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Rabid Squirrel Offline
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Post: #41
RE: New Expectations
(10-07-2019 10:32 AM)NIU007 Wrote:  A lot of Lynch's passing highlights showed Daron Brown or TLL getting past the defense and Lynch hitting a wide-open WR. Who caught the ball. I'm not seeing the receivers get open (except for a few short passes) or catch the ball.

And unlike others, I never minded the jet sweep, if we have somebody fast that can run it. We have to spread the defense out more.

A lot of that was the Lynch effect. Safeties crept up. Quick outs and jet sweeps worked in part to all the attention Lynch needed. Then Lewis or brown just do a double move on the out and they end up wide open.
10-07-2019 11:37 AM
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MaddDawgz02 Offline
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Post: #42
RE: New Expectations
(10-07-2019 11:37 AM)Rabid Squirrel Wrote:  
(10-07-2019 10:32 AM)NIU007 Wrote:  A lot of Lynch's passing highlights showed Daron Brown or TLL getting past the defense and Lynch hitting a wide-open WR. Who caught the ball. I'm not seeing the receivers get open (except for a few short passes) or catch the ball.

And unlike others, I never minded the jet sweep, if we have somebody fast that can run it. We have to spread the defense out more.

A lot of that was the Lynch effect. Safeties crept up. Quick outs and jet sweeps worked in part to all the attention Lynch needed. Then Lewis or brown just do a double move on the out and they end up wide open.

Yes especially when NIU is limited at offensive line. To go from the traditional spread NIU offense to complete pro style appears to have been a little too drastic of a transition. NIU probably still has an o line built more for a spread type attack than a traditional running game approach. For this offense to work, you need hogs up front
10-07-2019 02:11 PM
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NIU007 Offline
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Post: #43
RE: New Expectations
I guess I underestimated the impact of having to teach everyone a new system.
10-07-2019 02:31 PM
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NorthCoast Away
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Post: #44
RE: New Expectations
(10-07-2019 02:31 PM)NIU007 Wrote:  I guess I underestimated the impact of having to teach everyone a new system.

That may explain some of what has happened with the Offense and Defense (more so the Offense) but how many different ways is there to punt-protect?

No pass for the Special Teams. Get your sh*t together, ST.
10-07-2019 02:39 PM
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NIU007 Offline
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Post: #45
RE: New Expectations
(10-07-2019 02:39 PM)NorthCoast Wrote:  
(10-07-2019 02:31 PM)NIU007 Wrote:  I guess I underestimated the impact of having to teach everyone a new system.

That may explain some of what has happened with the Offense and Defense (more so the Offense) but how many different ways is there to punt-protect?

No pass for the Special Teams. Get your sh*t together, ST.

Yea after I posted that I thought about it more. Some of that is just players being undisciplined and has nothing to do with a new system, besides what you mentioned about special teams.
10-07-2019 02:45 PM
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MaddDawgz02 Offline
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Post: #46
RE: New Expectations
(10-07-2019 02:45 PM)NIU007 Wrote:  
(10-07-2019 02:39 PM)NorthCoast Wrote:  
(10-07-2019 02:31 PM)NIU007 Wrote:  I guess I underestimated the impact of having to teach everyone a new system.

That may explain some of what has happened with the Offense and Defense (more so the Offense) but how many different ways is there to punt-protect?

No pass for the Special Teams. Get your sh*t together, ST.

Yea after I posted that I thought about it more. Some of that is just players being undisciplined and has nothing to do with a new system, besides what you mentioned about special teams.

I think 80 percent of penalties can be explained by inferior talent, you are basically trying to get an edge on an opponent because you cannot do it naturally by the rules.
10-07-2019 05:08 PM
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Huskiepower2003 Offline
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Post: #47
RE: New Expectations
(10-07-2019 05:08 PM)MaddDawgz02 Wrote:  
(10-07-2019 02:45 PM)NIU007 Wrote:  
(10-07-2019 02:39 PM)NorthCoast Wrote:  
(10-07-2019 02:31 PM)NIU007 Wrote:  I guess I underestimated the impact of having to teach everyone a new system.

That may explain some of what has happened with the Offense and Defense (more so the Offense) but how many different ways is there to punt-protect?

No pass for the Special Teams. Get your sh*t together, ST.

Yea after I posted that I thought about it more. Some of that is just players being undisciplined and has nothing to do with a new system, besides what you mentioned about special teams.

I think 80 percent of penalties can be explained by inferior talent, you are basically trying to get an edge on an opponent because you cannot do it naturally by the rules.

Penalties are often from lack of discipline. Not lack of talent.
10-07-2019 06:42 PM
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Rabid Squirrel Offline
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Post: #48
RE: New Expectations
(10-07-2019 06:42 PM)Huskiepower2003 Wrote:  
(10-07-2019 05:08 PM)MaddDawgz02 Wrote:  
(10-07-2019 02:45 PM)NIU007 Wrote:  
(10-07-2019 02:39 PM)NorthCoast Wrote:  
(10-07-2019 02:31 PM)NIU007 Wrote:  I guess I underestimated the impact of having to teach everyone a new system.

That may explain some of what has happened with the Offense and Defense (more so the Offense) but how many different ways is there to punt-protect?

No pass for the Special Teams. Get your sh*t together, ST.

Yea after I posted that I thought about it more. Some of that is just players being undisciplined and has nothing to do with a new system, besides what you mentioned about special teams.

I think 80 percent of penalties can be explained by inferior talent, you are basically trying to get an edge on an opponent because you cannot do it naturally by the rules.

Penalties are often from lack of discipline. Not lack of talent.

This team has way too much physical talent to play this poorly. Coaches need to let them now what is expected starting right now. ut on just talent alone they held BSU to 34 yards passing! Thats freaking amazing. The great Dave Doreen got Shredded for 333 yards with his less talented defense.

This team has the athletes to succeed, they just need to be motivated. Teams are often a reflection of their coaches personality. Hammock my need to toughen his up a bit.
10-07-2019 08:13 PM
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badmoonrising13 Offline
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Post: #49
RE: New Expectations
One thing the coaches aren’t getting credited for was an awesome defensive game plan. I thought the offensive playcalling turned too conservative despite the lousy field position thanks to our lousy special teams. We should have tried something to flip the field. But we were just happy to punt the ball away or just give it away...
10-07-2019 08:41 PM
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Post: #50
RE: New Expectations
(10-06-2019 05:31 PM)Rabid Squirrel Wrote:  
(10-06-2019 04:22 PM)SiegInc Wrote:  
(10-06-2019 08:58 AM)Rabid Squirrel Wrote:  It's execution. Finishing drives. timely mistakes. It's not talent.

Does talent not beget each of those things you mentioned? Good players execute, find the end-zone, and avoid mistakes. Coaching plays a role as well obviously, but only to a point. People keep hanging their hat on last years team winning the MACC as some kind of metric about why they should still be good, but the MAC was really bad last year. Look back at the games, we struggled to edge by some atrocious teams by a margin of a touchdown or less. I would say that its a case of we didn't have a good team, our opposition was just really bad.

Great talent lets you overcome mistakes. Im not saying NIU has great talent. They have upper half Mac talent and should have no physical issue with other MAC teams.

I agree with you when NIU plays a top 20 P5 team. They are over matched physically and have to press. I expect the penalties to be at least 2 to 1 in favor of the P5 teams. Not 18-0 like Utah and Nebraska. But yes, they will hold and cheat a tad to offset the talent gap.

The Bears game today was a PERFECT example. That game was 100% decided by penalties and mistakes. Every mistake changed the momentum. Down to the running into the punter call that cost the Bears the win. You don't question the Bears talent. But they played like NIU for most of the game and looked talentless.

Look at the 2017 WMU Broncos. 6-6 after going 13-1 in 2016. There was the same talent level on that team except at QB and 1 wr. (both were huge. But now you're saying talent level is determined by just great players which we know is just luck at Mac recruiting level). But with the new coach and system the team collapsed. It's not talent. It's execution.
FYI the 2017 WMU team had 20 season ending injuries including the QB. That screwed up the season.
10-07-2019 08:43 PM
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MaddDawgz02 Offline
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Post: #51
RE: New Expectations
(10-07-2019 06:42 PM)Huskiepower2003 Wrote:  
(10-07-2019 05:08 PM)MaddDawgz02 Wrote:  
(10-07-2019 02:45 PM)NIU007 Wrote:  
(10-07-2019 02:39 PM)NorthCoast Wrote:  
(10-07-2019 02:31 PM)NIU007 Wrote:  I guess I underestimated the impact of having to teach everyone a new system.

That may explain some of what has happened with the Offense and Defense (more so the Offense) but how many different ways is there to punt-protect?

No pass for the Special Teams. Get your sh*t together, ST.

Yea after I posted that I thought about it more. Some of that is just players being undisciplined and has nothing to do with a new system, besides what you mentioned about special teams.

I think 80 percent of penalties can be explained by inferior talent, you are basically trying to get an edge on an opponent because you cannot do it naturally by the rules.

Penalties are often from lack of discipline. Not lack of talent.

Often times , less talented teams commit penalties because they are beaten otherwise. That can be in the form of a hold or a PI. The punch obviously is an exception, that is lack of discipline but even in that case you are showing that lack of discipline out of frustration for being beat physically
(This post was last modified: 10-07-2019 10:35 PM by MaddDawgz02.)
10-07-2019 10:34 PM
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Huskiepower2003 Offline
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Post: #52
RE: New Expectations
(10-07-2019 10:34 PM)MaddDawgz02 Wrote:  
(10-07-2019 06:42 PM)Huskiepower2003 Wrote:  
(10-07-2019 05:08 PM)MaddDawgz02 Wrote:  
(10-07-2019 02:45 PM)NIU007 Wrote:  
(10-07-2019 02:39 PM)NorthCoast Wrote:  That may explain some of what has happened with the Offense and Defense (more so the Offense) but how many different ways is there to punt-protect?

No pass for the Special Teams. Get your sh*t together, ST.

Yea after I posted that I thought about it more. Some of that is just players being undisciplined and has nothing to do with a new system, besides what you mentioned about special teams.

I think 80 percent of penalties can be explained by inferior talent, you are basically trying to get an edge on an opponent because you cannot do it naturally by the rules.

Penalties are often from lack of discipline. Not lack of talent.

Often times , less talented teams commit penalties because they are beaten otherwise. That can be in the form of a hold or a PI. The punch obviously is an exception, that is lack of discipline but even in that case you are showing that lack of discipline out of frustration for being beat physically

I guess that you will continue to blame our penalties, mistakes and lack of cohesion on Rod Carey. Thomas Hammock gets a free pass for the next four years in your book?
10-08-2019 09:14 AM
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Rabid Squirrel Offline
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Post: #53
RE: New Expectations
(10-08-2019 09:14 AM)Huskiepower2003 Wrote:  
(10-07-2019 10:34 PM)MaddDawgz02 Wrote:  
(10-07-2019 06:42 PM)Huskiepower2003 Wrote:  
(10-07-2019 05:08 PM)MaddDawgz02 Wrote:  
(10-07-2019 02:45 PM)NIU007 Wrote:  Yea after I posted that I thought about it more. Some of that is just players being undisciplined and has nothing to do with a new system, besides what you mentioned about special teams.

I think 80 percent of penalties can be explained by inferior talent, you are basically trying to get an edge on an opponent because you cannot do it naturally by the rules.

Penalties are often from lack of discipline. Not lack of talent.

Often times , less talented teams commit penalties because they are beaten otherwise. That can be in the form of a hold or a PI. The punch obviously is an exception, that is lack of discipline but even in that case you are showing that lack of discipline out of frustration for being beat physically

I guess that you will continue to blame our penalties, mistakes and lack of cohesion on Rod Carey. Thomas Hammock gets a free pass for the next four years in your book?

These are the same players that last year didn’t make dumb penalties. Same players. Same talent. More penalties. Different coach. Hmmmmmm. Wonder what the difference is? Did Kramer suddenly lose talent over the summer? Or I is it possible the new coaching isn’t working out for him as well?
10-08-2019 09:37 AM
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NIU007 Offline
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Post: #54
RE: New Expectations
(10-08-2019 09:37 AM)Rabid Squirrel Wrote:  
(10-08-2019 09:14 AM)Huskiepower2003 Wrote:  
(10-07-2019 10:34 PM)MaddDawgz02 Wrote:  
(10-07-2019 06:42 PM)Huskiepower2003 Wrote:  
(10-07-2019 05:08 PM)MaddDawgz02 Wrote:  I think 80 percent of penalties can be explained by inferior talent, you are basically trying to get an edge on an opponent because you cannot do it naturally by the rules.

Penalties are often from lack of discipline. Not lack of talent.

Often times , less talented teams commit penalties because they are beaten otherwise. That can be in the form of a hold or a PI. The punch obviously is an exception, that is lack of discipline but even in that case you are showing that lack of discipline out of frustration for being beat physically

I guess that you will continue to blame our penalties, mistakes and lack of cohesion on Rod Carey. Thomas Hammock gets a free pass for the next four years in your book?

These are the same players that last year didn’t make dumb penalties. Same players. Same talent. More penalties. Different coach. Hmmmmmm. Wonder what the difference is? Did Kramer suddenly lose talent over the summer? Or I is it possible the new coaching isn’t working out for him as well?

In Kramer's case, they definitely don't have the same talent on the D-line that they did last year.
10-08-2019 09:42 AM
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MaddDawgz02 Offline
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Post: #55
RE: New Expectations
(10-08-2019 09:42 AM)NIU007 Wrote:  
(10-08-2019 09:37 AM)Rabid Squirrel Wrote:  
(10-08-2019 09:14 AM)Huskiepower2003 Wrote:  
(10-07-2019 10:34 PM)MaddDawgz02 Wrote:  
(10-07-2019 06:42 PM)Huskiepower2003 Wrote:  Penalties are often from lack of discipline. Not lack of talent.

Often times , less talented teams commit penalties because they are beaten otherwise. That can be in the form of a hold or a PI. The punch obviously is an exception, that is lack of discipline but even in that case you are showing that lack of discipline out of frustration for being beat physically

I guess that you will continue to blame our penalties, mistakes and lack of cohesion on Rod Carey. Thomas Hammock gets a free pass for the next four years in your book?

These are the same players that last year didn’t make dumb penalties. Same players. Same talent. More penalties. Different coach. Hmmmmmm. Wonder what the difference is? Did Kramer suddenly lose talent over the summer? Or I is it possible the new coaching isn’t working out for him as well?

In Kramer's case, they definitely don't have the same talent on the D-line that they did last year.

I would not even attempt to provide reasoning NIU007, its a fruitless effort
10-08-2019 09:48 AM
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Rabid Squirrel Offline
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Post: #56
RE: New Expectations
(10-08-2019 09:42 AM)NIU007 Wrote:  
(10-08-2019 09:37 AM)Rabid Squirrel Wrote:  
(10-08-2019 09:14 AM)Huskiepower2003 Wrote:  
(10-07-2019 10:34 PM)MaddDawgz02 Wrote:  
(10-07-2019 06:42 PM)Huskiepower2003 Wrote:  Penalties are often from lack of discipline. Not lack of talent.

Often times , less talented teams commit penalties because they are beaten otherwise. That can be in the form of a hold or a PI. The punch obviously is an exception, that is lack of discipline but even in that case you are showing that lack of discipline out of frustration for being beat physically

I guess that you will continue to blame our penalties, mistakes and lack of cohesion on Rod Carey. Thomas Hammock gets a free pass for the next four years in your book?

These are the same players that last year didn’t make dumb penalties. Same players. Same talent. More penalties. Different coach. Hmmmmmm. Wonder what the difference is? Did Kramer suddenly lose talent over the summer? Or I is it possible the new coaching isn’t working out for him as well?

In Kramer's case, they definitely don't have the same talent on the D-line that they did last year.

Kramer and Heflin are the best D tackles NIU has had in a long long time. Sutton Smith is statistically the best End at applying QB pressure per game in the history of the ncaa. We are never going to have anyone like him again. Complaining about the drop off at D-end in 2019 would be like Miami of Ohio complaining about the QB who followed Roethlisberger.

NIU was getting around 25 sacks a season the years right before Smith came on. This was never rush-end-U.
10-08-2019 09:50 AM
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MaddDawgz02 Offline
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Post: #57
RE: New Expectations
(10-08-2019 09:14 AM)Huskiepower2003 Wrote:  
(10-07-2019 10:34 PM)MaddDawgz02 Wrote:  
(10-07-2019 06:42 PM)Huskiepower2003 Wrote:  
(10-07-2019 05:08 PM)MaddDawgz02 Wrote:  
(10-07-2019 02:45 PM)NIU007 Wrote:  Yea after I posted that I thought about it more. Some of that is just players being undisciplined and has nothing to do with a new system, besides what you mentioned about special teams.

I think 80 percent of penalties can be explained by inferior talent, you are basically trying to get an edge on an opponent because you cannot do it naturally by the rules.

Penalties are often from lack of discipline. Not lack of talent.

Often times , less talented teams commit penalties because they are beaten otherwise. That can be in the form of a hold or a PI. The punch obviously is an exception, that is lack of discipline but even in that case you are showing that lack of discipline out of frustration for being beat physically

I guess that you will continue to blame our penalties, mistakes and lack of cohesion on Rod Carey. Thomas Hammock gets a free pass for the next four years in your book?

I think Hammock should get 2 years to turn things around, that is more than fair in my book. He walked into a lack of talent, no matter how much you love Rod, you have to concede he did not leave much to work with.
10-08-2019 09:50 AM
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NIU007 Offline
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Post: #58
RE: New Expectations
(10-08-2019 09:50 AM)Rabid Squirrel Wrote:  
(10-08-2019 09:42 AM)NIU007 Wrote:  
(10-08-2019 09:37 AM)Rabid Squirrel Wrote:  
(10-08-2019 09:14 AM)Huskiepower2003 Wrote:  
(10-07-2019 10:34 PM)MaddDawgz02 Wrote:  Often times , less talented teams commit penalties because they are beaten otherwise. That can be in the form of a hold or a PI. The punch obviously is an exception, that is lack of discipline but even in that case you are showing that lack of discipline out of frustration for being beat physically

I guess that you will continue to blame our penalties, mistakes and lack of cohesion on Rod Carey. Thomas Hammock gets a free pass for the next four years in your book?

These are the same players that last year didn’t make dumb penalties. Same players. Same talent. More penalties. Different coach. Hmmmmmm. Wonder what the difference is? Did Kramer suddenly lose talent over the summer? Or I is it possible the new coaching isn’t working out for him as well?

In Kramer's case, they definitely don't have the same talent on the D-line that they did last year.

Kramer and Heflin are the best D tackles NIU has had in a long long time. Sutton Smith is statistically the best End at applying QB pressure per game in the history of the ncaa. We are never going to have anyone like him again. Complaining about the drop off at D-end in 2019 would be like Miami of Ohio complaining about the QB who followed Roethlisberger.

NIU was getting around 25 sacks a season the years right before Smith came on. This was never rush-end-U.

The point is, the D-line isn't as good as a whole, and it can lead to frustration when you get basically no pressure on the QB. And we have had very good D-ends before. But we had been getting fewer and fewer sacks, a definite trend, before SS showed up.
10-08-2019 10:09 AM
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NIU75 Offline
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Post: #59
RE: New Expectations
(10-08-2019 09:50 AM)MaddDawgz02 Wrote:  
(10-08-2019 09:14 AM)Huskiepower2003 Wrote:  
(10-07-2019 10:34 PM)MaddDawgz02 Wrote:  
(10-07-2019 06:42 PM)Huskiepower2003 Wrote:  
(10-07-2019 05:08 PM)MaddDawgz02 Wrote:  I think 80 percent of penalties can be explained by inferior talent, you are basically trying to get an edge on an opponent because you cannot do it naturally by the rules.

Penalties are often from lack of discipline. Not lack of talent.

Often times , less talented teams commit penalties because they are beaten otherwise. That can be in the form of a hold or a PI. The punch obviously is an exception, that is lack of discipline but even in that case you are showing that lack of discipline out of frustration for being beat physically

I guess that you will continue to blame our penalties, mistakes and lack of cohesion on Rod Carey. Thomas Hammock gets a free pass for the next four years in your book?

I think Hammock should get 2 years to turn things around, that is more than fair in my book. He walked into a lack of talent, no matter how much you love Rod, you have to concede he did not leave much to work with.
No need to worry No matter what Hammock's record is next year, SF will sign him to a four year extension.
10-08-2019 10:15 AM
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MaddDawgz02 Offline
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Post: #60
RE: New Expectations
(10-08-2019 10:09 AM)NIU007 Wrote:  
(10-08-2019 09:50 AM)Rabid Squirrel Wrote:  
(10-08-2019 09:42 AM)NIU007 Wrote:  
(10-08-2019 09:37 AM)Rabid Squirrel Wrote:  
(10-08-2019 09:14 AM)Huskiepower2003 Wrote:  I guess that you will continue to blame our penalties, mistakes and lack of cohesion on Rod Carey. Thomas Hammock gets a free pass for the next four years in your book?

These are the same players that last year didn’t make dumb penalties. Same players. Same talent. More penalties. Different coach. Hmmmmmm. Wonder what the difference is? Did Kramer suddenly lose talent over the summer? Or I is it possible the new coaching isn’t working out for him as well?

In Kramer's case, they definitely don't have the same talent on the D-line that they did last year.

Kramer and Heflin are the best D tackles NIU has had in a long long time. Sutton Smith is statistically the best End at applying QB pressure per game in the history of the ncaa. We are never going to have anyone like him again. Complaining about the drop off at D-end in 2019 would be like Miami of Ohio complaining about the QB who followed Roethlisberger.

NIU was getting around 25 sacks a season the years right before Smith came on. This was never rush-end-U.

The point is, the D-line isn't as good as a whole, and it can lead to frustration when you get basically no pressure on the QB. And we have had very good D-ends before. But we had been getting fewer and fewer sacks, a definite trend, before SS showed up.

How many sacks did Kramer and Heflin get when the QB stepped up in the pocket after Smith crashed the outside. It was the majority of their sacks.
10-08-2019 10:31 AM
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