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2019-20 College Football Coaching Carousel
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Almadenmike Offline
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Post: #21
RE: 2019-20 College Football Coaching Carousel
(11-26-2019 12:47 PM)GoodOwl Wrote:  
(11-26-2019 12:35 PM)InterestedX Wrote:  Lamar is D1.

FCS, not FBS.

If I recall that used to be called Div I(a)? I guess I meant top-tier, but we're not even that with the P5-G5 nonsense. So, technically correct, D-I FCS, ...

Lamar didn't make this year's NCAA D-1 FCS football tournament, but Central Arkansas, Nicholls State and Southeastern Lousiana did out of the Southland Conference.
11-26-2019 07:35 PM
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Owl 69/70/75 Offline
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Post: #22
RE: 2019-20 College Football Coaching Carousel
My guy Alex Grinch's OU defense was back last week, holding TCU to 11 first downs and 204 yards. For the season, even with a couple of lapses, OU is giving up 25 PPG, versus 33 last year. He probably won't get a head coaching job this year, but he's not far away. He is far away from our price range now. If Riley goes to the NFL, he might get a shot at the OU job.
11-26-2019 08:27 PM
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GoodOwl Offline
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Post: #23
Exclamation RE: 2019-20 College Football Coaching Carousel
(11-26-2019 08:27 PM)Owl 69/70/75 Wrote:  My guy Alex Grinch's OU defense was back last week, holding TCU to 11 first downs and 204 yards. For the season, even with a couple of lapses, OU is giving up 25 PPG, versus 33 last year. He probably won't get a head coaching job this year, but he's not far away. He is far away from our price range now. If Riley goes to the NFL, he might get a shot at the OU job.

Actually, the only reason that may well be the case is because our school chooses it to be so. HE is not more out of Rice's price range than any other coach. The market works.
11-27-2019 03:21 PM
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Owl 69/70/75 Offline
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Post: #24
RE: 2019-20 College Football Coaching Carousel
(11-27-2019 03:21 PM)GoodOwl Wrote:  
(11-26-2019 08:27 PM)Owl 69/70/75 Wrote:  My guy Alex Grinch's OU defense was back last week, holding TCU to 11 first downs and 204 yards. For the season, even with a couple of lapses, OU is giving up 25 PPG, versus 33 last year. He probably won't get a head coaching job this year, but he's not far away. He is far away from our price range now. If Riley goes to the NFL, he might get a shot at the OU job.
Actually, the only reason that may well be the case is because our school chooses it to be so. HE is not more out of Rice's price range than any other coach. The market works.

He’s at $1.4 million as OU DC. He’ll be in line for a P5 HC job in a year or two. He’s out of range for any G5.
11-27-2019 09:55 PM
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ExcitedOwl18 Offline
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Post: #25
RE: 2019-20 College Football Coaching Carousel
(11-27-2019 09:55 PM)Owl 69/70/75 Wrote:  
(11-27-2019 03:21 PM)GoodOwl Wrote:  
(11-26-2019 08:27 PM)Owl 69/70/75 Wrote:  My guy Alex Grinch's OU defense was back last week, holding TCU to 11 first downs and 204 yards. For the season, even with a couple of lapses, OU is giving up 25 PPG, versus 33 last year. He probably won't get a head coaching job this year, but he's not far away. He is far away from our price range now. If Riley goes to the NFL, he might get a shot at the OU job.
Actually, the only reason that may well be the case is because our school chooses it to be so. HE is not more out of Rice's price range than any other coach. The market works.

He’s at $1.4 million as OU DC. He’ll be in line for a P5 HC job in a year or two. He’s out of range for any G5.

Then how did UH hire Dana? Bobo at CSU? Harsin at BSU? Etc, etc.

P5 aspirations on a 3A budget. Pretty much describes Rice.
(This post was last modified: 11-27-2019 10:30 PM by ExcitedOwl18.)
11-27-2019 10:30 PM
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cr11owl Offline
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Post: #26
RE: 2019-20 College Football Coaching Carousel
(11-27-2019 10:30 PM)ExcitedOwl18 Wrote:  
(11-27-2019 09:55 PM)Owl 69/70/75 Wrote:  
(11-27-2019 03:21 PM)GoodOwl Wrote:  
(11-26-2019 08:27 PM)Owl 69/70/75 Wrote:  My guy Alex Grinch's OU defense was back last week, holding TCU to 11 first downs and 204 yards. For the season, even with a couple of lapses, OU is giving up 25 PPG, versus 33 last year. He probably won't get a head coaching job this year, but he's not far away. He is far away from our price range now. If Riley goes to the NFL, he might get a shot at the OU job.
Actually, the only reason that may well be the case is because our school chooses it to be so. HE is not more out of Rice's price range than any other coach. The market works.

He’s at $1.4 million as OU DC. He’ll be in line for a P5 HC job in a year or two. He’s out of range for any G5.

Then how did UH hire Dana? Bobo at CSU? Harsin at BSU? Etc, etc.

P5 aspirations on a 3A budget. Pretty much describes Rice.

Bingo. We could hire anyone in the country if we wanted to pay for it. We don’t.
11-27-2019 10:36 PM
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texowl2 Offline
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Post: #27
RE: 2019-20 College Football Coaching Carousel
(11-27-2019 10:36 PM)cr11owl Wrote:  
(11-27-2019 10:30 PM)ExcitedOwl18 Wrote:  
(11-27-2019 09:55 PM)Owl 69/70/75 Wrote:  
(11-27-2019 03:21 PM)GoodOwl Wrote:  
(11-26-2019 08:27 PM)Owl 69/70/75 Wrote:  My guy Alex Grinch's OU defense was back last week, holding TCU to 11 first downs and 204 yards. For the season, even with a couple of lapses, OU is giving up 25 PPG, versus 33 last year. He probably won't get a head coaching job this year, but he's not far away. He is far away from our price range now. If Riley goes to the NFL, he might get a shot at the OU job.
Actually, the only reason that may well be the case is because our school chooses it to be so. HE is not more out of Rice's price range than any other coach. The market works.

He’s at $1.4 million as OU DC. He’ll be in line for a P5 HC job in a year or two. He’s out of range for any G5.

Then how did UH hire Dana? Bobo at CSU? Harsin at BSU? Etc, etc.

P5 aspirations on a 3A budget. Pretty much describes Rice.

Bingo. We could hire anyone in the country if we wanted to pay for it. We don’t.

It's called commitment and effort. Yoda would be appalled at us....
11-27-2019 11:45 PM
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westsidewolf1989 Offline
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Post: #28
RE: 2019-20 College Football Coaching Carousel
(11-27-2019 10:36 PM)cr11owl Wrote:  
(11-27-2019 10:30 PM)ExcitedOwl18 Wrote:  
(11-27-2019 09:55 PM)Owl 69/70/75 Wrote:  
(11-27-2019 03:21 PM)GoodOwl Wrote:  
(11-26-2019 08:27 PM)Owl 69/70/75 Wrote:  My guy Alex Grinch's OU defense was back last week, holding TCU to 11 first downs and 204 yards. For the season, even with a couple of lapses, OU is giving up 25 PPG, versus 33 last year. He probably won't get a head coaching job this year, but he's not far away. He is far away from our price range now. If Riley goes to the NFL, he might get a shot at the OU job.
Actually, the only reason that may well be the case is because our school chooses it to be so. HE is not more out of Rice's price range than any other coach. The market works.

He’s at $1.4 million as OU DC. He’ll be in line for a P5 HC job in a year or two. He’s out of range for any G5.

Then how did UH hire Dana? Bobo at CSU? Harsin at BSU? Etc, etc.

P5 aspirations on a 3A budget. Pretty much describes Rice.

Bingo. We could hire anyone in the country if we wanted to pay for it. We don’t.

And what’s the ROI on that? Holgorsen and Bobo are failures at their respective schools, with the jury still out on Holgorsen. Harsin is obviously a huge success. There are far too many ADs in college sports that have horrible track records of doing anything other than lighting money on fire in football/basketball hires. Until people get the guts to do an Owl Numbers’ style contract (low buyouts on either side), most ADs are just professional capital destroyers.

The point being, why should Rice pony up $2mm or whatever per year to hire a football coach, until we have an AD that shows he/she can actually be a good steward of a smaller salary limit? Dr. K extended Bailiff, which enabled Bailiff the ability to believe he had tenure at Rice and didn’t have to do his job and Dr K also hired Bloomgren at a higher salary than Bailiff - we obviously know Bloomgren is a failure so far, but the jury is out for another year, at least. Unless Bloomgren manages to win a CUSA championship or two at Rice, why should anyone trust the AD with a bigger budget?
(This post was last modified: 11-28-2019 12:19 AM by westsidewolf1989.)
11-28-2019 12:17 AM
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Owl 69/70/75 Offline
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Post: #29
RE: 2019-20 College Football Coaching Carousel
(11-27-2019 10:30 PM)ExcitedOwl18 Wrote:  
(11-27-2019 09:55 PM)Owl 69/70/75 Wrote:  
(11-27-2019 03:21 PM)GoodOwl Wrote:  
(11-26-2019 08:27 PM)Owl 69/70/75 Wrote:  My guy Alex Grinch's OU defense was back last week, holding TCU to 11 first downs and 204 yards. For the season, even with a couple of lapses, OU is giving up 25 PPG, versus 33 last year. He probably won't get a head coaching job this year, but he's not far away. He is far away from our price range now. If Riley goes to the NFL, he might get a shot at the OU job.
Actually, the only reason that may well be the case is because our school chooses it to be so. HE is not more out of Rice's price range than any other coach. The market works.
He’s at $1.4 million as OU DC. He’ll be in line for a P5 HC job in a year or two. He’s out of range for any G5.
Then how did UH hire Dana? Bobo at CSU? Harsin at BSU? Etc, etc.
P5 aspirations on a 3A budget. Pretty much describes Rice.

I don’t know much about Bobo to CSU.

But Dana got the job at WVU under circumstances that looked a lot like shoving Bill Stewart aside. If Stewart had any friends among the support group, they may we’ll have had it in for Dana. And while Dana’s teams scored a lot and were innovative on offense, they didn’t play enough defense to win any championships. So the seat at WVU might well have been warm enough for Dana to want to make a pre-emptive move. There has been some speculation in that direction.

Harsin is just the latest in a train of good hires at Boise—Nutt, Koetter, Hawkins, Petersen, now Harsin. They haven’t been afraid to hire guys with higher ambitions because they trusted their ability to hire replacements. As a result, those guys have built consistent winners to build their resumes, which has helped both sides. Some people have said that we need to hire someone who wants to stay at Rice. I disagree. Someone who wants to stay at Rice is happy going 7-6, 3-9, 2-10, 4-8, 5-7, 8-5, 10-4, 7-6, rinse and repeat. I don’t want anyone who is happy with that.
11-28-2019 01:05 AM
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ESE84 Offline
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Post: #30
RE: 2019-20 College Football Coaching Carousel
(11-28-2019 01:05 AM)Owl 69/70/75 Wrote:  Harsin is just the latest in a train of good hires at Boise—Nutt, Koetter, Hawkins, Petersen, now Harsin. They haven’t been afraid to hire guys with higher ambitions because they trusted their ability to hire replacements. As a result, those guys have built consistent winners to build their resumes, which has helped both sides. Some people have said that we need to hire someone who wants to stay at Rice. I disagree. Someone who wants to stay at Rice is happy going 7-6, 3-9, 2-10, 4-8, 5-7, 8-5, 10-4, 7-6, rinse and repeat. I don’t want anyone who is happy with that.

Maybe we need the Boise athletic director.
11-28-2019 10:53 AM
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WRCisforgotten79 Offline
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Post: #31
RE: 2019-20 College Football Coaching Carousel
Boise State:

Houston Nutt: 4-7
Dirk Koetter: 6-5, 10-3, 10-2
Dan Hawkins: 8-4, 12-1, 13-1, 11-1, 9-4
Chris Petersen: 13-0, 10-3, 12-1, 14-0, 12-1, 12-1, 11-2, 8-4
Bob Gregory: 0-1
Bryan Harsin: 12-2, 9-4, 10-3, 11-3, 10-3, 10-1
(This post was last modified: 11-28-2019 12:03 PM by WRCisforgotten79.)
11-28-2019 12:02 PM
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bobreinhold1 Offline
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Post: #32
RE: 2019-20 College Football Coaching Carousel
Guess it's between Nutt and Gregory for us to hire.
11-28-2019 01:03 PM
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WRCisforgotten79 Offline
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Post: #33
RE: 2019-20 College Football Coaching Carousel
(11-28-2019 12:02 PM)WRCisforgotten79 Wrote:  Boise State:

Houston Nutt: 4-7
Dirk Koetter: 6-5, 10-3, 10-2
Dan Hawkins: 8-4, 12-1, 13-1, 11-1, 9-4
Chris Petersen: 13-0, 10-3, 12-1, 14-0, 12-1, 12-1, 11-2, 8-4
Bob Gregory: 0-1
Bryan Harsin: 12-2, 9-4, 10-3, 11-3, 10-3, 10-1

Just a reminder that, during that stretch, Boise State is 17-22 (.436) against teams from P5 conferences (at the time the game was played), and 220-35 (.863) against everyone else.
11-28-2019 02:13 PM
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GoodOwl Offline
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Post: #34
Exclamation RE: 2019-20 College Football Coaching Carousel
(11-28-2019 01:05 AM)Owl 69/70/75 Wrote:  
(11-27-2019 10:30 PM)ExcitedOwl18 Wrote:  
(11-27-2019 09:55 PM)Owl 69/70/75 Wrote:  
(11-27-2019 03:21 PM)GoodOwl Wrote:  
(11-26-2019 08:27 PM)Owl 69/70/75 Wrote:  My guy Alex Grinch's OU defense was back last week, holding TCU to 11 first downs and 204 yards. For the season, even with a couple of lapses, OU is giving up 25 PPG, versus 33 last year. He probably won't get a head coaching job this year, but he's not far away. He is far away from our price range now. If Riley goes to the NFL, he might get a shot at the OU job.
Actually, the only reason that may well be the case is because our school chooses it to be so. HE is not more out of Rice's price range than any other coach. The market works.
He’s at $1.4 million as OU DC. He’ll be in line for a P5 HC job in a year or two. He’s out of range for any G5.
Then how did UH hire Dana? Bobo at CSU? Harsin at BSU? Etc, etc.
P5 aspirations on a 3A budget. Pretty much describes Rice.

I don’t know much about Bobo to CSU.

But Dana got the job at WVU under circumstances that looked a lot like shoving Bill Stewart aside. If Stewart had any friends among the support group, they may we’ll have had it in for Dana. And while Dana’s teams scored a lot and were innovative on offense, they didn’t play enough defense to win any championships. So the seat at WVU might well have been warm enough for Dana to want to make a pre-emptive move. There has been some speculation in that direction.

Harsin is just the latest in a train of good hires at Boise—Nutt, Koetter, Hawkins, Petersen, now Harsin. They haven’t been afraid to hire guys with higher ambitions because they trusted their ability to hire replacements. As a result, those guys have built consistent winners to build their resumes, which has helped both sides. Some people have said that we need to hire someone who wants to stay at Rice. I disagree. Someone who wants to stay at Rice is happy going 7-6, 3-9, 2-10, 4-8, 5-7, 8-5, 10-4, 7-6, rinse and repeat. I don’t want anyone who is happy with that.

It's worth mentioning that Boise State currently has two distinct advantages over Rice:
1) they are basically similar to a football version of Gonzaga in that if you're a good player from the Northwestern part of the country and can't/aren't as interested in getting into a P-5 in that region (basically PAc-10, or perhaps some B1G) then they can suck up any other decent player in that part of the country (as long as they aren't longing for warmer weather): i.e. they have a lot less direct competition in their tier in that region than Rice does in its
and, of course
2) I'd go out on a limb and say that Boise is just a tad easier to get into academically than Rice, and there are more places to "hide" athletes academically, so they have a bit more time/energy to devote to football

Rice ostensibly has tons of competition from other G-5s in its own conference in its own state that are way easier academically, as well as have a bit better recent history of winning.

Not to say I wouldn't want Rice to emulate their string of coaching hires and successes, but it is a slightly easier school to have success on the football field for than we are at the moment.
(This post was last modified: 11-28-2019 11:05 PM by GoodOwl.)
11-28-2019 10:17 PM
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GoodOwl Offline
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Post: #35
Exclamation RE: 2019-20 College Football Coaching Carousel
(11-28-2019 02:13 PM)WRCisforgotten79 Wrote:  
(11-28-2019 12:02 PM)WRCisforgotten79 Wrote:  Boise State:

Houston Nutt: 4-7
Dirk Koetter: 6-5, 10-3, 10-2
Dan Hawkins: 8-4, 12-1, 13-1, 11-1, 9-4
Chris Petersen: 13-0, 10-3, 12-1, 14-0, 12-1, 12-1, 11-2, 8-4
Bob Gregory: 0-1
Bryan Harsin: 12-2, 9-4, 10-3, 11-3, 10-3, 10-1

Just a reminder that, during that stretch, Boise State is 17-22 (.436) against teams from P5 conferences (at the time the game was played), and 220-35 (.863) against everyone else.

tl;dr: It's all about the money and little else matters.

Fine print:
Imagine how far ahead we'd be from where we are now if we had done even half as well in those two categories. They have done an excellent job in their hires over time, not just a single hire, and developed a reputation where potential head coaches know: 1) they can win there, 2)they can recruit there (despite the remote area and harsh climate) and 3) they can get proportionally bigger time TV publicity from there

They are spending the money now, but at one point, they had ambition (they kept moving their program up the ranks from lower conferences/divisions) and similar, but different to TCU, at one point their school leadership collectively made a firm and unequivocal decision that being good in football was the number one way they could improve their standing as a school as well as marketing what, essentially, was something similar to, say, Montana, Idaho, Idaho State, etc...

While the Boise example is not a direct corollary to exactly what Rice has to do, both Boise and TCU inform in one important area (and one could also argue this for former peers (and bottom dwellers) Baylor and SMU) Their University Leadership Teams made a public and unequivocal decision to be a lot better, which came with a lot of financial dollars committed by the universities themselves, as well as an unwavering commitment to invest in what eventually led to greener pastures over time, although it took a decade or two (or more) for each school to really even begin to show a significant return. So...more than a one-time or a one or two year bump in commitment.

Rice has one HUGE advantage over all these schools in that it has the financial wherewithal to make that kind of a commitment any time it wants to...but is doesn't want to. Rice's leadership team has shown near-zero commitment, near-zero leadership, and near-zero courage. The only thing Rice's participation in D-I sports markets to the nation is near-consistent failure and ineptitude, which increasingly tarnishes the national respect its academic endeavors otherwise might engender.

To wit: People who don't follow Rice sports more than casually still will tell you that Rice is excellent in baseball, which we know at the moment and in the recent past is no longer true.

This seems to show two things: 1) Making a big splash nationally in a major sport, enters the national consciousness at some point and sticks there long after the actual success, thus shaping the school's general image in the collective national mindset, and this works for better or for worse (hence the need for a string of ultra-successful seasons over time, a la Boise and TCU vs the one lone CUSA championship that even some Rice folks don't remember anymore) Heck, most folks still remember and associate Appalachian State as a winning program because it once went into the Big House and beat Michigan.
2) D-I sports success on the field (i.e. winning at a much higher rate that Rice has in the last 50-60 years) has marketing value far beyond the gridiron or court or field and is more worthy of the investment than our current or past leadership teams has cared to acknowledge.

Will Coach Bloom be the answer here? Despite his poor performance so far, he still has a chance because he has won these past two games and will definitely get another season. But in order to be that answer, in season 3 he has to break out beyond just a Who-cares-bowl; otherwise he is only more or less equivalent to what we have already had, which doesn't change much if anything at all.

Boise's string of coaching successes moved the needle for them. They will for a long time still be a glorified commuter/community college. But everyone in the Top 25 won't mind having them play in their home stadiums, and every other year they are in contention for and will often play in, the Access Bow, with an outside chance of getting in the CFP final four if the cards fall right in a season. Compared to where Rice is, they have handled their hand extremely shrewdly and their millions invested prudently. They can get a LOT of quality head coaches to come coach them, because they kept their investment up over decades far above what their current or past station/success told them they could do.

tl;dr: It's all about the money and little else matters. Spend it consistently over time with a decades long commitment by the U leadership team to Publicly declare we intend to get out of the mess/conference we are in and it will eventually happen.
(This post was last modified: 11-28-2019 10:59 PM by GoodOwl.)
11-28-2019 10:41 PM
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ExcitedOwl18 Offline
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Post: #36
RE: 2019-20 College Football Coaching Carousel
(11-28-2019 10:17 PM)GoodOwl Wrote:  
(11-28-2019 01:05 AM)Owl 69/70/75 Wrote:  
(11-27-2019 10:30 PM)ExcitedOwl18 Wrote:  
(11-27-2019 09:55 PM)Owl 69/70/75 Wrote:  
(11-27-2019 03:21 PM)GoodOwl Wrote:  Actually, the only reason that may well be the case is because our school chooses it to be so. HE is not more out of Rice's price range than any other coach. The market works.
He’s at $1.4 million as OU DC. He’ll be in line for a P5 HC job in a year or two. He’s out of range for any G5.
Then how did UH hire Dana? Bobo at CSU? Harsin at BSU? Etc, etc.
P5 aspirations on a 3A budget. Pretty much describes Rice.

I don’t know much about Bobo to CSU.

But Dana got the job at WVU under circumstances that looked a lot like shoving Bill Stewart aside. If Stewart had any friends among the support group, they may we’ll have had it in for Dana. And while Dana’s teams scored a lot and were innovative on offense, they didn’t play enough defense to win any championships. So the seat at WVU might well have been warm enough for Dana to want to make a pre-emptive move. There has been some speculation in that direction.

Harsin is just the latest in a train of good hires at Boise—Nutt, Koetter, Hawkins, Petersen, now Harsin. They haven’t been afraid to hire guys with higher ambitions because they trusted their ability to hire replacements. As a result, those guys have built consistent winners to build their resumes, which has helped both sides. Some people have said that we need to hire someone who wants to stay at Rice. I disagree. Someone who wants to stay at Rice is happy going 7-6, 3-9, 2-10, 4-8, 5-7, 8-5, 10-4, 7-6, rinse and repeat. I don’t want anyone who is happy with that.

It's worth mentioning that Boise State currently has two distinct advantages over Rice:
1) they are basically similar to a football version of Gonzaga in that if you're a good player form the Northwestern part of the country and can't/aren't as interested in getting into a P-5 in that region (basically PAc-10, or perhaps some B1G) then they can suck up any other decent player in that part of the country (as long as they aren't longing for warmer weather): i.e. they have a lot less direct competition in their tier in that region than Rice does in its
and, of course
2) I'd go out on a limb and say that Boise is just a tad easier to get into academically then Rice, and there are more places to "hide" athletes academically, so they have a bit more time/energy to devote to football

Rice ostensibly has tons of competition from other G-5s in its own conference in its own state that are way easier academically, as well as have a bit better recent history of winning.

Not to say I wouldn't want Rice to emulate their string of coaching hires and successes, but it is a slightly easier school to have success on the football field for than we are at the moment.

Boise State has very few scholarship players from the PacNW (defining that as ID, WA, and OR)... I just went through their roster-you’d be surprised at the geographic distribution. The vast majority of their players are from CA (with a decent amount from Texas, actually)-where there’s plenty of G5 competition.

Agreed on the academics piece. Boise is a glorified community college though I’ve done some business in Boise (actually a great small city to visit) recently and it does appear to be a growing and vibrant school with lots of community support.
11-28-2019 10:44 PM
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GoodOwl Offline
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Post: #37
RE: 2019-20 College Football Coaching Carousel
(11-28-2019 10:44 PM)ExcitedOwl18 Wrote:  Boise State has very few scholarship players from the PacNW (defining that as ID, WA, and OR)... I just went through their roster-you’d be surprised at the geographic distribution. The vast majority of their players are from CA (with a decent amount from Texas, actually)-where there’s plenty of G5 competition.

Agreed on the academics piece. Boise is a glorified community college though I’ve done some business in Boise (actually a great small city to visit) recently and it does appear to be a growing and vibrant school with lots of community support.

Was that always the case: ie during their rise from lower divisions, to new-D-I program to now? I'm sure they have improved in national recruiting: they are getting close to a service academy in the variety of schools they play nationally and their reach is increasingly appealing for kids who want to play, and win at D-I football and have a chance at a meaningful bowl against quality opponents almost every year nowadays (plus usually a national Top25 ranking.)

There are many things to like about a city like Boise versus a city like Houston. Size after a certain point has its limitations, especially for a college student who is mostly occupied with things on or very near any college campus. Plus, you can always put more clothes on, but can only take so many off, and you might still be sweating from the oppressive heat. It's a preference, to be sure, but Boise State seems to do a pretty good job marketing what they have to a clearly defined segment of potential and actual players.
(This post was last modified: 11-28-2019 11:07 PM by GoodOwl.)
11-28-2019 10:56 PM
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cr11owl Offline
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Post: #38
RE: 2019-20 College Football Coaching Carousel
(11-28-2019 10:44 PM)ExcitedOwl18 Wrote:  
(11-28-2019 10:17 PM)GoodOwl Wrote:  
(11-28-2019 01:05 AM)Owl 69/70/75 Wrote:  
(11-27-2019 10:30 PM)ExcitedOwl18 Wrote:  
(11-27-2019 09:55 PM)Owl 69/70/75 Wrote:  He’s at $1.4 million as OU DC. He’ll be in line for a P5 HC job in a year or two. He’s out of range for any G5.
Then how did UH hire Dana? Bobo at CSU? Harsin at BSU? Etc, etc.
P5 aspirations on a 3A budget. Pretty much describes Rice.

I don’t know much about Bobo to CSU.

But Dana got the job at WVU under circumstances that looked a lot like shoving Bill Stewart aside. If Stewart had any friends among the support group, they may we’ll have had it in for Dana. And while Dana’s teams scored a lot and were innovative on offense, they didn’t play enough defense to win any championships. So the seat at WVU might well have been warm enough for Dana to want to make a pre-emptive move. There has been some speculation in that direction.

Harsin is just the latest in a train of good hires at Boise—Nutt, Koetter, Hawkins, Petersen, now Harsin. They haven’t been afraid to hire guys with higher ambitions because they trusted their ability to hire replacements. As a result, those guys have built consistent winners to build their resumes, which has helped both sides. Some people have said that we need to hire someone who wants to stay at Rice. I disagree. Someone who wants to stay at Rice is happy going 7-6, 3-9, 2-10, 4-8, 5-7, 8-5, 10-4, 7-6, rinse and repeat. I don’t want anyone who is happy with that.

It's worth mentioning that Boise State currently has two distinct advantages over Rice:
1) they are basically similar to a football version of Gonzaga in that if you're a good player form the Northwestern part of the country and can't/aren't as interested in getting into a P-5 in that region (basically PAc-10, or perhaps some B1G) then they can suck up any other decent player in that part of the country (as long as they aren't longing for warmer weather): i.e. they have a lot less direct competition in their tier in that region than Rice does in its
and, of course
2) I'd go out on a limb and say that Boise is just a tad easier to get into academically then Rice, and there are more places to "hide" athletes academically, so they have a bit more time/energy to devote to football

Rice ostensibly has tons of competition from other G-5s in its own conference in its own state that are way easier academically, as well as have a bit better recent history of winning.

Not to say I wouldn't want Rice to emulate their string of coaching hires and successes, but it is a slightly easier school to have success on the football field for than we are at the moment.

Boise State has very few scholarship players from the PacNW (defining that as ID, WA, and OR)... I just went through their roster-you’d be surprised at the geographic distribution. The vast majority of their players are from CA (with a decent amount from Texas, actually)-where there’s plenty of G5 competition.

Agreed on the academics piece. Boise is a glorified community college though I’ve done some business in Boise (actually a great small city to visit) recently and it does appear to be a growing and vibrant school with lots of community support.

The general student body is basically a community college, imagine how bad the football team is. I’m sure Blue Mountain State isn’t completely made up out of thin air 04-cheers

Schools like Boise are why the NCAA requires athletes to have minimum SAT scores (our conference has those schools too, hey Marshall and UTEP). Looking at the rules now though if a student can get a 3.5 at a terrible HS then they only need a 430 on their SAT. The minimum you can get on the SAT for showing up is 400. Someone with a GPA of 2.5 only needs a 900. Low bars indeed....
11-28-2019 11:13 PM
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ExcitedOwl18 Offline
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Post: #39
RE: 2019-20 College Football Coaching Carousel
(11-28-2019 11:13 PM)cr11owl Wrote:  
(11-28-2019 10:44 PM)ExcitedOwl18 Wrote:  
(11-28-2019 10:17 PM)GoodOwl Wrote:  
(11-28-2019 01:05 AM)Owl 69/70/75 Wrote:  
(11-27-2019 10:30 PM)ExcitedOwl18 Wrote:  Then how did UH hire Dana? Bobo at CSU? Harsin at BSU? Etc, etc.
P5 aspirations on a 3A budget. Pretty much describes Rice.

I don’t know much about Bobo to CSU.

But Dana got the job at WVU under circumstances that looked a lot like shoving Bill Stewart aside. If Stewart had any friends among the support group, they may we’ll have had it in for Dana. And while Dana’s teams scored a lot and were innovative on offense, they didn’t play enough defense to win any championships. So the seat at WVU might well have been warm enough for Dana to want to make a pre-emptive move. There has been some speculation in that direction.

Harsin is just the latest in a train of good hires at Boise—Nutt, Koetter, Hawkins, Petersen, now Harsin. They haven’t been afraid to hire guys with higher ambitions because they trusted their ability to hire replacements. As a result, those guys have built consistent winners to build their resumes, which has helped both sides. Some people have said that we need to hire someone who wants to stay at Rice. I disagree. Someone who wants to stay at Rice is happy going 7-6, 3-9, 2-10, 4-8, 5-7, 8-5, 10-4, 7-6, rinse and repeat. I don’t want anyone who is happy with that.

It's worth mentioning that Boise State currently has two distinct advantages over Rice:
1) they are basically similar to a football version of Gonzaga in that if you're a good player form the Northwestern part of the country and can't/aren't as interested in getting into a P-5 in that region (basically PAc-10, or perhaps some B1G) then they can suck up any other decent player in that part of the country (as long as they aren't longing for warmer weather): i.e. they have a lot less direct competition in their tier in that region than Rice does in its
and, of course
2) I'd go out on a limb and say that Boise is just a tad easier to get into academically then Rice, and there are more places to "hide" athletes academically, so they have a bit more time/energy to devote to football

Rice ostensibly has tons of competition from other G-5s in its own conference in its own state that are way easier academically, as well as have a bit better recent history of winning.

Not to say I wouldn't want Rice to emulate their string of coaching hires and successes, but it is a slightly easier school to have success on the football field for than we are at the moment.

Boise State has very few scholarship players from the PacNW (defining that as ID, WA, and OR)... I just went through their roster-you’d be surprised at the geographic distribution. The vast majority of their players are from CA (with a decent amount from Texas, actually)-where there’s plenty of G5 competition.

Agreed on the academics piece. Boise is a glorified community college though I’ve done some business in Boise (actually a great small city to visit) recently and it does appear to be a growing and vibrant school with lots of community support.

The general student body is basically a community college, imagine how bad the football team is. I’m sure Blue Mountain State isn’t completely made up out of thin air 04-cheers

Schools like Boise are why the NCAA requires athletes to have minimum SAT scores (our conference has those schools too, hey Marshall and UTEP). Looking at the rules now though if a student can get a 3.5 at a terrible HS then they only need a 430 on their SAT. The minimum you can get on the SAT for showing up is 400. Someone with a GPA of 2.5 only needs a 900. Low bars indeed....

From the Boise State grads I’ve met-which is admittedly a small sample and also probably some selection bias given that my interactions have been with the F50 company I work for-it’s a bit more complicated than that.

If you grow up in Idaho, you don’t really have many options for school. You can go to Boise St, University of Idaho, or Idaho State for public, or BYU-Idaho if you want a private/religious school. Traditionally, all of the “smart kids” went to University of Idaho, but with the growth of Boise and the increased notoriety of the school (largely due to football), many are now going to Boise State. As a result, I get the impression that there’s fairly high variance within the student body-lots of bright people and also some who are just scraping by...

But yes (stating the obvious), it’s not in remotely the same league as Rice or any of our peers.
11-28-2019 11:41 PM
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cr11owl Offline
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Post: #40
RE: 2019-20 College Football Coaching Carousel
(11-28-2019 11:41 PM)ExcitedOwl18 Wrote:  
(11-28-2019 11:13 PM)cr11owl Wrote:  
(11-28-2019 10:44 PM)ExcitedOwl18 Wrote:  
(11-28-2019 10:17 PM)GoodOwl Wrote:  
(11-28-2019 01:05 AM)Owl 69/70/75 Wrote:  I don’t know much about Bobo to CSU.

But Dana got the job at WVU under circumstances that looked a lot like shoving Bill Stewart aside. If Stewart had any friends among the support group, they may we’ll have had it in for Dana. And while Dana’s teams scored a lot and were innovative on offense, they didn’t play enough defense to win any championships. So the seat at WVU might well have been warm enough for Dana to want to make a pre-emptive move. There has been some speculation in that direction.

Harsin is just the latest in a train of good hires at Boise—Nutt, Koetter, Hawkins, Petersen, now Harsin. They haven’t been afraid to hire guys with higher ambitions because they trusted their ability to hire replacements. As a result, those guys have built consistent winners to build their resumes, which has helped both sides. Some people have said that we need to hire someone who wants to stay at Rice. I disagree. Someone who wants to stay at Rice is happy going 7-6, 3-9, 2-10, 4-8, 5-7, 8-5, 10-4, 7-6, rinse and repeat. I don’t want anyone who is happy with that.

It's worth mentioning that Boise State currently has two distinct advantages over Rice:
1) they are basically similar to a football version of Gonzaga in that if you're a good player form the Northwestern part of the country and can't/aren't as interested in getting into a P-5 in that region (basically PAc-10, or perhaps some B1G) then they can suck up any other decent player in that part of the country (as long as they aren't longing for warmer weather): i.e. they have a lot less direct competition in their tier in that region than Rice does in its
and, of course
2) I'd go out on a limb and say that Boise is just a tad easier to get into academically then Rice, and there are more places to "hide" athletes academically, so they have a bit more time/energy to devote to football

Rice ostensibly has tons of competition from other G-5s in its own conference in its own state that are way easier academically, as well as have a bit better recent history of winning.

Not to say I wouldn't want Rice to emulate their string of coaching hires and successes, but it is a slightly easier school to have success on the football field for than we are at the moment.

Boise State has very few scholarship players from the PacNW (defining that as ID, WA, and OR)... I just went through their roster-you’d be surprised at the geographic distribution. The vast majority of their players are from CA (with a decent amount from Texas, actually)-where there’s plenty of G5 competition.

Agreed on the academics piece. Boise is a glorified community college though I’ve done some business in Boise (actually a great small city to visit) recently and it does appear to be a growing and vibrant school with lots of community support.

The general student body is basically a community college, imagine how bad the football team is. I’m sure Blue Mountain State isn’t completely made up out of thin air 04-cheers

Schools like Boise are why the NCAA requires athletes to have minimum SAT scores (our conference has those schools too, hey Marshall and UTEP). Looking at the rules now though if a student can get a 3.5 at a terrible HS then they only need a 430 on their SAT. The minimum you can get on the SAT for showing up is 400. Someone with a GPA of 2.5 only needs a 900. Low bars indeed....

From the Boise State grads I’ve met-which is admittedly a small sample and also probably some selection bias given that my interactions have been with the F50 company I work for-it’s a bit more complicated than that.

If you grow up in Idaho, you don’t really have many options for school. You can go to Boise St, University of Idaho, or Idaho State for public, or BYU-Idaho if you want a private/religious school. Traditionally, all of the “smart kids” went to University of Idaho, but with the growth of Boise and the increased notoriety of the school (largely due to football), many are now going to Boise State. As a result, I get the impression that there’s fairly high variance within the student body-lots of bright people and also some who are just scraping by...

But yes (stating the obvious), it’s not in remotely the same league as Rice or any of our peers.

Every school has their high achievers who choose to attend for whatever reason (family, proximity, $) but Boise lets in 82% of applicants and has an average SAT of 1110. That’s about like Marshall. I believe both are considered “regional schools” by USNWR and aren’t even ranked against most FBS universities academically. UTEP lets in 100% of applicants. We should not be in a conference with these schools but that’s what we’ve let happen.
11-28-2019 11:59 PM
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