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BearcatMan Offline
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Post: #21
RE: USA TODAY 2017-18 NCAA l Finances
(08-14-2019 07:21 AM)Bearcat 1985 Wrote:  
(08-14-2019 06:26 AM)GoCats1994 Wrote:  The issue is broader than athletics. The need for brick and mortar is being reduced/going away in every industry - this includes education. Universities have built vast expanses of facilities that are not sustainable going forward. AD's are an easy target when talking about deficits... but the current/old model of higher education will be going the way of the dodo bird.

Kids who can, academically and financially, go to a real college will always do so. One can see that in the current admissions mania of parents to get their kids into the best possible college. Now that doesn't mean that there won't be losers, particularly in Ohio with its over built, redundant system and challenging demographics. But selective privates and big ten type flagships will still be going strong fifty years from now. The question for a school like UC is what decisions need to be made now to ensure that we're among the group of winners.

Yep...I don't see physical institutions ever going away, because even without all of the educational research that shows in-person education being more effective, the US Government and private industry won't let it happen. Far too much business, innovation, research, and product development is done at institutions of higher learning by those companies that it just wouldn't be something that could die. Hell, all three institutions I've worked with in my career as a staff and faculty all have lists miles long of private industry that use their facilities for pennies on the dollar that it would cost them to build themselves, and that's not even factoring in the billions of dollars shoveled in by the federal agencies to do research for which they don't have the capacity.

Honestly, there are many degree programs and professions that wouldn't survive going full digital. Just off the cuff medicine, health sciences, hard sciences, and engineering couldn't survive without the physical facilities needed for instruction.
 
08-14-2019 07:46 AM
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OKIcat Offline
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RE: USA TODAY 2017-18 NCAA l Finances
(08-14-2019 07:21 AM)Bearcat 1985 Wrote:  
(08-14-2019 06:26 AM)GoCats1994 Wrote:  The issue is broader than athletics. The need for brick and mortar is being reduced/going away in every industry - this includes education. Universities have built vast expanses of facilities that are not sustainable going forward. AD's are an easy target when talking about deficits... but the current/old model of higher education will be going the way of the dodo bird.

Kids who can, academically and financially, go to a real college will always do so. One can see that in the current admissions mania of parents to get their kids into the best possible college. Now that doesn't mean that there won't be losers, particularly in Ohio with its over built, redundant system and challenging demographics. But selective privates and big ten type flagships will still be going strong fifty years from now. The question for a school like UC is what decisions need to be made now to ensure that we're among the group of winners.

Bolded. UC can't take its foot off the gas pedal, but has done great work the past two decades to stake a claim as Ohio's other major public research university (and of course, OSU has nothing to worry about).

I do believe there is a looming crisis in higher education as tuition and student debt continue to escalate. High priced, non-prestige privates and mid-sized regional public universities should be concerned about survival.

Too bad the post-WWII peer pressure on parents to get every kid to college somehow stigmatized pursuing skilled trades. One has to get on a wait list for an electrician, finish carpenter or plumber (who are well compensated and turning away work) but we can find plenty with master's degrees in liberal arts working part-time in hourly rate retail jobs trying to pay off college loans.
 
08-14-2019 08:02 AM
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BearcatMan Offline
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RE: USA TODAY 2017-18 NCAA l Finances
(08-14-2019 08:02 AM)OKIcat Wrote:  
(08-14-2019 07:21 AM)Bearcat 1985 Wrote:  
(08-14-2019 06:26 AM)GoCats1994 Wrote:  The issue is broader than athletics. The need for brick and mortar is being reduced/going away in every industry - this includes education. Universities have built vast expanses of facilities that are not sustainable going forward. AD's are an easy target when talking about deficits... but the current/old model of higher education will be going the way of the dodo bird.

Kids who can, academically and financially, go to a real college will always do so. One can see that in the current admissions mania of parents to get their kids into the best possible college. Now that doesn't mean that there won't be losers, particularly in Ohio with its over built, redundant system and challenging demographics. But selective privates and big ten type flagships will still be going strong fifty years from now. The question for a school like UC is what decisions need to be made now to ensure that we're among the group of winners.

Bolded. UC can't take its foot off the gas pedal, but has done great work the past two decades to stake a claim as Ohio's other major public research university (and of course, OSU has nothing to worry about).

I do believe there is a looming crisis in higher education as tuition and student debt continue to escalate. High priced, non-prestige privates and mid-sized regional public universities should be concerned about survival.

Too bad the post-WWII peer pressure on parents to get every kid to college somehow stigmatized pursuing skilled trades. One has to get on a wait list for an electrician, finish carpenter or plumber (who are well compensated and turning away work) but we can find plenty with master's degrees in liberal arts working part-time in hourly rate retail jobs trying to pay off college loans.

Where are you at? Most of the Unions up here are struggling to attract anyone and will take just about anyone into their apprenticeship programs at this point.
 
08-14-2019 08:36 AM
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dubcat14 Offline
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RE: USA TODAY 2017-18 NCAA l Finances
(08-14-2019 08:36 AM)BearcatMan Wrote:  
(08-14-2019 08:02 AM)OKIcat Wrote:  
(08-14-2019 07:21 AM)Bearcat 1985 Wrote:  
(08-14-2019 06:26 AM)GoCats1994 Wrote:  The issue is broader than athletics. The need for brick and mortar is being reduced/going away in every industry - this includes education. Universities have built vast expanses of facilities that are not sustainable going forward. AD's are an easy target when talking about deficits... but the current/old model of higher education will be going the way of the dodo bird.

Kids who can, academically and financially, go to a real college will always do so. One can see that in the current admissions mania of parents to get their kids into the best possible college. Now that doesn't mean that there won't be losers, particularly in Ohio with its over built, redundant system and challenging demographics. But selective privates and big ten type flagships will still be going strong fifty years from now. The question for a school like UC is what decisions need to be made now to ensure that we're among the group of winners.

Bolded. UC can't take its foot off the gas pedal, but has done great work the past two decades to stake a claim as Ohio's other major public research university (and of course, OSU has nothing to worry about).

I do believe there is a looming crisis in higher education as tuition and student debt continue to escalate. High priced, non-prestige privates and mid-sized regional public universities should be concerned about survival.

Too bad the post-WWII peer pressure on parents to get every kid to college somehow stigmatized pursuing skilled trades. One has to get on a wait list for an electrician, finish carpenter or plumber (who are well compensated and turning away work) but we can find plenty with master's degrees in liberal arts working part-time in hourly rate retail jobs trying to pay off college loans.

Where are you at? Most of the Unions up here are struggling to attract anyone and will take just about anyone into their apprenticeship programs at this point.

I think that's what OKI is saying.. people who need work done are on a wait list because there's not enough skilled laborers out there. Parents want their kids to go to university and don't find the labor jobs attractive even though they pay very well.
 
08-14-2019 08:45 AM
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Def Berkkat Offline
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RE: USA TODAY 2017-18 NCAA l Finances
(08-14-2019 08:36 AM)BearcatMan Wrote:  
(08-14-2019 08:02 AM)OKIcat Wrote:  
(08-14-2019 07:21 AM)Bearcat 1985 Wrote:  
(08-14-2019 06:26 AM)GoCats1994 Wrote:  The issue is broader than athletics. The need for brick and mortar is being reduced/going away in every industry - this includes education. Universities have built vast expanses of facilities that are not sustainable going forward. AD's are an easy target when talking about deficits... but the current/old model of higher education will be going the way of the dodo bird.

Kids who can, academically and financially, go to a real college will always do so. One can see that in the current admissions mania of parents to get their kids into the best possible college. Now that doesn't mean that there won't be losers, particularly in Ohio with its over built, redundant system and challenging demographics. But selective privates and big ten type flagships will still be going strong fifty years from now. The question for a school like UC is what decisions need to be made now to ensure that we're among the group of winners.

Bolded. UC can't take its foot off the gas pedal, but has done great work the past two decades to stake a claim as Ohio's other major public research university (and of course, OSU has nothing to worry about).

I do believe there is a looming crisis in higher education as tuition and student debt continue to escalate. High priced, non-prestige privates and mid-sized regional public universities should be concerned about survival.

Too bad the post-WWII peer pressure on parents to get every kid to college somehow stigmatized pursuing skilled trades. One has to get on a wait list for an electrician, finish carpenter or plumber (who are well compensated and turning away work) but we can find plenty with master's degrees in liberal arts working part-time in hourly rate retail jobs trying to pay off college loans.

Where are you at? Most of the Unions up here are struggling to attract anyone and will take just about anyone into their apprenticeship programs at this point.

I think he was saying you have to get on a wait list to enlist the services of those trades, not to be one.

A question, looking back, that I sometimes ask myself. How many people out their can fix their own plumbing???

Oh well.

This is when it's not summer and I'm saying to myself that I should have been a teacher and get summers off.
 
08-14-2019 08:49 AM
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BearcatMan Offline
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RE: USA TODAY 2017-18 NCAA l Finances
(08-14-2019 08:49 AM)Def Berkkat Wrote:  
(08-14-2019 08:36 AM)BearcatMan Wrote:  
(08-14-2019 08:02 AM)OKIcat Wrote:  
(08-14-2019 07:21 AM)Bearcat 1985 Wrote:  
(08-14-2019 06:26 AM)GoCats1994 Wrote:  The issue is broader than athletics. The need for brick and mortar is being reduced/going away in every industry - this includes education. Universities have built vast expanses of facilities that are not sustainable going forward. AD's are an easy target when talking about deficits... but the current/old model of higher education will be going the way of the dodo bird.

Kids who can, academically and financially, go to a real college will always do so. One can see that in the current admissions mania of parents to get their kids into the best possible college. Now that doesn't mean that there won't be losers, particularly in Ohio with its over built, redundant system and challenging demographics. But selective privates and big ten type flagships will still be going strong fifty years from now. The question for a school like UC is what decisions need to be made now to ensure that we're among the group of winners.

Bolded. UC can't take its foot off the gas pedal, but has done great work the past two decades to stake a claim as Ohio's other major public research university (and of course, OSU has nothing to worry about).

I do believe there is a looming crisis in higher education as tuition and student debt continue to escalate. High priced, non-prestige privates and mid-sized regional public universities should be concerned about survival.

Too bad the post-WWII peer pressure on parents to get every kid to college somehow stigmatized pursuing skilled trades. One has to get on a wait list for an electrician, finish carpenter or plumber (who are well compensated and turning away work) but we can find plenty with master's degrees in liberal arts working part-time in hourly rate retail jobs trying to pay off college loans.

Where are you at? Most of the Unions up here are struggling to attract anyone and will take just about anyone into their apprenticeship programs at this point.

I think he was saying you have to get on a wait list to enlist the services of those trades, not to be one.

A question, looking back, that I sometimes ask myself. How many people out their can fix their own plumbing???

Oh well.

This is when it's not summer and I'm saying to myself that I should have been a teacher and get summers off.

I am forever thankful that my high school maintained a robust Tech Ed department well after it was en vogue to cut them for weight room space or special ed classrooms. I'm constantly reminded of how little even those in my own generation understand about how to make/fix things. Hell, I'll take the occasional case or event ticket off someone's hands to help with plumbing or basic electric any time I can now.
 
08-14-2019 09:02 AM
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OKIcat Offline
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RE: USA TODAY 2017-18 NCAA l Finances
(08-14-2019 08:45 AM)dubcat14 Wrote:  
(08-14-2019 08:36 AM)BearcatMan Wrote:  
(08-14-2019 08:02 AM)OKIcat Wrote:  
(08-14-2019 07:21 AM)Bearcat 1985 Wrote:  
(08-14-2019 06:26 AM)GoCats1994 Wrote:  The issue is broader than athletics. The need for brick and mortar is being reduced/going away in every industry - this includes education. Universities have built vast expanses of facilities that are not sustainable going forward. AD's are an easy target when talking about deficits... but the current/old model of higher education will be going the way of the dodo bird.

Kids who can, academically and financially, go to a real college will always do so. One can see that in the current admissions mania of parents to get their kids into the best possible college. Now that doesn't mean that there won't be losers, particularly in Ohio with its over built, redundant system and challenging demographics. But selective privates and big ten type flagships will still be going strong fifty years from now. The question for a school like UC is what decisions need to be made now to ensure that we're among the group of winners.

Bolded. UC can't take its foot off the gas pedal, but has done great work the past two decades to stake a claim as Ohio's other major public research university (and of course, OSU has nothing to worry about).

I do believe there is a looming crisis in higher education as tuition and student debt continue to escalate. High priced, non-prestige privates and mid-sized regional public universities should be concerned about survival.

Too bad the post-WWII peer pressure on parents to get every kid to college somehow stigmatized pursuing skilled trades. One has to get on a wait list for an electrician, finish carpenter or plumber (who are well compensated and turning away work) but we can find plenty with master's degrees in liberal arts working part-time in hourly rate retail jobs trying to pay off college loans.

Where are you at? Most of the Unions up here are struggling to attract anyone and will take just about anyone into their apprenticeship programs at this point.

I think that's what OKI is saying.. people who need work done are on a wait list because there's not enough skilled laborers out there. Parents want their kids to go to university and don't find the labor jobs attractive even though they pay very well.

Yes, you're correct and sorry if my wording was ambiguous. I have great respect for talented and skilled people in these trades and they are in short supply. We've gone from waiting weeks to waiting months for quality repair and remodeling when needed.
 
08-14-2019 09:10 AM
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dsquare Offline
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RE: USA TODAY 2017-18 NCAA l Finances
(08-13-2019 04:54 PM)QSECOFR Wrote:  
(08-13-2019 04:42 PM)dsquare Wrote:  Does anyone know if the value of a player's scholarship(tuition) is included with the expense number and if so how they cost it? I only ask because if it's the charge to a normal student that is obviously not real out of pocket cost for a variety of reasons.

All public institutions use Fund Accounting as opposed to Accrual Accounting that most people are used to because of the Ohio Revised Code.

The tuition expense of someone on scholarship (athletic or otherwise) is the list price of a student attending the school. If UC recruits a player who is a legal resident of Ohio, the expense is the same as so-called "in state tuition". If UC recruits an athlete who is a legal resident outside of Ohio, the expense is the same as "out of state tuition" except in cases where there is some sort of reciprocity agreement.

Therein lies the rub. Under fund accounting, the school shows a "deficit" as there is no concept of profit/loss under fund accounting. If the books were restated to use accrual accounting, schools might make a profit. It is hard to tell since accrual accounting would depreciate the value of buildings, equipment, etc. Under fund accounting, the expense is 100% recognized in the year that the asset is placed in service.

Excluding the depreciation of assets, the vast majority of schools are making a very handsome profit if the results were stated using accrual GAAP.

That's what i thought. You really get into a lot of hazy math when the cost of the schollys isn't at actual cost. I'm not sure how much incremental out of pocket funds are needed for the kids on schollys given the large existing operating population of normal students. There are probably other expenses as well that are not really "incremental" costs and would tend to drive the expenses down if it was in fact analyzed in that fashion.
 
08-14-2019 09:10 AM
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BearcatMan Offline
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Post: #29
RE: USA TODAY 2017-18 NCAA l Finances
(08-14-2019 09:10 AM)dsquare Wrote:  
(08-13-2019 04:54 PM)QSECOFR Wrote:  
(08-13-2019 04:42 PM)dsquare Wrote:  Does anyone know if the value of a player's scholarship(tuition) is included with the expense number and if so how they cost it? I only ask because if it's the charge to a normal student that is obviously not real out of pocket cost for a variety of reasons.

All public institutions use Fund Accounting as opposed to Accrual Accounting that most people are used to because of the Ohio Revised Code.

The tuition expense of someone on scholarship (athletic or otherwise) is the list price of a student attending the school. If UC recruits a player who is a legal resident of Ohio, the expense is the same as so-called "in state tuition". If UC recruits an athlete who is a legal resident outside of Ohio, the expense is the same as "out of state tuition" except in cases where there is some sort of reciprocity agreement.

Therein lies the rub. Under fund accounting, the school shows a "deficit" as there is no concept of profit/loss under fund accounting. If the books were restated to use accrual accounting, schools might make a profit. It is hard to tell since accrual accounting would depreciate the value of buildings, equipment, etc. Under fund accounting, the expense is 100% recognized in the year that the asset is placed in service.

Excluding the depreciation of assets, the vast majority of schools are making a very handsome profit if the results were stated using accrual GAAP.

That's what i thought. You really get into a lot of hazy math when the cost of the schollys isn't at actual cost. I'm not sure how much incremental out of pocket funds are needed for the kids on schollys given the large existing operating population of normal students. There are probably other expenses as well that are not really "incremental" costs and would tend to drive the expenses down if it was in fact analyzed in that fashion.

These are end of FY real reported expenses, not pre-disbursement fund rolling of budgets. So the numbers reported in USA Today and other aggregators are real cost, not fund rolls

Looking at the public budgets of some of these schools, their fund roll and actual expenses are between 20% and 40% off. Most of that can be attributed to general discount rates, as many athletic scholarships are "tacked on" to other institutional awards from different departments/divisions of the institution. Hell, there is a proposal at the State oversight level to change the way fund rolls are reserved for all institutionally guaranteed scholarship aid. Essentially, they would apply the average discount rate of the University for the previous year to the fund to give a better representation of expected "costs" for athletic departments and institutions.
 
08-14-2019 09:18 AM
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GoCats1994 Offline
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RE: USA TODAY 2017-18 NCAA l Finances
(08-14-2019 07:46 AM)BearcatMan Wrote:  
(08-14-2019 07:21 AM)Bearcat 1985 Wrote:  
(08-14-2019 06:26 AM)GoCats1994 Wrote:  The issue is broader than athletics. The need for brick and mortar is being reduced/going away in every industry - this includes education. Universities have built vast expanses of facilities that are not sustainable going forward. AD's are an easy target when talking about deficits... but the current/old model of higher education will be going the way of the dodo bird.

Kids who can, academically and financially, go to a real college will always do so. One can see that in the current admissions mania of parents to get their kids into the best possible college. Now that doesn't mean that there won't be losers, particularly in Ohio with its over built, redundant system and challenging demographics. But selective privates and big ten type flagships will still be going strong fifty years from now. The question for a school like UC is what decisions need to be made now to ensure that we're among the group of winners.

Yep...I don't see physical institutions ever going away, because even without all of the educational research that shows in-person education being more effective, the US Government and private industry won't let it happen. Far too much business, innovation, research, and product development is done at institutions of higher learning by those companies that it just wouldn't be something that could die. Hell, all three institutions I've worked with in my career as a staff and faculty all have lists miles long of private industry that use their facilities for pennies on the dollar that it would cost them to build themselves, and that's not even factoring in the billions of dollars shoveled in by the federal agencies to do research for which they don't have the capacity.

Honestly, there are many degree programs and professions that wouldn't survive going full digital. Just off the cuff medicine, health sciences, hard sciences, and engineering couldn't survive without the physical facilities needed for instruction.
FWIW - In my post, I intentionally did not mention on-line classes as being a wave of the future. I am merely suggesting that higher education, like every other industry, is susceptible to an "Uber" moment that changes the game completely. Brick and mortar is going away everywhere. I agree that some disciplines (engineering, etc) will continue to require in-person learning. But that does not mean it will continue to be necessary to include garbage classes in those degrees that have nothing to do with engineering, simply to create "well-rounded" individuals.
 
08-14-2019 09:21 AM
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BearcatMan Offline
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Post: #31
RE: USA TODAY 2017-18 NCAA l Finances
(08-14-2019 09:21 AM)GoCats1994 Wrote:  
(08-14-2019 07:46 AM)BearcatMan Wrote:  
(08-14-2019 07:21 AM)Bearcat 1985 Wrote:  
(08-14-2019 06:26 AM)GoCats1994 Wrote:  The issue is broader than athletics. The need for brick and mortar is being reduced/going away in every industry - this includes education. Universities have built vast expanses of facilities that are not sustainable going forward. AD's are an easy target when talking about deficits... but the current/old model of higher education will be going the way of the dodo bird.

Kids who can, academically and financially, go to a real college will always do so. One can see that in the current admissions mania of parents to get their kids into the best possible college. Now that doesn't mean that there won't be losers, particularly in Ohio with its over built, redundant system and challenging demographics. But selective privates and big ten type flagships will still be going strong fifty years from now. The question for a school like UC is what decisions need to be made now to ensure that we're among the group of winners.

Yep...I don't see physical institutions ever going away, because even without all of the educational research that shows in-person education being more effective, the US Government and private industry won't let it happen. Far too much business, innovation, research, and product development is done at institutions of higher learning by those companies that it just wouldn't be something that could die. Hell, all three institutions I've worked with in my career as a staff and faculty all have lists miles long of private industry that use their facilities for pennies on the dollar that it would cost them to build themselves, and that's not even factoring in the billions of dollars shoveled in by the federal agencies to do research for which they don't have the capacity.

Honestly, there are many degree programs and professions that wouldn't survive going full digital. Just off the cuff medicine, health sciences, hard sciences, and engineering couldn't survive without the physical facilities needed for instruction.
FWIW - In my post, I intentionally did not mention on-line classes as being a wave of the future. I am merely suggesting that higher education, like every other industry, is susceptible to an "Uber" moment that changes the game completely. Brick and mortar is going away everywhere. I agree that some disciplines (engineering, etc) will continue to require in-person learning. But that does not mean it will continue to be necessary to include garbage classes in those degrees that have nothing to do with engineering, simply to create "well-rounded" individuals.

I could not agree more...with the budget situations many schools are running into it's going to become very clear just how important that is. There are many people in academia who have significant issues with placing needless courses into a curriculum just to support departments with dwindling or non-existent enrollment who have a significant amount of tenured faculty straining the financials of the institution as a whole when that money could be used to further progress and support the degree pathways of import at certain institutions.

In my opinion, outside of one or two institutions in a state (depending on population) there should absolutely not be any other comprehensive or near comprehensive institutions. Education is the one industry in which competition actually HURTS the development of a quality product, and you see that very clearly when you look at institutions like those in the northern half of our state who refuse to remove dead weight for the purposes of appearance instead of simply specializing in areas where they're talented. Simply speaking about one institution in northern Ohio, there are only 16% of the students who populate colleges where nearly 44% of tenured faculty reside...that sort of inequity causes strain on the moneymaking sectors of the institution to the point where the best and brightest leave because they do not have the resources to do what they want here, thus further perpetuating the negative perception. All of that because they don't want the negative optics of cutting Colleges out that have proven time and again to be appendices to the greater institution. That's happening everywhere, not just in Ohio, but it's going to reach a critical mass here much quicker than most.
 
08-14-2019 09:35 AM
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Bearcat 1985 Offline
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Post: #32
RE: USA TODAY 2017-18 NCAA l Finances
(08-14-2019 09:35 AM)BearcatMan Wrote:  
(08-14-2019 09:21 AM)GoCats1994 Wrote:  
(08-14-2019 07:46 AM)BearcatMan Wrote:  
(08-14-2019 07:21 AM)Bearcat 1985 Wrote:  
(08-14-2019 06:26 AM)GoCats1994 Wrote:  The issue is broader than athletics. The need for brick and mortar is being reduced/going away in every industry - this includes education. Universities have built vast expanses of facilities that are not sustainable going forward. AD's are an easy target when talking about deficits... but the current/old model of higher education will be going the way of the dodo bird.

Kids who can, academically and financially, go to a real college will always do so. One can see that in the current admissions mania of parents to get their kids into the best possible college. Now that doesn't mean that there won't be losers, particularly in Ohio with its over built, redundant system and challenging demographics. But selective privates and big ten type flagships will still be going strong fifty years from now. The question for a school like UC is what decisions need to be made now to ensure that we're among the group of winners.

Yep...I don't see physical institutions ever going away, because even without all of the educational research that shows in-person education being more effective, the US Government and private industry won't let it happen. Far too much business, innovation, research, and product development is done at institutions of higher learning by those companies that it just wouldn't be something that could die. Hell, all three institutions I've worked with in my career as a staff and faculty all have lists miles long of private industry that use their facilities for pennies on the dollar that it would cost them to build themselves, and that's not even factoring in the billions of dollars shoveled in by the federal agencies to do research for which they don't have the capacity.

Honestly, there are many degree programs and professions that wouldn't survive going full digital. Just off the cuff medicine, health sciences, hard sciences, and engineering couldn't survive without the physical facilities needed for instruction.
FWIW - In my post, I intentionally did not mention on-line classes as being a wave of the future. I am merely suggesting that higher education, like every other industry, is susceptible to an "Uber" moment that changes the game completely. Brick and mortar is going away everywhere. I agree that some disciplines (engineering, etc) will continue to require in-person learning. But that does not mean it will continue to be necessary to include garbage classes in those degrees that have nothing to do with engineering, simply to create "well-rounded" individuals.

I could not agree more...with the budget situations many schools are running into it's going to become very clear just how important that is. There are many people in academia who have significant issues with placing needless courses into a curriculum just to support departments with dwindling or non-existent enrollment who have a significant amount of tenured faculty straining the financials of the institution as a whole when that money could be used to further progress and support the degree pathways of import at certain institutions.

In my opinion, outside of one or two institutions in a state (depending on population) there should absolutely not be any other comprehensive or near comprehensive institutions. Education is the one industry in which competition actually HURTS the development of a quality product, and you see that very clearly when you look at institutions like those in the northern half of our state who refuse to remove dead weight for the purposes of appearance instead of simply specializing in areas where they're talented. Simply speaking about one institution in northern Ohio, there are only 16% of the students who populate colleges where nearly 44% of tenured faculty reside...that sort of inequity causes strain on the moneymaking sectors of the institution to the point where the best and brightest leave because they do not have the resources to do what they want here, thus further perpetuating the negative perception. All of that because they don't want the negative optics of cutting Colleges out that have proven time and again to be appendices to the greater institution. That's happening everywhere, not just in Ohio, but it's going to reach a critical mass here much quicker than most.

Generally, the higher up the academic food chain one goes, the more the college of arts & sciences supports itself. At OSU, it is the largest enrolling college in the university and when one get up to the Chicagos and Princetons there literally is no such thing as an undergraduate business major.

When I spoke of decisions being made now to ensure that we're one of the winners, I actually had strengthening the arts and sciences as one of those things so that end up on the side of being one of Ohio's comprehensive universities.

One of the frustrating things about Ohio is that a culture arose that every school gets to think they're a comprehensive flagship type school. It was akin to the saying in the first Incredibles movie, if everyone is a flagship then nobody (ie OSU) is a flagship.
 
08-14-2019 01:13 PM
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