Interesting. Just can’t wait to see Wiseman in action.
I can’t see Cumberland from Cincy as a 3rd team anything, tho.

Well, he has Wiseman as first team all American
"I don’t think that Wiseman is going to be the most productive freshman in college basketball this season but I do think that he is going to be the best freshman."

But scroll down a little and look at his preseason top 25. What a pile of garbage.

Coming in at

#13. Seton Hall (final KenPOM #60, BTW Memphis finished #56)
Lost 6'8" Michael Nzei, added #183 Tyrese Samuel

#15 Utah State (final KenPOM #38)
Added the 65th best recruiting class ( we had the 30th best last year)
with 4 3 stars

#17 St Mary's (final KenPOM #13)
Lost 6'10" center, added 3 unrated players.

Nothing against these magnificent teams, but no way does a rational, objective journalists drop the #1 recruiting class with height, speed, athleticism, shooting and ball handling, to #21 when you have 3 returning starters who played significant roles.

He wouldn't even explain why in the article, but rather redirected you to click on another article that includes...

"But there is also plenty of reason to be skeptical of them (Memphis). For starters, we’ve seen Penny coach one season of college basketball. They probably exceeded expectations during that one season, but one year is not exactly a large sample size."

Not trying to be a jerk, but there are plenty of coaches with years and years of sample size, some ranked above him, that ain't never done nothing.

We'll be fighting this crap all year, even if we go undefeated.

The only reason Memphis is ranked at all is because of the Tournament. If basketball teams played in bowl games Memphis would be a mid major and would have to go undefeated to get an Easter bowl.

Can't see the OP caption, but I'm guessing it's Dauster. He's a definite skeptic of Penny. Seems like he had us around #10 in a way-too-early poll, but then dropped us as soon as he had an excuse (the Arky grad transfer who didn't grad). I don't think he's a hater like some, but he's certainly skeptical.

And, yeah, when you start breaking down these guys polls, it's pretty funny some of the psycho-gymnastics they go thru to rank some of these programs. Poll attacks could be interesting this year; however GP will probably avoid referencing us in order to keep his national cred.

(10-02-2019 02:30 AM)Tiger87 Wrote:  Can't see the OP caption, but I'm guessing it's Dauster. He's a definite skeptic of Penny. Seems like he had us around #10 in a way-too-early poll, but then dropped us as soon as he had an excuse (the Arky grad transfer who didn't grad). I don't think he's a hater like some, but he's certainly skeptical.

And, yeah, when you start breaking down these guys polls, it's pretty funny some of the psycho-gymnastics they go thru to rank some of these programs. Poll attacks could be interesting this year; however GP will probably avoid referencing us in order to keep his national cred.

Parrish has Memphis top 10, so that isn't the case.

(10-02-2019 08:34 AM)salukiblue Wrote:  

(10-02-2019 02:30 AM)Tiger87 Wrote:  Can't see the OP caption, but I'm guessing it's Dauster. He's a definite skeptic of Penny. Seems like he had us around #10 in a way-too-early poll, but then dropped us as soon as he had an excuse (the Arky grad transfer who didn't grad). I don't think he's a hater like some, but he's certainly skeptical.

And, yeah, when you start breaking down these guys polls, it's pretty funny some of the psycho-gymnastics they go thru to rank some of these programs. Poll attacks could be interesting this year; however GP will probably avoid referencing us in order to keep his national cred.

Parrish has Memphis top 10, so that isn't the case.

To me anything 15 and under is fair. It's pretty silly to have us in the 20's even if you think Penny can't coach.

(10-02-2019 09:15 AM)mairving Wrote:  

(10-02-2019 08:34 AM)salukiblue Wrote:  

(10-02-2019 02:30 AM)Tiger87 Wrote:  Can't see the OP caption, but I'm guessing it's Dauster. He's a definite skeptic of Penny. Seems like he had us around #10 in a way-too-early poll, but then dropped us as soon as he had an excuse (the Arky grad transfer who didn't grad). I don't think he's a hater like some, but he's certainly skeptical.

And, yeah, when you start breaking down these guys polls, it's pretty funny some of the psycho-gymnastics they go thru to rank some of these programs. Poll attacks could be interesting this year; however GP will probably avoid referencing us in order to keep his national cred.

Parrish has Memphis top 10, so that isn't the case.

To me anything 15 and under is fair. It's pretty silly to have us in the 20's even if you think Penny can't coach.

It literally defies logic.

I can see fair arguments between 5 and 15. 8-11 seems the right place when including how voters usually place schools with top recruiting classes and some returning players.

(10-02-2019 09:15 AM)mairving Wrote:  To me anything 15 and under is fair. It's pretty silly to have us in the 20's even if you think Penny can't coach.

Agreed, but I think if anything it'll just help motivate Penny and the team to prove the doubters wrong.

(10-02-2019 08:34 AM)salukiblue Wrote:  

(10-02-2019 02:30 AM)Tiger87 Wrote:  Can't see the OP caption, but I'm guessing it's Dauster. He's a definite skeptic of Penny. Seems like he had us around #10 in a way-too-early poll, but then dropped us as soon as he had an excuse (the Arky grad transfer who didn't grad). I don't think he's a hater like some, but he's certainly skeptical.

And, yeah, when you start breaking down these guys polls, it's pretty funny some of the psycho-gymnastics they go thru to rank some of these programs. Poll attacks could be interesting this year; however GP will probably avoid referencing us in order to keep his national cred.

Parrish has Memphis top 10, so that isn't the case.

I know that. I'm talking about when he starts his poll attacks. He will probably avoid castigating voters using Memphis as the basis, because his cred would be called into question.

(10-02-2019 09:33 AM)salukiblue Wrote:  

(10-02-2019 09:15 AM)mairving Wrote:  

(10-02-2019 08:34 AM)salukiblue Wrote:  

(10-02-2019 02:30 AM)Tiger87 Wrote:  Can't see the OP caption, but I'm guessing it's Dauster. He's a definite skeptic of Penny. Seems like he had us around #10 in a way-too-early poll, but then dropped us as soon as he had an excuse (the Arky grad transfer who didn't grad). I don't think he's a hater like some, but he's certainly skeptical.

And, yeah, when you start breaking down these guys polls, it's pretty funny some of the psycho-gymnastics they go thru to rank some of these programs. Poll attacks could be interesting this year; however GP will probably avoid referencing us in order to keep his national cred.

Parrish has Memphis top 10, so that isn't the case.

To me anything 15 and under is fair. It's pretty silly to have us in the 20's even if you think Penny can't coach.

It literally defies logic.

I can see fair arguments between 5 and 15. 8-11 seems the right place when including how voters usually place schools with top recruiting classes and some returning players.

Here's some stats for you:

Teams that had the #1 recruit and the #1 recruiting class (247 composite):
2011 - Anthony Davis - Kentucky (1st), AP Pre-season rank - 2
2012 - Nerlens Noel - Kentucky (1st), AP Pre-season rank - 3
2014 - Jahlil Okafor - Duke (1st), AP Pre-season rank - 4
2017 - Marvin Bagley - Duke (1st), AP Pre-season rank - 1
2018 - RJ Barrett - Duke (1st), AP Pre-season rank - 4
2019 - James Wiseman (1st), AP Pre-season rank - ???

Teams with the #1 recruit and a top 10 recruiting class:
2010 - Harrison Barnes - North Carolina (7th), AP Pre-season rank - 8
2013 - Andrew Wiggins - Kansas (2nd), AP Pre-season rank - 5
2015 - Ben Simmons - LSU (10th), AP Pre-season rank - 21

Teams with the #1 recruit and a recruiting class above 10:
2009 - Derrick Favors - Georgia Tech (11), AP Pre-season rank - 20
2016 - Josh Jackson - Kansas (16th), AP Pre-season rank - 3

So far no team in the last ten years has had the #1 recruiting class and the #1 recruit and failed to make the top 5 in the pre-season AP poll. LSU in 2015 got the #1 recruit and had a top 10 class but were ranked 21 to start the season. They finished unranked at 19-14 for the year. So there is a slight precedent for a coach getting the #1 recruit and not doing very well. It's a little harder to quantify all of this because the only teams with the #1 recruit and #1 team were either Kentucky or Duke, both with HOF coaches...until this year.

Yeah...

They have opinions and some people put more stock in coaching than others. So for the COACH leaning people they will rank Penny and Memphis lower.

But to be honest Memphis may start slow (Tough start of the schedule) and you will see a bunch of I told you so articles that will likely have to eat crow come tourney time.