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Fort Bend Owl Online
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Post: #81
RE: Fall Camp?
(Yesterday 07:35 PM)tanqtonic Wrote:  Apparently there are only 3 redshirt seniors, 1 senior, and 12 redshirt juniors on the roster.

Enormously bottom heavy --- that aspect just hit me for the first time.

I count 12 seniors on the team according to the riceowls.com roster. I'm not sure where you're getting your numbers from (unless you're not including graduate transfer seniors - I still think you'd have more than 4 seniors though). Granted, that's still not a ton but at least it's more than 4.

I didn't count the number of redshirt juniors.

ETA - the breakdown. Aston Walter (6th year senior), Reagan Williams (Stanford grad transfer), Nahshon Ellerbe (5th year senior), Tom Stewart (Harvard grad transfer), Charlie Booker (Harvard grad transfer), Adam Nunez (TCU grad transfer), Cole Elms (5th year senior), Nick Leverett (NC Central grad transfer), Brian Chaffin (Stanford grad transfer), Justin Gooseberry (Ouachita Baptist grad transfer), Chris Barnes (5th year senior), Myles Adams (4th year senior)
(This post was last modified: Yesterday 08:46 PM by Fort Bend Owl.)
Yesterday 08:39 PM
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RiceOL83 Online
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Post: #82
RE: Fall Camp?
(Yesterday 08:39 PM)Fort Bend Owl Wrote:  
(Yesterday 07:35 PM)tanqtonic Wrote:  Apparently there are only 3 redshirt seniors, 1 senior, and 12 redshirt juniors on the roster.

Enormously bottom heavy --- that aspect just hit me for the first time.

I count 12 seniors on the team according to the riceowls.com roster. I'm not sure where you're getting your numbers from (unless you're not including graduate transfer seniors - I still think you'd have more than 4 seniors though). Granted, that's still not a ton but at least it's more than 4.

I didn't count the number of redshirt juniors.

ETA - the breakdown. Aston Walter (6th year senior), Reagan Williams (Stanford grad transfer), Nahshon Ellerbe (5th year senior), Tom Stewart (Harvard grad transfer), Charlie Booker (Harvard grad transfer), Adam Nunez (TCU grad transfer), Cole Elms (5th year senior), Nick Leverett (NC Central grad transfer), Brian Chaffin (Stanford grad transfer), Justin Gooseberry (Ouachita Baptist grad transfer), Chris Barnes (5th year senior), Myles Adams (4th year senior)

Only 5 program guys. Rest transferred in. As for the beating a dead horse thing...sorry but complaining or making excuses for youth by choice is BS. Bloom chose the roster he has
Yesterday 08:54 PM
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tanqtonic Offline
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Post: #83
RE: Fall Camp?
(Yesterday 08:39 PM)Fort Bend Owl Wrote:  
(Yesterday 07:35 PM)tanqtonic Wrote:  Apparently there are only 3 redshirt seniors, 1 senior, and 12 redshirt juniors on the roster.

Enormously bottom heavy --- that aspect just hit me for the first time.

I count 12 seniors on the team according to the riceowls.com roster. I'm not sure where you're getting your numbers from (unless you're not including graduate transfer seniors - I still think you'd have more than 4 seniors though). Granted, that's still not a ton but at least it's more than 4.

I didn't count the number of redshirt juniors.

ETA - the breakdown. Aston Walter (6th year senior), Reagan Williams (Stanford grad transfer), Nahshon Ellerbe (5th year senior), Tom Stewart (Harvard grad transfer), Charlie Booker (Harvard grad transfer), Adam Nunez (TCU grad transfer), Cole Elms (5th year senior), Nick Leverett (NC Central grad transfer), Brian Chaffin (Stanford grad transfer), Justin Gooseberry (Ouachita Baptist grad transfer), Chris Barnes (5th year senior), Myles Adams (4th year senior)

Counted the classifications per the rice football roster. Your 12 specifically includes grad transfers which I specifically did not.

Aston is listed as a graduate school status on the Rice page --- not a redshirt senior or a senior. That is the disparity between your 5 and my 4.
(This post was last modified: Yesterday 09:26 PM by tanqtonic.)
Yesterday 09:22 PM
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Post: #84
Exclamation RE: Fall Camp?
(Yesterday 08:54 PM)RiceOL83 Wrote:  
(Yesterday 08:39 PM)Fort Bend Owl Wrote:  
(Yesterday 07:35 PM)tanqtonic Wrote:  Apparently there are only 3 redshirt seniors, 1 senior, and 12 redshirt juniors on the roster.

Enormously bottom heavy --- that aspect just hit me for the first time.

I count 12 seniors on the team according to the riceowls.com roster. I'm not sure where you're getting your numbers from (unless you're not including graduate transfer seniors - I still think you'd have more than 4 seniors though). Granted, that's still not a ton but at least it's more than 4.

I didn't count the number of redshirt juniors.

ETA - the breakdown. Aston Walter (6th year senior), Reagan Williams (Stanford grad transfer), Nahshon Ellerbe (5th year senior), Tom Stewart (Harvard grad transfer), Charlie Booker (Harvard grad transfer), Adam Nunez (TCU grad transfer), Cole Elms (5th year senior), Nick Leverett (NC Central grad transfer), Brian Chaffin (Stanford grad transfer), Justin Gooseberry (Ouachita Baptist grad transfer), Chris Barnes (5th year senior), Myles Adams (4th year senior)

Only 5 program guys. Rest transferred in. As for the beating a dead horse thing...sorry but complaining or making excuses for youth by choice is BS. Bloom chose the roster he has

Maybe, but my guess is he is also going for a culture change with his roster revamps. Looks like in his opinion, many of the guys who were on the roster were not the caliber of player necessary to compete at Div I. Since he did coach for a very successful Stanford roster for several years, I would give him the benefit of doubt that he might understand at least that aspect, whether his chosen style of offense/defense is your cup of Rice tea or not (or mine, for I'm not sure smashmouth works here.)

To the extent that for much of the previous 11 seasons those type of players are now Rice football alumns, they colour the perception of the program's level with their own perceptions, which may or may not be the type that are successful/compatible with successful Div I teams today. That is where an alleged acceptance of mediocrity may come from as far as the program. If it is instituted in the very players who are alumns of it, and they even subconsciously can't handle the program becoming far better than when they were there under differing systems/values. The damage to the Rice football program from those 11 years, like the damage form many previous regimes, is thus far long lasting due to those kind of attachments it created, and takes what are perceived by many of those previous players to be wrongheaded or painful measures to eradicate.

Summary: turning around the program is painful and can seem irrational or mean to the players who were part of the lack of success under a flawed leader. TG, for all his faults, embraced the radical and rapid change needed at Rice to turn the rudder to success from defeat. I am not endorsing all his methods, merely his mentality that "this $# here has to stop for Rice to be successful on the field." Some of that may be what Bloom is doing, albeit hopefully in a more ethical way than TG. It will still piss off a lot of Football alumni. So be it. We have not had the kind of success with what we were doing befitting a storied school like Rice. We need to change. We'll see if this change works.
Today 09:29 AM
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Fort Bend Owl Online
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Post: #85
RE: Fall Camp?
I'd also say that based on the number of football commitments we have lined up already, there is a very good chance that a number of those 4th year juniors will be reclassified as seniors on Senior Day.

It is what it is. Let's see how they look in two weeks before we beat up Bloomgren and the program too much. Even if we're losing our non-conference games as most people expect, there are different ways to lose a game. Starting with Army. Will we look like UH did against them in the bowl game (70-14)? Or if you want to look at recent Army-Rice games, will we be closer to the 2016 version (31-14) or the 2017 version (49-12)?
Today 09:59 AM
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Post: #86
RE: Fall Camp?
(Today 09:29 AM)GoodOwl Wrote:  
(Yesterday 08:54 PM)RiceOL83 Wrote:  
(Yesterday 08:39 PM)Fort Bend Owl Wrote:  
(Yesterday 07:35 PM)tanqtonic Wrote:  Apparently there are only 3 redshirt seniors, 1 senior, and 12 redshirt juniors on the roster.

Enormously bottom heavy --- that aspect just hit me for the first time.

I count 12 seniors on the team according to the riceowls.com roster. I'm not sure where you're getting your numbers from (unless you're not including graduate transfer seniors - I still think you'd have more than 4 seniors though). Granted, that's still not a ton but at least it's more than 4.

I didn't count the number of redshirt juniors.

ETA - the breakdown. Aston Walter (6th year senior), Reagan Williams (Stanford grad transfer), Nahshon Ellerbe (5th year senior), Tom Stewart (Harvard grad transfer), Charlie Booker (Harvard grad transfer), Adam Nunez (TCU grad transfer), Cole Elms (5th year senior), Nick Leverett (NC Central grad transfer), Brian Chaffin (Stanford grad transfer), Justin Gooseberry (Ouachita Baptist grad transfer), Chris Barnes (5th year senior), Myles Adams (4th year senior)

Only 5 program guys. Rest transferred in. As for the beating a dead horse thing...sorry but complaining or making excuses for youth by choice is BS. Bloom chose the roster he has

Maybe, but my guess is he is also going for a culture change with his roster revamps. Looks like in his opinion, many of the guys who were on the roster were not the caliber of player necessary to compete at Div I. Since he did coach for a very successful Stanford roster for several years, I would give him the benefit of doubt that he might understand at least that aspect, whether his chosen style of offense/defense is your cup of Rice tea or not (or mine, for I'm not sure smashmouth works here.)

To the extent that for much of the previous 11 seasons those type of players are now Rice football alumns, they colour the perception of the program's level with their own perceptions, which may or may not be the type that are successful/compatible with successful Div I teams today. That is where an alleged acceptance of mediocrity may come from as far as the program. If it is instituted in the very players who are alumns of it, and they even subconsciously can't handle the program becoming far better than when they were there under differing systems/values. The damage to the Rice football program from those 11 years, like the damage form many previous regimes, is thus far long lasting due to those kind of attachments it created, and takes what are perceived by many of those previous players to be wrongheaded or painful measures to eradicate.

Summary: turning around the program is painful and can seem irrational or mean to the players who were part of the lack of success under a flawed leader. TG, for all his faults, embraced the radical and rapid change needed at Rice to turn the rudder to success from defeat. I am not endorsing all his methods, merely his mentality that "this $# here has to stop for Rice to be successful on the field." Some of that may be what Bloom is doing, albeit hopefully in a more ethical way than TG. It will still piss off a lot of Football alumni. So be it. We have not had the kind of success with what we were doing befitting a storied school like Rice. We need to change. We'll see if this change works.

Well said. The only players that left/were encouraged to leave that would have played here this year were Abercrumbia and Wilkins, and neither was “run off.” The roster churn isn’t fun for those involved but was ultimately necessary to get where we all want to go.
Today 11:58 AM
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Post: #87
RE: Fall Camp?
(Today 09:29 AM)GoodOwl Wrote:  
(Yesterday 08:54 PM)RiceOL83 Wrote:  
(Yesterday 08:39 PM)Fort Bend Owl Wrote:  
(Yesterday 07:35 PM)tanqtonic Wrote:  Apparently there are only 3 redshirt seniors, 1 senior, and 12 redshirt juniors on the roster.

Enormously bottom heavy --- that aspect just hit me for the first time.

I count 12 seniors on the team according to the riceowls.com roster. I'm not sure where you're getting your numbers from (unless you're not including graduate transfer seniors - I still think you'd have more than 4 seniors though). Granted, that's still not a ton but at least it's more than 4.

I didn't count the number of redshirt juniors.

ETA - the breakdown. Aston Walter (6th year senior), Reagan Williams (Stanford grad transfer), Nahshon Ellerbe (5th year senior), Tom Stewart (Harvard grad transfer), Charlie Booker (Harvard grad transfer), Adam Nunez (TCU grad transfer), Cole Elms (5th year senior), Nick Leverett (NC Central grad transfer), Brian Chaffin (Stanford grad transfer), Justin Gooseberry (Ouachita Baptist grad transfer), Chris Barnes (5th year senior), Myles Adams (4th year senior)

Only 5 program guys. Rest transferred in. As for the beating a dead horse thing...sorry but complaining or making excuses for youth by choice is BS. Bloom chose the roster he has

Maybe, but my guess is he is also going for a culture change with his roster revamps. Looks like in his opinion, many of the guys who were on the roster were not the caliber of player necessary to compete at Div I. Since he did coach for a very successful Stanford roster for several years, I would give him the benefit of doubt that he might understand at least that aspect, whether his chosen style of offense/defense is your cup of Rice tea or not (or mine, for I'm not sure smashmouth works here.)

To the extent that for much of the previous 11 seasons those type of players are now Rice football alumns, they colour the perception of the program's level with their own perceptions, which may or may not be the type that are successful/compatible with successful Div I teams today. That is where an alleged acceptance of mediocrity may come from as far as the program. If it is instituted in the very players who are alumns of it, and they even subconsciously can't handle the program becoming far better than when they were there under differing systems/values. The damage to the Rice football program from those 11 years, like the damage form many previous regimes, is thus far long lasting due to those kind of attachments it created, and takes what are perceived by many of those previous players to be wrongheaded or painful measures to eradicate.

Summary: turning around the program is painful and can seem irrational or mean to the players who were part of the lack of success under a flawed leader. TG, for all his faults, embraced the radical and rapid change needed at Rice to turn the rudder to success from defeat. I am not endorsing all his methods, merely his mentality that "this $# here has to stop for Rice to be successful on the field." Some of that may be what Bloom is doing, albeit hopefully in a more ethical way than TG. It will still piss off a lot of Football alumni. So be it. We have not had the kind of success with what we were doing befitting a storied school like Rice. We need to change. We'll see if this change works.

Well said. We all want to win, and to do that we need(ed) a culture change.
Today 12:29 PM
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Post: #88
RE: Fall Camp?
(Today 09:59 AM)Fort Bend Owl Wrote:  I'd also say that based on the number of football commitments we have lined up already, there is a very good chance that a number of those 4th year juniors will be reclassified as seniors on Senior Day.

What do you mean? Are you just saying that because Senior Day is at the end of the season the 4th year juniors will become seniors, or are you saying that they will be reclassified in an effort to encourage them to leave the program, or are you saying something else?
Today 12:31 PM
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Fort Bend Owl Online
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Post: #89
RE: Fall Camp?
They'll be on target to graduate and will do so. Some will just finish playing, and some will transfer elsewhere to play another year. We've lost about 4 or 5 that way the last couple of years, and that's the new norm in college athletics.

But do the math. We have 12 seniors on the team (and I'm not even sure if all are on scholarship). You have 85 scholarships total and we're pretty much at that number. We have 13 commits already for the 2020 class, and we're still actively offering scholarships. There will be some natural attrition but I'm pretty sure the staff already knows that some of the 4th year juniors are playing their final season in 2019 (and the kids probably know that too).
Today 01:14 PM
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tanqtonic Offline
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Post: #90
RE: Fall Camp?
(Today 01:14 PM)Fort Bend Owl Wrote:  They'll be on target to graduate and will do so. Some will just finish playing, and some will transfer elsewhere to play another year. We've lost about 4 or 5 that way the last couple of years, and that's the new norm in college athletics.

But do the math. We have 12 seniors on the team (and I'm not even sure if all are on scholarship). You have 85 scholarships total and we're pretty much at that number. We have 13 commits already for the 2020 class, and we're still actively offering scholarships. There will be some natural attrition but I'm pretty sure the staff already knows that some of the 4th year juniors are playing their final season in 2019 (and the kids probably know that too).

I think there are 16 that are on schedule or could graduate this scholastic year.

3 redshirt seniors (i.e. on the 5th academic year, scheduled to use their 4th play year), 1 senior, (4th academic year, scheduled to use the 4th play year), and 12 redshirt juniors (4th academic year, scheduled to use their 3rd play year).

In addition there are 9 classified as Graduate Students.

That brings to 25 the number of potential scholarships, assuming all are not walk-ons.

https://riceowls.com/roster.aspx?path=fo...sort=class

But you also forget the Rice Investment --- at the coaches stop in Austin, Bloom mentioned he had something like 15-20 people as walk-ons or preferred walk ons this year, and expected to be able to very aggressively utilize the Rice Investment to bolster the number of recruits he could bring into the program.

And yes, there is an allocation of 85 scholarships; but again, during an aside with him at the coaches caravan meeting, both Bloom and a number of his assistants noted that for the people being brought in at the lower end of the economic spectrum, they were readily prepared to use the Rice Investment as a very big tool in that regard, and open up the ability to use the true sports scholarships in targeting upper middle class+ students with those.

The Investment, if used wisely, can really be somewhat of a game changer.
Today 01:33 PM
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Post: #91
RE: Fall Camp?
(Today 01:14 PM)Fort Bend Owl Wrote:  They'll be on target to graduate and will do so. Some will just finish playing, and some will transfer elsewhere to play another year. We've lost about 4 or 5 that way the last couple of years, and that's the new norm in college athletics.

But do the math. We have 12 seniors on the team (and I'm not even sure if all are on scholarship). You have 85 scholarships total and we're pretty much at that number. We have 13 commits already for the 2020 class, and we're still actively offering scholarships. There will be some natural attrition but I'm pretty sure the staff already knows that some of the 4th year juniors are playing their final season in 2019 (and the kids probably know that too).

A review of the 2019 football roster is shocking in the amount of turnover in under two years. I trust the new coaching staff and will assume that there is an improvement in overall playing ability even though it will be a young group. I just hope we will see signs this year of becoming more competitive with at least conference opponents.
I have followed Rice football for many decades and an area where they have struggled in recruitment and retention is interior defensive linemen. Even in the current world of passing offenses the first priority of a defense is to stop the run. On the current roster I find only four defensive linemen with two being freshmen.
Also, on the roster I do not find either Jake Syptak or Brendan Harmon. I wonder what happened to them? I recall Syptak was one of our more highly recruited players of the 2018 class.
Today 01:40 PM
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ExcitedOwl18 Online
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Post: #92
RE: Fall Camp?
(Today 01:40 PM)rice1931 Wrote:  
(Today 01:14 PM)Fort Bend Owl Wrote:  They'll be on target to graduate and will do so. Some will just finish playing, and some will transfer elsewhere to play another year. We've lost about 4 or 5 that way the last couple of years, and that's the new norm in college athletics.

But do the math. We have 12 seniors on the team (and I'm not even sure if all are on scholarship). You have 85 scholarships total and we're pretty much at that number. We have 13 commits already for the 2020 class, and we're still actively offering scholarships. There will be some natural attrition but I'm pretty sure the staff already knows that some of the 4th year juniors are playing their final season in 2019 (and the kids probably know that too).

A review of the 2019 football roster is shocking in the amount of turnover in under two years. I trust the new coaching staff and will assume that there is an improvement in overall playing ability even though it will be a young group. I just hope we will see signs this year of becoming more competitive with at least conference opponents.
I have followed Rice football for many decades and an area where they have struggled in recruitment and retention is interior defensive linemen. Even in the current world of passing offenses the first priority of a defense is to stop the run. On the current roster I find only four defensive linemen with two being freshmen.
Also, on the roster I do not find either Jake Syptak or Brendan Harmon. I wonder what happened to them? I recall Syptak was one of our more highly recruited players of the 2018 class.

Syptak decided he'd rather go to Arkansas as a regular student and give up football...

Harmon left Rice and is now on the Abilene Christian roster.
Today 01:59 PM
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