Hello There, Guest! (LoginRegister)

Post Reply 
Baseball @TexasTech #3 (Sunday)
Author Message
Bookmark and Share
RiceOwls2019 Offline
Water Engineer
*

Posts: 80
Joined: Aug 2019
Reputation: 3
I Root For: Rice
Location:
Post: #21
RE: Baseball @TexasTech #3 (Sunday)
(03-08-2020 05:41 PM)Owl 69/70/75 Wrote:  I'm not calling for Bragga's head, at least not at this point. I expect the recruiting to pick up substantially when the effects of the Rice Endowment kick in, and I think our recent recruiting drought was pretty much inevitable. But we need to start seeing improvement, at least in the basics. Our approach at the plate is horrible, and our pitchers don't throw strikes.

Sometimes pitchers don't throw strikes because they think their stuff is not good enough to get hitters out in the zone. But I don't know an explanation for taking so many third strikes and swinging at so many ball outside the zone.

I don’t know why you think the Rice Investment is going to dramatically affect baseball recruiting. The vast, vast majority of college baseball players—I’d guess well over 90%—come from families who will not qualify for the full ride (i.e. their families make over $65,000 a year). If we found players who met that criteria (and we’ve had a couple over the years) they were already getting a full ride or close to it anyways, it’s just been rebranded.

You may be able to find another player or two per year to get a half scholarship now through the new policy (65k-200k family income per year). So that may help things.

But a whole heap of talented kids, including a majority of the travel team players, will not qualify for any additional aid through the new changes. They are going to be getting the same deals as before. So while I think the Rice Investment will help some, I really doubt it’s going to be some great panacea.
03-08-2020 06:13 PM
Find all posts by this user Quote this message in a reply
bigowlsfan Offline
Water Engineer
*

Posts: 61
Joined: Nov 2017
Reputation: 6
I Root For: Rice
Location:
Post: #22
RE: Baseball @TexasTech #3 (Sunday)
To me, this start merits the southern cal/Lane Kiffen treatment. Just catch Bragga as he walks off the bus back home, and relieve him of his duties, right then and there. Seriously, this start is beyond pathetic.

Are we serious about the baseball program or not? It isn't as if the search process was brilliant or supported by the broader Rice community. It was a hot mess from the start; now, it has led to a hot mess result.

Move on, before the aircraft carrier drifts further out to sea and away from the home port.
(This post was last modified: 03-08-2020 06:35 PM by bigowlsfan.)
03-08-2020 06:30 PM
Find all posts by this user Quote this message in a reply
Owl 69/70/75 Online
Just an old rugby coach
*

Posts: 64,946
Joined: Sep 2005
Reputation: 1692
I Root For: RiceBathChelsea
Location: Montgomery, TX

DonatorsNew Orleans Bowl
Post: #23
RE: Baseball @TexasTech #3 (Sunday)
(03-08-2020 06:13 PM)RiceOwls2019 Wrote:  
(03-08-2020 05:41 PM)Owl 69/70/75 Wrote:  I'm not calling for Bragga's head, at least not at this point. I expect the recruiting to pick up substantially when the effects of the Rice Endowment kick in, and I think our recent recruiting drought was pretty much inevitable. But we need to start seeing improvement, at least in the basics. Our approach at the plate is horrible, and our pitchers don't throw strikes.
Sometimes pitchers don't throw strikes because they think their stuff is not good enough to get hitters out in the zone. But I don't know an explanation for taking so many third strikes and swinging at so many ball outside the zone.
I don’t know why you think the Rice Investment is going to dramatically affect baseball recruiting. The vast, vast majority of college baseball players—I’d guess well over 90%—come from families who will not qualify for the full ride (i.e. their families make over $65,000 a year). If we found players who met that criteria (and we’ve had a couple over the years) they were already getting a full ride or close to it anyways, it’s just been rebranded.
You may be able to find another player or two per year to get a half scholarship now through the new policy (65k-200k family income per year). So that may help things.
But a whole heap of talented kids, including a majority of the travel team players, will not qualify for any additional aid through the new changes. They are going to be getting the same deals as before. So while I think the Rice Investment will help some, I really doubt it’s going to be some great panacea.

I don't think it's going to be a panacea. In particular, as you note, I don't know how much it can help with kids whose parents can afford to to the travel team thing for them. What we're going to have to do is find some diamonds in the rough. But I do think there will be a couple a year where it will make a difference. And if we get two kids a year that we have been losing because of money, that will have a pretty big impact over 3-4 years. That can be 3 starting pitchers and 3 position players that are better than what we are getting now. Add that amount of talent to this team, and we'd be closer to 13-2 than 2-13.
03-08-2020 07:23 PM
Find all posts by this user Quote this message in a reply
OptimisticOwl Offline
Legend
*

Posts: 43,911
Joined: Apr 2005
Reputation: 583
I Root For: Rice
Location: Paradise

The Parliament AwardsNew Orleans BowlFootball GeniusCrappiesDonatorsDonators
Post: #24
RE: Baseball @TexasTech #3 (Sunday)
From top of the pile to bottom of the barrel took 17 years.
03-08-2020 07:24 PM
Find all posts by this user Quote this message in a reply
bigowlsfan Offline
Water Engineer
*

Posts: 61
Joined: Nov 2017
Reputation: 6
I Root For: Rice
Location:
Post: #25
RE: Baseball @TexasTech #3 (Sunday)
(03-08-2020 07:24 PM)OptimisticOwl Wrote:  From top of the pile to bottom of the barrel took 17 years.

Fair enough but it took 15 years to get from the top of the pile to the middle of the pile, and then 2 years to get from the middle of the pile to the bottom of the barrel. It was not a linear progression.
03-08-2020 07:28 PM
Find all posts by this user Quote this message in a reply
Owl 69/70/75 Online
Just an old rugby coach
*

Posts: 64,946
Joined: Sep 2005
Reputation: 1692
I Root For: RiceBathChelsea
Location: Montgomery, TX

DonatorsNew Orleans Bowl
Post: #26
RE: Baseball @TexasTech #3 (Sunday)
(03-08-2020 07:24 PM)OptimisticOwl Wrote:  From top of the pile to bottom of the barrel took 17 years.

I'd say more like 10 years. We were still pretty good until around 2010. Our last trip to Omaha was 2008. Our last super-regional was 2013. We were still making a pretty strong showing at the MLB draft through 2015. So somewhere in that range of years is when the tumble really started.
03-08-2020 07:31 PM
Find all posts by this user Quote this message in a reply
Owl 69/70/75 Online
Just an old rugby coach
*

Posts: 64,946
Joined: Sep 2005
Reputation: 1692
I Root For: RiceBathChelsea
Location: Montgomery, TX

DonatorsNew Orleans Bowl
Post: #27
RE: Baseball @TexasTech #3 (Sunday)
(03-08-2020 07:28 PM)bigowlsfan Wrote:  
(03-08-2020 07:24 PM)OptimisticOwl Wrote:  From top of the pile to bottom of the barrel took 17 years.
Fair enough but it took 15 years to get from the top of the pile to the middle of the pile, and then 2 years to get from the middle of the pile to the bottom of the barrel. It was not a linear progression.

We actually stayed pretty close to the top for about 5 years (Omaha 2006-08), than stayed within striking difference for another 5 (last super regional 2013), then 5 more to fall from near the top to the middle, the 2 to go from the middle to the bottom.

I said it at the time, and I still maintain it, I would have let Wayne pick his time to go (I think he would have been ready to hang it up after about one more year), let him pick his successor, done a sunset cruise year with the successor onboard, and then given him some sort of development/alumni relations position in the department. Lamar did the sunset cruise thing with Jim Gilligan, and that hasn't worked perfectly, but so far I'd say it has worked better than this. UH did the development/alumni thing with Yeoman, and I think that worked pretty well. We treated Wayne incredibly shabbily, particularly considering that he is probably the reason we still have a D-1 athletic program at all.
(This post was last modified: 03-08-2020 07:37 PM by Owl 69/70/75.)
03-08-2020 07:34 PM
Find all posts by this user Quote this message in a reply
ExcitedOwl18 Offline
Heisman
*

Posts: 5,848
Joined: Dec 2013
Reputation: 59
I Root For: Rice
Location: New York
Post: #28
RE: Baseball @TexasTech #3 (Sunday)
(03-08-2020 07:31 PM)Owl 69/70/75 Wrote:  
(03-08-2020 07:24 PM)OptimisticOwl Wrote:  From top of the pile to bottom of the barrel took 17 years.

I'd say more like 10 years. We were still pretty good until around 2010. Our last trip to Omaha was 2008. Our last super-regional was 2013. We were still making a pretty strong showing at the MLB draft through 2015. So somewhere in that range of years is when the tumble really started.

We got an at-large bid in 2016, a mere 4 seasons ago.

That’s still “top of the pile” relative to the 300+ teams in NCAA baseball.
03-08-2020 07:34 PM
Find all posts by this user Quote this message in a reply
bigowlsfan Offline
Water Engineer
*

Posts: 61
Joined: Nov 2017
Reputation: 6
I Root For: Rice
Location:
Post: #29
RE: Baseball @TexasTech #3 (Sunday)
(03-08-2020 07:31 PM)Owl 69/70/75 Wrote:  
(03-08-2020 07:24 PM)OptimisticOwl Wrote:  From top of the pile to bottom of the barrel took 17 years.

I'd say more like 10 years. We were still pretty good until around 2010. Our last trip to Omaha was 2008. Our last super-regional was 2013. We were still making a pretty strong showing at the MLB draft through 2015. So somewhere in that range of years is when the tumble really started.

Fair point but super regional is the sweet 16 and the results of that series (lost in 3 competitive games) showed we belonged at that level. I will put the quicker pace of the trip to bottom of the barrel starting at 2014.
03-08-2020 07:36 PM
Find all posts by this user Quote this message in a reply
RiceOwls2019 Offline
Water Engineer
*

Posts: 80
Joined: Aug 2019
Reputation: 3
I Root For: Rice
Location:
Post: #30
RE: Baseball @TexasTech #3 (Sunday)
(03-08-2020 07:23 PM)Owl 69/70/75 Wrote:  
(03-08-2020 06:13 PM)RiceOwls2019 Wrote:  
(03-08-2020 05:41 PM)Owl 69/70/75 Wrote:  I'm not calling for Bragga's head, at least not at this point. I expect the recruiting to pick up substantially when the effects of the Rice Endowment kick in, and I think our recent recruiting drought was pretty much inevitable. But we need to start seeing improvement, at least in the basics. Our approach at the plate is horrible, and our pitchers don't throw strikes.
Sometimes pitchers don't throw strikes because they think their stuff is not good enough to get hitters out in the zone. But I don't know an explanation for taking so many third strikes and swinging at so many ball outside the zone.
I don’t know why you think the Rice Investment is going to dramatically affect baseball recruiting. The vast, vast majority of college baseball players—I’d guess well over 90%—come from families who will not qualify for the full ride (i.e. their families make over $65,000 a year). If we found players who met that criteria (and we’ve had a couple over the years) they were already getting a full ride or close to it anyways, it’s just been rebranded.
You may be able to find another player or two per year to get a half scholarship now through the new policy (65k-200k family income per year). So that may help things.
But a whole heap of talented kids, including a majority of the travel team players, will not qualify for any additional aid through the new changes. They are going to be getting the same deals as before. So while I think the Rice Investment will help some, I really doubt it’s going to be some great panacea.

I don't think it's going to be a panacea. In particular, as you note, I don't know how much it can help with kids whose parents can afford to to the travel team thing for them. What we're going to have to do is find some diamonds in the rough. But I do think there will be a couple a year where it will make a difference. And if we get two kids a year that we have been losing because of money, that will have a pretty big impact over 3-4 years. That can be 3 starting pitchers and 3 position players that are better than what we are getting now. Add that amount of talent to this team, and we'd be closer to 13-2 than 2-13.

Fair enough.
03-08-2020 07:37 PM
Find all posts by this user Quote this message in a reply
bigowlsfan Offline
Water Engineer
*

Posts: 61
Joined: Nov 2017
Reputation: 6
I Root For: Rice
Location:
Post: #31
RE: Baseball @TexasTech #3 (Sunday)
(03-08-2020 07:34 PM)Owl 69/70/75 Wrote:  
(03-08-2020 07:28 PM)bigowlsfan Wrote:  
(03-08-2020 07:24 PM)OptimisticOwl Wrote:  From top of the pile to bottom of the barrel took 17 years.
Fair enough but it took 15 years to get from the top of the pile to the middle of the pile, and then 2 years to get from the middle of the pile to the bottom of the barrel. It was not a linear progression.

We actually stayed pretty close to the top for about 5 years (Omaha 2006-08), than stayed within striking difference for another 5 (last super regional 2013), then 5 more to fall from near the top to the middle, the 2 to go from the middle to the bottom.

I said it at the time, and I still maintain it, I would have let Wayne pick his time to go (I think he would have been ready to hang it up after about one more year), let him pick his successor, done a sunset cruise year with the successor onboard, and then given him some sort of development/alumni relations position in the department. Lamar did the sunset cruise thing with Jim Gilligan, and that hasn't worked perfectly, but so far I'd say it has worked better than this. UH did the development/alumni thing with Yeoman, and I think that worked pretty well. We treated Wayne incredibly shabbily, particularly considering that he is probably the reason we still have a D-1 athletic program at all.

I can accept this and for the sake of the 20 rice fans who care any more not carving each other up over crumbs, can we agree that the pace of decline has increased?
03-08-2020 07:39 PM
Find all posts by this user Quote this message in a reply
Owl 69/70/75 Online
Just an old rugby coach
*

Posts: 64,946
Joined: Sep 2005
Reputation: 1692
I Root For: RiceBathChelsea
Location: Montgomery, TX

DonatorsNew Orleans Bowl
Post: #32
RE: Baseball @TexasTech #3 (Sunday)
(03-08-2020 07:36 PM)bigowlsfan Wrote:  
(03-08-2020 07:31 PM)Owl 69/70/75 Wrote:  
(03-08-2020 07:24 PM)OptimisticOwl Wrote:  From top of the pile to bottom of the barrel took 17 years.
I'd say more like 10 years. We were still pretty good until around 2010. Our last trip to Omaha was 2008. Our last super-regional was 2013. We were still making a pretty strong showing at the MLB draft through 2015. So somewhere in that range of years is when the tumble really started.
Fair point but super regional is the sweet 16 and the results of that series (lost in 3 competitive games) showed we belonged at that level. I will put the quicker pace of the trip to bottom of the barrel starting at 2014.

I would say that the top is getting to Omaha. Winning an NC is special, but anybody can win it all if they get there. I'd say making a super-regional (the "sweet 16") is the second tier, and winning a conference championship is the third tier. We were top tier through 2008, second tier as recently as 2013, and third tier through about 2017. Since then, the bottom has dropped out.

I'm sorry, but right now Rice baseball is in Jerry Berndt territory.
(This post was last modified: 03-08-2020 07:46 PM by Owl 69/70/75.)
03-08-2020 07:44 PM
Find all posts by this user Quote this message in a reply
OptimisticOwl Offline
Legend
*

Posts: 43,911
Joined: Apr 2005
Reputation: 583
I Root For: Rice
Location: Paradise

The Parliament AwardsNew Orleans BowlFootball GeniusCrappiesDonatorsDonators
Post: #33
RE: Baseball @TexasTech #3 (Sunday)
I didn't say linear. But the trend is downward, from 2003 to now.
03-08-2020 08:42 PM
Find all posts by this user Quote this message in a reply
texowl2 Offline
1st String
*

Posts: 2,266
Joined: Jun 2005
Reputation: 22
I Root For:
Location:

New Orleans Bowl
Post: #34
RE: Baseball @TexasTech #3 (Sunday)
(03-08-2020 05:27 PM)OptimisticOwl Wrote:  
(03-08-2020 05:24 PM)Owl 69/70/75 Wrote:  
(03-08-2020 04:05 PM)ExcitedOwl18 Wrote:  
(03-08-2020 03:56 PM)WRCisforgotten79 Wrote:  
(03-08-2020 03:35 PM)ExcitedOwl18 Wrote:  2-13! Nice job team!
I don't care how "bare" the cupboard allegedly was (I'm not buying that, BTW), this is unacceptable.
Yeah, I was originally a pretty big Bragga supporter and was willing to give him some time, because the roster is/was depleted.
That said-It’s not 2-13 depleted. As I mentioned the other day-Look at what the LBSU coach is doing.

Something is obviously badly wrong. I don't know if it's Bragga or something else. Hard to believe, but Karlgaard has had three hires in major sports, and right now the most impressive looking one is Pera.

At least we know why the basketball cupboard was bare. We watched it being looted.

twice sadly, but ROFLMAO
03-09-2020 12:55 PM
Find all posts by this user Quote this message in a reply
Hou_Lawyer Offline
Water Engineer
*

Posts: 93
Joined: Sep 2016
Reputation: 10
I Root For: Rice
Location:
Post: #35
RE: Baseball @TexasTech #3 (Sunday)
But Berkman said something about bathrooms.
03-09-2020 03:16 PM
Find all posts by this user Quote this message in a reply
Owl1998 Offline
Special Teams
*

Posts: 775
Joined: Sep 2016
Reputation: 6
I Root For: Rice
Location:
Post: #36
RE: Baseball @TexasTech #3 (Sunday)
04-cheers
(03-09-2020 03:16 PM)Hou_Lawyer Wrote:  But Berkman said something about bathrooms.
03-09-2020 05:28 PM
Find all posts by this user Quote this message in a reply
bigowlsfan Offline
Water Engineer
*

Posts: 61
Joined: Nov 2017
Reputation: 6
I Root For: Rice
Location:
Post: #37
RE: Baseball @TexasTech #3 (Sunday)
(03-09-2020 05:28 PM)Owl1998 Wrote:  04-cheers
(03-09-2020 03:16 PM)Hou_Lawyer Wrote:  But Berkman said something about bathrooms.

Wouldn’t want to upset ESPN with our baseball hire. After all, it’s not about excellence. It is how you are perceived on Twitter.
03-09-2020 06:59 PM
Find all posts by this user Quote this message in a reply
Owl 69/70/75 Online
Just an old rugby coach
*

Posts: 64,946
Joined: Sep 2005
Reputation: 1692
I Root For: RiceBathChelsea
Location: Montgomery, TX

DonatorsNew Orleans Bowl
Post: #38
RE: Baseball @TexasTech #3 (Sunday)
I don't think Wayne wanted Berkman. Never heard him say that in so many words, but just an impression I got. And I still think Wayne earned the right to pick his successor.

Maybe that successor would not have been the right choice. But I doubt we'd be worse than 2-13 at this point.
03-09-2020 07:02 PM
Find all posts by this user Quote this message in a reply
Tomball Owl Offline
Heisman
*

Posts: 7,508
Joined: Oct 2005
Reputation: 50
I Root For: Rice Owls
Location: Comal County
Post: #39
RE: Baseball @TexasTech #3 (Sunday)
(03-09-2020 07:02 PM)Owl 69/70/75 Wrote:  I don't think Wayne wanted Berkman. Never heard him say that in so many words, but just an impression I got. And I still think Wayne earned the right to pick his successor.

Maybe that successor would not have been the right choice. But I doubt we'd be worse than 2-13 at this point.

Doubt he wanted Bragga either. At this point the past doesn’t matter.
03-09-2020 07:23 PM
Find all posts by this user Quote this message in a reply
Owl 69/70/75 Online
Just an old rugby coach
*

Posts: 64,946
Joined: Sep 2005
Reputation: 1692
I Root For: RiceBathChelsea
Location: Montgomery, TX

DonatorsNew Orleans Bowl
Post: #40
RE: Baseball @TexasTech #3 (Sunday)
(03-09-2020 07:23 PM)Tomball Owl Wrote:  
(03-09-2020 07:02 PM)Owl 69/70/75 Wrote:  I don't think Wayne wanted Berkman. Never heard him say that in so many words, but just an impression I got. And I still think Wayne earned the right to pick his successor.
Maybe that successor would not have been the right choice. But I doubt we'd be worse than 2-13 at this point.
Doubt he wanted Bragga either. At this point the past doesn’t matter.

I have a pretty good idea who he wanted and no, it was not Bragga. I do think Wayne went above and beyond the call of duty to assist in the turnover to Bragga. When that was done, I think he just wanted to walk completely away from Rice and Rice baseball. The way it ended left a very bad taste in his mouth, and IMO Rice should not have done that to the man who is the primary, if not only, reason why Rice still has D-1 sports.
03-09-2020 07:36 PM
Find all posts by this user Quote this message in a reply
Post Reply 




User(s) browsing this thread: 1 Guest(s)


Copyright © 2002-2020 Collegiate Sports Nation Bulletin Board System (CSNbbs), All Rights Reserved.
CSNbbs is an independent fan site and is in no way affiliated to the NCAA or any of the schools and conferences it represents.
This site monetizes links. FTC Disclosure.
We allow third-party companies to serve ads and/or collect certain anonymous information when you visit our web site. These companies may use non-personally identifiable information (e.g., click stream information, browser type, time and date, subject of advertisements clicked or scrolled over) during your visits to this and other Web sites in order to provide advertisements about goods and services likely to be of greater interest to you. These companies typically use a cookie or third party web beacon to collect this information. To learn more about this behavioral advertising practice or to opt-out of this type of advertising, you can visit http://www.networkadvertising.org.
Powered By MyBB, © 2002-2020 MyBB Group.