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ASun Committed to Expansion
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Yosef Himself Offline
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Post: #61
RE: ASun Committed to Expansion
(01-23-2020 07:25 AM)solohawks Wrote:  
(01-23-2020 01:20 AM)lion1983 Wrote:  
(01-23-2020 12:49 AM)solohawks Wrote:  
(01-23-2020 12:40 AM)lion1983 Wrote:  
(01-23-2020 12:17 AM)TDenverFan Wrote:  They're aiming to go to two conferences, that's the whole point of this plan.

ASun and a new United Athletic Conference, each would get an NCAA auto bid

The point of the two conferences is not what you think.

ALL 10 of the ASUN members will be part of the "New" ASUN...

The UAC (United Athletic Conference) will be a football only FCS conference that will accommodate the ASUN members with FCS football + Big South football members because the Big South will drop football from the conference.

The ASUN FCS schools will automatically have a home in FBS if they decided they wanted to move to FBS. Basically locking in UNA and Kennesaw State to the ASUN IF FBS aspirations come.

As far as other sports, it will be a dramatically improved conference.

If that were the case then why not just have the Big South drop FCS football sponsorship and the CCSA pick it up like the MVFC does?
That's exactly what is happening, just in a different name. The CCSA will turn into the "new" ASUN for legal reasons I guess. The old ASUN will turn into the UAC and only sponsor football. It's a weird loophole

So in simple terms, the CCSA=football only FCS UAC
The new 20 school conference will be the ASUN by transfer of name. The new 10 members will come out of the Sun Belt and C-USA. Them plus Liberty is a 10 school FBS conference, add UConn and UMass as football only members for 12.

KSU and UNA will play football in the FCS UAC. But will have a FBS home if they decided to go that route. If that happens, you have the 14 (football) team FBS ASUN conference. Could turn to 16 quickly if UNF and FGCU go through with their football studies.

I dont think so. The Asun wants both the new Asub and the UAC to have autobids
Yep. And why would the 5 all sport members of the Big South give up their power to join a new conference in just FB and lose their "power".


Liberty will probably try and lure FBS schools to the UAC but I don't think that'll happen.
01-23-2020 07:31 AM
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solohawks Online
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RE: ASun Committed to Expansion
(01-23-2020 07:31 AM)Yosef Himself Wrote:  Yep. And why would the 5 all sport members of the Big South give up their power to join a new conference in just FB and lose their "power".


Liberty will probably try and lure FBS schools to the UAC but I don't think that'll happen.

I think that is what is happening to

If this were just about FCS football an FCS football conference could be created no problem.

The only logical point for doing all this is because Liberty wants to start a new FBS conference and needs the ASun conference shell to do so. Liberty is trying to move the pieces around to make sure the current tenants of the ASun conference are taken care of while they come in and make it more to their liking

I dont think the NCAA is going to go for this but again Liberty usually gets what it wants from the NCAA so we will see.

If all this finagling can result in the Sunbelt or CUSA shutting down I think the NCAA will allow this new UAC to have that already established autobid
(This post was last modified: 01-23-2020 07:39 AM by solohawks.)
01-23-2020 07:39 AM
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BruceMcF Offline
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Post: #63
RE: ASun Committed to Expansion
(01-23-2020 07:39 AM)solohawks Wrote:  If all this finagling can result in the Sunbelt or CUSA shutting down I think the NCAA will allow this new UAC to have that already established autobid

Sure, if it's just a matter of swapping around existing autobids, the NCAA is not going to have the same adamant opposition, but then how do the 24 FBS schools in the two conferences squeeze into a single autobid?
01-23-2020 07:43 AM
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lion1983 Offline
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Post: #64
RE: ASun Committed to Expansion
(01-23-2020 07:25 AM)solohawks Wrote:  
(01-23-2020 01:20 AM)lion1983 Wrote:  
(01-23-2020 12:49 AM)solohawks Wrote:  
(01-23-2020 12:40 AM)lion1983 Wrote:  
(01-23-2020 12:17 AM)TDenverFan Wrote:  They're aiming to go to two conferences, that's the whole point of this plan.

ASun and a new United Athletic Conference, each would get an NCAA auto bid

The point of the two conferences is not what you think.

ALL 10 of the ASUN members will be part of the "New" ASUN...

The UAC (United Athletic Conference) will be a football only FCS conference that will accommodate the ASUN members with FCS football + Big South football members because the Big South will drop football from the conference.

The ASUN FCS schools will automatically have a home in FBS if they decided they wanted to move to FBS. Basically locking in UNA and Kennesaw State to the ASUN IF FBS aspirations come.

As far as other sports, it will be a dramatically improved conference.

If that were the case then why not just have the Big South drop FCS football sponsorship and the CCSA pick it up like the MVFC does?
That's exactly what is happening, just in a different name. The CCSA will turn into the "new" ASUN for legal reasons I guess. The old ASUN will turn into the UAC and only sponsor football. It's a weird loophole

So in simple terms, the CCSA=football only FCS UAC
The new 20 school conference will be the ASUN by transfer of name. The new 10 members will come out of the Sun Belt and C-USA. Them plus Liberty is a 10 school FBS conference, add UConn and UMass as football only members for 12.

KSU and UNA will play football in the FCS UAC. But will have a FBS home if they decided to go that route. If that happens, you have the 14 (football) team FBS ASUN conference. Could turn to 16 quickly if UNF and FGCU go through with their football studies.

I dont think so. The Asun wants both the new Asub and the UAC to have autobids
The UAC autobid will be for the FCS playoffs. It will be a FCS football only conference. The Big South will drop football from the conference and the Big South football schools will join the UAC for football only. It's not that complicated.
01-23-2020 07:50 AM
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Yosef Himself Offline
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Post: #65
RE: ASun Committed to Expansion
There's no incentive for the five Big South schools to go along with that.
01-23-2020 08:14 AM
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MUsince96 Offline
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RE: ASun Committed to Expansion
I need visuals to decipher that plan.

Or...

[Image: tumblr_ptzdnx2wY11r3ykuvo3_540.gifv]
01-23-2020 08:19 AM
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zibby Offline
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RE: ASun Committed to Expansion
(01-22-2020 06:17 PM)Blue_Trombone Wrote:  This is the beginning of the "New East Coast Conference" comprised of schools in the SunBelt and C-USA.

Couldn't they do this on their own? The C-USA East Division could bail then add App State, Georgia Southern and James Madison. Or another Sun Belt team. Or a C-USA West team.
01-23-2020 08:34 AM
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DoubleRSU Offline
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RE: ASun Committed to Expansion
LMAO at people thinking Liberty could lure FBS schools to the UAC. No college worth a damn is joining this.
01-23-2020 08:43 AM
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Crayton Offline
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RE: ASun Committed to Expansion
(01-22-2020 10:47 PM)Blue_Trombone Wrote:  I think one of the things people are missing is that the "ASUN 7" can be joined by any amount of other schools from the original conference. You could have a situation where some C-USA east and Sunbelt schools join the new conference, and then all the ASUN schools minus liberty go to the CCSA (to be renamed the ASUN, again).
Yes, essentially kicking out Liberty but giving them an auto bid with which to form a new D1 (even FBS?) conference. I think they’d have 2 years to get it done?
01-23-2020 09:03 AM
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Blue_Trombone Online
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RE: ASun Committed to Expansion
(01-23-2020 08:34 AM)zibby Wrote:  
(01-22-2020 06:17 PM)Blue_Trombone Wrote:  This is the beginning of the "New East Coast Conference" comprised of schools in the SunBelt and C-USA.

Couldn't they do this on their own? The C-USA East Division could bail then add App State, Georgia Southern and James Madison. Or another Sun Belt team. Or a C-USA West team.

It's possible they can't get a majority of each conference to buy off on it. If that's the case there will be no movement with just C-USA and SunBelt. With the UAC, it means the C-USA and SB East schools don't have to worry about what the West schools want/think.

It also means they don't have to worry about any potential "tag-alongs". Maybe GS, GSU, and App want to make a move, but don't want to include CCU. With a straight up swap everyone would have to be accounted for. By just making your own conference you can pick and choose which schools you want.
(This post was last modified: 01-23-2020 09:20 AM by Blue_Trombone.)
01-23-2020 09:12 AM
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RE: ASun Committed to Expansion
(01-23-2020 08:34 AM)zibby Wrote:  
(01-22-2020 06:17 PM)Blue_Trombone Wrote:  This is the beginning of the "New East Coast Conference" comprised of schools in the SunBelt and C-USA.

Couldn't they do this on their own? The C-USA East Division could bail then add App State, Georgia Southern and James Madison. Or another Sun Belt team. Or a C-USA West team.

We wouldn't have an autobid for many years. It seems they're going to create a new conference using the ASUN's continuity that will have the autobid. So why the CCSA? Why would this swimming & diving conference go along with the ASUN's plan? Take a look at it's membership. A lot of CUSA-E and Sun Belt-E teams that have in the past voiced displeasure of the spread out geography. I think Blue Trombone is right, this is the beginning of the east coast FBS conference. Sun Belt and CUSA were never going to sit down and work out swaps so the members had to work out some sort of coup. They may have figured it out. I don't understand the mechanics of it but I don't see any other reason the CCSA is going to go to great lengths to help ASUN expansion.
01-23-2020 09:15 AM
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RE: ASun Committed to Expansion
IF it's the beginnings of the FBS East Coast Conference, here's how I see it playing out:

1) ASUN expands to 20 teams. Right now the ASUN and CCSA are separate entities. ASUN still has their normal autobid and CCSA is still a single sport conference.

2) The ASUN 7 (plus UNA and Bellarmine, and maybe a few others D-II expansion candidates) join the CCSA. The CCSA is now a multisport conference. Due to the continuity rule (or whatever they decide to use) the CCSA now has an autobid as well. The expansion schools (lets just say CUSA-E, SB-E, and Liberty) stay in the ASUN.

3) The CCSA buys the ASUN brand from the original conference, and that conference rebrands as the UAC (this has to be a placeholder name, it is so uninspired)

4) Now BOTH the ASUN and the UAC have an autobid to the NCAA tournament. There is no more formal movement between these two conferences.

If the FBS idea is the case though, I have no idea how the UAC will become a signatory as a part of the CFP.
01-23-2020 09:31 AM
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RE: ASun Committed to Expansion
(01-23-2020 09:31 AM)Blue_Trombone Wrote:  IF it's the beginnings of the FBS East Coast Conference, here's how I see it playing out:

1) ASUN expands to 20 teams. Right now the ASUN and CCSA are separate entities. ASUN still has their normal autobid and CCSA is still a single sport conference.

2) The ASUN 7 (plus UNA and Bellarmine, and maybe a few others D-II expansion candidates) join the CCSA. The CCSA is now a multisport conference. Due to the continuity rule (or whatever they decide to use) the CCSA now has an autobid as well. The expansion schools (lets just say CUSA-E, SB-E, and Liberty) stay in the ASUN.

3) The CCSA buys the ASUN brand from the original conference, and that conference rebrands as the UAC (this has to be a placeholder name, it is so uninspired)

4) Now BOTH the ASUN and the UAC have an autobid to the NCAA tournament. There is no more formal movement between these two conferences.

If the FBS idea is the case though, I have no idea how the UAC will become a signatory as a part of the CFP.

It'd have to coincide with the resigning of the CFP contract (2024?). The other G5 won't like it but the P5 would throw a few more peanuts in the pile to avoid litigation maybe.
01-23-2020 09:36 AM
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solohawks Online
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RE: ASun Committed to Expansion
(01-23-2020 09:36 AM)mturn017 Wrote:  
(01-23-2020 09:31 AM)Blue_Trombone Wrote:  IF it's the beginnings of the FBS East Coast Conference, here's how I see it playing out:

1) ASUN expands to 20 teams. Right now the ASUN and CCSA are separate entities. ASUN still has their normal autobid and CCSA is still a single sport conference.

2) The ASUN 7 (plus UNA and Bellarmine, and maybe a few others D-II expansion candidates) join the CCSA. The CCSA is now a multisport conference. Due to the continuity rule (or whatever they decide to use) the CCSA now has an autobid as well. The expansion schools (lets just say CUSA-E, SB-E, and Liberty) stay in the ASUN.

3) The CCSA buys the ASUN brand from the original conference, and that conference rebrands as the UAC (this has to be a placeholder name, it is so uninspired)

4) Now BOTH the ASUN and the UAC have an autobid to the NCAA tournament. There is no more formal movement between these two conferences.

If the FBS idea is the case though, I have no idea how the UAC will become a signatory as a part of the CFP.

It'd have to coincide with the resigning of the CFP contract (2024?). The other G5 won't like it but the P5 would throw a few more peanuts in the pile to avoid litigation maybe.

If this expansion results in no net increase in the number of FBS conferences I doubt anyone will care.
01-23-2020 09:42 AM
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MUsince96 Offline
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Post: #75
RE: ASun Committed to Expansion
(01-23-2020 09:15 AM)mturn017 Wrote:  
(01-23-2020 08:34 AM)zibby Wrote:  
(01-22-2020 06:17 PM)Blue_Trombone Wrote:  This is the beginning of the "New East Coast Conference" comprised of schools in the SunBelt and C-USA.

Couldn't they do this on their own? The C-USA East Division could bail then add App State, Georgia Southern and James Madison. Or another Sun Belt team. Or a C-USA West team.

We wouldn't have an autobid for many years. It seems they're going to create a new conference using the ASUN's continuity that will have the autobid. So why the CCSA? Why would this swimming & diving conference go along with the ASUN's plan? Take a look at it's membership. A lot of CUSA-E and Sun Belt-E teams that have in the past voiced displeasure of the spread out geography. I think Blue Trombone is right, this is the beginning of the east coast FBS conference. Sun Belt and CUSA were never going to sit down and work out swaps so the members had to work out some sort of coup. They may have figured it out. I don't understand the mechanics of it but I don't see any other reason the CCSA is going to go to great lengths to help ASUN expansion.

This makes the most sense of anything I've read so far. Some CUSA-E and Sun Belt-E teams create a new FBS league through this plan. The left behind CUSA and Sun Belt schools would then merge, effectively killing either CUSA or the Sun Belt.

Thus, still leaving a group of 5. AAC, MWC, MAC, A-Sun, and CUSA or Sun Belt.
(This post was last modified: 01-23-2020 09:43 AM by MUsince96.)
01-23-2020 09:42 AM
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BruceMcF Offline
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Post: #76
RE: ASun Committed to Expansion
(01-23-2020 09:31 AM)Blue_Trombone Wrote:  IF it's the beginnings of the FBS East Coast Conference, here's how I see it playing out:

1) ASUN expands to 20 teams. Right now the ASUN and CCSA are separate entities. ASUN still has their normal autobid and CCSA is still a single sport conference.

2) The ASUN 7 (plus UNA and Bellarmine, and maybe a few others D-II expansion candidates) join the CCSA. The CCSA is now a multisport conference. Due to the continuity rule (or whatever they decide to use) the CCSA now has an autobid as well. ...

Except, they don't. The continuity rule for a multi-sports conference is eight years operating as a multi-sports conference.

The "whatever they decide to use" is they apply for a waiver of the requirement, as the new Big East did, though without the argument that the new Big East had, that the by laws for the C7 leaving their previous conference were created based on the previous continuity rule, and so they should be allowed to use the old rule.

And then, unlike the new Big East (which is not taking ANY at-large Tourney spots away from anybody with their autobid), the NCAA answers "please give use an extra annual NCAA tournament unit that we are not entitled to under the rules" with "No", and it's back to square one.
01-23-2020 09:50 AM
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lion1983 Offline
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Post: #77
RE: ASun Committed to Expansion
(01-23-2020 08:14 AM)Yosef Himself Wrote:  There's no incentive for the five Big South schools to go along with that.

They are already doing it, just with the Big South name. The ASUN and Big South already have an agreement for football together. If the ASUN pulls out, the Big South losses any power and an AQ spot in the FCS playoffs. This just changes the name, and puts any votes on equal terms. Most of the Big South does not play football. Monmouth is just a football only member. The Big South would then just concentrate on non football sports and everyone is happy. How is that so hard to understand?
01-23-2020 09:50 AM
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mturn017 Online
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RE: ASun Committed to Expansion
(01-23-2020 09:42 AM)MUsince96 Wrote:  
(01-23-2020 09:15 AM)mturn017 Wrote:  
(01-23-2020 08:34 AM)zibby Wrote:  
(01-22-2020 06:17 PM)Blue_Trombone Wrote:  This is the beginning of the "New East Coast Conference" comprised of schools in the SunBelt and C-USA.

Couldn't they do this on their own? The C-USA East Division could bail then add App State, Georgia Southern and James Madison. Or another Sun Belt team. Or a C-USA West team.

We wouldn't have an autobid for many years. It seems they're going to create a new conference using the ASUN's continuity that will have the autobid. So why the CCSA? Why would this swimming & diving conference go along with the ASUN's plan? Take a look at it's membership. A lot of CUSA-E and Sun Belt-E teams that have in the past voiced displeasure of the spread out geography. I think Blue Trombone is right, this is the beginning of the east coast FBS conference. Sun Belt and CUSA were never going to sit down and work out swaps so the members had to work out some sort of coup. They may have figured it out. I don't understand the mechanics of it but I don't see any other reason the CCSA is going to go to great lengths to help ASUN expansion.

This makes the most sense of anything I've read so far. Some CUSA-E and Sun Belt-E teams create a new FBS league through this plan. The left behind CUSA and Sun Belt schools would then merge, effectively killing either CUSA or the Sun Belt.

Thus, still leaving a group of 5. AAC, MWC, MAC, A-Sun, and CUSA or Sun Belt.

a) ASUN Conference expands to 20 members (by June, 2023)
let's say UCSA-E, App St and the two GA schools
b) The ASUN transfers rights to the ASUN name and marks to the CCSA
The CCSA just became the ASUN
c) The ASUN 7 join the CCSA (July 1, 2023)
The ASUN members move to their new conference making it an AQ for NCAA tourney. Probably all ASUN members but Liberty go.
d) The CCSA adopts the ASUN name as a multisport conference
Same ASUN as before (minus Liberty), Same name, Same everything
e) The remaining ASUN members adopt the name United Athletic Conference
A new FBS conference is born (I'd hope we change the name). In my scenario it has 11 members already, CUSA-E, App St , Ga So, Ga St & Liberty. We could fill out #12 with UAB or go to 14

We just have to give Side Show Joe his exit fees and leave the remaining members of the SB and CUSA to figure out what they're going to do. It'd be interesting if this is the case to see who the power brokers are in this scenario and who signs on. Basketball tourney in Atlanta or Charlotte.
(This post was last modified: 01-23-2020 09:54 AM by mturn017.)
01-23-2020 09:51 AM
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Post: #79
RE: ASun Committed to Expansion
(01-23-2020 09:51 AM)mturn017 Wrote:  
(01-23-2020 09:42 AM)MUsince96 Wrote:  
(01-23-2020 09:15 AM)mturn017 Wrote:  
(01-23-2020 08:34 AM)zibby Wrote:  
(01-22-2020 06:17 PM)Blue_Trombone Wrote:  This is the beginning of the "New East Coast Conference" comprised of schools in the SunBelt and C-USA.

Couldn't they do this on their own? The C-USA East Division could bail then add App State, Georgia Southern and James Madison. Or another Sun Belt team. Or a C-USA West team.

We wouldn't have an autobid for many years. It seems they're going to create a new conference using the ASUN's continuity that will have the autobid. So why the CCSA? Why would this swimming & diving conference go along with the ASUN's plan? Take a look at it's membership. A lot of CUSA-E and Sun Belt-E teams that have in the past voiced displeasure of the spread out geography. I think Blue Trombone is right, this is the beginning of the east coast FBS conference. Sun Belt and CUSA were never going to sit down and work out swaps so the members had to work out some sort of coup. They may have figured it out. I don't understand the mechanics of it but I don't see any other reason the CCSA is going to go to great lengths to help ASUN expansion.

This makes the most sense of anything I've read so far. Some CUSA-E and Sun Belt-E teams create a new FBS league through this plan. The left behind CUSA and Sun Belt schools would then merge, effectively killing either CUSA or the Sun Belt.

Thus, still leaving a group of 5. AAC, MWC, MAC, A-Sun, and CUSA or Sun Belt.

a) ASUN Conference expands to 20 members (by June, 2023)
let's say UCSA-E, App St and the two GA schools
b) The ASUN transfers rights to the ASUN name and marks to the CCSA
The CCSA just became the ASUN
c) The ASUN 7 join the CCSA (July 1, 2023)
The ASUN members move to their new conference making it an AQ for NCAA tourney. Probably all ASUN members but Liberty go.
d) The CCSA adopts the ASUN name as a multisport conference
Same ASUN as before (minus Liberty), Same name, Same everything
e) The remaining ASUN members adopt the name United Athletic Conference
A new FBS conference is born (I'd hope we change the name). In my scenario it has 11 members already, CUSA-E, App St , Ga So, Ga St & Liberty. We could fill out #12 with UAB or go to 14

We just have to give Side Show Joe his exit fees and leave the remaining members of the SB and CUSA to figure out what they're going to do. It'd be interesting if this is the case to see who the power brokers are in this scenario and who signs on. Basketball tourney in Atlanta or Charlotte.

I could most definitely live with this scenario.
01-23-2020 09:55 AM
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DoubleRSU Offline
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RE: ASun Committed to Expansion
App St leaving the Sun Belt for this thing LMAO!
01-23-2020 09:58 AM
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