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Mary Hardin-Baylor forced to vacate 2016 Division III National Title
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TampaTom Offline
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Exclamation Mary Hardin-Baylor forced to vacate 2016 Division III National Title
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UMHB to vacate D-III national title due to allowing players to borrow vehicle for 18 months.

Quote:UMHB previously self-imposed a two-year probation period, enhanced compliance training and a $2,500 fine. Fredenburg received a three-month suspension without pay and a three-game suspension, which was served in 2018. The NCAA accepted the self-imposed punishments, but levied the additional forfeits.

If the punishment is upheld, UMHB will have to vacate 29 total wins between the two seasons. The Crusaders appeared in the Stagg Bowl both seasons, and won the 2016 title over Wisconsin-Oshkosh.
10-10-2019 02:50 PM
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Wedge Offline
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RE: Mary Hardin-Baylor forced to vacate 2016 Division III National Title
The NCAA was so mad at Baylor, they put Mary Hardin Baylor on probation!
10-10-2019 03:06 PM
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Yosef Himself Offline
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RE: Mary Hardin-Baylor forced to vacate 2016 Division III National Title
(10-10-2019 03:06 PM)Wedge Wrote:  The NCAA was so mad at Baylor, they put Mary Hardin Baylor on probation!

Well they are like 30 minutes apart. Maybe someone goofed at the NCAA
10-10-2019 03:10 PM
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IWokeUpLikeThis Offline
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RE: Mary Hardin-Baylor forced to vacate 2016 Division III National Title
Quote:"The case involved the provision of local transportation by coaching staff and centered around the loan of Fredenburg’s 2006 Subaru to one student-athlete prior to and during the 2016 season and again during the 2017 season. These actions violated NCAA rules, including impermissible benefits, and head coach responsibility.

Mary Hardin-Baylor also self-reported a violation involving Fredenburg’s loan of the same car to another student-athlete for less than one hour before it broke down and had to be towed."

In summation, a total of two football players were given permission to use the head coach’s FREAKING 2006 SUBARU on four different occasions.

Because of that, the university confirmed, the NCAA has, among other punitive measures, stripped the football program of all of its wins and records during the 2016 and 2017 seasons — including its 2016 national championship. Over the loaning of a FREAKING 2006 SUBARU.

UMHB had previously self-imposed a handful of sanctions, including two years of probation; enhanced compliance training, $2,500 fine; and a three-month suspension without pay and a three-game suspension at the beginning of the 2018 season for head coach Pete Fredenburg. The COI accepted all of those self-imposed sanctions while adding the vacating of wins and records.

https://collegefootballtalk.nbcspor...coach-allowed-players-to-use-his-2006-subaru/
10-10-2019 03:27 PM
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MidWestMidMajor Offline
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RE: Mary Hardin-Baylor forced to vacate 2016 Division III National Title
Wow. Coach lets a kid borrow his old subaru (not a new Escalade), and the NCAA strips 29 victories and a national championship.
Justice means the the punishment fits the crime. How does this punishment fit this crime?? That's way too severe.
They are not just punishing 1 kid. They are punishing 100+ young men and coaches who are not guilty of this.

But when North Carolina gives fake grades to fake courses leading to fake degrees (much worse in my opinion), the NCAA shrugs.

Note: the school self-reported. Lesson to be learned: NEVER self report to the NCAA.
Drake AD once said, "If we give players bagels and leave jam next to them- it's OK. If we put jam on the bagels, it's a violation."
10-10-2019 03:31 PM
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quo vadis Offline
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RE: Mary Hardin-Baylor forced to vacate 2016 Division III National Title
Ridiculous.
10-10-2019 03:33 PM
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solohawks Online
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RE: Mary Hardin-Baylor forced to vacate 2016 Division III National Title
This is why we cant have nice things
10-10-2019 03:49 PM
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TuckerGnat Online
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RE: Mary Hardin-Baylor forced to vacate 2016 Division III National Title
(10-10-2019 03:31 PM)MidWestMidMajor Wrote:  But when North Carolina gives fake grades to fake courses leading to fake degrees (much worse in my opinion), the NCAA shrugs.

I love the way you people keep harping about UNC, yet totally ignore the sexual assaults (thousands of them!) that occurred at THREE different B1G schools. One was briefly penalized, but had the sanctions lifted, because they were complying with the NCAA... after they'd already been found guilty and were paying for the crimes. The other two? Not even a slap on the wrist.
10-10-2019 04:11 PM
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The Cutter of Bish Offline
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RE: Mary Hardin-Baylor forced to vacate 2016 Division III National Title
It never fails. Work with the NCAA, self-sanction...NCAA goes over the top.

It’s not an oppositional read, NCAA. When you can’t and don’t make an example with those who don’t work with you, but throw the book at those who do, other schools will simply neglect to work with you. And, yes...when you have some of the most awful cultures going on in places like Baylor and three Big Ten schools, but you do this? No, everybody sees the hypocrisy and fecklessness of your organization, not just smart marks.
10-10-2019 06:51 PM
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Big Frog II Offline
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RE: Mary Hardin-Baylor forced to vacate 2016 Division III National Title
I really hate the NCAA.
10-10-2019 06:53 PM
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solohawks Online
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RE: Mary Hardin-Baylor forced to vacate 2016 Division III National Title
Honestly whats the point and logic of making a D3 school forfeit wins over borrowing a coach's beat up car.

Has the NCAA issued their reasoing for the punishment they added on
10-10-2019 08:16 PM
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RE: Mary Hardin-Baylor forced to vacate 2016 Division III National Title
(10-10-2019 04:11 PM)TuckerGnat Wrote:  
(10-10-2019 03:31 PM)MidWestMidMajor Wrote:  But when North Carolina gives fake grades to fake courses leading to fake degrees (much worse in my opinion), the NCAA shrugs.

I love the way you people keep harping about UNC, yet totally ignore the sexual assaults (thousands of them!) that occurred at THREE different B1G schools. One was briefly penalized, but had the sanctions lifted, because they were complying with the NCAA... after they'd already been found guilty and were paying for the crimes. The other two? Not even a slap on the wrist.

Penn St. was a criminal matter that involved an EX-coach. The NCAA had to back off because they knew they had no authority over the matter and would lose any lawsuit.

Michigan St. was bad, but I don't remember the details as to who knew what about the trainer or if he managed to keep it secret.

Not sure who else you are talking about but thousands is an exaggeration.

Now Montana got a relative slap on the wrist.
10-10-2019 11:00 PM
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RE: Mary Hardin-Baylor forced to vacate 2016 Division III National Title
(10-10-2019 04:11 PM)TuckerGnat Wrote:  
(10-10-2019 03:31 PM)MidWestMidMajor Wrote:  But when North Carolina gives fake grades to fake courses leading to fake degrees (much worse in my opinion), the NCAA shrugs.

I love the way you people keep harping about UNC, yet totally ignore the sexual assaults (thousands of them!) that occurred at THREE different B1G schools. One was briefly penalized, but had the sanctions lifted, because they were complying with the NCAA... after they'd already been found guilty and were paying for the crimes. The other two? Not even a slap on the wrist.

And the NCAA is supposed to regulate college athletics. Its not about police actions.
10-10-2019 11:03 PM
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MidWestMidMajor Offline
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RE: Mary Hardin-Baylor forced to vacate 2016 Division III National Title
(10-10-2019 04:11 PM)TuckerGnat Wrote:  
(10-10-2019 03:31 PM)MidWestMidMajor Wrote:  But when North Carolina gives fake grades to fake courses leading to fake degrees (much worse in my opinion), the NCAA shrugs.

I love the way you people keep harping about UNC, yet totally ignore the sexual assaults (thousands of them!) that occurred at THREE different B1G schools. One was briefly penalized, but had the sanctions lifted, because they were complying with the NCAA... after they'd already been found guilty and were paying for the crimes. The other two? Not even a slap on the wrist.

I am not minimizing sexual assault, which is a crime and needs to be turned over to law enforcement and the courts. The court system is set up with the legal tools to determine guilt and punishment. The NCAA is not a legal law enforcement agency; it doesn't have those tools.

The NCAA is supposed to ensure fair play in sports. That's their job. The whole premise of the NCAA is the "student athlete". Fake classes, grades, & degrees are the extreme corruption of the "student" part of "student athlete". It is at the very core. That's why the failure of the NCAA to do anything about UNC while cracking the whip on smaller institution for smaller infractions drives me beyond crazy.

I look at what happened at Baylor: the HC, all football coaches, AD, and university president were all removed. Art Briles will likely never coach in the NCAA again for his lack of "institutional control" over his program. There was a thorough review of the athletic department and the university. 100 new Title IX policies were implemented. The school faced significant financial repercussion. From what I can tell, it is a changed institution. The NCAA didn't do that. The courts did.

interesting article from the Ft. Worth paper: https://www.star-telegram.com/sports/spt...68870.html
The money quote: "According to its bylaws, the NCAA didn’t have much of a reason to open an investigation in the first place. The organization handles matters regarding recruiting, eligibility and practices. It does not have authority over criminal cases, which are handled by police and the court system. But the NCAA got involved because it has a desired outcome: That the optics of mishandling sexual assault claims at one of its member institutions — one that has a record of bad headlines this century — cannot go unpunished."

From what I can tell, the NCAA hasn't yet issue its final ruling. https://www.dallasnews.com/sports/2019/0...is-summer/
10-10-2019 11:39 PM
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BruceMcF Offline
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RE: Mary Hardin-Baylor forced to vacate 2016 Division III National Title
(10-10-2019 11:00 PM)bullet Wrote:  Not sure who else you are talking about but thousands is an exaggeration.
Probably the sick team doctor at Ohio State. If so, the headline I see first thing in Google suggests accidentally adding a zero to "hundreds".
10-11-2019 04:14 AM
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quo vadis Offline
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RE: Mary Hardin-Baylor forced to vacate 2016 Division III National Title
The Michigan State and Penn State situations were FAR, FAR worse than North Carolina. Women and children being raped and abused is infinitely worse than grade cheating.

That said, the NCAA's ruling with regards to UNC is a case of pure chicken-shite. UNC should have been hit with massive penalties, vacating national titles, the whole shebang. The NCAA punting on UNC was just ridiculous.
10-11-2019 07:33 AM
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Shox Offline
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RE: Mary Hardin-Baylor forced to vacate 2016 Division III National Title
UMHB should take a stand on this and tell the NCAA it will not vacate it's national championships. The public and Texas lawmakers would be on their side and the NCAA will look even worse then they do now. I get that it's "against the rules" but when the NCAA gives UNC gets a free pass and then throws the book at a DIII because it's coach let a broke player borrow his 10 year old Subaru, something is wrong.
10-11-2019 09:16 AM
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RE: Mary Hardin-Baylor forced to vacate 2016 Division III National Title
I don't feel bad for them. They know the ncaa is a joke but chose it as their desired affiliation. They could be in the NAIA if they wanted, like a lot of similar schools. Naia has rules and follows them, but something this stupid would probably not even be on the radar of any Gestapo style rule hounds.
(This post was last modified: 10-13-2019 03:53 AM by Todor.)
10-13-2019 03:52 AM
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MidWestMidMajor Offline
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RE: Mary Hardin-Baylor forced to vacate 2016 Division III National Title
I'm about to lose my sh!t again. I just saw that the 2006 Suburu has a trade in value of about $1800.
Justice means the punishment has to fit the crime, it has to be proportionate.
I hate the NCAA!

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10-13-2019 05:18 PM
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