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Could this be death of one or more of directional schools
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klake87 Offline
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Post: #41
RE: Could this be death of one or more of directional schools
(03-29-2020 06:49 PM)MaddDawgz02 Wrote:  Even if there is part of a football season this year, which is looking increasingly more unlikely, they should not penalize season ticket holders for not renewing and losing their seats for 2021. Season ticket holders should be able to retain seats 2021

There is no waiting list. People are not waiting to get season tickets by attrition
03-29-2020 07:23 PM
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calvin12 Offline
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Post: #42
RE: Could this be death of one or more of directional schools
(03-23-2020 07:35 AM)klake87 Wrote:  
(03-23-2020 07:02 AM)HuskieJ Wrote:  I hope everyone realizes that the catering of the market with exponentially expand the Pension crisis in Illinois. Progressive tax or not the state is headed for insolvency. You can not raise taxes high enough to cover the mounting pension debt. When people can contribute $200k towards their pension, retire at 50, then get $100k+ per year for life with a 3% cola each year, there is no hope. This situation will just bring the end sooner. We should really worry about more than losing a few directional schools.

That is why Dick Durbin is holding up the stimulus package. He knows illinois needs 100 billion to cover all dumb decisions Illinois politicians have made. The state coffers are zero. The gas tax is 100% down from projections. Tolls are down. Unemployed people make less money so income tax payments down. 8 billion backlog on unpaid Bill's, this will double in 3 months. Pension assets down 25% or more. Grim outlook

Gas tax is down 100%, you're staying there is zero gas tax revenue for that to happen. Tolls are not relevant, they don't go to the state general fund, they are held entirely in the toll authority, and state funds do not pay for any toll authority business.
03-29-2020 09:40 PM
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NIU84 Offline
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Post: #43
RE: Could this be death of one or more of directional schools
Some ramblings:
16,609 kids enrolled at NIU in 2019. We've always had a big percentage of commuter students too, that's not the number that live on campus.

The economy takes a historic hit. NIU caters to lower/middle class kids, that part of the economy is hit hard, so I'm thinking we should expect a much lower enrollment #s (at NIU and all schools). Tell me if you think otherwise, just discussing here.

So, what does NIU look like at, say, 15000 kids, with more commuter students and now more online only kids? And, everyone still thinking 'social distancing'. For the coming football season, just forget about in person attendance. Open only small sections of the stands, and, yes, cut way down on the hot dogs sold :). But, no lines at the endzone pub!!!! Just be glad if we can actually play a full season with a full or near full roster! If I'm watching a game in September, I'll be thrilled.

Closing a school or 2 ? These are the times that trigger those types of changes.
Why not just have a North, Central and South school in Illinois? North? in Chicago. Central? Champaign. South, one of the SIU campuses. Those schools would thrive. Yes, no NIU, no ISU, no WIU/EIU. Forget about enrollment based on SAT/ACT test scores and grades, many schools do this now. Kids sink or swim, maybe they get a 2nd chance, but if you can't cut it at one of these 3 big schools, you attend community college or a private school. We limit the options the state provides, and thus cut costs. We completely restructure, no more Illinois Board of Regents, one school administrative agency.

Am I way off? God I hope so, just throwing it out there to see if anyone responds. I've got cabin fever.
(This post was last modified: 03-29-2020 11:58 PM by NIU84.)
03-29-2020 11:58 PM
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MaddDawgz02 Offline
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Post: #44
RE: Could this be death of one or more of directional schools
(03-29-2020 07:23 PM)klake87 Wrote:  
(03-29-2020 06:49 PM)MaddDawgz02 Wrote:  Even if there is part of a football season this year, which is looking increasingly more unlikely, they should not penalize season ticket holders for not renewing and losing their seats for 2021. Season ticket holders should be able to retain seats 2021

There is no waiting list. People are not waiting to get season tickets by attrition

I just meant if you did not want to lose your current seat locations hopefully they will develop a policy where you can opt not to buy tickets this year and be able to get those same tickets for 2021
03-30-2020 01:37 AM
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pvk75 Offline
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Post: #45
RE: Could this be death of one or more of directional schools
Some STH may also figure that if they're not renewing for 2020, why pay the required HAF "donation." Hope that doesn't happen, but it could also complicate renewal of same seats for 2021.

(R.e. Klake87: "There is no waiting list. People are not waiting to get season tickets by attrition." There used to be a waiting list. Back in the day, it took me several years to work my way down to row 12 on the 40 yard line. How things change.)

One of the biggest financial questions is this: student athletic fees provide just over 1/3 of athletic department revenue, so if there are no sports, or reduced sports, what happens to those fees? I believe the fee is based on credit hours per semester.

Big argument for fees is students get free admission to on-campus athletic events. But ... free admission to what?!

It's a big deal, especially to full-time students. Over the average 5 years it seems to take to earn a bachelor's degree these days, the total fee is almost $5,000. That's too big for some to pay out-of-pocket, so some include it in their student loans, on which they pay interest during the loan payoff.

This could open a whole new big can of worms, and not just at NIU.

(Notes: March 9, 2020, NBC reported study of 2017-18 revenues and fees. NIU got $9.1 million from fees of $25.8 million total revenues = 35%. Annual average fee $987.)
(This post was last modified: 03-30-2020 05:24 AM by pvk75.)
03-30-2020 02:25 AM
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HuskieJ Offline
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Post: #46
RE: Could this be death of one or more of directional schools
(03-26-2020 09:45 PM)uiniu57 Wrote:  
(03-25-2020 09:50 AM)Prince Crossing Wrote:  As a career public sector employee, here is my 2 cents about the pension. My friends in the private sector all receive bonus, stock options and perks that public service employees (at least at my very large public sector employer) can’t dream of. All have BS degrees with no added certifications, my BS and MBA from NIU didn’t help me much salary wise. The 4 professional certifications I paid for with my money also didn’t help. My buds all receive a new company car each year, btw a couple of their wives usually drive them which is ok with the company bosses. These guys are upper management (same levels as I) and have been employed for over 30 years at their place of work. Also, their salary is significantly higher than mine. I am forced to put 4.5% of my salary into the state plan in addition to paying into social security. After 27.5 years in the pension plan, you get 50% of your salary (generally averaged over the last 4 years of employment).
For the past dozen or so years, my employer has doled out an annual COLA of 2%, regardless of whether the employee is a shining star or one who takes a potty/smoke break 20 minutes every hour. For most, the annual increase in the health insurance cost exceeded the raise amount.

Could I have chosen a different path, like my buddies? Of course, but I found a job I enjoyed and stayed with it. Here is my biggest issue, my employer made a contract with me - give me 4.5% of your salary every paycheck and we will pay you $x at the end of your career. This is backed by a law approved by the legislature.

Me and the other public workers in the plan lived up to our part of the contract, the state needs to honor their part.

Before anyone else criticizes those with a state pension, re-read the above where it says they lived up to their part of the contract. The fact is once again it is the politicians who borrowed from the pension fund and never replaced that money who created this mess.

That's not true either. I agree that they paid in the amount required, but the math to obligate the taxpayers to that contract was totally flawed. It really does not matter that they "borrowed" from a plan. No matter how much they put in it will eventually be required that nearly 100% of tax revenue go to cover pensions and not regular expenses. No one is blaming the people taking the money, but it has to be pointed out that it is not sustainable. All new state employees should have been moved to 401k style plans 10 years ago, but the public sector unions do not want to release the strangle hold they have on Illinois. Illinois Supreme court is going way beyond what the law states right now to not allow new employees into this death spiral system. I will be here unfortunately for 2 more years. Wish I could leave tomorrow, because nobody wants to treat this seriously enough. Also it used to be that state employees were had lower pay to offset benefits like the pensions. Now state and federal employees have higher pay scales than the private sector and they get the benefits. Does not seem that fair to me.
(This post was last modified: 03-30-2020 10:39 AM by HuskieJ.)
03-30-2020 10:36 AM
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GeorgeBorkFan Offline
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Post: #47
RE: Could this be death of one or more of directional schools
(03-30-2020 10:36 AM)HuskieJ Wrote:  Also it used to be that state employees were had lower pay to offset benefits like the pensions. Now state and federal employees have higher pay scales than the private sector and they get the benefits. Does not seem that fair to me.

Cite some specifics on pay for state and federal employees and how they are paid more than the private sector. Specifics.
03-30-2020 11:09 AM
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klake87 Offline
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Post: #48
RE: Could this be death of one or more of directional schools
(03-29-2020 09:40 PM)calvin12 Wrote:  
(03-23-2020 07:35 AM)klake87 Wrote:  
(03-23-2020 07:02 AM)HuskieJ Wrote:  I hope everyone realizes that the catering of the market with exponentially expand the Pension crisis in Illinois. Progressive tax or not the state is headed for insolvency. You can not raise taxes high enough to cover the mounting pension debt. When people can contribute $200k towards their pension, retire at 50, then get $100k+ per year for life with a 3% cola each year, there is no hope. This situation will just bring the end sooner. We should really worry about more than losing a few directional schools.

That is why Dick Durbin is holding up the stimulus package. He knows illinois needs 100 billion to cover all dumb decisions Illinois politicians have made. The state coffers are zero. The gas tax is 100% down from projections. Tolls are down. Unemployed people make less money so income tax payments down. 8 billion backlog on unpaid Bill's, this will double in 3 months. Pension assets down 25% or more. Grim outlook

Gas tax is down 100%, you're staying there is zero gas tax revenue for that to happen. Tolls are not relevant, they don't go to the state general fund, they are held entirely in the toll authority, and state funds do not pay for any toll authority business.

I audited the toll highway authority 30 years ago. How will they pay for all this road construction. Soon it will come to a halt. As far as other taxes, they are down significantly. People are not driving so gas consumption down a lot. Come November you will see the governor telling you services will be cut. Schools, social services, higher education. The state will be insolvent.
03-30-2020 01:30 PM
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Dog Fan Offline
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Post: #49
RE: Could this be death of one or more of directional schools
Aw gee, maybe all the unnecessary road construction will slow down. You know, where they tear up a road that they just repaired a year or two ago....or a road in perfect shape. Maybe we'll get to drive all summer without traffic jams. What a shame! I worry that those fat cat road construction companies won't have all those extra millions to stuff the pockets of the politicians. Yet another worry to keep me up at night!
03-30-2020 01:40 PM
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uiniu57 Offline
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Post: #50
RE: Could this be death of one or more of directional schools
(03-30-2020 10:36 AM)HuskieJ Wrote:  That's not true either. I agree that they paid in the amount required, but the math to obligate the taxpayers to that contract was totally flawed. It really does not matter that they "borrowed" from a plan. No matter how much they put in it will eventually be required that nearly 100% of tax revenue go to cover pensions and not regular expenses. No one is blaming the people taking the money, but it has to be pointed out that it is not sustainable. All new state employees should have been moved to 401k style plans 10 years ago, but the public sector unions do not want to release the strangle hold they have on Illinois. Illinois Supreme court is going way beyond what the law states right now to not allow new employees into this death spiral system. I will be here unfortunately for 2 more years. Wish I could leave tomorrow, because nobody wants to treat this seriously enough. Also it used to be that state employees were had lower pay to offset benefits like the pensions. Now state and federal employees have higher pay scales than the private sector and they get the benefits. Does not seem that fair to me.

Sorry but there are a few flaws in your post. No. 1, the money was in there and being added to in sufficient amounts to sustain things until it was all borrowed and never repaid. No. 2, the unions negotiated that deal because state employees had lower pay and therefore earned the pension benefits in place of the higher pay scales in the private sector. Aside from those at the very top, the average state and federal employee still does not make more than its equivalent in the private sector. It's the private sector's insane bonuses and golden parachutes for the very top which led to the handful of the highest level of state and federal being overpaid. Those few --- the supposed 100K pensions you previously talked about --- are the ones always pointed to as creating the unsustainability, not the vast majority of state workers which include professors, staff administrators, janitors, etc. The original contract never obligated the taxpayers, it obligated the union employees to accept the benefits in exchange. It DID NOT become a "death spiral" until so the money was drained and never replaced.
03-30-2020 04:56 PM
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pvk75 Offline
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Post: #51
RE: Could this be death of one or more of directional schools
Imo, that's the problem with the proposed progressive income tax ... the spending plan calls for all kinds of spending, instead of just pumping up the state's contributions to the pension shortfall. It's about winning elections, not taking care of the shortfall. Same old same old.

Can't criticize too much (guilty of same), but isn't all this getting too far away from the OP? Maybe a separate thread on how the state got into this mess?
(This post was last modified: 03-30-2020 05:09 PM by pvk75.)
03-30-2020 05:08 PM
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pvk75 Offline
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Post: #52
RE: Could this be death of one or more of directional schools
A little off topic, but SIU refunding some money to students:

https://thesouthern.com/news/local/siu/s...7f005.html
03-31-2020 08:59 AM
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dogdangit Offline
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Post: #53
RE: Could this be death of one or more of directional schools
(03-31-2020 08:59 AM)pvk75 Wrote:  A little off topic, but SIU refunding some money to students:

https://thesouthern.com/news/local/siu/s...7f005.html

Northern doing the same, partially refunding housing costs to students who choose to move out as well as paying student employees stipends and all students will receive a partial student fee refund of $25 per credit hour
03-31-2020 06:03 PM
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NIU75 Offline
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Post: #54
RE: Could this be death of one or more of directional schools
(03-31-2020 06:03 PM)dogdangit Wrote:  
(03-31-2020 08:59 AM)pvk75 Wrote:  A little off topic, but SIU refunding some money to students:

https://thesouthern.com/news/local/siu/s...7f005.html

Northern doing the same, partially refunding housing costs to students who choose to move out as well as paying student employees stipends and all students will receive a partial student fee refund of $25 per credit hour
"Partial student fee refund of $25 per credit hour" will mean less money for the athletic department. The athletic department had to save money by cancelling the spring sports. Nothing but expenses running the spring programs with no revenue.
(This post was last modified: 03-31-2020 07:05 PM by NIU75.)
03-31-2020 07:04 PM
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NILAW Offline
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Post: #55
RE: Could this be death of one or more of directional schools
(03-28-2020 03:50 PM)randyfensfanclub1 Wrote:  
(03-28-2020 01:54 AM)MaddDawgz02 Wrote:  One of the more power voices in college football, Kirk Herbstreit, has already called for an end to the NFL/NCAA football seasons.

Only a matter of time.

NFL plans to play in front of fans https://thehill.com/homenews/media/49057...nt-of-fans

We will see if that changes as time goes on.
04-01-2020 11:20 AM
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NIU84 Offline
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Post: #56
RE: Could this be death of one or more of directional schools
(04-01-2020 11:20 AM)NILAW Wrote:  
(03-28-2020 03:50 PM)randyfensfanclub1 Wrote:  
(03-28-2020 01:54 AM)MaddDawgz02 Wrote:  One of the more power voices in college football, Kirk Herbstreit, has already called for an end to the NFL/NCAA football seasons.

Only a matter of time.

NFL plans to play in front of fans https://thehill.com/homenews/media/49057...nt-of-fans

We will see if that changes as time goes on.
With all the virus models available now, it seems like September might be well past the worst of it. Maybe it's do-able. But it'll be different in Texas vs NY, and so on. Later in the fall, I hear they expect a second wave of outbreak..ugh.

Imagine going to a game, you get your temperature checked. No one allowed in if your over some number.
Imagine they segment the stadiums to prevent alot of mingling by the crowd, no walking around the stadium or to the other side to get to a restaurant.
Imagine the nation gets it's testing together and you need to provide proof within the recent past your negative.
Imagine they somehow limit attendance so they have some crowds, but not packed sell outs.

If I can think of 4 mitigations in a minute, i wonder what the experts are thinking.
04-01-2020 11:20 PM
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Post: #57
RE: Could this be death of one or more of directional schools
(04-01-2020 11:20 AM)NILAW Wrote:  
(03-28-2020 03:50 PM)randyfensfanclub1 Wrote:  
(03-28-2020 01:54 AM)MaddDawgz02 Wrote:  One of the more power voices in college football, Kirk Herbstreit, has already called for an end to the NFL/NCAA football seasons.

Only a matter of time.

NFL plans to play in front of fans https://thehill.com/homenews/media/49057...nt-of-fans

We will see if that changes as time goes on.
Have fun folks. I’ll be watching from the safety of my home.

I imagine tickets will be reasonably priced.
04-02-2020 12:28 AM
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MaddDawgz02 Offline
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Post: #58
RE: Could this be death of one or more of directional schools
(04-02-2020 12:28 AM)holybovine Wrote:  
(04-01-2020 11:20 AM)NILAW Wrote:  
(03-28-2020 03:50 PM)randyfensfanclub1 Wrote:  
(03-28-2020 01:54 AM)MaddDawgz02 Wrote:  One of the more power voices in college football, Kirk Herbstreit, has already called for an end to the NFL/NCAA football seasons.

Only a matter of time.

NFL plans to play in front of fans https://thehill.com/homenews/media/49057...nt-of-fans

We will see if that changes as time goes on.
Have fun folks. I’ll be watching from the safety of my home.

I imagine tickets will be reasonably priced.

Highly unlikely there will be a football season. This corona thing wont die down until after the election
04-02-2020 07:48 AM
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Big_Man Offline
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Post: #59
RE: Could this be death of one or more of directional schools
(04-02-2020 07:48 AM)MaddDawgz02 Wrote:  
(04-02-2020 12:28 AM)holybovine Wrote:  
(04-01-2020 11:20 AM)NILAW Wrote:  
(03-28-2020 03:50 PM)randyfensfanclub1 Wrote:  
(03-28-2020 01:54 AM)MaddDawgz02 Wrote:  One of the more power voices in college football, Kirk Herbstreit, has already called for an end to the NFL/NCAA football seasons.

Only a matter of time.

NFL plans to play in front of fans https://thehill.com/homenews/media/49057...nt-of-fans

We will see if that changes as time goes on.
Have fun folks. I’ll be watching from the safety of my home.

I imagine tickets will be reasonably priced.

Highly unlikely there will be a football season. This corona thing wont die down until after the election

Someone going to take the political bait here? He's trying to get it going, but will deny he said anything.....
04-02-2020 08:51 AM
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RE: Could this be death of one or more of directional schools
(04-02-2020 08:51 AM)Big_Man Wrote:  
(04-02-2020 07:48 AM)MaddDawgz02 Wrote:  
(04-02-2020 12:28 AM)holybovine Wrote:  
(04-01-2020 11:20 AM)NILAW Wrote:  
(03-28-2020 03:50 PM)randyfensfanclub1 Wrote:  Only a matter of time.

NFL plans to play in front of fans https://thehill.com/homenews/media/49057...nt-of-fans

We will see if that changes as time goes on.
Have fun folks. I’ll be watching from the safety of my home.

I imagine tickets will be reasonably priced.

Highly unlikely there will be a football season. This corona thing wont die down until after the election

Someone going to take the political bait here? He's trying to get it going, but will deny he said anything.....
Nah, it's just a hoax.

But for real, we will be lucky to have sports for the next year or two.
04-02-2020 09:33 AM
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