Everyone, or nearly everyone, correctly points out that Childers struggled to complete long passes. What people forget is that he also struggled mightily to complete short and intermediate length passes. I have never seen a college QB struugle so much with high percentage screen passes.

Thst said he is a competitor and he had his best game when it mattered most so he is an easy guy to root for. I have always wondered if he could take his game to the next level with better coaching. Perhaps we will find out.

(08-19-2019 01:01 PM)bikechuck Wrote:  Everyone, or nearly everyone, correctly points out that Childers struggled to complete long passes. What people forget is that he also struggled mightily to complete short and intermediate length passes. I have never seen a college QB struugle so much with high percentage screen passes.

Thst said he is a competitor and he had his best game when it mattered most so he is an easy guy to root for. I have always wondered if he could take his game to the next level with better coaching. Perhaps we will find out.

Right. If he was never allowed to take any chances and always “coached” to take the easy passes, he should have a completion percentage up around 65-68. Not in the 50s.

(08-19-2019 01:29 PM)Rabid Squirrel Wrote:  

(08-19-2019 01:01 PM)bikechuck Wrote:  Everyone, or nearly everyone, correctly points out that Childers struggled to complete long passes. What people forget is that he also struggled mightily to complete short and intermediate length passes. I have never seen a college QB struugle so much with high percentage screen passes.

Thst said he is a competitor and he had his best game when it mattered most so he is an easy guy to root for. I have always wondered if he could take his game to the next level with better coaching. Perhaps we will find out.

Right. If he was never allowed to take any chances and always “coached” to take the easy passes, he should have a completion percentage up around 65-68. Not in the 50s.

That was exactly the problem, it was no secret to other teams. The basic and limited routes NIU ran were well covered. Opposing defenses were able to really shrink the field against NIU. I'll say it forever, no QB could have been successful at NIU last year

(08-19-2019 03:53 PM)MaddDawgz02 Wrote:  

(08-19-2019 01:29 PM)Rabid Squirrel Wrote:  

(08-19-2019 01:01 PM)bikechuck Wrote:  Everyone, or nearly everyone, correctly points out that Childers struggled to complete long passes. What people forget is that he also struggled mightily to complete short and intermediate length passes. I have never seen a college QB struugle so much with high percentage screen passes.

Thst said he is a competitor and he had his best game when it mattered most so he is an easy guy to root for. I have always wondered if he could take his game to the next level with better coaching. Perhaps we will find out.

Right. If he was never allowed to take any chances and always “coached” to take the easy passes, he should have a completion percentage up around 65-68. Not in the 50s.

That was exactly the problem, it was no secret to other teams. The basic and limited routes NIU ran were well covered. Opposing defenses were able to really shrink the field against NIU. I'll say it forever, no QB could have been successful at NIU last year

Sigh. I don’t even know why I bother with this, but did you forget what that offense looks like with a capable QB? It’s a ton of runs and short passes, and then when the defense inevitably gets sucked in, you hit them over the top.

NIU’s total offense ranks under Carey:
20th (OC)
4th (HC)
36th (in a year 3 QBs played)
52nd (3 more QBs played, including a true freshman walk on)
55th (3 more QBs played)
——————The Childers Line————
60th
121st


They never had an offense ranked lower than 55th before Childers showed up despite having a QB carousel (largely due to injuries) the 3 year prior. Even in 2017, they averaged 27 PPG against EIU, Nebraska (granted, defense aided), Boston college, and San Diego St before Childers took over.

Almost as soon as Childers showed up the offense fell off a cliff. The system was fine. The QB was Pooh.

And this idea they “turned Childers loose” against Buffalo is silly too. He made probably 5 of the best throws he’s ever made during the last 17 minutes of that game. He’s had guys open his 2 years and just has missed them.

Go rewatch the Utah game last year when he had Brown running open down the left sideline for a fairly easily TD and threw it 5 yards in front of him.

He couldn’t hit a deep ball and he’s terrible under pressure. He’s also not tremendously accurate on short stuff. Good luck designing an offense around that.

Last point and then I’m done ranting. None of that was meant to be a defense of Carey/U either. Recruit better QBs. Be more patient developing Santa who anybody could see had more talent, if not some decision making issues. And then if all else fails, have a better fallback than just continuing to do the same thing and running the same 6 plays on repeat when you’re obviously short handed at QB. On top of that the WRs were bad last year. It was a total failure by the coaching staff too.

But the idea no QB would be successful in that system is just silly. Even beyond Lynch, Hare and Maddie we’re both really good in it overall. Even graham was better in it than childers.

(08-19-2019 01:29 PM)Rabid Squirrel Wrote:  

(08-19-2019 01:01 PM)bikechuck Wrote:  Everyone, or nearly everyone, correctly points out that Childers struggled to complete long passes. What people forget is that he also struggled mightily to complete short and intermediate length passes. I have never seen a college QB struugle so much with high percentage screen passes.

Thst said he is a competitor and he had his best game when it mattered most so he is an easy guy to root for. I have always wondered if he could take his game to the next level with better coaching. Perhaps we will find out.

Right. If he was never allowed to take any chances and always “coached” to take the easy passes, he should have a completion percentage up around 65-68. Not in the 50s.

Both make very valid points that are not brought up enough.

There is no sugar coating it; our O last year was terrible - the stats matched what we saw on the field, and you can't miss the statistical correlation between how bad the O and Childers was. While others (including Childers) had flashes, the only consistent bright spot was Harbs. With 14 turnovers last year, you can't even make the argument Childers is the safe QB.

This is a good summary of what is being advertised as the new NIU offense: Tears: “The offense now is just totally different from the offense that we previously had”; “I honestly can say you’re going to see a lot of fireworks and a lot of big plays with this new offense that we have.” Hammock: “It’s going to be different"; “We’re going to have a lot of ‘eye candy,’ as you call it. We’re going to shift. We’re going to motion and different things. I think that stuff is hard to defend.” https://www.saukvalley.com/2019/07/30/ni...s/aiqi4gy/

I keep trying to envision Childers as the QB in this new "explosive" offense and it just doesn't fit - like trying to fit a square peg into a round hole. Someone pointed out that Hammock said running backs run and quarterbacks throw the ball. That sure sounds like he is describing Bowers and not Childers to me. I still sense the decision was made when we went after Bowers, and while that could have changed I have not heard anything that changes my impression Bowers being the starting QB was the plan from the start. Let's not forget that we know that the practice Childers is different from the game Childers, and I am quite sure Hammock and company know it too.

We'll know soon enough, but if Bowers is not the starter I'll be shocked!

(08-19-2019 04:33 PM)7 Wrote:  And this idea they “turned Childers loose” against Buffalo is silly too. He made probably 5 of the best throws he’s ever made during the last 17 minutes of that game. He’s had guys open his 2 years and just has missed them.

Go rewatch the Utah game last year when he had Brown running open down the left sideline for a fairly easily TD and threw it 5 yards in front of him.

He couldn’t hit a deep ball and he’s terrible under pressure. He’s also not tremendously accurate on short stuff. Good luck designing an offense around that.

Yeah....7 just dropped the microphone...your comments here

And the Pooh line was on the money. One big hunk of poop

(08-19-2019 03:53 PM)MaddDawgz02 Wrote:  

(08-19-2019 01:29 PM)Rabid Squirrel Wrote:  

(08-19-2019 01:01 PM)bikechuck Wrote:  Everyone, or nearly everyone, correctly points out that Childers struggled to complete long passes. What people forget is that he also struggled mightily to complete short and intermediate length passes. I have never seen a college QB struugle so much with high percentage screen passes.

Thst said he is a competitor and he had his best game when it mattered most so he is an easy guy to root for. I have always wondered if he could take his game to the next level with better coaching. Perhaps we will find out.

Right. If he was never allowed to take any chances and always “coached” to take the easy passes, he should have a completion percentage up around 65-68. Not in the 50s.

That was exactly the problem, it was no secret to other teams. The basic and limited routes NIU ran were well covered. Opposing defenses were able to really shrink the field against NIU. I'll say it forever, no QB could have been successful at NIU last year

Has it ever occurred to you that Childers simply checks down to the same, limited routes over and over because he is afraid to attempt certain passes? Multiple people here just told you that even it practice he checks down to safe routes while Bowers throw downfield. In practice he checks down....we’re talkin bout practice!

All the evidence says Childers is the reason the offense was so conservative. Honestly, all you see on tv is where the qb throws. You can’t see where the WRs are or who was the primary. So what you’re seeing is WHERE Childers is electing to throw.

For what's it worth, Kaleb Carter from the Chronicle reported it appears the coaching staff is split on who the starter should be. This was an article from yesterday.

(08-19-2019 06:25 PM)Rabid Squirrel Wrote:  

(08-19-2019 03:53 PM)MaddDawgz02 Wrote:  

(08-19-2019 01:29 PM)Rabid Squirrel Wrote:  

(08-19-2019 01:01 PM)bikechuck Wrote:  Everyone, or nearly everyone, correctly points out that Childers struggled to complete long passes. What people forget is that he also struggled mightily to complete short and intermediate length passes. I have never seen a college QB struugle so much with high percentage screen passes.

Thst said he is a competitor and he had his best game when it mattered most so he is an easy guy to root for. I have always wondered if he could take his game to the next level with better coaching. Perhaps we will find out.

Right. If he was never allowed to take any chances and always “coached” to take the easy passes, he should have a completion percentage up around 65-68. Not in the 50s.

That was exactly the problem, it was no secret to other teams. The basic and limited routes NIU ran were well covered. Opposing defenses were able to really shrink the field against NIU. I'll say it forever, no QB could have been successful at NIU last year

Has it ever occurred to you that Childers simply checks down to the same, limited routes over and over because he is afraid to attempt certain passes? Multiple people here just told you that even it practice he checks down to safe routes while Bowers throw downfield. In practice he checks down....we’re talkin bout practice!

All the evidence says Childers is the reason the offense was so conservative. Honestly, all you see on tv is where the qb throws. You can’t see where the WRs are or who was the primary. So what you’re seeing is WHERE Childers is electing to throw.

In 2018 we were 123 out of 129 in total offense, and Childers was 105 out of 113 in passing efficiency.

https://www.ncaa.com/stats/football/fbs/...team/21/p3

https://www.ncaa.com/stats/football/fbs/...idual/8/p3

The correlation between the two is obvious. Childers has the heart; he just doesn't have the skills, especially for the new offense.

(08-19-2019 06:25 PM)Rabid Squirrel Wrote:  

(08-19-2019 03:53 PM)MaddDawgz02 Wrote:  

(08-19-2019 01:29 PM)Rabid Squirrel Wrote:  

(08-19-2019 01:01 PM)bikechuck Wrote:  Everyone, or nearly everyone, correctly points out that Childers struggled to complete long passes. What people forget is that he also struggled mightily to complete short and intermediate length passes. I have never seen a college QB struugle so much with high percentage screen passes.

Thst said he is a competitor and he had his best game when it mattered most so he is an easy guy to root for. I have always wondered if he could take his game to the next level with better coaching. Perhaps we will find out.

Right. If he was never allowed to take any chances and always “coached” to take the easy passes, he should have a completion percentage up around 65-68. Not in the 50s.

That was exactly the problem, it was no secret to other teams. The basic and limited routes NIU ran were well covered. Opposing defenses were able to really shrink the field against NIU. I'll say it forever, no QB could have been successful at NIU last year

Has it ever occurred to you that Childers simply checks down to the same, limited routes over and over because he is afraid to attempt certain passes? Multiple people here just told you that even it practice he checks down to safe routes while Bowers throw downfield. In practice he checks down....we’re talkin bout practice!

All the evidence says Childers is the reason the offense was so conservative. Honestly, all you see on tv is where the qb throws. You can’t see where the WRs are or who was the primary. So what you’re seeing is WHERE Childers is electing to throw.

Oh lord no, this tend started with Drew Hare and really got worse in Careys last few years. Like Hammock said, the days of not trusting the players to make plays is over. It really became paralyzing to this team.

Kaleb Carter saying Bowers was repping with the 1’s again today.

It’s happening.

Interesting. Looks like they've made the call. I kind of get the sense they're in game prep mode already.

(08-19-2019 10:44 PM)MaddDawgz02 Wrote:  

(08-19-2019 06:25 PM)Rabid Squirrel Wrote:  Has it ever occurred to you that Childers simply checks down to the same, limited routes over and over because he is afraid to attempt certain passes? Multiple people here just told you that even it practice he checks down to safe routes while Bowers throw downfield. In practice he checks down....we’re talkin bout practice!

All the evidence says Childers is the reason the offense was so conservative. Honestly, all you see on tv is where the qb throws. You can’t see where the WRs are or who was the primary. So what you’re seeing is WHERE Childers is electing to throw.

Oh lord no, this tend started with Drew Hare and really got worse in Careys last few years. Like Hammock said, the days of not trusting the players to make plays is over. It really became paralyzing to this team.

Huh? What trend started with Hare?

61.9%, 8,944 yds, 8.2 AY/A, 68td - 26int, 145 QBR
61.4%, 8,289 yds, 8.2 AY/A, 63td - 10int, 141 QBR
61.8%, 8,363 yds, 8.0 AY/A, 68td - 19int, 142 QBR

That’s the career numbers for Hare, Harnish and Lynch(not in that order) given equal attempts. Can You figure out which is which and tell me how Hare wasn’t allowed to make plays? And no, his numbers did not tail off each year. He started 2016 off with 62.7%, 8.2 AY/A, 3td - 0int, 140 QBR

This is where you disappear when faced with real numbers and not opinion MD.

https://www.dailyherald.com/sports/20190...he-offense

I like both of these kids.

(08-19-2019 06:25 PM)Rabid Squirrel Wrote:  

(08-19-2019 03:53 PM)MaddDawgz02 Wrote:  

(08-19-2019 01:29 PM)Rabid Squirrel Wrote:  

(08-19-2019 01:01 PM)bikechuck Wrote:  Everyone, or nearly everyone, correctly points out that Childers struggled to complete long passes. What people forget is that he also struggled mightily to complete short and intermediate length passes. I have never seen a college QB struugle so much with high percentage screen passes.

Thst said he is a competitor and he had his best game when it mattered most so he is an easy guy to root for. I have always wondered if he could take his game to the next level with better coaching. Perhaps we will find out.

Right. If he was never allowed to take any chances and always “coached” to take the easy passes, he should have a completion percentage up around 65-68. Not in the 50s.

That was exactly the problem, it was no secret to other teams. The basic and limited routes NIU ran were well covered. Opposing defenses were able to really shrink the field against NIU. I'll say it forever, no QB could have been successful at NIU last year

Has it ever occurred to you that Childers simply checks down to the same, limited routes over and over because he is afraid to attempt certain passes? Multiple people here just told you that even it practice he checks down to safe routes while Bowers throw downfield. In practice he checks down....we’re talkin bout practice!

All the evidence says Childers is the reason the offense was so conservative. Honestly, all you see on tv is where the qb throws. You can’t see where the WRs are or who was the primary. So what you’re seeing is WHERE Childers is electing to throw.

That's just not true, Childers was chosen because he was a safer pick for Carey for his conservative offense than Santa. Carey devolved over time, and certainly by the end of his time at NIU just needed to go. I just dont understand why he just didnt take all hands off any offensive decisions since he obviously was a trainwreck. He should have put all responsibility to everything offense related in someone else's hands

I wonder if the rise of the NIU defense was a detriment to the offense. Seems like Carey's conservative tendencies were amplified to a crippling level when NIU had a great defense. Last year's NIU D should have been a part of a top 25 team

(08-20-2019 10:13 PM)MaddDawgz02 Wrote:  I wonder if the rise of the NIU defense was a detriment to the offense. Seems like Carey's conservative tendencies were amplified to a crippling level when NIU had a great defense. Last year's NIU D should have been a part of a top 25 team

Will you still be talking about Carey 20 years from now? Let it go

(08-20-2019 11:01 PM)JoeNovak Wrote:  

(08-20-2019 10:13 PM)MaddDawgz02 Wrote:  I wonder if the rise of the NIU defense was a detriment to the offense. Seems like Carey's conservative tendencies were amplified to a crippling level when NIU had a great defense. Last year's NIU D should have been a part of a top 25 team

Will you still be talking about Carey 20 years from now? Let it go

Pretty please
With sugar on top
Stop talking about Rod Carey
Move on already
His time is over