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Seahawkhoops Offline
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Post: #841
RE: Coaching speculation
(03-18-2020 10:22 AM)82hawk Wrote:  
(03-18-2020 10:07 AM)Gary Miller Wrote:  
(03-18-2020 09:01 AM)dan10 Wrote:  I dont think Miller to Wake is that much of a long shot, to be honest. I do think they will throw darts at guys like Beilein, first, but realistically I think Miller is probably the guy at Wake. That is unless the virus makes them decide to go one more year with Manning. There is also no chance in hell he ends at JMU. A guy like Miller could end up at CofC but not JMU. CAA is worse than the SoCon right now so you would have to be serious to get his attention. Right now I saw on the JMU board that CofC pays the most at 650k for their coach. It would take closer to 1M to get Miller away from UNCG.

And yes the virus is strong in that group at JMU. Expectations and reality are only worlds apart. Their fanbase better be ready for a very swift letdown. Last spending numbers available was like 2.9M basketball budget for JMU, yet their fans think spending half of that on a coaching staff is realistic. If they did, they would really need coaches to be amazing since they would be hampered in recruiting budget.

It's pretty clear that JMU fans want a hire that will get their basketball program to a level where they can leave the CAA, so their football program can become bowl level. However, I've never gotten any indication from their administration that this is their goal. If they get Mike Jones, he would be a tremendous hire. It's pretty sad a lot of them consider him an underwhelming hire.

EZU has sucked at basketball forever and it hasn't hampered their moves in football conferences. Basketball isn't their path to a football conference either.
Big difference between going from smaller conf to a larger, or going from FCS Sub, to FCS. (And I'm the last to stick up for EZ)
03-18-2020 10:25 AM
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82hawk Offline
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Post: #842
RE: Coaching speculation
(03-18-2020 10:25 AM)Seahawkhoops Wrote:  
(03-18-2020 10:22 AM)82hawk Wrote:  
(03-18-2020 10:07 AM)Gary Miller Wrote:  
(03-18-2020 09:01 AM)dan10 Wrote:  I dont think Miller to Wake is that much of a long shot, to be honest. I do think they will throw darts at guys like Beilein, first, but realistically I think Miller is probably the guy at Wake. That is unless the virus makes them decide to go one more year with Manning. There is also no chance in hell he ends at JMU. A guy like Miller could end up at CofC but not JMU. CAA is worse than the SoCon right now so you would have to be serious to get his attention. Right now I saw on the JMU board that CofC pays the most at 650k for their coach. It would take closer to 1M to get Miller away from UNCG.

And yes the virus is strong in that group at JMU. Expectations and reality are only worlds apart. Their fanbase better be ready for a very swift letdown. Last spending numbers available was like 2.9M basketball budget for JMU, yet their fans think spending half of that on a coaching staff is realistic. If they did, they would really need coaches to be amazing since they would be hampered in recruiting budget.

It's pretty clear that JMU fans want a hire that will get their basketball program to a level where they can leave the CAA, so their football program can become bowl level. However, I've never gotten any indication from their administration that this is their goal. If they get Mike Jones, he would be a tremendous hire. It's pretty sad a lot of them consider him an underwhelming hire.

EZU has sucked at basketball forever and it hasn't hampered their moves in football conferences. Basketball isn't their path to a football conference either.
Big difference between going from smaller conf to a larger, or going from FCS Sub, to FCS. (And I'm the last to stick up for EZ)

True. But basketball isn't really a consideration if they want to go to an fbs football conference. That's not how they make decisions to invite any schools that i've heard of. App state is a great example. They went FBS and have sucked at basketball forever as well.
03-18-2020 10:33 AM
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Seahawkhoops Offline
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Post: #843
RE: Coaching speculation
(03-18-2020 10:33 AM)82hawk Wrote:  
(03-18-2020 10:25 AM)Seahawkhoops Wrote:  
(03-18-2020 10:22 AM)82hawk Wrote:  
(03-18-2020 10:07 AM)Gary Miller Wrote:  
(03-18-2020 09:01 AM)dan10 Wrote:  I dont think Miller to Wake is that much of a long shot, to be honest. I do think they will throw darts at guys like Beilein, first, but realistically I think Miller is probably the guy at Wake. That is unless the virus makes them decide to go one more year with Manning. There is also no chance in hell he ends at JMU. A guy like Miller could end up at CofC but not JMU. CAA is worse than the SoCon right now so you would have to be serious to get his attention. Right now I saw on the JMU board that CofC pays the most at 650k for their coach. It would take closer to 1M to get Miller away from UNCG.

And yes the virus is strong in that group at JMU. Expectations and reality are only worlds apart. Their fanbase better be ready for a very swift letdown. Last spending numbers available was like 2.9M basketball budget for JMU, yet their fans think spending half of that on a coaching staff is realistic. If they did, they would really need coaches to be amazing since they would be hampered in recruiting budget.

It's pretty clear that JMU fans want a hire that will get their basketball program to a level where they can leave the CAA, so their football program can become bowl level. However, I've never gotten any indication from their administration that this is their goal. If they get Mike Jones, he would be a tremendous hire. It's pretty sad a lot of them consider him an underwhelming hire.

EZU has sucked at basketball forever and it hasn't hampered their moves in football conferences. Basketball isn't their path to a football conference either.
Big difference between going from smaller conf to a larger, or going from FCS Sub, to FCS. (And I'm the last to stick up for EZ)

True. But basketball isn't really a consideration if they want to go to an fbs football conference. That's not how they make decisions to invite any schools that i've heard of. App state is a great example. They went FBS and have sucked at basketball forever as well.

In the 3 years prior to the transition to FBS for Ap, they were around .500 in hoops. While not great, it was serviceable and showed improvement from historic numbers. I have no idea how much difference that did or didn't make, but it's worth mentioning.
03-18-2020 10:43 AM
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82hawk Offline
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Post: #844
RE: Coaching speculation
(03-18-2020 10:43 AM)Seahawkhoops Wrote:  
(03-18-2020 10:33 AM)82hawk Wrote:  
(03-18-2020 10:25 AM)Seahawkhoops Wrote:  
(03-18-2020 10:22 AM)82hawk Wrote:  
(03-18-2020 10:07 AM)Gary Miller Wrote:  It's pretty clear that JMU fans want a hire that will get their basketball program to a level where they can leave the CAA, so their football program can become bowl level. However, I've never gotten any indication from their administration that this is their goal. If they get Mike Jones, he would be a tremendous hire. It's pretty sad a lot of them consider him an underwhelming hire.

EZU has sucked at basketball forever and it hasn't hampered their moves in football conferences. Basketball isn't their path to a football conference either.
Big difference between going from smaller conf to a larger, or going from FCS Sub, to FCS. (And I'm the last to stick up for EZ)

True. But basketball isn't really a consideration if they want to go to an fbs football conference. That's not how they make decisions to invite any schools that i've heard of. App state is a great example. They went FBS and have sucked at basketball forever as well.

In the 3 years prior to the transition to FBS for Ap, they were around .500 in hoops. While not great, it was serviceable and showed improvement from historic numbers. I have no idea how much difference that did or didn't make, but it's worth mentioning.


JMU was far better than .500 under their previous coach and they still didn't make the leap. My point is that JMU fans have convinced themselves that the ticket to FBS is better basketball and there is simply no evidence that is true.
03-18-2020 11:20 AM
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SEA33HAWK Offline
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Post: #845
RE: Coaching speculation
It seems that fans of football schools tend to expect their basketball programs to be just as successful as their football. Even though they don't get the same type of financial support. Clemson is a prime example.
(This post was last modified: 03-18-2020 11:54 AM by SEA33HAWK.)
03-18-2020 11:52 AM
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Seahawk Nation 08 Offline
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Post: #846
RE: Coaching speculation
App's win @ Michigan had to play a big factor in them making the jump. Granted, JMU football did beat Virginia Tech.

If serviceable is all that is needed for basketball, then Mike Jones more than foots the bill. I don't get why so many of them seem hell bent on spending nearly $1M on their basketball coach. Even $500K seems unreasonable and yet that seems to be the bare minimum expectation for many of them.
(This post was last modified: 03-18-2020 12:03 PM by Seahawk Nation 08.)
03-18-2020 12:03 PM
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Seahawk2010 Offline
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Post: #847
RE: Coaching speculation
(03-18-2020 11:52 AM)SEA33HAWK Wrote:  It seems that fans of football schools tend to expect their basketball programs to be just as successful as their football. Even though they don't get the same type of financial support. Clemson is a prime example.

Clemson in no way expects their basketball to compete for Final Fours and Championships every year like their football team. Brownell has been average (2 NCAA Tourney appearances) over his tenure there and he will be back for an 11th year! They know who they are.

Now State is a better example, except their football and basketball programs are both average.
03-18-2020 05:28 PM
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CG_Hawk06 Offline
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Post: #848
RE: Coaching speculation
(03-18-2020 11:52 AM)SEA33HAWK Wrote:  It seems that fans of football schools tend to expect their basketball programs to be just as successful as their football. Even though they don't get the same type of financial support. Clemson is a prime example.

I think Alabama is in the same realm, maybe even less support than Clemson gets.
03-18-2020 05:50 PM
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SEA33HAWK Offline
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Post: #849
RE: Coaching speculation
(03-18-2020 05:28 PM)Seahawk2010 Wrote:  
(03-18-2020 11:52 AM)SEA33HAWK Wrote:  It seems that fans of football schools tend to expect their basketball programs to be just as successful as their football. Even though they don't get the same type of financial support. Clemson is a prime example.

Clemson in no way expects their basketball to compete for Final Fours and Championships every year like their football team. Brownell has been average (2 NCAA Tourney appearances) over his tenure there and he will be back for an 11th year! They know who they are.

Now State is a better example, except their football and basketball programs are both average.

Wrong. I am a lifetime Clemson fan with family ties. I'm on their fan boards a lot. The fans, not the admins, don't appreciate what Brad has had to work with. Many want him gone, thinking he is the sole problem. Many Clemson fans don't bother to follow basketball, but still want to put their two cents worth in. Dabo has spoiled them with football success.
03-18-2020 06:26 PM
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Seahawk2010 Offline
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Post: #850
RE: Coaching speculation
(03-18-2020 06:26 PM)SEA33HAWK Wrote:  
(03-18-2020 05:28 PM)Seahawk2010 Wrote:  
(03-18-2020 11:52 AM)SEA33HAWK Wrote:  It seems that fans of football schools tend to expect their basketball programs to be just as successful as their football. Even though they don't get the same type of financial support. Clemson is a prime example.

Clemson in no way expects their basketball to compete for Final Fours and Championships every year like their football team. Brownell has been average (2 NCAA Tourney appearances) over his tenure there and he will be back for an 11th year! They know who they are.

Now State is a better example, except their football and basketball programs are both average.

Wrong. I am a lifetime Clemson fan with family ties. I'm on their fan boards a lot. The fans, not the admins, don't appreciate what Brad has had to work with. Many want him gone, thinking he is the sole problem. Many Clemson fans don't bother to follow basketball, but still want to put their two cents worth in. Dabo has spoiled them with football success.

There is a difference between expecting basketball championships every year vs making the NCAA Tourney every year. The sane and rational Clemson fans do not expect them to compete for Final Fours every year. A lot of message board warriors are not rational, but are the most vocal. Clemson is a football school through and through and was a football school before Dabo. Now has Brownell underachieved in his tenure there? Yes. Clemson fans should expect to go to the NCAA Touney more than two times in 10 seasons.
03-20-2020 09:51 AM
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SEA33HAWK Offline
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Post: #851
RE: Coaching speculation
(03-20-2020 09:51 AM)Seahawk2010 Wrote:  
(03-18-2020 06:26 PM)SEA33HAWK Wrote:  
(03-18-2020 05:28 PM)Seahawk2010 Wrote:  
(03-18-2020 11:52 AM)SEA33HAWK Wrote:  It seems that fans of football schools tend to expect their basketball programs to be just as successful as their football. Even though they don't get the same type of financial support. Clemson is a prime example.

Clemson in no way expects their basketball to compete for Final Fours and Championships every year like their football team. Brownell has been average (2 NCAA Tourney appearances) over his tenure there and he will be back for an 11th year! They know who they are.

Now State is a better example, except their football and basketball programs are both average.

Wrong. I am a lifetime Clemson fan with family ties. I'm on their fan boards a lot. The fans, not the admins, don't appreciate what Brad has had to work with. Many want him gone, thinking he is the sole problem. Many Clemson fans don't bother to follow basketball, but still want to put their two cents worth in. Dabo has spoiled them with football success.

There is a difference between expecting basketball championships every year vs making the NCAA Tourney every year. The sane and rational Clemson fans do not expect them to compete for Final Fours every year. A lot of message board warriors are not rational, but are the most vocal. Clemson is a football school through and through and was a football school before Dabo. Now has Brownell underachieved in his tenure there? Yes. Clemson fans should expect to go to the NCAA Touney more than two times in 10 seasons.

That's a nice argument to a Clemson outsider. But don't pretend you know Clemson fans. And you certainly don't know the lack of support for basketball. It's a football school in a basketball conference. That's why Rick Barnes left. He couldn't get the support he needed to help recruit against Duke, UNC and even N.C. State. When Brownell arrived plans were to downsize Littlejohn. He's at least been able to dispell that notion. Can he coach? This year he started with four key injuries and had some bad losses. Add to it this being a rebuilding year. With that said, this year he became the winningest Clemson coach, became the only coach in Clemson history to win at UNC. He also became the only coach to beat three top 6 teams in the same season. And many still are calling for his head. The people I'm listening to are longtime donors. He should have made the NCAA more than twice. Came close a few times where, had he been in most any other conference, he would have made it. He is finally bringing in better talent. He all but had Zion until Duke's other recruits convinced him to go there. And the winning expectations in football now carries over to their other sports. They've seen him make the Sweet 16, and they now expect more. Sadly many think it can only happen with another coach. I personally think Brad is the right fit. And I believe they are finally getting better recruiting exposure, some comes from piggybacking on football. It's still going to be difficult being in the ACC.
03-20-2020 10:31 AM
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Seahawk Nation 08 Offline
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Post: #852
RE: Coaching speculation
Its been all but confirmed that Mark Byington interviewed at JMU this week:

Quote:@Shane_DNRSports
Just confirmed Georgia Southern's Mark Byington was in Harrisonburg two days ago. The AD who hired him there left Ga. Southern for Ole Miss earlier this year. #JMU


Shane Mettlen covers JMU sports for the Daily News Record in Harrisonburg.

Byington is from Salem, VA.


As expected, lots of JMU fans would not be happy with hiring Byington because he hasn't yet been to the NCAA Tournament with GSU. Amazing.
(This post was last modified: 03-20-2020 11:08 AM by Seahawk Nation 08.)
03-20-2020 11:03 AM
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Gary Miller Offline
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Post: #853
RE: Coaching speculation
(03-20-2020 11:03 AM)Seahawk Nation 08 Wrote:  Its been all but confirmed that Mark Byington interviewed at JMU this week:

Quote:@Shane_DNRSports
Just confirmed Georgia Southern's Mark Byington was in Harrisonburg two days ago. The AD who hired him there left Ga. Southern for Ole Miss earlier this year. #JMU


Shane Mettlen covers JMU sports for the Daily News Record in Harrisonburg.

Byington is from Salem, VA.


As expected, lots of JMU fans would not be happy with hiring Byington because he hasn't yet been to the NCAA Tournament with GSU. Amazing.

I didn't realize the AD that hired him wasn't there anymore... Wonder what happened with Mike Jones. Sounded like he was ready to take the job last week now he's not even being mentioned.
(This post was last modified: 03-20-2020 11:40 AM by Gary Miller.)
03-20-2020 11:40 AM
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Seahawk2010 Offline
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Post: #854
RE: Coaching speculation
(03-20-2020 10:31 AM)SEA33HAWK Wrote:  
(03-20-2020 09:51 AM)Seahawk2010 Wrote:  
(03-18-2020 06:26 PM)SEA33HAWK Wrote:  
(03-18-2020 05:28 PM)Seahawk2010 Wrote:  
(03-18-2020 11:52 AM)SEA33HAWK Wrote:  It seems that fans of football schools tend to expect their basketball programs to be just as successful as their football. Even though they don't get the same type of financial support. Clemson is a prime example.

Clemson in no way expects their basketball to compete for Final Fours and Championships every year like their football team. Brownell has been average (2 NCAA Tourney appearances) over his tenure there and he will be back for an 11th year! They know who they are.

Now State is a better example, except their football and basketball programs are both average.

Wrong. I am a lifetime Clemson fan with family ties. I'm on their fan boards a lot. The fans, not the admins, don't appreciate what Brad has had to work with. Many want him gone, thinking he is the sole problem. Many Clemson fans don't bother to follow basketball, but still want to put their two cents worth in. Dabo has spoiled them with football success.

There is a difference between expecting basketball championships every year vs making the NCAA Tourney every year. The sane and rational Clemson fans do not expect them to compete for Final Fours every year. A lot of message board warriors are not rational, but are the most vocal. Clemson is a football school through and through and was a football school before Dabo. Now has Brownell underachieved in his tenure there? Yes. Clemson fans should expect to go to the NCAA Touney more than two times in 10 seasons.

That's a nice argument to a Clemson outsider. But don't pretend you know Clemson fans. And you certainly don't know the lack of support for basketball. It's a football school in a basketball conference. That's why Rick Barnes left. He couldn't get the support he needed to help recruit against Duke, UNC and even N.C. State. When Brownell arrived plans were to downsize Littlejohn. He's at least been able to dispell that notion. Can he coach? This year he started with four key injuries and had some bad losses. Add to it this being a rebuilding year. With that said, this year he became the winningest Clemson coach, became the only coach in Clemson history to win at UNC. He also became the only coach to beat three top 6 teams in the same season. And many still are calling for his head. The people I'm listening to are longtime donors. He should have made the NCAA more than twice. Came close a few times where, had he been in most any other conference, he would have made it. He is finally bringing in better talent. He all but had Zion until Duke's other recruits convinced him to go there. And the winning expectations in football now carries over to their other sports. They've seen him make the Sweet 16, and they now expect more. Sadly many think it can only happen with another coach. I personally think Brad is the right fit. And I believe they are finally getting better recruiting exposure, some comes from piggybacking on football. It's still going to be difficult being in the ACC.

Simmer down with your condescending words. I do know Clemson fans. Multiple in my professional and personal life. None of them really care that much about basketball. Yes, they want to win and have a great season but their yearly expectations are pretty low. That explains why Brownell has kept his job for so long. Heck, a couple of the people are way more into baseball than basketball.
(This post was last modified: 03-20-2020 12:45 PM by Seahawk2010.)
03-20-2020 12:42 PM
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SEA33HAWK Offline
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Post: #855
RE: Coaching speculation
Not hot at all. Got my bourbon and ginger out on the patio chillaxin. And I agree with you on fans not caring about Clemson basketball. Doesn't change the fact that many want Brad gone. And no offense, but your reference to knowing Clemson fans make me think of the term "I've got black friends". Try living in it for 60 years.
03-20-2020 01:01 PM
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dan10 Offline
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Post: #856
RE: Coaching speculation
Speaking of support as of 2018...


Recruiting expenses:
Clemson- 2.79M
Duke- 1.83M
NC State- 1.54M
UNC- 1.46M

Operating expenses:
Duke- 4.16M
UNC- 3.62M
NC State- 1.58M
Clemson- 1.13M

Total Expenses:
Duke- 22.18M
UNC- 11.20M
NC State- 10.30M
Clemson- 8.23M

Clemson only spends more on men's basketball than Georgia Tech and Boston College, everyone else outspends them in the ACC
(This post was last modified: 03-24-2020 10:07 AM by dan10.)
03-24-2020 10:06 AM
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SEA33HAWK Offline
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Post: #857
RE: Coaching speculation
The Clemson Basketball team officially added two players to its program today. PJ Hall and Olivier-Maxence Prosper signed their Letters of Intent today and that gives Brownell a 2020 class that ranks 31st nationally in the 247 class rankings.

Hall is a 6′ 10 forward out of Dorman that already weighs 235 lbs. ESPN and 247 both have him as a 4 star and ESPN lists him as the 60th best player in the country. He’s the top prospect in the state and is rated number 10 in the nation at his position. 247 has him #61 overall and Rivals has him #62. He’s the 3rd best prospect to ever sign on to play basketball at Clemson. He chose Clemson over Virginia Tech, Florida, Tennessee, Georgia Tech and South Carolina among others.

Prosper is a 6’7 forward out of Montreal and is also rated as a 4 star prospect. 247 has him at #82 overall and as the 15th best power forward in the country. He’s also listed as the 3rd best prospect overall in Canada. He is the 4th best prospect to ever sign at Clemson and chose the Tigers over Cal, Baylor, and Stanford.
This class will hopefully help to build some momentum on the recruiting trail for Brownell. Convincing high level players to come to Clemson has been a tough sell over the years, but Brownell has managed to put some nice pieces for the future in place that he got over the offseason via the transfer market. Adding these two players is a big step in the right direction.
03-26-2020 10:53 PM
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82hawk Offline
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Post: #858
RE: Coaching speculation
Can we create a off topic thread fot this. It's cool and all, but now has zero to do with UNCW.
03-27-2020 05:56 AM
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SEA33HAWK Offline
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RE: Coaching speculation
(03-27-2020 05:56 AM)82hawk Wrote:  Can we create a off topic thread fot this. It's cool and all, but now has zero to do with UNCW.

I agree it needs to be moved to a thread of it's own. But but Brownell will always be a part of UNCW.
03-27-2020 07:19 AM
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CG_Hawk06 Offline
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Coaching speculation
(03-27-2020 07:19 AM)SEA33HAWK Wrote:  
(03-27-2020 05:56 AM)82hawk Wrote:  Can we create a off topic thread fot this. It's cool and all, but now has zero to do with UNCW.

I agree it needs to be moved to a thread of it's own. But but Brownell will always be a part of UNCW.


Just copy and paste your post and create a new “Clemson Basketball” thread in the Off Topic section.


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03-27-2020 09:04 AM
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