Cal Baptist is already a full D1 counter -- starts your 2nd year, although you remain ineligible for 3 more years for team post season play. D1 schools are allowed one non-counter and that will be Dixie State in 2020-21. So no threat to WAC.

Two (non-critical) sports will be at risk:

Men's Tennis: NMSU, GCU, Seattle, RGV
Women's Tennis: NMSU, GCU, Seattle, RGV, Dixie State

Women's Tennis can pick up an associate for the WAC tournament; Bingamton is such an Independent who's Men's Golf play in the Big Sky conference meet, and who's Men's Tennis play in the MAC meet. (Obviously they would not be part of the schedule, just the Meet).

The Men's Tennis would be SOL. The Summit will have 9 teams, and the Big Sky 11, so maybe one of them might pick up a school to balance the schedule. Seattle, GCU and NMSU would all work, but probably GCU and Seattle are better logistically for Big Sky schools. Maybe one or two WAC schools wind up dropping Men's Tennis.

Beyond that I see no impact. Eventually the WAC will want to bring up another D-II school in the West; 7 is living on the brink again.

It’s unfortunate that the mismanagement of the school has led to this. Time to let the Cougar athletic program die and maybe save the rest of the school.

As for the WAC their salvation is with 5 D2 Lone Star schools who play football. Coaxing them up solo with no football home is a tough sell but allow enough of them to create an FCS conference and you have 6 for football, and in Olympic sports a 6 school Texas Division and a 6 school West Division.

(08-03-2019 08:24 PM)Jjoey52 Wrote:  

(08-03-2019 07:24 PM)CoastalVANDAL Wrote:  The WAC will have five full D1 members is 2020 right?
With Cal-Baptist and Dixie St transitioning.
If I was NAU and SUU I would look into joining and leaving football in the BSC.
That would be pretty tight geography for Cal- Baptist , GCU,NAU,DSU,SUU and UVU .
Versus the Big Sky and NMSU is not too bad UTRG is pretty far out but warm at least. Seattle has a big airport so cheap flights vs the more isolated BSC schools.
With nine in each conference a challenge series H&H could give nine guaranteed home games. Less mouths to feed less travel cost.

Not likely but this is a realignment board.

At first, I thought this was a lame idea, but it might just work, biggest question would the BSC let them leave except for football.

I like the challenge idea, it is hard for BSC schools to get decent OOC home games.


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Splitting the thirteen BSC football teams into two football only conferences has been discussed.
WAC football
NAU,SUU, Dixie ST , CAl POly, UC-Davis, and Sac St and Northern Colorado from the BSC.
Big Sky Schools already play each other out of conference and complain about too many teams.
Trade Seattle for UNC and geography is much better for both leagues.

Is the WAC and Big Sky the western version of the CUSA and Sun Belt geographical realignment desire

(08-03-2019 10:55 PM)Wedge Wrote:  

(08-03-2019 07:24 PM)CoastalVANDAL Wrote:  The WAC will have five full D1 members is 2020 right?
With Cal-Baptist and Dixie St transitioning.
If I was NAU and SUU I would look into joining and leaving football in the BSC.
That would be pretty tight geography for Cal- Baptist , GCU,NAU,DSU,SUU and UVU .
Versus the Big Sky and NMSU is not too bad UTRG is pretty far out but warm at least. Seattle has a big airport so cheap flights vs the more isolated BSC schools.
With nine in each conference a challenge series H&H could give nine guaranteed home games. Less mouths to feed less travel cost.

Not likely but this is a realignment board.

NAU has been in the Big Sky since before most people on this message board were born. They're not going to leave that for an unstable conference with two schools that were in Division II five minutes ago and two other schools that are farther away from NAU than any of the Big Sky schools.

You are probably right and NAU is a good school .
The Big Sky is happy to have them.
The WAC has better geography without CSU and UMKC for NAU.
SUU is the closest BSC team not sure who NAU considers a rival.
Would they get better support playing GCU, Dixie ST , NMSU than Big Sky teams not sure?
When the WAC was last in danger Big Sky schools talked about switching to keep the Auto bid.
No Big Sky school was interested at that time.
NAU , SUU, and Northern Colorado to WAC and Seattle to Big Sky and Everyone saves on travel.
NAU probably has more alumni in Southern California,Southern Utah, Texas and especially in Phoenix .
Versus Idaho , Montana , Oregon and Washington, Northern California and Northern Utah.
Just looking at the map no idea how NAU feels about the BIg Sky or WAC.

(08-03-2019 04:17 PM)AZcats Wrote:  

(08-03-2019 03:03 PM)DavidSt Wrote:  

(08-03-2019 02:59 PM)Jjoey52 Wrote:  

(08-03-2019 02:05 PM)DavidSt Wrote:  Tarleton State and Colorado Mesa are up to bat for the WAC to replace Chicago State. Other schools that WAC mentioned last year need to raise funds to upgrade their facilities. Those 2 already upgraded or in process in upgrading. Central Washington and West Texas A&M are also in the middle of upgrading their facilities.

Those 4 are more ready to go D1 than any others right now. All 4 could actually play Independent in the area because west coast schools do have issues getting games OOC with a lack of teams.

There you go again, Mesa is not interested in going D1 for reasons I have stated numerous times.


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You do not know. People like you said the exact same thing with Northern Kentucky and North Alabama saying they are not interested in going to D1. Next thing you hear, the school announced they are going to D1.

Stop hijacking every thread with your fantasy D2 call-ups and stop telling people what they do not know. Do you need a reminder on what you thought a Nanook is?

How dare you talk to the realignment czar like that! He has had many great predictions that no one else could possibly think of. Never mind, he never gives dates and uses “could” all the time. Who else has the sack to “predict” Upper Iowa going D1? Again, no date or date range given on that one, but it it’s ever comes true, “I called it first”, he will say.

(08-04-2019 08:17 AM)solohawks Wrote:  Is the WAC and Big Sky the western version of the CUSA and Sun Belt geographical realignment desire

No they really do not overlap much but both are too spread out.
Seattle Belongs in WCC
Sacramento St belongs in Big West
UTRG belongs in the Southland
NAU and SUU are kind of far South in the Big Sky.
A Trade that will never happen would benefit NAU and SUU the most.
Giving NAU an in state rival in their population center.
Dixie St is close to both of the Big Sky Schools.
It makes sense if starting from scratch but their not so it won't happen.

(08-04-2019 01:07 AM)HawaiiMongoose Wrote:  

(08-03-2019 05:36 PM)solohawks Wrote:  

(08-03-2019 04:09 PM)Kit-Cat Wrote:  

(08-03-2019 02:06 PM)solohawks Wrote:  It might help the WAC find that 8th school western school now that the fathest east the conference will have to go is the Texas Rio Grande

The membership situation looks so much more solid than it did a few years ago.

UMKC made a gamble on the WAC which didnt pan but otherwise its pulled itself together.

I agree. While at only 7 once next year begins, assuming this Chicago St exit goes through, the footprint is much tighter and the league will hopefully be able to expand with a purpose and end game in mind

Been saying for a couple of years now that losing UMKC and Chicago State would be a blessing in disguise for the WAC. Nothing against those two schools, whose presence was essential to saving the WAC’s basketball auto-bid when the conference was on the brink of collapse, but it was a marriage of convenience that the WAC and UMKC no longer need and Chicago State can no longer afford.

With a tighter geographic footprint and improved competitiveness in men’s basketball as selling points I think the WAC is well-positioned to land the one or two additional members it needs to reach relative stability. I don’t have illusions that any Big Sky schools would join but there are other potential candidates in the neighborhood, notably Western Washington and Azusa Pacific. Also I have to think the Lone Star Conference’s recent expansion to an unwieldy 19 members will spur more Texas D-II schools to join Tarleton State in considering a move up. With the Southland already packed at 13 their only realistic D-I option would be the WAC.

The WAC really needs to try to merge with the Summit instead of dredging up small Division II schools.

(08-04-2019 01:07 AM)HawaiiMongoose Wrote:  

(08-03-2019 05:36 PM)solohawks Wrote:  

(08-03-2019 04:09 PM)Kit-Cat Wrote:  

(08-03-2019 02:06 PM)solohawks Wrote:  It might help the WAC find that 8th school western school now that the fathest east the conference will have to go is the Texas Rio Grande

The membership situation looks so much more solid than it did a few years ago.

UMKC made a gamble on the WAC which didnt pan but otherwise its pulled itself together.

I agree. While at only 7 once next year begins, assuming this Chicago St exit goes through, the footprint is much tighter and the league will hopefully be able to expand with a purpose and end game in mind

Been saying for a couple of years now that losing UMKC and Chicago State would be a blessing in disguise for the WAC. Nothing against those two schools, whose presence was essential to saving the WAC’s basketball auto-bid when the conference was on the brink of collapse, but it was a marriage of convenience that the WAC and UMKC no longer need and Chicago State can no longer afford.

With a tighter geographic footprint and improved competitiveness in men’s basketball as selling points I think the WAC is well-positioned to land the one or two additional members it needs to reach relative stability. I don’t have illusions that any Big Sky schools would join but there are other potential candidates in the neighborhood, notably Western Washington and Azusa Pacific. Also I have to think the Lone Star Conference’s recent expansion to an unwieldy 19 members will spur more Texas D-II schools to join Tarleton State in considering a move up. With the Southland already packed at 13 their only realistic D-I option would be the WAC.

If the WAC falls to 7, I'd expect GCU and NMSU to quietly start bribing other conferences to take them in.

Or how about this possibility if Azusa Pacific and Tarleton State move up?

That puts a revived Big West FCS conference in reach. Azusa Pacific, Tarleton State and Dixie State are football-only members. Portland State joins as the 12th full member with Cal Poly and UC Davis, and viola - a new football auto bid in the west.

On paper isn't that much easier to pull off than say, praying for six D2 call-ups at once? No startups necessary, no Cal State or UC balance issues, fewer moving pieces, and Portland State saves on travel costs. The Big Sky keeps its California presence with Sac State, the WAC is replenished with new members, Dixie State has a football home, and the Big West regains a toehold in the Pacific Northwest as well as a toehold in Texas for football.

Everyone wins.

(08-04-2019 02:45 PM)bullet Wrote:  

(08-04-2019 01:07 AM)HawaiiMongoose Wrote:  

(08-03-2019 05:36 PM)solohawks Wrote:  

(08-03-2019 04:09 PM)Kit-Cat Wrote:  

(08-03-2019 02:06 PM)solohawks Wrote:  It might help the WAC find that 8th school western school now that the fathest east the conference will have to go is the Texas Rio Grande

The membership situation looks so much more solid than it did a few years ago.

UMKC made a gamble on the WAC which didnt pan but otherwise its pulled itself together.

I agree. While at only 7 once next year begins, assuming this Chicago St exit goes through, the footprint is much tighter and the league will hopefully be able to expand with a purpose and end game in mind

Been saying for a couple of years now that losing UMKC and Chicago State would be a blessing in disguise for the WAC. Nothing against those two schools, whose presence was essential to saving the WAC’s basketball auto-bid when the conference was on the brink of collapse, but it was a marriage of convenience that the WAC and UMKC no longer need and Chicago State can no longer afford.

With a tighter geographic footprint and improved competitiveness in men’s basketball as selling points I think the WAC is well-positioned to land the one or two additional members it needs to reach relative stability. I don’t have illusions that any Big Sky schools would join but there are other potential candidates in the neighborhood, notably Western Washington and Azusa Pacific. Also I have to think the Lone Star Conference’s recent expansion to an unwieldy 19 members will spur more Texas D-II schools to join Tarleton State in considering a move up. With the Southland already packed at 13 their only realistic D-I option would be the WAC.

The WAC really needs to try to merge with the Summit instead of dredging up small Division II schools.

Well, not all of the schools are small at all if they are more than 10,000.

(08-03-2019 03:03 PM)DavidSt Wrote:  

(08-03-2019 02:59 PM)Jjoey52 Wrote:  

(08-03-2019 02:05 PM)DavidSt Wrote:  Tarleton State and Colorado Mesa are up to bat for the WAC to replace Chicago State. Other schools that WAC mentioned last year need to raise funds to upgrade their facilities. Those 2 already upgraded or in process in upgrading. Central Washington and West Texas A&M are also in the middle of upgrading their facilities.

Those 4 are more ready to go D1 than any others right now. All 4 could actually play Independent in the area because west coast schools do have issues getting games OOC with a lack of teams.

There you go again, Mesa is not interested in going D1 for reasons I have stated numerous times.


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You do not know. People like you said the exact same thing with Northern Kentucky and North Alabama saying they are not interested in going to D1. Next thing you hear, the school announced they are going to D1.

No they didn't. Everyone acknowledged that both had, and have had D1 aspirations.

Colorado-Mesa has said NO THANKS

(08-03-2019 07:24 PM)CoastalVANDAL Wrote:  The WAC will have five full D1 members is 2020 right?
With Cal-Baptist and Dixie St transitioning.
If I was NAU and SUU I would look into joining and leaving football in the BSC.
That would be pretty tight geography for Cal- Baptist , GCU,NAU,DSU,SUU and UVU .
Versus the Big Sky and NMSU is not too bad UTRG is pretty far out but warm at least. Seattle has a big airport so cheap flights vs the more isolated BSC schools.
With nine in each conference a challenge series H&H could give nine guaranteed home games. Less mouths to feed less travel cost.

Not likely but this is a realignment board.

Why the hell would either leave a stable conference for the unstable WAC?

(08-04-2019 02:46 PM)jdgaucho Wrote:  Or how about this possibility if Azusa Pacific and Tarleton State move up?

That puts a revived Big West FCS conference in reach. Azusa Pacific, Tarleton State and Dixie State are football-only members. Portland State joins as the 12th full member with Cal Poly and UC Davis, and viola - a new football auto bid in the west.

On paper isn't that much easier to pull off than say, praying for six D2 call-ups at once? No startups necessary, no Cal State or UC balance issues, fewer moving pieces, and Portland State saves on travel costs. The Big Sky keeps its California presence with Sac State, the WAC is replenished with new members, Dixie State has a football home, and the Big West regains a toehold in the Pacific Northwest as well as a toehold in Texas for football.

Everyone wins.

UC Davis loses. Their top-ten FCS football team would be marooned in a football conference in which half the teams just left Division II. They would just say no.

(08-03-2019 09:21 PM)seaking4steel Wrote:  

(08-03-2019 08:24 PM)Jjoey52 Wrote:  

(08-03-2019 07:24 PM)CoastalVANDAL Wrote:  The WAC will have five full D1 members is 2020 right?
With Cal-Baptist and Dixie St transitioning.
If I was NAU and SUU I would look into joining and leaving football in the BSC.
That would be pretty tight geography for Cal- Baptist , GCU,NAU,DSU,SUU and UVU .
Versus the Big Sky and NMSU is not too bad UTRG is pretty far out but warm at least. Seattle has a big airport so cheap flights vs the more isolated BSC schools.
With nine in each conference a challenge series H&H could give nine guaranteed home games. Less mouths to feed less travel cost.

Not likely but this is a realignment board.

At first, I thought this was a lame idea, but it might just work, biggest question would the BSC let them leave except for football.

I like the challenge idea, it is hard for BSC schools to get decent OOC home games.


Sent from my iPad using Tapatalk

They would probably follow Dixie's lead and go FCS independent, then maybe convince either the WAC or Summit to start FCS football.

Again, why would either leave a stable conference where they are guaranteed 8 games, 4 at home, for FCS independence?

Talk about a stupid idea.

(08-04-2019 08:29 AM)CoastalVANDAL Wrote:  

(08-03-2019 10:55 PM)Wedge Wrote:  

(08-03-2019 07:24 PM)CoastalVANDAL Wrote:  The WAC will have five full D1 members is 2020 right?
With Cal-Baptist and Dixie St transitioning.
If I was NAU and SUU I would look into joining and leaving football in the BSC.
That would be pretty tight geography for Cal- Baptist , GCU,NAU,DSU,SUU and UVU .
Versus the Big Sky and NMSU is not too bad UTRG is pretty far out but warm at least. Seattle has a big airport so cheap flights vs the more isolated BSC schools.
With nine in each conference a challenge series H&H could give nine guaranteed home games. Less mouths to feed less travel cost.

Not likely but this is a realignment board.

NAU has been in the Big Sky since before most people on this message board were born. They're not going to leave that for an unstable conference with two schools that were in Division II five minutes ago and two other schools that are farther away from NAU than any of the Big Sky schools.

You are probably right and NAU is a good school .
The Big Sky is happy to have them.
The WAC has better geography without CSU and UMKC for NAU.
SUU is the closest BSC team not sure who NAU considers a rival.
Would they get better support playing GCU, Dixie ST , NMSU than Big Sky teams not sure?
When the WAC was last in danger Big Sky schools talked about switching to keep the Auto bid.
No Big Sky school was interested at that time.
NAU , SUU, and Northern Colorado to WAC and Seattle to Big Sky and Everyone saves on travel.
NAU probably has more alumni in Southern California,Southern Utah, Texas and especially in Phoenix .
Versus Idaho , Montana , Oregon and Washington, Northern California and Northern Utah.
Just looking at the map no idea how NAU feels about the BIg Sky or WAC.

The northern schools have large amounts of alumni in the Phoenix area. No WAC school is going to bring 2K to Flagstaff for a football game like Montana does.

(08-04-2019 03:18 PM)dbackjon Wrote:  

(08-03-2019 09:21 PM)seaking4steel Wrote:  

(08-03-2019 08:24 PM)Jjoey52 Wrote:  

(08-03-2019 07:24 PM)CoastalVANDAL Wrote:  The WAC will have five full D1 members is 2020 right?
With Cal-Baptist and Dixie St transitioning.
If I was NAU and SUU I would look into joining and leaving football in the BSC.
That would be pretty tight geography for Cal- Baptist , GCU,NAU,DSU,SUU and UVU .
Versus the Big Sky and NMSU is not too bad UTRG is pretty far out but warm at least. Seattle has a big airport so cheap flights vs the more isolated BSC schools.
With nine in each conference a challenge series H&H could give nine guaranteed home games. Less mouths to feed less travel cost.

Not likely but this is a realignment board.

At first, I thought this was a lame idea, but it might just work, biggest question would the BSC let them leave except for football.

I like the challenge idea, it is hard for BSC schools to get decent OOC home games.


Sent from my iPad using Tapatalk

They would probably follow Dixie's lead and go FCS independent, then maybe convince either the WAC or Summit to start FCS football.

Again, why would either leave a stable conference where they are guaranteed 8 games, 4 at home, for FCS independence?

Talk about a stupid idea.

I didn't say it was a smart idea, I think it is dumb as well. I'm just saying that there is no way NAU or SUU could stay in BSC football if they tried to pull a move like that.

(08-04-2019 03:17 PM)Wedge Wrote:  

(08-04-2019 02:46 PM)jdgaucho Wrote:  Or how about this possibility if Azusa Pacific and Tarleton State move up?

That puts a revived Big West FCS conference in reach. Azusa Pacific, Tarleton State and Dixie State are football-only members. Portland State joins as the 12th full member with Cal Poly and UC Davis, and viola - a new football auto bid in the west.

On paper isn't that much easier to pull off than say, praying for six D2 call-ups at once? No startups necessary, no Cal State or UC balance issues, fewer moving pieces, and Portland State saves on travel costs. The Big Sky keeps its California presence with Sac State, the WAC is replenished with new members, Dixie State has a football home, and the Big West regains a toehold in the Pacific Northwest as well as a toehold in Texas for football.

Everyone wins.

UC Davis loses. Their top-ten FCS football team would be marooned in a football conference in which half the teams just left Division II. They would just say no.

it puts everything under one roof and their FCS auto bid is much easier to obtain. But if that's a non-starter for UC Davis, then an FCS WAC is out of the question as well. Because that would also require multiple division 2 call ups.

(08-04-2019 03:24 PM)jdgaucho Wrote:  

(08-04-2019 03:17 PM)Wedge Wrote:  

(08-04-2019 02:46 PM)jdgaucho Wrote:  Or how about this possibility if Azusa Pacific and Tarleton State move up?

That puts a revived Big West FCS conference in reach. Azusa Pacific, Tarleton State and Dixie State are football-only members. Portland State joins as the 12th full member with Cal Poly and UC Davis, and viola - a new football auto bid in the west.

On paper isn't that much easier to pull off than say, praying for six D2 call-ups at once? No startups necessary, no Cal State or UC balance issues, fewer moving pieces, and Portland State saves on travel costs. The Big Sky keeps its California presence with Sac State, the WAC is replenished with new members, Dixie State has a football home, and the Big West regains a toehold in the Pacific Northwest as well as a toehold in Texas for football.

Everyone wins.

UC Davis loses. Their top-ten FCS football team would be marooned in a football conference in which half the teams just left Division II. They would just say no.

it puts everything under one roof and their FCS auto bid is much easier to obtain. But if that's a non-starter for UC Davis, then an FCS WAC is out of the question as well. Because that would also require multiple division 2 call ups.

You might persuade a few struggling FCS programs to join a new football-only conference with teams that were just in D-II. They might like having the opportunity to win a conference title.

Also, I think there is an NCAA committee that decides on FCS autobids, so it might not be a sure thing for a new conference, especially one padded with D-II move-ups, to get an autobid right away.

(08-04-2019 03:57 PM)Wedge Wrote:  

(08-04-2019 03:24 PM)jdgaucho Wrote:  

(08-04-2019 03:17 PM)Wedge Wrote:  

(08-04-2019 02:46 PM)jdgaucho Wrote:  Or how about this possibility if Azusa Pacific and Tarleton State move up?

That puts a revived Big West FCS conference in reach. Azusa Pacific, Tarleton State and Dixie State are football-only members. Portland State joins as the 12th full member with Cal Poly and UC Davis, and viola - a new football auto bid in the west.

On paper isn't that much easier to pull off than say, praying for six D2 call-ups at once? No startups necessary, no Cal State or UC balance issues, fewer moving pieces, and Portland State saves on travel costs. The Big Sky keeps its California presence with Sac State, the WAC is replenished with new members, Dixie State has a football home, and the Big West regains a toehold in the Pacific Northwest as well as a toehold in Texas for football.

Everyone wins.

UC Davis loses. Their top-ten FCS football team would be marooned in a football conference in which half the teams just left Division II. They would just say no.

it puts everything under one roof and their FCS auto bid is much easier to obtain. But if that's a non-starter for UC Davis, then an FCS WAC is out of the question as well. Because that would also require multiple division 2 call ups.

You might persuade a few struggling FCS programs to join a new football-only conference with teams that were just in D-II. They might like having the opportunity to win a conference title.

Also, I think there is an NCAA committee that decides on FCS autobids, so it might not be a sure thing for a new conference, especially one padded with D-II move-ups, to get an autobid right away.

They may have to wait a couple of years, but that didn’t stop the Pioneer League from forming. Also, given how many playoff spots there are, there is a very good chance to get an at-large berth. Even Indy FCS teams have a good chance for an at-large spot.

It looks like a big chunk of prime real estate. Could be a good acquisition for some one like DePaul.