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UofMstateU Offline
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Post: #21
RE: Growing calls for IUD Vindman to be fired / courtmartialed
(02-10-2020 09:09 AM)Redwingtom Wrote:  
(02-07-2020 05:30 PM)CG_Hawk06 Wrote:  
(02-07-2020 04:15 PM)Redwingtom Wrote:  Bless the troops...until they tell the truth about dear leader.

#ItIsACult

The truth is he leaked classified information.

Source?

Besides his own f*ing testimony under oath?
(This post was last modified: 02-10-2020 09:10 AM by UofMstateU.)
02-10-2020 09:10 AM
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RE: Growing calls for IUD Vindman to be fired / courtmartialed
(02-07-2020 08:08 PM)CrimsonPhantom Wrote:  Per his lawyer:



Well well, so the little weasel hired Mark Zaid. Could there be more evidence this guy is a traitor and coup conspirator?
02-10-2020 09:20 AM
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UofMstateU Offline
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Post: #23
RE: Growing calls for IUD Vindman to be fired / courtmartialed
(02-10-2020 09:20 AM)SoMs Eagle Wrote:  
(02-07-2020 08:08 PM)CrimsonPhantom Wrote:  Per his lawyer:



Well well, so the little weasel hired Mark Zaid. Could there be more evidence this guy is a traitor and coup conspirator?

And then gets cover from "A Dan Abrams Production". Color me shocked.
02-10-2020 09:22 AM
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Post: #24
RE: Growing calls for IUD Vindman to be fired / courtmartialed
Here's something I find interesting about Vindman. The left keeps propping him up as a war hero because he got a Purple Heart. He was commissioned in 1999, so he has 21 years of service time. In that time, we've been at war for 18 of them. He deployed to South Korea and Germany and has one year of combat service, Sept 2004 to Sept 2005. When other soldiers, sailors, Marines, and airmen were doing three or four combat deployments, he was one and done. And he was injured by an IED, his Purple Heart, in October 2004, so we don't know exactly how much of that one year was actually combat time. He spent the rest of the time going to grad school and serving in various embassy and staff billets. That is not the resume of a war hero.

I've know officers like him, who padded their career with staff and diplomatic positions. They are competent paper shufflers, but hardly war heroes. They get by by kissing butts, not by doing things.
(This post was last modified: 02-10-2020 10:36 AM by Owl 69/70/75.)
02-10-2020 09:39 AM
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Post: #25
RE: Growing calls for IUD Vindman to be fired / courtmartialed
(02-10-2020 09:09 AM)Redwingtom Wrote:  
(02-07-2020 05:30 PM)CG_Hawk06 Wrote:  
(02-07-2020 04:15 PM)Redwingtom Wrote:  Bless the troops...until they tell the truth about dear leader.

#ItIsACult

The truth is he leaked classified information.

Source?

Once the lawyer moved information to a classified server, it can't be released. Lt. Col Vindman continued to discuss it with persons without a need to know, and that is what we call leaking classified information.
02-10-2020 10:18 AM
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UofMstateU Offline
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Post: #26
RE: Growing calls for IUD Vindman to be fired / courtmartialed
(02-10-2020 10:18 AM)CG_Hawk06 Wrote:  
(02-10-2020 09:09 AM)Redwingtom Wrote:  
(02-07-2020 05:30 PM)CG_Hawk06 Wrote:  
(02-07-2020 04:15 PM)Redwingtom Wrote:  Bless the troops...until they tell the truth about dear leader.

#ItIsACult

The truth is he leaked classified information.

Source?

Once the lawyer moved information to a classified server, it can't be released. Lt. Col Vindman continued to discuss it with persons without a need to know, and that is what we call leaking classified information.

VIndman admitted he told the contents of the call to 3 people during his testimony, at which time Schiff schiffed his pants and shut the questioning down.

Some on the left will say "but the people he told has security clearance!

Of which, of course, does not matter.
02-10-2020 10:26 AM
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Redwingtom Offline
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Post: #27
RE: Growing calls for IUD Vindman to be fired / courtmartialed
(02-10-2020 09:39 AM)Owl 69/70/75 Wrote:  Here's something I find interesting about Vindman. The left keeps propping him up as a war hero because he got a Purple Heart. He was commissioned in 1999, so he has 21 years of service time. In that time, we've been at war for 18 of them. He deployed to South Korea and Germany and has one year of combat service, Sept 2004 to Sept 2005. When other soldiers, sailors, Marines, and airmen were doing three or four combat deployments, he was one and done. And he was injured by an IED, his Purple Heart, in October 2004, so we don't know exactly how much of that one year was actually combat time. He spent the rest of the time going to grad school and serving in various embassy and staff billets. That is not the resume of a war hero.

I've know officers like him, who padded their career with staff and diplomatic positions. They are competent paper shufflers, but hardly war heroes. They get by by kissing butts, not by doing things.

You're despicable dude.
02-10-2020 01:22 PM
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Redwingtom Offline
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Post: #28
RE: Growing calls for IUD Vindman to be fired / courtmartialed
(02-10-2020 10:18 AM)CG_Hawk06 Wrote:  
(02-10-2020 09:09 AM)Redwingtom Wrote:  
(02-07-2020 05:30 PM)CG_Hawk06 Wrote:  
(02-07-2020 04:15 PM)Redwingtom Wrote:  Bless the troops...until they tell the truth about dear leader.

#ItIsACult

The truth is he leaked classified information.

Source?

Once the lawyer moved information to a classified server, it can't be released. Lt. Col Vindman continued to discuss it with persons without a need to know, and that is what we call leaking classified information.

What "classified" information did he release and where is your proof?
(This post was last modified: 02-10-2020 01:23 PM by Redwingtom.)
02-10-2020 01:23 PM
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UofMstateU Offline
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Post: #29
RE: Growing calls for IUD Vindman to be fired / courtmartialed
(02-10-2020 01:23 PM)Redwingtom Wrote:  
(02-10-2020 10:18 AM)CG_Hawk06 Wrote:  
(02-10-2020 09:09 AM)Redwingtom Wrote:  
(02-07-2020 05:30 PM)CG_Hawk06 Wrote:  
(02-07-2020 04:15 PM)Redwingtom Wrote:  Bless the troops...until they tell the truth about dear leader.

#ItIsACult

The truth is he leaked classified information.

Source?

Once the lawyer moved information to a classified server, it can't be released. Lt. Col Vindman continued to discuss it with persons without a need to know, and that is what we call leaking classified information.

What "classified" information did he release and where is your proof?

Get your head out of Vox'es anal canal. This has been covered ad nauseum.
02-10-2020 01:25 PM
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Post: #30
RE: Growing calls for IUD Vindman to be fired / courtmartialed
(02-10-2020 01:22 PM)Redwingtom Wrote:  
(02-10-2020 09:39 AM)Owl 69/70/75 Wrote:  Here's something I find interesting about Vindman. The left keeps propping him up as a war hero because he got a Purple Heart. He was commissioned in 1999, so he has 21 years of service time. In that time, we've been at war for 18 of them. He deployed to South Korea and Germany and has one year of combat service, Sept 2004 to Sept 2005. When other soldiers, sailors, Marines, and airmen were doing three or four combat deployments, he was one and done. And he was injured by an IED, his Purple Heart, in October 2004, so we don't know exactly how much of that one year was actually combat time. He spent the rest of the time going to grad school and serving in various embassy and staff billets. That is not the resume of a war hero.
I've know officers like him, who padded their career with staff and diplomatic positions. They are competent paper shufflers, but hardly war heroes. They get by by kissing butts, not by doing things.
You're despicable dude.

I guess you've never had the "pleasure" of serving under one of those officers. They'd show up in Vietnam, fresh from the Pentagon. They had spent 15 years shuffling papers, and they needed to check the combat box to get their next promotion. They were appalled that people didn't wear their rank insignia and didn't salute. Some sergeant or senior chief would try to explain to them that Charlie figured that if everybody was saluting somebody, the person they were saluting needed to become a sniper target. Some of the guys listened. Others went home in a box a week later.
(This post was last modified: 02-10-2020 02:17 PM by Owl 69/70/75.)
02-10-2020 01:27 PM
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Post: #31
RE: Growing calls for IUD Vindman to be fired / courtmartialed
(02-10-2020 01:23 PM)Redwingtom Wrote:  
(02-10-2020 10:18 AM)CG_Hawk06 Wrote:  
(02-10-2020 09:09 AM)Redwingtom Wrote:  
(02-07-2020 05:30 PM)CG_Hawk06 Wrote:  
(02-07-2020 04:15 PM)Redwingtom Wrote:  Bless the troops...until they tell the truth about dear leader.
#ItIsACult
The truth is he leaked classified information.
Source?
Once the lawyer moved information to a classified server, it can't be released. Lt. Col Vindman continued to discuss it with persons without a need to know, and that is what we call leaking classified information.
What "classified" information did he release and where is your proof?

The details of the phone call were classified until Trump released the transcript. Vindman discussed them with a lawyer, his brother, and an unnamed CIA person (presumably Ciaramella), none of whom were in his chain of command. He never took it to his boss, who is. That's the kind of thing that would have gotten me fired if I had done it when I was in the Navy, and I was never in as sensitive a spot as NSC. He states that all of them had the proper clearance and need to know. But that's his statement. Without knowing how the CIA person was, there is no way to know whether that person did or did not. And it would be at least a suspect statement about the lawyer and his brother, at least as far as the need to know.

And what exactly did Vindman testify to anyway? What I get is that Trump did not stick to the script that Vindman had laid out for him, and that Vindman was "troubled" by some of the comments. Neither of those is compelling evidence. As to the first, Trump was President and Vindman wasn't, and that means Vindman worked for Trump, not vice versa, so where was any obligation to stick to the script? As to the second, so Vindman was "troubled." By what? With no specifics, and I'm not aware that he provided any, that kind of subjective impression is pretty much meaningless. It's not really any more specific than the whistleblower communication. At this point, the only evidence that I am aware of as to the conversation is the transcript produced by the President. I've not seen anything specific that refutes that account, or at least not anything specific about the request made of Zelenske. If you are aware of any such testimony, please refer me. I did not watch every minute of the proceedings with bated breath, but I figured the media would fill me in on anything significant, so I may have missed that.
(This post was last modified: 02-10-2020 02:00 PM by Owl 69/70/75.)
02-10-2020 01:51 PM
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Post: #32
RE: Growing calls for IUD Vindman to be fired / courtmartialed
(02-10-2020 01:51 PM)Owl 69/70/75 Wrote:  
(02-10-2020 01:23 PM)Redwingtom Wrote:  
(02-10-2020 10:18 AM)CG_Hawk06 Wrote:  
(02-10-2020 09:09 AM)Redwingtom Wrote:  
(02-07-2020 05:30 PM)CG_Hawk06 Wrote:  The truth is he leaked classified information.
Source?
Once the lawyer moved information to a classified server, it can't be released. Lt. Col Vindman continued to discuss it with persons without a need to know, and that is what we call leaking classified information.
What "classified" information did he release and where is your proof?

He discussed it with a lawyer, his brother, and an unnamed CIA person (presumably Ciaramella), none of whom were in his chain of command. He never took it to his boss, who is. That's the kind of thing that would have gotten me fired if I had done it when I was in the Navy, and I was never in as sensitive a spot as NSC. He states that all of them had the proper clearance and need to know. But that's his statement. Without knowing how the CIA person was, there is no way to know whether that person did or did not. And it would be at least a suspect statement about the lawyer and his brother, at least as far as the need to know.

And what exactly did Vindman testify to anyway? What I get is that Trump did not stick to the script that Vindman had laid out for him, and that Vindman was "troubled" by some of the comments. Neither of those is compelling evidence. As to the first, Trump was President and Vindman wasn't, and that means Vindman worked for Trump, not vice versa, so where was any obligation to stick to the script? As to the second, so Vindman was "troubled." By what? With no specifics, and I'm not aware that he provided any, that kind of subjective impression is pretty much meaningless. It's not really any more specific than the whistleblower communication. At this point, the only evidence that I am aware of as to the conversation is the transcript produced by the President. I've not seen anything specific that refutes that account, or at least not anything specific about the request made of Zelenske. If you are aware of any such testimony, please refer me. I did not watch every minute of the proceedings with bated breath, but I figured the media would fill me in on anything significant, so I may have missed that.

Unless it was "impropriety" related to his immediate boss, this would get you fired at just about any job in America.
02-10-2020 01:57 PM
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Post: #33
RE: Growing calls for IUD Vindman to be fired / courtmartialed
(02-10-2020 01:22 PM)Redwingtom Wrote:  
(02-10-2020 09:39 AM)Owl 69/70/75 Wrote:  Here's something I find interesting about Vindman. The left keeps propping him up as a war hero because he got a Purple Heart. He was commissioned in 1999, so he has 21 years of service time. In that time, we've been at war for 18 of them. He deployed to South Korea and Germany and has one year of combat service, Sept 2004 to Sept 2005. When other soldiers, sailors, Marines, and airmen were doing three or four combat deployments, he was one and done. And he was injured by an IED, his Purple Heart, in October 2004, so we don't know exactly how much of that one year was actually combat time. He spent the rest of the time going to grad school and serving in various embassy and staff billets. That is not the resume of a war hero.

I've know officers like him, who padded their career with staff and diplomatic positions. They are competent paper shufflers, but hardly war heroes. They get by by kissing butts, not by doing things.

You're despicable dude.

Wow. You realize that is a veteran your talking to right?
02-10-2020 02:09 PM
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Post: #34
RE: Growing calls for IUD Vindman to be fired / courtmartialed
Here's something I don't understand. The democrats have taken to this idea that cabinet members and other executive branch personnel somehow have to be independent (and in their minds, independent seems to mean adverse to the President) rather than supportive of the President. It was considered outrageous that Trump asked about loyalty. Barr has been criticized for not being adverse to Trump. It was considered terrible that Ambassador Yovanovitch was fired when it appears that she made no secret of her anti-Trump views.

These people serve at the pleasure of the President. Their job is to conduct the business of the nation, not to spy on the President and stab him in the back.

What's particularly weird about this expectation is that it's pretty clear that the same expectations did not apply to Eric Holder or Loretta Lynch.
(This post was last modified: 02-10-2020 02:12 PM by Owl 69/70/75.)
02-10-2020 02:11 PM
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Post: #35
RE: Growing calls for IUD Vindman to be fired / courtmartialed
(02-10-2020 02:11 PM)Owl 69/70/75 Wrote:  Here's something I don't understand. The democrats have taken to this idea that cabinet members and other executive branch personnel somehow have to be independent (and in their minds, independent seems to mean adverse to the President) rather than supportive of the President. It was considered outrageous that Trump asked about loyalty. Barr has been criticized for not being adverse to Trump. It was considered terrible that Ambassador Yovanovitch was fired when it appears that she made no secret of her anti-Trump views.

These people serve at the pleasure of the President. Their job is to conduct the business of the nation, not to spy on the President and stab him in the back.

What's particularly weird about this expectation is that it's pretty clear that the same expectations did not apply to Eric Holder or Loretta Lynch.

The big political take away for any future president to derive from Trumps first 3 years is to completely sweep the deck clean when you come into power. Maybe everyone already knew that and it was just a rookie political mistake by Trump---but these last 3 years has made the need to do a complete system reset when a new administration comes into the White House absolutely crystal clear. Dont trust anyone left behind. Given that conservatives will likely look to use the same insurgent tactics next time a Democrat is in the White House---dont expect the Democrat president to make the same error Trump did.
(This post was last modified: 02-10-2020 04:25 PM by Attackcoog.)
02-10-2020 02:20 PM
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Post: #36
RE: Growing calls for IUD Vindman to be fired / courtmartialed
(02-10-2020 01:51 PM)Owl 69/70/75 Wrote:  
(02-10-2020 01:23 PM)Redwingtom Wrote:  
(02-10-2020 10:18 AM)CG_Hawk06 Wrote:  
(02-10-2020 09:09 AM)Redwingtom Wrote:  
(02-07-2020 05:30 PM)CG_Hawk06 Wrote:  The truth is he leaked classified information.
Source?
Once the lawyer moved information to a classified server, it can't be released. Lt. Col Vindman continued to discuss it with persons without a need to know, and that is what we call leaking classified information.
What "classified" information did he release and where is your proof?

The details of the phone call were classified until Trump released the transcript. Vindman discussed them with a lawyer, his brother, and an unnamed CIA person (presumably Ciaramella), none of whom were in his chain of command. He never took it to his boss, who is. That's the kind of thing that would have gotten me fired if I had done it when I was in the Navy, and I was never in as sensitive a spot as NSC. He states that all of them had the proper clearance and need to know. But that's his statement. Without knowing how the CIA person was, there is no way to know whether that person did or did not. And it would be at least a suspect statement about the lawyer and his brother, at least as far as the need to know.

And what exactly did Vindman testify to anyway? What I get is that Trump did not stick to the script that Vindman had laid out for him, and that Vindman was "troubled" by some of the comments. Neither of those is compelling evidence. As to the first, Trump was President and Vindman wasn't, and that means Vindman worked for Trump, not vice versa, so where was any obligation to stick to the script? As to the second, so Vindman was "troubled." By what? With no specifics, and I'm not aware that he provided any, that kind of subjective impression is pretty much meaningless. It's not really any more specific than the whistleblower communication. At this point, the only evidence that I am aware of as to the conversation is the transcript produced by the President. I've not seen anything specific that refutes that account, or at least not anything specific about the request made of Zelenske. If you are aware of any such testimony, please refer me. I did not watch every minute of the proceedings with bated breath, but I figured the media would fill me in on anything significant, so I may have missed that.

Owl, you know better than to try and explain anything "classified" related. Past experience tells you they simply will not care when told.
02-10-2020 02:40 PM
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Post: #37
RE: Growing calls for IUD Vindman to be fired / courtmartialed
(02-10-2020 02:20 PM)Attackcoog Wrote:  
(02-10-2020 02:11 PM)Owl 69/70/75 Wrote:  Here's something I don't understand. The democrats have taken to this idea that cabinet members and other executive branch personnel somehow have to be independent (and in their minds, independent seems to mean adverse to the President) rather than supportive of the President. It was considered outrageous that Trump asked about loyalty. Barr has been criticized for not being adverse to Trump. It was considered terrible that Ambassador Yovanovitch was fired when it appears that she made no secret of her anti-Trump views.
These people serve at the pleasure of the President. Their job is to conduct the business of the nation, not to spy on the President and stab him in the back.
What's particularly weird about this expectation is that it's pretty clear that the same expectations did not apply to Eric Holder or Loretta Lynch.
The big political take away for any future president to derive from Trumps first 3 years is to completely sweep the deck clean when you come into power. Maybe everyone already knew that and if was just a rookie political mistake by Trump---but these last 3 years has made the need to do a complete system reset when a new administration comes into the White House absolutely crystal clear. Dont trust anyone left behind. Given that conservatives will likely look to use the same insurgent tactics next time a Democrat is in the White House---dont expect the Democrat president to make the same error Trump did.

Absolutely. +3
02-10-2020 02:42 PM
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Post: #38
RE: Growing calls for IUD Vindman to be fired / courtmartialed
(02-10-2020 02:09 PM)Attackcoog Wrote:  
(02-10-2020 01:22 PM)Redwingtom Wrote:  
(02-10-2020 09:39 AM)Owl 69/70/75 Wrote:  Here's something I find interesting about Vindman. The left keeps propping him up as a war hero because he got a Purple Heart. He was commissioned in 1999, so he has 21 years of service time. In that time, we've been at war for 18 of them. He deployed to South Korea and Germany and has one year of combat service, Sept 2004 to Sept 2005. When other soldiers, sailors, Marines, and airmen were doing three or four combat deployments, he was one and done. And he was injured by an IED, his Purple Heart, in October 2004, so we don't know exactly how much of that one year was actually combat time. He spent the rest of the time going to grad school and serving in various embassy and staff billets. That is not the resume of a war hero.

I've know officers like him, who padded their career with staff and diplomatic positions. They are competent paper shufflers, but hardly war heroes. They get by by kissing butts, not by doing things.

You're despicable dude.

Wow. You realize that is a veteran your talking to right?

Right, and he's calling an active duty service member with a purple heart a traitor, among other things.
02-10-2020 03:07 PM
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Post: #39
RE: Growing calls for IUD Vindman to be fired / courtmartialed
Red, you're just a dumb cluck. You know nothing about the UCMJ or the military. You're at the disposal of your command and commanding officer. Even true war heroes like Patton was removed from his command. Patton, who really did great things for the nation. So how much more punishment should someone like Vind who was at the wrong time at the wrong place be excused because he got a purple heart.

You're really a dumb S, Red. Too bad for you. I'd hate to go through life being stupid like you
02-10-2020 03:24 PM
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Post: #40
RE: Growing calls for IUD Vindman to be fired / courtmartialed
(02-10-2020 03:07 PM)Redwingtom Wrote:  
(02-10-2020 02:09 PM)Attackcoog Wrote:  
(02-10-2020 01:22 PM)Redwingtom Wrote:  
(02-10-2020 09:39 AM)Owl 69/70/75 Wrote:  Here's something I find interesting about Vindman. The left keeps propping him up as a war hero because he got a Purple Heart. He was commissioned in 1999, so he has 21 years of service time. In that time, we've been at war for 18 of them. He deployed to South Korea and Germany and has one year of combat service, Sept 2004 to Sept 2005. When other soldiers, sailors, Marines, and airmen were doing three or four combat deployments, he was one and done. And he was injured by an IED, his Purple Heart, in October 2004, so we don't know exactly how much of that one year was actually combat time. He spent the rest of the time going to grad school and serving in various embassy and staff billets. That is not the resume of a war hero.

I've know officers like him, who padded their career with staff and diplomatic positions. They are competent paper shufflers, but hardly war heroes. They get by by kissing butts, not by doing things.

You're despicable dude.

Wow. You realize that is a veteran your talking to right?

Right, and he's calling an active duty service member with a purple heart a traitor, among other things.

You should read the glowing review his fellow Army Rangers gave him.

They tried to vote him out of the rangers. He was pushed thru anyway because of his proficiency in other languages.

He also doesnt have a bronze star. You might want to investigate why that is.

His own boss called him an activist in a uniform.
02-10-2020 03:39 PM
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