(03-31-2020 01:11 PM)cr11owl Wrote:  

(03-31-2020 12:48 PM)elw4796 Wrote:  If somebody who purportedly came to Rice because of the education transfers, you have to ask the question of what the hell happened during the season, or after the season ended, that made him want to leave. Others have said this, but not all schools have this issue. We know Rice is a unique school, but good lord, it's not bad enough for 5 guys to leave every two years. And this is coming from somebody who's been publicly critical of the Rice student body and fanbase on multiple occasions.

Rhoades' guys left because Rhoades left. Pera's first class of guys left because they were stopgaps and probably didn't have as good relationships with Pera and his staff as other recruits. But what's the excuse here? If I were a betting man, I'd say one of Mullins and Moore is probably going to leave too.

What's worst is that we're probably going to need to fire Pera after next year, meaning that we're going to need to rebuild immediately after what appears to be another rebuild. And that probably means losing the majority of Sheffield, Poteat, Hutchins, and Ondigo (and whoever else Pera brings in), which is a legitimately good class.

*Transfer list is updated. Rice now up to 32.3 ppg, 17.6 rpg, 6.1 apg in lost production and back to where it rightfully belongs as the team hardest hit by transfers

Pathetic. Every man for himself now.

To the point of what changed... why stay at Rice and play on a mediocre team in front of no crowds when your teammate who had a comparable season to you transfers and has 30 schools contact him in 1 day? That’s the mentality these days.

Feel bad for Pera but that should probably be it. I don’t even think the majority of this is his fault. Make the right hire and the class coming in might stay together.

I agree it's not all, and maybe even most, on Pera. Our transfer numbers are not unique even within CUSA. That tells us all we need to know: main culprit here is NCAA. So, until something changes at the rules/regs level, I'm no longer watching MBB

I really can't see this is a coach issue. Pera may not be the second coming of Coach K, but having been to games in the last 2 years at Kansas, Duke and Penn, there just is something wrong. The last opportunity to deal with our issues was in the 90's. Sadly, just imagine the teams that we could have had without all these transfers. One would think they can see this and realize that if they had stayed that maybe something could have been achieved and develop an atmosphere and culture. Not the Braun group with the exception of Arsalan-that seem to be a bunch of mercenaries, but all these others?

I have been a fan for 50 years (yes I got to see the SWC team) and there is nothing better than live college basketball (should have seen it at the Palestra in the late 70's/early 80's), but this is getting more and more difficult. I have 8 season tickets-4 seats just to help, but the interest in going by friends to sit in my good seats is just fading away.

I was getting optimistic for next year-this is really awful along the same lines as Connor leaving. LSU hiring the VCU coach really may have destroyed our last hope.

I just don't know what can be done and this is just one more straw on the way to DIII.

The transfers may be symptomatic of a failing system, but I still haven't seen enough from Pera. Maybe the solution is a staff adjustment and trying to bring in a defensive ace.

Quote:Mark Berman
@MarkBermanFox26
·
12m
.
@RiceBasketball
G/F
@Drewpeterson23
on transferring: “I had a great couple of years at Rice.Being in the transfer postal I’m looking for a bigger school..looking to get a lot of wins & make the March Madness tournament. I’m all ears & looking to c what I get out of this process”

(03-31-2020 01:42 PM)waltgreenberg Wrote:  

Quote:Mark Berman
@MarkBermanFox26
·
12m
.
@RiceBasketball
G/F
@Drewpeterson23
on transferring: “I had a great couple of years at Rice.Being in the transfer postal I’m looking for a bigger school..looking to get a lot of wins & make the March Madness tournament. I’m all ears & looking to c what I get out of this process”

Should we ask the NCAA to officially classify us as minor league?

I’m in an argument offline with a recent ex-Rice athlete about this. I was told that every player should be allowed to do what is “best for them” and to these guys it’s usually playing at a big school and making the NCAA tournament and “Rice will never do that”.

(03-31-2020 01:53 PM)cr11owl Wrote:  

(03-31-2020 01:42 PM)waltgreenberg Wrote:  

Quote:Mark Berman
@MarkBermanFox26
·
12m
.
@RiceBasketball
G/F
@Drewpeterson23
on transferring: “I had a great couple of years at Rice.Being in the transfer postal I’m looking for a bigger school..looking to get a lot of wins & make the March Madness tournament. I’m all ears & looking to c what I get out of this process”

Should we ask the NCAA to officially classify us as minor league?

I’m in an argument offline with a recent ex-Rice athlete about this. I was told that every player should be allowed to do what is “best for them” and to these guys it’s usually playing at a big school and making the NCAA tournament and “Rice will never do that”.

I fail to see why Rice can't make the NCAA tournament when MTSU, ODU, etc do (and get wins in the tournament).

The reality is that we hire **** coaches who can't get us out of the cellar of our own conference.

There are lots of teams that have several transfers per year in our conference. Not many teams who are as consistently in the cellar as us. That says something about the coaching.

(03-31-2020 01:57 PM)ExcitedOwl18 Wrote:  

(03-31-2020 01:53 PM)cr11owl Wrote:  

(03-31-2020 01:42 PM)waltgreenberg Wrote:  

Quote:Mark Berman
@MarkBermanFox26
·
12m
.
@RiceBasketball
G/F
@Drewpeterson23
on transferring: “I had a great couple of years at Rice.Being in the transfer postal I’m looking for a bigger school..looking to get a lot of wins & make the March Madness tournament. I’m all ears & looking to c what I get out of this process”

Should we ask the NCAA to officially classify us as minor league?

I’m in an argument offline with a recent ex-Rice athlete about this. I was told that every player should be allowed to do what is “best for them” and to these guys it’s usually playing at a big school and making the NCAA tournament and “Rice will never do that”.

I fail to see why Rice can't make the NCAA tournament when MTSU, ODU, etc do (and get wins in the tournament).

The reality is that we hire **** coaches who can't get us out of the cellar of our own conference.

There are lots of teams that have several transfers per year in our conference. Not many teams who are as consistently in the cellar as us. That says something about the coaching.

I responded the same way. Apparently the attitude is: “ Accomplishments on a small team don’t amount to much. They want to play with better people. Being a standout in conference USA doesn’t mean ****”.

We’ve done this to ourselves by falling into a garbage conference with no peers. This is a BOT/president level problem. The only way we’re ever going to have a chance at this point is to be lucky or have some unique identity as a team.

(03-31-2020 02:02 PM)cr11owl Wrote:  

(03-31-2020 01:57 PM)ExcitedOwl18 Wrote:  

(03-31-2020 01:53 PM)cr11owl Wrote:  

(03-31-2020 01:42 PM)waltgreenberg Wrote:  

Quote:Mark Berman
@MarkBermanFox26
·
12m
.
@RiceBasketball
G/F
@Drewpeterson23
on transferring: “I had a great couple of years at Rice.Being in the transfer postal I’m looking for a bigger school..looking to get a lot of wins & make the March Madness tournament. I’m all ears & looking to c what I get out of this process”

Should we ask the NCAA to officially classify us as minor league?

I’m in an argument offline with a recent ex-Rice athlete about this. I was told that every player should be allowed to do what is “best for them” and to these guys it’s usually playing at a big school and making the NCAA tournament and “Rice will never do that”.

I fail to see why Rice can't make the NCAA tournament when MTSU, ODU, etc do (and get wins in the tournament).

The reality is that we hire **** coaches who can't get us out of the cellar of our own conference.

There are lots of teams that have several transfers per year in our conference. Not many teams who are as consistently in the cellar as us. That says something about the coaching.

I responded the same way. Apparently the attitude is: “ Accomplishments on a small team don’t amount to much. They want to play with better people. Being a standout in conference USA doesn’t mean ****”.

We’ve done this to ourselves by falling into a garbage conference with no peers. This is a BOT/president level problem. The only way we’re ever going to have a chance at this point is to be lucky or have some unique identity as a team.

Overall institutional commitment, yes...

I really don't think it has to do with the conference though.

From an average attendance POV, C-USA is no worse than the WCC. Do you think Gonzaga players get hyped to go play at University of Portland (a smaller school than Rice)? Loyola Marymount?

Iona has made the tournament 5 or 6 times in the last decade and plays at schools like Niagara, Canisius, St. Peters, Rider, etc... Not even map dots and many of which resemble TRUE high school gyms (trust me, I've been in several of them). And then, their coach leaves because of health issues and they go hire Rick Pitino (not endorsing Rice do that-but shows that they care). They CARE, Rice doesn't.

(03-31-2020 02:11 PM)ExcitedOwl18 Wrote:  

(03-31-2020 02:02 PM)cr11owl Wrote:  

(03-31-2020 01:57 PM)ExcitedOwl18 Wrote:  

(03-31-2020 01:53 PM)cr11owl Wrote:  

(03-31-2020 01:42 PM)waltgreenberg Wrote:  

Should we ask the NCAA to officially classify us as minor league?

I’m in an argument offline with a recent ex-Rice athlete about this. I was told that every player should be allowed to do what is “best for them” and to these guys it’s usually playing at a big school and making the NCAA tournament and “Rice will never do that”.

I fail to see why Rice can't make the NCAA tournament when MTSU, ODU, etc do (and get wins in the tournament).

The reality is that we hire **** coaches who can't get us out of the cellar of our own conference.

There are lots of teams that have several transfers per year in our conference. Not many teams who are as consistently in the cellar as us. That says something about the coaching.

I responded the same way. Apparently the attitude is: “ Accomplishments on a small team don’t amount to much. They want to play with better people. Being a standout in conference USA doesn’t mean ****”.

We’ve done this to ourselves by falling into a garbage conference with no peers. This is a BOT/president level problem. The only way we’re ever going to have a chance at this point is to be lucky or have some unique identity as a team.

Overall institutional commitment, yes...

I really don't think it has to do with the conference though.

From an average attendance POV, C-USA is no worse than the WCC. Do you think Gonzaga players get hyped to go play at University of Portland (a smaller school than Rice)? Loyola Marymount?

Iona has made the tournament 5 or 6 times in the last decade and plays at schools like Niagara, Canisius, St. Peters, Rider, etc... Not even map dots and many of which resemble TRUE high school gyms (trust me, I've been in several of them). And then, their coach leaves because of health issues and they go hire Rick Pitino (not endorsing Rice do that-but shows that they care). They CARE, Rice doesn't.

Our conference is a symptom of lack of caring for 50 years. I agree though we should be able to win CUSA if we cared about basketball. Don’t think we’ve finished in the top 4 in the last 10 years and most of those years we were in the bottom 4.

Where I think our conference hurts us is we don’t play against any peers. There’s little overlap between our recruiting and LaTech or UNT. It seems almost 0 basketball players value a Rice degree over “the experience” so there goes our 1 selling point AND even if they do value the degree, they have a good season and can transfer to a comparable big state school. Not much difference in degree between UT and Rice for Murphy.

Let's not lose sight of the transfer epidemic in the entire system. Obviously Rice is not helping its case, but the entire system is bad. Not worth watching for me anymore.

Our last gasp died with Greenspan basically spitting on the AAC. Almost certainly if we had showed interest UH would have blocked us but then there should have been an all out push to rejoin the MWC.

(03-31-2020 01:42 PM)waltgreenberg Wrote:  @Drewpeterson23
on transferring: “I had a great couple of years at Rice.Being in the transfer postal I’m looking for a bigger school..looking to get a lot of wins & make the March Madness tournament. I’m all ears & looking to c what I get out of this process”

So he played 2 years at Rice, will presumably have to sit out a year, then have 1 year of eligibility left? I guess he just wants a good seat for the games at his yet to be determined "dream school" as he will have to really impress to get the kind of playing time he would have had for 2 more years at Rice. Makes no sense to me.

Someone explain to me again why I should continue to spend thousands of dollars a year on season tickets and Owl Club support, not to mention travel expenses now that I no longer live in the Houston area? Maybe I should just funnel those funds to the Bulverde Little League.

(03-31-2020 04:49 PM)Tomball Owl Wrote:  

(03-31-2020 01:42 PM)waltgreenberg Wrote:  @Drewpeterson23
on transferring: “I had a great couple of years at Rice.Being in the transfer postal I’m looking for a bigger school..looking to get a lot of wins & make the March Madness tournament. I’m all ears & looking to c what I get out of this process”

So he played 2 years at Rice, will presumably have to sit out a year, then have 1 year of eligibility left? I guess he just wants a good seat for the games at his yet to be determined "dream school" as he will have to really impress to get the kind of playing time he would have had for 2 more years at Rice. Makes no sense to me.

Did JP ask Coach Pera about this seemingly dismal transfer situation in yesterday's "Rice Owls Insider" radio show? (The sound doesn't play for me.)

(03-31-2020 04:49 PM)Tomball Owl Wrote:  

(03-31-2020 01:42 PM)waltgreenberg Wrote:  @Drewpeterson23
on transferring: “I had a great couple of years at Rice.Being in the transfer postal I’m looking for a bigger school..looking to get a lot of wins & make the March Madness tournament. I’m all ears & looking to c what I get out of this process”

So he played 2 years at Rice, will presumably have to sit out a year, then have 1 year of eligibility left? I guess he just wants a good seat for the games at his yet to be determined "dream school" as he will have to really impress to get the kind of playing time he would have had for 2 more years at Rice. Makes no sense to me.

Someone explain to me again why I should continue to spend thousands of dollars a year on season tickets and Owl Club support, not to mention travel expenses now that I no longer live in the Houston area? Maybe I should just funnel those funds to the Bulverde Little League.

I haven't been called since the Corona outbreak began, but Rice is already on my $hit list and they are getting no money from me (granted my total spend was in $500-700 range vs. thousands).

I have made it clear to the people that call me, both from athletics and academics, that I won't give money to either until Rice does one of the following 1) makes a bowl game 2) makes the NCAA tournament in MBB or 3) hosts a regional in baseball or advances to a super regional.

Then, they did no favors to my opinion of them when denied my sister (six years younger than me) from school earlier this year when her stats were squarely in the middle 50% of the admissions profile. I know other posters on this forum have had their children/loved ones denied by Rice, so I know the story isn't unique. It's like they don't want to build tradition/family legacy in the same way that Ivy league schools do (given that we follow in their direction in many other ways)...

(03-31-2020 05:19 PM)ExcitedOwl18 Wrote:  Then, they did no favors to my opinion of them when denied my sister (six years younger than me) from school earlier this year when her stats were squarely in the middle 50% of the admissions profile. I know other posters on this forum have had their children/loved ones denied by Rice, so I know the story isn't unique. It's like they don't want to build tradition/family legacy in the same way that Ivy league schools do (given that we follow in their direction in many other ways)...

At the risk of diverging this thread farther off-topic ... it was a humbling experience being an alumni interviewer for many years. Nearly all the applicants I talked with (none of them potential "legacy" candidates) were fabulous! Three-quarters of them I would have loved to have as my own child. But only 1/4 -- or fewer -- were admitted.

Ivy League universities are larger than Rice. But that means they also have more alums, who presumably would want THEIR children to be legacy admits. And they are even more selective than Rice, too.

Aside from great grades, I wonder what makes the difference in the Ivies' legacy admissions decisions. Does the donation potential (or history) of their alumni parents play a significant role? Do Ivies actually admit a higher fraction of their alumni's children than Rice does?

(03-31-2020 04:49 PM)Tomball Owl Wrote:  

(03-31-2020 01:42 PM)waltgreenberg Wrote:  @Drewpeterson23
on transferring: “I had a great couple of years at Rice.Being in the transfer postal I’m looking for a bigger school..looking to get a lot of wins & make the March Madness tournament. I’m all ears & looking to c what I get out of this process”

So he played 2 years at Rice, will presumably have to sit out a year, then have 1 year of eligibility left? I guess he just wants a good seat for the games at his yet to be determined "dream school" as he will have to really impress to get the kind of playing time he would have had for 2 more years at Rice. Makes no sense to me.

Someone explain to me again why I should continue to spend thousands of dollars a year on season tickets and Owl Club support, not to mention travel expenses now that I no longer live in the Houston area? Maybe I should just funnel those funds to the Bulverde Little League.

Same discussion here for about the last year.

Seeing the quote from Drew, I think the issues are a sad combination of (1) size, (2) campus life, (3) conference and (4) tough academics

Others are able to overcome 1 or more of these. There are small ACC schools, but they are in the ACC. Small ones-Gonzaga, Butler, Villanova but conferences, easier academics overcome that.

I think this may be just about the end. Hope I am wrong. but 4 mass exodus in 8 years and other keys like Cashaw and one of the players from the first one left a year later is really really bad.

(03-31-2020 04:04 PM)Tiki Owl Wrote:  Our last gasp died with Greenspan basically spitting on the AAC. Almost certainly if we had showed interest UH would have blocked us but then there should have been an all out push to rejoin the MWC.

Rick, but those who hired Rick most of all-delivered the coup de grace-we've just been fooling ourselves since then. We didn't get the message when the SWC broke up and kept not digesting it since then.

(03-31-2020 04:49 PM)Tomball Owl Wrote:  

(03-31-2020 01:42 PM)waltgreenberg Wrote:  @Drewpeterson23
on transferring: “I had a great couple of years at Rice.Being in the transfer postal I’m looking for a bigger school..looking to get a lot of wins & make the March Madness tournament. I’m all ears & looking to c what I get out of this process”

So he played 2 years at Rice, will presumably have to sit out a year, then have 1 year of eligibility left? I guess he just wants a good seat for the games at his yet to be determined "dream school" as he will have to really impress to get the kind of playing time he would have had for 2 more years at Rice. Makes no sense to me.

Someone explain to me again why I should continue to spend thousands of dollars a year on season tickets and Owl Club support, not to mention travel expenses now that I no longer live in the Houston area? Maybe I should just funnel those funds to the Bulverde Little League.

Peterson/Murphy can both use their redshirt during their "sit out" year. They'll retain two years of eligibility at their new schools

(03-31-2020 05:53 PM)Almadenmike Wrote:  

(03-31-2020 05:19 PM)ExcitedOwl18 Wrote:  Then, they did no favors to my opinion of them when denied my sister (six years younger than me) from school earlier this year when her stats were squarely in the middle 50% of the admissions profile. I know other posters on this forum have had their children/loved ones denied by Rice, so I know the story isn't unique. It's like they don't want to build tradition/family legacy in the same way that Ivy league schools do (given that we follow in their direction in many other ways)...

At the risk of diverging this thread farther off-topic ... it was a humbling experience being an alumni interviewer for many years. Nearly all the applicants I talked with (none of them potential "legacy" candidates) were fabulous! Three-quarters of them I would have loved to have as my own child. But only 1/4 -- or fewer -- were admitted.

Ivy League universities are larger than Rice. But that means they also have more alums, who presumably would want THEIR children to be legacy admits. And they are even more selective than Rice, too.

Aside from great grades, I wonder what makes the difference in the Ivies' legacy admissions decisions. Does the donation potential (or history) of their alumni parents play a significant role? Do Ivies actually admit a higher fraction of their alumni's children than Rice does?

https://www.cnbc.com/2019/04/07/harvards...egacy.html

Per this article, it is much, much easier to get into Ivies as a legacy than not as a legacy.

No idea what Rice's legacy percentage is... But it's nowhere close to 30%... Maybe in the 7-8% range?