them to draw from all of those places. They are close enough for kids located in the Austin or San Antonio area to commute if they want, but far enough for them to "get away from home" if they want that experience too.

Anyway. Cheers!

(04-08-2020 09:04 AM)georgia_tech_swagger Wrote:  

(04-08-2020 08:58 AM)bullet Wrote:  Basketball doesn't count? Is that because you are in Georgia? UTEP (who also has a load of track championships)?

And of course Rice also has a baseball title.

I was referring to baseball. Didn't know Rice had one too, though I knew they were very good for a very long time. Track isn't a major. Who won one in basketball? Is this a ye olde title like UNLV?

Texas Western (UTEP)

They made a movie about it.

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/1965%E2%80...tball_team

(04-08-2020 09:04 AM)bullet Wrote:  

(04-08-2020 08:18 AM)georgia_tech_swagger Wrote:  

(04-07-2020 01:44 PM)Herd6993 Wrote:  1. Marshall
2. ODU
3. UNCC
4. Appy
5. Coastal
6. GA Southern
7. WKU
8. MTSU

It's pretty easy to find your final two to bolt on. Choose your own adventure:
FAU and FIU (travel partner bonus savings)
UAB and Troy (travel partner bonus savings)
UAB and FAU (if access to both AL and FL is more important than the travel partner)
JMU and UAB (both of these could travel partner with existing membership ... App State and Georgia State respectively)

The biggest problem for these conferences is that they keep on adding FCS schools. That should be the last thing they do. 12 of these 24 southern schools are moveups in the last 15 years. Liberty also moved up in that time frame. 8 of the other 12 moved up between 1989 and 2002.

JMU has been a G5 in all but name for years. Compare school size, fan support, national titles/success, athletics budget, facilities, academics (finally getting Carnegie national classification), etc and JMU would be at least in the top half of CUSA/Sun Belt. We've just been held back by lackluster leadership.

(04-08-2020 11:00 AM)CitrusUCF Wrote:  

(04-08-2020 10:22 AM)Cajuns1252 Wrote:  

(04-08-2020 10:01 AM)Side Show Joe Wrote:  

(04-08-2020 09:13 AM)quo vadis Wrote:  

(04-07-2020 06:46 PM)Side Show Joe Wrote:  I'll go ahead and bold the most important part of this post. I guess you didn't read the whole thing.

I'd much rather North Texas travel to Florida every year and play teams that go bowling. We want to conference with the best competition we can. Geography is secondary to quality.

By the way North Texas is a larger university. We are the 5th largest university in Texas with an enrollment of 39,454. Texas State is close, but currently not larger. They have an enrollment of 38,848. Plus, North Texas is a Carnegie Tier 1 research university. Texas State is not.

I would say the bolded part is least important. Sure, a few programs win (Ohio State) or lose (Vandy) all the time, but for most schools wins and losses will come and go, are no basis to make conference decisions on. That's certainly true of FAU and FIU.

We are going to have to agree to disagree. In my opinion, Texas State does nothing for North Texas. UTSA is located 50 miles from Texas State, and UTSA is in San Antonio. I know UTSA hasn't done much, but I don't think Texas State has their potential either, so there is no need to overlap in that region. But, if UTSA was a small private school, I'd probably feel differently.

Like I stated, North Texas needs to focus on conferencing with the best programs we can, not looking for cheap local bus games no one will care about. We are building facilities, improving recruiting, improving our OOC scheduling, and growing our budget. Those things are not being done just so we can move to a regional conference no one will care about.

North Texas can only do what we can do. I'm sure we would jump at an AAC invitation, but that is beyond our control. So, we will make the best of being in C-USA and build our athletic programs. No whining, and not excuses.

THANK YOU, what you said basically applies the exact same way for Louisiana.

So you don't think in state teams generate more interest from casual fans and thus encourage ticket sales?

Other then LaTech ABSOLUTELY NOT ULM doesn’t even travel to Lafayette when we play, the two teams that I’ve seen from in state that travel well are Southern and Grambling and they arnt leaving the SWAC nor do I want them too. Also why would I want to be in a Conference with UTEP when App State is a much better team and the drive to Boone is close then the drive to El Paso from Lafayette

(04-08-2020 02:19 PM)Cajuns1252 Wrote:  

(04-08-2020 11:00 AM)CitrusUCF Wrote:  

(04-08-2020 10:22 AM)Cajuns1252 Wrote:  

(04-08-2020 10:01 AM)Side Show Joe Wrote:  

(04-08-2020 09:13 AM)quo vadis Wrote:  I would say the bolded part is least important. Sure, a few programs win (Ohio State) or lose (Vandy) all the time, but for most schools wins and losses will come and go, are no basis to make conference decisions on. That's certainly true of FAU and FIU.

We are going to have to agree to disagree. In my opinion, Texas State does nothing for North Texas. UTSA is located 50 miles from Texas State, and UTSA is in San Antonio. I know UTSA hasn't done much, but I don't think Texas State has their potential either, so there is no need to overlap in that region. But, if UTSA was a small private school, I'd probably feel differently.

Like I stated, North Texas needs to focus on conferencing with the best programs we can, not looking for cheap local bus games no one will care about. We are building facilities, improving recruiting, improving our OOC scheduling, and growing our budget. Those things are not being done just so we can move to a regional conference no one will care about.

North Texas can only do what we can do. I'm sure we would jump at an AAC invitation, but that is beyond our control. So, we will make the best of being in C-USA and build our athletic programs. No whining, and not excuses.

THANK YOU, what you said basically applies the exact same way for Louisiana.

So you don't think in state teams generate more interest from casual fans and thus encourage ticket sales?

Other then LaTech ABSOLUTELY NOT ULM doesn’t even travel to Lafayette when we play, the two teams that I’ve seen from in state that travel well are Southern and Grambling and they arnt leaving the SWAC nor do I want them too. Also why would I want to be in a Conference with UTEP when App State is a much better team and the drive to Boone is close then the drive to El Paso from Lafayette

UTEP is a giant outlier for anybody but the MWC. The question is whether you would rather have UTSA and UNT instead of App. For recruiting purposes, probably does a lot for you.

(04-08-2020 02:46 PM)CitrusUCF Wrote:  

(04-08-2020 02:19 PM)Cajuns1252 Wrote:  

(04-08-2020 11:00 AM)CitrusUCF Wrote:  

(04-08-2020 10:22 AM)Cajuns1252 Wrote:  

(04-08-2020 10:01 AM)Side Show Joe Wrote:  We are going to have to agree to disagree. In my opinion, Texas State does nothing for North Texas. UTSA is located 50 miles from Texas State, and UTSA is in San Antonio. I know UTSA hasn't done much, but I don't think Texas State has their potential either, so there is no need to overlap in that region. But, if UTSA was a small private school, I'd probably feel differently.

Like I stated, North Texas needs to focus on conferencing with the best programs we can, not looking for cheap local bus games no one will care about. We are building facilities, improving recruiting, improving our OOC scheduling, and growing our budget. Those things are not being done just so we can move to a regional conference no one will care about.

North Texas can only do what we can do. I'm sure we would jump at an AAC invitation, but that is beyond our control. So, we will make the best of being in C-USA and build our athletic programs. No whining, and not excuses.

THANK YOU, what you said basically applies the exact same way for Louisiana.

So you don't think in state teams generate more interest from casual fans and thus encourage ticket sales?

Other then LaTech ABSOLUTELY NOT ULM doesn’t even travel to Lafayette when we play, the two teams that I’ve seen from in state that travel well are Southern and Grambling and they arnt leaving the SWAC nor do I want them too. Also why would I want to be in a Conference with UTEP when App State is a much better team and the drive to Boone is close then the drive to El Paso from Lafayette

UTEP is a giant outlier for anybody but the MWC. The question is whether you would rather have UTSA and UNT instead of App. For recruiting purposes, probably does a lot for you.

I would mind having UNT and but as far as UTSA, App state any day. If I had to choose App or UNT it would still be App. The only C-USA Texas team I would want to be with would be Rice and sorry Texas State I really like San Marcos but would trade Texas state for Rice in a heart beat.

(04-08-2020 09:04 AM)georgia_tech_swagger Wrote:  

(04-08-2020 08:58 AM)bullet Wrote:  Basketball doesn't count? Is that because you are in Georgia? UTEP (who also has a load of track championships)?

And of course Rice also has a baseball title.

I was referring to baseball. Didn't know Rice had one too, though I knew they were very good for a very long time. Track isn't a major. Who won one in basketball? Is this a ye olde title like UNLV?

UTEP won basketball. They even did a movie about it-all Black starting 5 in the 60s, the one gap in UCLA's streak. They were called Texas Western then.

Rice won in 2003 and went to 7 CWS in that era.

Here’s that statistical analysis I would apply if I had the raw data:

I’d sort the voters by the school they support.

I’d tally the results within each fanbase and take average score they assigned other schools—-

1= 1
2= .9
3= .8
4= .7
5= .6
6= .5
7= .4
8= .3
9= .2
Not Selected = 0

I’d then look to see what fan bases have mutual interest in each other and build out that way.

(04-08-2020 11:02 AM)quo vadis Wrote:  

(04-08-2020 10:01 AM)Side Show Joe Wrote:  

(04-08-2020 09:13 AM)quo vadis Wrote:  

(04-07-2020 06:46 PM)Side Show Joe Wrote:  

(04-07-2020 05:07 PM)quo vadis Wrote:  Taggart and Davis won't be at FAU/FIU forever (and really, who cares if they are?), and Texas State is growing by leaps and bounds. They are a budding colossus.

If I were North Texas, I'd want to get on their good side.

I'll go ahead and bold the most important part of this post. I guess you didn't read the whole thing.

I'd much rather North Texas travel to Florida every year and play teams that go bowling. We want to conference with the best competition we can. Geography is secondary to quality.

By the way North Texas is a larger university. We are the 5th largest university in Texas with an enrollment of 39,454. Texas State is close, but currently not larger. They have an enrollment of 38,848. Plus, North Texas is a Carnegie Tier 1 research university. Texas State is not.

I would say the bolded part is least important. Sure, a few programs win (Ohio State) or lose (Vandy) all the time, but for most schools wins and losses will come and go, are no basis to make conference decisions on. That's certainly true of FAU and FIU.

We are going to have to agree to disagree. In my opinion, Texas State does nothing for North Texas. UTSA is located 50 miles from Texas State, and UTSA is in San Antonio. I know UTSA hasn't done much, but I don't think Texas State has their potential either, so there is no need to overlap in that region. But, if UTSA was a small private school, I'd probably feel differently.

Like I stated, North Texas needs to focus on conferencing with the best programs we can, not looking for cheap local bus games no one will care about. We are building facilities, improving recruiting, improving our OOC scheduling, and growing our budget. Those things are not being done just so we can move to a regional conference no one will care about.

North Texas can only do what we can do. I'm sure we would jump at an AAC invitation, but that is beyond our control. So, we will make the best of being in C-USA and build our athletic programs. No whining, and not excuses.

I appreciate your POV, no problem with disagreeing to agree (LOL).

FWIW though, I just looked at FAU's football record the past 5 years. Sure, they have two 11-3 seasons. But they also have two 3-9 seasons, with a 5-7 in there too. Not exactly a juggernaut on the field. FIU also has 3 losing seasons in the last 5, and their best record during that time is 9-4. These are not world-beaters. FAU is barely above .500 for those years, FIU is below .500.

I agree with the idea of partnering with the best schools you can, I just don't think that necessarily means traveling far afield (the Ivy Leagus is a regional conference), and as I don't see any real quality difference between the SB and CUSA schools, so in that case, geography does IMO matter.

I also think you underestimate Texas State. Potential? They are growing by leaps and bounds. Unlike UTSA and UNT, they aren't in a big metro footprint, but that is actually working to their advantage. Their location is kind of epicenter among Austin, San Antonio, and even Houston, allowing them to draw from all of those places. They are close enough for kids located in the Austin or San Antonio area to commute if they want, but far enough for them to "get away from home" if they want that experience too.

Anyway. Cheers!

Thanks.

Yes, FAU/FIU have some weak seasons in the last five years, but their most recent seasons have them trending up. And, I think that will continue under Taggart and Davis.

Overall, sure their isn't much difference between C-USA and the Sun Belt. But, when you look at each division, the Sun Belt West's footprint just has too much baggage. The teams in C-USA West have no need or desire to conference with ULM, or basketball only UT-A & A- Little Rock. In my opinion, there are just not enough quality regional programs within a "bus league" distance, to make up for what we already enjoy in C-USA. And, I believe being too regional would hurt recruiting and national relevance. Given C-USA's media deal (or lack there of), we can't afford to lose more ground in that regard. The overall strength of a program's football still trumps everything in my book.

I don't view Texas State's location as a positive at all. They are located between Austin and San Antonio, and both cities have large public universities already playing in the FBS, with more success than Texas State. Texas State will always be playing second fiddle to both in those cities.

I thank you for your thoughtful opinion, but I still feel it is in UNT's best interest to help stabilize C-USA until a better configuration can be attained.

(04-08-2020 05:00 PM)Side Show Joe Wrote:  

(04-08-2020 11:02 AM)quo vadis Wrote:  

(04-08-2020 10:01 AM)Side Show Joe Wrote:  

(04-08-2020 09:13 AM)quo vadis Wrote:  

(04-07-2020 06:46 PM)Side Show Joe Wrote:  I'll go ahead and bold the most important part of this post. I guess you didn't read the whole thing.

I'd much rather North Texas travel to Florida every year and play teams that go bowling. We want to conference with the best competition we can. Geography is secondary to quality.

By the way North Texas is a larger university. We are the 5th largest university in Texas with an enrollment of 39,454. Texas State is close, but currently not larger. They have an enrollment of 38,848. Plus, North Texas is a Carnegie Tier 1 research university. Texas State is not.

I would say the bolded part is least important. Sure, a few programs win (Ohio State) or lose (Vandy) all the time, but for most schools wins and losses will come and go, are no basis to make conference decisions on. That's certainly true of FAU and FIU.

We are going to have to agree to disagree. In my opinion, Texas State does nothing for North Texas. UTSA is located 50 miles from Texas State, and UTSA is in San Antonio. I know UTSA hasn't done much, but I don't think Texas State has their potential either, so there is no need to overlap in that region. But, if UTSA was a small private school, I'd probably feel differently.

Like I stated, North Texas needs to focus on conferencing with the best programs we can, not looking for cheap local bus games no one will care about. We are building facilities, improving recruiting, improving our OOC scheduling, and growing our budget. Those things are not being done just so we can move to a regional conference no one will care about.

North Texas can only do what we can do. I'm sure we would jump at an AAC invitation, but that is beyond our control. So, we will make the best of being in C-USA and build our athletic programs. No whining, and not excuses.

I appreciate your POV, no problem with disagreeing to agree (LOL).

FWIW though, I just looked at FAU's football record the past 5 years. Sure, they have two 11-3 seasons. But they also have two 3-9 seasons, with a 5-7 in there too. Not exactly a juggernaut on the field. FIU also has 3 losing seasons in the last 5, and their best record during that time is 9-4. These are not world-beaters. FAU is barely above .500 for those years, FIU is below .500.

I agree with the idea of partnering with the best schools you can, I just don't think that necessarily means traveling far afield (the Ivy Leagus is a regional conference), and as I don't see any real quality difference between the SB and CUSA schools, so in that case, geography does IMO matter.

I also think you underestimate Texas State. Potential? They are growing by leaps and bounds. Unlike UTSA and UNT, they aren't in a big metro footprint, but that is actually working to their advantage. Their location is kind of epicenter among Austin, San Antonio, and even Houston, allowing them to draw from all of those places. They are close enough for kids located in the Austin or San Antonio area to commute if they want, but far enough for them to "get away from home" if they want that experience too.

Anyway. Cheers!

Thanks.

Yes, FAU/FIU have some weak seasons in the last five years, but their most recent seasons have them trending up. And, I think that will continue under Taggart and Davis.

Overall, sure their isn't much difference between C-USA and the Sun Belt. But, when you look at each division, the Sun Belt West's footprint just has too much baggage. The teams in C-USA West have no need or desire to conference with ULM, or basketball only UT-A & A- Little Rock. In my opinion, there are just not enough quality regional programs within a "bus league" distance, to make up for what we already enjoy in C-USA. And, I believe being too regional would hurt recruiting and national relevance. Given C-USA's media deal (or lack there of), we can't afford to lose more ground in that regard. The overall strength of a program's football still trumps everything in my book.

I don't view Texas State's location as a positive at all. They are located between Austin and San Antonio, and both cities have large public universities already playing in the FBS, with more success than Texas State. Texas State will always be playing second fiddle to both in those cities.

I thank you for your thoughtful opinion, but I still feel it is in UNT's best interest to help stabilize C-USA until a better configuration can be attained.

Yea man, I completely agree with this from a sunbelt point we have baggage (sunbelt west) and like you said C-USA West also has baggage and you can that much baggage in one conference together. You’d see schools like UNT, LaTech, UL, Arkansas State, Southern Miss get tired of it go independent and it would all fall apart....plain and simple and small geographic footprint is just as bad as one too big.

(04-08-2020 05:00 PM)Side Show Joe Wrote:  

(04-08-2020 11:02 AM)quo vadis Wrote:  

(04-08-2020 10:01 AM)Side Show Joe Wrote:  

(04-08-2020 09:13 AM)quo vadis Wrote:  

(04-07-2020 06:46 PM)Side Show Joe Wrote:  I'll go ahead and bold the most important part of this post. I guess you didn't read the whole thing.

I'd much rather North Texas travel to Florida every year and play teams that go bowling. We want to conference with the best competition we can. Geography is secondary to quality.

By the way North Texas is a larger university. We are the 5th largest university in Texas with an enrollment of 39,454. Texas State is close, but currently not larger. They have an enrollment of 38,848. Plus, North Texas is a Carnegie Tier 1 research university. Texas State is not.

I would say the bolded part is least important. Sure, a few programs win (Ohio State) or lose (Vandy) all the time, but for most schools wins and losses will come and go, are no basis to make conference decisions on. That's certainly true of FAU and FIU.

We are going to have to agree to disagree. In my opinion, Texas State does nothing for North Texas. UTSA is located 50 miles from Texas State, and UTSA is in San Antonio. I know UTSA hasn't done much, but I don't think Texas State has their potential either, so there is no need to overlap in that region. But, if UTSA was a small private school, I'd probably feel differently.

Like I stated, North Texas needs to focus on conferencing with the best programs we can, not looking for cheap local bus games no one will care about. We are building facilities, improving recruiting, improving our OOC scheduling, and growing our budget. Those things are not being done just so we can move to a regional conference no one will care about.

North Texas can only do what we can do. I'm sure we would jump at an AAC invitation, but that is beyond our control. So, we will make the best of being in C-USA and build our athletic programs. No whining, and not excuses.

I appreciate your POV, no problem with disagreeing to agree (LOL).

FWIW though, I just looked at FAU's football record the past 5 years. Sure, they have two 11-3 seasons. But they also have two 3-9 seasons, with a 5-7 in there too. Not exactly a juggernaut on the field. FIU also has 3 losing seasons in the last 5, and their best record during that time is 9-4. These are not world-beaters. FAU is barely above .500 for those years, FIU is below .500.

I agree with the idea of partnering with the best schools you can, I just don't think that necessarily means traveling far afield (the Ivy Leagus is a regional conference), and as I don't see any real quality difference between the SB and CUSA schools, so in that case, geography does IMO matter.

I also think you underestimate Texas State. Potential? They are growing by leaps and bounds. Unlike UTSA and UNT, they aren't in a big metro footprint, but that is actually working to their advantage. Their location is kind of epicenter among Austin, San Antonio, and even Houston, allowing them to draw from all of those places. They are close enough for kids located in the Austin or San Antonio area to commute if they want, but far enough for them to "get away from home" if they want that experience too.

Anyway. Cheers!

Thanks.

Yes, FAU/FIU have some weak seasons in the last five years, but their most recent seasons have them trending up. And, I think that will continue under Taggart and Davis.

Overall, sure their isn't much difference between C-USA and the Sun Belt. But, when you look at each division, the Sun Belt West's footprint just has too much baggage. The teams in C-USA West have no need or desire to conference with ULM, or basketball only UT-A & A- Little Rock. In my opinion, there are just not enough quality regional programs within a "bus league" distance, to make up for what we already enjoy in C-USA. And, I believe being too regional would hurt recruiting and national relevance. Given C-USA's media deal (or lack there of), we can't afford to lose more ground in that regard. The overall strength of a program's football still trumps everything in my book.

I don't view Texas State's location as a positive at all. They are located between Austin and San Antonio, and both cities have large public universities already playing in the FBS, with more success than Texas State. Texas State will always be playing second fiddle to both in those cities.

I thank you for your thoughtful opinion, but I still feel it is in UNT's best interest to help stabilize C-USA until a better configuration can be attained.

Only way I see regional conferences working is if this played out and this is a big Maybe, let the Eastern schools do their thing

Conference one with travel partners:

Louisiana -USM
Rice -UNT
Arkansas state -LaTech
Troy-UAB


Conference 2:
NMSU
UTEP
UTSA
TXST
ULM
USA
2 FCS move ups or get UTA and UALR start football

(04-08-2020 08:53 AM)ballantyneapp Wrote:  

(04-08-2020 08:28 AM)Rabonchild Wrote:  South Eastern Atlantic (SEA)

Charlotte
ODU
Liberty
Appalachian
Coastal
Georgia St.
Georgia Southern
FAU
FIU
Marshall
VCU - basketball
Charleston - basketball

I can get on board with this, although to be honest non AAC conference affiliation isn't as important to me. Sunbelt has been just fine to us.

However, if we were going to do something like this, it is my strongest preference that we take out Liberty and insert JMU. The quad of App-JMU-UNCC-ODU stand to make a bunch of extra $$$ each year from playing each other.

I prefer no FCS.