https://nationalpost.com/opinion/barbara...ting-worse

Article warrants its own thread rather than being buried in mass murder threads. Its not so much about violence as the prevalence of loneliness.

"...In August of 2003, a dreadful heat wave washed across Europe. Some 35,000 people died; most of them fit the above profile. A disproportion of the deaths — 14,000 —occurred in France, prompting investigation, which revealed the uncomfortable fact that it was not material poverty that was the key factor in many of these deaths. Rather it was a form of social poverty; the victims had nobody who cared enough about them to check up on them and alleviate their distress. Worse, in a way, was the fact that many of the victims did have adult children, who could not be bothered to interrupt their traditional August holiday at the seashore to take responsibility for their parents’ needs....

Every year in Japan, where childlessness is rampant, some 4,000 elderly Japanese people die without being discovered until the smell of their decomposing bodies alerts their neighbours. In fact, while obstetrics is fading as a profession in Japan, a new industry has arisen: firms that clean out the apartments of the isolated dead. Insurance companies are offering policies that protect landlords in case a “lonely death” happens in their building....

A May 2018 Cigna poll cited by the author found that nearly half of all Americans report “sometimes or always” feeling alone, and that Generation Z — adults aged 18 to 22 — is the loneliest generation of all. Loneliness is sad in itself, but it also has public health implications...."

During the most connected era in human history, physical isolation is at an all time high. It's an interesting dynamic. Even when people are with other people they ignore them in favor of technology.

(08-07-2019 09:59 PM)banker Wrote:  During the most connected era in human history, physical isolation is at an all time high. It's an interesting dynamic. Even when people are with other people they ignore them in favor of technology.

Dopamine and serotonin both can stimulate addictive like reactions. I don't know exactly what neurotransmitters are emitted by our technological stimulation but they must be powerful. I literally think that people are addicted! They ignore spouses in the same room to be on one, their children, and things happening around them like the college students that walk out in front of traffic looking at hand held devices, and people sitting through traffic lights or who don't have a clue as to how fast or slow they are driving while looking at one.

I really don't know any other way to explain why relatively normal adults are so oblivious. I don't carry a cell phone for that reason, and others, allow no devices in the car, and only use them at home, where I have caught myself missing something my wife said because I was either reading or writing on the lap top. Back in the early 90's a friend of mine called them a time thief. I think he was right.

I recall reading an article back in the late 90's about how so many of us are lonely even while surrounded by people and that was pretty much before the advent of hand held devices. I'm sure they've taken the phenomenon to another level though. Although I have a few really good friends and a boatload of acquaintances I am a bit of a solitary person by nature so I'm not sure I've ever been truly lonesome.

(08-08-2019 06:38 AM)TigerBlue4Ever Wrote:  I recall reading an article back in the late 90's about how so many of us are lonely even while surrounded by people and that was pretty much before the advent of hand held devices. I'm sure they've taken the phenomenon to another level though. Although I have a few really good friends and a boatload of acquaintances I am a bit of a solitary person by nature so I'm not sure I've ever been truly lonesome.

"Loneliness" I'm not surprised these past few generations have had such a problem with it. They never had true dates like we did. Instead they had a group they would hang out with. They didn't have dances, or formals. Most never learned table etiquette for dining at a fine restaurant, and most don't have good social manners period. My point being how can you be social if you've never learned how to behave in socially acceptable ways.

So again I take this issue back to the parents and the school system. The electronic devices allow them to communicate without the fear of being socially awkward. I think that's part of the allure. And I think another part of it is that it gives them a way to be heard when in person their timidity, or fear, would prevent them from it. The major negative here is that it also prevents them from finding confidence, learning social skills, and ultimately keeps them from face to face friendships.

(08-08-2019 12:19 PM)JRsec Wrote:  

(08-08-2019 06:38 AM)TigerBlue4Ever Wrote:  I recall reading an article back in the late 90's about how so many of us are lonely even while surrounded by people and that was pretty much before the advent of hand held devices. I'm sure they've taken the phenomenon to another level though. Although I have a few really good friends and a boatload of acquaintances I am a bit of a solitary person by nature so I'm not sure I've ever been truly lonesome.

"Loneliness" I'm not surprised these past few generations have had such a problem with it. They never had true dates like we did. Instead they had a group they would hang out with. They didn't have dances, or formals. Most never learned table etiquette for dining at a fine restaurant, and most don't have good social manners period. My point being how can you be social if you've never learned how to behave in socially acceptable ways.

So again I take this issue back to the parents and the school system. The electronic devices allow them to communicate without the fear of being socially awkward. I think that's part of the allure. And I think another part of it is that it gives them a way to be heard when in person their timidity, or fear, would prevent them from it. The major negative here is that it also prevents them from finding confidence, learning social skills, and ultimately keeps them from face to face friendships.

You've just described my girlfriends 17 year old daughter perfectly. She has the entire upstairs of my house to herself and we rarely ever see her except when she has to use the bathroom or eat. When I mention it to my girlfriend I get a look that says I will cut your balls off and feed them to you if you don't shut up.

Sadly, this is an extremely talented girl who sees no value in being an outstanding artist and singer. I just shake my head and wish she would hurry up and graduate high school and go make her own way in the world. But, she won't, she can't, she is extremely unprepared for real life. I hope she proves me wrong.

(08-08-2019 01:02 PM)TigerBlue4Ever Wrote:  You've just described my girlfriends 17 year old daughter perfectly. She has the entire upstairs of my house to herself and we rarely ever see her except when she has to use the bathroom or eat. When I mention it to my girlfriend I get a look that says I will cut your balls off and feed them to you if you don't shut up.
Sadly, this is an extremely talented girl who sees no value in being an outstanding artist and singer. I just shake my head and wish she would hurry up and graduate high school and go make her own way in the world. But, she won't, she can't, she is extremely unprepared for real life. I hope she proves me wrong.

Wow, so I'm not the only one who has had that experience.

In my case, she actually had three kids, two of whom have made their own way in the world quite nicely. The oldest, with by far the most potential, has made a total wreck of her life. She is currently employed part-time and back living with mom while trying to get a divorce from the husband who is in jail awaiting trial for molesting one of their three daughters. I'm fortunately out of that relationship, but I still hear about what is happening with them.

Why don't the lonely people get together with other lonely people to alleviate their loneliness? I don't get it.

(08-08-2019 01:58 PM)Owl 69/70/75 Wrote:  

(08-08-2019 01:02 PM)TigerBlue4Ever Wrote:  You've just described my girlfriends 17 year old daughter perfectly. She has the entire upstairs of my house to herself and we rarely ever see her except when she has to use the bathroom or eat. When I mention it to my girlfriend I get a look that says I will cut your balls off and feed them to you if you don't shut up.
Sadly, this is an extremely talented girl who sees no value in being an outstanding artist and singer. I just shake my head and wish she would hurry up and graduate high school and go make her own way in the world. But, she won't, she can't, she is extremely unprepared for real life. I hope she proves me wrong.

Wow, so I'm not the only one who has had that experience.

In my case, she actually had three kids, two of whom have made their own way in the world quite nicely. The oldest, with by far the most potential, has made a total wreck of her life. She is currently employed part-time and back living with mom while trying to get a divorce from the husband who is in jail awaiting trial for molesting one of their three daughters. I'm fortunately out of that relationship, but I still hear about what is happening with them.

I'm lucky it's just one then! Damn.

(08-08-2019 04:41 PM)Ohio Poly Wrote:  Why don't the lonely people get together with other lonely people to alleviate their loneliness? I don't get it.

Fear. Fear of embarrassment. Fear of being laughed at. Fear of failing to connect with other people. Fear of judgment. Fear of not being enough. Fear of rejection. Fear of being looked down. Fear of being alone.

For some its easier to communicate through words via text, email, forums, social media. Getting upvotes and likes makes a person feel good.

Who doesn't like it when someone agrees with you? It makes you feel justified in your way of thinking.

Today, how much positive reinforcement like compliments and being congratulated occurs in the real physical world?

(08-08-2019 06:38 AM)TigerBlue4Ever Wrote:  I recall reading an article back in the late 90's about how so many of us are lonely even while surrounded by people and that was pretty much before the advent of hand held devices. I'm sure they've taken the phenomenon to another level though. Although I have a few really good friends and a boatload of acquaintances I am a bit of a solitary person by nature so I'm not sure I've ever been truly lonesome.

For anyone who's been in the service that's what happens. You might be surrounded by other GIs but yet you feel so alone. You might have friends but what's missing is family. That's why many marry young when in the military, they want their own people with them.

I can imagine that happens to those who go out of town to college.

For those who need something you might identify with the lyrics to "Eleanor Rigby" and "The Sounds of Silence" as they still ring true. For those less inclined to early Rock & Roll there is Orbison's "Only the Lonely" and Hank Williams, "I'm So Lonesome I Could Cry." And for those from the TV generation I offer you the lyrics to the theme song from Cheers, "Where Everybody Knows Your Name."

I'm not being glib, just pointing out that human loneliness is a state of being that has plagued humanity from the beginning. The problem we face today is that there are so many other things to distract and steal your time away from others. And since solo entertainment has replaced the dinner and a movie, or a dance, the social skills that we had acquired in the days before TV and the computer are vanishing.

Heck, even neighbors don't spend much time with each other these days. There was a time when they were your greatest source of entertainment with card or board games, or just shared meals.

The Japanese are having to teach young people how to meet and talk to one another in state sponsored mixers in hopes of increasing marriages and therefore children.

It's a very sick world in which we now live. I hope we come to our senses and switch off the electronics and get to know one another again. It's important not just to defeat the loneliness, but to feel empowered enough together to take back our Republic from Corporate control before that's too late as well.

Is this really surprising though? We've been going down this path for over 20 years. Online dating sites, Tinder, etc have replaced going out and creating a connection in the physical world.

It's the same in the business world. When my youngest graduated last year we pushed him to go out and find a job. He looked at us like we had snakes coming out of our heads because going and filling out an application has been replaced by online applications. The first time my oldest son's soon to be fiance set foot in the physical location she has been working as an intern this summer was her first day of work. She had a Skype interview. I can't comprehend it because one of the biggest keys I had when I sat on interview boards was the physical reaction the interviewee had to the question being asked.

(08-09-2019 01:07 AM)Kaplony Wrote:  Is this really surprising though? We've been going down this path for over 20 years. Online dating sites, Tinder, etc have replaced going out and creating a connection in the physical world.

It's the same in the business world. When my youngest graduated last year we pushed him to go out and find a job. He looked at us like we had snakes coming out of our heads because going and filling out an application has been replaced by online applications. The first time my oldest son's soon to be fiance set foot in the physical location she has been working as an intern this summer was her first day of work. She had a Skype interview. I can't comprehend it because one of the biggest keys I had when I sat on interview boards was the physical reaction the interviewee had to the question being asked.

This is precisely why certifications and degrees have replaced job knowledge, experience, and willingness to learn and work. You don't get the interview without the certificates and degrees. One local business where a friend of mine worked needed a forklift driver. They had a middle aged man who had operated fork lifts for 20 years apply and about 3 young kids who had just gotten a certification of their training on a forklift. The man with 20 years experience didn't even get an interview. The kids with certificates did and they hired what they thought was the best one. He didn't know how to operate the lift they had at the job site but neither did he tell them that until he dropped a one ton pallet onto some other equipment destroying the equipment and the product. So they called the next one. He'd been on the job about 2 weeks when he nearly ran over an employee pushing hand trucks. So they called in the third one. He bent the product racks where the pallets were stored. This went on and on and they never called the man with 20 years experience (who on his resume pointed out he knew how to maintain the forklifts as well). Why? He started work before certification and didn't understand why he needed to pay the local certification service nearly $600 bucks to get a piece of paper saying he could do what he had been doing for 20 years.

So yes, here's one more area where face to face can't happen without a certificate or degree. My buddy was later told that this guy wasn't the only uncertified lift operator who had tried to apply. There had been two others who dropped written resumes by but they didn't interview them because they had not demonstrated with an online application that they had computer skills. Why was that important? Because the company had employee training by C.B.E. (computer based education). Most of those were P.C. instructions mostly.

Like I said Kap, the world is very very screwed up. And the certification process is one more level of bureaucracy stealing money from people who know how to work, have skills that can be demonstrated, but might not have $600.00 to pay some scam organization that doesn't really teach the skills but does have some local or state law requiring that the experienced submit themselves to be ripped off by some representative's buddy.

I liked to eyeball those I interviewed because their eyes and body language told you more than most resumes and how they dressed and how well groomed they were told you a bit about their discipline. And when you hired them they didn't start worried that you were going to quickly fire them because some level of trust had already been established.

I'll tell you what my buddy didn't trust while he was still working, certifications.

Im going back to school to get a master's degree for this very reason. It is incredibly difficult to get an opportunity without a piece of paper saying you deserve an opportunity

(08-09-2019 12:58 AM)JRsec Wrote:  For those who need something identify with the lyrics to "Eleanor Rigby" and "The Sounds of Silence" still ring true. For those less inclined to early Rock & Roll there is Orbison's only the Lonely and Hank Williams, "I'm So Lonesome I Could Cry." And those for the TV generation I offer you the lyrics to the theme song from Cheers, "Where Everybody Knows Your Name."

I'm not being glib, just pointing out that human loneliness is a state of being that has plagued humanity from the beginning. The problem we face today is that there are so many other things to distract and steal your time away from others than today. And since solo entertainment has replaced the dinner and a movie, or a dance the social skills that we had acquired in the days before TV, and the computer, are vanishing.

Heck, even neighbors don't spend much time with each other these days. There was a time when they were your greatest source of entertainment with card or board games, or just shared meals.

The Japanese are having to teach young people how to meet and talk to one another in state sponsored mixers in hopes of increasing marriages and therefore children.

It's a very sick world in which we now live. I hope we come to our senses and switch off the electronics and get to know one another again. Not just to defeat loneliness, but to feel empowered together enough to take back our Republic from Corporate control before that's too late as well.

Funny that you should mention that, as I was falling asleep last night I thought of my mother and those thoughts led me to memories of nights filled with family and friends around the dinner table either eating or afterward playing scrabble or some other board or card game. I had cousins who lived on either side of us so those events were almost nightly happenings.

Our house was where all the cousins came when they were late getting home from a date or they were a little too drunk to go home and face my aunts or uncles. My mom would call their parents and explain they were staying the night and we would often be up until the wee hours on weekends. It was a gathering place for hungry and bored people who were fed and entertained and no one sat around the table absorbed by an inanimate object.