(04-29-2021 09:45 PM)Seahawkhoops Wrote:  

(04-29-2021 09:41 PM)bricksnivy Wrote:  Not mad about drafting Justin Fields.

I love the Pats getting Jones at 15. I’m not on the fields train, osu qbs have sucked in the nfl


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1) Fields wasn't an Ohio St recruit. He started at Georgia.

2) If Fields HAD been recruited by OSU, he would have been the highest-caliber HS prospect to arrive there in a long time, maybe even program history. He was way higher caliber than Dwayne Haskins.

3) Ryan Day is VERY different from Urban Meyer when it comes to the QB's he looks for and succeeds with. It's hard to pin the Urban NFL QB failures on Day.

4) Which QB's from Cal succeeded in the NFL before or since Aaron Rodgers? How about Texas Tech prior or since Pat Mahomes?


The program argument is a weak one. Judge the prospect, not the program. Fields is an excellent gamble. The 4th QB off the board and there is no reason to think he can't be the top QB in the class. Athletic QB's are killing it in the NFL these days and he has that, in addition to tremendous toughness (I.E. playing through that rib injury in the national title game).

I preferred both Fields and Lance (in that order) over who my Jets took at 2. Mormon Mahomes just doesn't seem to me to be a good fit in today's NFL. But then again I've been dead wrong on so many QB prospects before. For instance, Darnold was my top guy in 2018 prior to the Jets taking him, with Josh Allen un-draftable to me. Yeah, that worked out great.

(04-30-2021 07:56 AM)Seahawk Nation 08 Wrote:  

(04-29-2021 09:45 PM)Seahawkhoops Wrote:  

(04-29-2021 09:41 PM)bricksnivy Wrote:  Not mad about drafting Justin Fields.

I love the Pats getting Jones at 15. I’m not on the fields train, osu qbs have sucked in the nfl


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk

1) Fields wasn't an Ohio St recruit. He started at Georgia.

2) If Fields HAD been recruited by OSU, he would have been the highest-caliber HS prospect to arrive there in a long time, maybe even program history. He was way higher caliber than Dwayne Haskins.

3) Ryan Day is VERY different from Urban Meyer when it comes to the QB's he looks for and succeeds with. It's hard to pin the Urban NFL QB failures on Day.

4) Which QB's from Cal succeeded in the NFL before or since Aaron Rodgers? How about Texas Tech prior or since Pat Mahomes?


The program argument is a weak one. Judge the prospect, not the program. Fields is an excellent gamble. The 4th QB off the board and there is no reason to think he can't be the top QB in the class.

I preferred both Fields and Lance (in that order) over who my Jets took at 2. Mormon Mahomes just doesn't seem to me to be a good fit in today's NFL. But then again I've been dead wrong on so many QB prospects before. For instance, Darnold was my top guy in 2018 prior to the Jets taking him, with Josh Allen un-draftable to me. Yeah, that worked out great.

You guys are taking the stance that i said he sucks, those words never came out of my mouth. I just didn't like him better than the other guys in the top 5. He could be Watson, he could be Darnold.
and before Mahomes at TT? Super Bowl Champ Kingsbury, Duh

(04-30-2021 07:48 AM)Seahawkhoops Wrote:  All I'm saying is that the lists are unimpressive, take a look for yourself. That's not narrative. They liked Fields and traded up to get their guy, good for them. The last time they traded up to get a QB it didn't work out , maybe this time will work out better. If you had to guess which of the top 5 QBs will a bust, who is it? We both know there is likely to be 1.

And all I'm saying in the post above is there's no such thing as a program that's a "QB factory". Schools that have produced NFL greats tend to just produce one and that's it. Maybe 1 great one and a couple decent/OK ones.

Cal "only" has 1 in Rodgers. Texas Tech "only" has one in Mahomes. Supposedly one of the best NFL QB school's in the NCAA is Oklahoma. Their BEST QB's have been Baker Mayfield (who didn't play his full career there), Kyler Murray (started at Texas A&M) and Sam Bradford. lol.

(04-30-2021 08:00 AM)Seahawkhoops Wrote:  

(04-30-2021 07:56 AM)Seahawk Nation 08 Wrote:  

(04-29-2021 09:45 PM)Seahawkhoops Wrote:  

(04-29-2021 09:41 PM)bricksnivy Wrote:  Not mad about drafting Justin Fields.

I love the Pats getting Jones at 15. I’m not on the fields train, osu qbs have sucked in the nfl


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk

1) Fields wasn't an Ohio St recruit. He started at Georgia.

2) If Fields HAD been recruited by OSU, he would have been the highest-caliber HS prospect to arrive there in a long time, maybe even program history. He was way higher caliber than Dwayne Haskins.

3) Ryan Day is VERY different from Urban Meyer when it comes to the QB's he looks for and succeeds with. It's hard to pin the Urban NFL QB failures on Day.

4) Which QB's from Cal succeeded in the NFL before or since Aaron Rodgers? How about Texas Tech prior or since Pat Mahomes?


The program argument is a weak one. Judge the prospect, not the program. Fields is an excellent gamble. The 4th QB off the board and there is no reason to think he can't be the top QB in the class.

I preferred both Fields and Lance (in that order) over who my Jets took at 2. Mormon Mahomes just doesn't seem to me to be a good fit in today's NFL. But then again I've been dead wrong on so many QB prospects before. For instance, Darnold was my top guy in 2018 prior to the Jets taking him, with Josh Allen un-draftable to me. Yeah, that worked out great.

You guys are taking the stance that i said he sucks, those words never came out of my mouth. I just didn't like him better than the other guys in the top 5. He could be Watson, he could be Darnold.
and before Mahomes at TT? Super Bowl Champ Kingsbury, Duh

I never said in my post the words "you think Fields sucks". And now you're once again moving the goalposts and changing what you said originally. lol. Your original words were: "I’m not on the fields train, osu qbs have sucked in the nfl". What else were we supposed to infer?

I hate the way you argue.

I don't hate the Mac Jones pick either, but only because he was ridiculously efficient and I don't know just how much stock to put on him having 3 amazing WR's. Was it 25 % of his success? 75 %? I didn't watch him often enough to say. But he's a worthwhile gamble at 15.

Just as Fields is a worthwhile gamble at 11.

(04-30-2021 08:04 AM)Seahawk Nation 08 Wrote:  

(04-30-2021 07:48 AM)Seahawkhoops Wrote:  All I'm saying is that the lists are unimpressive, take a look for yourself. That's not narrative. They liked Fields and traded up to get their guy, good for them. The last time they traded up to get a QB it didn't work out , maybe this time will work out better. If you had to guess which of the top 5 QBs will a bust, who is it? We both know there is likely to be 1.

And all I'm saying in the post above is there's no such thing as a program that's a "QB factory". Schools that have produced NFL greats tend to just produce one and that's it. Maybe 1 great one and a couple decent/OK ones.

Cal "only" has 1 in Rodgers. Texas Tech "only" has one in Mahomes. Supposedly one of the best NFL QB school's in the NCAA is Oklahoma. Their BEST QB's have been Baker Mayfield (who didn't play his full career there), Kyler Murray (started at Texas A&M) and Sam Bradford. lol.

You didn't look back far enough at Cal or TT, they have had some but certainly not to the level of Rodgers or Mahomes. But that's a pretty high bar

(04-30-2021 08:06 AM)Seahawkhoops Wrote:  

(04-30-2021 08:04 AM)Seahawk Nation 08 Wrote:  

(04-30-2021 07:48 AM)Seahawkhoops Wrote:  All I'm saying is that the lists are unimpressive, take a look for yourself. That's not narrative. They liked Fields and traded up to get their guy, good for them. The last time they traded up to get a QB it didn't work out , maybe this time will work out better. If you had to guess which of the top 5 QBs will a bust, who is it? We both know there is likely to be 1.

And all I'm saying in the post above is there's no such thing as a program that's a "QB factory". Schools that have produced NFL greats tend to just produce one and that's it. Maybe 1 great one and a couple decent/OK ones.

Cal "only" has 1 in Rodgers. Texas Tech "only" has one in Mahomes. Supposedly one of the best NFL QB school's in the NCAA is Oklahoma. Their BEST QB's have been Baker Mayfield (who didn't play his full career there), Kyler Murray (started at Texas A&M) and Sam Bradford. lol.

You didn't look back far enough at Cal or TT, they have had some but certainly not to the level of Rodgers or Mahomes. But that's a pretty high bar

OK. You're right. Cal had some excellent NFL QB's in the 60s and 70s. I'm comfortable with my assessment that the QB prospect needs to be evaluated separate from the program, especially if you have to go back that far, when the college game was like a completely different sport for QB's.

As Bricks and I noted, its a lazy, weak argument. Do better.

(04-30-2021 08:06 AM)Seahawk Nation 08 Wrote:  

(04-30-2021 08:00 AM)Seahawkhoops Wrote:  

(04-30-2021 07:56 AM)Seahawk Nation 08 Wrote:  

(04-29-2021 09:45 PM)Seahawkhoops Wrote:  

(04-29-2021 09:41 PM)bricksnivy Wrote:  Not mad about drafting Justin Fields.

I love the Pats getting Jones at 15. I’m not on the fields train, osu qbs have sucked in the nfl


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk

1) Fields wasn't an Ohio St recruit. He started at Georgia.

2) If Fields HAD been recruited by OSU, he would have been the highest-caliber HS prospect to arrive there in a long time, maybe even program history. He was way higher caliber than Dwayne Haskins.

3) Ryan Day is VERY different from Urban Meyer when it comes to the QB's he looks for and succeeds with. It's hard to pin the Urban NFL QB failures on Day.

4) Which QB's from Cal succeeded in the NFL before or since Aaron Rodgers? How about Texas Tech prior or since Pat Mahomes?


The program argument is a weak one. Judge the prospect, not the program. Fields is an excellent gamble. The 4th QB off the board and there is no reason to think he can't be the top QB in the class.

I preferred both Fields and Lance (in that order) over who my Jets took at 2. Mormon Mahomes just doesn't seem to me to be a good fit in today's NFL. But then again I've been dead wrong on so many QB prospects before. For instance, Darnold was my top guy in 2018 prior to the Jets taking him, with Josh Allen un-draftable to me. Yeah, that worked out great.

You guys are taking the stance that i said he sucks, those words never came out of my mouth. I just didn't like him better than the other guys in the top 5. He could be Watson, he could be Darnold.
and before Mahomes at TT? Super Bowl Champ Kingsbury, Duh

I never said in my post the words "you think Fields sucks". And now you're once again moving the goalposts and changing what you said originally. lol. Your original words were: "I’m not on the fields train, osu qbs have sucked in the nfl". What else were we supposed to infer?

I hate the way you argue.

I don't hate the Mac Jones pick either, but only because he was ridiculously efficient and I don't know just how much stock to put on him having 3 amazing WR's. Was it 25 % of his success? 75 %? I didn't watch him often enough to say. But he's a worthwhile gamble at 15.

Just as Fields is a worthwhile gamble at 11.

You will see where i said they liked him, so they moved up to get him good job on them. I don't have any ill will towards the Bears, i hope this one works out for them, and it very well could. All i said is i didn't like him, I'm entitled to that.

(04-30-2021 08:08 AM)Seahawkhoops Wrote:  

(04-30-2021 08:06 AM)Seahawk Nation 08 Wrote:  

(04-30-2021 08:00 AM)Seahawkhoops Wrote:  

(04-30-2021 07:56 AM)Seahawk Nation 08 Wrote:  

(04-29-2021 09:45 PM)Seahawkhoops Wrote:  I love the Pats getting Jones at 15. I’m not on the fields train, osu qbs have sucked in the nfl


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk

1) Fields wasn't an Ohio St recruit. He started at Georgia.

2) If Fields HAD been recruited by OSU, he would have been the highest-caliber HS prospect to arrive there in a long time, maybe even program history. He was way higher caliber than Dwayne Haskins.

3) Ryan Day is VERY different from Urban Meyer when it comes to the QB's he looks for and succeeds with. It's hard to pin the Urban NFL QB failures on Day.

4) Which QB's from Cal succeeded in the NFL before or since Aaron Rodgers? How about Texas Tech prior or since Pat Mahomes?


The program argument is a weak one. Judge the prospect, not the program. Fields is an excellent gamble. The 4th QB off the board and there is no reason to think he can't be the top QB in the class.

I preferred both Fields and Lance (in that order) over who my Jets took at 2. Mormon Mahomes just doesn't seem to me to be a good fit in today's NFL. But then again I've been dead wrong on so many QB prospects before. For instance, Darnold was my top guy in 2018 prior to the Jets taking him, with Josh Allen un-draftable to me. Yeah, that worked out great.

You guys are taking the stance that i said he sucks, those words never came out of my mouth. I just didn't like him better than the other guys in the top 5. He could be Watson, he could be Darnold.
and before Mahomes at TT? Super Bowl Champ Kingsbury, Duh

I never said in my post the words "you think Fields sucks". And now you're once again moving the goalposts and changing what you said originally. lol. Your original words were: "I’m not on the fields train, osu qbs have sucked in the nfl". What else were we supposed to infer?

I hate the way you argue.

I don't hate the Mac Jones pick either, but only because he was ridiculously efficient and I don't know just how much stock to put on him having 3 amazing WR's. Was it 25 % of his success? 75 %? I didn't watch him often enough to say. But he's a worthwhile gamble at 15.

Just as Fields is a worthwhile gamble at 11.

You will see where i said they liked him, so they moved up to get him good job on them. I don't have any ill will towards the Bears, i hope this one works out for them, and it very well could. All i said is i didn't like him, I'm entitled to that.

You are entitled to whatever opinion you wish. Just make your arguments in good faith and stop constantly moving the goalposts in hindsight to suit your new positions.

If this opinion you just stated here was the one you posted initially, I would have agreed and moved on. It wasn't. So it just ended up a giant waste of time.

(04-30-2021 08:10 AM)Seahawk Nation 08 Wrote:  

(04-30-2021 08:08 AM)Seahawkhoops Wrote:  

(04-30-2021 08:06 AM)Seahawk Nation 08 Wrote:  

(04-30-2021 08:00 AM)Seahawkhoops Wrote:  

(04-30-2021 07:56 AM)Seahawk Nation 08 Wrote:  1) Fields wasn't an Ohio St recruit. He started at Georgia.

2) If Fields HAD been recruited by OSU, he would have been the highest-caliber HS prospect to arrive there in a long time, maybe even program history. He was way higher caliber than Dwayne Haskins.

3) Ryan Day is VERY different from Urban Meyer when it comes to the QB's he looks for and succeeds with. It's hard to pin the Urban NFL QB failures on Day.

4) Which QB's from Cal succeeded in the NFL before or since Aaron Rodgers? How about Texas Tech prior or since Pat Mahomes?


The program argument is a weak one. Judge the prospect, not the program. Fields is an excellent gamble. The 4th QB off the board and there is no reason to think he can't be the top QB in the class.

I preferred both Fields and Lance (in that order) over who my Jets took at 2. Mormon Mahomes just doesn't seem to me to be a good fit in today's NFL. But then again I've been dead wrong on so many QB prospects before. For instance, Darnold was my top guy in 2018 prior to the Jets taking him, with Josh Allen un-draftable to me. Yeah, that worked out great.

You guys are taking the stance that i said he sucks, those words never came out of my mouth. I just didn't like him better than the other guys in the top 5. He could be Watson, he could be Darnold.
and before Mahomes at TT? Super Bowl Champ Kingsbury, Duh

I never said in my post the words "you think Fields sucks". And now you're once again moving the goalposts and changing what you said originally. lol. Your original words were: "I’m not on the fields train, osu qbs have sucked in the nfl". What else were we supposed to infer?

I hate the way you argue.

I don't hate the Mac Jones pick either, but only because he was ridiculously efficient and I don't know just how much stock to put on him having 3 amazing WR's. Was it 25 % of his success? 75 %? I didn't watch him often enough to say. But he's a worthwhile gamble at 15.

Just as Fields is a worthwhile gamble at 11.

You will see where i said they liked him, so they moved up to get him good job on them. I don't have any ill will towards the Bears, i hope this one works out for them, and it very well could. All i said is i didn't like him, I'm entitled to that.

You are entitled to whatever opinion you wish. Just make your arguments in good faith and stop constantly moving the goalposts in hindsight to suit your new positions.

You are confusing me with 82, I don't move goal posts. I'm as consistent as it gets with my arguments.
Now onto the real intrigue, how does the Rodgers situation play out? GM came out this morning and said they will not trade him, and he says he doesn't want to play. Does he pull a Gronk and temporarily retire, host jeopardy for a year?

(04-30-2021 07:48 AM)Seahawkhoops Wrote:  

(04-30-2021 07:37 AM)bricksnivy Wrote:  

(04-30-2021 07:03 AM)Seahawkhoops Wrote:  

(04-29-2021 09:53 PM)bricksnivy Wrote:  

(04-29-2021 09:45 PM)Seahawkhoops Wrote:  I love the Pats getting Jones at 15. I’m not on the fields train, osu qbs have sucked in the nfl


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk

That is a narrative for sure. Any recent examples of Bama producing a successful QB?

Recently other than Tua who has shown flashes no. Both lists are pretty unimpressive. It’s more than narrative when you look at the lists. Both of them could go either way, I like Mac’s fit in NE system


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk

No, it's a lazy narrative that has zero value evaluating this specific player. Other than Haskins, you're not even comparing him to other QBs that played for the same coach.

Of course there is risk in drafting a QB. It is freaking hard to do, so of course Fields could fail, but it will have absolutely nothing to do with coming from Columbus. Should teams next year pass on Sam Howell because Trubisky sucked?

It's okay to admit that you're not an expert at evaluating the position. There are loads of people paid to do this that miss on this position frequently.

All I'm saying is that the lists are unimpressive, take a look for yourself. That's not narrative. They liked Fields and traded up to get their guy, good for them. The last time they traded up to get a QB it didn't work out , maybe this time will work out better. If you had to guess which of the top 5 QBs will a bust, who is it? We both know there is likely to be 1.

Sure, it's an unimpressive list, but my point is that it is irrelevant to Fields. I don't know if he'll be successful, but I think it was a good move for Chicago. There are a lot of people questioning the pick because he's from OSU and that is what I'm calling lazy.

And listen, I suck at evaluating prospects. I'm from Winston and a few years older than CP3 and I remember telling people that he'd be average when he faced ACC caliber competition. That is why I have such respect for guys like Telep that have a proven track record evaluating talent, and why I defer to them when evaluating talent.

Regarding Fields, I trust Nagy's ability to evaluate, but I'm not sure about development.

Of the 5, I think the most likely bust is Lance due to the caliber of competition and limited starts. Wilson is probably second on that list, but I like him a lot. I don't think Jones will be a bust, but I do believe he has the lowest ceiling of the 5.

(04-30-2021 08:13 AM)Seahawkhoops Wrote:  

(04-30-2021 08:10 AM)Seahawk Nation 08 Wrote:  

(04-30-2021 08:08 AM)Seahawkhoops Wrote:  

(04-30-2021 08:06 AM)Seahawk Nation 08 Wrote:  

(04-30-2021 08:00 AM)Seahawkhoops Wrote:  You guys are taking the stance that i said he sucks, those words never came out of my mouth. I just didn't like him better than the other guys in the top 5. He could be Watson, he could be Darnold.
and before Mahomes at TT? Super Bowl Champ Kingsbury, Duh

I never said in my post the words "you think Fields sucks". And now you're once again moving the goalposts and changing what you said originally. lol. Your original words were: "I’m not on the fields train, osu qbs have sucked in the nfl". What else were we supposed to infer?

I hate the way you argue.

I don't hate the Mac Jones pick either, but only because he was ridiculously efficient and I don't know just how much stock to put on him having 3 amazing WR's. Was it 25 % of his success? 75 %? I didn't watch him often enough to say. But he's a worthwhile gamble at 15.

Just as Fields is a worthwhile gamble at 11.

You will see where i said they liked him, so they moved up to get him good job on them. I don't have any ill will towards the Bears, i hope this one works out for them, and it very well could. All i said is i didn't like him, I'm entitled to that.

You are entitled to whatever opinion you wish. Just make your arguments in good faith and stop constantly moving the goalposts in hindsight to suit your new positions.

You are confusing me with 82, I don't move goal posts. I'm as consistent as it gets with my arguments.
Now onto the real intrigue, how does the Rodgers situation play out? GM came out this morning and said they will not trade him, and he says he doesn't want to play. Does he pull a Gronk and temporarily retire, host jeopardy for a year?

No you're not, and you both do it.

I think Rodgers just wanted to ensure the Packers drafted him some help this year by making the play he did at the timing he did.
And of course they took a Corner in the 1st round, almost like they wanted to taunt him. lol.

Jeopardy Host is certainly an intriguing future option for him. He'll make quite a bit of coin (obviously not nearly as much as a QB, but certainly 7 figures is in play). He did well at it too.

(04-30-2021 08:15 AM)bricksnivy Wrote:  

(04-30-2021 07:48 AM)Seahawkhoops Wrote:  

(04-30-2021 07:37 AM)bricksnivy Wrote:  

(04-30-2021 07:03 AM)Seahawkhoops Wrote:  

(04-29-2021 09:53 PM)bricksnivy Wrote:  That is a narrative for sure. Any recent examples of Bama producing a successful QB?

Recently other than Tua who has shown flashes no. Both lists are pretty unimpressive. It’s more than narrative when you look at the lists. Both of them could go either way, I like Mac’s fit in NE system


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk

No, it's a lazy narrative that has zero value evaluating this specific player. Other than Haskins, you're not even comparing him to other QBs that played for the same coach.

Of course there is risk in drafting a QB. It is freaking hard to do, so of course Fields could fail, but it will have absolutely nothing to do with coming from Columbus. Should teams next year pass on Sam Howell because Trubisky sucked?

It's okay to admit that you're not an expert at evaluating the position. There are loads of people paid to do this that miss on this position frequently.

All I'm saying is that the lists are unimpressive, take a look for yourself. That's not narrative. They liked Fields and traded up to get their guy, good for them. The last time they traded up to get a QB it didn't work out , maybe this time will work out better. If you had to guess which of the top 5 QBs will a bust, who is it? We both know there is likely to be 1.

Sure, it's an unimpressive list, but my point is that it is irrelevant to Fields. I don't know if he'll be successful, but I think it was a good move for Chicago. There are a lot of people questioning the pick because he's from OSU and that is what I'm calling lazy.

And listen, I suck at evaluating prospects. I'm from Winston and a few years older than CP3 and I remember telling people that he'd be average when he faced ACC caliber competition. That is why I have such respect for guys like Telep that have a proven track record evaluating talent, and why I defer to them when evaluating talent.

Regarding Fields, I trust Nagy's ability to evaluate, but I'm not sure about development.

Of the 5, I think the most likely bust is Lance due to the caliber of competition and limited starts. Wilson is probably second on that list, but I like him a lot. I don't think Jones will be a bust, but I do believe he has the lowest ceiling of the 5.

We all suck at evaluating QBs. Sometimes you have to take the emotion out of it and even some of the eye test and look at the metrics.

Football Outsiders' metric, QBASE, heavily factors in # of collegiate starts, completion %, level of competition/surrounding talent, and the QB's draft stock into a formula that spits out one number. That algorithm has resulted in them getting their QB projections right or close to it about 50 % of the time, including nailing their evaluation of "busts" about 75 % of the time.

There is no front office, scouting department, individual scout, coach, analyst, talking head, etc that gets it right at a clip even approaching that. So there's little hope for me sitting on my couch as a casual college football fan and watcher. And anyone who claims they're great at it needs to produce their record, because we all tend to remember guys we "hit" on. Not so much the guys where we whiffed.

(04-30-2021 08:16 AM)Seahawk Nation 08 Wrote:  

(04-30-2021 08:13 AM)Seahawkhoops Wrote:  

(04-30-2021 08:10 AM)Seahawk Nation 08 Wrote:  

(04-30-2021 08:08 AM)Seahawkhoops Wrote:  

(04-30-2021 08:06 AM)Seahawk Nation 08 Wrote:  I never said in my post the words "you think Fields sucks". And now you're once again moving the goalposts and changing what you said originally. lol. Your original words were: "I’m not on the fields train, osu qbs have sucked in the nfl". What else were we supposed to infer?

I hate the way you argue.

I don't hate the Mac Jones pick either, but only because he was ridiculously efficient and I don't know just how much stock to put on him having 3 amazing WR's. Was it 25 % of his success? 75 %? I didn't watch him often enough to say. But he's a worthwhile gamble at 15.

Just as Fields is a worthwhile gamble at 11.

You will see where i said they liked him, so they moved up to get him good job on them. I don't have any ill will towards the Bears, i hope this one works out for them, and it very well could. All i said is i didn't like him, I'm entitled to that.

You are entitled to whatever opinion you wish. Just make your arguments in good faith and stop constantly moving the goalposts in hindsight to suit your new positions.

You are confusing me with 82, I don't move goal posts. I'm as consistent as it gets with my arguments.
Now onto the real intrigue, how does the Rodgers situation play out? GM came out this morning and said they will not trade him, and he says he doesn't want to play. Does he pull a Gronk and temporarily retire, host jeopardy for a year?

No you're not, and you both do it.

I think Rodgers just wanted to ensure the Packers drafted him some help this year by making the play he did at the timing he did.
And of course they took a Corner in the 1st round, almost like they wanted to taunt him. lol.

Jeopardy Host is certainly an intriguing future option for him. He'll make quite a bit of coin (obviously not nearly as much as a QB, but certainly 7 figures is in play). He did well at it too.

I'll ignore your inaccurate shot, and talk about Rodgers.
If he were to take that route, and tried to come back, i don't think they would amicably trade him like the Pats did and they would still have his rights.
I do agree, he did a solid job on the show, at least the parts of a few shows i watched.

(04-30-2021 08:24 AM)Seahawk Nation 08 Wrote:  

(04-30-2021 08:15 AM)bricksnivy Wrote:  

(04-30-2021 07:48 AM)Seahawkhoops Wrote:  

(04-30-2021 07:37 AM)bricksnivy Wrote:  

(04-30-2021 07:03 AM)Seahawkhoops Wrote:  Recently other than Tua who has shown flashes no. Both lists are pretty unimpressive. It’s more than narrative when you look at the lists. Both of them could go either way, I like Mac’s fit in NE system


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk

No, it's a lazy narrative that has zero value evaluating this specific player. Other than Haskins, you're not even comparing him to other QBs that played for the same coach.

Of course there is risk in drafting a QB. It is freaking hard to do, so of course Fields could fail, but it will have absolutely nothing to do with coming from Columbus. Should teams next year pass on Sam Howell because Trubisky sucked?

It's okay to admit that you're not an expert at evaluating the position. There are loads of people paid to do this that miss on this position frequently.

All I'm saying is that the lists are unimpressive, take a look for yourself. That's not narrative. They liked Fields and traded up to get their guy, good for them. The last time they traded up to get a QB it didn't work out , maybe this time will work out better. If you had to guess which of the top 5 QBs will a bust, who is it? We both know there is likely to be 1.

Sure, it's an unimpressive list, but my point is that it is irrelevant to Fields. I don't know if he'll be successful, but I think it was a good move for Chicago. There are a lot of people questioning the pick because he's from OSU and that is what I'm calling lazy.

And listen, I suck at evaluating prospects. I'm from Winston and a few years older than CP3 and I remember telling people that he'd be average when he faced ACC caliber competition. That is why I have such respect for guys like Telep that have a proven track record evaluating talent, and why I defer to them when evaluating talent.

Regarding Fields, I trust Nagy's ability to evaluate, but I'm not sure about development.

Of the 5, I think the most likely bust is Lance due to the caliber of competition and limited starts. Wilson is probably second on that list, but I like him a lot. I don't think Jones will be a bust, but I do believe he has the lowest ceiling of the 5.

We all suck at evaluating QBs. Sometimes you have to take the emotion out of it and even some of the eye test and look at the metrics.

Football Outsiders' metric, QBASE, heavily factors in # of collegiate starts, completion %, level of competition/surrounding talent, and the QB's draft stock into a formula that spits out one number. That algorithm has resulted in them getting their QB projections right or close to it about 50 % of the time, including nailing their evaluation of "busts" about 75 % of the time.

There is no front office, scouting department, individual scout, coach, analyst, talking head, etc that gets it right at a clip even approaching that. So there's little hope for me sitting on my couch as a casual college football fan and watcher. And anyone who claims they're great at it needs to produce their record, because we all tend to remember guys we "hit" on. Not so much the guys where we whiffed.

Field Yates Tweeted after the first 3 picks, obviously he was being sarcastic but it was funny nonetheless " For the record, my mock draft has been spot on" hahaha

(04-30-2021 08:15 AM)bricksnivy Wrote:  

(04-30-2021 07:48 AM)Seahawkhoops Wrote:  

(04-30-2021 07:37 AM)bricksnivy Wrote:  

(04-30-2021 07:03 AM)Seahawkhoops Wrote:  

(04-29-2021 09:53 PM)bricksnivy Wrote:  That is a narrative for sure. Any recent examples of Bama producing a successful QB?

Recently other than Tua who has shown flashes no. Both lists are pretty unimpressive. It’s more than narrative when you look at the lists. Both of them could go either way, I like Mac’s fit in NE system


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No, it's a lazy narrative that has zero value evaluating this specific player. Other than Haskins, you're not even comparing him to other QBs that played for the same coach.

Of course there is risk in drafting a QB. It is freaking hard to do, so of course Fields could fail, but it will have absolutely nothing to do with coming from Columbus. Should teams next year pass on Sam Howell because Trubisky sucked?

It's okay to admit that you're not an expert at evaluating the position. There are loads of people paid to do this that miss on this position frequently.

All I'm saying is that the lists are unimpressive, take a look for yourself. That's not narrative. They liked Fields and traded up to get their guy, good for them. The last time they traded up to get a QB it didn't work out , maybe this time will work out better. If you had to guess which of the top 5 QBs will a bust, who is it? We both know there is likely to be 1.

Sure, it's an unimpressive list, but my point is that it is irrelevant to Fields. I don't know if he'll be successful, but I think it was a good move for Chicago. There are a lot of people questioning the pick because he's from OSU and that is what I'm calling lazy.

And listen, I suck at evaluating prospects. I'm from Winston and a few years older than CP3 and I remember telling people that he'd be average when he faced ACC caliber competition. That is why I have such respect for guys like Telep that have a proven track record evaluating talent, and why I defer to them when evaluating talent.

Regarding Fields, I trust Nagy's ability to evaluate, but I'm not sure about development.

Of the 5, I think the most likely bust is Lance due to the caliber of competition and limited starts. Wilson is probably second on that list, but I like him a lot. I don't think Jones will be a bust, but I do believe he has the lowest ceiling of the 5.

I don't think it's a questionable pick in that spot. It would have been more questionable at 3 IMO. But, I don't disagree with the Lance pick, but who knows, he could be the next 08's favorite QB Josh Allen from a school like that. 08 had more spirited debates about how bad he was and would be than i ever have about Fields.

(04-30-2021 08:35 AM)Seahawkhoops Wrote:  [I don't think it's a questionable pick in that spot. It would have been more questionable at 3 IMO. But, I don't disagree with the Lance pick, but who knows, he could be the next 08's favorite QB Josh Allen from a school like that. 08 had more spirited debates about how bad he was and would be than i ever have about Fields.

I'm not arguing that Fields will be great, just that he was a good gamble. If he's bad, it won't be because of Art Schlichter.

(04-30-2021 08:16 AM)Seahawk Nation 08 Wrote:  I think Rodgers just wanted to ensure the Packers drafted him some help this year by making the play he did at the timing he did.
And of course they took a Corner in the 1st round, almost like they wanted to taunt him. lol.

Jeopardy Host is certainly an intriguing future option for him. He'll make quite a bit of coin (obviously not nearly as much as a QB, but certainly 7 figures is in play). He did well at it too.

The Packers draft strategy is wild. They've drafted defense 9 out of the last 10 years, and last year added a backup RB and QB. They have a talented offense, a good OL, with an 1 elite WR and RB. So they're not terrible, and their defense is getting better. But, continually alienating your franchise QB seems to be such bad form. Then again, Rodgers is portrayed as a huge jerk, so maybe it's not the front office.

If the packers defense had played better they would have been in more super bowls.

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(04-30-2021 08:43 AM)tke75hawk Wrote:  If the packers defense had played better they would have been in more super bowls.

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Doesn't hurt my feelings that they've failed to build around 32 years of elite QB play.

(04-30-2021 08:52 AM)bricksnivy Wrote:  

(04-30-2021 08:43 AM)tke75hawk Wrote:  If the packers defense had played better they would have been in more super bowls.

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Doesn't hurt my feelings that they've failed to build around 32 years of elite QB play.

Put the Bears Defenses and the Packers offenses over that time together, that would be a bunch of SB wins!

Crazy that a deal to Denver was " All but done" from many sources then it fell through apparently.