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Cayman Islands Gm 3: Loyola Chicago - Wed 11/27, 11:00am
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Gilesfan Offline
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Post: #41
RE: Cayman Islands Gm 3: Loyola Chicago - Wed 11/27, 11:00am
We are def. fouling too much. Defensive performance in 3 of the last 4 games has been really bad though some of that is because we've been behind and had to foul. We defended the 3 point line much better in the last 3 games but fouled too much.

Offensively, that was was a little bit better and enough to win if we had a decent defensive performance. Doing good on the offensive glass...not getting to the free throw line enough. Our guys seem to try to avoid contact. We aren't shooting enough 3s, too many long jumpers.

Green has to get going. He has the talent to be the man on offense but he has too many costly turnovers and bad shots.

The growth of Reece would be a boost. Hopefully Oliver can play right away and Green gets better. Dickens isn't giving us much right now and Kalu is fouling too often.
11-27-2019 02:49 PM
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Monarchblue Offline
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Cayman Islands Gm 3: Loyola Chicago - Wed 11/27, 11:00am
This team struggles to get offense for all the reasons posted above, but there are a couple things they can do, and we're doing in the earlier games.

1. Jeff is going to have to be flexible in his "defensive principles" to allow this team to create some turnovers and transition points.

2. Curry needs to have the ball in his hands late in the shot click not Green. Green can't create, but he can score if Curry creates and dishes to him. Curry can also get his own shot.

3. Wade has to shoot 3s. I don't care if he shoots 20%. He has to take the shots so defenders will guard him. He is not getting the drives to the basket that he was getting earlier this season now that opponents have figured out he won't shoot.

4. Everyone else that can shoot has to shoot when they are wide open. That is Curry, Kalu, Reece.

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11-27-2019 04:03 PM
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ODU BBALL Offline
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RE: Cayman Islands Gm 3: Loyola Chicago - Wed 11/27, 11:00am
(11-27-2019 01:54 PM)JJMonarch Wrote:  Our lack of an inside scorer is killing the entire offense. No team is collapsing on us when we do get the ball in the post. When we do throw the ball in the paint the opposing team just locks down even more on our shooters. Therefore, nobody is open. We will struggle to get 55 points against everyone if our bigs don’t figure out how to score. Maybe Reece playing the 4 some will open it up a little. He at least seems to be aggressive looking to get a shot.

As much as I like Carver, it’s much like watching our offense struggle when Denzel Taylor played. Carver had the ball on a couple of possessions from about 10 feet. There wasn’t anyone within 5 feet of him and he is looking to pass. Who are you going to throw it to? We really need 5 guys that would at try to score.

I agree and it is nice to hear from someone else that sees the same issues as you and ODUBB35 have. I also agree with some of what Monarchblue has stated, especially regarding Jeff needing to be flexible in his "defensive principals".

After yesterday's game my wife and I were discussing the game and I expressed to her that I felt that with this particular team Jeff needed to play a full court press defense in order to -

1). Take advantage of his depth and wear the opponent down:
Starters - 1 Curry, 2 Godwin, 3 Green, 4 Carver, 5 Dickins
Bench - 1 Hunter, 2 Oliver II, 3 Wade, 4 Reece, 5 Ezikpe

2). To create steals in the back court and mid court that lead to easy baskets.

3). To create turnovers via 5 second counts, 10 second counts, traveling, throw aways, stepping on the sideline, and via offensive fouls.

4). To cause the opponent to use up much of the shot clock before ever getting into their half court offense.

5). To make the opponent (in some cases) play at a faster pace than they want to.

I was semi encouraged to hear Jeff's post game comments today when he said that he may have to play a little bit more full court press, although he said he didn't feel he could play it too much as he had concerns about the depth of the team. I strongly disagree with him on the depth part, especially in another 2 or 3 weeks when Oliver II will be available, and on top of that whenever Karaiskos is available he will hopefully add even more depth.

In short, I don't see ODU has having a bunch of really good outside shooters. Maybe those that have played thus far will improve in the upcoming games going forward. Maybe Oliver II will come out shooting 40% and open things up more for the other shooters to do better. Unless things improve significantly, they don't have a strong inside presence either which hurts their half court offense. In recent years when ODU also had poor shooting teams it was often said that ODU's best offense was a missed shot since they frequently got the offensive rebound and cashed in with the follow shot. That hasn't happened very often thus far this year, because they don't rebound as well, because they aren't as big and talented inside. At this point they need to get more easy shots in the form of break away layups and wide open 3 point looks as a result of 2 on 1 breaks off a steal and such. If I was the coach I would definitely try something different than what he likes to do - i.e. full court press, then drop back into a pressure/attacking half court defense. Not saying Jeff will go that route however.
(This post was last modified: 11-27-2019 10:26 PM by ODU BBALL.)
11-27-2019 05:04 PM
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ODUDJ96 Offline
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Post: #44
RE: Cayman Islands Gm 3: Loyola Chicago - Wed 11/27, 11:00am
(11-27-2019 05:04 PM)ODU BBALL Wrote:  
(11-27-2019 01:54 PM)JJMonarch Wrote:  Our lack of an inside scorer is killing the entire offense. No team is collapsing on us when we do get the ball in the post. When we do throw the ball in the paint the opposing team just locks down even more on our shooters. Therefore, nobody is open. We will struggle to get 55 points against everyone if our bigs don’t figure out how to score. Maybe Reece playing the 4 some will open it up a little. He at least seems to be aggressive looking to get a shot.

As much as I like Carver, it’s much like watching our offense struggle when Denzel Taylor played. Carver had the ball on a couple of possessions from about 10 feet. There wasn’t anyone within 5 feet of him and he is looking to pass. Who are you going to throw it to? We really need 5 guys that would at try to score.

I agree and it is nice to hear from someone else that sees the same issues as you and ODUBB35 have. I also agree with some of what Monarchblue has stated, especially regarding Jeff needing to be flexible in his "defensive principals".

After yesterday's game my wife and I were discussing the game and I expressed to her that I felt that with this particular team Jeff needed to play a full court press defense in order to -

1). Take advantage of his depth and wear the opponent down:
Starters - 1 Curry, 2 Godwin, 3 Green, 4 Carver, 5 Dickins
Bench - 1 Hunter, 2 Oliver II, 3 Wade, 4 Reece, 5 Ezikpe

2). To create steals that in the back court and mid court that lead to easy baskets.

3). To create turnovers via 5 second counts, 10 second counts, traveling, throw aways, stepping on the sideline, and via offensive fouls.

4). To cause the opponent to use up much of the shot clock before ever getting into their half court offense.

5). To make the opponent (in some cases) play at a faster pace than they want to.

I was semi encouraged to hear Jeff's post game comments today when he said that he may have to play a little bit more full court press, although he said he didn't feel he could play it too much as he had concerns about the depth of the team. I strongly disagree with him on the depth part, especially in another 2 or 3 weeks when Oliver II will be available, and on top of that whenever Karaiskos is available he will hopefully add even more depth.

In short, I don't see ODU has having a bunch of really good outside shooters. Maybe those that have played thus far will improve in the upcoming games going forward. Maybe Oliver II will come out shooting 40% and open things up more for the other shooters to do better. Unless things improve significantly, they don't have a strong inside presence either which hurts their half court offense. In recent years when ODU also had poor shooting teams it was often said that ODU's best offense was a missed shot since they frequently got the offensive rebound and cashed in with the follow shot. That hasn't happened very often thus far this year, because they don't rebound as well, because they aren't as big and talented inside. At this point they need to get more easy shots in the form of break away layups and wide open 3 point looks as a result of 2 on 1 breaks off a steal and such. If I was the coach I would definitely try something different than what he likes to do - i.e. full court press, then drop back into a pressure/attacking half court defense. Not saying Jeff will go that route however.

Excellent post. Could not agree more. What Oliver will add and Joe Reece’s development are the big unknowns at this point. Joe flashed today. I still remember the first time I saw Freeman play and it was obvious he was special. I’m hopeful Oliver is another key add to our team (although I’m guessing not Freeman level, but one can hope). We need it desperately at this point.
11-27-2019 07:34 PM
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JJMonarch Offline
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Post: #45
RE: Cayman Islands Gm 3: Loyola Chicago - Wed 11/27, 11:00am
(11-27-2019 07:34 PM)ODUDJ96 Wrote:  
(11-27-2019 05:04 PM)ODU BBALL Wrote:  
(11-27-2019 01:54 PM)JJMonarch Wrote:  Our lack of an inside scorer is killing the entire offense. No team is collapsing on us when we do get the ball in the post. When we do throw the ball in the paint the opposing team just locks down even more on our shooters. Therefore, nobody is open. We will struggle to get 55 points against everyone if our bigs don’t figure out how to score. Maybe Reece playing the 4 some will open it up a little. He at least seems to be aggressive looking to get a shot.

As much as I like Carver, it’s much like watching our offense struggle when Denzel Taylor played. Carver had the ball on a couple of possessions from about 10 feet. There wasn’t anyone within 5 feet of him and he is looking to pass. Who are you going to throw it to? We really need 5 guys that would at try to score.

I agree and it is nice to hear from someone else that sees the same issues as you and ODUBB35 have. I also agree with some of what Monarchblue has stated, especially regarding Jeff needing to be flexible in his "defensive principals".

After yesterday's game my wife and I were discussing the game and I expressed to her that I felt that with this particular team Jeff needed to play a full court press defense in order to -

1). Take advantage of his depth and wear the opponent down:
Starters - 1 Curry, 2 Godwin, 3 Green, 4 Carver, 5 Dickins
Bench - 1 Hunter, 2 Oliver II, 3 Wade, 4 Reece, 5 Ezikpe

2). To create steals that in the back court and mid court that lead to easy baskets.

3). To create turnovers via 5 second counts, 10 second counts, traveling, throw aways, stepping on the sideline, and via offensive fouls.

4). To cause the opponent to use up much of the shot clock before ever getting into their half court offense.

5). To make the opponent (in some cases) play at a faster pace than they want to.

I was semi encouraged to hear Jeff's post game comments today when he said that he may have to play a little bit more full court press, although he said he didn't feel he could play it too much as he had concerns about the depth of the team. I strongly disagree with him on the depth part, especially in another 2 or 3 weeks when Oliver II will be available, and on top of that whenever Karaiskos is available he will hopefully add even more depth.

In short, I don't see ODU has having a bunch of really good outside shooters. Maybe those that have played thus far will improve in the upcoming games going forward. Maybe Oliver II will come out shooting 40% and open things up more for the other shooters to do better. Unless things improve significantly, they don't have a strong inside presence either which hurts their half court offense. In recent years when ODU also had poor shooting teams it was often said that ODU's best offense was a missed shot since they frequently got the offensive rebound and cashed in with the follow shot. That hasn't happened very often thus far this year, because they don't rebound as well, because they aren't as big and talented inside. At this point they need to get more easy shots in the form of break away layups and wide open 3 point looks as a result of 2 on 1 breaks off a steal and such. If I was the coach I would definitely try something different than what he likes to do - i.e. full court press, then drop back into a pressure/attacking half court defense. Not saying Jeff will go that route however.

Excellent post. Could not agree more. What Oliver will add and Joe Reece’s development are the big unknowns at this point. Joe flashed today. I still remember the first time I saw Freeman play and it was obvious he was special. I’m hopeful Oliver is another key add to our team (although I’m guessing not Freeman level, but one can hope). We need it desperately at this point.

I would love to see us play up tempo as well. Sure, we will make mistakes and probably have some crazy bad turnovers but our athleticism may get some easy baskets and create some open threes. The commentators today mentioned several times how much more athletic we looked than Loyola, however or pace of play was no faster than theirs. We needed to wear out that 6’9” kid and make him work. I know at least once he brought the ball up against our press. Let him do that about 5 times in a half and see how good his touch is then.
11-27-2019 07:58 PM
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VB Monarch Offline
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RE: Cayman Islands Gm 3: Loyola Chicago - Wed 11/27, 11:00am
(11-27-2019 07:58 PM)JJMonarch Wrote:  
(11-27-2019 07:34 PM)ODUDJ96 Wrote:  
(11-27-2019 05:04 PM)ODU BBALL Wrote:  
(11-27-2019 01:54 PM)JJMonarch Wrote:  Our lack of an inside scorer is killing the entire offense. No team is collapsing on us when we do get the ball in the post. When we do throw the ball in the paint the opposing team just locks down even more on our shooters. Therefore, nobody is open. We will struggle to get 55 points against everyone if our bigs don’t figure out how to score. Maybe Reece playing the 4 some will open it up a little. He at least seems to be aggressive looking to get a shot.

As much as I like Carver, it’s much like watching our offense struggle when Denzel Taylor played. Carver had the ball on a couple of possessions from about 10 feet. There wasn’t anyone within 5 feet of him and he is looking to pass. Who are you going to throw it to? We really need 5 guys that would at try to score.

I agree and it is nice to hear from someone else that sees the same issues as you and ODUBB35 have. I also agree with some of what Monarchblue has stated, especially regarding Jeff needing to be flexible in his "defensive principals".

After yesterday's game my wife and I were discussing the game and I expressed to her that I felt that with this particular team Jeff needed to play a full court press defense in order to -

1). Take advantage of his depth and wear the opponent down:
Starters - 1 Curry, 2 Godwin, 3 Green, 4 Carver, 5 Dickins
Bench - 1 Hunter, 2 Oliver II, 3 Wade, 4 Reece, 5 Ezikpe

2). To create steals that in the back court and mid court that lead to easy baskets.

3). To create turnovers via 5 second counts, 10 second counts, traveling, throw aways, stepping on the sideline, and via offensive fouls.

4). To cause the opponent to use up much of the shot clock before ever getting into their half court offense.

5). To make the opponent (in some cases) play at a faster pace than they want to.

I was semi encouraged to hear Jeff's post game comments today when he said that he may have to play a little bit more full court press, although he said he didn't feel he could play it too much as he had concerns about the depth of the team. I strongly disagree with him on the depth part, especially in another 2 or 3 weeks when Oliver II will be available, and on top of that whenever Karaiskos is available he will hopefully add even more depth.

In short, I don't see ODU has having a bunch of really good outside shooters. Maybe those that have played thus far will improve in the upcoming games going forward. Maybe Oliver II will come out shooting 40% and open things up more for the other shooters to do better. Unless things improve significantly, they don't have a strong inside presence either which hurts their half court offense. In recent years when ODU also had poor shooting teams it was often said that ODU's best offense was a missed shot since they frequently got the offensive rebound and cashed in with the follow shot. That hasn't happened very often thus far this year, because they don't rebound as well, because they aren't as big and talented inside. At this point they need to get more easy shots in the form of break away layups and wide open 3 point looks as a result of 2 on 1 breaks off a steal and such. If I was the coach I would definitely try something different than what he likes to do - i.e. full court press, then drop back into a pressure/attacking half court defense. Not saying Jeff will go that route however.

Excellent post. Could not agree more. What Oliver will add and Joe Reece’s development are the big unknowns at this point. Joe flashed today. I still remember the first time I saw Freeman play and it was obvious he was special. I’m hopeful Oliver is another key add to our team (although I’m guessing not Freeman level, but one can hope). We need it desperately at this point.

I would love to see us play up tempo as well.
Sure, we will make mistakes and probably have some crazy bad turnovers but our athleticism may get some easy baskets and create some open threes. The commentators today mentioned several times how much more athletic we looked than Loyola, however or pace of play was no faster than theirs. We needed to wear out that 6’9” kid and make him work. I know at least once he brought the ball up against our press. Let him do that about 5 times in a half and see how good his touch is then.

Amen. If we're going to lose, I'd much rather play an exciting, up tempo style.We played Loyolas game today and got beat. Make big teams run to keep up, wear them out.
11-27-2019 08:25 PM
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imfsff3 Offline
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Post: #47
RE: Cayman Islands Gm 3: Loyola Chicago - Wed 11/27, 11:00am
The tournament results were obviously terrible. The worst part, however, is FLOHOOPS. Is this tourney so low on the totem pole that is has to be streamed on a pay to see outlet? Sounds like the old days of the alphabet post season tourneys that nobody other than the teams involved cared about. I know these trips are nice, but if they are so unimportant, why play?
11-29-2019 12:52 PM
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JJMonarch Offline
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RE: Cayman Islands Gm 3: Loyola Chicago - Wed 11/27, 11:00am
(11-29-2019 12:52 PM)imfsff3 Wrote:  The tournament results were obviously terrible. The worst part, however, is FLOHOOPS. Is this tourney so low on the totem pole that is has to be streamed on a pay to see outlet? Sounds like the old days of the alphabet post season tourneys that nobody other than the teams involved cared about. I know these trips are nice, but if they are so unimportant, why play?

Who said the games were not important? It’s fair to say if we had won the tournament it would not guarantee anything for post season chances, but that doesn’t mean they are not important. It’s probably fair to say if we had won ANY of the holiday tournaments it still wouldn’t guarantee anything in the post season. It’s important to win and continue to show improvement, gain experience for this young team, and grab some momentum. Unfortunately the only thing we gained was experience and some confidence boost for a player like Reece. Hopefully our team learned something from this week and improve going forward.
11-29-2019 03:01 PM
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odu83alumni Offline
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RE: Cayman Islands Gm 3: Loyola Chicago - Wed 11/27, 11:00am
All this fouling is sickening. We are beginning to resemble VCU.
11-29-2019 04:04 PM
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ODUBB35 Offline
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RE: Cayman Islands Gm 3: Loyola Chicago - Wed 11/27, 11:00am
(11-29-2019 04:04 PM)odu83alumni Wrote:  All this fouling is sickening. We are beginning to resemble VCU.

Except we get called for them.
11-29-2019 04:45 PM
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monarx Offline
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RE: Cayman Islands Gm 3: Loyola Chicago - Wed 11/27, 11:00am
(11-29-2019 04:45 PM)ODUBB35 Wrote:  
(11-29-2019 04:04 PM)odu83alumni Wrote:  All this fouling is sickening. We are beginning to resemble VCU.

Except we get called for them.

And lose
11-29-2019 09:21 PM
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blewbyu Offline
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RE: Cayman Islands Gm 3: Loyola Chicago - Wed 11/27, 11:00am
(11-29-2019 09:21 PM)monarx Wrote:  
(11-29-2019 04:45 PM)ODUBB35 Wrote:  
(11-29-2019 04:04 PM)odu83alumni Wrote:  All this fouling is sickening. We are beginning to resemble VCU.

Except we get called for them.

And lose

I wish we did resemble VCU...VCU train left the station years ago. ODU is still standing in line waiting to buy a ticket. VCU joined the A10 and we got stuck in CUSA ..a death sentence for us.
11-29-2019 10:10 PM
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